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[Dopeslap]

Archery / Bard Build

Recommended Race:
Human: Rolling a Human Is the best choice since you don't need to waste your attributes on strength.

Attributes:

Keep in mind that during the Circle Tower arch, you will receive attribute boosts, they are

Strength         +4
Dexterity         +4
Willpower      +4
Cunning         +5
Constitution   +1
Magic              +2

With this in mind your final attributes should look like this

At level 1

Strength.....16
Dexterity....15
Willpower....12
Magic........11
Cunning.....14
Constitution.10

At level 25 with circle tower boosts.

Strength.....20 No points
Dexterity.....35 or 31 +4
Willpower....16 No points
magic........13 no points
Cunning......76 or 72 +4
Constitition.11 no points

Talents:

Lethality
Combat Stealth
Device Mastery
Master Archer
Arrow of Slaying
Rapid Shot
Bard: Song of Courage / Gives nice bonuses attack, damage, and critical chance's and its based on your kick ass high cunning score.
Ranger: Master Ranger / Well a little extra DPS would not hurt anyone except the one your pummeling.

Keep in mind that books can be found that grant you talent points to spend, I normally spend these points on the Device and Stealth trees.

Skills:

Master Combat Training
Master Coercion
Master Trap-Making
Expert Poison Making


Q and A

Q. Why only 35 Dex?
A. Anything over 35 is a waste, 34 is needed for Dragonthorn bows and you will receive equipment that will boost your dex attribute.

Q. Why crazy high cunning and only 20 strength?
A. Well with the talent "Lethality" your cunning score effects your ranged damage, also 20 strength is needed for Wade's Superior Drakeskin Leather set.

Q. WTF why only 11 constitution?
A. Well with combat stealth and a properly speced and planned team, you should never die just hit combat stealth when your health is low.

recommended longbows,

Any Dragonthorn Longbow, or keep an eye out for one of these.

Far Song
+2 Damage
Rapid Aim
+3% Ranged Critical Chance
+10 Attack
+10% Critical/Backstab Damage

Falon'Din's Reach
+2 damage
Rapid aim

Hope this helps...

Modifié par Dopeslap, 29 novembre 2009 - 12:22 .

[emontyj]

that's exactly how my archer stats looked by the time i killed archdemon.

[Forumtroll]

Rapid Aim doesn't stack with bows that have a bonus named Rapid Aim.

[Tonya777]

Wait so...... Lethality works with Bows? I never knew that

[hOnOr]

I like this. Quick question ... you go to rank 3 for lethality (of course), but you don't go for evasion (just one more point), is there a reason why?

[Meggor]

Dopeslap wrote...

Keep in mind that during the Circle Tower arch, you will receive attribute boosts, they are

Strength         +4
Dexterity         +4
Willpower      +4
Cunning         +4
Constitution   +1
Magic              +2

I'm afraid you missed 2 somewhere. When I did that I aquired:
Strength 4
Cunning 5
Will 4
Dexterity 4
Constitution 2
Magic 2
---------------------------------------------------------------

Also, too bad there is no archery specialization in this game, or did I miss somehing?

[Tonya777]

I never thought of the fade extra stats thing that way

[T0rin3]

Dopeslap wrote...

Keep in mind that during the Circle Tower arch, you will receive attribute boosts, they are

Strength         +4
Dexterity         +4
Willpower      +4
Cunning         +4
Constitution   +1
Magic              +2

With this in mind your final attributes should look like this

At level 1

Strength.....16
Dexterity....15
Willpower....12
Magic........11
Cunning.....14
Constitution.10

Some quick corrections...

It's +4 strength, +4 dexterity, +4 willpower, +2 magic, +5 cunning and +2 constitution in the tower, for these level 1 base stats:

Strength 15
Dexterity 19
Willpower 16
Magic 13
Cunning 20
Constitution 12

It also looks like your starting stats quoted were for a warrior, not a rogue.

Talents:

Combat Stealth

You definitely want Master Stealth for stealthing vs boss level enemies.

