9972 réponses à ce sujet

[MeldarthX]

GUYS AND GALS!!! Its that time again

Please keep everything respectful; civil.......pleast DON'T EMBED PICTURES - as they can use it as a way to lock a forums......link the pictures instead


HOLD THE LINE

[Nadtsat]

MeldarthX wrote...

GUYS AND GALS!!! Its that time again

Please keep everything respectful; civil.......pleast DON'T EMBED PICTURES - as they can use it as a way to lock a forums......link the pictures instead


HOLD THE LINE

The two blue pictures have been removed.
They were taking a lot of space indeed.
I thank your alertness!

[Old Mariner]

Just wanted to show my support.
HOLD THE LINE

[wheelierdan]

i really like the blue one, it reminds me of war propaganda posters "loose lips sink ships" and all those.

[shephard987]

atghunter wrote...




Some of these questions are fun to answer as they allow me to speculate as much as everyone else.

We have firmly established that Bioware/EA has every conceivable PR lockdown measure going they can.  Problem is, they have to keep responding to tweets or they will get called out for it.

Imagine that you are at a desk and all day long people are calling you about the sixteen setting toaster that burns your toast on all sixteen settings.  How many times do you think it takes before that person gets so frustrated saying "thank you for your input" they blurt out "some people like 16 different types of burnt toast!"

The PR guys are walking on eggshells trying not to stir anything up (look at Sunday night).  The twitter thing is probably just someone needing to blow off steam and chose the wrong way to do it.

Social Media, meet Bunker.  Bunker, enjoy meeting Social Media 
 
As always, stay strong, stay passionate (yet civil), and let your voice be heard no matter where you stand!
 
Hold the Line!

Thank you for being the voice of informed reason.
Helping us see into the tactics is invaluable to our cause. 
You are a very crucial part of the movement, no doubt about that.

Hold the Line

[Nadtsat]

Bachuck wrote...

Does anyone know how to jump to a specific page in a thread? I.e., if I want to get to page 100, can I just zip there or do I have to go through the long process of jumping 3 pages?

The last three digits in the thread's URL refer to the page. Simply change these 3 digits and voilà!

[chkchkchk]

We should re-quote this lovely insight once per page.  An hour ago I saw more stuff on the @masseffect twitter feed about how Bioware's still listening.  I can only imagine the meetings they're having.

SkaldFish wrote...

I've also posted this to the ME3 ending "megathread" as well as making it available as a blog post here.

Just a few words of encouragement:

First: I think I may sometimes come across as some kind of know-it-all. The fact is I don't know very much about very much at all -- a fact that becomes clearer with each passing year. But, having been a practicing graphic artist, then working as a project manager, IT manager, programmer, software architect, and finally enterprise architect, over a 33-year career, I do think I understand corporations, and especially software product companies. So what I'm about to say isn't a posterior pull.

I see quite a few posts since yesterday from people who are either discouraged by the silence or are concluding "It's over" or some similar sentiment. In response, I'd like to make a few points that I hope will provide insight that encourages continued patience and resolve.

My disclaimer? Simple, in spite of long-term exposure to lots of corporate cultures, I could easily be wrong. The decision could already be made, and all that's left is a date to trigger an announcement. But it's opinion informed by experience. It's somewhere above a wild-ass guess and somewhere below insider information. So, for what it's worth:

