145 réponses à ce sujet

[Odd Hermit]

kleindropper wrote...

I'm guessing atheists don't think the ending is such a big deal then. After all, all that death and destruction is just a random transfer of matter and energy meaning nothing. ex. Tali committing suicide = Two asteroids colliding. Just random events in a universe randomly existing through space magic.

And I don't know where this evolution stuff is coming from though I know I've heard Catholic priests discuss in detail the development of the planet over billions of years, so that is just high and mighty atheists setting up strawmen to try and make themselves sound superior.

You have a pretty skewed view of what atheism means. :/

All it means is you don't believe in God. You can be a Buddhist atheist.
You seem to be mistaking it with something like existentialism or nihilism.

Modifié par Odd Hermit, 17 mars 2012 - 04:42 .

[finc.loki]

kleindropper wrote...

I'm guessing atheists don't think the ending is such a big deal then. After all, all that death and destruction is just a random transfer of matter and energy meaning nothing. ex. Tali committing suicide = Two asteroids colliding. Just random events in a universe randomly existing through space magic.

And I don't know where this evolution stuff is coming from though I know I've heard Catholic priests discuss in detail the development of the planet over billions of years, so that is just high and mighty atheists setting up strawmen to try and make themselves sound superior.

So you think Evolution is a "straw man". 

Also, here we go with the proverbial "Atheists don't care about life or anything", where is the "Atheists don't have morals".
Or the long time favorite "Atheists just reject god".

Funny how you should say "space magic" about Science and knowledge, yet, somehow don't think a "god" is space "magic".

"you don't know where this evolution stuff comes from", well my only advice is pick up a text-book and educate yourself about it.

There is nothing "high and mighty" about it.

PS. this is the no spoilers part of the forum.

[PiEman]

finc.loki wrote...

I thank the flying spaghetti monster that they dropped religion.
Any species capable of interstellar travel would have ditched that fantasy long ago.
Now if only that could happen here today on earth as well.

Don't worry though, the Asari "thanks the goddess" all the time.

Disclaimer:
Yes my comment is my own personal view, people are free to believe whatever they want.
Personally I stick to Science and logic/common sense.

Also I think Religion and Science is EXTREMLY mutually exclusive...

Religion and a general belief in Deity is very different. One is dogma and tries to tell "how it is" Noah's ark, earth being 6000 years old, need I say more.

Being a Deist is simply a belief that there is or might be a "higher power/entity" so that is different.

Yes, it's  pretty obvious I'm an Atheist.

Oh look, the bottom of my sh*tlist is here!

This thread was actually going pretty smoothly before you decided to randomly attack religion after the OP tried to be very open minded with his discussion of faith.

Thanks a ton...

[PiEman]

finc.loki wrote...

kleindropper wrote...

I'm guessing atheists don't think the ending is such a big deal then. After all, all that death and destruction is just a random transfer of matter and energy meaning nothing. ex. Tali committing suicide = Two asteroids colliding. Just random events in a universe randomly existing through space magic.

And I don't know where this evolution stuff is coming from though I know I've heard Catholic priests discuss in detail the development of the planet over billions of years, so that is just high and mighty atheists setting up strawmen to try and make themselves sound superior.

So you think Evolution is a "straw man". 

Also, here we go with the proverbial "Atheists don't care about life or anything", where is the "Atheists don't have morals".
Or the long time favorite "Atheists just reject god".

Funny how you should say "space magic" about Science and knowledge, yet, somehow don't think a "god" is space "magic".

"you don't know where this evolution stuff comes from", well my only advice is pick up a text-book and educate yourself about it.

There is nothing "high and mighty" about it.

PS. this is the no spoilers part of the forum.

Did you even read his post, or did you see the word "Catholic" and stop thinking?

He didn't call evolution a strawman you dumb ****, he called YOU a straw man, because that's what you are.

