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EA/Bioware in Full PR Damage Control Mode *UPDATED 3/22/12, 5:28 PM UTC/GMT -4 hours*


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#2651
Razorsteel

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Kilshrek wrote...

Coming back to say again, everyone should read the first post and familiarise themselves with the little tactics that will be employed against us. Subtle derailments are as insidious as indoctrinations.

Remember, while we may all want different things out of the endings, we have a common theme, we want the ending that Shepard's story deserves. No obfuscation, no clever scenes implying this or that. Don't accept a candy floss ending, it only looks impressive, but it's pitifully poor on actual content.

When another falters, we pick them up. Nobody gets left behind, We hold the line.


Hold the line, fight like a Krogan.

#2652
Singu

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Gigaheart wrote...

Promchek wrote...

news from german front (oh my this sounded kinda weird o0 ). The poll on gamestar.de

Gamestar Poll

50,5% this end destroys whole serie
9,5% i am dissapointed
5,6% was ok, could be better
6,7% different then expected, but still good
3,6% very good, exactly wat i've hoped for.

i think it's very clear picture.


Aaand 24.1% think that..? =) Just wandering.


24.1% is playing the game and haven't gotten to the end yet.

#2653
oh_saki

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TurambarEA wrote...

Have just caught up with the posts I missed yesterday. Very good collating by the OP and thanks to atghunter and others for continuing to contribute such valuable insights. I wonder, if perhaps one of the more motivated amongst us (with a knack for plain, concise drafting) could put some of these concepts being discussed into a more tangible form?

E.g.:
1. A concise, polite, objective list of all the problems we currently have with the ending. So that it's clear what we stand for.

2. An addendum or replacement (banish the thought!) to 'hold the line' - something that is more 'on-message' and thus hammers home our position time and again. Need the PR/Marketing folks amongst you.

In a related matter, I was wondering if there was some other way to organise better - to avoid being 'divided and conquered' by the better equipped EA publicity/marketing machine. There's clearly some very smart Mass Effect fans here and some with some valuable life/professional experience. Is it worth trying to get a few heads together and form some kind of pseudo-leadership or spokesperson group? If we can get all of the above happening - focus this ragged group into a tight, on-message army of Bioware fans, then we're going to be in a much better position going forward and we're going to be that much harder to ignore.

To that end, I would like to throw all the names of people in the OP forward. If they don't want to be 'leaders', sure, that's fine - but perhaps they could get together on MSN or something of the sort, to flesh out some of the concepts they've talked about - drafting a unified message, etc.? If they can do that initially, and then throw it back to us on the forums here for comment then I'm sure we can make some great strides.

If they DO want to accept that role as leaders, then importantly, when we end up acting exactly how EA wants us to act (fighting amongst ourselves, accepting faux olive branches) we have people to look to set us straight, encourage us, stop us from faltering, show us a path forward, etc.

The sort of almost single-minded cooperation I've witnessed in this movement is unprecedented. Even as we are, I've never seen this many fans mobilised, motivated and on-message. I have moderated for Infinity Ward for a few years now and have seen countless examples of the sort of mistakes that atghunter and the others have alluded to - gamers might have a very good point that 'matchmaking is sub-par' or 'the spawn system is far from optimal' BUT that criticism usually comes across as 'fix your [expletive] game, you guys are lazy, now point me in the direction of the DLC you're selling'. We're definitely not that, we've shown that we're better than that, but I fear the longer we go without consolidating our position, the more people we'll lose to apathy (stop caring about the issue) or despair (start getting angry and hinder our campaign).

The short of it: we need to consolidate our movement while we're still flush with numbers, I believe we need leaders.


I agree. The big argument against Occupy Wallstreet was, though they had a great cause, they had no actual PLAN to go about any change. We have to have a plan. We all want different things out of the endings, some of us want happy endings, some of us wouldn't mind sad endings, but ALL of us want DIFFERENT endings.

