504 réponses à ce sujet

[Capt Shanderson2]

cljqnsnyc wrote...

It's really funny how the "review bomb" theory is continually pushed by some. Ask yourselves if this theory were true, why are there sooooo many threads in multiple sites, including this one, discussing customer dissatisfaction?

Are these all the same people?

I seriously doubt that.

If you think people are wrong to be upset, just read all the numerous claims the devs promised about ME3. It's actually hard to believe.

Either this was a deliberate plan in order to use the bad press to get people to buy the ME3 version of "Broken Steel," or it's simply a laundry list of lies, lies, lies....yeeeaahhhh!

Whatever you may think, Bioware is playing a dangerous game with their fans.

First DA2, then this? Both games are part of franchises. After burning the fans twice, who do they think will buy DA3 or ME4?

Maybe they'll just turn them into full on FPS games, STILL trying to go after that crowd they seem desperate to please.

Hey Bioware......did you know you could continue to make games that your fans love and still be successful? Just ask Bethesda. Last I checked, Skyrim is very much like an old fashioned rpg, like the previous ES games...and the fans are eating it up....without multiplayer even!

Imagine that!

As much as I enjoyed Skyrim, Mass Effect is still my favorite game series. Even with the bad ending. I never quite understood the problem with Dragon Age 2. Some things about it were worse and others were better. The setting, yeah being in Kirkwall for the majority of the game was bad. The combat imo was much better in DA2. Characters overall were better in DA2. Story was about as interesting as Dragon Age Origins. In my opinion at least.

Modifié par Capt Shanderson2, 17 mars 2012 - 01:43 .

[kbct]

Capt Shanderson2 wrote...

As much as I enjoyed Skyrim, Mass Effect is still my favorite game series. Even with the bad ending. I never quite understood the problem with Dragon Age 2. Some things about it were worse and others were better. The setting, yeah being in Kirkwall for the majority of the game was bad. The combat imo was much better in DA2. Characters overall were better in DA2. Story was about as interesting as Dragon Age Origins. In my opinion at least.

So you still like ME3 even with a bad ending. The problem is the ending ruins the game for sooo many people. It's just a fact. How would you rate ME3 if it made you NOT want to replay ME1, ME2, or ME3?

[Capt Shanderson2]

kbct wrote...

Capt Shanderson2 wrote...

As much as I enjoyed Skyrim, Mass Effect is still my favorite game series. Even with the bad ending. I never quite understood the problem with Dragon Age 2. Some things about it were worse and others were better. The setting, yeah being in Kirkwall for the majority of the game was bad. The combat imo was much better in DA2. Characters overall were better in DA2. Story was about as interesting as Dragon Age Origins. In my opinion at least.

So you still like ME3 even with a bad ending. The problem is the ending ruins the game for sooo many people. It's just a fact. How would you rate ME3 if it made you NOT want to replay ME1, ME2, or ME3?

I have hope that Bioware is going to fix the ending. I was bent out of shape at first but after reading about the indoctrination theory and seeing all of the evidence I am confident that Bioware either planned it from the start or they will use it as a basis.

[naledgeborn is back]

"Get "Mass Effect 3" for Free when you Buy a Select Xbox 360 Console."

Looks like Amazon is trying to get rid of their copies ASAP.

[Glitch007]

RocketManSR2 wrote...

I wonder what % of those reviews were actually intelligent sounding.

Read like the fist page, all are several paragraphs long and all raise points with compelling cases. All seem to love the game, but hate the ending and give sound logical explainations why.

BTW this WILL cause concern, negative press in a open forum where the product is sold, TERRIBLE for business ...

Modifié par Glitch007, 17 mars 2012 - 01:58 .

[Lord Gremlin]

It's unfair that 360 version is 2 stars and PS3 is 3 stars. PS3 version is a badly coded port with severe issues. It should be 1 star.
Also, speaking of review bombing... That's not the case. Those are reviews for consumer product. Overall package.Which includes bad ending, technical issues etc.
Reviews basically indicate - is this product worth paying $59.99? Can you say it's worth paying $59.99 now?
then again, if it was $20 and had same 2 stars I would say that's unfair rating for the product.

