7052 réponses à ce sujet

[Xenite]

Was discussing it again with my wife tonight and I realized something else that had no impact on the ending. The Citadel, what was the point of the quests to improve the security on the Citadel, such as training a citizen militia and such?

Had they went with a battle on the Citadel to activate the Catalyst it could have been worked into the fight. Just one more thing that we did that had no point whatsoever.

[Lakeshow1986]

The starchild is Harbinger, tricking you into thinking you can control the reapers or even merge organics with synthetics. The cannon ending is destroying the reapers control over you, then you wake up in London after winning the battle for your mind. What happens with the reapers is up to anyone!

[mattynutz]

 How to fix ME3? There are so many good ideas here. And while I'm not crazy about indoc theory, I think it could be made to work. Part of why I'm not crazy about it is that it's already spoiled for me and it would be great to have a huge reveal a la Bioshock that would make my jaw drop and my mouth utter "You... you had me fooled the WHOLE time!"

But now, if you do indoc, the most you're going to get from me is a complacent and bored "Oh. Indoc theory. I guess it works. Whatever. Better than Star Child. Mostly." If you DO do indoc, I reccomend that you make the part from Reaper Beam on earth to RGB be the hallucination. Then pick up the game from there, do a final boss battle of some sort, and then give some dialogue with the other chracters where we get options to discuss the whole indoc theory (if we can make Sheperd survive). This would probably require you to open up the galaxy map post ending cutscene like you did in ME2.

What was missing for me, regardless of indoc (which again, I'm not crazy about)?

Boss battle. Where are the boss battles? I only recall one. Ninja man. And I like ninjas. And I don't think that he was as terrible as I've read others say. Def a bit... done, though. If there were a few other boss battles with some less standard types, then we'd have a broad variety to distract us from the standard issue ninja man. I like TIM as a boss. TIM posessed by Harbinger is a cool idea too. How neat is that? Not only is the Cerberus Human supremacist turned into a reaper (another species) he's turned into the biggest baddest one of them all. Perfect if I don't say so myself. This is what your writers would call irony. Or what Shyamalan would refer to as "a tweest!"

War Assets: This may be very tough and very expensive to do, but for crying out loud, what the hell am I supposed to do with all these war assetts? You should give me something to do with them. An option to allocate them and see how that plays out. Think Risk (the boardgame). You missed a wonderful opportunity for a mini game here. I kept waiting to be asked "Shepherd, the eclipse, the blood pack, and the blue suns are itching for some action, where should we send them?" or "Shepherd, Do we want Turian ground forces backed up by Krogan tank thingies or Salarian short range fighters?" There was so much potential for that. 
 
keepers: Ever gonna pull off that reveal? I'd really like it.

My choices. I made a bunch of choices in the game. In all three of the games. I'd like to see them referrenced in an epilogue. 

Aftermath: You guys could totally milk this out and make it episodic after the end. Look at Fallout 3. I'm sure that you keep hearing it referenced. So look at it! It was great.

You really should provide the 16 endings that you promised. Whatever it takes. And you should not be charging for the DLC for that. Bioware made a very big mistake. And that mistake is fixable. But first, you have to admit it. Someone has to stand up and say "Everybody, it was me. I farted. I'll open a window and light a candle. I'm sorry. No more Chilli before D&D night for me." Take responsability. No more of this backsliding backpeddling headgame stuff you're doing. And admit you were doing that too because you needed to buy time. If you had just asked THE FANS for more time, without putting god child in and temporarily ending the game at Marauder Shields, you would have porbably found them very forgiving. They LOVE this game. And then fix the problem. On your dime. Because it shows good faith. Because it shows you accept and understand the responsability for the mistake that you made and the promises that you broke.


Those are my suggestions for what NEEDS to happen to save this title. Below are a few things that I missed in ME3 from the previous games or hoped would be innovated for this game.

Merc Battles: How about some merc squads that won't capitulate to their bosses and want to break off or take over? Those merc squads were very cool. I liked fighting them.

Mechs: One model? Only one model? It was neat to drive one though.

Mako: I was hoping a new and improved Mako model would be rolled out. Or maybe even to be able to fly and fight in a Kodiak. I liked the planet crawl in ME1, and missed it greatly in ME2.

Mini Games: I loved hacking. Loved it. I thought it was very well done. I have no idea why you would cut it. 

All that unused space on the Normandy: Look at that tricked out rec room! Another minigame or more! I'm sure some stuff was planned for DLC. But man... I couldn't shake the feeling that there needed to be more going on in the normandy. I love that ship.

Upgrading the normandy: One flimsy upgrade? Was there even a repercussion for not getting it? Come on! You did such a great job with it in ME2.

