285 réponses à ce sujet

[Uezurii]

LucidStrike wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

iamthedave3 wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...
Normandy is smaller than those larger ships, and a heck of a lot faster (fastest ship ever built as I understand it) and Joker is the best pilot ever. Now you guys are just purposely looking for the negative instead of trying to see any other outcome. In short, you have decided that you are right no matter what and there is no room for any other debate.

You win.

So you're saying that Joker chickened out of the greatest fight of his time and fled the battle unlike those heroic Alliance soldiers seen fighting against the reapers on foot during the final scene? moreover, Joker and the entire squad chickened out and fled?

The Crucible was tearing all the ships in it's vicinity apart. I'd say that at that point fight is over, run or die.

The Crucible's event horizon was relatively small, so I dunno why you two are debating
it so much. It sucked in very few ship PARTS from relatively close
by...and Joker's not a coward. I don't have any cowards in my crew.

Here's plothole to discuss: WTF are they so happy when the Normandy lands? O_o

Maybe because Joker knows he can watch his massive amount of porn in peace now.

[saracen16]

[quote]Uezurii wrote...

[quote]saracen16 wrote...

[quote]wikkedjester wrote...

You will be who you will be. We are our choices.
- Helios, Deus Ex

Yeah that’s nice and all, but what about Shepard’s (ours) choices? Everything we've done for 5 years 100's of hours. In the end all the choice was taken away from us for an ABC ending that Shepard would never just lay down and take. Shepard is our choices, good or bad, his ending should reflect that, not disregard that. 
[/quote]

Read the OP again. There is no singular ending. You will not get the graybox ending in the Reaper plot. There are many plots and subplots in the game, and to conjoin them in a convoluted mess goes against proper writing. Mass Effect is not a movie, but a serialized epic.

[/quote]Yes there are many subplots in Mass Effect 3, but everyone that played this game, got 1 of  3 ending, which is still a slightly adjusted cutscene. No matter what you did before the last 15 minutes, it will always play out the same. [/quote]

Death will ALWAYS play out the same if you ended up getting shot in a gutter. None of your previous decisions in life affect that. At least you died saving the galaxy, and that you will be remembered for what you did in the previous games right up to every single plot and subplot that found its conclusion in ME3.

[quote]You are wounded after Harbinger hits you, struggle to get to the Conduit, have an all out epic battle with Marauder Shields. Enter the Conduit and land in a strange Hallway, all of a sudden anderson is there too, even though there was no one around you and the coms said that everyone was dead and no one made it, surely they could see Shepard stand up then too and right behind him Anderson trying to catch up. [/quote]

The final boss was the Illusive Man, not "Marauder Shields". Even if that was, the game didn't have a traditional boss battle (except that son of a **** Kai Leng). Again, read my post: you're not god. You're Shepard. You just got knocked out by a beam and you don't know where everyone is.

[quote]Anyway moving on, Anderson is always in front of you and get to the terminal first, Illusive man shows up, He dies and anderson dies, then a random and conviniently placed elevator starts up without making any sense.[/quote]

You were supposed to question that experience. Are you going to Citadel Heaven? Did you actually press the console and it worked? Did the Catalyst itself summon you?

[quote]The Catalyst get's introduced, he gives you the 3 options, of which, and this is important, the destroy choice he says you will die, yet it's the only ending you live in.[/quote]

MY GOD, you didn't even read my post! HE DID NOT OUTRIGHT TELL YOU THAT YOU WILL DIE. He said that you are partly synthetic. There's a difference. And the Catalyst is not introduced suddenly: you find out about him since the beginning of the game (Liara and the council in which she says the Crucible is missing a component). You fight for your own life to gather resources for the Crucible and quest for the Catalyst. The VI tells you it's the Citadel. But when you arrive at the Citadel, it's not all as it seems: the Catalyst is IN the Citadel.

[quote]Already showing he is lying to you.[/quote]

You didn't even read my post, did you?

[quote]But anyway, you pick one of these choices, and then the same FMV starts playing with slight alterations, soldiers die, soldiers live. But this isn't based on your choices, but EMS.[/quote]

No, it IS based on your choices. The Reapers either die or leave the galaxy, and Earth is either saved or burned, and Joker and crew either survive or dies. You were ONLY given two choices at the end of ME2 and ME1, and you saw the consequence of those choices. There is no way that the game can bring EVERY SINGLE CHOICE to the end because it would be convoluted and unrealistic.

