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[bayul]

LiarasShield wrote...

bayul wrote...

sdinc009 wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...

But The ending to this final bit of the trilogy Will forever divide the fanbase and here it is

The group who supposedly like the ending but can't give any real reasons why the ending was great other then saying it was great well different colored explosions and cotton candy for the win yay

The Other group who either sees the ending or everything after the harbingers beam as only indoctrination or a big dream sequence which I'd almost be willing to accept because it is better then giving up the the reaper creator and ultimately giving up to what he wants to happen

And Then the group I fall into that can't accept a suicide or submitting to the reaper creator who has created the reapers that has been destroying advanced organics for aeons under the twisted logic of him saving them and for shepard to just give up or for the reapers to live in almost all the endings or for our forces to be trapt in our damaged solar system getting screwed over by the reaper creator we came to defeat their forces not have them run us down so easily

I'm with you LiaraShields!

And the group that wants to fix the abysmal plot blunders of the game AND add what is necesary to make this product much more profitable and unforgettable.The group that wants to save the Mass Effect galaxy.

wouldn't that still fall in with the group that i'm in that can't accept a we lose ending no matter what we did or giving into the enemy and doing what he wants because of the twisted logic or plot holes that presented lol?

Yes. I'm just present the group in a more neutral way. So that everybody aligns behind the same IMPROVE banner instead of dividing themselves and giving Bioware yet another reason to not process our ideas and make them toilet paper for their maintnance staff.

[bayul]

Voodoo-j wrote...

Actually that Poll..
91 % the ending is wrong
6 % just needs further explanation

If that 6% is the IT group...

A 91% is a very compelling number. I would be compelled to reunite my creative staff to discuss such a study.

[BlueStorm83]

I think that the Indoctrination Theory WOULD have been a great idea - if after Shepard woke up there was an actual conclusion to the game,
-to the trilogy,
-to the reaper war,
-to the cycles,
-to every character's storylines,
-to the Citadel's politics,
-to humanity finding their place in the galaxy,
-to Cerberus' "At All Cost" policies,
-to the Krogans' decision as to if they'll get revenge on the Salarians and Turians,
-to the question if everyone on the citadel is alive or dead,
And to the ongoing narative of Shepard's story altogether. 

BioWare promised that:
1:  You wouldn't be picking from ending A, B, and C.
2:  They wouldn't "Do a 'Lost' and leave people with more questions than answers
3:  There would be WILDLY different and variable endings that hinged on EVERYTHING you did.
4:  Everyone would be satisfied.

I am not satisfied, so #4 is out.  If you discount the colors of the energy, the endings use around 75% to 90% the same footage, depending on how you handle minor differences.  So #3 is untrue.  This thread is FULL of questions, so BAM, number 2 is false also.  And in the end, we literally, LITERALLY have 3 endings set before us (From a LITERAL DEUS EX MACHINA who lives INSIDE A MCGUFFIN) from which we must pick from.  The product was not as advertised.

I almost want to start a campaign wherein we shatter our ME3 discs and mail them to BioWare with a snort note that states only "We chose the Destroy Ending."  ALMOST.  Don't actually do that.  Good or bad, what you buy is your own.  So I guess do that if you want, but I won't.  I still like the multiplayer.  And hope hope HOPE that the Extended Cut ending makes the Indoc Theory true just so the ending will be less bizarre nonsensical and terrible.  It'll still be unacceptable (Since then we STILL didn't TAKE BACK EARTH as all the marketing said.)  But it would be better.

[AlienShagger]

LiarasShield wrote...

Their is no way in the shining burning red star of our sun can I accept a ending where we give into the enemy that has been destroying the galaxy and us The very same enemy that we brought the entire galaxy to beat them I did not bring us all together I didn't bring the armies to fight the reapers only to submit to their creator or have the reaper god tell me what my final options are and just submitting to him

Shepard in general has always been about finding another way or not giving up under extreme Impossiable situations but not only does he or she break characters and gives up entirely but gives into the head of the reapers to have the reapers pick what they want and for them to ultimately win it is the shame nonsense that ruined Final Fantasy 13-2 where no matter all that you did the bad guys still wins or for all your actions to not meaning anything or for it to not change anything at all

I think he was in-character all along. There were many times you had just one option and only a red/blue way to get through the non-choice. This is not the case with the last scenes; here you get real choices (I really try to go with the positive examples):

1) control - people in real life attempt to become powerful to exert influence on society (George Soros)
2) synthesis - working within the system to influence society (Joseph Stiglitz)
3) rebellion - rejection of the system and fight (Leonard Peltier)

The choice really is a mirror of the discussion we have in our society on how to affect change. BioWare wants you to make the choice, given a government that is as bad as you can imagine (Reapers).