Device Mastery

Total waste with your high cunning. WIth 60 cunning and Deft Hands, you can open every chest in the game.

Rapid Shot

.... is garbage. If you go down that particular talent line, it is for Scattershot (and maybe supressing fire), but definitely not Rapid Shot. With Rapid Aim on a bot, Rapid Shot is a complete waste to use for even half a second.

Ranger: Master Ranger / Well a little extra DPS would not hurt anyone except the one your pummeling.

You actually want Duelist, because of your pooooooor attack rating. You miss a lot with 90-100 attack rating, that extra 10 points goes a long way towards making you accurate on normal shots. (which makes up the bulk of your damage)

Skills:

Master Coercion

For every 25 points above 10 in cunning, that is 1 less point in coercion you need. With 60 cunning, you only need 2 points in Coercion.

Q and A

Q. Why only 35 Dex?
A.
Anything over 35 is a waste, 34 is needed for Dragonthorn bows and you
will receive equipment that will boost your dex attribute.

Anything over 30 dex is a waste if you aren't going for Evasion. (which you shouldn't, it is BAD for archers... ruining your 3 second wind up for arrow of slaying + wasted stamina just to dodge an attack, YAYYYY) You only need 34 for Dragonthorn bows, and getting +4 dexterity from equipment is really easy. My archer currently has +14 dex from equipment. 30 dex is required for Arrow of Slaying, anything beyond that is better spent in cunning. (unless maybe you don't go Duelist, then  you need more than 5 extra dexterity to boost your attack rating.

Q. Why crazy high cunning and only 20 strength?
A.
Well with the talent "Lethality" your cunning score effects your ranged
damage, also 20 strength is needed for Wade's Superior Drakeskin
Leather set.

Why 20 strength at all? You can easily raise strength to 20 from a base of 15 (minimum strength for human noble rogue archer with 0 stat points into strength) to equip the best light armor. (and even up to 22 to equip the best boots, which are medium armor) Also, Wade's Superior Drakeskin Leather sucks compared to Felon's Coat/Red Jenny's Seekers/Tackmasters Boots.. unless of course you are fighting a high dragon, in which case you can substitute the armor for a Greater Salve of Warming.

Modifié par T0rin3, 29 novembre 2009 - 12:16 .

[Meggor]

If you use the dexterity fix piercing weapons like daggers and arrows will behave as intended:

http://dragonage.gul...rity_hotfix_101



Shortbows will do damage using Cunning if you have lethality.

Longbows will be strength based.

Took me some time to figure out why a LB with higher damage rating than a SB did much less damage (dex & cunning heavy rogue)

[hOnOr]

Meggor wrote...

If you use the dexterity fix piercing weapons like daggers and arrows will behave as intended:
http://dragonage.gul...rity_hotfix_101

Shortbows will do damage using Cunning if you have lethality.
Longbows will be strength based.
Took me some time to figure out why a LB with higher damage rating than a SB did much less damage (dex & cunning heavy rogue)

So on consoles this build is a no-go?

[Tonya777]

Are there even any unique/good shortbows?

What if your on Xbox 360 and therefore screwed out of the dex patch (for now)

[T0rin3]

hOnOr wrote...

Meggor wrote...

If you use the dexterity fix piercing weapons like daggers and arrows will behave as intended:
http://dragonage.gul...rity_hotfix_101

Shortbows will do damage using Cunning if you have lethality.
Longbows will be strength based.
Took me some time to figure out why a LB with higher damage rating than a SB did much less damage (dex & cunning heavy rogue)

So on consoles this build is a no-go?

Tonya777 wrote...

Are there even any unique/good shortbows?
What if your on Xbox 360 and therefore screwed out of the dex patch (for now)

No, actually, without the dex fix, the cunning based archer blows the dexfix'd archer out of the water, as it gets 100% of it's damage bonus from Cunning with Lethality, instead of having to share the other 50% with dexterity that you don't particularly care about. (beyond picking up arrow of slaying)

Modifié par T0rin3, 29 novembre 2009 - 12:17 .