[quote]The relays go poof, and Joker always Crash lands with the squadmates that also should have been hit by Harbinger, with the running right behind you and all.[/quote]

It's obvious that you didn't read my earlier responses. Are you really interested in debating, or just spouting arguments without answering my responses to your post?

[quote]No matter what you do, no matter what you choose, this is how the last few minutes go. Except for when you have enough EMS, pick destroy, and we see Shepard lying in stone rubble, something the Citadel isn't made out of, drawing breath again. [/quote]

Where does the EMS come from? I'll answer for you: your choices. That's right: YOUR choices, and they mattered. As for Shepard in stone rubble, it didn't look like stone to me. Even if it did, it's possible that he crash landed to Earth, or that it was all a dream. We don't know. The stone rubble part, I admit, is poorly executed, but it does not negate everything else.

[quote]You can say your choices mattered, and I agree with you, troughout the game, you shaped your story, but in the last 15 minutes, you dont see anything back from that, no one does.[/quote]

And what makes you think the developers had that in mind? It's unrealistic. The developers NEVER intended to do that, and you know it. There is no way that they can humanly do so, and introducing some elements and not others will ****** people off. Some people want to see how the Rachni factor in the ending. Others will want to see how Grunt does. They do matter in the EMS, and that is more than enough. Think about it: does your choice of spouse matter if you get shot dead in a gutter? Does your choice of job? You've seen how realistically and humanly possible that your choices reflect on your story and your ending, and the fate of the galaxy YOU and NO ONE ELSE shaped. That's enough closure as they can get.

Read the OP regarding the choice on Wrex, and you'll realize that he got enough closure. But he's also a living, breathing character. He has ambitions, plans for Tuchanka. He has a wife, Eve, who is pregnant, symbolizing hope for the future of the Krogan. She's not on Earth now. If he makes it back to Tuchanka, Eve's personality will stabilize the influence of wanting more worlds for the Krogan. She wants to rebuild Tuchanka. Wrex wants to expand. You've done what you could for them throughout the last two games. And now they have a future to look forward to, and leaving you in wonderment means that you are interested in learning about what happens to them afterwards.

The same goes for all your other choices.

[iamthedave3]

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

GnusmasTHX wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

iamthedave3 wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...
Normandy is smaller than those larger ships, and a heck of a lot faster (fastest ship ever built as I understand it) and Joker is the best pilot ever. Now you guys are just purposely looking for the negative instead of trying to see any other outcome. In short, you have decided that you are right no matter what and there is no room for any other debate.

You win.

So you're saying that Joker chickened out of the greatest fight of his time and fled the battle unlike those heroic Alliance soldiers seen fighting against the reapers on foot during the final scene? moreover, Joker and the entire squad chickened out and fled?

The Crucible was tearing all the ships in it's vicinity apart. I'd say that at that point fight is over, run or die.

Yeah, except the giant ships it was meant to destroy.

You mean the giant ships that characters ASSUMED it was meant to destroy? What if all the Crucible ended up being nothing more than a really big coffee machine?

Then your desperate attempt to explain away an obvious plot hole becomes even sillier, because Joker fled from the greatest battle of his time due to A REALLY BIG COFFEE MACHINE.

I can see him getting his post-war award right now. I really can.

[Genera1Nemesis]

Besides, the original argument was whether they should change the ending or not. I don't think changing it is a good thing; adding to it is completely different however....

[NPH11]

You lose all credibility in the artistic debate when you start mass producing it to be sold at $60-90. You're a business, an art-factory at best. You're producing a product and you're expected to meet the expectations of the consumer. If you don't, we won't support you in your future endeavors.

What you call "ruining art" I call "being a responsible consumer". While people like Stephen King most certainly care about art, Bioware and EA really don't give a damn about making art. They're major corporations. They care about creating profit so shareholders will continue to support them. That is their number one priority as a corporation.