[kbct]

Capt Shanderson2 wrote...

I have hope that Bioware is going to fix the ending. I was bent out of shape at first but after reading about the indoctrination theory and seeing all of the evidence I am confident that Bioware either planned it from the start or they will use it as a basis.

I can understand that. Maybe it will happen like you say. However, I'm no sure if it was a good business tactic to withhold information about a new planned ending while your customers burn down the internet. The negative reviews and bad word of mouth is doing a lot of damage while BioWare keeps quiet. Even Casey Hudson's statement yesterday didn't mention anything concrete:

"But we also recognize that some of our most passionate fans needed more closure, more answers, and more time to say goodbye to their stories—and these comments are equally valid. Player feedback such as this has always been an essential ingredient in the development of the series." -Hudson (3/16/12)

[Elhanan]

kbct wrote...

If you haven't finished the game, how can you understand how others feel about it?

One does not have to experience a specific joy or pain to read and empathize with others.

However, if I see folks engage as a mob, herd, gaggle; whatever attempt to tank a product purposely because they do not get the conclusion they wanted, my empathy is rather restricted to others.

Yep; money does entitle you to a Vote at Amazon, but not a demand for a re-write. And it does not seem to appear to iinclude ethics, morality, or a conscience in said purchase either; tis a shame.

[kbct]

Glitch007 wrote...

RocketManSR2 wrote...

I wonder what % of those reviews were actually intelligent sounding.

Read like the fist page, all are several paragraphs long and all raise points with compelling cases. All seem to love the game, but hate the ending and give sound logical explainations why.

BTW this WILL cause concern, negative press in a open forum where the product is sold, TERRIBLE for business ...

Exactly. He/she should go read them. There are lots of well worded negative reviews there.

Maybe Amazon will do what GameStop did and just delete the negative reviews.

[kbct]

Elhanan wrote...

kbct wrote...

If you haven't finished the game, how can you understand how others feel about it?

One does not have to experience a specific joy or pain to read and empathize with others.

However, if I see folks engage as a mob, herd, gaggle; whatever attempt to tank a product purposely because they do not get the conclusion they wanted, my empathy is rather restricted to others.

Yep; money does entitle you to a Vote at Amazon, but not a demand for a re-write. And it does not seem to appear to iinclude ethics, morality, or a conscience in said purchase either; tis a shame.

Most of the reviews don't demand a new ending. They are simply expressing their dissatisfaction in the game. The problem is there are so many people that feel the same way. The scores reflect that.

I don't think a ten paragraph reviews that starts with "Mass Effect was my favorite series..." and ends with a negative review should be considered a "review bomb."

[Darth Malignus]

First of all, when a huge segment of the fanbase sees review after review from the gamer magasines and webpages being totally opposite of their own opinions, this kind of reaction shouldn't come as a surprise. In the heat of the moment? Perhaps. Passionate fury? Definitely! But it's the only way most of the fanbase will ever have an influence on the company in question. We've all seen how much good sending the company a mail or posting on the forum does. So far a handfull of vague "We're listening to all customer feedback"-posts has been the only response.

So people use the only other option they have. User reviews. And even though people regard the negative user reviews as whining and fanboy rage, you can't really blame them. Some people give a 9/10, 99%, whatever, and use the horrible ending as the reason for the game not getting a perfect score.

And others grade the game per replay value, some even the entire trilogy's replay value, which in their opinion is flushed straight down the toilet because of the endings. And grade it accordingly.

I can't really put a "right og wrong"-label on either method.

Modifié par Darth Malignus, 17 mars 2012 - 02:15 .

[Ronin1325]

Elhanan wrote...

Massefeckt wrote...

You can be ungrateful for a present, gift or free service you can't be ungrateful for something you pay for. As you said they could have made different endings based on your decisions through the game or games this doesn't seem like a difficult conclusion, they wouldn't need thousands of endings even three majorly different endings would have cut the complaints in more than half.