We need to be a little more precise with our demands. If we just tell Bioware, different endings, they could change it to something just as bad and say that we should deal with it as it is, after all, a different ending. As Legion would say, we need to reach a consensus.

#2654
redsox95MB

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This is getting intense lol

#2655
cyrrant

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TurambarEA wrote...
The short of it: we need to consolidate our movement while we're still flush with numbers, I believe we need leaders.


It's a slippery slope, atghunter said that PR LOVES when a movement nominates someone to lead, as it gives them a target to tear down instead of taking on the roiling ocean of faceless masses.  It probably serves a secondary effect of making the movement appear to be a cult of personality, in that as soon as the leader gets attacked, there would be a TON of foaming fans roaring their disapproval.  This is what allows them to marginalize us.

It's not a terrible idea to get some heads together, but I'd worry about the repercussions.

#2656
TheSteelArcher

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Razorsteel wrote...

Kilshrek wrote...

Coming back to say again, everyone should read the first post and familiarise themselves with the little tactics that will be employed against us. Subtle derailments are as insidious as indoctrinations.

Remember, while we may all want different things out of the endings, we have a common theme, we want the ending that Shepard's story deserves. No obfuscation, no clever scenes implying this or that. Don't accept a candy floss ending, it only looks impressive, but it's pitifully poor on actual content.

When another falters, we pick them up. Nobody gets left behind, We hold the line.


Hold the line, fight like a Krogan.


...run like a leopard but you'll never be better than Commander Shepard! :D

Modifié par TheSteelArcher, 18 mars 2012 - 04:56 .


#2657
Jacobcus

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c3pu2 wrote...

TurambarEA wrote...

Have just caught up with the posts I missed yesterday. Very good collating by the OP and thanks to atghunter and others for continuing to contribute such valuable insights. I wonder, if perhaps one of the more motivated amongst us (with a knack for plain, concise drafting) could put some of these concepts being discussed into a more tangible form?

E.g.:
1. A concise, polite, objective list of all the problems we currently have with the ending. So that it's clear what we stand for.

2. An addendum or replacement (banish the thought!) to 'hold the line' - something that is more 'on-message' and thus hammers home our position time and again. Need the PR/Marketing folks amongst you.

In a related matter, I was wondering if there was some other way to organise better - to avoid being 'divided and conquered' by the better equipped EA publicity/marketing machine. There's clearly some very smart Mass Effect fans here and some with some valuable life/professional experience. Is it worth trying to get a few heads together and form some kind of pseudo-leadership or spokesperson group? If we can get all of the above happening - focus this ragged group into a tight, on-message army of Bioware fans, then we're going to be in a much better position going forward and we're going to be that much harder to ignore.

To that end, I would like to throw all the names of people in the OP forward. If they don't want to be 'leaders', sure, that's fine - but perhaps they could get together on MSN or something of the sort, to flesh out some of the concepts they've talked about - drafting a unified message, etc.? If they can do that initially, and then throw it back to us on the forums here for comment then I'm sure we can make some great strides.

If they DO want to accept that role as leaders, then importantly, when we end up acting exactly how EA wants us to act (fighting amongst ourselves, accepting faux olive branches) we have people to look to set us straight, encourage us, stop us from faltering, show us a path forward, etc.

The sort of almost single-minded cooperation I've witnessed in this movement is unprecedented. Even as we are, I've never seen this many fans mobilised, motivated and on-message. I have moderated for Infinity Ward for a few years now and have seen countless examples of the sort of mistakes that atghunter and the others have alluded to - gamers might have a very good point that 'matchmaking is sub-par' or 'the spawn system is far from optimal' BUT that criticism usually comes across as 'fix your [expletive] game, you guys are lazy, now point me in the direction of the DLC you're selling'. We're definitely not that, we've shown that we're better than that, but I fear the longer we go without consolidating our position, the more people we'll lose to apathy (stop caring about the issue) or despair (start getting angry and hinder our campaign).

