1907 réponses à ce sujet

[Petrikles]

There is a very important reason why the endings should be changed ASAP. Refer to this thread:

http://social.biowar...dex/10036548/32

In short I will quote what I stated there, and I urge Bioware to seriously consider the implications reveiled therein:

"I wonder why all the news and gaming magazines did not get it. The ending definitely has strong tones of racism, which borders on the unacceptable. And Shepard is given no other option as to play along these lines. I don´t get it why they complain about naked bodies in ME1, but this issue totally escapes them.

You can easily prove this thesis by replacing the word "organic" by "white people" and the word "synthetic" by "black people". I was really shocked when I finally came to realize this.

Maybe the synthesis ending symbolizes the way out of this predicament, by symbolizing the merging of cultures which ultimately eliminates racism. But the context seems plain wrong, as it is placed a forced upon sollution, and it also removes cultural differences as a whole. Again, this is something which leans strongly to the philosophy of racism. I am scared, now. "

[WolfyZA]

http://i2.kym-cdn.co...272/942/ddc.jpg 

[ile_1979]

Kailord wrote...

.........
You can easily prove this thesis by replacing the word "organic" by "white people" and the word "synthetic" by "black people". I was really shocked when I finally came to realize this.

Maybe the synthesis ending symbolizes the way out of this predicament, by symbolizing the merging of cultures which ultimately eliminates racism. But the context seems plain wrong, as it is placed a forced upon sollution, and it also removes cultural differences as a whole. Again, this is something which leans strongly to the philosophy of racism. I am scared, now. "

Dude, i think you mix the terms "race" and "culture" here. Memebers of the same "race" can have variable and diverse cultural heritige (pretty much Euro Asia and Africa), while the members of the different "race" can have/belong to a similar or common "culture", like a grat part  of the new world.  

[Petrikles]

ile_1979 wrote...

Kailord wrote...

.........
You can easily prove this thesis by replacing the word "organic" by "white people" and the word "synthetic" by "black people". I was really shocked when I finally came to realize this.

Maybe the synthesis ending symbolizes the way out of this predicament, by symbolizing the merging of cultures which ultimately eliminates racism. But the context seems plain wrong, as it is placed a forced upon sollution, and it also removes cultural differences as a whole. Again, this is something which leans strongly to the philosophy of racism. I am scared, now. "

Dude, i think you mix the terms "race" and "culture" here. Memebers of the same "race" can have variable and diverse cultural heritige (pretty much Euro Asia and Africa), while the members of the different "race" can have/belong to a similar or common "culture", like a grat part  of the new world.  

Copied from wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism)
"Racism" and "racial discrimination" are often used to describe discrimination on an ethnic or cultural basis, independent of their somatic (i.e., "racial") differences. According to the United Nations conventions, there is no distinction between the term racial discrimination and ethnicity discrimination."

[Bullius]

What happened to the thread about the 3 endings, you know the yes we are listening one?

I was enjoying hearing other peoples feedback and seeing that I am far from alone with my feelings about this total cluster **** of an ending.

Bottom line is we got screwed on the ending so they could slap in mutliplayer and that will continue to happen in future DLC (oohhh shiny new maps, any story???) I couldn't care less about multiplayer, but if people enjoy it then that's great for them.

Just don't rush an unfinished game out the door and lie through your teeth about choices and consequences that aren't there, because your damn resources and development time where used elswhere.

Oh and on the "artistic ending answer"........................I call bollox.

[Alucard of the dragon]

Mr.BlazenGlazen wrote...

I am honestly starting to get really irritated by Hudson.

Truest comment on this topic.

[General dripik]

Cool. so at what point does he grow a pair and admit that he blatantly lied in those interviews?

[LegendaryBlade]

Alucard of the dragon wrote...

Mr.BlazenGlazen wrote...

I am honestly starting to get really irritated by Hudson.

Truest comment on this topic.

+1

[Alucard of the dragon]

Look, I LOVE Bioware and their games. I really
do, but the ending was terrible. I won't lie: I'll play ME3 again. And
probably again after that too. Why? Because it's amazing RIGHT UP TO THE
LAST 15 MINS! Bioware made ONE critical mistake: They made it so that
every choice we've ever made, is worth nothing. None of them matters = No
story-wise reason for replaying. Bioware should care about this and fix
it. Why? Cause it's the conculsion of their epic saga, and when that
sucks, it's gonna create ALOT of negative feedback (which it obivously
has), which in turn, will drop sales EXTREMELY fast.
I don't even care if they're only there for the money; If they were in
for the money, then they would do it, just to make at least SOME profit.
Right now, the only thing holding them back is: Pride, Laziness, and probably, EA. It's not just a SINGLE GAME
that takes damage: it's every Mass Effect game that does. Potential
costumers won't buy ANY of the games, cause they've heard from THOUSANDS
of people that the conclusion of the final game sucks.

