43 réponses à ce sujet

[Lynx7725]

To be really honest? I don't want to cloak, as I want to save it for (1) Running away, (2) Objective cap, (3) stealth revive, and (4) the really important cloak headshots. Roughly in that order.

If I got no better target and the poor sod is something I can bodyshot without cloaking, I'm not going to incur cooldown to get overkill damage... well, maybe, if TWO of them are nicely lined up and I have the AP mod.... xD

[Nocturnalfox]

Put the armour penetration and damage mod on the mantis X and it will do better then all non upgraded sniper rifles. When you get widow to 4-5 then you might want to switch to that, but that depends on if you use your powers.

[Shock n Awe]

I figure if I have to reload after the shot anyway, why not toss the cloak on for that extra damage, considering it changes virtually nothing?

By the time I'm ready to run away, cap an objective, or sneak in for a revive (generally after I finish reloading; going anywhere without a clip in your weapon is bad strategy), the cloak is sitting there ready to be used the instant my reload is done (and sometimes quick enough to cut a small amount of time off the reload).

[HaesoME3]

Sevrun wrote...

For Gold, I'd really recommend an X lvl weapon. Meaning the Mantis X in this case. It has phenomenal stopping power and a fairly light weight for sniper rifles. Some people who use powers less swear by the Widow/Black Widow but I've never been fond of them myself. The Mantis is easier to upgrade and does superior damage at 10 vs a Widow 1.

Stay away from the Raptor unless you plan on using it like an assault rifle, and there are better choices there anyway. high weight to damage ratio and low damage per shot mean your cloaked headshots will be FAR less effective.

Widow I is significantly higher than mantis X in damage...

[KillerSnake616]

i prefer the Saber over any sniper rifle

as for the actual sniper rifles, i like the Javelin. stats are about the same as the Widow but also has that infrared type scope. only downside is you have to hold down the trigger for a second

[stribies]

Lynx7725 wrote...

To be really honest? I don't want to cloak, as I want to save it for (1) Running away, (2) Objective cap, (3) stealth revive, and (4) the really important cloak headshots. Roughly in that order.

If I got no better target and the poor sod is something I can bodyshot without cloaking, I'm not going to incur cooldown to get overkill damage... well, maybe, if TWO of them are nicely lined up and I have the AP mod.... xD

Unless you're doing something terribly wrong with your build, you should be able to cloak with every shot. I use a black widow and there are very few times when I can't use cloak to add more damage to my shots. Also, if you've been playing gold, the mobs don't exactly give you the opportunity to aim at them unless you're cloaked anyways.

[NY Dynasty1977]

Im not really feeling the mantis as its too slow for me.  I like to be up close to my squad to help revive and stuff and this is just too slow for me when being up close, being there are lots of enemies and im not the best head shot-no scoper at that.  I use the raptor on SP and like it a lot as its a good hybrid of AR/sniper but see mix feelings on it here.  Are there any other sniper rifles that kinda have this mix that would be better than the raptor???

 

[Elecbender]

NY Dynasty1977 wrote...

Im not really feeling the mantis as its too slow for me.  I like to be up close to my squad to help revive and stuff and this is just too slow for me when being up close, being there are lots of enemies and im not the best head shot-no scoper at that.  I use the raptor on SP and like it a lot as its a good hybrid of AR/sniper but see mix feelings on it here.  Are there any other sniper rifles that kinda have this mix that would be better than the raptor???

 

Only other sniper rifle that has this trait is the Indra and that's not available in multiplayer.

[Tangster]

LuckyIronAxe wrote...

M13 Raptor, less intense scope makes switching targets easier in my opinion.

I only scope in for the shot. Staying in scope is suicide since you can't tell if you're being flanked.

[Tangster]

NY Dynasty1977 wrote...