Loyalty Missions: Man. I know you aren't going to do this, but loyalty missions would have been a BILLION times better than those fetch quests. They were terrible. Overhear this. Get in the normandy. Go here. Scan. Run from reapers. Scan. Press A. Press B. Press B. Run from reapers. Go back to the citadel. Go find the person you overheard. Have some kind of boring dialogue. Meh. Loyalty missions would have been cooler (even if they were for the people on the citadel instead of your crew).

Diana Allers: Why didn't I see any Allers reports? Coulda been so neat.

Koliat: I was waiting for him to ask to join the Normandy crew after Thane's beautiful prayer. Where Thane was shrouded in darkness, Koliat would have been a great turn as one uplifted by hope. Hope that you (Shepherd) helped bring to him.  You could even use the Thane model and tweek the outfit a bit. It would have been nice to be around him filling the role of the preacher guy from Firefly (I forget his name). A total morale boost for the crew too.

TIM/Miranda: You needed to make TIM be Miranda's father. She would have been the perfect unreliable narrator for her own story. And he fit the profile of her father excellently. Instead we got insert random scientist here. Boring.

Squad Members: I had the same 4 or 5 squad members for most of the game with a couple of short lived guest appearances. Come on, guys! What is that all about? Boring.

Hmm. I'm out of steam for now. I'll edit this as I think of stuff.

Keeper tunnels: Why didn't we get to flush out some cerberus baddies ourselves? We should.

Edit: Rachni! Get those Rachni in that battle!

Modifié par mattynutz, 19 mars 2012 - 03:23 .

[MustOnen]

http://filesmelt.com/dl/PTsmall.jpg 

Modifié par MustOnen, 19 mars 2012 - 01:36 .

[Shallyah]

As most people are asking, I think it's general consensus that we want the opportunity to earn something better for Shepard and all Shepard knows and loves.

We do not want this to be the only possibility, but definitely one which can be earned through hardships, correct choices, or even skilled gameplay. Let's have a "Reapers win, organics are harvested, new cycle begins" ending if you like, or let's have 17 "bad" endings and 1 "good" ending. But let us fight for that one good ending.

Mass Effect was always about making choices that matter to shape the outcome of the story to that which you fought for. Mass Effect 3 ends leaving us nothing. No hope, no glory, and no solace beyond a weak gasp and seeing Shepard's LI stuck in some weird planet where they probably won't thrive, considering their unusual feeding needs.

Politely requesting this, and still believing that you won't let us down.

Modifié par Shallyah, 19 mars 2012 - 01:38 .

[garytwine]

The ending definitely needs more closure and explanation.

I feel the same way now as I did watching the finale of 'Lost', except 'Lost's' ending had more closure. At least we know, we saw what happened to everyone in the end. They lived their lives (we didn't see that part) and they die and meet up in the afterlife, waiting for each other until they can all move toward the light.

The final cutscene of Mass Effect 3 seems like a montage of clips which have no real timescale in basis to the events prior to them. Whether the key ending is changed or not it is generally very sloppy and lazy design and story telling. It is not worthy of the previous games and franchise as a whole.

I'm a Designer professionally, mainly for Corporate clients. We may have our design integrity and creative spirit that drives us to create great things if possible, but at the end of the day we are doing it for pay, for the end client. Not for ourselves. In the end, we're not creating for us but for the people paying for it.

We don't give them 50% of what they want, nor 70% or even 99%. We have to give them 100% what they want and expect. They are the bosses. Whether we like the end result or not (usually not 2nd draft onwards).

Mass Effect 3 gives only 95%. It's a great game but the poorly executed ending tarnishes the entire series in my eyes. Bioware needs to start  remembering this.

Some key questions which need to be asked and addressed in follow up DLC are below:

• The fleet seemed to be holding their own against the Reapers. it doesn't seem logical that a few Reapers break free and can't be stopped if every ship in the fleet focus fires on them.

• Are the two team members who accompanied you dead from the Harbringer laser blast? Where are they? Why didn't Shepard look for them or at least acknoweldge their deaths if they are dead?

• The catalyst makes no sense. Who or what is it? How did it place itself in the position to decide the fate of the galaxy, whether right or wrong? 

• Why did the surviving team members get onto the Normandy and abandon the battle?

• How did the surviving team members get onto the Normandy so quickly? There seems to be missing hours here.  (This missing time should be covered with an explanation and DLC, not left for exposition. It is lazy story telling)

• Why did Joker leave the Armarda mid-battle? 

• Where was he jumping to and why? Who ordered him to?  (There is no logic to him taking the Normandy and trying to escape Earth. Why would he leave the Earth?)

• Hackett, team members and other Key characters should have been shown reacting to fact Shepard is presumed dead and then when the mass relays exploding. This really needs to be addressed. 