This whole entitled/ungrateful argument is so stupid. Basically you are saying as a paying customer you must take whatever you are given without complaint, that's suicidal for any kind of customer power. I swear this whole thing must have been started by corporations somewhere "Lets get the sheep, I mean customers to keep going on about entitlement, soon we'll be able to get away with whatever the hell we want and the sheep, sorry customers will just follow for fear of being called entitled"

Would some prefer the words spoiled, immature, disgraceful, discourteous, or infantile to descibe such behaviour? Or would we, as those that hold such opinions of the viewed mad little mob of lemmings, also be coerced into altering our conclusions?

So Elhanan, when we address the article I posted specifically, you say "Eh, maybe some of it was implemented, and this is from January, so that makes it less legitimate." (Obviously I'm paraphrasing). Then when I mentioned that the game was finished *months* beforehand, you ignore it. As well as ignoring my mention of Mac Walters making the same claims the day after it was released. There are many more quotes from the makers of the game that state similar things- That our choices would matter more than ever before, that we would have 'wildly divergent' endings & that we would have closure. All of those claims are demonstrably false.

Then you say that a customer who is complaining that a product they bought not working as advertised is "spoiled, immature, disgraceful, etc..." I hope that the next time you buy a house/car/washing machine or whatever, & it does not have features you were sold on & formed a major part of why you bought it, that you keep what you said in mind & don't complain.

[Overule]

You bet I have. Here's hoping there's more than one overweight executive at EA gets fired over this ^.^

[Elhanan]

Personally, I hope that Bioware does create a nice ending, and donates it to those that gifted to the various charities created as a gesture and nod towards the unique approach. Then it is up to Bioware to sell it as a DLC, or whatever they wish.

But personally, I do not negotiate with terrorists, hackers, or vandals, and would be tempted to release it in a novel / Kindle format only. Make it into a bedtime story of what might have been, and not the grim reality seen in game.

Modifié par Elhanan, 17 mars 2012 - 02:21 .

[cljqnsnyc]

Capt Shanderson2 wrote...

cljqnsnyc wrote...

It's really funny how the "review bomb" theory is continually pushed by some. Ask yourselves if this theory were true, why are there sooooo many threads in multiple sites, including this one, discussing customer dissatisfaction?

Are these all the same people?

I seriously doubt that.

If you think people are wrong to be upset, just read all the numerous claims the devs promised about ME3. It's actually hard to believe.

Either this was a deliberate plan in order to use the bad press to get people to buy the ME3 version of "Broken Steel," or it's simply a laundry list of lies, lies, lies....yeeeaahhhh!

Whatever you may think, Bioware is playing a dangerous game with their fans.

First DA2, then this? Both games are part of franchises. After burning the fans twice, who do they think will buy DA3 or ME4?

Maybe they'll just turn them into full on FPS games, STILL trying to go after that crowd they seem desperate to please.

Hey Bioware......did you know you could continue to make games that your fans love and still be successful? Just ask Bethesda. Last I checked, Skyrim is very much like an old fashioned rpg, like the previous ES games...and the fans are eating it up....without multiplayer even!

Imagine that!

As much as I enjoyed Skyrim, Mass Effect is still my favorite game series. Even with the bad ending. I never quite understood the problem with Dragon Age 2. Some things about it were worse and others were better. The setting, yeah being in Kirkwall for the majority of the game was bad. The combat imo was much better in DA2. Characters overall were better in DA2. Story was about as interesting as Dragon Age Origins. In my opinion at least.

There isn't enough space for me to go into detail about DA2 and what it's done to Bioware's reputation. No need to rehash all that has been documented numerous times. We'll have to simply agree to disagree...about that sloppy, unfocused, rushed, inconsistent, lore busting, non sequel.......  sorry, I was having a flashback..bad memories.

...anyway
 The claims that were made about ME3 just don't hold true. It's really amazing that in just 5 minutes, they manage to completely wipe out the lore, the plot, the choices, and even the 2 previous games, no...even the third game itself!

The more I think about it the more I'm inclined to believe this has to be a huge ruse. It's just not possible to believe CH would allow this foolishness be the way his baby ends. Has to be a ruse. It makes absolutely ZERO SENSE!

