7052 réponses à ce sujet

[Tehzim]

I just wanted to say that I have been playing BioWare games back to Neverwinter Nights. I jumped at the chance to enter the Mass Effect universe. I've spent over 300 hours across more than one system just making new Sheps and making different decisions and watching them play out. That is why the ending for 3 hurt. All had been for naught, nothing mattered. I'm not mad, just very sad. Here is why.

I had made many decisions over the course of the trilogy (save the Krogan, save the Rachni, full survival of the suicide mission) and I even loved the little things (like Conrad Verner, Blasto, and Rebekah and Jacob). Seeing those pay off were spectacular. Thane's prayer got me misty-eyed. I was shocked by Virmire and to this day have trouble deciding who will die. I fought off Saren, destroyed the Collectors, and even worked for the hated Cerberus (never forget Kahoku). I loved every minute of it (except a couple of really annoying fights). So imagine my disappointment when none of these decisions paid off.

I drove the Mako, scanned planets, made tough world altering decisions. I saved Jack from herself, Grunt from his tank, and Legion from life as an experiment. I saved Garrus from his vengeful heart and helped to shape all my crew for the better I did my best to help the flotilla, saving Tali and her father's legacy. Miranda warmed and I even got the sniffles when she went to talk to her sister. I did every loyalty mission, and they were all special. Hell, I even denied Zaeed his revenge, saved the people in the refinery and still had enough Paragon (well cultivated) to keep him loyal.

I didn't just play your game, I lived in the galaxy you created, fell in love with it, and spent many hours in it. I fought to save it, even when no one believed it could be done. Again and again, my crew and I did the impossible. I asked questions like "what does it mean to be alive" or "what is a soul?" I felt the burden of command and was a mother/father to my crew.

I cheered when EDI got a body, Tali got drunk and teased Javik, and when Mordin made offhand comments about things like Varren based STDs on the Normandy. I drank with Chakwas and we shared our scars. I played cards with Gabby and Ken. When Kelly fell, I was there to catch her. And when the Collectors stole my crew, I powered in and took them back.

I spanned the galaxy fighting for just a chance to defeat the Reapers. I forged alliances that began the healing of thousands of years of hatred and mistrust. I saved people I didn't like and had to leave some I cared about to die (RIP Kaiden). I built an armada. The Drell would be there with their Hanar masters, The living weapon platform Elcors would trudge inexorably toward victory or death. The Geth, with their alliance with the Quarians would bring the combined might of their fleets and technology to disrupt the enemy at every turn. The vengeful Asari would blast enemies apart avenging my failure on Thessia. The Salarians would revolt against the dalatrass and show up when and where needed most to make trouble (such is the STG way).

All my squadmates made it to the end. I saved them all. They would be there with me or with their respective armies leading the fight. Together we would banish the Reapers or die trying.

But I didn't get to see any of that. I don't know what happened to any of those people. I never saw the war. There was neither victory or defeat. I didn't fire the Crucible at the darkest moment to save the day. I didn't have the option NOT to fire it, to choose to let everyone live together and fight to the death. Perhaps if I had all my assets we might even win. I would gladly have sacrificed myself for this. I was ready to die, as I had been from day one. I had to do it. Someone else might have gotten it wrong.

All I got was a color shifted cutscene that made no sense. Even if I died indoctrinated I should have got to see the war, to know what became of the people and the world that I loved. Did I really doom all life by destroying the Mass Relays? When I synthesized with the Crucible did I make a difference? I don't know. Everything I did, every decision made, every love and enemy saved or lost, every compromise, every minor decision, every character I pulled along to the end, was for nothing.

Collector base saved or destroyed? No difference. Did everyone or just one person survive the Suicide mission. No difference. Did the Rachni come to me in my hour of need or disappear into the ether? Doesn't matter. Did I lead a paragon's life or was I a violent and psychopathic renedgade? Who cares? Nothing I did mattered. It just came down to a two minute cutscene that may or may not have been a dream/indoctrination/whatever and three choices that didn't take into account the 300+ hours of work I did in moulding my world and everyone I touched.

So yeah, you can play ME3 without playing the others because nothing you did in the other two really matters in the end. I feel betrayed but more than that I feel incomplete and very sad. I haven't written anything before about this because I thought perhaps I was overreacting or that no one would read it. But I'm laying it on the line because I want to know the fate of the world I loved and the people in it. If you could give me a cutscene or a slide show like ME 2: Genesis that would be fine. I don't want a big DLC or even to change the ending. Just give me what I fought for and what I earned, even if it fails.

Don't leave me 5 years and 300+ hours of gameplay hanging out in dark space. It's the right thing to do and only fair. Don't make this love letter a Dear John.

Sorry this post was so long, I just had to tell you how I felt and I hope you listened. Thanks.

[FyreSyder]

This was posted by 
CDRSkyShepard here: http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/9851623 
But I feel it must be in this thread aswell just in the likely event that BW doesn't see it.

"
The Guardian/Catalyst/Starchild

What is it, exactly? We get that the kid was a visual representation of the Guardian, but there is so much that isn’t explained. Who or what was the Guardian? What was its origin? Obviously, the answer helps us understand more about the Reapers, but we’re never given that answer. The Guardian’s justification for creating the Reapers to “end the cycle” raises questions in of itself. What’s the Guardian’s story specifically? We’re left to kind of figure that one out for ourselves. An “Investigate” option would have been really handy right there at the end.

Where are the “Wildly Divergent Endings?”

