23455 réponses à ce sujet

[LiarasShield]

Destroying entire races isn't in form of protecting them or saving them what the catalyst is saying is lies hes is just as evil as the machines that he has made or allowed to come into existence to wipe us out

Modifié par LiarasShield, 17 mai 2012 - 06:52 .

[daveyeisley]

Malditor wrote...
However, in order to placate the overly loud minority, all other content is pushed back to give you "closure". I'm sorry, but that is just selfish.

Dude. We paid for this game. We spent our money on it because  it was advertised to us as offering a bunch of stuff we wanted.

We paid just as much money as you did.

Saying we don't deserve to be satisfied with what we paid for just because you want extra content is just as fracking selfish (if not moreso).

On top of that, they just pushed the other DLC back, they didnt cancel it. So you have to wait, just like we do, to get what you want.

The main reason we are discussing this is because the official statements on what Bioware has planned do not line up with what we are upset about.

Your comments make it pretty clear your satisfaction stems from speculation in your head. Good for you. If you had taken the time to not only read, but then also carefully consider the opposing points of view, then I might engage you in a real discussion.

What I have read so far from you is pretty close-minded and judgemental, serving no positive purpose and offering nothing productive to our discussion.

We didn't buy a product so that we would have to imagine a satisfactory conclusion that was advertised for said product.

Modifié par daveyeisley, 17 mai 2012 - 06:56 .

[Malditor]

The difference, it seems, between you and I in this debate/discussion is you are coming almost wholely from an emotional standpoint. I'm looking at it more philosophically I suppose. We will never see eye to eye, and while I can concede your point has merits you most likely would never do the same.

[Thanatos144]

daveyeisley wrote...

Malditor wrote...
However, in order to placate the overly loud minority, all other content is pushed back to give you "closure". I'm sorry, but that is just selfish.

Dude. We paid for this game. We spent our money on it because  it was advertised to use as offering a bunch of stuff we wanted.

We paid just as much money as you did.

Saying we don't deserve to be satisfied with what we paid for just because you want extra content is just as fracking selfish (if not moreso).

On top of that, they just pushed the other DLC back, they didnt cancel it. So you have to wait, just like we do, to get what you want.

The main reason we are discussing this is because the official statements on what Bioware has planned do not line up with what we are upset about.

Your comments make it pretty clear your satisfaction stems from speculation in your head. Good for you. If you had taken the time to not only read, but then also carefully consider the opposing points of view, then I might enage you in a real discussion.

What I have read so far from you is pretty close-minded and judgemental, serving no positive purpose and offering nothing productive to our discussion.

We didn't buy a product so that we would have to imagine a satisfactory conclusion that was advertised for said product.

Because you paid money for a game doesnt mean you get say in  its content.

[LiarasShield]

The catalyst is the villian shepard doesn't die like a hero he or she commits suicide and in two of the three endings the reapers live all relays are destroyed forces trapt yeah nothing heroic about that and in the third good ending it looks like shepard woke up from being hit with the harbingers beam but yes

Any being or thing that considers mass genocide in the form of helping or saving is wrong and is evil because the reapers follow the catalysts orders and they're just as equally as evil just ask harbinger and soverign

[LiarasShield]

Thanatos144 wrote...

daveyeisley wrote...

Malditor wrote...
However, in order to placate the overly loud minority, all other content is pushed back to give you "closure". I'm sorry, but that is just selfish.

Dude. We paid for this game. We spent our money on it because  it was advertised to use as offering a bunch of stuff we wanted.

We paid just as much money as you did.

Saying we don't deserve to be satisfied with what we paid for just because you want extra content is just as fracking selfish (if not moreso).

On top of that, they just pushed the other DLC back, they didnt cancel it. So you have to wait, just like we do, to get what you want.

The main reason we are discussing this is because the official statements on what Bioware has planned do not line up with what we are upset about.

Your comments make it pretty clear your satisfaction stems from speculation in your head. Good for you. If you had taken the time to not only read, but then also carefully consider the opposing points of view, then I might enage you in a real discussion.

What I have read so far from you is pretty close-minded and judgemental, serving no positive purpose and offering nothing productive to our discussion.

We didn't buy a product so that we would have to imagine a satisfactory conclusion that was advertised for said product.

Because you paid money for a game doesnt mean you get say in  its content.

Still we should get what the head man casey hudson promised would be in the game lieing in interviews and saying stuff that is suppose to be in the game or that doesn't happen is still lying and fraud against consumers he can still be sued for that ^^

[Thanatos144]

LiarasShield wrote...