• The timescale is way off throughout the final 15-20 minutes, unless hours or days have passed in between Shepard waking up next to the Catalyst. What happened to the Fleet and the ground teams in this missing time? Did Hackett order a retreat? Some DLC to cover this missing time is essential to adding closure for people.

• Some DLC to cover all of the above would be a good way to end this trilogy. I'm fine with Shepard sacrificing himself (if that's actually what's happened and it's not just a dream) but we really need to these very important gaps filled in. As it goes the finale just doesn't make sense.

This is just my opinion but its one I hope Bioware will listen to. Bioware are one of my all time favourites, but I really feel like they've just slapped me in the face and told me to go to the corner of the room for being thick with a pointed hat on.

Modifié par garytwine, 19 mars 2012 - 01:47 .

[super4star]

I just want to say that this thread is pointless. The game is finished so Bioware give us a breake.

Modifié par super4star, 19 mars 2012 - 01:42 .

[Lucypo0n]

The only thing I would change about ME3 is its ending. Everything else prior to the ending was an absolutely fantastic experience. Yes, there were problems with the facial import, but I really didn't feel it a chore to simply rearrange a few features here and there (at best, it took 10 minutes), so it looked reminiscent of my character from the preceding games. Yes, there were a few bugs here and there, but really nothing substantial that could bother me at all whilst I played.

The developers specifically stated that there would be sixteen different endings to ME3, and that our choices would matter. The reason myself, and many other people out there are disappointed with the ending was because there weren't sixteen different endings at all. There were three, and our choices during the course of ME3, and those carried over from ME1 and 2, were rendered completely obsolete.

I don't usually ask for anything, but now I would ask for an ending where everything I've done and all of the hours I've put in (a lot of hours, I might add), actually make a difference to the way the ending plays out. The possibility of a happy ending for my near-complete paragon Shepard with her LI, and sacrificial endings for those who want their Shepards to be hailed as heroic martyrs that gave their life so that everyone else could carry on living. That way, those who don't wish for a happy ending don't have to have it forced upon them, and vice versa.

[Ross42899]

Can we please also get somekind of mission in a future DLC, where you are able to drive a vehicle like in Mass Effect 2 "Overlord"?
In both previous games (Mass Effect 1 & 2) there where missions to drive somekind of vehicle. In Mass Effect 3 there was no single part, where you could drive a tank or something like that. Really missed a vehicle based mission.

[Archonsg]

And please SCRAP multiplayer requirement to get 100% Galactic readiness. 2, 3 years from now, even if I want to load the game up and replay for old times sake, It'll be stuck at 50% assuming the MP servers are taken offline or even if we can find people to play with.

EVERYTHING about the game as it is screams "play it once, maybe twice and we don't want you to play the game again, ever."

[-Rikard-]

As I wrote in my user review ( http://social.biowar...945/52#10118008 ), Mass Effect 3 is a fantastic game right up to the ending.

The only gameplay feature I would like to see changed is the mission journal, which should update the status of your missions. It´s the first game I´ve played since ME1 where I´ve had to use pen and paper to keep track of where I had been and what I had done.

As for the ending I think it´s been pretty well established why people don´t like it, so here is what I would have liked to see in it:

-The three endings in and of themselves would be fine if the plot holes were fixed (Normandy deserting the battle for no apparent reason with presumed dead squad members onboard), there were more variety and you were told more about what happened. As the mass relays are Reaper tech I can see why the pulse destroys them along with the Reapers. But why are they destroyed in the control and merge endings?

-Having player choice. Always keep in mind that the Catalyst is the very enemy Shepard has been fighting since the beginning - that Shepard just gives in and accepts everything it says feels like a defeat. That he/she does so in a cutscene without the player being able to disagree with the Catalysts flawed logic feels like a step backwards and a betrayal of what the series has been about so far. Like someone else mentioned, a maxed out paragon/renegade player could expose the Catalyst/Reapers as being afraid of the unprecedented opposition. They´ve never seen anything like this before.

-Having the option of rejecting the Catalyst. Shepard would just sit down and watch the battle unfold. With a VERY high number of war assets the tide would slowly turn and the reapers would be on the defensive. Knowing the job is done and that he/she can finally relax, Shepard smiles as he/she bleeds out.

-Having spent so many hours in this universe making friends and securing allies, I want to know in one way or another how they´re affecting the final battle. Even if it´s just a voiceover from Hackett.

-We want to see how Shepard affected his/her friends and how each player changed the galaxy. Was it really a good idea to save the Rachni, the Geth and the Krogan? I can see Wrex working to rebuild Krogan civilization. If Eve is alive and with him, their combined influence might just be enough to pull it off. I can see Wreav preparing the next Krogan Wars. I can see Garrus finally becoming a Council Spectre. Depending on the player´s Paragon/Renegade score, Garrus the Spectre comes to be known as either considerate and fair or ruthlessly efficient. I think something along those lines are what players want to see more than anything else.

