613 réponses à ce sujet

[Quill74Pen]

"Dragon Age: Origins" was a great way to kick off a new series of games. I sure hope the Bioware development team in charge of that IP is keeping an eye on how the ending of ME3 pretty much destroyed the ME universe. Maybe it'll keep the same thing from happening when DA3 drops in the next year or so.

Quill74Pen

[Whybother]

Skyblade012 wrote...

How exactly did this guy lose his job? He understands the fans, understands the gaming medium, and made one heck of a good game in DA: O.

I think we all know now what happened to DA2, and if BioWare has lost their people with this sound a grip on what they are doing, no wonder the ending sucked so bad.

Burn-out, possibly.  Gaming is a tough industry - long hours for months at a time (and you don't get overtime), and as Brent said you don't get royalties either.  When I was in the industry, average lifespan for a developer in games was something like 3 years.

It sounds like he likes living in Edmonton, as there are plenty of game studios in Montreal and Vancouver if he wanted to stay north of the border.

[Killer3000ad]

I believe this human understands!

[Cobra5]

1- He is only commenting on the ending judged on what the angry fans are shouting, which is an extremely unfair and biased reaction. I went in to the game fearing the ending because of everything that was said on the forums and left the game not minding it at all. So by this alone, his opinion is difficult to take seriously. It only follows the pattern of people hating because they want to hate and nothing more.

2- His two points are that the choices should matter, and that the game should end on a positive note, neither of which were problems with Mass Effect 3 in my book. All of my choices were summed up very nicely, and in fact this is one of the game's strong points: the genophage, the Geth and the Quarians, saving the Rachni and them actually being peaceful... all of these were addressed, validated, and finalized.

And for ending on a positive note, the reapers blew up and everyone, Shepard included, survived. I guess I don't see the tragedy here.

And before you "Everyone is going to starve on Eaaaarrrthhhh!!" at me, they have the biggest, smartest, pan-species group of scientists and engineers ever assembled together and just fought off an apocalyptic invasion by building the most complex and advanced undertaking ever developed in the history of the galaxy.

[Peer of the Empire]

Xandax wrote...

DA:O - now that game had an ending that blew me away. The Sacrifice ending and Alistar's ending speech.

That's an end I had expected for Mass Effect 3

You mean the Warden King.  That was satisfying.  Alistair is way too sissy to be allowed near the throne

[Rolling Flame]

BringBackNihlus wrote...

daisekihan wrote...

And note: DA:O offered you the opportunity to sacrifice yourself, similar to Shepard. But in those games, you felt like your sacrifice ultimately meant something.

Nothing wrong with sacrificing for the greater good. I should be an option, but so should stopping the bad guys and living on in the process (and so should completely and utter failure).

That's my problem: I feel like we don't have a choice. We're either going to die, or see some retarded cutscene where we take one breath, and I have no idea what my choices did for the universe. 

Yeah, this. I don't want to be railroaded in dying every time.

[Rafe34]

Aaaand now I'm gonna back and play Dragon Age: Origins some more.

[DoubleHell]

Brent Knowles says it perfectly - at the end of the day, it's a game, not a movie.

We play games for enjoyment and to revel in the joy of winning, to walk away as the hero.

I made my Shepard look like me (I'm sure many other players made their Shepard in their likeness) - I became the protagonist, the hero, and watched as I roamed the galaxy saving everyone.

In ME1, I defeated Saren and Sovereign, saved the Citadel, and kicked butt throughout. The game ended on a high note, and that feeling encouraged replay after replay.

The same feeling continues in ME2, I came back from the dead, saved my crew, kicked the Collectors' butts and stuck it to the Illusive man. The game ends on another high note, and that feeling encouraged replay.

Now with ME3 - the game starts great, and ramps it up all the way to the end battle. Then there's the rush for the beam of light, the expecation of a final glorious battle.... and poof....the rug gets pulled out from under us. The writers tease us with successes through the game - being part of curing the genophage, seeing peace between the geth and quarians, seeing the quarians back on their homeworld...we expect the ending to top all of that.

The joy and feeling of triumph that came with finishing ME1 and ME2 was simply not there. The game ended without me feeling like the hero, and that feeling sucks.

To be honest, even if a new ending was written and inserted, replaying the game to reach it wouldn't feel the same. The moment of completing and triumphing over the game the very first time has been lost, and the experience tainted.