The catalyst is the villian shepard doesn't die like a hero he or she commits suicide and in two of the three endings the reapers live all relays are destroyed forces trapt yeah nothing heroic about that and in the third good ending it looks like shepard woke up from being hit with the harbingers beam but yes

Any being or thing that considers mass genocide in the form of helping or saving is wrong and is evil because the reapers follow the catalysts orders and they're just as equally as evil just ask harbinger and soverign

So to translate no matter what happens if you dont get a live Shepard and blue babies you wont except any ending.....

Modifié par Thanatos144, 17 mai 2012 - 06:57 .

[Benchpress610]

Malditor wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...

he is the creator of the reapers who have been destroying and harvesting and mutating organic like for thousands or millions of years how in hells glorious name can you see this as not being evil?

Not to get into a religious argument, but the same could be said of any "god" that allows multitudes to be murdered and yet saves others. The being isn't necessarily doing anything out of evil intent, but only acting on what it believes logical or the best path to preserve future life. When faced with a person that defies the logic it has followed all along it is forced to change it's path, and putting the choice to the only one who's been able to withstand all the obsticles placed before him/her.

Except that “god” is not the one doing the murdering

[LiarasShield]

Fraud is still fraud bubbles no addjusting that ^^

[BlueStorm83]

Knowing history is irrelevant. The Dodo Bird can never in the future pose any kind of a threat to us. We killed it and all its kin. The American Indian (WRONGFULLY) was nearly wiped out and crushed. Taking millions from stupid white guys in casinos (hilarious as it is) isn't going to put them in charge of the planet. What is dead and buried can not hurt me. Kill the Reapers, and TAKE what was theirs. Reaper Tech isn't necessarily a bad thing: If you find the logs on the Cerberus base, you'll learn that EDI is part rogue VI and part Reaper Tech. Given her own identity, free from the Catalyst's nonsensical bull****, and trusted and treated as an equal, she's a hell of an ally. Same of the Geth. Once you treat them with respect and as equals, they join us freely, despite them gaining true sentience and individuality due to reaper upgrades.

Mass Effect's most positive message was "Hey, I'm me, and you're you, but that doesn't mean we can't both be US." Why else can I romance a dextro-amino-acid based girl who can't breathe my air without getting the Superflu and dying? Why else does a girl made of Titanium and silicone fall in love with a man made of Meat and Glass? Many many different things always came together not because they were forced to, but because they were shown that they could, and that they didn't have to hate each other. Human, Asari, turian, Quarrian, Krogan, Salarian, Geth- and now, in the multiplayer Resurgence pack, even BATARIAN. None of them give up anything of what they are, and can work together.

That's what bugs me so much about the endings. Nobody was defined simply by what they were. Well, nobody but the Reapers. That's what made them great bad guys. They were simple, set on their course, and not even willing to entertain that it might be worth thinking about considering not doing things the way they wanted. Then we get the Catalyst, and he feeds you 14 lines of dialogue (count them, that's the real number) that offer strawman arguments against things you know to be true.

Imagine if every day, before the sun rose, a madman ran from house to house, burning people to death, claiming that he had to, before the sun rose and the sunlight burned them all to death. Now imagine that you had, in fact, seen sunrises before. Some times the sun looked really big, some times really small. Some days it was cloudy; or even RAINING. Others the sky was pure blue. But you have irrefutable proof that sunlight won't burn people to death. Then he says "You have three options! You can destroy my flamethrower... by lighting yourself on fire and running to all the houses, burning them down. But the people will scatter and run away and around 7 eighths of them will survive. Option Two is that you can try to CONTROL my flamethrower. By taking it, burning down the houses and making the people run away before any of them burn to death. And then you have to light yourself on fire and die. Or, since you were SUPER diligent in picking up everyone's laundry before you talked to me, you have a third option. You can merge everyone in the village... WITH FIRE! They'll be half man, and HALF FIRE!" You'd be understandably confused if for some incomprehensible reason you couldn't just save everyone by killing this crazed moron.

The ending's premises are nonsense, and that's why it's bad. If you watch the second video in LiarasShield's signature, you get an ending that I could actually accept. You can even remove all the parts after the conversation with Anderson. It wraps up the game's storylines according to the motivations I had, it gives a poignant moment post victory, and it leaves things open, much like the current endings... but it leaves things open with an idea of HOPE.

[Malditor]

daveyeisley wrote...

Malditor wrote...
However, in order to placate the overly loud minority, all other content is pushed back to give you "closure". I'm sorry, but that is just selfish.

Dude. We paid for this game. We spent our money on it because  it was advertised to use as offering a bunch of stuff we wanted.

We paid just as much money as you did.

Saying we don't deserve to be satisfied with what we paid for just because you want extra content is just as fracking selfish (if not moreso).