[T0rin3]

hOnOr wrote...

I like this. Quick question ... you go to rank 3 for lethality (of course), but you don't go for evasion (just one more point), is there a reason why?

Becase evasion is terrible. I can't recall how many times I was half-way into my wind-up for pinning shot or arrow of slaying and I evaded an attack, killing my attack animation, and flushing 97 stamina down the drain. When evasion kicks in, it does a little "dodging" animation, and kills whatever attack you were doing. It also does not resume attacking afterwards, it just makes you stand there waiting to tell the game who to attack next. It's bad for archery.

[Tonya777]

T0rin3 wrote...

hOnOr wrote...

Meggor wrote...

If you use the dexterity fix piercing weapons like daggers and arrows will behave as intended:
http://dragonage.gul...rity_hotfix_101

Shortbows will do damage using Cunning if you have lethality.
Longbows will be strength based.
Took me some time to figure out why a LB with higher damage rating than a SB did much less damage (dex & cunning heavy rogue)

So on consoles this build is a no-go?

Tonya777 wrote...

Are there even any unique/good shortbows?
What if your on Xbox 360 and therefore screwed out of the dex patch (for now)

No, actually, without the dex fix, the cunning based archer blows the dexfix'd archer out of the water, as it gets 100% of it's damage bonus from Cunning with Lethality, instead of having to share the other 50% with dexterity that you don't particularly care about. (beyond picking up arrow of slaying)

Would I still be stuck w/ shortbows?

[T0rin3]

Tonya777 wrote...

T0rin3 wrote...

hOnOr wrote...

Meggor wrote...

If you use the dexterity fix piercing weapons like daggers and arrows will behave as intended:
http://dragonage.gul...rity_hotfix_101

Shortbows will do damage using Cunning if you have lethality.
Longbows will be strength based.
Took me some time to figure out why a LB with higher damage rating than a SB did much less damage (dex & cunning heavy rogue)

So on consoles this build is a no-go?

Tonya777 wrote...

Are there even any unique/good shortbows?
What if your on Xbox 360 and therefore screwed out of the dex patch (for now)

No, actually, without the dex fix, the cunning based archer blows the dexfix'd archer out of the water, as it gets 100% of it's damage bonus from Cunning with Lethality, instead of having to share the other 50% with dexterity that you don't particularly care about. (beyond picking up arrow of slaying)

Would I still be stuck w/ shortbows?

No, on the 360 or non-dexfix'd PC version, you definitely want longbows. Since with a longbow you get 100% damage boost from strength, when you take Lethality, it replaces that with a 100% damage boost from cunning, which is huge in this build.

[Dopeslap]

T0rin3 wrote...

Dopeslap wrote...

Keep in mind that during the Circle Tower arch, you will receive attribute boosts, they are

Strength         +4
Dexterity         +4
Willpower      +4
Cunning         +4
Constitution   +1
Magic              +2

With this in mind your final attributes should look like this

At level 1

Strength.....16
Dexterity....15
Willpower....12
Magic........11
Cunning.....14
Constitution.10

Some quick corrections...

It's +4 strength, +4 dexterity, +4 willpower, +2 magic, +5 cunning and +2 constitution in the tower, for these level 1 base stats:

Strength 15
Dexterity 19
Willpower 16
Magic 13
Cunning 20
Constitution 12

It also looks like your starting stats quoted were for a warrior, not a rogue.

Talents:

Combat Stealth

You definitely want Master Stealth for stealthing vs boss level enemies.

Device Mastery

Total waste with your high cunning. WIth 60 cunning and Deft Hands, you can open every chest in the game.

Rapid Shot

.... is garbage. If you go down that particular talent line, it is for Scattershot (and maybe supressing fire), but definitely not Rapid Shot. With Rapid Aim on a bot, Rapid Shot is a complete waste to use for even half a second.

Ranger: Master Ranger / Well a little extra DPS would not hurt anyone except the one your pummeling.