-It would be perfect to end the series with some unknown alien discovering one of Liara´s black boxes and a fade to black as Liara begins to describe Shepard the way the player asked her to. I´m a little surprised this didn´t happen, the game really seemed to be building towards something like that.

-Ahh, who am I kidding, I want my blue babies.

If anyone from Bioware went to the trouble of reading this, thank you! 

[ShinAnubisXIII]

IMHO, there should be an EMS based option to blow the reapers back to hell and beyond WITHOUT sacrificing the entire galactic society, community and economy. Meaning, keep the Mass Relays and the Citadel intact. Plus, blowing up the Relays quite literally annihilates any logical chance of continuation of the Mass Effect IP, with or without Shepard.

Seriously, the current ending(s), besides not making any sense at all, are neither bitter nor sweet. They're just plain depressing. Isn't the loss of billions maybe even trillions of lives enough grief to deal with?

Also, with the Relays intact and running, there was at least a chance of finding Joker on Gilligan's planet.

[Aweus]

I could type a really huge WoT, but lets just cut it to the most important part.

Choices, choices, choices. This was always the main strenght of Mass Effect franchise and ME3's ending should reflect on that much more than it does now. All current endings should be kept as they are now (becouse retcons are bad and also some people already like what they got, taking this away would be just wrong) with added additional explanation to them. On top of that I would see a few more endings added which would take into account the fate of entire Normandy crew, fate of Shepard himself and fate of Earth and fleets surrounding it. Add some "Disney" option where all live happy ever after. Add some malicious option where Shepard pulls a stunt at the end and betrays everyone in some way in order to seize power. Or some ending where you somehow convince Reapers to leave (ultimate master of smart talking?). How about some option where you "board" the Harbinger and sabotage it in some way? Those are just some examples, there are really many possibilities here. The key is to have several different endings with vastly different feelings to them. I am sure that would leave lots of people satisfied. Make it in form of DLC or some sort of Director's Cut if you see this fitting. It would be a win-win situation.

Modifié par Aweus, 19 mars 2012 - 02:06 .

[cbutz]

I like the MAJORITY of fans do not like the ending of many reasons. There was no closure, no questions answered, ooc Shepard, themes that do not fit ME, Star child, Normandy turning coward etc.

Things I would like:
1. A range of endings depending on your choices and possibly military strength.
Bad Ending: Reapers win
Middle endings: Reapers die, Shepard dies, or entire populations die
Good Ending: Shep lives, reunites with LI, Relatively minor loss, Shep reflects on those who died to take them to this point, for example Mordin, Legion, Pressley, Kaiden . \\

2. Closure:
Some sort of explanation as to what happens to the rest of the galaxy and squad mates. For example, it can show Wrex rebuilding Tuchanka. Perhaps one scene can be Shepard staring off into the distance, like an ocean or something and reflects on those he lost, his LI comes up and he starts thinking about those who survived, que the Tuchanka scene, or Quarians and Geth, these scenes show some of the characters doing their own thing. Shepard turns around to the view of a ruined city with the Alliance starting the rebuilding process of Earth. Then an epilogue, perhaps in DA: O text style, explains things that happen years down the road.

3. War assets that matter. It really feels like they did not play much of a role in the final battle.

4. More interaction and exposure to the ME 2 squadmates. if possible, even if that is just added onto the final battle. Why Miranda or even Jack was not at TIM's base was weird, you would think that would have been included.

That is all I can really coherently put down for the moment. There is more I wish to say but so many more have said it and my ability to write today is not at it's highest.
Bioware FIX THIS.

Modifié par cbutz, 19 mars 2012 - 02:14 .

[LelianaHawke]

Also... a final scene with Kelly before the final Earth battle, please. This goes with the 'treat all love interests equally' comment I made a page back.

As it is, Shepard only seems to care about catching up with love interests if they're one of the select group with full voice actors - Liara especially. You can really feel that particular hole, where Shepard's caring seems limited to major characters.

I'd love to see a final scene where Shepard convinces Kelly to come back to the captain's cabin for one last time given the impending battle with Cerberus... and then circumstances force them to launch the mission straight away. She gets saved from the faceless Citadel destruction, and is on the same footing as the other love interests.

Modifié par LelianaHawke, 19 mars 2012 - 02:19 .

[XEmbraceEternityX]

Like most of the people posting here, I absolutely loved 99% of ME3.  Some parts made me laugh (Garrus's joke about the future shadow broker) , some parts made me cry (Mordin's death that even a paragon interruption couldn't stop) , and some parts were truly touching (Thane's final prayer for Shepard).  I never even thought that a video game could bring about all those emotions, but ME3 did.

