9972 réponses à ce sujet

[Hydralysk]

redknight38 wrote...

SLana wrote...

And now everybody say "I'll pay just do it" Great. Just great. By buying ME3 I bought myself a lot of stress and now it turns out I should wish to pay more money for DLC because I want to be happy instead of depressed? There's a lot of stress situations and misery in the real life, I doubt we play games to get more of it.

You might have no choice on the matter. They can always legitmiately claim the game was finished and fine "as is." It's why starting something like a class action suit or even taking it to small claims will be dubious. The programming runs, so the game "works." Storytelling would be very difficult to prove as "incomplete." Hence the debate here on "art."

What this means is that any DLC they release on the ending will be bonus. It can be marketed as something for people who want "alternatives" but they can continue to insist that the game is complete as is.

So realistically, I strongly suspect that IF they release an ending DLC (big IF), then you'll have to pay for it. Producing something like that does cost money, after all, and making it paid DLC might be the only way for it to ever get the green light. In all fairness, they would be well within their rights to do so. They're running a business after all. I mean, come on people. These guys aren't sitting in a room on golden chairs throwing wads of cash at each other-- it takes lots of people to make games, from the programmers and storytellers to the janitors who clean up after them. And all of them have to get paid. If anything, the people like Hudson (far from cackling with greedy glee) are currently having ulcers about the prospect of getting fired and their careers Daikatana'd.

What they might do in conciliation is to bundle the DLC with extras, like MP packs or weapons or the like, to make it seem like you are getting something extra. A peace offering and to make it seem like you're getting more value for your money.

That is IF they decide to release this DLC at all.

This is my exact stance on it. Except I wouldn't of mentioned Daikatana, there's some things you just can't take back.

[crimsontotem]

Mr. Lee I just want to say this one point...

My brother pre-ordered PS3 version of ME3 from Gamestop and we got a phone call, asking us when we were going to pick up. Before I even give out my response, a clerk who was on the phone was telling me to just don't bother coming over since the ending destroys the whole entire franchise... game store CLERK was discouraging a customer from buying it! I am sure you guys, especially people like you who has seen the birth of ME1 and seen how the franchise grew, are devastated but you must act quick!

[Lena Grozi]

SLana wrote...

And now everybody say "I'll pay just do it" Great. Just great. By buying ME3 I bought myself a lot of stress and now it turns out I should wish to pay more money for DLC because I want to be happy instead of depressed? There's a lot of stress situations and misery in the real life, I doubt we play games to get more of it.

Yes, you are right. I wrote previously that paying for a new ending is what probably will happen, but it doesn't mean I think it's okay, or that it should happen. I personally paid for the Collector's Edition, and for every single pre-order bonus I could find. (My credit card cried!) If I also have to pay for the ending that should have been there from the start, it's just another insult to our love and passion for the game. But after reading the explanation of the marketing process and PR I couldn't help my sad, quite sarcastic note that in the end, if BW gives us the option of a new ending for money, we won't be able to resist. We invested so much in this already, we need closure and the company will make money from it. 

[Militarized]

crimsontotem wrote...

Mr. Lee I just want to say this one point...

My brother pre-ordered PS3 version of ME3 from Gamestop and we got a phone call, asking us when we were going to pick up. Before I even give out my response, a clerk who was on the phone was telling me to just don't bother coming over since the ending destroys the whole entire franchise... game store CLERK was discouraging a customer from buying it! I am sure you guys, especially people like you who has seen the birth of ME1 and seen how the franchise grew, are devastated but you must act quick!

...really? Wow.... wow that is not good. 

[Sentr0]

MouseNo4 wrote...

I want what all you guys want. I want a better ending. But the fact is they wont give us a better or alternate ending. Ever. The sooner you guys just accept that the sooner this pointless thread(s) will stop clogging up the forums.

The endings are exactly how the writers envisioned them to be - perhaps displayed in different ways but essentially, the story is the same. No author will just accept a major alteration in THEIR story based on internet QQ.

If the company's survival is at stake they will do it...

[EsterCloat]

atghunter wrote...

Khallos wrote...

Here's a question for ya, atg: could this "bunkering" strategy just be the tactic chosen to weather the storm until the Q1 fiscal period ends at the end of March? A post on Reddit brought this up, and the posters explanation that they (being BW) wouldn't want to rock the boat too much before the first quarterly numbers came out.

I'll be honest, that's out of my depth a bit.  You'd be talking to accounting types.  Granted, quarterly stock reports were data we would be provided but didn't factor much into out paradigm.  PR in situations like these are to diffuse the controversy by the most financially viable option.  We concerned ourselves with external forces, company response, and hoped our paychecks didn't bounce.