You actually want Duelist, because of your pooooooor attack rating. You miss a lot with 90-100 attack rating, that extra 10 points goes a long way towards making you accurate on normal shots. (which makes up the bulk of your damage)

Skills:

Master Coercion

For every 25 points above 10 in cunning, that is 1 less point in coercion you need. With 60 cunning, you only need 2 points in Coercion.

Q and A

Q. Why only 35 Dex?
A.
Anything over 35 is a waste, 34 is needed for Dragonthorn bows and you
will receive equipment that will boost your dex attribute.

Anything over 30 dex is a waste if you aren't going for Evasion. (which you shouldn't, it is BAD for archers... ruining your 3 second wind up for arrow of slaying + wasted stamina just to dodge an attack, YAYYYY) You only need 34 for Dragonthorn bows, and getting +4 dexterity from equipment is really easy. My archer currently has +14 dex from equipment. 30 dex is required for Arrow of Slaying, anything beyond that is better spent in cunning. (unless maybe you don't go Duelist, then  you need more than 5 extra dexterity to boost your attack rating.

Q. Why crazy high cunning and only 20 strength?
A.
Well with the talent "Lethality" your cunning score effects your ranged
damage, also 20 strength is needed for Wade's Superior Drakeskin
Leather set.

Why 20 strength at all? You can easily raise strength to 20 from a base of 15 (minimum strength for human noble rogue archer with 0 stat points into strength) to equip the best light armor. (and even up to 22 to equip the best boots, which are medium armor) Also, Wade's Superior Drakeskin Leather sucks compared to Felon's Coat/Red Jenny's Seekers/Tackmasters Boots.. unless of course you are fighting a high dragon, in which case you can substitute the armor for a Greater Salve of Warming.

Some very good information you have their, Ill need to re wright this build with everything you corrected. I have seen allot of people question the archery game play, so I hope this clears up headache's some people are having.

[T0rin3]

Yeah, I'm currently level 20 in a solo Nightmare run as a rogue archer, so everything I learned is from that.

[Forumtroll]

Amend that. Get 22 STR so you can equip Helm on Honnleath. You'll trade up for Long Sight Helm with +ranged crit but still. That helm is worth it in the early game.

[T0rin3]

Forumtroll wrote...

Amend that. Get 22 STR so you can equip Helm on Honnleath. You'll trade up for Long Sight Helm with +ranged crit but still. That helm is worth it in the early game.

Helm of Honnleath only requires 20 strength?

[Iggynous]

Falon'Din's Reach is out done by Marjolin's recurve

[T0rin3]

Iggynous wrote...

Falon'Din's Reach is out done by Marjolin's recurve

Which is Leliana only and is outdone by Far Song.

[Seraphael]

T0rin3 wrote...

No, actually, without the dex fix, the cunning based archer blows the dexfix'd archer out of the water, as it gets 100% of it's damage bonus from Cunning with Lethality, instead of having to share the other 50% with dexterity that you don't particularly care about. (beyond picking up arrow of slaying)

Weird. Without the dexterity hotfix both shortbow and longbow use 50/50 strength/dexterity, with the fix shortbow use 100% dexterity while longbow stays the same.

Wouldn't a pure dexterity archer then blow a cunning/lethality archer out of the water if using shortbows? If I understand it correctly, a dexterity shortbow build would have superior attack, damage and defense.

In your mind, what is the best build for a ranged Leiliana with the dexterity hotfix?

Modifié par Seraphael, 29 novembre 2009 - 01:51 .

[Solwen_Polyhymnia]

I do have a question about cunning base archer. Does cunning affect the accuracy of a bow? Would you want to put a few more points into dex just to increase your attack rating?



And were do you find Far Song? I think I totally miss that bow on my first time around. Is it on some merchant?

[tranj84cl]

Cunning does NOT affect the accuracy. Which is why Bard or Duelist helps so much.



Far Song comes from the replacement blacksmith in Redcliffe.

[Forumtroll]

My bad about the helm.