[Rafe34]

Quill74Pen wrote...

"Dragon Age: Origins" was a great way to kick off a new series of games. I sure hope the Bioware development team in charge of that IP is keeping an eye on how the ending of ME3 pretty much destroyed the ME universe. Maybe it'll keep the same thing from happening when DA3 drops in the next year or so.

Quill74Pen

They already screwed it all up with DA2.

I mean, MageHawke running around in the city while the Templars just let him do whatever he wants? Despite them arresting any *other* mage who's not in the circle and dragging them to the circle? Including your own SISTER, (when you're not a mage).

Yeah, that makes sense.

[daisekihan]

BringBackNihlus wrote...

daisekihan wrote...

And note: DA:O offered you the opportunity to sacrifice yourself, similar to Shepard. But in those games, you felt like your sacrifice ultimately meant something.

Nothing wrong with sacrificing for the greater good. I should be an option, but so should stopping the bad guys and living on in the process (and so should completely and utter failure).

That's my problem: I feel like we don't have a choice. We're either going to die, or see some retarded cutscene where we take one breath, and I have no idea what my choices did for the universe. 

Indeed. In DA:O you could, I believe, have Alistair sacrifice himself instead of you. But I just chose to sacrifice my Warden. Because that's how I wanted it to go down.

They just...they don't really care anymore, I think.

The worst thing is, I attributed the failure of DA2 to the pernicious influence of EA, but it seems more and more apparently that the people that made BG and KOTOR have turned away from their fans of their own free will.

[Clive Howlitzer]

I didn't even realize the lead designer of DA:O left Bioware. It seems they are losing all their old talent.

[People4Peace]

RazorrX wrote...

Ah Brent, so many of the good ones left.

He was spot on too.

This.

I completely agree with him. It's sad that there aren't more devs like him at Bioware....

[Quill74Pen]

Rafe34 wrote...

Aaaand now I'm gonna back and play Dragon Age: Origins some more.

You know what? I'm tempted to begin another playthrough of DAO, too. I've still got two of the six origin stories to play through — city elf and dwarf commoner.

Before that, though, I need to run my human royal Nova through "Witch Hunt" in order to complete a third world state import for DA2. (Nova is queen of Ferelden, and Alistair is king.) The other two world states are a female mage in love with Alistair, both having stayed Grey Wardens, and a human female royal who is consort to King Alistair, who shares power with Queen Anora.

It might be a good change of settings and pace now that I've finished ME3.

Quill74Pen

[Quill74Pen]

Rafe34 wrote...

Quill74Pen wrote...

"Dragon Age: Origins" was a great way to kick off a new series of games. I sure hope the Bioware development team in charge of that IP is keeping an eye on how the ending of ME3 pretty much destroyed the ME universe. Maybe it'll keep the same thing from happening when DA3 drops in the next year or so.

Quill74Pen

They already screwed it all up with DA2.

I mean, MageHawke running around in the city while the Templars just let him do whatever he wants? Despite them arresting any *other* mage who's not in the circle and dragging them to the circle? Including your own SISTER, (when you're not a mage).

Yeah, that makes sense.

Well, to be fair, there is a conversation option with Meredith where she specifically states the only reason you're allowed about Kirkwall unhindered is because of the good deeds you've done (which also explains Anders). I wouldn't be surprised if Varric was pulling a few strings, too.

Quill74Pen

[MadCat221]

Cobra5 wrote...

2- His two points are that the choices should matter, and that the game should end on a positive note, neither of which were problems with Mass Effect 3 in my book. All of my choices were summed up very nicely, and in fact this is one of the game's strong points: the genophage, the Geth and the Quarians, saving the Rachni and them actually being peaceful... all of these were addressed, validated, and finalized.

And for ending on a positive note, the reapers blew up and everyone, Shepard included, survived. I guess I don't see the tragedy here.

And before you "Everyone is going to starve on Eaaaarrrthhhh!!" at me, they have the biggest, smartest, pan-species group of scientists and engineers ever assembled together and just fought off an apocalyptic invasion by building the most complex and advanced undertaking ever developed in the history of the galaxy.

And they are on a completely devastated world, and that's pretty much all they have.  A levo world.  With huge swaths of continents on fire.

Did you miss the mass relay destruction?  That would have a rather galactic society-destroying effect as well.