Sorry I can't give a better opine
 

Quick question Mr. atghunter: in your experience, do these kind of things ever have a "victor", so to speak? Do corporations usually weather these types of things or do the consumers get at least some kind of resolution or something to that effect? I guess I'm wondering whether we're looking at something feasible here or is this going to be a very steep uphill battle?

Modifié par EsterCloat, 17 mars 2012 - 08:45 .

[Laughing_Man]

rickelmo wrote...

MouseNo4 wrote...

I want what all you guys want. I want a better ending. But the fact is they wont give us a better or alternate ending. Ever. The sooner you guys just accept that the sooner this pointless thread(s) will stop clogging up the forums.

The endings are exactly how the writers envisioned them to be - perhaps displayed in different ways but essentially, the story is the same. No author will just accept a major alteration in THEIR story based on internet QQ.

 Doesnt' posting and complaining here do the very thing you don't want; making this thread go to the front page of the forums?

 Indeed.
Besides, even if in the end the crap won't be fixed (the crap in it..), I bet they will remember this thing for a loong time, and will think twice before pulling the same crap on us again.
Not to mention the fact that they are going to lose a cut of what could have been made through paid DLC's.

[SLana]

redknight38 wrote...
You might have no choice on the matter.

What they might do in conciliation is to bundle the DLC with extras, like MP packs or weapons or the like, to make it seem like you are getting something extra. A peace offering and to make it seem like you're getting more value for your money.

That is IF they decide to release this DLC at all.

I know I have no choice. But it's like you need surgery because your surgeon left something inside your guts while fixing you and you have to pay for extraction :happy:

[atghunter]

Necroscope wrote...

Just wanted to say Thank You atghunter!

... and Marauder Shields.

*smiles*  I'd thank Marauder Shields before me.  He apparently tried to save us all from what I've read.

[MouseNo4]

rickelmo wrote...

MouseNo4 wrote...

I want what all you guys want. I want a better ending. But the fact is they wont give us a better or alternate ending. Ever. The sooner you guys just accept that the sooner this pointless thread(s) will stop clogging up the forums.

The endings are exactly how the writers envisioned them to be - perhaps displayed in different ways but essentially, the story is the same. No author will just accept a major alteration in THEIR story based on internet QQ.

 Doesnt' posting and complaining here do the very thing you don't want; making this thread go to the front page of the forums?

Yes i agree, asking people to stop crying about spilt milk is pointless. People must have something to complain about!

But im afraid it will stay on the front page regardless what i do, until people learn that no matter how many pages these threads go for, no matter how many emails, tweets, private messages and letters are sent - nothing will change. 

[Kirival]

 bump...appreciate the updates OP and i appreciate the insight atg well done

[MouseNo4]

Sentr0 wrote...

MouseNo4 wrote...

I want what all you guys want. I want a better ending. But the fact is they wont give us a better or alternate ending. Ever. The sooner you guys just accept that the sooner this pointless thread(s) will stop clogging up the forums.

The endings are exactly how the writers envisioned them to be - perhaps displayed in different ways but essentially, the story is the same. No author will just accept a major alteration in THEIR story based on internet QQ.

If the company's survival is at stake they will do it...

The company is fine. I can assure you of that. ROFL! Check the sales records they recently announced. Check the massive list of critic reviews they WANT you to read! They are doing perfectly fine. 

In Mr End of Line's words - if people PAY for something, that means what they are doing is the RIGHT thing to do and therefore should KEEP doing it. 

[musicaleCA]

redknight38 wrote...

SLana wrote...

And now everybody say "I'll pay just do it" Great. Just great. By buying ME3 I bought myself a lot of stress and now it turns out I should wish to pay more money for DLC because I want to be happy instead of depressed? There's a lot of stress situations and misery in the real life, I doubt we play games to get more of it.

You might have no choice on the matter. They can always legitmiately claim the game was finished and fine "as is." It's why starting something like a class action suit or even taking it to small claims will be dubious. The programming runs, so the game "works." Storytelling would be very difficult to prove as "incomplete." Hence the debate here on "art."

What this means is that any DLC they release on the ending will be bonus. It can be marketed as something for people who want "alternatives" but they can continue to insist that the game is complete as is.

So realistically, I strongly suspect that IF they release an ending DLC (big IF), then you'll have to pay for it. Producing something like that does cost money, after all, and making it paid DLC might be the only way for it to ever get the green light. In all fairness, they would be well within their rights to do so. They're running a business after all. I mean, come on people. These guys aren't sitting in a room on golden chairs throwing wads of cash at each other-- it takes lots of people to make games, from the programmers and storytellers to the janitors who clean up after them. And all of them have to get paid. If anything, the people like Hudson (far from cackling with greedy glee) are currently having ulcers about the prospect of getting fired and their careers Daikatana'd.