On top of that, they just pushed the other DLC back, they didnt cancel it. So you have to wait, just like we do, to get what you want.

The main reason we are discussing this is because the official statements on what Bioware has planned do not line up with what we are upset about.

Your comments make it pretty clear your satisfaction stems from speculation in your head. Good for you. If you had taken the time to not only read, but then also carefully consider the opposing points of view, then I might enage you in a real discussion.

What I have read so far from you is pretty close-minded and judgemental, serving no positive purpose and offering nothing productive to our discussion.

We didn't buy a product so that we would have to imagine a satisfactory conclusion that was advertised for said product.

Stopping/holding up the progress of the game's content is less selfish than being satisfied with the ending... Interesting. I did not say that they shouldn't put out something that offers more closure to the game, actually I just expected it within the content released. Demanding something to give the minority of gamers closure to what the were unhappy about with the game ending before giving others any more useful content is massively more selfish, and possibly more detrimental to the overall health and longevity of the game. By the time actual playable content for the game is released, due to the delay because of work on the EC, will lead to a lot of players moving on to other new games.

[Thanatos144]

LiarasShield wrote...

Thanatos144 wrote...

daveyeisley wrote...

Malditor wrote...
However, in order to placate the overly loud minority, all other content is pushed back to give you "closure". I'm sorry, but that is just selfish.

Dude. We paid for this game. We spent our money on it because  it was advertised to use as offering a bunch of stuff we wanted.

We paid just as much money as you did.

Saying we don't deserve to be satisfied with what we paid for just because you want extra content is just as fracking selfish (if not moreso).

On top of that, they just pushed the other DLC back, they didnt cancel it. So you have to wait, just like we do, to get what you want.

The main reason we are discussing this is because the official statements on what Bioware has planned do not line up with what we are upset about.

Your comments make it pretty clear your satisfaction stems from speculation in your head. Good for you. If you had taken the time to not only read, but then also carefully consider the opposing points of view, then I might enage you in a real discussion.

What I have read so far from you is pretty close-minded and judgemental, serving no positive purpose and offering nothing productive to our discussion.

We didn't buy a product so that we would have to imagine a satisfactory conclusion that was advertised for said product.

Because you paid money for a game doesnt mean you get say in  its content.

Still we should get what the head man casey hudson promised would be in the game lieing in interviews and saying stuff that is suppose to be in the game or that doesn't happen is still lying and fraud against consumers he can still be sued for that ^^

Again for the learning impared....No one promised you a damn thing.

[LiarasShield]

nope i won't accept any ending where shepard gives into the main bad guy and that her sacrifice doesn't save the races or the galaxy that he or she fought for ^^

[daveyeisley]

Malditor wrote...

The difference, it seems, between you and I in this debate/discussion is you are coming almost wholely from an emotional standpoint. I'm looking at it more philosophically I suppose. We will never see eye to eye, and while I can concede your point has merits you most likely would never do the same.

Oh, I am invested in both an emotional and an intellectual capacity.

I am just not going to dignify some of your arguments with intellectual responses because that would involve me actually taking the time and making the effort to try and refute your thinking, which it is pretty clear you arent open to.

You havent bothered to read this thread, or the many, many, many excellent posts which have already been made that basically render your arguments null and void.

If you go back and read, and consider those posts, and then come back to use with some actual understanding of what we are discussing, then you might get somewhere. At current, you're not helping at all.

[LiarasShield]

oh thanatos mac walters and casey hudson are the main guys lol

[Malditor]

Benchpress610 wrote...

Malditor wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...

he is the creator of the reapers who have been destroying and harvesting and mutating organic like for thousands or millions of years how in hells glorious name can you see this as not being evil?

Not to get into a religious argument, but the same could be said of any "god" that allows multitudes to be murdered and yet saves others. The being isn't necessarily doing anything out of evil intent, but only acting on what it believes logical or the best path to preserve future life. When faced with a person that defies the logic it has followed all along it is forced to change it's path, and putting the choice to the only one who's been able to withstand all the obsticles placed before him/her.

Except that “god” is not the one doing the murdering

Technically, the catalyst isn't murdering anyone either.

[LiarasShield]

http://alizrak.wordp...ect-3-spoilers/

[LiarasShield]

So what the catalyst created or controls the monsters that do destroy enitre civilazations and form of life he is just as guilty as them because he directs them and tells them to destroy us unless you think hitler was such a good guy and that the ****s that caused the holocaust is such a beautiful thing

[BlueStorm83]

Everyone can have an opinion on the ending. You can be satisfied, you can be dissatisfied. Personally, I'm not saying the ending is bad, disappointing, sad, whatever. I'm saying that the ending is broken.