[Genera1Nemesis]

iamthedave3 wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

GnusmasTHX wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

iamthedave3 wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...
Normandy is smaller than those larger ships, and a heck of a lot faster (fastest ship ever built as I understand it) and Joker is the best pilot ever. Now you guys are just purposely looking for the negative instead of trying to see any other outcome. In short, you have decided that you are right no matter what and there is no room for any other debate.

You win.

So you're saying that Joker chickened out of the greatest fight of his time and fled the battle unlike those heroic Alliance soldiers seen fighting against the reapers on foot during the final scene? moreover, Joker and the entire squad chickened out and fled?

The Crucible was tearing all the ships in it's vicinity apart. I'd say that at that point fight is over, run or die.

Yeah, except the giant ships it was meant to destroy.

You mean the giant ships that characters ASSUMED it was meant to destroy? What if all the Crucible ended up being nothing more than a really big coffee machine?

Then your desperate attempt to explain away an obvious plot hole becomes even sillier, because Joker fled from the greatest battle of his time due to A REALLY BIG COFFEE MACHINE.

I can see him getting his post-war award right now. I really can.

He ran because every alliance ship was being ripped apart by the buildup of energy the Crucible had. If he hadn't run, the Normandy would have been destroyed right then and there. What Joker did was self-preservation; which is what Joker has always been very good at.

[blah64]

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

The entire game was the end of the story, not just the last 5 minutes.

Not true. The game was the last act. The last 10 minutes were the ending. And it failed to deliver what was promised. As Forbes argued, we're not entitled gamers, were active consumers.

http://www.forbes.co...er-entitlement/ 

and

http://www.forbes.co...ible-consumers/ 

Both are very good articles. The first dispels the arguement for gamer "entitlement" and the latter describes how our actions are good business. I would give both a read before continuing to judge us.

[saracen16]

deathscythe517 wrote...

Oh hey you guys are finally taking the advice and grouping together. Also I'm going to state it one more time.

Art is viewed before purchase and is either created at the request of someone or for the artist to display, it is not about profit. Books are the same way, they are tailored to the audience or made to make art or a statement. Video games are for-profit purely and thus never can and never will be art and at best will contain artistic elements.

No. You buy a book and read it. You are left with your own reaction as to its ending: you are surprised, disappointed, or sad. They are not based on audience feedback.

This idiocy that we're somehow ruining the game by petitioning for extra content that gives real choices and consequences in the final act or at the very least some kind of freaking epilogue is just rude. We're not taking content away from you, we're trying to add onto it after being disgruntled, we aren't fans, we're customers, and as customers we are suppose to voice our criticisms so a business can do better. There was a time that this train of thought was encouraged but instead we have that minority who are brand loyalists who act as deniable PR for the company as well as trying to suppress concerns.

No. You're petitioning for completely CHANGING the initial ending. There's a difference.

It is our choice to fight for what we want and to do what we want so long as we remain civil there is no problem. Even if Bioware slaps our petition down most of us would've rather tried and failed than just accept what we're given. So I have to ask, what right do you have to tell us to shut up?

I'm not telling you to shut up. I'm just saying that you have no right to force BioWare to CHANGE the ending, which is what most people here want. Even an "addition" is a change: it means that BioWare has to sacrifice its own right of artistic expression and free speech. The same goes with The Satanic Verses controversy, except that it reached a point demanding the author's head. This is EXACTLY the same pattern we are seeing here.

[LucidStrike]

Uezurii wrote...

LucidStrike wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

iamthedave3 wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...
Normandy is smaller than those larger ships, and a heck of a lot faster (fastest ship ever built as I understand it) and Joker is the best pilot ever. Now you guys are just purposely looking for the negative instead of trying to see any other outcome. In short, you have decided that you are right no matter what and there is no room for any other debate.

You win.

So you're saying that Joker chickened out of the greatest fight of his time and fled the battle unlike those heroic Alliance soldiers seen fighting against the reapers on foot during the final scene? moreover, Joker and the entire squad chickened out and fled?

The Crucible was tearing all the ships in it's vicinity apart. I'd say that at that point fight is over, run or die.

The Crucible's event horizon was relatively small, so I dunno why you two are debating
it so much. It sucked in very few ship PARTS from relatively close
by...and Joker's not a coward. I don't have any cowards in my crew.

