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[Genera1Nemesis]

111987 wrote...

Beast919 wrote...

THE REASON WHY IS THE ENTIRE CRUX OF THE REAPER ARGUMENT.  If you're saying the Quarians making Geth, panicing, trying to murder them, then coming to peace with them after trying to murder them a second time is the same as the Geth trying to dominate all organic life as we know it.....

I really am done with you.  You simply don't think through what you're saying.

The past two cycles have proven that AI *DO NOT* have an inherant thirst for organic blood nor the capability to followthrough on it.

Ugh...okay. Are you just forgetting about the whole heretic Geth thing? Remember, the Heretic Geth CHOSE to follow Sovereign and attack organics. They weren't forced to; they CHOSE it. That right there supports the Starchild's thinking.

The past two cycles have shown different cases of synthetics and organics warring against each other.

Exactly. All it takes is one. That's it. Just one AI that wants to wipe out life by it's own choice for the Catalyst to be right.

[Wowlock]

You are talking about killing entire species just because '' something MIGHT happen'' ...

You know how much tragedy happened in history because of the messed up logic ? That logic only serves to those with an ill mind. If you ask a murderer why he killed those people he killed, he will answer ''For their own good '' . And that is the kind of response we get from the Reapers.

If you can actually support than idea, then you must be paranoid since Organics can wipe eachother as we saw many times. But would it help to speed the process ? Would you try to kill someone because someday ''he might go crazy and kill me ! ''

And no, harvesting organics and ''saving'' their materials won't justify genocide ( in fact it sounds more like Hitler's logic than anything and we know how that turned out ). They are not ''saving'' species...they are growing their numbers and somehow justify their acts.

All I see is Reapers enforcing their sick and twisted logic upon the rest , basicly bullying the galaxy. They act as if they have the rights to play with Organic lives whether for good or ill. In the end, anything that destroy our free-will is not something you can support.

[Doctoglethorpe]

Only sith deal in absolutes.

[111987]

General User wrote...

In the last two cycles, organics triumphed over synthetics and organics and synthetics managed to find accomodation respectively.  Neither of which fits the StarKid's mold.

Starchild never said that wasn't possible. He just said that eventually the Created will always turn on the Creators. We saw this in the Prothean's time, with the Heretic Geth, the Luna VI and Overlord AI.

As organics advance, so do their AI's. Eventually, an AI will be created that dooms organics. That's the starchild's argument. We haven't seen this 'advanced' AI because the Reapers invade before it happens.

[Beast919]

111987 wrote...

Beast919 wrote...

THE REASON WHY IS THE ENTIRE CRUX OF THE REAPER ARGUMENT.  If you're saying the Quarians making Geth, panicing, trying to murder them, then coming to peace with them after trying to murder them a second time is the same as the Geth trying to dominate all organic life as we know it.....

I really am done with you.  You simply don't think through what you're saying.

The past two cycles have proven that AI *DO NOT* have an inherant thirst for organic blood nor the capability to followthrough on it.

Ugh...okay. Are you just forgetting about the whole heretic Geth thing? Remember, the Heretic Geth CHOSE to follow Sovereign and attack organics. They weren't forced to; they CHOSE it. That right there supports the Starchild's thinking.

The past two cycles have shown different cases of synthetics and organics warring against each other.

Uh.....the synthetics chose to follow Reaper overlords that offered them the pinnacle of their evolution (which, in of itself is a lie, by the way), and start a war.  This sure proves they wanted to end the life of all organics everywhere, and weren't just a civilization trying to get an upper hand *cough* humans finding prothean ruins and going to war with Turians with newfound technology *cough*

Guess what the past two cycles have also shown.  Organics winning.

Your thought process is so deluded its sad.  At the core of your argument, you're willing to trust what a random, godchild-AI is telling you to try and justify his extermination of all life as you know it.  That is just sad.  Regardless of whether or not its true, or canon, or the intentional ending, the fact that you're willing to accept it at face value, is sad.

If you were Shepard we would be so ****ed.

[111987]

forgottenlord wrote...

111987 wrote...

Everyone else's logic seems to be "The Reapers are just lying", without any proof of it. In my mind, that's worse. Which is probably why I don't see fault with the Starchild's logic.

I'm working off the evidence we have at hand. Other people are working off the assumption that evidence is false, despitw having no evidence that said evidence is false.