Modifié par Alucard of the dragon, 27 mars 2012 - 01:17 .

[Manic Mandela]

Josen wrote...

I love ME3, it really lifts you to another level, grows to a crescendo, but... well you know... :crying:
Just imagine if you had done this to SWTOR... but maybe that's why you did it to ME3, run out of time and resources huh?

BioWare, if you are looking for damage control read this "Why we are right" excelent article:

Warning! Spoilers ahead! http://www.gamefront.com/mass-effect-3-ending-hatred-5-reasons-the-fans-are-right/

^ This. The linked article covers it all. There's a follow up on indoctrination theory as well which also makes several excellent points.

More content is required. I just can't get my second playthrough far into the game with things as they are.

[Danse Macabre]

ok i finished the game, did every possible side quest, explored 100% of all the galaxy (took me a while trying to avoid reapers chasing my ship all the dam time...lol) done the DLC to get my extra companion who i kinda like and dislike at the same time (would of loved him to of been able to help liara a bit more on her research, didnt like that she knew more than him about his own races tech etc..). up until the assault on the elusive mans base i was feeling the game was fantastic, then in that base i was like, wow, im starting to have a few things come to light a little more, end of the base, ok my predictions on him being indoctrinated and being half reaper where right... i expected that really cant complain, as i dont see him doing anything other than trying to control the reapers like he controlled everything else. it is at this point my other idea that was a potential candidate for the ending was invalidated, that idea was that the illusive man was always in control of tham, and was actually an ancient VI controlling the reapers and using shep to make his plan come to fruition, well that last bit about using shep was right oin some respects. ok anyway i move now to the final battle, we take down a reaper yey i was happy about that, then we get to the transport beam, and harbinger shoots us all (i had EVI and the Prothian with me at this point, remember that coz it beings up an issue with the ending), everyone is either dead of dieing on the floor, im walking ever so dam slowly to the light (pause and stumble for dramatic effect, love that part by the way) get onto the ship, find anderson by crawling over dead bodies, meet illusive man

[Danse Macabre]

, shoot him, activate the lift to the catalyst, talk to the annoying VI star child who is pretending to be the kid i saw die back on earth who was haunting my dreams, wanted to kill it coz it said it was controlling the reapers who where as the game said ALL in earths orbit protecting the Citadel, game didnt lets me, dam if that was an option all the reapers would of been dealt with and nothing else would of been effected, oh well guess that option would of meant a massive battle between shep and the galaxies biggest bad ass rogue VI known as the catalyst. so then im left with 3 options, option 1 kill reapers (bad thing is i let one of my most fav me2 companions die to free the geth, and i just love how EDI evoled and doing this woulld kill them all, so that wasnt an option to me), option 2 try control them but die in the process, now i saw what happened to david when he was connected to synthetics, and wasnt about to let that happen to me and the reapers so not an option either, that leaves me with 1 alternative option 3 again involving my death but making all organics and synthetics a mix of the two (this is the only viable option to me but also made me feel bad for the companion i romanced and left behind, also for steve who had a mega crush on me for helping him get over his past losses, so not only has he lost his husband in this was but now his best friend too, poor poor guy) you know i actually cried at the end of this, and am in a love hate relationship with it. so i think people have over reacted with the ending and not spent enough time on the side quests, coz when you play the whole game oh and by that i mean ME1,2,3 and all DLC for all 3, then the ending of ME3 will actually make sense to you as they did for me, and i hate to say it, life isnt fair, you cant expect a everyone lives happily ever after just as they did before the reapers shown up for the harvest, coz no that just isnt how the reality works out, and gived this game is meant to be in a realistic fantasy futuristic setting i cant see them polishing over the end so you all live and everything is honky-dory once more.

[SalsaDMA]

Kailord wrote...

There is a very important reason why the endings should be changed ASAP. Refer to this thread:

http://social.biowar...dex/10036548/32

In short I will quote what I stated there, and I urge Bioware to seriously consider the implications reveiled therein:

"I wonder why all the news and gaming magazines did not get it. The ending definitely has strong tones of racism, which borders on the unacceptable. And Shepard is given no other option as to play along these lines. I don´t get it why they complain about naked bodies in ME1, but this issue totally escapes them.

You can easily prove this thesis by replacing the word "organic" by "white people" and the word "synthetic" by "black people". I was really shocked when I finally came to realize this.

Maybe the synthesis ending symbolizes the way out of this predicament, by symbolizing the merging of cultures which ultimately eliminates racism. But the context seems plain wrong, as it is placed a forced upon sollution, and it also removes cultural differences as a whole. Again, this is something which leans strongly to the philosophy of racism. I am scared, now. "

Ouch... I don't browse the spoiler forum much since I can't post in it, so I hadn't spotted that one.

But..

Ouch...

