9972 réponses à ce sujet

[Ender99]

Well I just returned my Mass Effect 3 game to Amazon. This doesn't mean I'm give up, if they fix the ending, I'll be more than happy to buy it again. Until then, I want my money back. I'll give it to Child's Play.

Hold the line!

[Vap0ur_Snake]

Carnage752 wrote...

Syrellaris wrote...

Vap0ur_Snake wrote...

SuperTeal wrote...

ArmyKnifeX wrote...

SuperTeal wrote...

But the problem with ME3 isn't an artistic one - it is a story and game mechanics one.  The end doesn't deliver what was advertised for many months by the developers.  They are artists to an extent - but they are also delivering a product.

We need to remember that Mass Effect is not high art - it is an entertainment product.  The consumer has every right to demand that the product deliver what was promised.  That's it.  It is business.

Films are just as much "entertainment products" as they are art. Some films lean more towards one direction, others to the other. I certainly wouldn't bill a film like Melancholia or Antichrist as pure entertainment, just like I wouldn't call a film like Crank high art.

ME3 is so interseting because it serves us so very well in both an artistic and entertainment way that people are getting confused.

I agree that as consumers we were lied to. This is a separate issue from the art issue, though. ME3 is also high art. I don't think these two qualities HAVE to be reconciled with one another.

You're right - but the primary difference between Mass Effect (as a video game) and any film is that Mass Effectrequires interaction from the player to make decisions which direct the story.  If I do not make these decisions the story stands still and doesn't move forward.  As the consumer/player you have some control over the direction of the story - unlike a film.

That is where the problem with Mass Effect 3's ending comes in - it takes that promised control out of the hands of the consumer and delivers it to a pseudo deus ex mechina - delivering an ending that is polar opposite to what Casey Hudson said would happen.

My point is that there is no "art issue."  Art doesn't factor into this, because Mass Effect 3 is a beautiful game - with a mostly well crafted story and character development.  The problem is that the story development and one of the primary gameplay mechanics - choice - is broken by the ending.

Great point. How can they possibly ignore this, it is blatant fact. They lied about the ending which made it an even harder kick in the nuts when we were presented with a giant bowl of s*** to eat by the star child. 

Or they didn't lie and left us with a cliffhanger for future DLC. its not uncommon practice to be honest.

Doesn't make it right. If this was their intention they would have made it clear, or ignore us completely. The fact they are in such a scramble now indicates this was an honest screw up. They would have already confirmed ending DLC.

I honestly do still think its a possibility that they did this on purpose.. Maybe to bring us the proper ending later or maybe something more sinister like making us all depressed or to keep us busy with something while they turn the real world into a police state. The fact is I've heard of a lot of stuff too g on in the world using tactics like this. Maybe they made the ding terrible on purpose for some reason that is bigger than Mass Effect 3. 

[Syrellaris]

Carnage752 wrote...

Syrellaris wrote...

Leafs43 wrote...

Syrellaris wrote...

Leafs43 wrote...

PR team has extended the olive branch.

EA offering a $10 purchase on Batman Arkham City if you purchase ME3 on Origin. This has been advertised on both twitter and facebook.

Probably the most anticipated release in Bioware's history and 2 weeks after release they practically have to give another game away for people to buy it.


We are winning.

Spring sales, its getting lowered in price on steam too and stores currently sell it for 29.99...(batman arkham city that is)

The only time EA does this sort of thing is because sales are taking an immediate hit.

This same thing happened with DA2.  


If 2 weeks ago, if you told EA they would have to offer a $10 version of Arkam City, I bet the would laugh at you.

You are aware I hope that origin is EA's version of Steam right and they are constantly improving and making it more versatile like steam is and thus also include the sales and so on. 

I understand people hate EA right now and truthfully that hatred is not deserved. EA is no different then Activision / Blizzard, codemasters or any other large publishing company.  There for not everything they do is tied to Mass effect 3.

I mean I can understand you would say that about the multiplayer event, and perhaps even he free trial weekend in Swtor, but people are really starting to grab at totally loose ends right now, just to muster some extra support.

Run into to your local game store and check the used prices for the game. I guarantee that adds justification for these peoples' thoughts.