Still, an extremely big risk nonetheless.

Modifié par cljqnsnyc, 17 mars 2012 - 02:51 .

[Capt Shanderson2]

kbct wrote...

Capt Shanderson2 wrote...

I have hope that Bioware is going to fix the ending. I was bent out of shape at first but after reading about the indoctrination theory and seeing all of the evidence I am confident that Bioware either planned it from the start or they will use it as a basis.

I can understand that. Maybe it will happen like you say. However, I'm no sure if it was a good business tactic to withhold information about a new planned ending while your customers burn down the internet. The negative reviews and bad word of mouth is doing a lot of damage while BioWare keeps quiet. Even Casey Hudson's statement yesterday didn't mention anything concrete:

"But we also recognize that some of our most passionate fans needed more closure, more answers, and more time to say goodbye to their stories—and these comments are equally valid. Player feedback such as this has always been an essential ingredient in the development of the series." -Hudson (3/16/12)

I'd admire them if they planned all of this from the start. Giving a game a purposely terrible ending so you can come in later and say " Gotcha! You guys thought that was the end didn't you? Did you honestly think we'd make an ending that terrible and not have something planned? Here's the real ending guys, prepare to have your minds blown!" It would be pretty radical and I'd respect them for having the balls to try something like this. Of coarse that's assuming they did indeed plan it. I honestly don't know how they could have not planned it though. There are too many clues throughout the game and there is just no way the writers could have been that dumb.

Modifié par Capt Shanderson2, 17 mars 2012 - 02:25 .

[kbct]

Elhanan wrote...

Personally, I hope that Bioware does create a nice ending, and donates it to those that gifted to the various charities created as a gesture and nod towards the unique approach. Then it is up to Bioware to sell it as a DLC, or whatever they wish.

But personally, I do not negotiate with terrorists, hackers, or vandals, and would be tempted to release it in a nove l/ Kindle format only. Make it into a bedtime story of what might have been, and not the grim reality seen in game.

You think BioWare should create a new ending. Good, you voiced your opinion.

Some people bashed the "Retake Mass Effect" drive. A charity!!! Some people don't want anyone to voice anything negative about the game.

The reality is you can't stop people from voicing their opinion. Most are doing it in a civilized manner. Mr. Woo said as much a couple days ago:

"The community has been articulate, considerate, and for the most part extremely respectful and smart with how it is providing its feedback. And a large portion of those dissatisfied with the ME3 endings are cautioning others to keep the criticism constructive, to be respectful to the developers, and to remain civil in their arguments. I appreciate that a great deal, and I thank you and the rest of our community for that." -Woo

[Darth Malignus]

kbct wrote...

Elhanan wrote...

Personally, I hope that Bioware does create a nice ending, and donates it to those that gifted to the various charities created as a gesture and nod towards the unique approach. Then it is up to Bioware to sell it as a DLC, or whatever they wish.

But personally, I do not negotiate with terrorists, hackers, or vandals, and would be tempted to release it in a nove l/ Kindle format only. Make it into a bedtime story of what might have been, and not the grim reality seen in game.

You think BioWare should create a new ending. Good, you voiced your opinion.

Some people bashed the "Retake Mass Effect" drive. A charity!!! Some people don't want anyone to voice anything negative about the game.

The reality is you can't stop people from voicing their opinion. Most are doing it in a civilized manner. Mr. Woo said as much a couple days ago:

"The community has been articulate, considerate, and for the most part extremely respectful and smart with how it is providing its feedback. And a large portion of those dissatisfied with the ME3 endings are cautioning others to keep the criticism constructive, to be respectful to the developers, and to remain civil in their arguments. I appreciate that a great deal, and I thank you and the rest of our community for that." -Woo

Yeah, some even offered him coffee and waffles.

[AkiKishi]

Capt Shanderson2 wrote...