Now onto that 1% of the game that everyone is talking about.  THE END.  For a game that was supposed to be the end of a trilogy, the ending was just horrible.  These are the problems that I had with the ending:

- Lack of a happy ending - Yes, I understand that not everyone gets a happy ending.  I am well aware of that, but I don't need to see it in a video game.  The reason I play video games is because I want to see at least some kind of happy ending.  I want the hero to win at the end and be able to get the girl/guy.

- Lack of choices - No matter what choice you make, it all leads to the same thing.  The only difference is the colors. 

- Lack of closure - For a game that's supposed to be the end of a trilogy, there was no closure what so ever.  I have no problem saying goodbye to this trilogy and it's characters, but the ending was anything but final.  If this was truly the ending then why were there so many questions left unanswered?

As much as I loved the 99% of the game, I find no replay value of it like I have with ME2.  Nothing about it makes me want to rush and import all my other Shepard's into this game to share the same fate.  Adding a few things would make me want to play this game over and over again such as:

- An extension to the current endings - Because the endings that were in the game didn't actually feel like they were the end, incorporate something's that everyone wants in a more detailed ending.  Let people get to choose if they want a sad ending, a bittersweet one, or even a happy ending.  Don't deny people of getting that ultimate happy ending. 

- An epilogue - Answer whatever questions that are left hanging, and finish Shepard's story.  I wouldn't even mind a DAO type of epilogue that cleared up any loose ends.

The new common motto around here seems to be "we're listening" and it's my hope that you truly are and not just saying that to appease the community.

[CaptainMonday]

Here is what I was hoping for in the ending:

1. Closure
In it's current form the ending just cuts the game off suddenly by destroying the whole galaxy. This should be the worst case scenario for people who rushed through the game. Best ending I think should offer a sense of accomplishment and offer some insight into how the choices we made affected the galaxy after the final battle, shown on the characters we care about (and not some old man and his grand son saying "thats all folks")

2. No "choose your own ending" button at the end
This is what pissed me off in Deus Ex: Human Revolution and I was sad to see it in Mass Effect 3: It's not a real ending to the story if you just tell us to "pick the one you like best". The ending should be the result of the choices you made throughout the game (or 3 games in this case) not a "choose your final cut scene" button. If you ever played the fitst Witcher then you know what I mean. Hell, if you played Mass Effect 2 then you know what I mean.

3. A Boss Fight
In ME1 you fight Sovereign (or Saren possessed by Sovereign). In ME2 you fight a giant terminator - human - reaper - thing. In ME3 you make the illusive man shoot himself in the head. See the difference? =)

4. Reaper motivation
The explanation we were given seams a little rushed and full of plot holes. Why does the starchild A.I. think synthetics would kill all organics even though he himself is an A.I. and wants to "protect" them? Then there are the Geth (not wanting to kill organics) and theres EDI (also, not wanting to kill organics).
There was a book I once read which also featured A.I's who had a plan to harvest humanity. In this book their goal was to create a real, existing God. I'm not saying that that's what I think the reapers should have been doing, just pointing out that there are other possibilities. Or just leave their motivation "beyond our comprehension" =)

I think thats it. On a side note I would like to add that I am a huge fan of the series and you guys have done an amazing job! I hope we will see more of the Mass Effect universe in the future!

[Troubleshooter11]

Owh boy there's a lot of feedback here, i'd hate to be the Bioware guy reading all this but here is my feedback. What little old me would change about ME3 if given the oppertunity and resources:

Story:
- Avoid the Deus-ex-machina Crucible and hammering in the idea we cannot beat the Reapers conventionally.
The codex and news articles gave plenty of examples of the organics giving the Reapers a bloody nose, all they need is an edge. This cycle is probably one of the few that managed to kill a Reaper and have the time to reverse engineer it's main weapon, the Thanix cannon, which Turians and Quarians have on some of their ships. As does the Normandy if you upgraded her in ME2.
Also, Sovereign was destroyed by his signal being disrupted after Shepard killed the possessed Saren. This would have or should have been the key advantage they should have researched and exploited to cripple the Reapers.

- TAKE EARTH BACK. A fancy trailer slogan with an epic battle we didnt see in the game itself. Borderline false-advertising if you ask me. Of course Shepard needs to spend most of the game preparing a relief force and coming up with ways to gain the advantage over the Reapers. But i would have liked to see atleast 25% of the game being a series of missions on Earth in the same style as the wonderful Suicide Mission in ME2. Possiblity of losing squadmates, former squadmates making cameo appearances to give you assistance in 1 or 2 battles, seeing the Normandy + Allied ships give you close air support. In other words, actually TAKE EARTH BACK, and not just VISIT EARTH...on your way to the Citadel to speak with AstroBoy the wonder AI.