The short of it: we need to consolidate our movement while we're still flush with numbers, I believe we need leaders.

leaders is not a good idea at least not official ones cause they would be to easy to target

We need no leaders, because we lead ourselves,a Soldier behind a desk is a Soldier not on the field Holding the Line. We our a Union in a maybe easier way to understand I'll take a point from Mass Effect iself. We are Legion.

#2658
Flamewielder

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I have money and own ME3 on both PC and XBox... and will buy all DLC twice if an ending makes it worth it.

Do the math, Bioware! ;)

#2659
c3pu2

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cyrrant wrote...

TurambarEA wrote...
The short of it: we need to consolidate our movement while we're still flush with numbers, I believe we need leaders.


It's a slippery slope, atghunter said that PR LOVES when a movement nominates someone to lead, as it gives them a target to tear down instead of taking on the roiling ocean of faceless masses.  It probably serves a secondary effect of making the movement appear to be a cult of personality, in that as soon as the leader gets attacked, there would be a TON of foaming fans roaring their disapproval.  This is what allows them to marginalize us.

It's not a terrible idea to get some heads together, but I'd worry about the repercussions.

once agian leaders is a bad idea we need to reach consensus were not many were one one wave we cant give them targets we have to be one mass so they cant attack us personaly

#2660
animadpig

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We have to keep the pressure on the Bio/EA. Bio/EA sell a incomplete game to the consumers. And yet, they expect consumers will accept this incomplete game? This is a insult to consumers.

#2661
Razorsteel

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I agree with atghunter, we need to remain decentralized for the reasons he and cyrrant mentioned.

Modifié par Razorsteel, 18 mars 2012 - 05:00 .


#2662
cyrrant

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c3pu2 wrote...

cyrrant wrote...

TurambarEA wrote...
The short of it: we need to consolidate our movement while we're still flush with numbers, I believe we need leaders.


It's a slippery slope, atghunter said that PR LOVES when a movement nominates someone to lead, as it gives them a target to tear down instead of taking on the roiling ocean of faceless masses.  It probably serves a secondary effect of making the movement appear to be a cult of personality, in that as soon as the leader gets attacked, there would be a TON of foaming fans roaring their disapproval.  This is what allows them to marginalize us.

It's not a terrible idea to get some heads together, but I'd worry about the repercussions.

once agian leaders is a bad idea we need to reach consensus were not many were one one wave we cant give them targets we have to be one mass so they cant attack us personaly


I tend to agree with this.  However, circulating some kind of comprehensive list isn't a terrible idea, edited maybe by those people who are heading up the most prominent threads?  It's human nature to want to fall in behind someone you believe in, like people were having a hard time not crowning atghunter earlier today.

Modifié par cyrrant, 18 mars 2012 - 05:00 .


#2663
ArmyKnifeX

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 I've come up with a Mission Statement for the Retake ME3 movement, inspired by this thread. Please let me know if you guys feel it accurately reflects your feelings.

We hold grievances with the current ending and EA/BioWare because:

The game's ending fails to meet what we were promised as consumers.
[/list]The game's ending fails to meet our expectations as fans.
[/list]The response from BioWare needs to change.
[/list]We have jobs, families, responsibilities. We dedicate our time to this cause because we genuinely care about Mass Effect and its story.
[/list]We want to see a product that we, as human beings, as consumers, as fans, and as players can be proud of.
[/list]Retake Mass Effect 3 - Hold the line.


You can find the thread here:
http://social.biowar...ndex/10146448/1 
And the poll to cast your vote in support (so we can count how many like or dislike it) here:
http://social.biowar...25/polls/29868/ 

#2664
c3pu2

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omg been here way to long
im gonna go hold the line in my bed
keelah se'lai
to the end i hope to see someday

#2665
Nathan_41

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cyrrant wrote...

TurambarEA wrote...
The short of it: we need to consolidate our movement while we're still flush with numbers, I believe we need leaders.


It's a slippery slope, atghunter said that PR LOVES when a movement nominates someone to lead, as it gives them a target to tear down instead of taking on the roiling ocean of faceless masses.  It probably serves a secondary effect of making the movement appear to be a cult of personality, in that as soon as the leader gets attacked, there would be a TON of foaming fans roaring their disapproval.  This is what allows them to marginalize us.