Im not really feeling the mantis as its too slow for me.  I like to be up close to my squad to help revive and stuff and this is just too slow for me when being up close, being there are lots of enemies and im not the best head shot-no scoper at that.  I use the raptor on SP and like it a lot as its a good hybrid of AR/sniper but see mix feelings on it here.  Are there any other sniper rifles that kinda have this mix that would be better than the raptor???

 

The saber is a nice alternative, even if it is a assault rifle, very heavy and really rare. I haven't had the chance to try one in MP yet.

[Nocturnalfox]

Tangster wrote...

NY Dynasty1977 wrote...

Im not really feeling the mantis as its too slow for me.  I like to be up close to my squad to help revive and stuff and this is just too slow for me when being up close, being there are lots of enemies and im not the best head shot-no scoper at that.  I use the raptor on SP and like it a lot as its a good hybrid of AR/sniper but see mix feelings on it here.  Are there any other sniper rifles that kinda have this mix that would be better than the raptor???

 

The saber is a nice alternative, even if it is a assault rifle, very heavy and really rare. I haven't had the chance to try one in MP yet.

I  just got one 
Dying to try it out

[Sabbatine]

Tangster wrote...

The widow by itself is really best for taking down mini-bosses like the banshee, it's still overkill for anything else, especially with the damage bonuses from tac cloak and no damage bleed through on gold. Great fun on silver though.

In the hands of someone fully aware of the strengths and weaknesses of the widow, the overkill isn't too big a problem.  You just have to prioritize your shots based on two primary factors.  First, choose a target based on an enemy's threat to you or your squad at that exact moment.  If no enemies are in a position to immediately threaten you or your squad then pick your target based on their potential threat to you or your squad.

Sometimes killing a single husk that has your team mate stuck in the button mash sequence is a better way of spending your bullet than the brute or banshee you just saw emerge from a passage 25 meters away.  Sometimes getting a multikill on three cannibals is a better way of spending the bullet than hitting a more armored target.  You just need to get good at making these decisions and knowing which enemy is the best enemy to kill right at that moment.

Lynx7725 wrote...

To be really honest? I don't want to cloak, as I want to save it for (1) Running away, (2) Objective cap, (3) stealth revive, and (4) the really important cloak headshots. Roughly in that order.

If I got no better target and the poor sod is something I can bodyshot without cloaking, I'm not going to incur cooldown to get overkill damage... well, maybe, if TWO of them are nicely lined up and I have the AP mod.... xD

That is an inefficient way of using tactical cloak.  Cloak is a versatile skill but the entire reason it exists is to facilitate the quick slaughter of enemies.  It is intelligent to avoid cloaking if you are taking a shot that you know will kill the enemy without the damage modifier, but saving it to run away is unnecessary except for the most specific of situations.  The recharge speed is very fast and it's pretty rare when that time will matter because half the enemies that you'll be running from on Gold see through your cloak anyways up to medium range.

Rather than saving cloak for situations you should not allow yourself to frequently be in, use it to thin out the enemies and reduce the chance of those situations happening at all.  All the reasons you listed are great to use tactical cloak to achieve, but actually not using it until one of these situations occurs is a waste of potential.

The AP mod is not required if you are using the widow, it will pierce multiple enemies without needing a mod.

Nocturnalfox wrote...

Put the armour penetration and damage mod on the mantis X and it will do better then all non upgraded sniper rifles. When you get widow to 4-5 then you might want to switch to that, but that depends on if you use your powers.

It will do better in many situations, but even with an AP mod the mantis, the widow will outperform it on armored targets and does not suffer from damage reduction when shooting through cover.  AP ammo would be a better choice for the mantis.

HaesoME3 wrote...

Widow I is significantly higher than mantis X in damage...

This is true, but people are not saying the Mantis will do more damage, they are saying it will outperform the widow.

This means that no matter how much more damage the widow does, against most targets the mantis is more efficient because your weapon can only do as much damage as enemies have hp.