Okay, so there are variations on Earth being destroyed/not destroyed within the three ending choices we can make: Control, Destroy, and Synergy. You can Control the Reapers and send them back to dark space, you can Destroy the Reapers (and consequently the geth/other synthetic life) at the risk of the cycle eventually starting over again, or you can Synergize...you can somehow combine the synthetic and organic, so that a mutual understanding can be reached and true peace can finally be achieved. Shepard can live in two of the Destroy endings if your Effective Military Strength is high enough (the variable being what happens to Anderson). Effectively, though, the same things happen: the Reapers are stopped, the mass relays are destroyed, the allied fleet is stuck at Earth, and the Normandy somehow crashes. The implications for the future might be different in the three endings, but the immediate consequences are all the same. 

'Gilligan’s Planet'

This is the fate of the Normandy SR-2 and her crew: when the mass relays are destroyed, the Normandy is caught in transit between two relays (more on the “how in the world did that happen?” later) and is thrown out, ultimately crashing on a tropical planet. This is a point that has a lot of people irked, myself included. In my own case, if BioWare was willing to fix just this ONE thing, I’d be perfectly happy with everything else the way it is. 

Why is it such a problem? We spent the better part of three epic games building relationships with our crew, the other characters in the story. We were even encouraged to do so: there were great rewards to be won. Some characters we could fall in love with, others we had to gain their loyalty in order to survive a mission that would have otherwise been a suicide mission. In encouraging these interactions, BioWare built up a huge theme of friendship - a sense of true togetherness - that really catapulted the Mass Effect story above and beyond other sci-fi and video game stories. Now, if our Shepards are alive, they will most likely never see their friends again. No one knows where they are, and FTL travel at its fastest will still make a cross-galaxy journey take decades even if the Normandy somehow became operational again or a rescue party was sent out. 

Joker bugging out of a huge battle also seems pretty cowardly. Why would he do that? It just isn't in Joker's nature to do something like this; he has stood by Shep no matter what...but at the very end he bugs out? I can't figure out how any of that is supposed to make sense. 

There are many people who are not happy they won’t have their “happily ever after” with their LI. Whether or not that should happen or if it’s too “happy” of an ending is a different debate for a different day (some of the LIs are on Earth still, so that is a possibility for some options). What I’m most concerned about are the characters I’ve come to care about after hundreds of hours invested into their stories. We’ve already permanently lost several beloved characters, why can’t we be able to share our victory with the ones we have left? They were by our side in the beginning...they should be there at the end. Everything is already bittersweet enough without this.

Plot Holes

Plot holes everywhere. Shepard is supposed to live during one of the Destroy endings...but the Citadel is blown to smithereens. How in the world is he/she supposed to survive that? Does he/she get magically teleported back to London? Speaking of the Citadel, why didn't the Reapers just take control of the mass relay network when they took control of the Citadel? In the Control ending, why do the relays have to be destroyed? How does Shepard get them back to dark space? Normandy just in time to be flung across the galaxy? Why in the world is the Normandy using a mass relay when the relays get destroyed, leading to its subsequent crash and stranding the crew? Surely Joker wouldn’t take the Normandy away from the battle, especially at its most dire. Is there food for Tali and Garrus on Gilligan's Planet? Questions, questions, and more questions.

Of any issue previously listed, this one sorely needs to be addressed. We were told loose ends would all be tied up. I would assume that means the plot should be airtight, as well. You can’t just leave us scratching our heads trying to figure out what’s going on. BioWare, you tell the stories; it’s up to you to tell them in a way that makes sense. With all these plot holes, the ending just flat-out didn’t make sense.

Organics and AIs: Coexistence Impossible?

Shepard is the one force in the galaxy that can finally end the Reaper threat. In the end he/she accepts the Guardian's options as his/her only options. He/she accepts the Guardian's logic that AIs will only ever destroy their creators. This is a soldier who has defied all odds and got the quarians and geth to work together peacefully. Shepard knows that the geth are perfectly willing to co-exist peacefully. Despite all this, Shepard has no choice in the matter? He/she must either destroy them, control them, or forcibly (with no one else's consent) merge the two? This makes no sense, and is out of character for Shepard, who is naturally an inquisitive being that always wants to find the best path for everyone.

Lack of closure

We were told the ending of the trilogy would bring closure. It didn’t, not for a lot of people. It left us empty, confused, and in some cases, sick to the stomach. Endings should be inspired, even bittersweet...but not confusing. You can’t have a satisfying ending that brings closure to a series when it raises more questions than it answers. Given the complicated nature of variables in this game trilogy, it would probably be very difficult to give us anything terribly detailed, but we need...something. We need answers of some kind, not the questions we currently have.

Where do we go from here?

I'm not talking prequels. I want to know what this means for the future. What is going to happen to the Mass Effect universe now? The relays are all destroyed and galactic civilization is devastated...any story that happens after this trilogy is going to have to answer for that. The fans want to know how all of this is going to work moving forward.

Was the galaxy worth saving?

In its current state, it seems like it was almost more worth trying to give the next cycle a fighting chance and go down fighting the Reapers, possibly softening them up, instead of leaving galactic civilization the way it was after the end of ME3. Sacrifice was going to be necessary...but all of civilization now seems to be doomed. In the end, the player is wondering if it was all really worth it.

Abandoned Themes

Themes of hope and unified diversity. Themes of never giving up and friendship. All of these are thrown out the window in the last 10 minutes in favor of themes of despair, loss, and inevitability of defeat. Sure, we knew that taking down the Reapers would involve the themes of loss and despair, but if ME1 and ME2 taught us anything, it's that we can stare those evils down and come through triuphant regardless of how hopless things look.
"

Modifié par FyreSyder, 18 mars 2012 - 02:21 .

[Lili_oups]

 what a question......
The ending OFC....ASAP
Make the illusion/indoctrination TRUE
Harbinger conversation-fight....(this bad @ss need to be destroyed by US)

Modifié par Lili_oups, 18 mars 2012 - 02:21 .