Apologies if this has already been hashed.  I didn't get a chance to go through the now 14 pages worth of debate

On page 8, I went into, at length, my arguments why starchild's claims don't make sense - I don't want to repeat them here, but I went through extensive effort to try and counter starchild's arguments - and none of them are based upon starchild's claims being false but rather overly simplistic.  In effect, I'm arguing that Starchild isn't nearly as advanced or smart as it thinks it is.

Sorry, I didn't see your arguments. I'll take a look at them when the debates I currently have going on die down a bit.

[forgottenlord]

Examurai1 wrote...

Whats with this dark energy theory I've been hearing about? I mean reading through the forums some people mentions this, was this what the ending was meant to be originally before they changed or something.

The original plot was something along the lines of the use of Mass Effect fields causes buildups of Dark Matter causing galactic instability blah blah blah so the cycle was really the Reapers trying to prevent societies from reaching a point where they can inadvertantly destroy the galaxy.  Or something like that.  There's more twists to it but it got leaked and canned in favor of this synthetic singularity plot instead.

[General User]

111987 wrote...
Ugh...okay. Are you just forgetting about the whole heretic Geth thing? Remember, the Heretic Geth CHOSE to follow Sovereign and attack organics. They weren't forced to; they CHOSE it. That right there supports the Starchild's thinking.

The Heretics chose to do so only at the behest of the StarKid's agent.  And they were defeated.  Both of which argue against the StarKid's philosophy and it personally.

111987 wrote...
The past two cycles have shown different cases of synthetics and organics warring against each other.

Also different cases of organics and organics warring against each other.  And different cases of synthetics and synthetics warring against each other. 

Lots of different people have fought against each other (and made peace) for alot of reasons, and will continue to do so no matter what.  What makes a potential conflict between these two particular forms of life so worthy of special attention?

[111987]

Beast919 wrote...
Uh.....the synthetics chose to follow Reaper overlords that offered them the pinnacle of their evolution (which, in of itself is a lie, by the way), and start a war.  This sure proves they wanted to end the life of all organics everywhere, and weren't just a civilization trying to get an upper hand *cough* humans finding prothean ruins and going to war with Turians with newfound technology *cough*

Guess what the past two cycles have also shown.  Organics winning.

You are once again missing the point. It doesn't matter than organics were winning. As organics continue to advance, so does their AI. Eventually, the AI will become too advanced to defeat. Just like how Overlord would have been too advanced to defeat.

The comparison between the humans and Turians is totally irrelevant by the way. i would hope you could understand that. The fact that the Heretic Geth were willing to break off from the main Geth collective, to kill organics and ascend at the expense or organics, just shows how the Starchild is right. Even if Sovereign wasn't there, this instance proves that an synthetic's desire to become greater and more powerful could very well put them at odds with organics.

Beast919 wrote...
Your thought process is so deluded its sad.  At the core of your argument, you're willing to trust what a random, godchild-AI is telling you to try and justify his extermination of all life as you know it.  That is just sad.  Regardless of whether or not its true, or canon, or the intentional ending, the fact that you're willing to accept it at face value, is sad.

If you were Shepard we would be so ****ed.

Enough with the personal attacks. They contribute nothing to the discussion. i thought you were 'done with me', anyways?

[OtaconUCF]

111987 wrote...

Beast919 wrote...

THE REASON WHY IS THE ENTIRE CRUX OF THE REAPER ARGUMENT.  If you're saying the Quarians making Geth, panicing, trying to murder them, then coming to peace with them after trying to murder them a second time is the same as the Geth trying to dominate all organic life as we know it.....

I really am done with you.  You simply don't think through what you're saying.

The past two cycles have proven that AI *DO NOT* have an inherant thirst for organic blood nor the capability to followthrough on it.

Ugh...okay. Are you just forgetting about the whole heretic Geth thing? Remember, the Heretic Geth CHOSE to follow Sovereign and attack organics. They weren't forced to; they CHOSE it. That right there supports the Starchild's thinking.

The past two cycles have shown different cases of synthetics and organics warring against each other.

I think you need to go reread the background on the Geth here. After the Morning War the geth decided they wer going to build a structure to house all of the geth platforms and set about doing that. The heretics, which were a minority in the Geth network, agreed to join with Sovereign and Saren and aid them in exchange for technological gifts to aid them in the construction of this Dyson Sphere/giant server farm. The majority of the Geth consensus rejected the Reaper's offer and went about their own business of attempting to build it, until the Quarians came along in ME3 and wrecked it with a large chunk of the Consensus already installed in it.