Endings.
Owh boy, yeah it cant be avoided, sorry. But multiple endings different endings should be possible, and none of them involving SPACE MAGIC. To stick with the current plotline as much as possible, here are the endings i would have liked to see:
- Epic fail ending: Crucible malfunctions, all organic and synthetic life dies, relays/citadel blow up.
- Very bad ending: Crucible destroyed, Reapers win, Shepard indoctrinated and betrays his allies, then dies.
- Bad ending: Crucible fires, Reapers die, relays/citadel blow up, Shepard dies, galaxy in chaos.
- Bittersweet ending 1: Crucible fires, Reapers die, citadel blows up, Shepard dies, relays remain.
- Bittersweet ending 2: Crucible fires, Reapers die, relays/citadel remain, Shepard dies next to Anderson
- Golden ending: Crucible fires, Reapers die, relays/citadel remain, reinforcements make it to the Citadel and give Shepard and Anderson medical treatment. (Should require a BOATLOAD of war assets and doing everything right)

All endings should come with an epiloque, doesnt even have to be animated. Even Baldur's Gate 2 had proper epiloques for your squadmates. Any idea how many players were moved with reading the epiloque of Mincs and Boo? Manly tears were shed all over the world.

Side-Missions.
- Overal, the missions and plots not related to the main story line is where ME3 scores lots of points. Though some more N7 side-missions would have been great.

Combat.
I felt the combat in ME2 was the best in terms of speed, action and strategy. ME3 seems to focus more on Gears-of-War style action when it comes to the speed and the many ducks and rolls you do. Turning it a bit too much into a 3rd person shooter insted of a action-RPG. The enhanced evolutions for your powers are nice and bring a little bit of RPG back into the game in that area.

Modifié par Troubleshooter11, 19 mars 2012 - 02:34 .

[masseffectinglife]

All the Citadel quests don't appear to matter. When the reapers take it you never find out how. I would like to see that.

[VAIOMANIAC]

I for one do not want a rewrite of the endings but a fallout 3 continuation and be given more closure.
A proper continuation and more choices to what happens in the end keep the endings but add more choice and a epilogue.

I would pay money for this Bioware I just want the choice in what ending i get and I feel that a happy ending choice would be good.

And I know happy endings are cliche but I still would like that as an option.

[gwalchmai18]

I already described what I felt needed work, how, and why, here: social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/10038935/1#10038935

[leapingmonkeys]

So many things to fix.

To start with, I don't want to feel that I am playing a game where the developers were more concerned with how much effort it would take to make the game.  The whole ending felt like Bioware just gave up because they were running up against a deadline.  Even silly things like Tali - we were told we would "finally see Tali" in ME3 and all that we get is a poorly photoshoped picture in our cabin?  No sane person could believe that putting a photo in the game would in any way be seen as "seeing Tali".

I think first and foremost, you have to revamp the whole EMS construct.  It was a cheap and sleezy way to try to make the claim that past actions impact ME3.  It had no impact on the game play at all, and its only impact was to act as a lookup table at the very end to decide which final cut-scene to display.

Past actions have to show up as a tangible impact on the game play during ME3.  For example, the decision to destroy or save the collector base in ME2 should have been significant (as it turns out, it had little impact on ME3).  The only way that past action had any real impact in ME3 was by changing the EMS number (quite often in ways that are no even clear from playing the game).

Lets say you still want those three outcomes - control/symbiosis/destroy.  Then what should have been done is that those outcomes would require that you run a specific quest during the game to get a widget of some sort which you then bring to the final, climactic battle.

For example, if one saved the collector base in ME2, the following should have happened in ME3:

1) Cerberus forces would be much more advanced.  They would have had more units, and tougher units, because they were able to benefit from the tech they recovered.
2) There would have been a quest line open in which one would have a battle with TIM (who would be a mini-boss) in order to retrieve the "control-the-reapers" widget (which would then be taken to the final, climactic battle).

The "symbiosis" ending would similarly be tied to past actions.  I think probably the Geth/Quarian actions.  If one re-writes the Heritics and then makes peace with the Quarians, a quest opens up where there is one last rebel Geth encampment that has to be defeated.  Defeating them yields a "symbiosis" widget to take to the final battle.

There should be a similar mechanism for the "destruction" ending as well.  Perhaps some widget picked up from the remains of reaper destroyed in ME1 (there was some sort of feedback mechanism proposed for why the reaper was destroyed in ME1 - perhaps that is the mechanism used, on a grander scale, in ME3 to destroy all reapers).  There could be some sort of quest line to find something left over from the destruction of the reaper in ME1 to get the "destroy" widget.

I think that the Krogen should be unsaveable unless one kep the research data from ME2.  The quest line to cure the krogen should not open unless one has that data.