[Lili_oups]

pomrink wrote...

Indoctrination theory being correct, then showing us what happens afterwards, with the extra bonus that we will never find out the reapers motivations(they  need to stay unknowable, otherwise it cheapens them).

Edit: Also, with an epilogue of sorts, no mass relay explosion (unless you fail), potential failure like promised (i.e. reapers win), and maybe possibly a golden ending with shep living, but very hard to get?

Edit: Golden ending with shep living would hopefully be with LI....

I'd be willing to shell out.


This page has a good list of our problems with the ending.
http://social.biowar...5/index/9851623

This ^^

[Lili_oups]

FyreSyder wrote...

This was posted by 
CDRSkyShepard here: http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/9851623 
But I feel it must be in this thread aswell just in the likely event that BW doesn't see it.

"
The Guardian/Catalyst/Starchild

What is it, exactly? We get that the kid was a visual representation of the Guardian, but there is so much that isn’t explained. Who or what was the Guardian? What was its origin? Obviously, the answer helps us understand more about the Reapers, but we’re never given that answer. The Guardian’s justification for creating the Reapers to “end the cycle” raises questions in of itself. What’s the Guardian’s story specifically? We’re left to kind of figure that one out for ourselves. An “Investigate” option would have been really handy right there at the end.

Where are the “Wildly Divergent Endings?”

Okay, so there are variations on Earth being destroyed/not destroyed within the three ending choices we can make: Control, Destroy, and Synergy. You can Control the Reapers and send them back to dark space, you can Destroy the Reapers (and consequently the geth/other synthetic life) at the risk of the cycle eventually starting over again, or you can Synergize...you can somehow combine the synthetic and organic, so that a mutual understanding can be reached and true peace can finally be achieved. Shepard can live in two of the Destroy endings if your Effective Military Strength is high enough (the variable being what happens to Anderson). Effectively, though, the same things happen: the Reapers are stopped, the mass relays are destroyed, the allied fleet is stuck at Earth, and the Normandy somehow crashes. The implications for the future might be different in the three endings, but the immediate consequences are all the same. 

'Gilligan’s Planet'

This is the fate of the Normandy SR-2 and her crew: when the mass relays are destroyed, the Normandy is caught in transit between two relays (more on the “how in the world did that happen?” later) and is thrown out, ultimately crashing on a tropical planet. This is a point that has a lot of people irked, myself included. In my own case, if BioWare was willing to fix just this ONE thing, I’d be perfectly happy with everything else the way it is. 

Why is it such a problem? We spent the better part of three epic games building relationships with our crew, the other characters in the story. We were even encouraged to do so: there were great rewards to be won. Some characters we could fall in love with, others we had to gain their loyalty in order to survive a mission that would have otherwise been a suicide mission. In encouraging these interactions, BioWare built up a huge theme of friendship - a sense of true togetherness - that really catapulted the Mass Effect story above and beyond other sci-fi and video game stories. Now, if our Shepards are alive, they will most likely never see their friends again. No one knows where they are, and FTL travel at its fastest will still make a cross-galaxy journey take decades even if the Normandy somehow became operational again or a rescue party was sent out. 

Joker bugging out of a huge battle also seems pretty cowardly. Why would he do that? It just isn't in Joker's nature to do something like this; he has stood by Shep no matter what...but at the very end he bugs out? I can't figure out how any of that is supposed to make sense. 

There are many people who are not happy they won’t have their “happily ever after” with their LI. Whether or not that should happen or if it’s too “happy” of an ending is a different debate for a different day (some of the LIs are on Earth still, so that is a possibility for some options). What I’m most concerned about are the characters I’ve come to care about after hundreds of hours invested into their stories. We’ve already permanently lost several beloved characters, why can’t we be able to share our victory with the ones we have left? They were by our side in the beginning...they should be there at the end. Everything is already bittersweet enough without this.

Plot Holes

Plot holes everywhere. Shepard is supposed to live during one of the Destroy endings...but the Citadel is blown to smithereens. How in the world is he/she supposed to survive that? Does he/she get magically teleported back to London? Speaking of the Citadel, why didn't the Reapers just take control of the mass relay network when they took control of the Citadel? In the Control ending, why do the relays have to be destroyed? How does Shepard get them back to dark space? Normandy just in time to be flung across the galaxy? Why in the world is the Normandy using a mass relay when the relays get destroyed, leading to its subsequent crash and stranding the crew? Surely Joker wouldn’t take the Normandy away from the battle, especially at its most dire. Is there food for Tali and Garrus on Gilligan's Planet? Questions, questions, and more questions.

Of any issue previously listed, this one sorely needs to be addressed. We were told loose ends would all be tied up. I would assume that means the plot should be airtight, as well. You can’t just leave us scratching our heads trying to figure out what’s going on. BioWare, you tell the stories; it’s up to you to tell them in a way that makes sense. With all these plot holes, the ending just flat-out didn’t make sense.

Organics and AIs: Coexistence Impossible?

Shepard is the one force in the galaxy that can finally end the Reaper threat. In the end he/she accepts the Guardian's options as his/her only options. He/she accepts the Guardian's logic that AIs will only ever destroy their creators. This is a soldier who has defied all odds and got the quarians and geth to work together peacefully. Shepard knows that the geth are perfectly willing to co-exist peacefully. Despite all this, Shepard has no choice in the matter? He/she must either destroy them, control them, or forcibly (with no one else's consent) merge the two? This makes no sense, and is out of character for Shepard, who is naturally an inquisitive being that always wants to find the best path for everyone.