Lets say a hypothetical mantis has a base damage of 1000 per shot and a hypothetical widow has a base damage of 1500 per shot.  Lets say the mantis hits an enemy with 500 hp and kills it in a single shot.  The mantis has just done 500 damage but 500 damage was overkill and thus wasted.  Now lets say the widow also hits an enemy with 500 hp and kills them in the same shot.  The widow has just done the exact same amount of damage as the mantis, but 1000 damage was overkill and thus wasted.

The stats on the mantis have been balanced around the weapon's overall power so while it does less damage than the Widow on paper, the vast majority of the time it is actually dealing damage equal to the widow's but has the added benefit of being lighter and having a larger ammunition reserve.

The situations where a widow outperforms the mantis are far and few between because on bronze and silver most enemies are killed by a single headshot from either the widow or mantis.  The widow on the other hand is only more efficient when certain conditions are met:

*Killing enemies in one shot that the mantis cannot kill in one shot.
*Hitting enemies that can absorb all the damage generated by each widow hit.
*Hitting enemies through cover (the mantis loses damage if it is equipped with the piercing mod, or simply cannot do this at all if it is not equipped with the mod.
*Getting multikills, or damaging multiple enemies with a single shot.
*Firing from the hip.
*Striking an armored target (a target with a yellow life bar).

There are probably more situations, but those are the ones on my mind right now.  If losing a lot of reserve ammo and having your skills refreshing less quickly is worth it to gain a superior rifle in the above scenarios, then the widow is the way to go... otherwise use the mantis.

[Apollys]

Black Widow is the clear best, and Widow is second. A high level widow may be preferable to a low level Black widow.

[NY Dynasty1977]

Tangster wrote...

NY Dynasty1977 wrote...

Im not really feeling the mantis as its too slow for me.  I like to be up close to my squad to help revive and stuff and this is just too slow for me when being up close, being there are lots of enemies and im not the best head shot-no scoper at that.  I use the raptor on SP and like it a lot as its a good hybrid of AR/sniper but see mix feelings on it here.  Are there any other sniper rifles that kinda have this mix that would be better than the raptor???

 

The saber is a nice alternative, even if it is a assault rifle, very heavy and really rare. I haven't had the chance to try one in MP yet.

yeah, I heard its nice but I wont be able to use any of the sniper perks that come with the infiltrator if the saber is strictly an AR...I guess the raptor will have to do....

[NY Dynasty1977]

Elecbender wrote...

NY Dynasty1977 wrote...

Im not really feeling the mantis as its too slow for me.  I like to be up close to my squad to help revive and stuff and this is just too slow for me when being up close, being there are lots of enemies and im not the best head shot-no scoper at that.  I use the raptor on SP and like it a lot as its a good hybrid of AR/sniper but see mix feelings on it here.  Are there any other sniper rifles that kinda have this mix that would be better than the raptor???

 

Only other sniper rifle that has this trait is the Indra and that's not available in multiplayer.

how is it in SP compared to the raptor?

[BJshepard]

If your a pro at evasion and head shots, the black widow is the pick because it is still powerful and has a default 3 shots per clip.

If you are more defensive and can find a good spot without getting shot at repeatedly the the one shot guns (Mantis, Widow, Javelin, and Kishock Harpoon Gun are the ones because they provide the overall best damage per shot ratio.

If you can't get multiple head shots that easily but at least can keep on their bodies while being evasive then snipers with the most ammo are the ones (e.g. Raptor, Indra, Incisor, and collector Sniper rifle) with the Incisor, Keep in mind it is a 3 round burst and the damage you see from its stats is per bullet not 3 round burst if I remember correctly.

[Kuato Livezz]

Nothing wrong with using a Mantis X on Gold. However, as you progress through your purchases, the Widow would be the next best thing. Everything becomes just a change of pace once you get a Black Widow X or Javelin X.

[lktalon22]

Oh Man! Nostalgia! Recruit packs? Mantis? Wow, we have come so far...