• This will take time. It just will. Never forget that. I'm not the first to say that, but it bears repeating. Nothing happens quickly in a corporate environment. Nothing. This is especially true in an acquired business unit of a larger corporation. It's likely that there are "urgent" meetings regarding the ME3 ending whose reminders haven't even come up on calendars yet. We like to think we must be the only thing on BioWare executives' minds right now, but that's just not going to be the case.
• A company is not a hive mind. While this isn't the only issue on the executives' plates, some key decision makers and other key players at BioWare have not been able to think of anything BUT this issue since customers began to finish the game and discuss their experiences. That focus does not mean they are able to take any official action or make any statement, even if they personally feel they know what course should be taken. Escalation processes, market analysis timetables, change management procedures, and communication approval protocols are just a few of the hurdles that have to be crossed before any message can go out. Even if key decision makers have already reached a consensus (which is doubtful), they can't just pick a person to fire up a laptop and push out an email. It's also likely that there are internal power structures on both sides of this issue. The apple cart will have been upset, and some may be fighting to retain or gain credibility that earns them the right to be heard within the corporate culture.
• This is serious. There can be little doubt that BioWare, as they have said, are taking this seriously. If they had foreseen the possibility of this level of negative reaction, they would have prepared statements designed to close the door quickly, and these would have been issued immediately. (Microsoft, for example, folllows this approach whenever they plan to announce discontinuation of a product, and they execute the plan with precision.) Instead, the first official statement from BioWare didn't appear for days, and both it and subsequent statements -- even firefighting statements like the Facebook statement -- have been careful to leave options open. This is the behavior of a company that was blindsided to some degree and is very carefully weighing its options. This takes time (but not months of time), because...
• This is all about impact analysis. They're not weighing all the details of all the possible actions they could take. That would require many weeks of detailed analysis. They're weighing the impact of a small set of broadly framed approaches, like "continue with original post-release plan," looking at short- and long-term revenue impact, brand impact, and impact on their core demographics, across all their sales channels. While this doesn't take months, it brings together decision makers from multiple departments and involves unplanned expenditures from multiple cost centers. Issues surrounding that kind of collision of varying perspectives, goals, and budgets is not something that gets resolved quickly or in a single meeting.
• Silence is a good thing. The fact that we hear very little outside of approved channels, and misstatements are VERY quickly corrected, is a very strong indication that this is now designated a corporate-level public relations issue. Depending on BioWare's corporate culture, there have been company-wide team/department/business unit meetings, or perhaps minimally internal memos, detailing very clear and enforceable restrictions on employee communication on this subject outside the company until a decision has been made.
• None of this is personal. While I'm sure there are employees at BioWare who are angry or frustrated or feel insulted or disappointed or sad (and we've seen evidence of that on Twitter), that will never cross the corporate barrier, and I can assure you that no publicly-held corporation that wants to survive will ever make decisions based on personal feelings. The decision we hear will be based solely on factors related to revenue, market demographics, and public relations. The good news there is that all three of those factors are inextricably tied to us as consumers, and that's the main thing I urge you to remember.

Don't be discouraged. Don't fall silent. Don't let the natural tendency towards cynicism lure you into fatalism.

Even when the first response comes, don't let it be an "off" switch. Compare it with what we're asking for. If there are gaps, say "what about [these things]?" It's not over until each one of us decides s/he is satisfied with the result.

Hold the line!

Modifié par chkchkchk, 21 mars 2012 - 02:24 .

[GriffinXP]

Bachuck wrote...

Does anyone know how to jump to a specific page in a thread? I.e., if I want to get to page 100, can I just zip there or do I have to go through the long process of jumping 3 pages?

The last few numbers in the thread's url are the page number; change /### to /100.

[MeldarthX]

atghunter wrote...

MeldarthX wrote...

Ok folks - reason they attack - several - one their are a troll.  They just like annoying people; getting people upset - they do it for kicks.  Those are easiest to disarm. 

You be nice to them - use intelligance and if that doesn't work. Ignore them.  They then end up getting pissed off themselves and making themselves look very stupid.

Number 2 - they are a plant - its their job to calm the storm - insite people into anger so they look like just what they claiming we are.  Again easily delt with; with respect - civility - and you counter with facts.  They will end up slipping up and doing something dumb; making themselves look like exactly what they claim you are.

Number 3 - Illogic and Ill Informated - these can be dangerous.  If they are Illogic - no matter what you say to them - they will continue to spout whatever - leave them to do just that; they burn fast and just look foolish.  Ill informed - can easily be turned into ally if you are smart about it.  You engage them in conversation; show your side; give your facts without being preachy; condensending.  Treat them like you want to be treated.


The side tatics of attacking us has slowed down - ATGhunter said; tieing ourselves to this charity was best thing we could of done.  People complain oh your using this charity.  I say; yes we are; that's its done.  You say any artist - actor supporting a Charity - its for PR - it to show them in a good light - very few just go oh I'm doing this just because.

We've raised 83k for children - this is a great thing - remember this - no matter what happens - we have made a major difference.  I've donated - and when I can I will donate again - yea its slowed down - but people are still donating - and continueing to donate.  We will hit 100k -

Most of all - We Will Win - BELIEVE - for there is no try - there is do or DO NOT......

I choose DO......

HOLD THE LINE

I read somewhere (probably on a stone tablet when I was in undergraduate studies) something to the effect:

The essence of understanding is to take fundamental knowledge and theory and apply it to the real world.  Those that provide that knowledge are honored best when those that apply it do so with brilliance.

You honor an old gamer Sir.  /salute

I'm not exactly a young gamer anymore my friend - I take inspiration where I find it.  I've found your posts very insightful - helpful......

Some I knew- some I didn't - a TV cartoon I used to love - was so right.........

Knowing is Half the Battle.

If we know what BW/EA is doing; going to do; we can easily counter it - keep the pressure on and win...

I'm proud to say; to each of you......I have your back - and I WILL HOLD THE LINE WITH YOU.

When this is over; meet me in the bar

[Siegdrifa]

animadpig wrote...

cinderburster wrote...

animadpig wrote...