Lack of closure

We were told the ending of the trilogy would bring closure. It didn’t, not for a lot of people. It left us empty, confused, and in some cases, sick to the stomach. Endings should be inspired, even bittersweet...but not confusing. You can’t have a satisfying ending that brings closure to a series when it raises more questions than it answers. Given the complicated nature of variables in this game trilogy, it would probably be very difficult to give us anything terribly detailed, but we need...something. We need answers of some kind, not the questions we currently have.

Where do we go from here?

I'm not talking prequels. I want to know what this means for the future. What is going to happen to the Mass Effect universe now? The relays are all destroyed and galactic civilization is devastated...any story that happens after this trilogy is going to have to answer for that. The fans want to know how all of this is going to work moving forward.

Was the galaxy worth saving?

In its current state, it seems like it was almost more worth trying to give the next cycle a fighting chance and go down fighting the Reapers, possibly softening them up, instead of leaving galactic civilization the way it was after the end of ME3. Sacrifice was going to be necessary...but all of civilization now seems to be doomed. In the end, the player is wondering if it was all really worth it.

Abandoned Themes

Themes of hope and unified diversity. Themes of never giving up and friendship. All of these are thrown out the window in the last 10 minutes in favor of themes of despair, loss, and inevitability of defeat. Sure, we knew that taking down the Reapers would involve the themes of loss and despair, but if ME1 and ME2 taught us anything, it's that we can stare those evils down and come through triuphant regardless of how hopless things look.
"

Agreed completely in everything

[Cloud Windfoot Omega]

ReiCow wrote...

My biggest anger and disappointment with the game has to do with the Tali (and other Quarians) reveal. If Tali is a romance character, and one is pro Quarian or pro Geth & Quarians in their selections, we see her take her mask off numerous times... with her back to the screen. Every single time. (We also see other Quarians remove their masks.. again backs to the screen.) This was an acceptable tease in ME2, as we knew there was one more game, but to have no reveal in these scenes was a MAJOR disappointment. I literally seethed when this kept happening, and all I had was the photograph. Even the "love scene" was a major let down, in that we never got a peak of anything under the suit... every time she is facing the camera, she has the stinking mask on. Each time she removed her mask, back turned the screen, it increasingly felt like a cruel joke was being played on me.

The photograph felt like further insult as it is obviously a photoshop of some stock photo, which in and of itself, I'm rather apathetic about. However, given the above lack of reveals, it felt very much like an afterthought, as if no one cared at all about it. It reeked of laziness and apathy.

I would dearly love to see proper Quarian reveals patched in. A more revealing love scene would be icing.

Regarding the game's ending, I believe the Indoctrination Theory and that you guys will be releasing a free DLC with the rest of the game (and, thus, actual ending), so I only feel a need to point out my hurt at the Tali/Quarian reveals.

Moo.

the picture just made her look too human too. 

[Ham Solo]

I doubt cerberus could have salvaged anything from the collector base after that explosion, so... put away your reaper tech and human reaper.

Modifié par Ham Solo, 18 mars 2012 - 02:31 .

[ReiCow]

Cloud Windfoot Omega wrote...

ReiCow wrote...

My biggest anger and disappointment with the game has to do with the Tali (and other Quarians) reveal. If Tali is a romance character, and one is pro Quarian or pro Geth & Quarians in their selections, we see her take her mask off numerous times... with her back to the screen. Every single time. (We also see other Quarians remove their masks.. again backs to the screen.) This was an acceptable tease in ME2, as we knew there was one more game, but to have no reveal in these scenes was a MAJOR disappointment. I literally seethed when this kept happening, and all I had was the photograph. Even the "love scene" was a major let down, in that we never got a peak of anything under the suit... every time she is facing the camera, she has the stinking mask on. Each time she removed her mask, back turned the screen, it increasingly felt like a cruel joke was being played on me.

The photograph felt like further insult as it is obviously a photoshop of some stock photo, which in and of itself, I'm rather apathetic about. However, given the above lack of reveals, it felt very much like an afterthought, as if no one cared at all about it. It reeked of laziness and apathy.

I would dearly love to see proper Quarian reveals patched in. A more revealing love scene would be icing.

Regarding the game's ending, I believe the Indoctrination Theory and that you guys will be releasing a free DLC with the rest of the game (and, thus, actual ending), so I only feel a need to point out my hurt at the Tali/Quarian reveals.

Moo.

the picture just made her look too human too. 

I actually don't mind how human she (and the quarians) look or don't look. I take that as artistic license in the universe creation. I do mind that Commander Sheppard (who is ME) saw her face many times, and *I* didn't. I only saw "myself" seing her. Insultingly frustrating.

Moo.

[Cloud Windfoot Omega]

ReiCow wrote...

Cloud Windfoot Omega wrote...

ReiCow wrote...

My biggest anger and disappointment with the game has to do with the Tali (and other Quarians) reveal. If Tali is a romance character, and one is pro Quarian or pro Geth & Quarians in their selections, we see her take her mask off numerous times... with her back to the screen. Every single time. (We also see other Quarians remove their masks.. again backs to the screen.) This was an acceptable tease in ME2, as we knew there was one more game, but to have no reveal in these scenes was a MAJOR disappointment. I literally seethed when this kept happening, and all I had was the photograph. Even the "love scene" was a major let down, in that we never got a peak of anything under the suit... every time she is facing the camera, she has the stinking mask on. Each time she removed her mask, back turned the screen, it increasingly felt like a cruel joke was being played on me.

The photograph felt like further insult as it is obviously a photoshop of some stock photo, which in and of itself, I'm rather apathetic about. However, given the above lack of reveals, it felt very much like an afterthought, as if no one cared at all about it. It reeked of laziness and apathy.

I would dearly love to see proper Quarian reveals patched in. A more revealing love scene would be icing.

