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ME3 Suggested Changes Feedback Thread - Spoilers Allowed


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#3376
NekOoNinja

NekOoNinja
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G3n0c1de wrote...

 Please DON'T go with the indoctrination theory.  It's just their way of somehow justifying everything that happened, when they should actually want a better ending.

I am a space battle porn lover.  The battle you had was pretty good, I have to say, but there could always be more of it.  Take a page out of Star War's book, and cut back to the space battle a couple of times, showing its progress.  Hackett has a larger role than ever before, so I'd like to see him not only directing his fleet, but also in combat.  The Normandy should also get in the fight, with the upgrades that you have.  And I want to see more damage done to the Reaper side, especially if you have a high EMS.

Also, those people who expressly said that they'd be helping you fight on Earth should make an appearance.  Like Kirrahe, Jondum Bau, and many others.

To my bigger point, EMS shouldn't just be a number.  I'd like to see how the different things you've acquired add to the battle on Earth and in space.  It's a fantastic way to reward the player.

Also, there needs to be an ending where the Reapers win.  You're fighting a war, and everything you do impacts the war in some way.  If you don't prepare enough, you should lose.  This is no different than doing the Suicide Mission in ME2 without upgrades for the Normandy or crew loyalty.

We'd also really like closure for the major characters.  Perhaps one final playable segment, where we can talk to them.  Or even a DA style epilogue would work.

Anyway, I've come up with my own version of the ending incorporating some of my suggestions.  If it's too much work to factor in your old acquaintences, I wrote this only taking EMS scores into account.  Be warned, this is extremely long.

If you have a low EMS:

First off, the space battle needs to be different.  You get fewer ships, and the tone is more desperate.  The Sword fleet is not effective at all, they really amount to only a distraction.  The Allied fleet is fighting, but it's immediately obvious that they can't win.

Most of Hammer group is shot down.  When Shepard reaches the ground, the Allied FOB is overrun with Reaper forces and you have to fight your way to Anderson in his command center.  The tone is very desperate.  Hammer doesn't have nearly enough men or firepower to mount an effective attack.  All they can do is one suicidal thrust. Hammer and the resistance try pushing to the Conduit but are repulsed by the Reaper ground forces.  The fight with the destroyer remains the same.

Cut back to the battle in space.  The Reapers break through Sword Fleets lines, throwing them into disarry.  Sword begins to be overwhelmed.  Admiral Hackett does his best to keep control, but even he knows that he doesn't have much time.  If the Destiny Ascension is present, it is destroyed.  Hackett's dreadnought takes damage but keeps fighting.

There isn't much left of Hammer group for the final push to the Conduit.  They charge, but are met by Harbinger.  Shepard takes a Reaper laser to the face.  This sequence plays out pretty much as it does in the game.

Badly injured, Shepard limps through the Citadel, eventually finding Anderson.  TIM shows up, but in this scene, he is dissappointed and angry with Shepard.  Shepard is forced to kill Anderson.  TIM knows how the battle is going, and knows that the Crucible won't reach the Citadel.  Shepard has failed.  TIM is conflicted as he actually finds some joy in that the Reapers will win, to which Shepard points out that he is indoctrinated.  TIM kills himself.  Shepard goes up to the console to open the Citadel's arms.  He can now see the battle outside, and tunes his radio in.

Sword fleet is mostly destroyed or routing.  Over the radio, Shepard hears Admiral Hackett give the order for Shield fleet and the Crucible to enter the system before his dreadnought explodes.  Shepard also hears chatter from the battle on the ground.

Cut to London.  The dead of Hammer group and the resistence litter the battlefield.  The survivors attempt to retreat, but find that in their push to the Conduit, the Reaper forces have encircled them.  It is chaos.  All of Shepard's squadmates and other characters are cut down, one by one.  Shepard attempts to tell them to get out of there, to no avail.  As the last radio falls silent, Harbinger comes on, and gloats.

The Crucible tries make one last run at the Citadel.  Shield fleet attempts to protect the Crucible, but they are destroyed in the effort.  The Crucible itself makes it far, thanks to the sacrifice of the Shield fleet ships.  Joker and the Normady attempt to help, doing major damage to a Reaper before being chased off.   The Crucible doesn't reach the Citadel.  As it gets close, Reaper lasers destroy it.  

All remaining Allied ships attempt to flee but are destroyed.  Like the ground forces, they are also encircled.  Joker attemps to break through to escape, but the Normady is cut apart by multiple Reaper ships.

Shepard can only watch as the wreckage of the Crucible drifts toward his location, and then impacts.

The epilogue is narrated by Harbinger, who talks about the continuation of the cycle.

So that's the downer ending.  Everyone dies.

For a medium EMS

The space battle is similar to that of the game, but we get to see more of it.  While still outmatched, Sword fleet has enough firepower to hold it's own against the Reapers.  Ships get destroyed on both sides.

The ground war is also similar to that of what happened in the game.  The FOB has a decent amount of Allied units.  The enemy is at the walls, but the base holds it's own.  The tone is tentatively hopeful.  Hammer is able to push to the Reaper destroyer, and your allies help you on the ground during the fight, making it easier.

Cutting back to space, Sword fleet is still holding it's own.  Both sides are losing ships. Hackett notes that they won't be able to keep up these losses forever.