I think 3) is the only way to go. Others may think 1) and 2) are acceptable. I really did my best with Stiglitz, 'cause I don't think synthesis deserves a fighter.

[BlueStorm83]

Again, AlienShagger, Mass Effect hasn't been a societal sociopolitical analogy all along, it's been a SciFi Talky/Techy war story. You're making HUGE leaps in logic with no base within the game itself. For 140 hours of blowing **** up to stop evil space cuttlefish to then *supposedly* end with a commentary on our government is either a horrendous betrayal of your base audience or not real.

[Benchpress610]

Voodoo-j wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...

I honestly doubt they're paying attention to the forums anymore or this thread anymore because if they were we probably would've at least gotten some decent response or being able to have a decent talk with the moderators so we get a sense of they actually are listening and maybe even care instead of pure silence with talk to the hand being the model because that is what it is right now and you know what if they were paying attention to this thread I'd probably would've been banned or warned for cussing out other people who I think are wrong or for me reposting my comments through quotes

I certianly agree with that, I was considering pushing the envelope especially with bubbles ( I did a bit when I changed his quote )  But how Renegade do I have to go?

Either they have been told to leave this hands off no matter what, or they are not listening.

Agreed…they are not distinguishing themselves by their smooth PR campaign…oh wait, there is not a PR campaign, the are just silent. I’d be out there trying to smooth thing out with the fans…then again, while BW made fantastic games, their PR always stunk.

[Benchpress610]

@ AlienShagger
You call those “positive examples”? I think you, and everyone else, should keep political opinions and themes outside this forum if we don’t want this thread to degenerate into a political philosophical debate at best or all out mud slinging at worst. Please let’s keep it within the Mass Effect universe for the betterment of all.

[AlienShagger]

BlueStorm83 wrote...

Again, AlienShagger, Mass Effect hasn't been a societal sociopolitical analogy all along, it's been a SciFi Talky/Techy war story. You're making HUGE leaps in logic with no base within the game itself. For 140 hours of blowing **** up to stop evil space cuttlefish to then *supposedly* end with a commentary on our government is either a horrendous betrayal of your base audience or not real.

Sorry, i just love the outrage and how active and creative people are about it. After we get the new and fixed DLC ending, maybe we should go join the occupy movement or something that could fix the treatment of Palestinians or get some bank CEOs arrested

[BlueStorm83]

lol.  I agree with arresting bank CEOs.  I'd like to burn the Palestinians.  Anyone who launches missiles into a residential area is automatically the bad guys.

And let's burn the Occupy guys too.  Because they smell.

Revolutions are only real when people have guns.

[Benchpress610]

BlueStorm83 wrote...

lol.  I agree with arresting bank CEOs.  I'd like to burn the Palestinians.  Anyone who launches missiles into a residential area is automatically the bad guys.

And let's burn the Occupy guys too.  Because they smell.

Revolutions are only real when people have guns.

Agreed...but let's keep ploitical issues out....please...

[LiarasShield]

no shepard didn't follow character and broke everything giving into the reapers and their creator and the circular wrong logic that their creator presents and forces shepard into making the decisions that the reapers want

And alien your whole point going off this is the indoctrination theory which they have already denied I mean it is already bad enough that they promised 16 different endings and how we wouldn't get a abc ending but that is exactly what we got or how our actions would affect the ending and not everybody would get the same endings but that is what we got we have shepard submitting to the creator of the reapers for 3 different colored suicide explosions that don't really accomplish anything other then your forces being stranded and shepard dying and the reaper god smiling at the end yay Go us

uh no no no no no lol O-o my sanity will not acknowledge such failure espically in video games because the whole sense of trying to beat the game is to indeed beat the game not the game beat you

Modifié par LiarasShield, 22 mai 2012 - 04:20 .

[AlienShagger]

Benchpress610 wrote...

BlueStorm83 wrote...

lol.  I agree with arresting bank CEOs.  I'd like to burn the Palestinians.  Anyone who launches missiles into a residential area is automatically the bad guys.

And let's burn the Occupy guys too.  Because they smell.

Revolutions are only real when people have guns.

Agreed...but let's keep ploitical issues out....please...

