9972 réponses à ce sujet

[Salyut]

shephard987 wrote...

To help you with the stages of grief we are all feeling.

http://www.gamezone....-effect-3-grief

Hold The Line

In response to LOTS OF SPECULATION FROM EVERYONE: "Oh sorry, I just speculated all over myself. I'll be back in a minute..."

Lol, that article was great.

Modifié par Salyut, 19 mars 2012 - 07:47 .

[Marcin K]

maki0129 wrote...

Let us all please refrain from attacking moderators, or really people in general.

The reason why this movement has been working, is not only because of sheer numbers, but because we have been able to keep a significant measure of civility in our discontent. Let us try not to taint that by reducing this whole thing to a nasty flame war.

Let's keep calm, and keep voicing our opinions and our discontent, with our wallets, with our input, with our feedback, but most importantly with RESPECT.

i fully support this-DON'T BACK UP but be CIVILISED 
HOLD THE LINE
P.S. if someone could deliver this analisys to BioWare

Modifié par Marcin R, 19 mars 2012 - 07:47 .

[Harbing3r]

The most common theme I'm seeing in the arguments against us (along with words like 'whiny' and 'entitled') is the notion of artistic integrity ie that we can't demand an artist change their art.

I just don't think this argument flies with added multiplayer, day 1 DLC, purchasable content for multiplayer etc

I think there are some marvelously talented and artistic people at Bioware and this campaign is to let them express themselves more than that travesty of an ending allowed them to.

[CommanderConnor]

Hey all,

I've been lurking the movement in the forums for several days since I completed my second playthrough of ME3. I say second because on my first I assumed that I had screwed up during my initial playthrough and needed to build up my EMS to get a better final result. After I recieved the same ending I finally took to researching the ending to see if other outcomes were available. After discovering that I had achieved the BEST outcome in the game I became depressed. I had not gauged how deeply attached I had become to the series, and was shocked that such a poorly composed ending (in my eyes) could personally affect me.

It took me approximately a week to figure out how to even be able to post on the forums; something that I view as a testament to how little I normally am involved in gaming. Mass Effect is the ony series I get excited about, and I play very little games apart from it. I needed to get involved.

In this post I would like to achieve the following things:
1. Potential feedback from those of you in the movement to give me direction on how I can actively participate. I have donated to Child's Play and created a twitter to engage the Mass Effect twitter. Where do I go from here?

2. Discuss how amazing you folks are.

I will be accomplishing number 2 now.

I have witnessed a truly beautiful movement over the last week. To observe peaceful and active protest within a gaming community is something that I did not expect to find, but deeply resonated in me. I may normally not be a gamer, but I do actively campaign for equality in my personal life. This is why I have been so touched to see people stand up for what they believe in, and in such a positive way as well. The charitable nature of the community, and their willingness to put the time and effort into persuing a better gaming experience is something that have changed the way I view video game fans.

Reading some of what people have taken the time to compose on here has made me even more emotional than the game itself. I have been exposed to so many different perspectives and each of them have given me insight to my own personal ME3 feelings. What has struck me the most is how strongly you stand together. The bond that this mutual dissappointment has created is awe-inspiring and yet another positive way to oppose it. It truly embodies Shepard and her/his philosophy that standing together can achieve greatness. I have never been so inspired by a collective fanbase, and would love the opportunity to join in that stand.

For a little insight into me I am an artist by profession and passion. Perhaps this is why I have been so touched by the response to Mass Effect. Video games are entertainment, but they are no more or less art than literature. This is proven by how it inspires an emotional response it its players. That does not negate a negative response to the ending and a desire to change it. If art were so concrete in its convictions and it never evolved due to critique we would all be producing finger-paintings. Critique of a work can and should influence its evolution, and if it is not listened to or disregarded then the author is missing out of further expansion of their work. No artist should be stubborn and stick to their guns 100% of the time, it suggests they have lost the passion to grow. I would truly be honored if people presented me with so many well-formulated critiques. It shows their level of care for the work itself.

I apologize for this lengthy post. In short, continue standing up for what you believe in. There are people out there that are inspired by what you are doing, and have been moved to join you.

[RockyRoberts]

Some wonderful insight on these most recent pages...whether it be the *nerd theory* that I think explains many discrepancies with the end (I feel though if it was indoc I'd gleefully laugh at the joke bioware just ripped on us and accept it)

or Weary/ Vigna reminding us how to be civil. No I'm not mocking, its just great to see everyone working together, being constructive, staying positive...in the end I have to agreed 100% with Commander Connor...

could you imagine what America or the world would be like this united????

The possibilities!!!

Modifié par RockyRoberts, 19 mars 2012 - 07:52 .