Regarding the game's ending, I believe the Indoctrination Theory and that you guys will be releasing a free DLC with the rest of the game (and, thus, actual ending), so I only feel a need to point out my hurt at the Tali/Quarian reveals.

Moo.

the picture just made her look too human too. 

I actually don't mind how human she (and the quarians) look or don't look. I take that as artistic license in the universe creation. I do mind that Commander Sheppard (who is ME) saw her face many times, and *I* didn't. I only saw "myself" seing her. Insultingly frustrating.

Moo.

well personally,  the first insault was making it so we cant see them the seccond was using the easiest solution (human like features) the skin and such.

i was kinda expecting diffence like every species in the game.  hell they are way diffrent then us  just read up on their genetics

[Tarnation007]

Yes, I have posted here before. No, this post won't be very long.

I would like the option to romance Vega. Considering femShep only has one male LI available (Kaidan) to newly romance in the game, I (along with others too) would like Vega to be added to that small list. I know there are female options available, which I fully support, but that's not for me. So may I please ask why we only have the option of one male LI, when we have a lovely Mr Vega just begging to be romanced (and broSheps have Liara, Ash, & Allers as new romancables).

On a positive note: I found the romances to be lovely, heart-felt and well written, which is why I would like this option of LI Vega.

[ReiCow]

Cloud Windfoot Omega wrote...

ReiCow wrote...

Cloud Windfoot Omega wrote...

ReiCow wrote...

My biggest anger and disappointment with the game has to do with the Tali (and other Quarians) reveal. If Tali is a romance character, and one is pro Quarian or pro Geth & Quarians in their selections, we see her take her mask off numerous times... with her back to the screen. Every single time. (We also see other Quarians remove their masks.. again backs to the screen.) This was an acceptable tease in ME2, as we knew there was one more game, but to have no reveal in these scenes was a MAJOR disappointment. I literally seethed when this kept happening, and all I had was the photograph. Even the "love scene" was a major let down, in that we never got a peak of anything under the suit... every time she is facing the camera, she has the stinking mask on. Each time she removed her mask, back turned the screen, it increasingly felt like a cruel joke was being played on me.

The photograph felt like further insult as it is obviously a photoshop of some stock photo, which in and of itself, I'm rather apathetic about. However, given the above lack of reveals, it felt very much like an afterthought, as if no one cared at all about it. It reeked of laziness and apathy.

I would dearly love to see proper Quarian reveals patched in. A more revealing love scene would be icing.

Regarding the game's ending, I believe the Indoctrination Theory and that you guys will be releasing a free DLC with the rest of the game (and, thus, actual ending), so I only feel a need to point out my hurt at the Tali/Quarian reveals.

Moo.

the picture just made her look too human too. 

I actually don't mind how human she (and the quarians) look or don't look. I take that as artistic license in the universe creation. I do mind that Commander Sheppard (who is ME) saw her face many times, and *I* didn't. I only saw "myself" seing her. Insultingly frustrating.

Moo.

well personally,  the first insault was making it so we cant see them the seccond was using the easiest solution (human like features) the skin and such.

i was kinda expecting diffence like every species in the game.  hell they are way diffrent then us  just read up on their genetics

That is a fair point, I definitely buy the notion that it adds to the sense of laziness, disregard for the fans, and thoughtlessness regarding Tali's reveal. If we had that face in a proper reveal, however, I'd have no issue with it.

Moo.

[Shepp2230]

I made a post several days ago with my thoughts and will repost here:

I think Ross Lincoln's article on Gamefront: "Mass Effect 3 Ending-Hatred: 5 Reasons The Fans Are Right" sums it up the best. I'm also going to assume that Bioware doesn't have any plans already in place to alter the ending.

I think that everyone who is unhappy with the ending can agree that the game is good, if not great, right up until the final scene on the Citidel. If I were to change the ending that is where I would start. After taking the elevator ride up the the Catalyst I would can the three choices all together. The coversation between Shepard and the Catalyst would talk about the Reapers being their "solution" but since organics have found a way to construct the Crucible they have earned the right to come up with their own solution. The Catalyst would then tell Shepard that an organic lifeforce is neaded to kick-start the whole process. Shepard would then walk into the light and the end would start. I imagine a scene where Mordin, Thane, and any other teammate who died along the way is waiting to greet Shepard on the other side. After starting the Crucible the Reapers are stopped, completing the mission you started three games ago. The Citidel isn't destroyed, the Mass Relays aren't destroyed, the Normandy doesn't crash land, and some old guy isn't telling stories to his gandkid.

The galaxy would left to rebuild based on the decisions that Shepard has made over the course of three games. It really doesn't need to be anything more elabotate than a slide show with some narration. Sort of like the end of the original "Fallout". It would explain what happened to all of the major races and characters from the series. How everyone ended up would have a couple of possibilites based on what you did throughout the game.

A small example would be the Krogan. Did Wrex and Eve both survive? Did you cure the genophage? If the answer to those questions is yes, then a good ending would reflect a resurgent Krogan race whose expansionist tendancies are kept in check by Wrex and Eve. A middle ending would be if either Wrex or Eve survived. A bad ending would be Wreave leading a cured Krogan and they would become the next great menace of the galaxy.

Each of the surviving major characters would get a blurb about what happened to them after the war. There might be a couple of possibilites for each depending how their race ended up or if they were a love intertest.

I understand the process would get a little tricky when you look at all of the different variables involved but I doubt it would be impossible. An ending like this would maintain the "Shepard dies" ending that Bioware obviously wanted, it would fulfill the promise of multiple possible endings based on what you've done throughout the series, and it would give closure to the fans who want to know what happens to everyone.