Siegdrifa wrote...

You kidding ? Patcher is pretty famous in france and french video game media, this guy is treated like "the patcher show" the only things he can predict is the obvious after he read the news that it happened already.
That's a good news if he said all that  : )

Why are you willing to believe someone you only saw him on the TV not your own voice? Or, you are that kind people who believe everything told by the policians? Think about the ending of ME3 again and speak out what is your feeling.

I think they're saying that in France, he's watched in a sort of "lol look at THIS guy" way.

Well, I know couple french, they are pretty smart not like this Patcher.

Yes to the bold line  : )

[MeldarthX]

Nadtsat wrote...

MeldarthX wrote...

GUYS AND GALS!!! Its that time again

Please keep everything respectful; civil.......pleast DON'T EMBED PICTURES - as they can use it as a way to lock a forums......link the pictures instead


HOLD THE LINE

The two blue pictures have been removed.
They were taking a lot of space indeed.
I thank your alertness!

Hehe np Nadtstat - I think they are awesome.........actually t-shirt worthy like Marauder Shields

[OMTING52601]

IMO, it doesn't matter what *some* media sites print about the dissatisfaction. If someone reads one of those articles, or hears about it on the news and googles it, they'll find several pages filled with actual commentary from actual unsatisfied customers where they will likely find the better detailed reasons behind the discontent.

I don't agree with what some folks say they want, or don't, but I do agree that I paid for a product, which at this time, failed to deliver the goods. I want my choices to matter through to the end, not just up to the point where a plot device of any kind arbitrarily decides my choice, my playing of the game, should no longer matter, FWIW, YMMV.

I also want those players who are okay/good/great with the current end to be able to have that, as well. LOL, I guess I figure if they can get their cake, I should too

[wheelierdan]

FliegenkillerX wrote...

I think it isn't only the thing of PR.
In my opinion the storywriters, producers etc, going through the five stages of grief.

1-Denial: Why? it is a good ending
2-Anger: They are all wrong. They don't understand.
3-Bargaining: Please give us time. We concern your worries
4-Depression: OMG so many don't like it. We screwed up.
5-Acceptance. ok let's work something out

i never thought to look at it this way, thankyou for pointing it out.

[SkitSkit]

FliegenkillerX wrote...

I think it isn't only the thing of PR.
In my opinion the storywriters, producers etc, going through the five stages of grief.

1-Denial: Why? it is a good ending
2-Anger: They are all wrong. They don't understand.
3-Bargaining: Please give us time. We concern your worries
4-Depression: OMG so many don't like it. We screwed up.
5-Acceptance. ok let's work something out

Yeah, while I'm going through the five stages

1-Denial: Huh? what was that? like a 2001 shout out or something? the other endings are probably be better
2-Anger: WHAT THE **** IS THIS ****
3-Bargaining: They're going to release ending DLC? I'll buy that! I'll buy anything! take my money!
4-Depression: *Crys in a bathtub with a tub of icecream
5-Acceptance, Depression (Continued): *Crys into Garrus Vikarian love pillow*

And yes I do frequent the escapist, that strip was uncanny, I was like "Where's the Oblilesk?". OH aside from the Garrus Vikarian Love Pillow *Shifty eyes*

[BostonVamp]

Not sure if this was posted in here, but I think it sums up a lot of the thinking...great game...until the end.

http://www.examiner....betrayal-review

[Nithe]

Bachuck wrote...

Does anyone know how to jump to a specific page in a thread? I.e., if I want to get to page 100, can I just zip there or do I have to go through the long process of jumping 3 pages?

Yes. In the url the last set of numbers should be the threads page number, change that to go to the page you want to go to.

[DoctorCrowtgamer]

Bioware is now saying that they are hearing from tons of people who liked the ending. I have to ask if that is so then why are they putting so much energy into trying to win us back and get us to buy their DLC and why have so many stores marked down the price and why are they offering refunds for open games if only a few people don't like the ending.

Please check out this group and join in.

http://social.biowar.../user_group.php

Thank you for your time.

[mi_dad]

Pandoravv3 wrote...


They did lie, didn't you see casey hudsons pre-release quotes?

  
     The more I really start digging into what was actually said in the pre-release interviews,  the more upset I become.  We were purposely decieved

GameInformer :  With the ending in Mass Effect 2, there were so many different
variables and possibilities for Ithe outcome and what could happen. As players reached the end, they started comparing notes and trying to figure out how it worked. A few months after it came out, we ran a chart in the magazinethat showed the layout of how to get the different endings and how things happened. Is that same type of complexity built into the ending of Mass Effect 3?

