23455 réponses à ce sujet

[Thanatos144]

LiarasShield wrote...

Well this is my new thread that I have made similar to this thread but it being more of a is anyone really listening thread


http://social.biowar.../index/12087176

dammit quoted wrong post

Modifié par Thanatos144, 16 mai 2012 - 06:12 .

[LiarasShield]

still thanks for copying my link bubbles

[Thanatos144]

Redbelle wrote...

BlueStorm83 wrote...

     They did say they found him ON the planet?  Dammit, then they jumped the shark.

     And no, not the bodies before the conduit, the bodies in the red crawlspace when you get to the Conduit.  They were all un-articulated, I'd say.

Gotta go so a few quick points about finding Shep on a planet.

Atmospheric friction only burns things that enter at high speed as deceleration occurs from that friction.

The planet could have been a low atmoshere planet. If it was the same as the Normandy crash site then I remember Shep in his breather helmet.

Haven't time to form an opinion so thought I'd throw in some food for thought.

Um Falling from miles up easily reaches 32 feet per second per
second.....Terminal velocity.....Thus cause all the friction needed to burn up in atmosphere.....Just saying.

[Thanatos144]

LiarasShield wrote...

still thanks for copying my link bubbles

[LiarasShield]

ahh see nice to see that we don't have to fight once in awhile lol

[BlueStorm83]

Yeah, atmosphere slowing and causing friction, or NO atmosphere and then the, you know, GROUND stopping and causing HELLA friction, either way, that's some crazy ass body armor. Maybe, MAYBE if its kinetic barriers (shields) were active, it could keep enough of Shemp intact for rebuilding him.

Even still, there's plenty of plotholes and problems in the "ending" that we can tear up. Two years to resurrect a dead man (with a process more expensive than anything before or since) does go a long way toward explaining how Fictional Science could make it happen.

Dammit, I really, really don't want to accept any of the 3 badly imagined, half-assed, Joker's Ark inducing endings.

[LiarasShield]

I hear ya

[Mandalore007]

Well Jacob does say that when they found shepard he was just meat in tubes, and later on in ME3 they say that the helmet kept the brain intact. I think all they really needed was the brain as the body was reassembled and heavily modified with cybernetics

[LiarasShield]

well liara was the one that gave cerberus shepards body or dna so that cerberus could bring him or her back to life

[Holger1405]

Thanatos144 wrote...

Redbelle wrote...

BlueStorm83 wrote...

     They did say they found him ON the planet?  Dammit, then they jumped the shark.

     And no, not the bodies before the conduit, the bodies in the red crawlspace when you get to the Conduit.  They were all un-articulated, I'd say.

Gotta go so a few quick points about finding Shep on a planet.

Atmospheric friction only burns things that enter at high speed as deceleration occurs from that friction.

The planet could have been a low atmoshere planet. If it was the same as the Normandy crash site then I remember Shep in his breather helmet.

Haven't time to form an opinion so thought I'd throw in some food for thought.

Um Falling from miles up easily reaches 32 feet per second per
second.....Terminal velocity.....Thus cause all the friction needed to burn up in atmosphere.....Just saying.

It snowed on this Planet. :innocent:

masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Alchera

Modifié par Holger1405, 16 mai 2012 - 07:37 .

[LiarasShield]

*Throws a snowball at holger and thens hides behind a snow man and giggles* O-o

[LiarasShield]

ah humor and sillyness is the only way to relieve the stress I have lol

[LiarasShield]

*Then gives bubbles a hello kitty doll* O_o

[Archonsg]

Holger1405 wrote...

Mass Effect is, I have the same opinion, mostly Science Fiction, but and this is my Point, not merely Science Fiction. The author of the conversation you quoted refers to Star Wars, and the "giant space worm that lives in an asteroid." How is that different to Kalros or any other thresher maw? There are other examples. Shepard resurrected after falling from Space to the ground of a Planet. The whole concept of Biotic (The Force much) and more.
So, imho there was already "Space Magic" or science fantasy in this Game before the Catalyst was introduced.

The space worm thing is a very valid point. 
Asteroid in space without any viable atmosphere nor eco system to feed or sustain it. What, it just sits there in vacumm and waits for a passing ship / organic to fly into its maw to feed it?
While the Thresher Maws are part of the eco system of Tuchanka, a planet, even before it was devastated by nuclear war. It can be assumed that they survived by preying on anything that moves on the surface and on themselves.