Here's plothole to discuss: WTF are they so happy when the Normandy lands? O_o

Maybe because Joker knows he can watch his massive amount of porn in peace now.

"But there was time now!"

[saracen16]

NPH11 wrote...

You lose all credibility in the artistic debate when you start mass producing it to be sold at $60-90.

Tell that to the people who write books, many of which cost even more than $60.

[iamthedave3]

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

Besides, the original argument was whether they should change the ending or not. I don't think changing it is a good thing; adding to it is completely different however....

In fairness, nobody has ever wanted these endings to be -gone- they just want more choices, and preferably ones that more closely reflect their choices made in the game.

If you're followed the rage closely, you'll notice that the majority of the anger is not at shephard's death, though a lot do want to be reunited with their LI... the majority of the anger is centred on the treatment of the Normandy.

[MrLee95]

Do you all notice that when saracen16 posts then Genera1Nemesis posts right after?
And they are pretty much the only 2 arguing against you all?

Either these are the same person or they are friends, and all they are trying to do is Troll you.

Stop talking to these "people" and stop giving them a rise. No matter what you say to people like this they will not listen.

Modifié par MrLee95, 16 mars 2012 - 12:24 .

[GnusmasTHX]

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

GnusmasTHX wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

iamthedave3 wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...
Normandy is smaller than those larger ships, and a heck of a lot faster (fastest ship ever built as I understand it) and Joker is the best pilot ever. Now you guys are just purposely looking for the negative instead of trying to see any other outcome. In short, you have decided that you are right no matter what and there is no room for any other debate.

You win.

So you're saying that Joker chickened out of the greatest fight of his time and fled the battle unlike those heroic Alliance soldiers seen fighting against the reapers on foot during the final scene? moreover, Joker and the entire squad chickened out and fled?

The Crucible was tearing all the ships in it's vicinity apart. I'd say that at that point fight is over, run or die.

Yeah, except the giant ships it was meant to destroy.

You mean the giant ships that characters ASSUMED it was meant to destroy? What if all the Crucible ended up being nothing more than a really big coffee machine?

That flew right over your head, didn't it?

You claim that the Normandy knew the Crucible was bad business because it was destroying all the ships. It wasn't. It doesn't destroy a single ship we see, at least not explosively. The Reapers just slump over. Even the debris of the ships around the Crucible remain intact after the signal wave passes through them.

Now you say that Joker didn't know what the Crucible was going to do, and fled anyway, huh? It helps your case when your example is that the Crucible might've been harmless, so Joker should've fled.

Modifié par GnusmasTHX, 16 mars 2012 - 12:28 .

[MrLee95]

Do you all notice that when saracen16 posts then Genera1Nemesis posts right after?
And they are pretty much the only 2 arguing against you all?

Either these are the same person or they are friends, and all they are trying to do is Troll you.

Stop talking to these "people" and stop giving them a rise. No matter what you say to people like this they will not listen.

Modifié par MrLee95, 16 mars 2012 - 12:25 .

[Genera1Nemesis]

NPH11 wrote...

You lose all credibility in the artistic debate when you start mass producing it to be sold at $60-90. You're a business, an art-factory at best. You're producing a product and you're expected to meet the expectations of the consumer. If you don't, we won't support you in your future endeavors.

What you call "ruining art" I call "being a responsible consumer". While people like Stephen King most certainly care about art, Bioware and EA really don't give a damn about making art. They're major corporations. They care about creating profit so shareholders will continue to support them. That is their number one priority as a corporation.

So you're saying that Bioware (the brand) is just a collective hive mind that doesn't consist of writers and programmers who DID have an artistic vision? Authors need publishing companies too; that doesn't demean their form of art. It just proves that in order to share your vision with a wide audience you have to either find someone who will financially support you (EA) or try to raise those funds youself.

Sterphen King is published by Bantam; a major publishing giant corporation. So that means what he does isn't art?

[akuma1973]

[quote]saracen16 wrote...


What we do in life echoes in eternity.
- Gladiator

You will be who you will be. We are our choices.
- Helios, Deus Ex

[quote]Protecting Creative Risk And Integrity: Why Mass Effect 3′s Ending Should Never Be Changed
Snip drivel
[/quote]

Ok I don't think you understand the difference between what Mass Effect was advertised as and for the most part was and a Movie or book. Even PIck a Path Books have more varied endings than ME3. Let's explain it in another way.