If Sovereign had never shown up the entire Geth population would have just continued on their merry way, minding their own business until the Quarians came in as the aggressors again. I don't see how the Reapers causing their justification for their existance and actions in this case as a very strong indicator that they are absolutely right, from the perspective of Shepard anyway. If you agree with me that the Catalyst and Reapers are misguided than clearly they must believe so whole heartedly(or whatever the Reaper equivalent of a heart is) that they can't even see the possibility for peace that the story of the Geth presents.

http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Geth 

[111987]

General User wrote...
The Heretics chose to do so only at the behest of the StarKid's agent.  And they were defeated.  Both of which argue against the StarKid's philosophy and it personally.

The fact that the temptation for greater power would make them willingly go against organics supports the Starchld, does it not? Regardless of where that temptation comes from.

General User wrote...

Also different cases of organics and organics warring against each other.  And different cases of synthetics and synthetics warring against each other. 

Lots of different people have fought against each other (and made peace) for alot of reasons, and will continue to do so no matter what.  What makes a potential conflict between these two particular forms of life so worthy of special attention?

That's a good question. The Reapers obviously think it's a more serious conflict...dunno why though.

Once again, I'm not saying the Reapers are right. You can have perfectly sound logic and still be wrong about something.

Modifié par 111987, 16 mars 2012 - 03:48 .

[Genera1Nemesis]

OtaconUCF wrote...

111987 wrote...

Beast919 wrote...

THE REASON WHY IS THE ENTIRE CRUX OF THE REAPER ARGUMENT.  If you're saying the Quarians making Geth, panicing, trying to murder them, then coming to peace with them after trying to murder them a second time is the same as the Geth trying to dominate all organic life as we know it.....

I really am done with you.  You simply don't think through what you're saying.

The past two cycles have proven that AI *DO NOT* have an inherant thirst for organic blood nor the capability to followthrough on it.

Ugh...okay. Are you just forgetting about the whole heretic Geth thing? Remember, the Heretic Geth CHOSE to follow Sovereign and attack organics. They weren't forced to; they CHOSE it. That right there supports the Starchild's thinking.

The past two cycles have shown different cases of synthetics and organics warring against each other.

I think you need to go reread the background on the Geth here. After the Morning War the geth decided they wer going to build a structure to house all of the geth platforms and set about doing that. The heretics, which were a minority in the Geth network, agreed to join with Sovereign and Saren and aid them in exchange for technological gifts to aid them in the construction of this Dyson Sphere/giant server farm. The majority of the Geth consensus rejected the Reaper's offer and went about their own business of attempting to build it, until the Quarians came along in ME3 and wrecked it with a large chunk of the Consensus already installed in it.

If Sovereign had never shown up the entire Geth population would have just continued on their merry way, minding their own business until the Quarians came in as the aggressors again. I don't see how the Reapers causing their justification for their existance and actions in this case as a very strong indicator that they are absolutely right, from the perspective of Shepard anyway. If you agree with me that the Catalyst and Reapers are misguided than clearly they must believe so whole heartedly(or whatever the Reaper equivalent of a heart is) that they can't even see the possibility for peace that the story of the Geth presents.

http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Geth 

That's just it; Sovereign proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that there was an AI in existance that chose to kill organics in order to advance themselves.

[111987]

OtaconUCF wrote...


I think you need to go reread the background on the Geth here. After the Morning War the geth decided they wer going to build a structure to house all of the geth platforms and set about doing that. The heretics, which were a minority in the Geth network, agreed to join with Sovereign and Saren and aid them in exchange for technological gifts to aid them in the construction of this Dyson Sphere/giant server farm. The majority of the Geth consensus rejected the Reaper's offer and went about their own business of attempting to build it, until the Quarians came along in ME3 and wrecked it with a large chunk of the Consensus already installed in it.