What they might do in conciliation is to bundle the DLC with extras, like MP packs or weapons or the like, to make it seem like you are getting something extra. A peace offering and to make it seem like you're getting more value for your money.

That is IF they decide to release this DLC at all.

class-action suit? Dubious, yes. But if BW/EA doesn't fix this to the community's satisfaction, we should start a new campaign to register complaints to the BBB. A flood of complaints against BW and EA about how they unethically advertised that the endings would depend on one's choices throughout the games, then did not provide the product as advertised, and since no one can demand a refund because we played it, it's a very severe breach of business ethics and trust.

The BBB is concerned with ethical business practice, whereas a class-action would depend on the law (which really wouldn't hold water b/c they have their ducks in a row on that front). If the BBB has to deal with thousands of complaints from ME3 owners asking that either the product be fixed so that it is complete and as it was advertised, or a full refund, two things may happen: the ending may be fixed (refunding thousands upon thousands of copies isn't really a good option), and EA/BW's BBB rating may well drop. That can hurt.

The BBB's slogan is "Start With Trust". BW and EA have broken our trust in them by not delivering the advertized product. A litany of complaints to the BBB on this issue would at least demand that they finally rate EA. And that rating, if bad, could affect business.

It's capitalism. We've been swindled out of our money, so attack their pocketbooks.

[Xandax]

Sentr0 wrote...

MouseNo4 wrote...

I want what all you guys want. I want a better ending. But the fact is they wont give us a better or alternate ending. Ever. The sooner you guys just accept that the sooner this pointless thread(s) will stop clogging up the forums.

The endings are exactly how the writers envisioned them to be - perhaps displayed in different ways but essentially, the story is the same. No author will just accept a major alteration in THEIR story based on internet QQ.

If the company's survival is at stake they will do it...

I most certainly do not think Bioware's survival is at stake at all.

But it is perhaps the next major shift away from their traditional customers into the new segment they obviously want. And question then is - whether that new segment is more loyal or fickle than those of us who've been playing Bioware games for a decade.
And that in turn could mean a much lesser role for Bioware within the EA umbrealla which then in turn will mean a diminished roll in the industry as a large.

Loyality takes a long time to build up but can be ruined very fast; and for me - Bioware is at a turning point now. I followed them into DA2 while clearly seeing the flaws because of loyalty - will I follow them out of ME3? I'm doubtful right now.
And I'm sure I'm not alone in this aspect.

Modifié par Xandax, 17 mars 2012 - 08:51 .

[GothamLord]

MouseNo4 wrote...

But im afraid it will stay on the front page regardless what i do, until people learn that no matter how many pages these threads go for, no matter how many emails, tweets, private messages and letters are sent - nothing will change. 

BioWare Ending Expansion Kickstarter program.   Set a production cost value.  See if people bite.   Everybody wins.   Money changes everything. 

[mjh417]

I feel bad for Mr. Jarrett Lee. I want to say thank you to him for giving a response to the thread. I believe him to be genuine.

That being said... this fight against Bioware can't waiver for ANY REASON

HOLD THE LINE

[Ajirasan]

I love mass effect. Heck, I localized Mass Effect 2 to Turkish, I bought their every freaking game. I tried to finish the game as late as possible. I was hoping that there will be some kind of free DLC or something but Bioware just trolling us. I won't play Bioware games anymore. DLC or free stuff can't change that. Sayanora Bioware. It was nice to know you.

[MouseNo4]

TheRedVipress wrote...

rickelmo wrote...

MouseNo4 wrote...

I want what all you guys want. I want a better ending. But the fact is they wont give us a better or alternate ending. Ever. The sooner you guys just accept that the sooner this pointless thread(s) will stop clogging up the forums.

The endings are exactly how the writers envisioned them to be - perhaps displayed in different ways but essentially, the story is the same. No author will just accept a major alteration in THEIR story based on internet QQ.

 Doesnt' posting and complaining here do the very thing you don't want; making this thread go to the front page of the forums?

 Indeed.
Besides, even if in the end the crap won't be fixed (the crap in it..), I bet they will remember this thing for a loong time, and will think twice before pulling the same crap on us again.
Not to mention the fact that they are going to lose a cut of what could have been made through paid DLC's.

This. This is ALL that will happen regarding this topic. Check the sales of Dragon Age 2. Then have a look at how badly it did soon after launch once people started finishing that game. (i actually quite enjoyed that game, minus the repetitive nature and the horrible ending)

Release a really crap map pack for call of duty or or... whatever the current fps game is. Because it has ''call of duty'' stamped on it, absolutely everyone would gobble it down super fast. 

[Bachuck]

*edited*

BaChuck

Modifié par Bachuck, 17 mars 2012 - 09:06 .