To say that it ended on a "positive" note shows that you didn't consider the ramifications of anything that happened.  Earth is just shy of being a cinder, and there's nothing beyond whatever is within range of conventional FTL.  How do you expect such a critical infrastructure system like the relay network to be rebuilt when everything else is in complete shambles?

Modifié par MadCat221, 17 mars 2012 - 07:57 .

[Azreal Inc]

Cobra5 wrote...

And for ending on a positive note, the reapers blew up and everyone, Shepard included, survived. I guess I don't see the tragedy here.

And before you "Everyone is going to starve on Eaaaarrrthhhh!!" at me, they have the biggest, smartest, pan-species group of scientists and engineers ever assembled together and just fought off an apocalyptic invasion by building the most complex and advanced undertaking ever developed in the history of the galaxy.

Well, Shep only survives one of them. I guess that is the sunshine and rainbows ending. And yes, they did just fight off an apocalyptic invasion while suffering massive losses and more then likely consuming a large amount of their available resources.

But you are just assuming they figure it out and it all ends fine? In no way did the ending of the game lead me to that conclusion. I agree there is a strong vibe of hope through the ending(s?) but it's hope that really won't be realized for 50,000 years when the Reapers don't come back to .. er ... reap. Which in that case, yay!

[BrowncoatN7]

Well said.

[DeadLetterBox]

Cobra5 wrote...

1- He is only commenting on the ending judged on what the angry fans are shouting, which is an extremely unfair and biased reaction. I went in to the game fearing the ending because of everything that was said on the forums and left the game not minding it at all. So by this alone, his opinion is difficult to take seriously. It only follows the pattern of people hating because they want to hate and nothing more.

2- His two points are that the choices should matter, and that the game should end on a positive note, neither of which were problems with Mass Effect 3 in my book. All of my choices were summed up very nicely, and in fact this is one of the game's strong points: the genophage, the Geth and the Quarians, saving the Rachni and them actually being peaceful... all of these were addressed, validated, and finalized.

And for ending on a positive note, the reapers blew up and everyone, Shepard included, survived. I guess I don't see the tragedy here.

And before you "Everyone is going to starve on Eaaaarrrthhhh!!" at me, they have the biggest, smartest, pan-species group of scientists and engineers ever assembled together and just fought off an apocalyptic invasion by building the most complex and advanced undertaking ever developed in the history of the galaxy.

I'm happy you enjoyed the game.  I did not.  I'm not screaming hate, I just didn't think they did a very good job.  

I think the ending should be at the end, not all throughout the game with some trippy ending tacked on because you already wrapped up everything you cared to.  

[moteh]

Awesome OP I fully agree with Brent Knowles

[thrashmental]

True words.

[Peer of the Empire]

Burn-out, possibly.  Gaming is a tough industry - long hours for months at a time (and you don't get overtime), and as Brent said you don't get royalties either.  When I was in the industry, average lifespan for a developer in games was something like 3 years.

It sounds like he likes living in Edmonton, as there are plenty of game studios in Montreal and Vancouver if he wanted to stay north of the border.

You dont get royalties.  Someone needs better lawyers

Modifié par Peer of the Empire, 17 mars 2012 - 08:20 .

[Alex-_-]

Wow, this guy has got it completely right, sometimes mass effect is just too much like a movie. I know some who hated the endings will disagree but I for one wanted a happy ending. Well not as a set ending, but at least as an option if you did everything "right"

[Eterna]

I don't agree with him that a trilogy has to end on a high note.

[macarius5]

i have played DA:O, first time i was amazed at how my choices reflected to the characters & outcome. it was brilliant. Also I might add that there were varying endings influenced by my choices whether I played as human noble, mage.

Though there were bad reviews on DA2, I still enjoyed the game, I found the recycled dungeon annoying, other than that the story was okay as well as the ending, though I miss the varying endings of DA:O

However for ME3, the ending was a disappointment, I did not feel uplifted or inspired as what Casey Hudson's intended. I was lost.. I see no connection ME1 to ME2 to ME3's prior to catalyst child.. what happen to my past actions? and the ending made no sense.. yes my shepard sacrifice himself but I could not make a connection to how his sacrifice mattered because the ending has a lot of unanswered questions. I can relate to a theme regarding sacrifices...like legion's because it has a clear conclusion & outcome and the fact that Legion's action was influenced by decisions I made previously in ME2. However as for the ending.. well I do not feel the emotions associated to the heroic sacrifice of my Shepard.