Indoctrinated presence detected! Activating Security Protocols!

[AlienShagger]

Instead of double-post, here's the right choice:

Modifié par AlienShagger, 22 mai 2012 - 04:26 .

[LiarasShield]

The indoctrination would've been cool because then shepard wouldn't have submitted to the reapers wouldn't have commited a rainbow color suicde but because the It theory was denied in the final hours app and during once of their news annoucements It unfortunately won't happen in extended but it still would've been cooler then total submission and agreeing with the reaper creator to essentially doom us all and then riddle us down with plot holes

[LiarasShield]

If I knew we'd ultimately kiss the reapers asses and let them win I'd wouldve had shepard eat a plasma or shrapnel grenade first and die in that blaze of glory at least then shepard wouldn't have agreed or submitted to the reaper leader

[Ben20530]

I finished ME3 yesterday, like so many I was left empty, despondent and to be honest a bit of a mess.

I have loved ME from the beginning, proceeding immediately down the war hero paragon route, romancing Ash, then enjoying every minute of the experience. To this day I can't bring myself to stray from paragon or Ash. I finished the game in triumph with my LI at my side

I moved on to ME2, pined for Ash, stayed faithful and marvelled at the ME universe once more. I replayed until we all got out of the collector base alive and loyal. I revelled in the triumph of the ending again, even without Ash.

Then ME3 came and I genuinely worried about who would live and who would die. I not stupid, I knew that the omens for Shep were not good, but I drove on in hope I could beat the odds. For the first time in 20 odd years of gaming I shouted in despair at the screen as Ash was beaten to a pulp, I knew that in the third of any trilogy - all bets are off on who survives. I nearly shouted again with joy as I realised my long nurtured LI would survive and set about revelling in the ME universe again, even as some of my comrades fell to hourable deaths.

I rekindled my LI, tied up every loose end I could, spoke to all and sundry as if it were my own wake. I loved every minute and like all good stories, could not put it down.

Then to London, where the foreboding came ever more present and as I walked down the pummeled streets I knew I was speaking to the squad for the last time. I choked as I said goodbye to Ash.

Then the beginning of the end, which I will not cover again as it has all been said. Suffice to say, I was devastated, a grown man so invested in his "game" that the sense of loss was tangible.

Now I don't know what the future holds, and reading this thread has brought me some solace, some hope that I am not alone in my despair. Don't get me wrong, I'm a romantic, and the happy ending with the same triumph of ME1 & ME2 would always be my first choice but.......

If that is not to be I would ask not to have the secrets of cycles and universes explained to me, nor the colour of my choice dwelt upon. I would ask please,

What happened to my friends?


Thanks for reading, and torch me if you like. But I came to ME a hopeless do gooder romantic soldier and thats damn well how I'll leave!

[LiarasShield]

I feel your loss ben more then you know and it affects me on a level so extreme so high it was like watching the death of the human spirit the way shepard just gave up to the reaper creator the catalayst instead of never giving up instead holding his or her ground or questiong or fighting against the twisted logic and the catalyst shepard becomes a zombie and just submits not only did shepard die in the ending but everything that he or she stood for died with him or her

Modifié par LiarasShield, 22 mai 2012 - 04:40 .

[Iakus]

Ben20530 wrote...

I finished ME3 yesterday, like so many I was left empty, despondent and to be honest a bit of a mess.

I have loved ME from the beginning, proceeding immediately down the war hero paragon route, romancing Ash, then enjoying every minute of the experience. To this day I can't bring myself to stray from paragon or Ash. I finished the game in triumph with my LI at my side

I moved on to ME2, pined for Ash, stayed faithful and marvelled at the ME universe once more. I replayed until we all got out of the collector base alive and loyal. I revelled in the triumph of the ending again, even without Ash.

Then ME3 came and I genuinely worried about who would live and who would die. I not stupid, I knew that the omens for Shep were not good, but I drove on in hope I could beat the odds. For the first time in 20 odd years of gaming I shouted in despair at the screen as Ash was beaten to a pulp, I knew that in the third of any trilogy - all bets are off on who survives. I nearly shouted again with joy as I realised my long nurtured LI would survive and set about revelling in the ME universe again, even as some of my comrades fell to hourable deaths.

I rekindled my LI, tied up every loose end I could, spoke to all and sundry as if it were my own wake. I loved every minute and like all good stories, could not put it down.