[Soundawave098]

Yeah, the whole thing follows the normal scifi community, the world comes to peace, who gives a crap about any belief. ME follows that in every way except for that one moment in me1

[ncknck]

i dont think religion topics are allowed here.

[PiEman]

ncknck wrote...

i dont think religion topics are allowed here.

Well, it is bringing back memories of why I have such a bitter initial impression of atheists in the first place.

The first large group of atheists I ever met were on the internet. A bodybuilding site I was on. They were all dicks, and quickly ruined my opinion of atheists in general, and that's been very hard to undo.

I've been working for years to try and not have a sour outlook towards a person because they're an atheist, and some people have helped that. My best friend of a few years was an atheist, my current History 105 teacher is an atheist, but they aren't complete assh*les like the ones I first met were.

The guy I quoted a few minutes ago however...is destroying what I have tried to build...again...

[Sangheili_1337]

I don't see how evolution and religion are exclusive from each other. If you feel evolution is anti religion then you shouldn't play this game in the first place because that is exactly how new organic races arise over many cycles. You can say Shepard's possible faith is never followed up on, but neither is his possible atheism so it evens out in my mind.

[Rabbi Satan]

kleindropper wrote...

I find it funny how uninformed most atheists are about religion.  I also find if funny that scientists work so hard to unravel  the rules of the universe but totally dismiss who created the rules in the first place.

And just "why" does there have to be an entity who created the rules? It's an entire possibility that the rules coalesced by themselves. If there was a creator of the universe, who created the creator? If you say that the creator was the first prime cause, and thus had no precursor - why couldn't the same be applied to the natural universe?

The reason why scientists "dismiss" the notion of a creator is simply because There isn't any damn evidence for it. Sure, you might use the old canard that, "Absence of evidence does not equal evidence of absence", but I'm sorry, science doesn't work like that. That's essentially saying, "Oh, it exists, but we have no evidence for it LOL!".

BatmanPWNS wrote...

Melca36 wrote...

Lets face facts here....

The minute we discover that aliens do exist in the universe...its going to affect every single religion on Earth.


Life and religion will never be the same.

People will be forced to rethink what they were taught.

Nope,
not really every. Some will continue and new ones will be made.
Religion never died before and, as much as some want, won't die in the
future.

What I find ironic about this situation, is that when it happens (It's a matter of when, not if - the universe is far too large for us and in turn our homeworld to be the only one capable of supporting life. Even with the most conservative of estimates put into the Drake equation, it still churns out a massive number of worlds and systems capable of housing garden worlds), religions will evolve into a new form which simply accepts the new status quo. Which is ironic, seeing how religion in our current time and in centuries past have tried its best to supress evolution.

kleindropper wrote...

And
I don't know where this evolution stuff is coming from though I know
I've heard Catholic priests discuss in detail the development of the
planet over billions of years, so that is just high and mighty atheists
setting up strawmen to try and make themselves sound superior.

The Papacy tried its best to supress anything that didn't support its Geocentric, God-uber-alles world view, and when they lost that battle, now they're like, "Oh, lol, we were just kidding, we can like, TOTALLY co-exist LOL! Sorry about trying to strangle you, Science, when you were an infant in your crib!". If you want a current example, just look at Kansas, Georgia, and the rest of the Belt. Hell, look at Federal level politics in the states. Declaring yourself to be nonreligious/atheist is tantamount to political suicide.

[Carnage752]

Oh yay. Another religious flame war.

I will say one thing though. This game is about character developement. If I wanted to develop my character as a spiritual person, then I should have the option. If I wanted to develop myself as a religious-hating guy, then I should have the option. I love how some people love to derail the thread with their religious hate or zealotry.

And no religion and science are not exclusive to eachother, despite what some self-righteous pricks want to believe.

And yes I'm a Christian. Make your belligerent comments on sky fairies and sphagetti monsters if you lack any proper civility.

[Edje Edgar]

Well you can just 'imagine' him being Christian and play him like as best as befits the role. You know if there was an emphasis on it we'd have to make a Muslim, Hindo and Bhudist shep.