The decision to save/leave the council in ME1 should have a similar, significant impact on the game play during ME3.

The end of the game needs to build to a final, climactic battle.  Since the prior two games were all about building up a team, the final battle in ME3 needs to involve them.  My current thinking is that the final sequence is a kind of baton race in which Shepard has to make it through a series of battles to make it to the final battle.  In each battle, you get to choose two companions to help.  At the end of each battle, those companions stay behind to "hold off reinforcements" to give you time to reach the end.  There could be a mechanism for choosing between a few alternate sequences of fights to get to the end.  Each fight would tend to fit certain companions better than others, that way the choice of companions makes a difference.  If too many of your companions died in prior decisions, you might have to go through a battle with less than two companions, making it more difficult.

The finale has to be a climactic battle to place your end-of-game widget into some device (or some similar mechanism).  Now is a good time to use EMS as a timer - but that mechanism has to be clear during the game play.  A timer on-screen, or periodic updates from the fleet indicating how they are doing.  Something to make the EMS-as-timer mechansm tangible during game play.

The ending then falls into a couple categories, based on the timer:

1) Not enough time - everyone dies, the reapers win
2) Some time - you can place the widget to get the indicated result for the universe, but you are critically injured, as you collapse, you see your team charging in to save you, but then everyone dies
3) More time - same as above except that not everyone in the squad dies and you wake up in a hospital with the survivors
4) Enough time - same as above except that everyone in your squad survives

If Shepard dies, the epilogue shows either the Reaper victory or it shows their defeat plus the burial of Shepard and his/her team mates.

If you get to the "Shepard Lives" stage, then the game needs to go into an *interactive* epilogue mode.  In this mode, you can travel the universe and talk to all the NPCs to find how they fared and what they are going to do.  You get to see how the various races fared and how they are rebuilding.  You get to talk to your squad and find their fate.  If you have a LI you should also have the choice to settle down somewhere with them.

And for crying out loud, do the work to create a new skin/model for Tali where she is not wearing an enviro suit that we can see and interact with during the game play.

Basically, just make good on the promises made for ME3 - past decisions should materially, and tangibly impact the game play in ME3 and the arc of ME3 should follow the same construction used in ME1/ME2 - that's why the earlier games were popular, after all.

Modifié par leapingmonkeys, 19 mars 2012 - 03:05 .

[leapingmonkeys]

Also, given the endings I described above, there is no reason that one could not have 2 or three of the "final widget" quests available if they made the right choices up to that point. So one could go into the final battle with 2 or 3 widgets and decide which one to use at that time.

In terms of tacking this onto the current game, you could try to use the "hallucination" ploy. Shepard wakes up and realizes that he has to go get one or more of these widgets to use the Crucible to destroy the Reapers. That was the point of the hallucination, it was giving Shepard the last piece of information needed to complete the process - go get the desired 'catalyst' widget.

It is tacky as heck, but since most players are espousing some form of the hallucination ending to rationalize away the current broken ending, it would probably be palatable to most players and it would allow for the game to follow the arc that it should to make it into an enjoyable game.

The ending is still bitter sweet as there is still massive destruction done to Earth and the other planets, and there are still several dead team mates (Mordin, Thane - possibly more). But now the ending would include a "sweet" part which was missing in the original ME3. The current ending is simply "bitter" - time to add the "sweet".

Modifié par leapingmonkeys, 19 mars 2012 - 02:59 .

[RegularX]

 General:

- I'm not a fan of the "indoctrination theory".  Don't fix lousy writing by simply extending it after the fact.  Fix the lousy writing first, then extend it if you want. 

- Everything after Harbringer's attack needs to go.  While the scene of a wounded Shepard fighting to get to the Catalyst Light worked for me, everything else either fell completely falt or was utterly confusing.

- The conversation with TIM at the end highlights everything annoying about indoctrination.  I'd rather see someone truly being tormented by having taken on more power than he can handle than a bunch of speeches about how the other side simply doesn't understand.  At the end of the game, TIM doesn't feel important, powerful, spooky, empathetic, or anything but a Bond Villian with an HR Giger tattoo whose every motivation can be explained away far, far too easily by "INDOCTRINATION".

- Or to put it another way, if TIM is going to be the big boss fight of this epic story, he would be 1000x more interesting if he wasn't indoctrinated.  Morally bankrupt, devoid of compassion and having a singular goal of galactic domination by humankind, sure - but by making it so obvious he's been a Reaper plaything the whole time, the entire bit with TIM is just plain boring.

- Do this:  go back and play the original Deus Ex.  Now play your current ending.  Anything, anything at all, which is similar should be completely removed.  You've created a brilliant, innovative and in many ways unique story here which up until the end may homage to various moments of sci fi, but it never feels like it is simply lifting them because you were lazy.  Sure, biotics remind me of force powers.  Yes, the Rachni feel like Heinlein wrote them first.  EDI might be Data's sister-in-law.  But all of these Mass Effect managed to make their own.  The ending feels like someone read Warren Spector's Cliff Notes and changed out some nouns.