[Metal_Psycho]

Hey everyone,just dropping in to thank everyone here doing what has to be done.
I'm glad i'm not the only one who feels the same way.
Infact,i'm still waiting for a proper choise driven ending,before i start up my Mass Effect 3,wich i bought a few days ago,but haven't touched ever since i found out about the lackluster endings.
I really dislike how the PR tactics have managed to convice people in thinking we just want a happy ending with double rainbows,when infact,that is so far from what we really want.
I wont repeat what has been said many times already about why the endings are truely bad,but just off the top of my mind - introducing space magic kid in the very end of the game,wich is also the very end of a trilogy, is anything but artistic,so trying to defend the current endings as being artistic is......just wrong.
It is just showing how badly out of touch with the rest of the game(and previous games) the ending truly is.
Could this ending work if given more time to work it in to the story?Maybe,but at least in its current state,it just feels disconnected with the rest of the game.
I'm sorry for my bad english,but i felt i needed to vent some of my  disappointment.
Hold the line!

[Bachuck]

Boceephus wrote...

Thanks for all the hard work Bachuck.

You're welcomed.

Mister Mida wrote...

I like reading the OP. It has weight.

Me too, but I've run out of space. 

vigna wrote...

I actually think ATG's first post is very important. I'd at least leave that one   IMO. It introduces the concept of the thread very eloquently.

I agree. What I'm going to do is leave some posts up in their full form and make others links. It's the only way to continue updating it with new content.

[Fallenfromthesky]

DoctorCrowtgamer wrote...

Fallenfromthesky wrote...

Optimus J wrote...

So, Operation Goliath apparently didn't come with the results they were expecting, and people are already pissed off with the preventive excuse that it wasn't a success because people forgot to turn on the on-line tracking.

See what they did there? They can deny people's lack of interest and blame the players on not sending the proper data on the otherwise HUGE success of that "goliath something".

So did the operation Goliath work or not I don't know as I have been avoiding my copy of Mass Effect 3. Just seems to me that if Goliath did fail then it shows our movement is being hear AND having a noticable effect on the player base. 

Well if that is true it may  explain why they seemed so paniced last night and early today.  They can't even tell EA and their stockholders that multiplayer is populare.

One thing I am surprised is not being talked about more is the deal Bioware made to get a Mass effect movie made.  It seems to me if this drags on the studio may become a behind the scenes player that could put presure on Bioware.  After all they want to be sure that the Mass effect brand will still have a fan base in three to five years time when they release the movie.  If I were them I would not be happy with someone doing everything they can to destroy loyalty to a brand I had just paid millions for.

We just have to stick togher and we will win.

Hold the line for as long as it takes people.

  I'd totally forgot about the rumor of a movie. Surely NO studio would want to be involved in a Mass Effect related project with a large part of the core fanbase alienated (no pun intended). 

If you can't meet your target audience what the point of trying?  

[Rulycar]

I was taught to hate behavior, not people.


LOL, this was in response to abusive speach toward moderators.
Darned if I can find the quote now.

Modifié par Rulycar, 19 mars 2012 - 07:51 .

[billyzero]

Bioware has said that the game has been developed in conjunction with the players. That WE'VE helped tell their story. The also have repeatedly told us how much they value our input and how they are listening. How can people be complaining when the co-writers are trying to give their input as to the state of the series ending?

[LinksOcarina]

Harbing3r wrote...

The most common theme I'm seeing in the arguments against us (along with words like 'whiny' and 'entitled') is the notion of artistic integrity ie that we can't demand an artist change their art.

I just don't think this argument flies with added multiplayer, day 1 DLC, purchasable content for multiplayer etc

I think there are some marvelously talented and artistic people at Bioware and this campaign is to let them express themselves more than that travesty of an ending allowed them to.

So games are not, is what you are saying?

Not that there is anything wrong with that stance.

Modifié par LinksOcarina, 19 mars 2012 - 07:52 .

[Sentr0]

look at this video (IGN): http://youtu.be/tm-OtQNJVEg?t=2m15s

we have to stay civil you say...

Modifié par Sentr0, 19 mars 2012 - 07:53 .

[BensterMan]

Everyone that I know who has completed ME3 has hated the last half of the ending, the only people out of my friends that have complained about people moaning about it are the ones who have not yet even finished the game.

It's a shame really, I would happily say that Mass Effect 3 is the best game I've played in a long time, looking at how the choices that I made in ME1&2 affect ME3.

I can't understand the disconnect between the gaming press and people who have played it, they all seem to whinge and moan about how we are being unreasonable about it, how it is a great ending.

