Aryck1095 V2 wrote...
You're getting rid of the game just because of the ending? I'm not entirely satisfied with the ending either, but the other 99% percent of the game is amazing.
SalsaDMA wrote...
al9998 wrote...
al9998 wrote...
SalsaDMA wrote...
al9998 wrote...
Again, I have no problem if you sell the games that you don't like. But asking for a refund after you have experienced the whole game is dishonest.
Selling a different product than advertised is dishonest. Demanding your money back when faced with such schemes is not.
Yes, provided that you play for a few minutes and quicly STOP and RETURN your game immediately. Again, my point is that after experiencing the full game, which the developers have put countless hours to produce, and THEN get a refund is dishonest.
To give an analogy, if you go to a movie theatre and expect to watch a comedy but end up watching p0rn somehow, then you would quickly get out and demand a refund. In that case you have a case. However, it would be absurd if you sit through the whole p0rn movie and then demand a refund afterwards.
To stick with your analogy: You pay a movie ticket to see a comedy with your underaged kid. You get in and the movie plays out like a comedy, except for the last 10 minutes where the entire cast throws all their clothes and starts having a ball with everything being shown explicit to the viewer. Shocked, you are unable to comprehend what you are seeing before you as the scene plays out and the movie ends.
Your claim, in this case, would then be that the customer should not get a refund and that there was nothing wrong with the product (the movie) compared to what it was advertised as.
My claim, however, would be that the movie was sold on a wrong basis and I would demand not only my money back, but also be infuriated at having had to have that experience with my kid at my side.
al9998 wrote...
Your analogy is far-fetched and exaggerated. How do you apply your analogy to mass effect 3? Did you or your kids actually being traumatized after playing Mass Effect 3?
al9998 wrote...
Your analogy is far-fetched and exaggerated. How do you apply your analogy to mass effect 3? Did you or your kids actually being traumatized after playing Mass Effect 3? If so, I suggest you go to see your doctor and contact the lawyer, you really have a case there.
Objectively speaking, the fact that you have played through the whole 20+hours game till the end, is a strong case to argue that the game does actually conform to your expectation. So the only thing left to argue is that the ending is not what you like. However, how do you proof your case that it is a false advertisement just because the ending is not what you like? Whether you like the ending or not is subjective and I don't think you will ever have a case if you bring it to court.
al9998 wrote...
Lycius wrote...
al9998 wrote...
I hope that the OP is genuine and honest to himself, and will not try to abuse the retailer's goodwill in the future. I am afraid once you find out you can 'game the system' this way, you will do it again and again, while rationalize yourself away. Claiming that a game is completely worthless AFTER finishing the WHOLE GAME is quite absurd (I just can't figure out how you can endure to finish the whole game if you don't enjoy it). In psychology, there is a term about this kind of self-rationalization, it is called 'self deception' (please google this term and learn more about it).
One thing you should understand is that, despite how you hate the ending, there are many honest and hard working people who had put countless hours to produce a game; those people have a right to their livelihood. If most people behaves like you do, it is the honest people that get hurt.
If you are truly sincere and honest, I would suggest that in the future, you should NOT pre-ordering or buying any games early. You should do more research and read more customer's review. Please do not do this again, DON'T play the WHOLE game and then refund it. Thank you.
I wont be pre-ordering a game from Bioware again. Bank on that.
However, I typically pre-order CE's of anything I find interesting before release. Considering the amount of games I have purchased since I was using DOS 2.11 and this is the first I've ever returned.......Perhaps your selfcontrol is so weak that you couldn't resist something you could abuse once you found out but mine is not.
By the way, could you maybe try sounding a bit more pretencious? I'm pretty sure you could but I had to google that term and learn more about it.
Perhaps you should read this thread a bit more closely and you will see time and again why many of us have returned the game, myself included. You'll also see just how ridiculous your families are getting hurt idea really is. The mortgage bankers who've destroyed millions of families over greed and the oil speculators currently screwing us with gas prices have familes too. Should I just accept thier bull**** because they have familes?
To the OP and everyone that have returned the game:
Since I do not know you personally, I can only hope that you are as honest as you claim.
I am a software developer so I believe I have a better understanding of the amount of effort that need to make a game, and I tend to sympathize with the game developers. Please understanding that the 20+hours that you spent enjoying the game requires years and years of hard work by the game developers; a majority of game developers are not decision makers, they are just doing honest work and trying to make a living. if the game does not sell well, they are the first ones to go. In that sense, playing a video game is more similar to watching a movie or reading a book; during the process you are enjoying other people's hard work (and so the 'car' analogy is irrelevant here). if you genuinely feel that they have put hard work into the game, then they should be rewarded. Enjoying the full game and then demand a FULL refund is unfair.
The reason I bring up the psychology term about 'self-rationalization' and 'self-deception' is because people have a tendency to justify their dishonest behaviour by coming up with many excuses to fool THEMSELVES. Such as the excuse that since the ending is 'bad', they are entitled for a FULL refund, despite the fact that these gamers have spent 20+ hours enjoying the whole process.