That gotta sting, cause the way I see it, his character asesment of the "star brat" is spot on.

Some explaining is needed by the writers why they decided to throw out the underlying themes of co-existence in the series to pull a fast one like what the ending turned out to be regarding that kind of ideas.

[Schmitty23]

Just finished the game. Was really enjoying it up till the ending. I have to say I agree with almost every point (and there are SOOO many) brought up by the previous posters, from the gaping plot holes to the unresolved story. One of the biggest problems for me was complete lack of ramifications in terms of Paragon\\Renegade decisions, and the slightest difference in the ending. Three games across many years warranted much better effort. So count me in with those who feel angry about the end.

Also, having played the game, I want to add that the Ashes DLC should have been included with the main game and I feel completely ripped off that I had to pay for this. The Prothean plot line is integral to the game and making people pay to experience the DLC was an awful business decision.

I for one am probably not going to buy any more DLC, or for that matter, given DA2 and this ending, possibly any more Bioware\\EA games.

[aries1001]

So, you're arguing now - some of you at least - that synthethics such as EDI etc. are - ehm - people now? And to be seen and treated as such? That synthetcis sucs as the geth, and maybe even the reapers?, are not just machines, but sentient beings, and therefore worthy of not getting -ehm- wiped out?

[SalsaDMA]

aries1001 wrote...

So, you're arguing now - some of you at least - that synthethics such as EDI etc. are - ehm - people now? And to be seen and treated as such? That synthetcis sucs as the geth, and maybe even the reapers?, are not just machines, but sentient beings, and therefore worthy of not getting -ehm- wiped out?

They're portrayed as people in the game.

[Getorex]

WolfyZA wrote...

http://i2.kym-cdn.co...272/942/ddc.jpg 

Poor Dave.  He actually has to LIVE a totally f*cked up ("artsy") ending.  He's tooling along in a fine, rational movie and then WHAMO!  Suddenly he's in a hallucinagenic sh*tstorm fueled by the DTs and LSD (with a nice does of fever thrown in).

Poor, poor Dave.  Now we all have gotten to almost first hand experience his nightmare by playing through the ME3 ending. 

Dave...you and me, we're bros.

[Getorex]

aries1001 wrote...

So, you're arguing now - some of you at least - that synthethics such as EDI etc. are - ehm - people now? And to be seen and treated as such? That synthetcis sucs as the geth, and maybe even the reapers?, are not just machines, but sentient beings, and therefore worthy of not getting -ehm- wiped out?

Did you even play the game?  ME2 and ME3 show the Geth to be MUCH more than "just synthetics".  They are not merely smart toasters.  They are intentionally shown as sentient.  Look up "sentient" and you will see it has absolutely no requirement that it only be applied to organics.  Sentience has nothing to do with being nice, or pleasant, or peaceful.  Thus it CAN apply to the Reapers too.  

[Palas1978]

Danse Macabre wrote...
so i think people have over reacted with the ending and not spent enough time on the side quests, coz when you play the whole game oh and by that i mean ME1,2,3 and all DLC for all 3, then the ending of ME3 will actually make sense to you as they did for me, and i hate to say it, life isnt fair, you cant expect a everyone lives happily ever after just as they did before the reapers shown up for the harvest, coz no that just isnt how the reality works out, and gived this game is meant to be in a realistic fantasy futuristic setting i cant see them polishing over the end so you all live and everything is honky-dory once more.

i ve playd all 3 ME-games + DLC as well. I dit not expected that life is fair. If i must sacrifice Shep to save the galaxy, then i must be done. If i have to sacrifice a race like the geth or Krogans to save the other races, then this may be the price for victory and the continued exitence for the rest of the galaxy.

But if all feels wrong, because all has no logic. You did not even know, what happend to the galaxy. In the DLC Arrival the explosion of a mass effect relay destroys a whole solar-system. Now all Relays are destroyed - so the consequense ist, that many star-systems are burn to ashes. Was it this, i was figthing for? I dont think so

[Getorex]

Palas1978 wrote...

Danse Macabre wrote...
so i think people have over reacted with the ending and not spent enough time on the side quests, coz when you play the whole game oh and by that i mean ME1,2,3 and all DLC for all 3, then the ending of ME3 will actually make sense to you as they did for me, and i hate to say it, life isnt fair, you cant expect a everyone lives happily ever after just as they did before the reapers shown up for the harvest, coz no that just isnt how the reality works out, and gived this game is meant to be in a realistic fantasy futuristic setting i cant see them polishing over the end so you all live and everything is honky-dory once more.

i ve playd all 3 ME-games + DLC as well. I dit not expected that life is fair. If i must sacrifice Shep to save the galaxy, then i must be done. If i have to sacrifice a race like the geth or Krogans to save the other races, then this may be the price for victory and the continued exitence for the rest of the galaxy.