Suppose one day yous ee an adveret for the ideal Island getaway in the pacific. You buy your tickets, get great seats. The airline is owned by the same compnay that owns the resort and therefore starts asking you about things you would like during your stay.

Would like like a beach front room? A room facing the jungle paradise? or a view of the extinct volcano? You pick one.

Then they ask where you would like dinner when you arrive? In the beach front restaurant? Or would you like to ride the gondola to the top of the volcano and enjoy a spectacular local style feast there? You pick one.

Would you like to go on a yacht around the island on your first day? relax on the beach? Or  go on a walk through the jungle? You pick one.

These choices are offered to you throughtout the flight, and then on the scenic journey to the resort. So by the time you get their you have this amazing holiday planned out and know it will be awesome.

When You check in you are given a key to a room with no windows, are told that dinner and breakfast will be served in your room, and during the day you will only be able to sit ina  boring Hall with nothing to do.

Would you not then feel you have the right to complain? The right to ask for things to be changed to what you had been told you were going to get? The right to a refund? And the right to slag of the liars who misled you?

Because that's pretty much what has happened here.

[Genera1Nemesis]

MrLee95 wrote...

Do you all notice that when saracen16 posts then Genera1Nemesis posts right after?
And they are pretty much the only 2 arguing against you all?

Either these are the same person or they are friends, and all they are trying to do is Troll you.

Stop talking to these "people" and stop giving them a rise. No matter what you say to people like this they will not listen.

Wow, you couldn't be more wrong. Assumptions, assumptions and more assumptions, lol.

[NPH11]

saracen16 wrote...

NPH11 wrote...

You lose all credibility in the artistic debate when you start mass producing it to be sold at $60-90.

Tell that to the people who write books, many of which cost even more than $60.

They're not major corporations with shareholders to answer to. Way to completely miss the rest of my initial post.

[Genera1Nemesis]

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

MrLee95 wrote...

Do you all notice that when saracen16 posts then Genera1Nemesis posts right after?
And they are pretty much the only 2 arguing against you all?

Either these are the same person or they are friends, and all they are trying to do is Troll you.

Stop talking to these "people" and stop giving them a rise. No matter what you say to people like this they will not listen.

Wow, you couldn't be more wrong. Assumptions, assumptions and more assumptions, lol.

And I love how providing a counter-argument is 'trolling". Ah, internet; you have destroyed logical thinking with all your meme's....

Modifié par Genera1Nemesis, 16 mars 2012 - 12:27 .

[saracen16]

iamthedave3 wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

Besides, the original argument was whether they should change the ending or not. I don't think changing it is a good thing; adding to it is completely different however....

In fairness, nobody has ever wanted these endings to be -gone- they just want more choices, and preferably ones that more closely reflect their choices made in the game.

Dave, Mass Effect was NEVER about easy choices. We only had a few in each scenario. Why can't Khalisah be my LI? Why can't Kasumi be my LI? Because the game writers didn't design it that way. Read the OP, dave. You'll find out that your choices have been reflected, and that the entire game IS the ending. BioWare can't humanly put every single sub-plot and plot in the last 15 minutes.

"Hey, Shepard, it's Conrad Verner! I married Jenna! Hey, Shepard, it's Barla Von! Here are your troops. Now go fight the Reapersss! Hey, Shepard, it's Kasumi. Thanks for the greybox! Here's a thermal clip to help you kill Starchild! Hey, Shepard, it's Wrex! Thanks for curing the genophage! I baked you a cake!" You realize that most of this happens throughout the game, right? Again, read the OP.

If you're followed the rage closely, you'll notice that the majority of the anger is not at shephard's death, though a lot do want to be reunited with their LI... the majority of the anger is centred on the treatment of the Normandy.

You're not god. You're Shepard. You don't know where any of the Normandy crewmembers are. You can make assumptions on what you see, but that doesn't make it true because you're seeing the game through Shepard's eyes, not anyone else's.

[Relwyn]

Valah79 wrote...