I'd admire them if they planned all of this from the start. Giving a game a purposely terrible ending so you can come in later and say " Gotcha! You guys thought that was the end didn't you? Did you honestly think we'd make an ending that terrible and not have something planned? Here's the real ending guys, prepare to have your minds blown!" It would be pretty radical and I'd respect them for having the balls to try something like this. Of coarse that's assuming they did indeed plan it. I honestly don't know how they could have not planned it though. There are too many clues throughout the game and there is just no way the writers could have been that dumb.

That's great if the game was a 100% online release. It's not though, actually pulling something like that could even open them up to legal action rather than just fan revolt. More likely the "clues" are from an ending that was cut from the game at some point.

Modifié par BobSmith101, 17 mars 2012 - 02:32 .

[Elhanan]

Ronin1325 wrote...

So Elhanan, when we address the article I posted specifically, you say "Eh, maybe some of it was implemented, and this is from January, so that makes it less legitimate." (Obviously I'm paraphrasing). Then when I mentioned that the game was finished *months* beforehand, you ignore it. As well as ignoring my mention of Mac Walters making the same claims the day after it was released. There are many more quotes from the makers of the game that state similar things- That our choices would matter more than ever before, that we would have 'wildly divergent' endings & that we would have closure. All of those claims are demonstrably false.

Then you say that a customer who is complaining that a product they bought not working as advertised is "spoiled, immature, disgraceful, etc..." I hope that the next time you buy a house/car/washing machine or whatever, & it does not have features you were sold on & formed a major part of why you bought it, that you keep what you said in mind & don't complain.

I say my sympathies lie elsewhere due to the methods chosen despite the feelings or motives behind them.

As mentioned, I found the charity ploy amusing, and rather refreshing in this day and age of entitlements, so I am not opposed to people asking for a change. And I am not opposed to constructive criticism.

But if I purchased a car, and then tried to extort service as my response via bad press, I would also be seen in a rather poor light, as well as wrong considering I did not like the bumper sticker.

[kbct]

Capt Shanderson2 wrote...

I'd admire them if they planned all of this from the start. Giving a game a purposely terrible ending so you can come in later and say " Gotcha! You guys thought that was the end didn't you? Did you honestly think we'd make an ending that terrible and not have something planned? Here's the real ending guys, prepare to have your minds blown!" It would be pretty radical and I'd respect them for having the balls to try something like this. Of coarse that's assuming they did indeed plan it. I honestly don't know how they could have not planned it though. There are too many clues throughout the game and there is just no way the writers could have been that dumb.

That's a dangerous game to play, Cap'n. People will feel trolled because of it. Hey, I killed your dog!!! HA! Just kidding! Give me some more money and I'll show the location of your dog.

I hope the writers weren't that dumb either. Actually, I hope Mac Walters wasn't that dumb because an employee on Twitter basically said he was the one responsible for it. I would like to think some exec told Walters how to finish it. At least that makes more sense if they planned a DLC the whole time.

[Capt Shanderson2]

BobSmith101 wrote...

Capt Shanderson2 wrote...

I'd admire them if they planned all of this from the start. Giving a game a purposely terrible ending so you can come in later and say " Gotcha! You guys thought that was the end didn't you? Did you honestly think we'd make an ending that terrible and not have something planned? Here's the real ending guys, prepare to have your minds blown!" It would be pretty radical and I'd respect them for having the balls to try something like this. Of coarse that's assuming they did indeed plan it. I honestly don't know how they could have not planned it though. There are too many clues throughout the game and there is just no way the writers could have been that dumb.

That's great if the game was a 100% online release. It's not though, actually pulling something like that could even open them up to legal action rather than just fan revolt. More likely the "clues" are from an ending that was cut from the game at some point.

Maybe, I read somewhere that the original ending was leaked and they changed the ending late in developement to what it is now. With the intention of releasing it or something similar to it later. I don't remember where I read it so there isn't really any credibility to what I'm saying, but it would explain why the ending seems like it was written in an afternoon at least. I'm 100% sure there won't be any legal action though. They reserve the right to make the game how they want and we the customers have the right to buy the product or not. It ends there and anyone attempting to sue Bioware and EA will get shot down. Who knows, they may even give the dlc to us free, or as a bonus with the purchase of another dlc pack. I doubt it, but who knows.