It's not a terrible idea to get some heads together, but I'd worry about the repercussions.


This. We need centers to focus the movement around, but we already have those: Twitter, Facebook, Child's Play Drive, etc. Electing individuals to represent us is a poor decision.

#2666
johnbonhamatron

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c3pu2 wrote...

cyrrant wrote...

TurambarEA wrote...
The short of it: we need to consolidate our movement while we're still flush with numbers, I believe we need leaders.


It's a slippery slope, atghunter said that PR LOVES when a movement nominates someone to lead, as it gives them a target to tear down instead of taking on the roiling ocean of faceless masses.  It probably serves a secondary effect of making the movement appear to be a cult of personality, in that as soon as the leader gets attacked, there would be a TON of foaming fans roaring their disapproval.  This is what allows them to marginalize us.

It's not a terrible idea to get some heads together, but I'd worry about the repercussions.

once agian leaders is a bad idea we need to reach consensus were not many were one one wave we cant give them targets we have to be one mass so they cant attack us personaly

Yup. Put simply, they can't cut off our head if we don't have a head.

That analogy... wasn't perfect, but it's 5 in the morning and you get the idea.

#2667
cyrrant

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ArmyKnifeX wrote...

 I've come up with a Mission Statement for the Retake ME3 movement, inspired by this thread. Please let me know if you guys feel it accurately reflects your feelings.

We hold grievances with the current ending and EA/BioWare because:

The game's ending fails to meet what we were promised as consumers.
[/list]The game's ending fails to meet our expectations as fans.
[/list]The response from BioWare needs to change.
[/list]We have jobs, families, responsibilities. We dedicate our time to this cause because we genuinely care about Mass Effect and its story.
[/list]We want to see a product that we, as human beings, as consumers, as fans, and as players can be proud of.
[/list]Retake Mass Effect 3 - Hold the line.


You can find the thread here:
http://social.biowar...ndex/10146448/1 
And the poll to cast your vote in support (so we can count how many like or dislike it) here:
http://social.biowar...25/polls/29868/ 


This is a little too non-specific for my tastes.  I think the idea is that we want to get our message across about what EXACTLY we want.  We need specifics so we can pin them down.  I think we will reach an issue here, however, because there are myriad different wants among the movement.  Some people just want ending clarification, others, like myself, want actual choice, akin to the flow chart that was being circulated earlier today.  I was honestly expecting an ending similar to ME2, where a non-upgraded ship could lead to dead squad-mates, only this was a fleet, and it could lead to dead species instead.

#2668
Sylvanfeather

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oh_saki wrote...

Kileyan wrote...

Sylvanfeather wrote...

From a PR stance would it really be more harmful to provide an insiders look, than to say nothing?


We don't know how this ending ended up happening. But during the major release sales period you can't really expect them to come forward and say any of the following:

-we gambled on this ending and didn't expect this backlash. This is as close as you will get from them "it was our artistic vision", we are sorry CERTAIN fans are outraged but some GREAT fans like our ending. THis game is very polarizing!

-we ran out of time and money, we had to go with this ending since it was low on computer animation and voice acting costs, less variables cheaper to do

-we honeslty had no clue how to end the game, god child Deus Ex was all we had left

-we did this on purpose because we wanted to erase this game from existance so it was much easier for our team to produce ME4, without worrying about players previous choices being niggled about in the lore of the far future

I subscribe to the ending sucking because Bioware was more worried about erasing everything so that it was easier to make ME4, than ending the game for the fans.


18 months from now you will get the real answer, right before they announce their new game. They will own up to their mistakes, point by point, promise they have learned their lesson, while saying please buy our new game, we love and listen to our fans!

We'll see how that goes, DA3 will be that game first.



I'll admit, I love DA almost as much as ME, but ME was such an epic.... I really don't see them admitting to their mistakes, like you said, unless they're trying to get us to buy a new game...