Specific things I would have preferred to have seen:

- First, I'm not 100% sure - but it looks like in order to "Save Shepard" you have to play multiplayer.  I honestly haven't had the time to prove this, going to ask the forums in a bit.  If so - a) that contradicts what BioWare said previous to playing the game.  If you want to reward people who play MP with some additional cutscenes or something, fine - but having it be attached to something major like sparing the main character is just a thumb in the eye to people who didn't buy this game to play online (or don't have online).  I love MP, but it should be a distinct experience.

- Second, I really expected my EMS to have more of an impact on the ending.  The occasional strike from space to help Shep out or the like.  If you need to explain how some people escape, or how Shep gets past Harbringer, or the like - I'd say with a certain EMS Harbinger could be defeated in a way similar to the (I acknowledge much smaller) Rannoch Reaper.

- One of the amazing things about ME2 was the Suicie Missions, the choices you had to make around it, and the possibility of losing squad mates forever.  ME3 has none of that.  Absolutely none.  When I chose EDI and Jarvik, I thought they might not come back.  So when EDI shows up mysteriously in the end sequence, you've really robbed a great deal of the narrative from the user.  Make who I choose on the mission important, at the very least.

Finally:

Don't leave things like like "well, maybe exploding the relays this time is totally different" up to player interpretation.  Blowing up the relays is a huge plot point, and I like many other pretty much assumed this negated anything I did on Citadel since most of the galaxy was destroyed anyway.  Assume I've played Arrival and I have that ending in my head when I'm watching a chain reaction like that.

Or if you're going to strand an entire space armada, give it some epilogue.  These black sun sized plot holes are what are keeping the ending from the "bittersweet" ending and instead just being "WTF".

Or if killing the geth happens, show what happens to the quarians because of that decision.  In my case, I reunited the the two races, and the quarians appeared to be integrating them.  If a quarian had allowed geth technology into their suits - what happens??  GIve us some context as to what the ending actually means when it comes to the final decisions over all these choices.

TBH, my take on the ending right now is that BioWare did it completely on the cheap and hoped that inspiring imagery and Buzz Aldrin would compensate for the fact.  I'm pretty astonished, since everything else in the game is so tightly put together with intricate and often wildly noteworthy differences based on character input.  I think this ending has the potential to be the game equivalent of the Star Wars prequels, and I'd certainly like BioWare to avoid that.

Or if I had to put all the above in three simple words:

No Space Magic.

[Zaalbar]

First off the space battle scene that we got at the beginning was simply amazing, but I feel they should have expanded on it, maybe cut back and fourth and show us the struggle and sacrifice of all the races, Survival or destruction should be tied to the galactic Readiness and war assets

The companion characters (Me2 Me3) should have all had a larger role in this battle, (Me2 Suicide Mission)
Not or would survive in the final hours. Survival of who lives and dies could be tied into the amount of war assets you've accumulated.

The endings themselves should be expanded on and be given entirely new scenes representing each choice with drastically different outcomes.
The Normandy trying to outrun the blast and its crash on some jungle planet should be completely removed in my opinion as it serves no purpose.
example, If Shepard chooses renegade destroy which ends all synthetic life in the galaxy then there should be a scene of Joker in pain over the loss of Edi..
This ending would also be problematic to the galactic races as the destruction of the Relays has left many stranded and cut off from there home worlds, In time the relationships of the different races world become fragile as everyone is fighting for what little resources are left. The galaxy becomes Chaos. (Shepard's Survives)

The Paragon control option should not end with the destruction of the Mass Relay's instead this ending should give us a bitter sweet conclusion of sacrifice for the greater good. Despite the losses the galaxy will unify in a new era where Earth becomes the Centre of galactic relations. This ending will also show us Shepard's surviving companions taking up important roles in the new community or simply moving with there lives. (Shepard Dies)

The synthesis ending for me is a hard one to fit as it involves space magic and in my opinion just doesn't fit into the mass effect universe.

And lastly with very little assets its possible to experience the worst ending that involves the complete victory of the Reapers and the destruction of all galactic life, this scenario would have Liar T'soni as the one of the last survivors setting up a Beacon in the image of Commander Shepard programmed to send a warning to the next cycle. (Shepard Dies)

This is my interpretation of what Mass Effect 3 endings could be, the point is I'm not asking Bioware to radically change the endings but to maybe ad content to what is already there to enrich the endings that will give us radically different conclusions with some variations. My hope is that both Bioware and fans can somehow meet in the middle and work to give Mass Effect 3 the closure it deserves.