I don't think my local gamestore would like me to run in at 21:51 right now also I was talking about the price of Batman, not ME

[Sinnick03]

cut for length

[/quote]

From the way I understand the Indoc theory,  the Starchild is still very much part of the indoctrination. 

[/quote]
If they just said every ending was the result of indoctrination, then there would still be an uproar. This is still a lack of choice.

[/quote]

Agreed, the Indoc theory is not a complete ending and would *require* additional content to make sense.  The way I read it is that you are still being controlled during the Starchild sequence.  This is way you don't really ask any questions, or refute the glaring untruths (at least in my playthrough).  You are forced to select between Join with us and die, join with us and die, or fight on and damn the costs. Choosing the fight on option would then be tantamount to shaking off the indoctrination.  A lot of the credibility of the theory for me come from if you choose to fight you get that little clip of Shepard taking a breath in what looks like the rubble of London.

[BostonVamp]

Suggestion: I've seen some great comments on articles that have misquoted or misunderstood the Take Back ME movement; bascially that players want a "happy ending." Would it be possible for someone to succinctly write a response that summarizes the issues, post it on the Facebook page and then use that as a response to those writers who have misquoted the rationale of the movement? If this has already happened, my apologies. I don't Facebook.

[Hydralysk]

Let's try and avoid the quote pyramids people.

[BensterMan]

ah apologies, I'm a fanny got the wrong end of the stick

Modifié par BensterMan, 19 mars 2012 - 08:55 .

[IndustrializedTaco]

I just got here, I read the updates. I'm starting to wonder why haven't they just caved, and given us an official response? Especially since they pulled that whole stunt last night. I know they are trying to talk it out, but when you pull a facebook post off line within the hour ON A SUNDAY NIGHT somethings going on. I'm even wondering if they are seriously considering changing the ending. They do know they can make money from changing it right?

[Vap0ur_Snake]

By the way I'm sorry about all the typos in my posts but I can't actually see what I'm typing as there's no way to scroll the text down on my iPhone. EA sites in general are terrible for using with apple devices.

[shephard987]

Shephard signing in.
I see some people losing morale.
REMEMBER
This is the PR's intention and ultimate goal.
Stay strong.
We brought together the fans,
and we will stay together
even if we are denied in the end.
BioWare and EA has a lot to talk about,
and a lot of money needs to be moved around, I'm sure.
It will take time.

Hold the Line.

[SuperTeal]

ArmyKnifeX wrote...

Carnage752 wrote...

Thing is, with all our theories, there is a lot of mights. Fact is, nothing has been confirmed for a fix for the ending, and until that happens we will have to stay and hold the line.

Exactly. They're still evaluating a lot of data and trying to keep up with the forums. 

Also I'd like to point out that there WERE some blatant marketing lies about the ending, which is part of why so many people are as upset as they are.

This video points out those lies pretty clearly:  

Just watch the first minute of it.  The rest is fine too... but it's long.

Modifié par SuperTeal, 19 mars 2012 - 08:55 .

[Harbing3r]

It slays me that I could only say goodbye to Miranda via holocom, promising her that I would find her after. Whether I lived or died, I don't know where she is or what happened to her and that sucks.

In LotSB, there's an entry on the Shadow Broker's console about a consultation Miranda has with a fertility specialist and she can't have children. I read this and thought 'Wow, that's some heavy stuff - look forward to seeing that resolved" Alas, just another plot thread left to hang forever. I'm gutted...

Holding the line!

[Femlob]

I was looking for that topic with the list of pre-release promises by BioWare, but I can't find it anywhere - so I'll just leave this here:

Counting the assets from the "From Ashes" DLC and the two assets that were cut from the game, the maximum Total Military Readiness you can achieve with Singleplayer alone is 7,824 - which translates to an Effective Military Readiness of 3,912. Anyone who says different is either cheating or increased their Readiness through Facebook, the iOS apps or Multiplayer.

The "best" ending (taken with bags of salt by all involved) requires an Effective Military Readiness of 4,000.

What this implies I'll gladly leave to you.

[Carnage752]

Syrellaris wrote...

Carnage752 wrote...

Syrellaris wrote...

Leafs43 wrote...

Syrellaris wrote...

Leafs43 wrote...

PR team has extended the olive branch.

EA offering a $10 purchase on Batman Arkham City if you purchase ME3 on Origin. This has been advertised on both twitter and facebook.