[Blackgate456]

The ending needs changing. I agree on that. The endings does not make me feel like the hero I was in ME1 and ME 2. So I would like a sort of "happy ending" where Shepard lives and can join his or her Li and see the rest of the team again. Also I would like to see how their live progresses a bit ("Garrus+ Tali" for example). You can make it hard to achieve no problem but make it ONE possibility. If you did not so well during the game maybe you die but the galaxy is saved or the Reapers ar winning in the end.

Also I want a resume like in the epilogue of the Fallout Games where you can see what your decisions have changed for the better (or for the worse).

And perhaps you can improve the romances. I liked my Romance with Liara a lot, especially later in the game because is was intimate. But before that It seemed that at the expense of new players, people that romanced a character for two games had to suffer a leck of depth in the middle of their romance. Its not very romantic to be called "friend" four times in a conversation with Liara even if your romanced her in ME 1 and reclaimed it inME 2? And a bug prevents her from remembering you get back together in ME 2, but it is of less important so you will never fix it? If it is so minor you could chang it in a heart beat.

All of this only to give people the opportunity to back down to romance someone else? Liara does not seems very interested in Shepard if she is totally ok if Shepard would say "Naaa lets just be friends I decided different in the last five minutes."

For the rest of the game I would say thank you Bioware! Their were many awesome moments to remember.

[killzorattack]

There are a great deal of intelligently written and lengthy posts in this and other forums so I will make this short.

I would love to have a new ending. I love the series and will be so disappointed if it ended this way.

[ThatGuy777]

Kittenpirate wrote...

I want my blue babies.

That is all.

My name is Commander Shepard, and I approve of this message.

I would love to see some "life goes back to normal" epilogue DLC, no mass relay destruction preferred. I also believe giving the love interest subplots a chance to come to a more positive conclusion would be great. Blue babies indeed.

[glacier1701]

nikola8 wrote...

Killer3000ad wrote...

YOu want some feedback? How about the issue of who is the minority/majority?
What people don't realize is that the forums are a good indication of the larger audience and polls conducted here are quite a good sample. Example, the infamous FemShep facebook poll last year. The facebook poll had about 73,744 total likes. Meanwhile a separate BSN poll was run by the community which had 2178 votes.

Facebook poll http://www.facebook....035.85811091644
FemShep 1:8047 = 10.9%
FemShep 2:5355 = 7.3%
FemShep 3:11447 = 15.5 %
FemShep 4:13266 = 18%
FemShep 5:31931 = 43.3 %
FemShep 6:3698 = 5%

Now look at the BSN poll
http://social.biowar...31/polls/22498/
FemShep 1= 14%
FemShep 2= 8%
FemShep 3= 12 %
FemShep 4= 17%
FemShep 5= 42%
FemShep 6= 7%

See how close the numbers match? That the BSN poll with only 2178 votes closely followed the facebook poll with 73,744 likes. Now take a look at the BSN polls on the endings http://social.biowar...06/polls/28989/ and an outside poll conducted at http://www.computera...ioware-blow-it/

The numbers speak for themselves. So stop calling us 'some' or the minority. The fact of the matter is, based on these numbers, the ones who like the ending are in the clear minority, a very MINOR MINORITY!

While I don't doubt that a majority dislike the ending, polls are often highly deceiving.  When you play a game and like it, you don't instantly think "I need to go fill out a poll to say I liked it."  Whereas people who hated it are more likely to voice their complaint- the rule applies to games, stores, restaurants, etc.  The dissatisfied want their voices heard, whereas the satisfied are fine to just sit back.  Therefore, voluntary polls are usually not something to hang your hat on because only the angry will do them.  That said, I do believe that people who hate the ending are in the majority, but not in such a percentage as the poll indicates.

 Then you should educate yourself about polls about which there is a lot of information on the internet. Basically most market/poll/survey companies poll 1.000 people for their opinions on an issue. From the statistics analysis which stems from a theory 300 years old (and which has held up for that long) the fact is that the results of polling those people will have a margin of error of +/- 3% for 95% of the time. Granted that for the polls there are additional factors that have to be looked at that may bias the results but once the poll sample reaches 10,000 (which is has in the polls I've seen) the margin of error is now +/- 1%. 

  As shown above the polls do seem to correlate well and thus are good proof that 80+% of the player population of ME3 did not like the ending. This is a figure that is most probably being shown by BioWare's market researchers to their top people (Casey Hudson in particular) because it really means that ANY misstep in handling the problem could be catastrophic for the company. After all 1 negative opinion by a player translates into 67 people (another figure published by market researchers when they discuss how opinions affect other potential customers) being told about it and who are now much less likely to buy from the company. If the numbers of games shipped is correct and allowing for wastage etc there are perhaps 2 million people who dislike the endings which means that potentially 100 million people will hear about it and be less likely to buy the game or anything else from BioWare. These are numbers that should scare BioWare - quite literally this is their entire target population for games in the ME universe.


EDIT: Oh and as for suggested changes basically it has to be concerning the endings. Lots of great suggestions already but in a nutshell the endings need to reflect the choices made in the entire trilogy, fit with the themes presented within them and above all else make sense.

Modifié par glacier1701, 18 mars 2012 - 02:54 .

[Kanon777]

glacier1701 wrote...

 Then you should educate yourself about polls about which there is a lot of information on the internet. Basically most market/poll/survey companies poll 1.000 people for their opinions on an issue. From the statistics analysis which stems from a theory 300 years old (and which has held up for that long) the fact is that the results of polling those people will have a margin of error of +/- 3% for 95% of the time. Granted that for the polls there are additional factors that have to be looked at that may bias the results but once the poll sample reaches 10,000 (which is has in the polls I've seen) the margin of error is now +/- 1%. 