Besides god and aliens becomes a creepy prelude to racism. Afterall we can't all be created in his likeness and well he doesnt tolerate any other gods before him...so. Where did the other guys come from?

[shadey]

I think it's kind of hypocritical though that they won't put religion in a game because it's "controversial" even though anywhere between 50-80% of a population has some time of belife, but will put in 2 gay characters and a bi-character when <10% of the population swings that way and we're basically told we have to accept it.

yeah anyway no suprise

[Edje Edgar]

shadey wrote...

I think it's kind of hypocritical though that they won't put religion in a game because it's "controversial" even though anywhere between 50-80% of a population has some time of belife, but will put in 2 gay characters and a bi-character when <10% of the population swings that way and we're basically told we have to accept it.

yeah anyway no suprise

Well we'd probably be more opposed to gay people if they had a long history of trying to force people to live a certain way or believe certain things.

[Gabey5]

No thanks. Saying you believed in me1 was enough, there is no relevant time to discuss religion in the scope of the game

[shadey]

Edje Edgar wrote...


Well we'd probably be more opposed to gay people if they had a long history of trying to force people to live a certain way or believe certain things.

right and atheist run communist countries never killed millions

[Rabbi Satan]

shadey wrote...

right and atheist run communist countries never killed millions

Haha, oh good sir! Witty reparte! 5+ internets 4 j00!!

/sarcasm

And is there any evidence that Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Ceaușescu et al, slaughtered millions and subjigated millions more because they were atheists, and NOT because they were after naked power and were generally blights apon the human race?

nah atheists l0ol amirite?

You know what, lets take this further:

Did you know that the heads of the communist run countries had funny hair? Ate food? Drank water? WERE MEN?!

[Edje Edgar]

shadey wrote...

Edje Edgar wrote...


Well we'd probably be more opposed to gay people if they had a long history of trying to force people to live a certain way or believe certain things.

right and atheist run communist countries never killed millions

I think the guy directly below you allready pointed out why that argument is flawed. In addition the argument was why there was content for homosexuals but not for religious people. So your argument should be: "because gay people never killed millions". Which they indeed did not.

P.s. I never implied religious people killed millions, you did.

[Inquisitor Recon]

Rabbi Satan wrote...
And is there any evidence that Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Ceaușescu et al, slaughtered millions and subjigated millions more because they were atheists, and NOT because they were after naked power and were generally blights apon the human race?

nah atheists l0ol amirite?

You know what, lets take this further:

Did you know that the heads of the communist run countries had funny hair? Ate food? Drank water? WERE MEN?!

Oh yes atheism has never done anything bad ever. Atheism never played into the actions of Stalin, Mao, etc. at all, just ignore all of the priests and religious figures lined up and shot. They had it coming for spreading their "outdated" ideas amirite?

On the other hand, everytime theistic individuals (specifically those big bad Christians) do something bad it's because they believe in God.

Yup, atheists are the superior human beings, spreading truth­­™ and logic™ from their mothers basements via internet webcams. Truly the ideal human society!

Modifié par ReconTeam, 17 mars 2012 - 07:31 .

[Ashilana]

Pretty sure this thread should be locked. >.<

[j78]

Isn’t it implied that shepherd is space Jesus .That’s why his name is shepherd bioware said something about this at the start of the series.

Modifié par j78, 17 mars 2012 - 07:54 .

[Zaydin]

As others have said, religion in gaming is something of a live hand grenade; mishandle it, and it blows your face off. It's better either to just leave it out or not focus on it if it does come up, and if they do involve religion, you have to include them all to avoid offending people of other religions. ME3 has been controversial enough already; the last thing BioWare needs is to add the disaster waiting to happen by bringing religious debates into the mix. This thread and how the 'debate' has devolved is good reason why religion is probably best left out of Mass Effect.

If you want your Shepard to be religious, more power to you; your Shepard is just the sort of religious person who doesn't feel the need to make a big fuss about his/her faith, and keeps it private.