If Sovereign had never shown up the entire Geth population would have just continued on their merry way, minding their own business until the Quarians came in as the aggressors again. I don't see how the Reapers causing their justification for their existance and actions in this case as a very strong indicator that they are absolutely right, from the perspective of Shepard anyway. If you agree with me that the Catalyst and Reapers are misguided than clearly they must believe so whole heartedly(or whatever the Reaper equivalent of a heart is) that they can't even see the possibility for peace that the story of the Geth presents.

http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Geth 

The Geth weren't peaceful in the 300 years before the events of ME1. Have you all forgotten how they would brutally kill anything that came near their territory, including people seeking peace with the Geth?

The fact that the Heretics would be willing to kill organics to achieve their own power shows how the Starchild's logic works. Even if Sovereign wasn't involved, it shows how if the opportunity presented itself, some AI would take the opportunity to butcher organics if it bettered themselves.

[Beast919]

111987 wrote...

You are once again missing the point. It doesn't matter than organics were winning. As organics continue to advance, so does their AI. Eventually, the AI will become too advanced to defeat. Just like how Overlord would have been too advanced to defeat.

Again your *ONLY* evidence to support the theory is what Reaper-Godchild tells you.  EVERYTHING ELSE points to this not being an outcome.

The comparison between the humans and Turians is totally irrelevant by the way. i would hope you could understand that. The fact that the Heretic Geth were willing to break off from the main Geth collective, to kill organics and ascend at the expense or organics, just shows how the Starchild is right. Even if Sovereign wasn't there, this instance proves that an synthetic's desire to become greater and more powerful could very well put them at odds with organics.

It is not irrelevant.  As someone else just pointed out, people go to war *all the time* for different reasons.  In the case of the Turian/Human conflict, it was a case of fear, survival, and potential power.  In the case of the Geth Heretics, it was a case of power.  That's it.  Power.  They were not drawn to Soverign because he hated organics, they were drawn to him because of the power he offered.  That's it.  It is not any more philosophical than that.

AND IF SOVEREIGN ISN'T THERE, WE HAVE PROOF THAT SYNTHETICS DO NOT DESIRE POWER AT THE EXPENSE OF ORGANICS.  LOOK AT THE NON HERETIC GETH.  THEY RESISTED SOVERIGNS OFFER.

Enough with the personal attacks. They contribute nothing to the discussion. i thought you were 'done with me', anyways?

That wasn't so much a personal attack as a simple statement of how out of place the entire argument is. 

Virmire : Sovereign presents the notion that we, organics, are subject to the will of the Reapers.  That they are our Salvation through Destruction.  Shepard responds with.....the big ****** off.  

Citadel, Catalyst:  Godchild presents the notion that we, organics, are subject to the will of the Reapers.  That they have been our Salvation through Destruction.  Shepard responds with.....Ok buddy, cool story, whats next?

Do you not see how absolute absurd this is?

Modifié par Beast919, 16 mars 2012 - 03:52 .

[Wowlock]

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

111987 wrote...

Beast919 wrote...

THE REASON WHY IS THE ENTIRE CRUX OF THE REAPER ARGUMENT.  If you're saying the Quarians making Geth, panicing, trying to murder them, then coming to peace with them after trying to murder them a second time is the same as the Geth trying to dominate all organic life as we know it.....

I really am done with you.  You simply don't think through what you're saying.

The past two cycles have proven that AI *DO NOT* have an inherant thirst for organic blood nor the capability to followthrough on it.

Ugh...okay. Are you just forgetting about the whole heretic Geth thing? Remember, the Heretic Geth CHOSE to follow Sovereign and attack organics. They weren't forced to; they CHOSE it. That right there supports the Starchild's thinking.

The past two cycles have shown different cases of synthetics and organics warring against each other.

Exactly. All it takes is one. That's it. Just one AI that wants to wipe out life by it's own choice for the Catalyst to be right.

You know WHY they chose to follow Sovereign ? It is not because they carry grudge for Organics or anything.... They saw the Reapers as Gods... Legion said it himself.  And we know how bad zealots can be, syntetic or Organic.  Reapers play the part of the Messiah and  they got an army for their cause.

Geth are a syntetic race who try to find their place in the universe after the attempted ''extermination '' against them. And there comes an Advanced and superior Reaper who , in all aspects , is an epidemy for Syntetics. It ''tells '' them to follow him to their destiny and some of them do but NOT ALL. They do not believe in destroying Organics... As we saw, Heretics ''tricked'' into believing the Reapers. And by Reaper logical point, they are breaking their own logic by using Syntetics to wipe out organics. I don't care if they will leave the ''younger '' races alive , they are the creators of their counter points soo they basicly fight against their own actions....