Biotics are the more "touchy" and iffy of the lot but they did make an effort to explain it. Humans all need implants and during the early stages, these implants weren't perfect, causing physical trauma and insanity in some cases. 

The point is, Biotics, "space magic" as it were, was given a set of rules on how they worked and what it could do.

Holger1405 wrote... 

Archonsg wrote...
In all three cases of the "choices" you get. NONE of them can be attributed to anything you know in game, explained in any logigcal way as to how and why they would happen.

Control COULD work though, had they "plugged" Shepard as a living mind, as a living computer, making him part of the Citadel, (similar to Project Overlord, ME2 DLC) but that would not kill or remove Shepard's physical form from the game.

I think that the problem here are the Reapers (Again?!   )  Bioware created with the Reapers a uberstrong enemy, especially for a Main character that Fights on foot. That was good for the atmosphere of the Game, and imho also for the main storyline. But in the end Bioware had no other choice than to relied on some kind of space magic or deus ex machina to solve this problem.

Perhaps, perhaps not. 
There are degrees of just how much "space magic" or dues ex machina if done well enough and worked into the narrative would not seem such a shock to the player.
The problem was that the ending as it is, had so many things wrong with it that it became a glaring 100,000,000 ilum light bulb screaming "I'm duex ex machina and here's a ton of space magic!!". 


 

Holger1405 wrote... 

Archonsg wrote...
If it is in control, it could just have easily have stopped the Reapers. Requiring your death isn't nescessary.

And THIS is a very good Point.
Admittedly Catalyst stated that he can't make this "new possibilities" happened, but there is no explanation whatsoever why he can't.  And this is not a coherence problem or a problem based on the question if this Game is science fiction or science fantasy, this is simple a logical gape.

Which is the problem. Again it is science fiction not science fantasy. Logical gapes, can be allowed if they are small but once they are as obvious as the ones found here. It is just simply bad writing.

[3DandBeyond]

Mandalore007 wrote...

Well Jacob does say that when they found shepard he was just meat in tubes, and later on in ME3 they say that the helmet kept the brain intact. I think all they really needed was the brain as the body was reassembled and heavily modified with cybernetics

Please refer to my post on this.  All they may well need is some DNA and they would likely be able to rebuild organs.  Scientists are even now researching this.  So, in the future it could be that Shepard is a bag of jelly and they could created him/her from that.

Oh heck, here's the link...

http://www.boston.co..._grow_your_own/

This makes it irrelevant what state Shepard's corpse was in, if they found one tooth it could possibly be enough.  Cerberus has advanced genetics labs.

[LiarasShield]

well I'm still happy that liara was the one that helped at getting shepards body or a part of shepards body to cerberus ^^

[Mandalore007]

LiarasShield wrote...

well I'm still happy that liara was the one that helped at getting shepards body or a part of shepards body to cerberus ^^

Agreed

[BlueStorm83]

Mmmmm hm.

[Archonsg]

3DandBeyond wrote...

Mandalore007 wrote...

Well Jacob does say that when they found shepard he was just meat in tubes, and later on in ME3 they say that the helmet kept the brain intact. I think all they really needed was the brain as the body was reassembled and heavily modified with cybernetics

Please refer to my post on this.  All they may well need is some DNA and they would likely be able to rebuild organs.  Scientists are even now researching this.  So, in the future it could be that Shepard is a bag of jelly and they could created him/her from that.

Oh heck, here's the link...

http://www.boston.co..._grow_your_own/

This makes it irrelevant what state Shepard's corpse was in, if they found one tooth it could possibly be enough.  Cerberus has advanced genetics labs.

Point of note, the planet on question has a methane, amonia atmosphere at roughly 0.8 density that of Earth and has a sub zero surface temperature. At work at the moment so can't look it up on the codex.

Also, an object "burning" up on re-entry in an atmosphere requires the presence of oxygen, which is absent in this case. The other thing of interest, would be the "scan" or x-ray of Shepard's body showing trauma to his spine, ribs, fibula and other major bone structure back in that sequence in ME2, could have sworn they took that off a skydiving accident victim.