And it was a great ending, all the way up to the point after anderson dies, I had tears streaming down my face (It was 4AM sunday morning, empty mountain dew bottles and dorito bags litter the battlefield). I can't understand how we are given all these choices throughout the game, how these choices affect the course of events but it all counts for nothing in a simple A,B or C ending that they said they wouldn't do.

What the hell happens to the fleets? all those races stranded, the galaxy united in a final stand by you, all that effort for nothing?.

The introduction of the damn god child, a random character introduced waaaaaay too late into the game that is apparently an "end all questions" tool. I am awesome, I created reapers, they stop chaos, it is necessary.

But why? I proved that they can co-exist, my shepard brokered peace between the geth and the quarians, why the hell am I now being told its impossible?.

The crew on the ground magically appearing in the normandy to appear on a fancy garden world, why the hell was joker trying to escape the system through the mass relay when apparently they are all throwing everything they have at the reapers. It's just against everything that we were made to think of the characters.

I remember reading the article where Casey Hudson stated that they did tie off different character relations throughout the game, and they did. But the ending stirs up more questions which it shouldn't do, I have no real CHOICE even though it was an eerily beautiful scene.

It feels like no matter what I pick the same thing happens, shepard just takes God Childs word for it which goes against everything the first two games set up. He is there to stop the reapers and save humanity, but it's almost as if the choices put all the races in a more dire situation than they were in before.


People here are being extremely reasonable about what they want, which really shows we are not just a petty band of idiots mouthing off and insulting the developers. I just can't see why this movement is getting such a negative reaction in the press?.

Modifié par BensterMan, 19 mars 2012 - 07:55 .

[ArmyKnifeX]

LinksOcarina wrote...

Harbing3r wrote...

The most common theme I'm seeing in the arguments against us (along with words like 'whiny' and 'entitled') is the notion of artistic integrity ie that we can't demand an artist change their art.

I just don't think this argument flies with added multiplayer, day 1 DLC, purchasable content for multiplayer etc

I think there are some marvelously talented and artistic people at Bioware and this campaign is to let them express themselves more than that travesty of an ending allowed them to.

So games are not, is what you are saying?

Not that there is anything wrong with that stance.

We're in the murky world of corporate art, IMO. Changing the ending to ME3 will not, I think, ruin the artistic integrity of BioWare or EA or any of the sub-contracted companies. They are not obligated to change a damn thing if they feel they are proud of the product and that it adequately satisfies their goals. However, from both a corporate and artistic standpoint, if they do so they risk losing their most avid consumer base. If they are also not too happy with what happened for the ending, well, how is it going to ruin the work's artistic integrity for the artist to say "Yes, a mistake was made. Let me change it for you!"

[luzburg]

Sentr0 wrote...

look at this video (IGN): http://youtu.be/tm-OtQNJVEg?t=2m15s

we have to stay civil you say...

was that video a insult or something.......

[MeldarthX]

Deflagratio wrote...

I consider it a violation of the Artistic Integrity of Mass Effect if they create a new ending just because the consumer demands it.

It doesn't matter what combinations of reasons it is, if they want to make a new ending, because they feel the fans are right, and Mass Effect deserves better, then it's fine.

I guess, in easier words, you can't force someone to make new art. You can say "This sucks" and then inspire them to revise it, but you can't force it.

I'd agree with you - but going by EA's own statements - Video Games are not art; they are business.

This is a commity which has several promises which were broken - As a customer and a consumer - its well within my rights to demain this be fixed.

Folks need to remember this - Most also have said; they don't the ending changed per say - expanded into something that actually makes sense.  Also why not a happy ending - bittersweet; sad  endings are all the normal and honestly are boring to me........To others they aren't.

They promised mulitple endings - something for everyone - closure - they weren't going to do an A, B or C ending *which can be argued they only did 1 ending; specially if you are color blind*  They said wouldn't do a lost ending......they did.

As I said I actually want to spend my money with BW and EA - but I won't until they fix this.  I don't want BW to fail far from it - but I would like them to remember what they were; and who has supposed them all these years........Their fans

Our Choices Should Matter - Hold the Line

[ReavousX]

Sentr0 wrote...

look at this video (IGN): http://youtu.be/tm-OtQNJVEg?t=2m15s

we have to stay civil you say...

I think that's a great video! 

Now, hear me out.

Their own poll has a majority of fans not liking the ending.  They're alienating their own fans/viewers.  That could go horribly for IGN.  So, let them joke and have their fun.  I hope they're saving up that ad money.

[InsaneNarwhal]

LinksOcarina wrote...

Harbing3r wrote...