Casey Hudson:  Yeah, and I’d say much more so, because we have the ability to build the endings out in a way that we don’t have to worry about eventually tying them back together somewhere. This story arc is coming to an end with this game. That means the endings can be a lot more different. At this point we’re taking into account so many decisions that you’ve made as a player and reflecting a lot of that stuff. It’s not even in any way
like the traditional game endings, where you can say how many endings there are or whether you got               ending A, B, or C.

Really casey? our choices do not boil down to A B or C?  I must have missed it.

Casey Hudson:  It’s more like there are some really obvious things that are different and then lots and lots of smaller things, lots of things about who lives and who dies, civilizations that rose and fell, all the way down to
individual characters. That becomes the state of where you left your galaxy. The endings have a lot more sophistication and variety in them. It would be interesting to see if somebody could put together a chart
for that.

I saw one really obvious thing and that was Three different colors.
As far as the civilizations that rose and fell I must have missed it.
Lots and lots of who lives and dies?  I saw that joker and 2 other squad mates survive one of them being a robot that should have been destroyed.  

Modifié par mi_dad, 21 mars 2012 - 02:36 .

[MayaBalrin]

This is my first time posting to the forums here on Bioware.
Well other than answering a few polls saying I can't stand the ending.

I finished my first and only play through Sunday March 11. I gave it some time
to sink in thinking that my disappointment in the endings ( I replayed the last
20 minutes three time to see all endings) was not merely my disappoint at the
series ending. It wasn't.

I then took to the internet thinking maybe it was only me and discovered that
many other felt the same way. My phone died twice because I spent the better
part of the evening trolling sites and this forum at someplace I had limited
internet access, for information. Still I remained silent in my support.

No longer will I remain silent. The endings are horrible on so many levels. And
I'm telling you from a writers perspective (I have a couple books published)
when you write you take what your fans feel into consideration. You agonize
over the ending and make sure that the actions fit the characters you've
created. And if you don't you should.

So please listen to us Bioware. I loved the game just not the ending. Please
create one that does your story/game the justice it deserves.

I know in this road will be long. I
know it may have a sad ending. I will hold out hope and I will… Hold The Line.

Modifié par MayaBalrin, 21 mars 2012 - 02:34 .

[c3pu2]

DoctorCrowtgamer wrote...

Bioware is now saying that they are hearing from tons of people who liked the ending. I have to ask if that is so then why are they putting so much energy into trying to win us back and get us to buy their DLC and why have so many stores marked down the price and why are they offering refunds for open games if only a few people don't like the ending.

Please check out this group and join in.

http://social.biowar.../user_group.php

Thank you for your time.

that is called deflection my friend its a strategy to make people think that there are more people who like it than people who dont and i can tell you most people i talked to did not so my stat might be at 95% did not like the end on different level

[FliegenkillerX]

DoctorCrowtgamer wrote...

Bioware is now saying that they are hearing from tons of people who liked the ending. I have to ask if that is so then why are they putting so much energy into trying to win us back and get us to buy their DLC and why have so many stores marked down the price and why are they offering refunds for open games if only a few people don't like the ending.

Please check out this group and join in.

http://social.biowar.../user_group.php

Thank you for your time.

just to call the numbers:
Support-Ending: 550 likers on Facebook
Retake ME: about 50.000 likers on Facebook

A tons of people?!

[MeldarthX]

MayaBalrin wrote...

snip

Maya welcome *hands you your rifle*  bar over there; there was food - but I think Krogans were complaining about there's no nuggets left


HOLD THE LINE

[OneWithTheAssassins]

FliegenkillerX wrote...

I think it isn't only the thing of PR.
In my opinion the storywriters, producers etc, going through the five stages of grief.

1-Denial: Why? it is a good ending
2-Anger: They are all wrong. They don't understand.
3-Bargaining: Please give us time. We concern your worries
4-Depression: OMG so many don't like it. We screwed up.
5-Acceptance. ok let's work something out

Boy, I hope there going through the same thing we are.

[Zero.Gee]

Just checking in for the evening, interesting reads tonight.

Hold the Line

[Hydralysk]

FliegenkillerX wrote...

I think it isn't only the thing of PR.
In my opinion the storywriters, producers etc, going through the five stages of grief.

1-Denial: Why? it is a good ending
2-Anger: They are all wrong. They don't understand.
3-Bargaining: Please give us time. We concern your worries
4-Depression: OMG so many don't like it. We screwed up.
5-Acceptance. ok let's work something out

That's kind of appropriate because I went through:

1-Shock: What in the hell was that?
2-Depression: I can't believe it ended like that....
3-Rationalization: Was the ending really that bad?
4-Realization: Yes it really was that bad.
5-Anger: I can't believe someone actually thought this ending was a good idea!