So no, I don't find anything different about Heretic Geth's actions then anyother zealot group whether it be organic or syntetic.

[General User]

111987 wrote...

General User wrote...

In the last two cycles, organics triumphed over synthetics and organics and synthetics managed to find accomodation respectively.  Neither of which fits the StarKid's mold.

Starchild never said that wasn't possible. He just said that eventually the Created will always turn on the Creators. We saw this in the Prothean's time, with the Heretic Geth, the Luna VI and Overlord AI.

As organics advance, so do their AI's. Eventually, an AI will be created that dooms organics. That's the starchild's argument. We haven't seen this 'advanced' AI because the Reapers invade before it happens.

The Prothean's synthetic adversaries and the Heretics were both defeated, the Luna VI became friendly (very friendly to Joker), and Overlord was not an AI. 

In fact the only "civilization destroying AI" we do see is the StarKid itself.  For the foreseeable future, the problem of evil machines destroying organic life ends with its destruction.

Modifié par General User, 16 mars 2012 - 03:50 .

[Genera1Nemesis]

The Geth heretics made the choice to kill in the name of advancement. The fact that Sovereign made them the offer was possibly just a test of the Geth and some chose to advance themselves no matter the cost; thus; proving the threat was real.

[Beast919]

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

That's just it; Sovereign proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that there was an AI in existance that chose to kill organics in order to advance themselves.

Sovereign proved there was an AI collective that would go to war (to what extent was unknown) in order to better themselves when given the opportunity.  This proves nothing about the "inevitable evolution of synthetic life to achieve this end on their own."  It also proves nothing about organics being completely without the ability to defend themselves against such an attack. 

Even reaper augmented, the entire Geth armada Sovereign deploys was defeated by a galaxy caught with its pants down, while being aided by a Reaper itself. 

This argument only goes to show *further* proof why their supposition is bogus.

[Genera1Nemesis]

Beast919 wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

That's just it; Sovereign proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that there was an AI in existance that chose to kill organics in order to advance themselves.

Sovereign proved there was an AI collective that would go to war (to what extent was unknown) in order to better themselves when given the opportunity.  This proves nothing about the "inevitable evolution of synthetic life to achieve this end on their own."  It also proves nothing about organics being completely without the ability to defend themselves against such an attack. 

Even reaper augmented, the entire Geth armada Sovereign deploys was defeated by a galaxy caught with its pants down, while being aided by a Reaper itself. 

This argument only goes to show *further* proof why their supposition is bogus.

You forget that Shep was a badass, right? He ended the cycle....

[Beast919]

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

Beast919 wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

That's just it; Sovereign proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that there was an AI in existance that chose to kill organics in order to advance themselves.

Sovereign proved there was an AI collective that would go to war (to what extent was unknown) in order to better themselves when given the opportunity.  This proves nothing about the "inevitable evolution of synthetic life to achieve this end on their own."  It also proves nothing about organics being completely without the ability to defend themselves against such an attack. 

Even reaper augmented, the entire Geth armada Sovereign deploys was defeated by a galaxy caught with its pants down, while being aided by a Reaper itself. 

This argument only goes to show *further* proof why their supposition is bogus.

You forget that Shep was a badass, right? He ended the cycle....

Well I mean the godchild *did* say the fact that one organic was standing on top of the Citadel without a helmet after being teleported up by a magic elevator in a beam of light was proof that things had changed.

Thats...logic....right?

....

[Genera1Nemesis]

Beast919 wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

Beast919 wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

That's just it; Sovereign proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that there was an AI in existance that chose to kill organics in order to advance themselves.

Sovereign proved there was an AI collective that would go to war (to what extent was unknown) in order to better themselves when given the opportunity.  This proves nothing about the "inevitable evolution of synthetic life to achieve this end on their own."  It also proves nothing about organics being completely without the ability to defend themselves against such an attack. 

Even reaper augmented, the entire Geth armada Sovereign deploys was defeated by a galaxy caught with its pants down, while being aided by a Reaper itself. 

This argument only goes to show *further* proof why their supposition is bogus.

You forget that Shep was a badass, right? He ended the cycle....

Well I mean the godchild *did* say the fact that one organic was standing on top of the Citadel without a helmet after being teleported up by a magic elevator in a beam of light was proof that things had changed.