Modifié par Capt Shanderson2, 17 mars 2012 - 02:50 .

[cljqnsnyc]

Capt Shanderson2 wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

Capt Shanderson2 wrote...

I'd admire them if they planned all of this from the start. Giving a game a purposely terrible ending so you can come in later and say " Gotcha! You guys thought that was the end didn't you? Did you honestly think we'd make an ending that terrible and not have something planned? Here's the real ending guys, prepare to have your minds blown!" It would be pretty radical and I'd respect them for having the balls to try something like this. Of coarse that's assuming they did indeed plan it. I honestly don't know how they could have not planned it though. There are too many clues throughout the game and there is just no way the writers could have been that dumb.

That's great if the game was a 100% online release. It's not though, actually pulling something like that could even open them up to legal action rather than just fan revolt. More likely the "clues" are from an ending that was cut from the game at some point.

Maybe, I read somewhere that the original ending was leaked and they changed the ending late in developement to what it is now. With the intention of releasing it or something similar to it later. I don't remember where I read it so there isn't really any credibility to what I'm saying, but it would explain why the ending seems like it was written in an afternoon at least. I'm 100% sure there won't be any legal action though. They reserve the right to make the game how they want and we the customers have the right to buy the product or not. It ends there and anyone attempting to sue Bioware and EA will get shot down. Who knows, they may even give the dlc to us free, or as a bonus with the purchase of another dlc pack. I doubt it, but who knows.

Interesting enough, some are filing complaints.

I can't ever remember any game having this sort of polarizing "effect." DA2 must be extremely jealous!

[gekkemarvin]

KotorEffect3 wrote...

RocketManSR2 wrote...

I wonder what % of those reviews were actually intelligent sounding.

Probably not very many

If you used your ''intelligent'' and read the reviews, you will see that they liked 99% of the game
but the ending was their experience where it gone wrong. Its their opinion. You can have a discussion
if they deserve this low rating or not, but its a fact that the ending ruined it for most of the fanbase.

Modifié par gekkemarvin, 17 mars 2012 - 03:11 .

[AkiKishi]

cljqnsnyc wrote...

Capt Shanderson2 wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

Capt Shanderson2 wrote...

I'd admire them if they planned all of this from the start. Giving a game a purposely terrible ending so you can come in later and say " Gotcha! You guys thought that was the end didn't you? Did you honestly think we'd make an ending that terrible and not have something planned? Here's the real ending guys, prepare to have your minds blown!" It would be pretty radical and I'd respect them for having the balls to try something like this. Of coarse that's assuming they did indeed plan it. I honestly don't know how they could have not planned it though. There are too many clues throughout the game and there is just no way the writers could have been that dumb.

That's great if the game was a 100% online release. It's not though, actually pulling something like that could even open them up to legal action rather than just fan revolt. More likely the "clues" are from an ending that was cut from the game at some point.

Maybe, I read somewhere that the original ending was leaked and they changed the ending late in developement to what it is now. With the intention of releasing it or something similar to it later. I don't remember where I read it so there isn't really any credibility to what I'm saying, but it would explain why the ending seems like it was written in an afternoon at least. I'm 100% sure there won't be any legal action though. They reserve the right to make the game how they want and we the customers have the right to buy the product or not. It ends there and anyone attempting to sue Bioware and EA will get shot down. Who knows, they may even give the dlc to us free, or as a bonus with the purchase of another dlc pack. I doubt it, but who knows.

Interesting enough, some are filing complaints.

I can't ever remember any game having this sort of polarizing "effect." DA2 must be extremely jealous!

I've seen plenty of games do that. What is new is such a large % of the fanbase pulling in the same direction.

Lets for a moment accept the "false ending" theory. Where does this leave things in the future ?Would you pre-order knowing that you may not get he "real" game ? Would it be worth taking the risk on a day 1 purchase ? 
It would be far more sensible to adopt a wait and see attiture before purchase and that's a very bad thing for developers and publishers.