I hated the way that Lost ended. But I still recommend it to everyone. Because it was weird metaphysical bull**** from start to finish, and the last episode never strayed from that. It was a real bittersweet ending. But it was still Lost.

The ending of ME3 isn't Mass Effect. It denies some of the very foundations that the series was built on. Have any of you played the game Braid? The ending of that game was a very subjective, very ambiguous, very open to interpretation mind-****. And I LOVED it. It was almost undeniably a sad ending. But it made sense if you read the game's dialogue and understood the characters.

Once again Shempard would sooner have blown his brains out than obey that little ghost-doody.

[Malditor]

daveyeisley wrote...

Malditor wrote...

The difference, it seems, between you and I in this debate/discussion is you are coming almost wholely from an emotional standpoint. I'm looking at it more philosophically I suppose. We will never see eye to eye, and while I can concede your point has merits you most likely would never do the same.

Oh, I am invested in both an emotional and an intellectual capacity.

I am just not going to dignify some of your arguments with intellectual responses because that would involve me actually taking the time and making the effort to try and refute your thinking, which it is pretty clear you arent open to.

You havent bothered to read this thread, or the many, many, many excellent posts which have already been made that basically render your arguments null and void.

If you go back and read, and consider those posts, and then come back to use with some actual understanding of what we are discussing, then you might get somewhere. At current, you're not helping at all.

Actually, I've been the one who's open minded here. I didn't think there was any reason to dislike the endings to begin with, because they did, in fact, line up with my way of thinking. I do now understand the reason for some people to be unhappy with the ending. However, I will never agree that it is right and fair to hold up playable content for the EC because of those not happy with the ending. You, on the other hand seem to think that nothing matters unless you get a satisfactory ending, regardless of whether others did and would like more content to enjoy.

Just to point out, as a side note, my original comment about emotional/philosphical was meant for LiarasShield.

[daveyeisley]

Thanatos144 wrote...

daveyeisley wrote...


We didn't buy a product so that we would have to imagine a satisfactory conclusion that was advertised for said product.

Because you paid money for a game doesnt mean you get say in  its content.

Guh. Im gonna take the insipid trollbait one last time....

Paying for a game means you get the right to complain when it does not deliver its advertised content. Thats exactly what is going on here, along with thoughtful discussion of the why and how.

By rights, I should start trolling you back for this rubbish... but I'm better than that.

So, please, hit me with your best shot, bubbles.

Tell us all why we are wrong, again.

Tell us we have no right to complain, and that we should stay silent, and be grateful for what we were given.

Tell us all why you, and Malditor, and others who are satsfied with the ending are all more important than us, and your opinions and render ours irrelevant.

Yo dawg, what else? What else?

[Malditor]

LiarasShield wrote...

So what the catalyst created or controls the monsters that do destroy enitre civilazations and form of life he is just as guilty as them because he directs them and tells them to destroy us unless you think hitler was such a good guy and that the ****s that caused the holocaust is such a beautiful thing

Oh, let's jump off subject and pull Hitler into it? Wow.... that's sad. Huge difference between Hitler and the Catalyst, if you aren't able to see that then you clearly aren't thinking straight.

[Benchpress610]

Malditor wrote...

Benchpress610 wrote...

Malditor wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...

he is the creator of the reapers who have been destroying and harvesting and mutating organic like for thousands or millions of years how in hells glorious name can you see this as not being evil?

Not to get into a religious argument, but the same could be said of any "god" that allows multitudes to be murdered and yet saves others. The being isn't necessarily doing anything out of evil intent, but only acting on what it believes logical or the best path to preserve future life. When faced with a person that defies the logic it has followed all along it is forced to change it's path, and putting the choice to the only one who's been able to withstand all the obsticles placed before him/her.

Except that “god” is not the one doing the murdering

Technically, the catalyst isn't murdering anyone either.

Technically?...Last time I checked he/it (whatever) was the one who created the reapers for specific mission of controlling the chaos of organic life by comitting genocide on them every 50K years.

[LiarasShield]

Still if you think the catalyst is a good guy then you might as well think hitler was a hero too but the catalyst is even worse then hitlers n a z i s because his reapers destroy hundreds of thousands of different life every 50 thousand years and if you think this is ok then we better not meet in rl because i'd probably battle you to the bitter end for thinking such evil is ok and or acceptable

[LiarasShield]

yes Except the catalyst is more twisted then hitler and more evil because he thinks by destroying thousands or hundreds of civilizations that he is actually saving us bull**** he and his reapers or destroying life whenever they appear they aren't saving or chaning bthe cycle only adding onto the chaos if you support this like I said I would most likely stop you before you caused hundreds or thousands of lives to die