But if all feels wrong, because all has no logic. You did not even know, what happend to the galaxy. In the DLC Arrival the explosion of a mass effect relay destroys a whole solar-system. Now all Relays are destroyed - so the consequense ist, that many star-systems are burn to ashes. Was it this, i was figthing for? I dont think so

No.  I don't want sacrifice and only sacrifice (Shepard dead) because SOMEONE thinks that is the only ending out there or that it is the only artsy-fartsy ending or the only edgy ending.  IT IS A CLICHE ENDING.  No less a cliche than the Star Wars ending.  Done to death.  Since having a so-called "bittersweet" ending (meaning Shepard must die) is NOT "new", is NOT "creative", is NOT in tune with the entire rest of the series, it is not required at all.  

The BIGGEST reason not to ONLY have a dead Shepard ending is for replayability.  You HAVE to give players something to aim for, something to aspire to.  I do NOT aspire to death, death, or death.  I aspire the best possible ending for me (I am Shepard, as Shepard IS an alter-ego for any and all who play) and for my squad.  If the best I can get is 3 endings and they all lead to me dead, there goes replayability.  I already know I cannot "win" or do any better than dying so after dying once, there's no point in playing again and again or trying different decisions here or there.  

I don't pay $60 for a single-play game.  Anyone who does is a moron.  You should be RENTING the game for MUCH less than that $60 or $80, playing it once, and having done with it.

[chillinhills]

I only have one comment that does not give spoilers. The ending of this game puts me in mind of "Darth Vader stopped to help the farmer fix his tractor." In other words, it doesn't fit. There are entirely TOO many inconsistancies. The end of this game feels like the story writers and coders were getting tired and bored so they just whipped up a mish mash of crap and threw it into development. This is the second game this year (Star Wars: The Old Republic being the first), that I have played; put out by Bioware that I have thought of as a real let down. Mass Effect 3 is an awesome game, right up till the point where the decisions you made through ALL of the 100 plus hours of game play through all 3 of the Mass Effect games, results in a big old goose egg. It makes me wonder, why did I spend so much money buying all of these games? Why did I spend so much money buying DLC? Why did I spend so much time playing all of these games? Why did I replay Mass Effect AND Mass Effect 2 so that I could get the nearly perfect paragon ending that I didn't get. If this trend continues, I will quit looking to Bioware for my gaming enjoyment.

Modifié par chillinhills, 27 mars 2012 - 08:26 .

[IS1991]

It was an awesome ending! to a toddler who likes nice colours.

[ile_1979]

Kailord wrote...

ile_1979 wrote...

Kailord wrote...

.............. "

......

Copied from wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism)
"Racism" and "racial discrimination" are often used to describe discrimination on an ethnic or cultural basis, independent of their somatic (i.e., "racial") differences. According to the United Nations conventions, there is no distinction between the term racial discrimination and ethnicity discrimination."

Huh! This was actually  news to me. Maybe because of me not being a native english speaker. Where i come from we have distinctive terms for all those different forms of discrimination (not that it stops us from practicing them:sick:)

[Balduran Elsdragon]

"Great is the art of beginning, but greater is the art of ending."

Like a lot of people who grew up in the 90’s, I came in contact with adventure and rpg games where the main focus was story and ambience. Among the most prominent I count the Baldur’s Gate saga, Fallout 1&2, Torment, Blade Runner, Broken Sword, Ocarina of Time, Majora’s Mask, The Witcher, ...


Today I’m still playing all of these games. I can get fully immersed in the experience and empathize with the characters which makes it so damn hard to say goodbye. While each ending feels bittersweet, I can easily replay the games because there is closure. People move on or to say it blunt, book closed - continue in a sequel.


I have to admit, when I played DA:Origins and the ME series, I could feel the same sparks as the characters and story are well-built. The stories had a climax.


When I look at the endings in ME3 separately, they are very emotional, which is for me heavily due to the overall feeling of sacrifice, the music and the flashbacks. A sad ending does not necessarily mean a bad ending and it’s
basically nothing other than what I’d expected of the series.

However, and this is ofcourse my personal point of view, an ending makes or breaks a story. Therefore, when writing the last of a series, it’s often the very first thing you start with.

My criticism is the same as with Dragon Age 2. I didn’t feel closure with Mass Effect 3 (unless Bioware was planning on a ME MMORPG, which is the overall feeling I’m starting to get after the online part). Shepard just listening to the Catalyst, Normandy running away from the scene, it feels completely out of character, much like the decisions which you made throughout Dragon Age 2 didn’t make a difference in which side supports *you* in the end battle.

The ending is artistic, emotional even, I’ll definitely give it that but there’s not much difference in the outcome. After DA 2, ME 3 is without a doubt the last time I pre-ordered from Bioware / EA.

Modifié par Balduran Elsdragon, 27 mars 2012 - 10:41 .