I don't understand why you bring up mortgage bankers, that is irrelevant to our discussion. I have no comment on that.
Lycius wrote...
Glad you're a software developer. My wife is a game designer, and I've worked in the industry since 2003. Your point is?
My point, is that you are coming across as a pretencious snob. Let me guess, you have a degree in psychology. The mortgage banker comments are pretty self explainitory. You said I shouldn't refund the game because the devs have families blah blah and I asked if we should also tolerate BS from mortgage brokers/oil speculators because they have families as well.
That's a ridiculous statement. The most evil and reprehensible people in history all had families.
Again, just because you are too weak willed to resist justifying poor behavior and theft because it's possible doesn't mean everyone is.
Modifié par Rafe34, 21 mars 2012 - 09:04 .
SalsaDMA wrote...
al9998 wrote...
Your analogy is far-fetched and exaggerated. How do you apply your analogy to mass effect 3? Did you or your kids actually being traumatized after playing Mass Effect 3? If so, I suggest you go to see your doctor and contact the lawyer, you really have a case there.
Objectively speaking, the fact that you have played through the whole 20+hours game till the end, is a strong case to argue that the game does actually conform to your expectation. So the only thing left to argue is that the ending is not what you like. However, how do you proof your case that it is a false advertisement just because the ending is not what you like? Whether you like the ending or not is subjective and I don't think you will ever have a case if you bring it to court.
You still refuse to acknowledge that selling a different product than advertised is wrong.
You may try and deflect with weak excuses all you like, but it doesn't change the underlying fact or importance of the above sentence.
I especially abhor the whole 'artist' excuse bioware is trying with now. If anything, artists live by the critic they receive, and when you start considering delivering paid artistic products it really unravels with their excuse. I'm quite sure any proffesional artist have had to deal with changing a piece they made (sometimes up to numerous times) based solely on feedback/criticism from the customer they are selling the piece to. I wager even bioware/EA has done this with their own artist teams on several occasions, so why they suddenly think it's a valid excuse is beyond me. And even so, it doesn't even touch the fact that they still advertised the product as something it wasn't.
kbct wrote...
al9998 wrote...
Your analogy is far-fetched and exaggerated. How do you apply your analogy to mass effect 3? Did you or your kids actually being traumatized after playing Mass Effect 3?
I actually heard a couple stories on this forum where the parents had to console their kids after the ending. I guess it was a little too bittersweet for them.
kbct wrote...
al9998 wrote...
Your analogy is far-fetched and exaggerated. How do you apply your analogy to mass effect 3? Did you or your kids actually being traumatized after playing Mass Effect 3?
I actually heard a couple stories on this forum where the parents had to console their kids after the ending. I guess it was a little too bittersweet for them.
Gerza71 wrote...
kbct wrote...
al9998 wrote...
Your analogy is far-fetched and exaggerated. How do you apply your analogy to mass effect 3? Did you or your kids actually being traumatized after playing Mass Effect 3?
I actually heard a couple stories on this forum where the parents had to console their kids after the ending. I guess it was a little too bittersweet for them.
Poor little darlings. Sooner or later something happens to them in real life then what. How many time I got drag through the coals when I was a child.
When I was 12 I had my nose broken by a cricket ball. I had a big black eye playing on the monkey bars at state (primary) school.
If children played this game why they played it at the first place? Where I am it has a MA15+ tag on it.
Modifié par Naughty Bear, 27 mars 2012 - 07:59 .
D.K. And wrote...
$87.95 refund?
CE cost $79.99 US, how did you get more money than the game cost?
As for OP returning the game for a refund, it was his choice. Amazon, the company told him they'd take it back, he sent it back.
Regardless of the reason or what people may think of that action, does it really necessitate a 16 page thread on the topic?
Elhanan wrote...
What is rerehensible is folks asking for full refunds for a game they enjoyed until the end. The ones that do this appear to be self-focused, and rather apathetic about any other concerns save their own myopic worlds. IMO.
Naughty Bear wrote...
Gerza71 wrote...
kbct wrote...
al9998 wrote...
Your analogy is far-fetched and exaggerated. How do you apply your analogy to mass effect 3? Did you or your kids actually being traumatized after playing Mass Effect 3?
I actually heard a couple stories on this forum where the parents had to console their kids after the ending. I guess it was a little too bittersweet for them.
Poor little darlings. Sooner or later something happens to them in real life then what. How many time I got drag through the coals when I was a child.
When I was 12 I had my nose broken by a cricket ball. I had a big black eye playing on the monkey bars at state (primary) school.
If children played this game why they played it at the first place? Where I am it has a MA15+ tag on it.
Beat this.
When i was 10, there was this pole which was part of an obstacle course outside my class. I decided to stand on top of the poles and lift my self up using my hands only.
Slipped and whacked my balls off it. They were bruised.
I also decided to fold my arms in my jumper and run around. Tripped over and since my arms were in my jumper, i could not fall on my hands so Instead, i fell face first onto the floor, breaking my nose.
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