Can you point me to where in this world it says "I don't have the right" to demand a change? I can demand whatever the hell I want. Bioware has the right to ignore me, and then I have the right to never buy any of their games again. It's really is that simple, new ending, or tons of revenue loss. No one's rights is being trampled in any way shape or form in this. It's just cause and effect. You give us a **** ending that's a slap in the face of all the time and money we invested in your product (not art), and don't fix it. We stop buying your other products, because I don't want to be slapped in the face again. Sorry not a masochist like that.

This post pretty much sums it up... 

[Spitfiremk87]

MrLee95 wrote...

Do you all notice that when saracen16 posts then Genera1Nemesis posts right after?
And they are pretty much the only 2 arguing against you all?

Either these are the same person or they are friends, and all they are trying to do is Troll you.

Stop talking to these "people" and stop giving them a rise. No matter what you say to people like this they will not listen.

Quit feeding the trolls. This person is right. They are the only two posting here. The sooner we stop posting, the sooner this will float to the bottom of the forum.

[shurryy]

saracen16 wrote...

Protecting Creative Risk And Integrity: Why Mass Effect 3′s Ending Should Never Be Changed 

http://0.gravatar.co...523536?s=16&r=G Mark Serrels




Kotaku AU



March 13, 2012 1:00 PM

Yesterday folks got into a bit of a kerfuffle about Mass Effect 3‘s
ending. Some were happy with it, some were angry — but many have gone
as far to say it should actually be retrospectively changed. You can
agree or disagree — but that’s where I draw the line. This rant is
completely spoiler free!
In Tsugumi Ohba’s Bakuman, the talented Mashiro and Tagaki
write manga. It is their dream to create incredible stories together;
stories that will inspire and dazzle their audience. Their nemesis is
the scheming Nanamine, a writer who idolises the combined abilities of
Mashiro and Takagi, but secretly wishes to dethrone them.
He has no writing or drawing talent to speak of — he can’t create
Manga — so in order to compete he recruits hundreds of wanna-be writers
and artists from the internet. By manipulating this hive mind he
attempts to compete with Mashiro and Takagi.
Nanamine crowdsources everything — the writing, the art, the plot,
the structure — every aspect of his manga is fine tuned to the
expectations and demands of this massive group. His work is the end
result of hours of group testing, by hundreds of informed readers. The
end result is the perfect manga — finely tuned, slickly produced,
well-constructed.
And completely, utterly sterile.

I was reminded of Bakuman as the internet bile began to surface in response to Mass Effect 3’s ending. Considering the investment gamers had in the Mass Effect trilogy, and the personal investment
many had — in their own designed protagonist and choices — some sort of
negative response was always going to be expected.
I had no issue with the negativity, because I understand. On multiple
occasions I’ve been massively disappointed in fiction. I’ve been
frustrated. I’ve been downright furious with the way certain movies,
games or books have ended.
But not once have I ever, ever suggested that the author take their work back and completely transform and change something to my own personal specifications.
Because that would be complete lunacy.
Let me reiterate — if you hated the ending of Mass Effect 3,
please continue to whinge. Continue to be angry. Please continue to
**** about how it goes against everything the series stands for —
dramatically cast your hands to the sky like a collective Darth Vader,
and scream ‘NNOOOO’ in abject despair! Absolutely, that is your right.
But it is not your right to demand that the ending be changed. You have absolutely no say in that, and that is the way it should be.

There’s a tremendous difference between arguing and discussing how Bioware should have handled Mass Effect 3’s ending, and demanding they change it. Some are too entitled to tell the difference, but it’s paramount.
A game like Mass Effect, which is clearly designed and
carefully built — with every detail of the universe accounted for —
could not bear the damage a fan-demanded change to its fiction would
create. Its integrity would collapse. This is Bioware’s story — no
matter how personal your own existence within Mass Effect’s universe is,
that existence was made possible within the confines of Bioware’s
authorial intent. Full stop. You don’t get to change that. Once a word
is said, it cannot be unsaid.
Fiction should delight us, it should broaden our horizons. It should
challenge us, make us angry — often for the wrong reasons. Fiction
should also have the propensity to disappoint us. But it must never, never pander to us.
I don’t want to engage with fiction that simply regales the story I
want it to tell. Why would I? I want to be surprised by what I
read/play/watch. Compared to other media, video game fiction is easily
the least static, but that doesn’t mean that the creative act should be
democratic — there still has to be structure. You must still react to
what a creator has made for you, and you don’t get to change that —
imagine the precedent that would set.
Once a piece of fiction is placed is complete, and released into the
wild, it must remain that way or its integrity will be desecrated.