[People4Peace]

MouseNo4 wrote...

I want what all you guys want. I want a better ending. But the fact is they wont give us a better or alternate ending. Ever. The sooner you guys just accept that the sooner this pointless thread(s) will stop clogging up the forums.

The endings are exactly how the writers envisioned them to be - perhaps displayed in different ways but essentially, the story is the same. No author will just accept a major alteration in THEIR story based on internet QQ.

Right because Fallout 3 and Prince of Persia never changed/added onto their endings? And throughout history authors never changed the endings to their books? And...Bioware never changed an ENTIRE book?

It's too bad you lost hope. I understand but what I don't understand is why you're trying to bring other people down with you. Plus these are your opinions and they aren't fact. Not yet anyway. None of us know what Bioware is going to do. It remains to be seen.

As I've said before, I am going to hope until I am given a reason not to. There is still hope and there is no point in giving up now. If we never tried and gave up, we would never know. Plus the game just came out in Asia and already a lot of the players there aren't liking the endings.

Hope is still alive. And until Bioware slams that door in my face, I will hold the line.

Modifié par People4Peace, 17 mars 2012 - 08:53 .

[deathscythe517]

I feel this needs to be heard as it displays what I feel about people who support the ending but who cannot agree to disagree on top of showing the scummy business practices of Bioware/EA.

[Wowlock]

MouseNo4 wrote...

Sentr0 wrote...

MouseNo4 wrote...

I want what all you guys want. I want a better ending. But the fact is they wont give us a better or alternate ending. Ever. The sooner you guys just accept that the sooner this pointless thread(s) will stop clogging up the forums.

The endings are exactly how the writers envisioned them to be - perhaps displayed in different ways but essentially, the story is the same. No author will just accept a major alteration in THEIR story based on internet QQ.

If the company's survival is at stake they will do it...

The company is fine. I can assure you of that. ROFL! Check the sales records they recently announced. Check the massive list of critic reviews they WANT you to read! They are doing perfectly fine. 

In Mr End of Line's words - if people PAY for something, that means what they are doing is the RIGHT thing to do and therefore should KEEP doing it. 

I wonder how many of us would've bought the game if they would tell us how the game's ending gonna be. Only reason they got our money is by their false advertisement and if it wasn't for that, those sale would've been plummeted.....

And if they KEEP doing this....they won't have a fanbase left to comeback to .....

[DeadLetterBox]

SLana wrote...

redknight38 wrote...
You might have no choice on the matter.

What they might do in conciliation is to bundle the DLC with extras, like MP packs or weapons or the like, to make it seem like you are getting something extra. A peace offering and to make it seem like you're getting more value for your money.

That is IF they decide to release this DLC at all.

I know I have no choice. But it's like you need surgery because your surgeon left something inside your guts while fixing you and you have to pay for extraction :happy:

Yeah, I had a botched surgery.  No foreign objects or anything but I was pretty well crippled until the problem was fixed.  I paid for both.  I will say that the second surgeon was not the same person as the first.

This isn't as serious as surgery, though.  This is more like... 

I'm a woman and I'm blind as a bat without my glasses.  One time I got up in the night and had to use the bathroom.  Next thing I know my backside is in cold water.  I didn't see that the seat was up and not down.  My boyfriend at the time did not mean for my backside to wind up in cold water, but there I was anyway.  The end of this game is a backside in cold toilet water.  An unforseen consequence of leaving the toilet seat where you left it.

It didn't cripple me or anything, but it was shocking and very unpleasant.

[Shadeart]

Thanks for sharing!

[MouseNo4]

People4Peace wrote...

MouseNo4 wrote...

I want what all you guys want. I want a better ending. But the fact is they wont give us a better or alternate ending. Ever. The sooner you guys just accept that the sooner this pointless thread(s) will stop clogging up the forums.

The endings are exactly how the writers envisioned them to be - perhaps displayed in different ways but essentially, the story is the same. No author will just accept a major alteration in THEIR story based on internet QQ.

Right because Fallout 3 and Prince of Persia never changed/added onto their endings? And throughout history authors never changed the endings to their books? And...Bioware never changed an ENTIRE book?

It's too bad you lost hope. I understand but what I don't understand is why you're trying to bring other people down with you. Plus these are your opinions and they aren't fact. Not yet anyway. None of us know what Bioware is going to do. It remains to be seen.

As I've said before, I am going to hope until I am given a reason not to. There is still hope and there is no point in giving up now. If we never tried and gave up, we would never know. Plus the game just came out in Asia and already a lot of the players there aren't liking the endings.

Hope is still alive. And until Bioware slams that door in my face, I will hold the line.

I never said give up hope. By all means hope for the best. I still cling to a hopeless cause as well. 

Just quit the whinging on the forums is all im asking.