  As shown above the polls do seem to correlate well and thus are good proof that 80+% of the player population of ME3 did not like the ending. This is a figure that is most probably being shown by BioWare's market researchers to their top people (Casey Hudson in particular) because it really means that ANY misstep in handling the problem could be catastrophic for the company. After all 1 negative opinion by a player translates into 67 people (another figure published by market researchers when they discuss how opinions affect other potential customers) being told about it and who are now much less likely to buy from the company. If the numbers of games shipped is correct and allowing for wastage etc there are perhaps 2 million people who dislike the endings which means that potentially 100 million people will hear about it and be less likely to buy the game or anything else from BioWare. These are numbers that should scare BioWare - quite literally this is their entire target population for games in the ME universe.

Wrong, that marging of error asumes that the poll is completly random, the fact that voluntary polls will attract more people who dislike the product is a good argument against the idea that the poll was completly random.

<--- Took statistic classes

Modifié par tobito113, 18 mars 2012 - 02:57 .

[LilyasAvalon]

I WANT MY TURIAN FEMALES.

[the-small-print]

 In answer to what I would
like to see changed:

• Shep exemplifies rugged humanity. He can cut through overarching fatalism and
  overwhelming odds by sheer force of personality and guts. He does
  not give into projections of doom or wasteful tactics: 'there is
  always another way'. To choose any of the three options feels like
  losing hope and giving in to despair, and the 'sweet' bit of the
  bittersweet is handled in a throwaway and nonsensical manner.
• You not only finished the story but burned the book. The tale has been epic, but
  destroying the relays and causing supernovae, wiping out all
  synthetic life (EDI, Geth) destroys so much of what was cool about
  the universe that it drives you away from the story: 'well, that's
  that ficiton ruined'. There has already been enough tragedy:
  hundreds of billions killed. Nothing can ever be the same again. We
  don't need to strand the armada and wipe out more people to achieve
  the 'bitter' in bittersweet.
• Plot holes. All good fiction only requires a few suspensions of disbelief. It establishes
  its rules and it sticks to them. There are so many plot holes in the
  endings that it just gets surreal and pointless, and instead of a
  cool, immersive universe, you've just made it an uncomfortable
  schitzophrenic one. Games only provide good entertainment and
  escapism if there is something compelling and real about their
  setting.

PLEASE fix this. Mass effect games are the only ones I've actually caught myself looking
forward to since I was a kid, and the only ones I've seen that break
the 'sequels are never as good as the original' rule – they keep
getting better and better right up until they fall flat on their
face. I really love the setting and ME3 remains my favourite game, so
long as I try to forget the ending.




If fixed I WILL buy an ending DLC, even if it is a marketing ploy to milk us for more cash, I don't care.
I am greatly looking forward to further story and multiplayer DLC,
but be sure that I won't buy anything more from you until that's
been fixed.

Thanks.

Modifié par the-small-print, 18 mars 2012 - 03:28 .

[e2m2]

I also agree that this sums up my feelings about the ending well www.gamefront.com/mass-effect-3-ending-hatred-5-reasons-the-fans-are-right/

Ideally, I'd love to forgo to final Star Child part altogether, but to be honest I can't see a full-on ret-con going down too well, in which case I'd love to see you go with the indoctrination theory or something along those lines. Above all, I want to be able to QUESTION the Star Child, to reject his solutions. It makes absolutely no sense for my Shepard, who has been doing the impossible and finding her own solutions for the last three games to suddenly roll over and accept what some crazy AI says as gospel. The organics vs synthetics dichotomy in particular didn't make any sense in relation to my choices, since by uniting the Quarians and geth and by guiding EDI I'd done everything in my power to prove that the two can and do coexist. To not be able to use that at all in the end made no sense to me at all and left me screaming at the Star Child in frustration.

While deep down I'd love a happy, "perfect" ending, I was completely prepared for Shepard to heroically sacrifice herself and/or for more key characters to die (hell, even for Earth to be sacrificed) and would be completely fine with that IF it was done well. Heroic deaths in battle are fine by me, so long as the end result is worth it. That means the Reapers have to be defeated and the mass relays have to be preserved.

To elaborate on those last two points:

Defeating the Reapers. For all Hackett's assurances that they can't be defeated "by conventional means," I don't think that means they can't be defeated in war full stop. The fact that I brought everyone together (I did every side quest, scanned every planet, united the Quarians and geth, got the Batarian fleet etc etc) should constitute "unconventional means" in my book. I mean, it's been demonstrated that they absolutely can be taken down by force, so that's not the problem. If a thresher maw can destroy a Reaper, the combined forces of all life in the galaxy should be able to defeat them, albeit suffering heavy losses (as I said, heroic sacrifice is fine, even on a massive scale if it feels worth it).

As for the mass relays, quite aside from the horrific prospect of everyone starving to death in the Sol System which has been raised time and time again by this point, I couldn't stop thinking about all the families and friends throughout the galaxy I'd just forceably separated forever. Don't make me do that. And please don't make me destroy the dreamworld I've fallen in love with. Seriously, destroying the mass relays (especially given that it was forced on us no matter what we did) broke my heart, and not in a good way. I had a horrible feeling that it might happen very early on in the game and was praying for my hunch to be wrong the whole way through. It was crushing and definitely didn't feel worth it.

My favourite parts of the game were those that focussed on the characters. I loved having several "couple-y" conversations with my LI (Garrus) and not just the one scene we got in previous games. I loved that it felt like the game acknowledged your LI so they didn't just act like any other crew member outside the sex scenes. I loved the jokes and throwaway remarks (mentioning Shepard's bad dancing was fantastic). I loved the characters moving around, both on the Normandy and on the Citadel, and interacting with each other, not just with me. With this in mind, I really do think you owe it to yourselves, having created such wonderful, fleshed out characters, to finish their stories. Let us know what happened to them. It doesn't have to be happy necessarily, but just let us know.