I don't know. Honestly, I see BW telling us to deal with it, or giving us a half-a**'d ending, just enough so that most of us will begrudgingly accept it. Maybe it's me just preparing for the worst but hoping for the best.


No, I don't expect any apologies or admissions to making a mistep with the ending of ME3. Just merely curious that if this is the ending they wanted to have all along, they must believe what happens makes sense. Why not provide some of that insight to the rest of us? Though I can understand they wouldn't want to further alienate their fanbase by implying 'you guys just don't get it'.

Personally, I think Bioware's plan all along was to leave it to the player to interpret their own ending but it's backfired.

#2669
sistersafetypin

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I am incredibly glad I took the time to go back the OP and read through all the updates. It's exhausting when you feel like you're screaming at a brick wall, while onlookers throw insults. But I love this game, and the ME universe as a whole. I need for the ending to reflect the greatness of everything that came before it.

So I'm holding the line. That means if I decide to play ME3 again [I honestly haven't been able to get over my disappointment enough to do that yet] It will be ofline, so my gameplay can't be tracked by EA/Microsoft/Raptr.com. I'm also going to encourage my younger siblings, [who due to my urging have also become huge ME fans] to do the same.

Other than that, I'm not sure what else to do other then keeping the pressure up here... But I'm open to suggestions. We must get Bioware to make this right

#2670
shephard987

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GUYS this video is brilliant.
Watch this.



THIS SHOULD BE PROMOTED EVERYWHERE
THIS SUPPORTS OUR CAUSE
MOST RECENT VIDEO TO RETAKE MASS EFFECT 3

HOLD THE LINE

Modifié par shephard987, 18 mars 2012 - 05:07 .


#2671
vigna

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c3pu2 wrote...

TurambarEA wrote...

Have just caught up with the posts I missed yesterday. Very good collating by the OP and thanks to atghunter and others for continuing to contribute such valuable insights. I wonder, if perhaps one of the more motivated amongst us (with a knack for plain, concise drafting) could put some of these concepts being discussed into a more tangible form?

E.g.:
1. A concise, polite, objective list of all the problems we currently have with the ending. So that it's clear what we stand for.

2. An addendum or replacement (banish the thought!) to 'hold the line' - something that is more 'on-message' and thus hammers home our position time and again. Need the PR/Marketing folks amongst you.

In a related matter, I was wondering if there was some other way to organise better - to avoid being 'divided and conquered' by the better equipped EA publicity/marketing machine. There's clearly some very smart Mass Effect fans here and some with some valuable life/professional experience. Is it worth trying to get a few heads together and form some kind of pseudo-leadership or spokesperson group? If we can get all of the above happening - focus this ragged group into a tight, on-message army of Bioware fans, then we're going to be in a much better position going forward and we're going to be that much harder to ignore.

To that end, I would like to throw all the names of people in the OP forward. If they don't want to be 'leaders', sure, that's fine - but perhaps they could get together on MSN or something of the sort, to flesh out some of the concepts they've talked about - drafting a unified message, etc.? If they can do that initially, and then throw it back to us on the forums here for comment then I'm sure we can make some great strides.

If they DO want to accept that role as leaders, then importantly, when we end up acting exactly how EA wants us to act (fighting amongst ourselves, accepting faux olive branches) we have people to look to set us straight, encourage us, stop us from faltering, show us a path forward, etc.

The sort of almost single-minded cooperation I've witnessed in this movement is unprecedented. Even as we are, I've never seen this many fans mobilised, motivated and on-message. I have moderated for Infinity Ward for a few years now and have seen countless examples of the sort of mistakes that atghunter and the others have alluded to - gamers might have a very good point that 'matchmaking is sub-par' or 'the spawn system is far from optimal' BUT that criticism usually comes across as 'fix your [expletive] game, you guys are lazy, now point me in the direction of the DLC you're selling'. We're definitely not that, we've shown that we're better than that, but I fear the longer we go without consolidating our position, the more people we'll lose to apathy (stop caring about the issue) or despair (start getting angry and hinder our campaign).