Then to London, where the foreboding came ever more present and as I walked down the pummeled streets I knew I was speaking to the squad for the last time. I choked as I said goodbye to Ash.

Then the beginning of the end, which I will not cover again as it has all been said. Suffice to say, I was devastated, a grown man so invested in his "game" that the sense of loss was tangible.

Now I don't know what the future holds, and reading this thread has brought me some solace, some hope that I am not alone in my despair. Don't get me wrong, I'm a romantic, and the happy ending with the same triumph of ME1 & ME2 would always be my first choice but.......

If that is not to be I would ask not to have the secrets of cycles and universes explained to me, nor the colour of my choice dwelt upon. I would ask please,

What happened to my friends?


Thanks for reading, and torch me if you like. But I came to ME a hopeless do gooder romantic soldier and thats damn well how I'll leave!

man, that could have been me writing that post.

rekindling the relationship with Ash was one of my Shepard's great accomplishments in the game.  After all the loss and heartache, to finally reconnect with someone he cared about, and to build the relationship even stronger than before was one of ME3's great achievements.  Almost enough to make me forgive ME2 for Horizon.  Almost...

Then ME3 with it's "choose the color of your destruction"

What was the point?  Why rekindle, or pursue any relationship, when it will all end in tears?  IT takes omething beautiful and turnsit to ash. Not Ash, ash.

[sdinc009]

Ben20530 wrote...

I finished ME3 yesterday, like so many I was left empty, despondent and to be honest a bit of a mess.

I have loved ME from the beginning, proceeding immediately down the war hero paragon route, romancing Ash, then enjoying every minute of the experience. To this day I can't bring myself to stray from paragon or Ash. I finished the game in triumph with my LI at my side

I moved on to ME2, pined for Ash, stayed faithful and marvelled at the ME universe once more. I replayed until we all got out of the collector base alive and loyal. I revelled in the triumph of the ending again, even without Ash.

Then ME3 came and I genuinely worried about who would live and who would die. I not stupid, I knew that the omens for Shep were not good, but I drove on in hope I could beat the odds. For the first time in 20 odd years of gaming I shouted in despair at the screen as Ash was beaten to a pulp, I knew that in the third of any trilogy - all bets are off on who survives. I nearly shouted again with joy as I realised my long nurtured LI would survive and set about revelling in the ME universe again, even as some of my comrades fell to hourable deaths.

I rekindled my LI, tied up every loose end I could, spoke to all and sundry as if it were my own wake. I loved every minute and like all good stories, could not put it down.

Then to London, where the foreboding came ever more present and as I walked down the pummeled streets I knew I was speaking to the squad for the last time. I choked as I said goodbye to Ash.

Then the beginning of the end, which I will not cover again as it has all been said. Suffice to say, I was devastated, a grown man so invested in his "game" that the sense of loss was tangible.

Now I don't know what the future holds, and reading this thread has brought me some solace, some hope that I am not alone in my despair. Don't get me wrong, I'm a romantic, and the happy ending with the same triumph of ME1 & ME2 would always be my first choice but.......

If that is not to be I would ask not to have the secrets of cycles and universes explained to me, nor the colour of my choice dwelt upon. I would ask please,

What happened to my friends?


Thanks for reading, and torch me if you like. But I came to ME a hopeless do gooder romantic soldier and thats damn well how I'll leave!

Feel the same way.

[Benchpress610]

Ben20530 wrote...

I finished ME3 yesterday, like so many I was left empty, despondent and to be honest a bit of a mess.

I have loved ME from the beginning, proceeding immediately down the war hero paragon route, romancing Ash, then enjoying every minute of the experience. To this day I can't bring myself to stray from paragon or Ash. I finished the game in triumph with my LI at my side

I moved on to ME2, pined for Ash, stayed faithful and marvelled at the ME universe once more. I replayed until we all got out of the collector base alive and loyal. I revelled in the triumph of the ending again, even without Ash.

Then ME3 came and I genuinely worried about who would live and who would die. I not stupid, I knew that the omens for Shep were not good, but I drove on in hope I could beat the odds. For the first time in 20 odd years of gaming I shouted in despair at the screen as Ash was beaten to a pulp, I knew that in the third of any trilogy - all bets are off on who survives. I nearly shouted again with joy as I realised my long nurtured LI would survive and set about revelling in the ME universe again, even as some of my comrades fell to hourable deaths.

I rekindled my LI, tied up every loose end I could, spoke to all and sundry as if it were my own wake. I loved every minute and like all good stories, could not put it down.