I adored ME3 right up until the last 15 minutes. Yes, there were a few minor irritations (the journal, the stop-start feeling when you go from the War Room to the CIC), but overall I loved every second. I was ready to name it my favourite game of all time, but the ending left me feeling hollow and still, several days later, completely overshadows the rest of the game for me. It's a testament to what you have achieved that the bad ending has elicited such an emotional response (I'm talking genuine distress here) from your fans. It's not that we hate the game or you, we just know you can do better and we feel that this spectacular series deserves a spectacular ending, not a Deus Ex ripoff.

Please, please make this right.

Modifié par e2m2, 18 mars 2012 - 03:00 .

[Kanon777]

INDOCTRINATION THEORY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I cant say this is enough, even if you didnt plan this:

INDOCTRINATION THEORY!!!INDOCTRINATION THEORY!!!INDOCTRINATION THEORY!!!INDOCTRINATION THEORY!!!INDOCTRINATION THEORY!!!

Please just pretend thats the idea you were going for and make this PLEAAAAAAAAAAAAASE

[Tarnation007]

Blackgate456 wrote...

The ending needs changing. I agree on that. The endings does not make me feel like the hero I was in ME1 and ME 2. So I would like a sort of "happy ending" where Shepard lives and can join his or her Li and see the rest of the team again. Also I would like to see how their live progresses a bit ("Garrus+ Tali" for example). You can make it hard to achieve no problem but make it ONE possibility. If you did not so well during the game maybe you die but the galaxy is saved or the Reapers ar winning in the end.

Also I want a resume like in the epilogue of the Fallout Games where you can see what your decisions have changed for the better (or for the worse).

And perhaps you can improve the romances. I liked my Romance with Liara a lot, especially later in the game because is was intimate. But before that It seemed that at the expense of new players, people that romanced a character for two games had to suffer a leck of depth in the middle of their romance. Its not very romantic to be called "friend" four times in a conversation with Liara even if your romanced her in ME 1 and reclaimed it inME 2? And a bug prevents her from remembering you get back together in ME 2, but it is of less important so you will never fix it? If it is so minor you could chang it in a heart beat.

All of this only to give people the opportunity to back down to romance someone else? Liara does not seems very interested in Shepard if she is totally ok if Shepard would say "Naaa lets just be friends I decided different in the last five minutes."

For the rest of the game I would say thank you Bioware! Their were many awesome moments to remember.

I like this. Yes I mentioned I like the romances, well considering I only romanced Kaidan, I am quite biased. But that reminds me, I would like to know what this "reward" was for staying loyal to my ME1 LI that the devs mentioned would happen. I would have liked to see us 'faithfuls' get an extra romance scene where you can only get it if you were faithful (not just a few different dialogue options). Oh and I thought there was going to be "consequences for not staying faithful" - I'm sorry what were these? Kaidan mentions it in passing like it's completely excusable, I don't call that a consequence. These are just a few problems I picked up on, so while I enjoyed the whole romance experience, it just didn't seem like what was actually promised (like other things I guess *ahem*... endings (which I won't go into detail as many other people have and I support these views).

[Cloud Windfoot Omega]

tobito113 wrote...

INDOCTRINATION THEORY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I cant say this is enough, even if you didnt plan this:

INDOCTRINATION THEORY!!!INDOCTRINATION THEORY!!!INDOCTRINATION THEORY!!!INDOCTRINATION THEORY!!!INDOCTRINATION THEORY!!!

Please just pretend thats the idea you were going for and make this PLEAAAAAAAAAAAAASE

pretend? thats waht really happened LALLALLAA  shut up LALLAALALLA

[watch hawk]

First off; the game itself was great. Loved the new gun play and level up system.

Really the only issue is the choice of three endings, which render everything you've done up til then moot. Please don't misunderstand; it's nothing to do with them being "gloomy", or "dark", it's the fact that they explain nothing and make almost zero sense.

How does Anderson get in front of you?
How can Illusive Man control Shepard and Anderson?
Shepard bleeds after shooting Anderson, why?

Starchild: That kid was a ham-fisted attempt to make us sad, as far as I can tell. We know Earth was in trouble. We know what the stakes are. I thought the dream sequences were great, but why not have the VI appear to Shepard as his lover, or the squad mate the player used most in ME3?
Chances are they were with him when the reaper got him.

I think it'd have been better if the last boss fight was a talk with Harbinger on the Citadel. Shepard could've stayed in the room where he confronted Illusive Man. Then Habinger explains why the reapers are erasing life, and possibly hint at who created them. You could have Shepard and Harbinger come to a peace agreement, where the reapers take humanity away, or sacrifice another race to satisfy the Reapers' needs.

You could give up, and let them win.

Or Shepard activates the catalyst, taking down all synthetics including himself.

Don't give us the happy ending. Real quality sci fi should never be wrapped up neatly.

PS: A fight with Harbinger could be awesome, too - Shepard climbing him while in space to get to the core and rocket him. Just for fan satisfaction. Shepard would go down with the bastard in this case, of course.

Thanks, and please fix things. Please.

[Lamina]

 If the endings were fixed, I would totally buy some DLC, where I could get to know the new ME characters better. A special assignment with Vega with lots of macho bull****ting 

And I would also like to retake Omega.  Again if the endings were fixed.

I would have liked a more epic battle with the Illusive Man. I really wanted to kick his ass towards the ending. Even though I went for paragon, I still wanted to make his life pure agony  It was too easy.