So, they did their best to keep it "real" and plausible by giving Shepard's body a planet with an atmosphere that won't "burn" his body up on re-entry, with a surface temperature to preserve Shepard's corpse till someone gets it. And judging by the scans and physical trauma, both in bone structure and flesh damage, they at least tried to keep it "real".

[BlueStorm83]

Wow. That's a lot of research, lol. Also, should I be worried that I was gathering snow for sno-cones on that mission and sold them to a bunch of kids on the Citadel?

But yeah, that does keep it a bit real. Of course, flames from re-entry and just heat from hitting an atmosphere will both screw you up. But again, N7-grade armor with kinetic barriers to soften the blow and insulate the body. Not bad, not bad.

At hey, look at it this way! They killed him to bring him right back. I mean, they could have just left him alive and introduced the Cerberus Crew and TIMmy in another way. This was just a plot device.

Unlike the Endings Machine, which was a Machine designed to OBLITERATE the plot.

Modifié par BlueStorm83, 16 mai 2012 - 09:07 .

[Holger1405]

LiarasShield wrote...

*Throws a snowball at holger and thens hides behind a snow man and giggles* O-o

I think you Missed! 

@ Archonsg

Because I leaving  for Munich now I didn't have much time.
 
As I said before I have my own problems with the endings. They are not as big as yours or others in this Thread, but still...
 
and BTW, if you allow me to suggest, don't give up on Bioware, I think they will continue to make great Games.

[3DandBeyond]

Archonsg wrote...


Point of note, the planet on question has a methane, amonia atmosphere at roughly 0.8 density that of Earth and has a sub zero surface temperature. At work at the moment so can't look it up on the codex.

Also, an object "burning" up on re-entry in an atmosphere requires the presence of oxygen, which is absent in this case. The other thing of interest, would be the "scan" or x-ray of Shepard's body showing trauma to his spine, ribs, fibula and other major bone structure back in that sequence in ME2, could have sworn they took that off a skydiving accident victim.

So, they did their best to keep it "real" and plausible by giving Shepard's body a planet with an atmosphere that won't "burn" his body up on re-entry, with a surface temperature to preserve Shepard's corpse till someone gets it. And judging by the scans and physical trauma, both in bone structure and flesh damage, they at least tried to keep it "real".

Great information that I never realized, but I didn't have a problem with the way they did that-it was extremely emotional, played on themes within ME3 and was also an incredible entry into ME2.  I think the scene of Shepard flying out of the Normandy and the body language right before the rip in the suit kills her/him is one of the most memorable of the game.  It just epitomizes the strength of Shepard.  It's kind of defiant.

[Benchpress610]

BlueStorm83 wrote...

Wow. That's a lot of research, lol. Also, should I be worried that I was gathering snow for sno-cones on that mission and sold them to a bunch of kids on the Citadel?

But yeah, that does keep it a bit real. Of course, flames from re-entry and just heat from hitting an atmosphere will both screw you up. But again, N7-grade armor with kinetic barriers to soften the blow and insulate the body. Not bad, not bad.

At hey, look at it this way! They killed him to bring him right back. I mean, they could have just left him alive and introduced the Cerberus Crew and TIMmy in another way. This was just a plot device.

Unlike the Endings Machine, which was a Machine designed to OBLITERATE the plot.

Good point, I was never too keen on Shepard dying and then reconstructed by Cerberus. It introduced a little bit of Space Magic into the narrative. For once, perhaps Bubbles makes a valid point.
 
But I understand the writers needed a powerful reason for Shep to leave the Alliance and go to work for Cerberus. I don’t think it would’ve been plausible that Shep  renounced his commission as an Alliance Navy officer if TIM just got him in the link and said: “Hey Shep, I know we had been enemies in the past, but the Collectors are abducting human colonies and the Alliance is doing nothing about it. Here is the evidence. Wanna come help me stop them?”
 
A little space magic here at the beginning of the game was not a deal breaker. More so when it was abundantly explained in game.

[tonnactus]

3DandBeyond wrote...

This makes it irrelevant what state Shepard's corpse was in, if they found one tooth it could possibly be enough.  Cerberus has advanced genetics labs.

That would a clone. (jacob said shepard isnt)
Genes didnt store memories.

Modifié par tonnactus, 17 mai 2012 - 12:32 .

[ofarrell]

Thresher Maw beats Reaper