Then to London, where the foreboding came ever more present and as I walked down the pummeled streets I knew I was speaking to the squad for the last time. I choked as I said goodbye to Ash.

Then the beginning of the end, which I will not cover again as it has all been said. Suffice to say, I was devastated, a grown man so invested in his "game" that the sense of loss was tangible.

Now I don't know what the future holds, and reading this thread has brought me some solace, some hope that I am not alone in my despair. Don't get me wrong, I'm a romantic, and the happy ending with the same triumph of ME1 & ME2 would always be my first choice but.......

If that is not to be I would ask not to have the secrets of cycles and universes explained to me, nor the colour of my choice dwelt upon. I would ask please,

What happened to my friends?


Thanks for reading, and torch me if you like. But I came to ME a hopeless do gooder romantic soldier and thats damn well how I'll leave!

Pretty much my own experience and most people's in this thread...welcome to the club...

Modifié par Benchpress610, 22 mai 2012 - 04:46 .

[Ben20530]

I will play it again soon, when I have calmed down. But I will get to London, talk to everyone, walk up to Anderson's battle map....and save the game. I could not put myself through the end again, not until the DLC which I already fear to be a lost cause.

I would much rather witness the glorious death of all my squad than simply not know their fates.

[Holger1405]

Redbelle wrote...

@Holger.

Should we all just hold hands and accept that those opinions you deemed offensive are opinions and appreciate them? Although being deemed statements may reduce them to not being opinions....... though why you would deem their statements that could be deemed opinions as not the absolute truth does accept that their may be some truth in those opinions/statements.

I didn't say that you have to accept every Opinion. There are many Opinions I will never accept, but I will respect them because every Person has the right to think different.  Still, there are Opinions I will never accept nor respect.
For example: I am a German. So I will never accept or respect a Opinion that tries to trivialize the Crimes of the ****s and the Third Reich.

(Also I know that there are People out there who only say that they love the endings because they are Bioware Fan boy's. It's just that this is not true for all the People who love the endings.)

But this is about a damn video game, don't get me wrong, imho it is the best dame video game I ever Played, and I love it, but to state that People who have a different opinion about the endings or a possible sacrifice of Shepard are partly insane, or must be "horrible sick" (And don't tell my she/he didn't implied that with is little insertion) is way out of line.   
 

Redbelle wrote...
Urgh, I can't keep this up all day.

But to end on a note of unity. The endings, while unsatisfying for me, were acceptable to others. I get that. I've also had chats where ppl have expressed why they thought the endings were good. While I still maintain they were not up to the quality that BW have delivered time and again, the different perspectives allows me to re-evaluate my opinion based on new information.

We agree on that.

[LiarasShield]

I hear ya ben and yeah you share what alot of us are feeling

[LiarasShield]

Giving up the the reaper creator the catalyst only following the options that the catalysts desires having in both endings the reapers lvie while in all endngs the cliff hanger is our forces trapt around our damaged solar system while are loyal crew left or abandon us to be either destroyed by the reapers or to be trapt in sace

In my mind it can't get much worse really

[Holger1405]

sdinc009 wrote...

Holger1405 wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...




Still can't think why a suicide with no real victory is appealing to some of you it just makes me question the very sanity of people today U-u

BlueStorm83 wrote...

--- I'm quick to say that anyone who LOVED the endings is just a blind fanboy. While I acknowledge that it is possible for a human being to enjoy anything (LOTS of horrible sick fetishes exist) I'd be more willing to believe that people would say things like, "If the Catalyst created not only the Reapers, but all current organic life as well, I'd be willing to trust him and then ending BLANK was satisfying to me." Qualify it. I can accept a victory ending, I can accept a defeat ending. I can't accept an ending that tries to do both, succeeds at neither, and hinges on a character with a POWERFULLY independant and decisionmaking personality just kinda give up.

Ironically, Shepard was Shepherded into three near-identical cluster****s.

These two statements showing an incredible lack of appreciation for other people's opinions.
In addition they are offensive, especially because they are also based on opinions only. Opinions who are neither confirmed nor the absolute truth.

@Holger1405
I'm inclined to agree you here. There's no need to insult others based soley on their opinion. I don't agree with the people that like the ending and have many posts that detail how it is a terribly broken ending, but I do not need to reduce myself to insults to get my point across. Let's keep things repectful people

Agreed.

Modifié par Holger1405, 22 mai 2012 - 04:52 .