Probably the most anticipated release in Bioware's history and 2 weeks after release they practically have to give another game away for people to buy it.


We are winning.

Spring sales, its getting lowered in price on steam too and stores currently sell it for 29.99...(batman arkham city that is)

The only time EA does this sort of thing is because sales are taking an immediate hit.

This same thing happened with DA2.  


If 2 weeks ago, if you told EA they would have to offer a $10 version of Arkam City, I bet the would laugh at you.

You are aware I hope that origin is EA's version of Steam right and they are constantly improving and making it more versatile like steam is and thus also include the sales and so on. 

I understand people hate EA right now and truthfully that hatred is not deserved. EA is no different then Activision / Blizzard, codemasters or any other large publishing company.  There for not everything they do is tied to Mass effect 3.

I mean I can understand you would say that about the multiplayer event, and perhaps even he free trial weekend in Swtor, but people are really starting to grab at totally loose ends right now, just to muster some extra support.

Run into to your local game store and check the used prices for the game. I guarantee that adds justification for these peoples' thoughts.

I don't think my local gamestore would like me to run in at 21:51 right now also I was talking about the price of Batman, not ME

It's 3:50 pm here. Anyways.

The fact they are throwing in a discout on another game already just to sell ME3 new is great justification for their thoughts.

So ya, I don' think they are grasping at loose ends.

[Zero.Gee]

Carnage752 wrote...

It's quite easy for people to associate anyone who doesn't like the ending with the cause.

Example: The idiotic FTC guy.

The fan who filed a complaint with the FTC had every right to do so. Its rude to say that the guy is idiotic because he felt the best way for his voice to be heard was to file an online complaint with the FTC. While we may not all agree with how someone else chooses to voice his or her opinions of the ending, its never good to ridicule them on how they choose to take a stand. Some of the press has even gone as far as to berate that fan for his actions; which doesn't paint them in a good light either.

Please remember people, be civil be polite and hold the line. We wont get very far otherwise.

Modifié par Zero.Gee, 19 mars 2012 - 08:57 .

[Boceephus]

Harbing3r wrote...

It slays me that I could only say goodbye to Miranda via holocom, promising her that I would find her after. Whether I lived or died, I don't know where she is or what happened to her and that sucks.

In LotSB, there's an entry on the Shadow Broker's console about a consultation Miranda has with a fertility specialist and she can't have children. I read this and thought 'Wow, that's some heavy stuff - look forward to seeing that resolved" Alas, just another plot thread left to hang forever. I'm gutted...

Holding the line!

Yup. Abandonment of the stories and romances of the ME2 crew. Issue 4237 with the ending of ME3.

[Optimus J]

BensterMan wrote...

What the hell, anyone noticed the 50 percent off ALL ITEMS on the origin store?.

Do you think this is a result of the backlash?

Yes, people noticed that a week ago when they discovered that the sales of ME3 were going to hell, and administrative folks did such a maneuver to save the day, by creating faux good sales reports, to appease the shareholders.

Thing is for how long they will be supportive on this whole "THE GAME IS MINE, I END AS I WANT" situation.

Because I'm starting to think that Bioware is stalling EA board as much as they are stalling us.

[Carnage752]

[quote]Sinnick03 wrote...

cut for length

[/quote]

From the way I understand the Indoc theory,  the Starchild is still very much part of the indoctrination. 

[/quote]
If they just said every ending was the result of indoctrination, then there would still be an uproar. This is still a lack of choice.

[/quote]

Agreed, the Indoc theory is not a complete ending and would *require* additional content to make sense.  The way I read it is that you are still being controlled during the Starchild sequence.  This is way you don't really ask any questions, or refute the glaring untruths (at least in my playthrough).  You are forced to select between Join with us and die, join with us and die, or fight on and damn the costs. Choosing the fight on option would then be tantamount to shaking off the indoctrination.  A lot of the credibility of the theory for me come from if you choose to fight you get that little clip of Shepard taking a breath in what looks like the rubble of London.

[/quote]
Still, a great deal of plotholes, lack of choice, and no clear statement from Bioware this is true. If they run with it I will continue on with this. They need to either refine or expand on these endings, probably both.

[Syrellaris]

I don't think my local gamestore would like me to run in at 21:51 right now also I was talking about the price of Batman, not ME

It's 3:50 pm here. Anyways.