In Bakuman, Mashiro and Tagaki write a weekly manga. They
respond to their audience, because theirs is a commercial endeavour. If
certain characters aren’t liked, they may phase them out. If a certain
story arc isn’t gaining traction, they may cut it short. But nothing is
ever changed in retrospect. Once is story is told it cannot be untold.
Mashiro and Tagaki work in isolation, fuelled by their own creative
impulse, delivering content fans are inspired and energised by. The same
audience reacts to Nanamine’s output with a dull indifference. It’s
hard to become passionate about something that’s created by committee —
something that lacks the spark of an individual voice. It can never be
original, it can never dazzle.
And that’s what we risk when we demand retrospective change by
committee — we risk derailing creative risk, we risk subverting the act
of individual creativity.
I haven’t finished Mass Effect 3 yet, but I don’t care if
Bioware’s ending completely shatters everything I hold dear about the
series. I don’t care if my Shepard starts doing the moonwalk over Reaper
corpses before engaging in a dance fight to the death with the Illusive
Man. I don’t care how ludicrous or flat out wrong Bioware’s ending to Mass Effect
is, I will accept it as canon because I shouldn’t have any choice.
Sure, I will howl at the moon with a primordial rage, maybe even snap
both discs in two, [b]but I will never question Bioware’s authorial
integrity, because Mass Effect is Bioware’s story to tell, and I’m just going to have to deal with it.

"Oh look, a Kotaku article! Yeah... we have dismissed that claim..."

Modifié par shurryy, 16 mars 2012 - 12:31 .

[RLesueur]

saracen16 wrote...

You're not god. You're Shepard. You don't know where any of the Normandy crewmembers are. You can make assumptions on what you see, but that doesn't make it true because you're seeing the game through Shepard's eyes, not anyone else's.

Well that doesn't make any sense, Shepard is dead at that point. You're not seeing anything through his/her eyes then.

Besides, having to make assumptions on what the hell happened is exactly what makes this a bad ending that needs changing.

[Uezurii]

saracen16 wrote...

iamthedave3 wrote...

Genera1Nemesis wrote...

Besides, the original argument was whether they should change the ending or not. I don't think changing it is a good thing; adding to it is completely different however....

In fairness, nobody has ever wanted these endings to be -gone- they just want more choices, and preferably ones that more closely reflect their choices made in the game.

Dave, Mass Effect was NEVER about easy choices. We only had a few in each scenario. Why can't Khalisah be my LI? Why can't Kasumi be my LI? Because the game writers didn't design it that way. Read the OP, dave. You'll find out that your choices have been reflected, and that the entire game IS the ending. BioWare can't humanly put every single sub-plot and plot in the last 15 minutes.

"Hey, Shepard, it's Conrad Verner! I married Jenna! Hey, Shepard, it's Barla Von! Here are your troops. Now go fight the Reapersss! Hey, Shepard, it's Kasumi. Thanks for the greybox! Here's a thermal clip to help you kill Starchild! Hey, Shepard, it's Wrex! Thanks for curing the genophage! I baked you a cake!" You realize that most of this happens throughout the game, right? Again, read the OP.

If you're followed the rage closely, you'll notice that the majority of the anger is not at shephard's death, though a lot do want to be reunited with their LI... the majority of the anger is centred on the treatment of the Normandy.

You're not god. You're Shepard. You don't know where any of the Normandy crewmembers are. You can make assumptions on what you see, but that doesn't make it true because you're seeing the game through Shepard's eyes, not anyone else's.

Ok this is already where your whole statements is flawed, we see it all trough Shepard's eyes right? Yet he is up on the citadel dying while he made his choice, and then we see how Earth gets hit by the beam, and how the Normandy crash lands. But according to you, we wont see what happens next to the Normandy crew because we look trough Shepards eyes and he doesn't know it, so how does he know they crash land?

Again though, I'm not saying the last 3 choices are bad, I'm saying the execution leaves a lot to be desired.