The short of it: we need to consolidate our movement while we're still flush with numbers, I believe we need leaders.

 leaders is not a good idea at least not official ones cause they would be to easy to target


* I am strictly using this as an example and not for a debate topic so don't go there.

I'll use the Tea party as an example--not to get political, but it is appropriate-bear with me. When it started it was full of republicans, democrats and independants: When leaders started arising--- then  the direction went from displeasure with big govt and overspending to a wing of the Rep party destroying what originally had brought people from varying parties together in the first place, and much of the original intent was lost. Also a bunch of infighting.

Leaders are not always a good thing--especially with something organic like this movement that needs to develop a malleable path that can flow as easily as the PR tactics.
End rant.
Hold the line...

Modifié par vigna, 18 mars 2012 - 05:24 .


#2672
InsaneNarwhal

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sistersafetypin wrote...

I am incredibly glad I took the time to go back the OP and read through all the updates. It's exhausting when you feel like you're screaming at a brick wall, while onlookers throw insults. But I love this game, and the ME universe as a whole. I need for the ending to reflect the greatness of everything that came before it.

So I'm holding the line. That means if I decide to play ME3 again [I honestly haven't been able to get over my disappointment enough to do that yet] It will be ofline, so my gameplay can't be tracked by EA/Microsoft/Raptr.com. I'm also going to encourage my younger siblings, [who due to my urging have also become huge ME fans] to do the same.

Other than that, I'm not sure what else to do other then keeping the pressure up here... But I'm open to suggestions. We must get Bioware to make this right


This.

#2673
Razorsteel

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sistersafetypin wrote...

I am incredibly glad I took the time to go back the OP and read through all the updates. It's exhausting when you feel like you're screaming at a brick wall, while onlookers throw insults. But I love this game, and the ME universe as a whole. I need for the ending to reflect the greatness of everything that came before it.

So I'm holding the line. That means if I decide to play ME3 again [I honestly haven't been able to get over my disappointment enough to do that yet] It will be ofline, so my gameplay can't be tracked by EA/Microsoft/Raptr.com. I'm also going to encourage my younger siblings, [who due to my urging have also become huge ME fans] to do the same.

Other than that, I'm not sure what else to do other then keeping the pressure up here... But I'm open to suggestions. We must get Bioware to make this right


Keep the faith, hold the line, we are with you!

#2674
c3pu2

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well might stay a little longer the best example i have of this would be anonimus they cant be takken down they are no one and every one the descision are made as a group yes some times it goes wrong but it makes them way arder to get to plus if you have a leader and he/she is removed then you have chaos because no one is used to not be led but this started without a leader we already have stability electing leaders would put us at risk

#2675
cyrrant

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sistersafetypin wrote...

I am incredibly glad I took the time to go back the OP and read through all the updates. It's exhausting when you feel like you're screaming at a brick wall, while onlookers throw insults. But I love this game, and the ME universe as a whole. I need for the ending to reflect the greatness of everything that came before it.

So I'm holding the line. That means if I decide to play ME3 again [I honestly haven't been able to get over my disappointment enough to do that yet] It will be ofline, so my gameplay can't be tracked by EA/Microsoft/Raptr.com. I'm also going to encourage my younger siblings, [who due to my urging have also become huge ME fans] to do the same.

Other than that, I'm not sure what else to do other then keeping the pressure up here... But I'm open to suggestions. We must get Bioware to make this right


Like the facebook page: www.facebook.com/DemandABetterEndingToMassEffect3
Donate to Child's Play: social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/9845819
Take a gander at the Google and find some articles supporting our position to click on, Forbes is a safe bet.  This will ensure that they stay near the first page of the search.
There's a letter-writing campagin on, as well, though the specifics of that aren't available to me at the moment.
Also, if you're feeling emotionally drained it might be wise to take a break.  Monday will be the true test of the movement and we will need all your (civil) fury to come raining down on Bioware's heads once the workweek starts.

Hold the Line