If you really want to play a game that heavily involves religion, play Dragon Age, what with the Chantry and all that.

Modifié par Zaydin, 17 mars 2012 - 08:03 .

[Rabbi Satan]

ReconTeam wrote...

Oh yes atheism has never done anything bad ever. Atheism never played into the actions of Stalin, Mao, etc. at all,

Because a philosophy that simply states that it doesn't believe in any diety due to lack of evidence is inherently "bad" - I guess that's believable if you link morality with religion, I mean hey, those atheists don't believe in God, therefore, they MUST be evil!

just ignore all of the priests and religious figures lined up and shot. They had it coming for spreading their "outdated" ideas amirite?

And I'm sure they were the only ones that were lined up, shot, or put into gulags. WON'T SOMEBODY THINK OF THE PRIESTS?! They weren't destroyed along with the rest of Stalin's enemies because they opposed him, or represented a power structure that could potentially cause instability later on. Nope, it MUST be evil, evil atheism, and because Superman hated evil evil evil evil relijun, and not ruthless political maneurvering.

On the other hand, everytime theistic individuals (specifically those big bad Christians) do something bad it's because they believe in God.

Well, the guys fighting over the "Holy Land", past and present, wouldn't certainly fit into this statement!

Yup, atheists are the superior human beings, spreading truth­­™ and logic™ from their mothers basements via internet webcams. Truly the ideal human society!

Well, technically, Hong Kong has very few basements, due to the nature of housing here. But I DO live with my mom though!

[Sarcastic]

Good and bad has nothing to do with believing in God or not.
I have not found any scientific proof that God does or does not exist.
Sometimes I think the idea of beliving in something greater can lead someone through a dark time in his or her lives. Thus the saying there is no atheist in a foxhole. Being required to face the finality of death before old age is not something easy to do and for many God is the answer. Quantum physics will help you very little in a live fire situation.

[Cootie]

ReconTeam wrote...

Rabbi Satan wrote...
And is there any evidence that Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Ceaușescu et al, slaughtered millions and subjigated millions more because they were atheists, and NOT because they were after naked power and were generally blights apon the human race?

nah atheists l0ol amirite?

You know what, lets take this further:

Did you know that the heads of the communist run countries had funny hair? Ate food? Drank water? WERE MEN?!

Oh yes atheism has never done anything bad ever. Atheism never played into the actions of Stalin, Mao, etc. at all, just ignore all of the priests and religious figures lined up and shot. They had it coming for spreading their "outdated" ideas amirite?

On the other hand, everytime theistic individuals (specifically those big bad Christians) do something bad it's because they believe in God.

Yup, atheists are the superior human beings, spreading truth­­™ and logic™ from their mothers basements via internet webcams. Truly the ideal human society!

I think you misunderstand.
State religions are still religions, in a different sense of the word. None of those people did what they did to further the cause of atheism. They wanted to further their own State Religion or personal agenda.

Atheism is the default state. Theists are the ones proposing ideas and ideologies, where as Atheism is simply saying no to those kinds of faith-based suggestions.
The only thing those people had in common was that they didn't care for the rest of the world's religions. Atheism has no agenda, so to speak.
What they did, they did on their own accord.

On the other hand, we have religious families labeling their children with the help of very questionable doctrines.

Back on topic though;
There are way too many religions for Bioware's poor dialogue wheel. It can't support all of them.

[Simpfan]

 Im seeing a lot of posts claiming how they think people wouldve ditched any religious beliefs by the time they achieve the level of tech in Mass Effect, but thats not really a valid point since in the world of Mass Effect, religion does exist.

The Hanar, the Drell, the Asari, and there are many references to Human religions both in game and out.
And not just religions dealing with gods, but ancestor worship and believing in something bigger and better than oneself. Its all over the ME canon, and I have no problem with that.

If you can make your Shepard as straight, gay, or ambiguously aloof as you want, why not have options for how much they believe in a religion?