Thats...logic....right?

....

I've seen crazier things than that in science-fiction my friend.

[General User]

111987 wrote...

General User wrote...
The Heretics chose to do so only at the behest of the StarKid's agent.  And they were defeated.  Both of which argue against the StarKid's philosophy and it personally.

The fact that the temptation for greater power would make them willingly go against organics supports the Starchld, does it not? Regardless of where that temptation comes from.

Hogwash!

If the fact that a particular form of life is capable of producing corruptible and/or dangerous individuals and/or factions makes it worthy of having its rise prevented at all costs, then ALL forms of sapient life need to be prevented from arising, not just synthetics. 

Modifié par General User, 16 mars 2012 - 03:58 .

[Beast919]

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

I've seen crazier things than that in science-fiction my friend.

Just trying to cement the fact that believing *anything* the godchild says after he spouts that initital nonsense is grounds for mental evaluation.

[forgottenlord]

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

Anyone ever watch Terminator and stuff? In those we create just ONE AI, or Synthetic for the non-racist crowd. Why in those fictions does it only require one, but in Mass Effect it has to be what, something really special to be made that wants to destroy life? I'm pretty sure if Skynet could build ships they'd be taking over the galaxy in a nano-second.

The flaw in Terminator was the claim that Skynet started learning at an exponential rate.  It, like humans, is hardware limited.  There's only so fast it can process, so much it can process concurrently, and so many conclusions it can store before it needs to upgrade hardware.  Hardware speeds increase exponentially, but that's using distinct hardware (and at some point, we're going to hit a limit, we just don't know where that limit is - already, there are some areas we seem to have lost our ability to advance (we still can't get very far past 4GHz).  One of the few saving graces of Terminator 3 is they changed it from hardware based to software based, enabling it to take over the existing network.

Problem is, that would be more akin to the entire geth collective being one voice rather than individual units of geth.  Even more problematic is it's not clear what the motivation of Skynet is in T3.  T2 it was self-preservation (which we've been over) and T1 was about winning the war that T2 explained the justification of.  T3....Skynet attacked because it's chaotically evil, at least as near as I can tell.

Motivation matters.  Unless it was specifically designed to be chaotically evil, AI's rarely are going to try to kill organics for the heck of it.  And thus the created vs creator conflict seems contrived to me.

[111987]

Beast919 wrote...


Again your *ONLY* evidence to support the theory is what Reaper-Godchild tells you.  EVERYTHING ELSE points to this not being an outcome.

But if you accept that the Starchild is telling the truth (which we don't have any reason not to; as someone said, it's supposed to be the big reveal of the game), then you can see why the Reapers do what they do, right? That's what I'm trying to say here; the logic is sound if you believe what the Reapers are saying. The Reapers clearly believe what they are saying. Thus their logic, from their perspective is sound.

Beast919 wrote...

It is not irrelevant.  As someone else just pointed out, people go to war *all the time* for different reasons.  In the case of the Turian/Human conflict, it was a case of fear, survival, and potential power.  In the case of the Geth Heretics, it was a case of power.  That's it.  Power.  They were not drawn to Soverign because he hated organics, they were drawn to him because of the power he offered.  That's it.  It is not any more philosophical than that.

AND IF SOVEREIGN ISN'T THERE, WE HAVE PROOF THAT SYNTHETICS DO NOT DESIRE POWER AT THE EXPENSE OF ORGANICS.  LOOK AT THE NON HERETIC GETH.  THEY RESISTED SOVERIGNS OFFER.

You raise good points about the Heretic Geth. You're right, they only targeted organics for power, not because of fear/hatred of organics. However they still did ruthlessly attack anyone who came near them for centuries, and the true Geth did nothing to aid organics in the fight against Sovereign.

Beast919 wrote...

Virmire : Sovereign presents the notion that we, organics, are subject to the will of the Reapers.  That they are our Salvation through Destruction.  Shepard responds with.....the big ****** off.  

Citadel, Catalyst:  Godchild presents the notion that we, organics, are subject to the will of the Reapers.  That they have been out Salvation through Destruction.  Shepard responds with.....Ok buddy, cool story, whats next?[/i][/b]

Do you not see how absolute absurd this is?

It's different in ME3, because Shepard has the power to destroy or control the Reapers. He knows he has the power in this case. It's a different situation.