The fact they are throwing in a discout on another game already just to sell ME3 new is great justification for their thoughts.

So ya, I don' think they are grasping at loose ends.

Well considering this is a spring sale (the big banner says so even ) and combinging games with other games or strategy guides aint an uncommon practice during season sales (my local gamestore combined Gears of War 3 and the guide for 10 bucks total during the winter season for example)

It is only logical they link 2 very popular games together in a sale. Specially if one of them is going to drop in price after the season again

[Vovea]

My local independent game shop has pre-owned copies of ME3 for £15 already. I could hardly believe it. I mean yeah, the codes are used up but its still its less than half price within two weeks.

[Vap0ur_Snake]

Hydralysk wrote...

Let's try and avoid the quote pyramids people.

Ha ha, that works for me. I can't reply properly with a wall of text. I just need to work out how to use the forum mechanics properly to quote the exact sections I need. I would just use my laptop but it has a fan problem and makes so much noise I can't bare to have it switched on so it's iPhone 4S or nothing for now. 
I have used other forums that let me scroll down through text though but that was with an iPhone 3 GS. Still don't think I much newer model would take that ability away. I blame the poor EA forum engine as they've never worked proper on an apple device. 

Oh... And Hold The Line. 

[The Almighty Ali]

beetlebailey123 wrote...

I just got here, I read the updates. I'm starting to wonder why haven't they just caved, and given us an official response? Especially since they pulled that whole stunt last night. I know they are trying to talk it out, but when you pull a facebook post off line within the hour ON A SUNDAY NIGHT somethings going on. I'm even wondering if they are seriously considering changing the ending. They do know they can make money from changing it right?

My guess it was the PR People dipping their toe in the water.

Just to see what the effects would be, the fact that they removed it so quick means two things.

1. They are paying very close attention, more then we probably thought considering they did that on a Sunday around midnight. And the fact it was removed so quickly also indicates they are paying attention.

2. They want to know if we are paying just as much attention to them as they are on us, granted they can observe our activity here without us knowing or noticing them. But our activity also shows that we're still determined and probably much more organized then they initially though.

Modifié par The Almighty Ali, 19 mars 2012 - 08:59 .

[Syrellaris]

Optimus J wrote...

BensterMan wrote...

What the hell, anyone noticed the 50 percent off ALL ITEMS on the origin store?.

Do you think this is a result of the backlash?

Yes, people noticed that a week ago when they discovered that the sales of ME3 were going to hell, and administrative folks did such a maneuver to save the day, by creating faux good sales reports, to appease the shareholders.

Thing is for how long they will be supportive on this whole "THE GAME IS MINE, I END AS I WANT" situation.

Because I'm starting to think that Bioware is stalling EA board as much as they are stalling us.

Except for the fact you are wrong and this is a simple Spring sale...

[Carnage752]

Zero.Gee wrote...

Carnage752 wrote...

It's quite easy for people to associate anyone who doesn't like the ending with the cause.

Example: The idiotic FTC guy.

The fan who filed a complaint with the FTC had every right to do so. Its rude to say that the guy is idiotic because he felt the best way for his voice to be heard was to file an online complaint with the FTC. While we may not all agree with how someone else chooses to voice his or her opinions of the ending, its never good to ridicule them on how they choose to take a stand. Some of the press has even gone as far as to berate that fan for his actions; which doesn't paint them in a good light either.

Please remember people, be civil be polite and hold the line. We wont get very far otherwise.

He brought a great deal of negative PR on us. He might have had good intentions, but the fact he did this action while identifying with us selfish. This movement has been to try and get Bioware to cooperate, not force them into this ending.

Go to the Retake Facebook page and read his message. He makes it clear he did this for us. He shouldn't have.

[Lestatman]

Read the update on the 1st page and my view is if EA/Bioware continue with their PR tactics then they're going to lose loyal customers. I really find it hard that they would go down this road as 99.9% of us love the game but dislike the ending. If we all hated the entire game the sure do ur PR stuff but to treat us this way over what 10-15 mins that could be changed or altered in a DLC is beyond belief. I have the fullest respect for the people who have posting in this thread as they've remained civil and intelligent with their replies.

Hold The Line.

Modifié par Lestatman, 19 mars 2012 - 09:03 .