The most common theme I'm seeing in the arguments against us (along with words like 'whiny' and 'entitled') is the notion of artistic integrity ie that we can't demand an artist change their art.

I just don't think this argument flies with added multiplayer, day 1 DLC, purchasable content for multiplayer etc

I think there are some marvelously talented and artistic people at Bioware and this campaign is to let them express themselves more than that travesty of an ending allowed them to.

So games are not, is what you are saying?

Not that there is anything wrong with that stance.

I think they meant games sold with a multiplayer and the promise of DLC can't defend one tiny portion of the game as artistic expression, when they are trying to sell the consumers other things so hard.

Modifié par InsaneNarwhal, 19 mars 2012 - 07:56 .

[luzburg]

anyway was the facebook post a poke for reaction? it seems that way.
and i gusse they felt it.

i want my little blue babies
HOLD THE LINE

[Corrik Ronis]

Stanley Woo wrote...

TurambarEA wrote...

Volion wrote...

Noatz wrote...

I like how Stanley Woo is saying "End of Line." whenever he locks a thread.

This could just be an ironic turn of phrase, but it is also possible he is doing it specifically to try and get under people's skin.

Don't rise to it.

"End of Line." The phrase was most famously used by the Master Control Program in TRON. 
It is similar to human phrases like, "End of communication", "That's final", and "That will be all".

There's no way he picked it absent of thought for our unofficial catch cry 'hold the line'. I thought it was somewhat inflammatory as well (throwing sarcasm at already agitated people is always going to be inflammatory) but yes, agreed, don't rise to it.

I don't see how any threads concerning the endings or reactions to them can be considered not to be relevant to the story/campaign but if he's locking that thread for not being story related, then this one is really no different. Any Plan B in the event they start locking our threads?

"End of line" predates "hold the line"  by approximately 25 years. I have been using it for at least 9 years, since before Mass Effect 1. It is an homage to the Mster Control Program in the 1982 Disny movie "Tron," not a dig at anyone's cause or protest movement. If you believe it is inflammatory, then I would suggest that you're overthinking things and should perhaps learn a little more about me and the movie I am referencing.

Threads are locked if they are not story and campaign related. Since we already have a couple of threads discussing the protest movement, new threads discussing only the protest movement or addressing the protest movement will likelt be locked. This is not decret information, and I would have gladly told you all of this had you but asked in a private message. Jumping to conclusions and crafting conspiracy theories based on half-considered circumstantial evidence does none of us--least of all your "cause"--any good.

thank you.

So can we take the fact that you put cause in quotation marks as inflamitory. It certainly sounds like you are trying to send a message there.

[sabasebatyne]

Wow, I guess everyone left to get lunch or something.

Anyway, I think it's very likely that any form of official response will be delayed until a significant amount of time has passed, at least until enough players globally have reached the end of the game (and start crying foul, too). Note that by "response" I mean an actual answer to fan concerns and demands, not the "We are listening to your concerns" variety currently popular.

[Militarized]

Sentr0 wrote...

look at this video (IGN): http://youtu.be/tm-OtQNJVEg?t=2m15s

we have to stay civil you say...

Yes, it makes them look like fools for that video. 

[Razorsteel]

Sentr0 wrote...

look at this video (IGN): http://youtu.be/tm-OtQNJVEg?t=2m15s

we have to stay civil you say...

Ea gives them AD dollars and throws one of their own into the game. They want to protect their interest.
So they put this infantile stuff up on youtube to get you fired up. Don't fall for it. This is part of the game to smear us.
Don't fall for those "Jedi" mind tricks.
.

[Harbing3r]

LinksOcarina wrote...

Harbing3r wrote...

The most common theme I'm seeing in the arguments against us (along with words like 'whiny' and 'entitled') is the notion of artistic integrity ie that we can't demand an artist change their art.

I just don't think this argument flies with added multiplayer, day 1 DLC, purchasable content for multiplayer etc

I think there are some marvelously talented and artistic people at Bioware and this campaign is to let them express themselves more than that travesty of an ending allowed them to.

So games are not, is what you are saying?

Not that there is anything wrong with that stance.

I maybe could have phrased that better. I was just pointing out the contradiction I perceive in their arguments. I am a believer in games (especially choice-based RPGs) as collaberative art.

I think in this instance, the line between good business and good art has been badly muddied, resulting in the ending we all are so disappointed in... And I fully support this thread and movement!

I continue to hold the line

[SuperTeal]

Sentr0 wrote...

look at this video (IGN): http://youtu.be/tm-OtQNJVEg?t=2m15s

we have to stay civil you say...

Their own poll shows that 10 to 1 people hate the ending.  They're just making themselves look like the bully on the playground.  So yes - be civil.