Hammer attemps to push to the Conduit.  Harbinger and some other Reapers break off from the space battle to intercept.  Hackett orders his dreadnought and the Fifth Fleet to pursue them.  With some of Harbinger's allies taken out, Harbinger engages Hackett and his fleet.  Hackett's dreadnought is disabled, and many of the Fifth Fleet's ships are lost.

Instead of Harbinger, it is another Reaper destroyer that meets Hammer at the Conduit, and it begins to cut Hammer down.  Hammer fights back.  The Normandy makes a thanix and javelin run on the destroyer and takes it out.  Hammer reaches the Conduit.  Shepard is uninjured.  Anderson and Shepard agree that a small team should go through, while the rest of Hammer stays behind to make sure nothing follows the team through the Conduit.

Anderson, Shepard, and his squadmates enter the Citadel.  They make their way to the control room.  They reach the console and Anderson begins to open the Citadel arms.  He is then shot by TIM who appears out of nowhere.  TIM controls Shepard and his squadmates.  He is about to force Shepard to kill one of his squadmates, but Shepard overcomes this at the last second, shooting TIM in the head instead.  Something about Shepard being the only person to have the strength of will to resist the control of the Reapers.  This is what makes him able to break TIM's control.  One of your squadmates attends to Anderson.

Opening the arms, we can see the battle still raging in space.  Sword fleet has taken heavy losses, but has also weakened the Reapers as well.  The Reapers begin to press their attacks, gaining them the advantage.  Hackett orders the Crucible and Shield fleet into the system.  Shield fleet relieves Sword, and together they sucessfully push through to the Citadel with the Crucible.  It docks with the station.  The Reapers go after the Crucible in droves only to be repulsed.  The Reapers retreat.  

The fleet claims victory, but Reaper reinforcements appear in system.  They come from Palaven, Thessia, and all over the galaxy.  Hackett urges Shepard to get the Crucible working quickly.  It won't be long before they are able to destroy the Crucible.  Hackett orders the remaining ships to defend the Crucible at all costs.

Shepard then recieves word on what's happening on the ground.  His squadmates and the rest of Hammer are dug in around the Conduit., but are in heavy fighting and are taking casualties.  Again, Shepard must work quickly or else Hammer will be overrun and the Reaper forces will storm the Citadel.

Shepard begins the sequence for charging the Crucible.  Somehow, TIM gets up, and dusts himself off.  The hole in his head reveals only more synthetic structures.  Your squad opens fire, blowing away TIM's skin.  He is fully cybernetic.  Shepard is apalled.  He states that you've just done his work for him, and the Reapers will be under his control soon.  Harbinger interjects, and assumes direct control of TIM through his cybernetics.  TIM dies screaming.  The Crucible is finished charging, and you attempt to go for the console, but Harbinger blocks you.  You must now fight Harbinger.  Cue a boss fight similar to when we fought Saren.  During pauses in the action, there will be cuts to the space battle, ground battle, and dialogue with Harbinger.  

Harbinger confirms that the races of the galaxy are harvested in order to make more Reapers, making their side stronger.  They are destroyed before they can advance to a point where they could actually fight the Reapers.  **** the bull**** about synthetics versus organics.  Keep it simple.

Fighting on the ground is intense.  Shepard's squadmates and other important characters rally and weather the Reaper assault.

The battle in space is desperate.  The Allied fleet has been severely weakened by the initial assault on Earth, but Hackett rallies his forces to hold their lines.  Cut to shots of the Normandy engaging a Reaper and winning if it has the thanix cannon.  One Reaper breaks through the Allied lines and move toward the Citadel: Harbinger.  Hackett's dreadnought is the last ship in a position to protect the Crucible, and he positions himself directly in Harbinger's path.  Hackett's ship takes heavy damage.  He retaliates with a javelin strike to take down Harbinger's shields, and then follows up with his ship's main gun.  Harbinger is badly damaged but, keeps advancing.  Hackett's ship is out of javelins and then has it's main gun knocked out.  Hackett order's his ship to full thrust forward.  Harbinger tries firing on Hackett's ship, but is unable to destroy it.  The two impact.  Hackett's ship explodes.  It is his finest hour.

This sever's Harbinger's link with TIM's body, and allows Shepard to finsih it off.  Shepard walks over to the console, and a Prothean VI appears.  It informs Shepard about using the Crucible.  Shepard has questions and they are answered.  The Crucible can do one of two things.  It can either destroy all Reaper technology in the galaxy, or allow Shepard to control all Reaper technology in the galaxy.  Shepard's squadmates point out that the Mass Relays and the Citadel were also made by the Reapers, so if Shepard chose that option, for one thing they would all die, because the Citadel would be destroyed with them on it.  And that whole long list of things that would be bad when all the relays are destroyed.  Shepard considers the other option.  The Prothean VI informs Shepard that he would have to be infused with the Reapers in order to control them.  He'll die.  Controlling the Reapers is a huge unknown and a huge risk.  Would Shepard be the same person afterward?  What would he do with that power?  As Shepard contemplates, his squadmates notice something.

From the debris of Hackett's dreadnought, Harbinger emerges, badly damaged.  It's lasers no longer work, so it limps toward the Crucible.  He gets one last report from space and the ground.  The fleets are at the breaking point, with more Reapers slipping through their lines and advancing on the Citadel.  His friends on the ground are reduced to fighing in close quarters, and are close to being overrun.  Whatever decision Shepard makes, he is now has limited time.

You could decide to do nothing:  This choice has Shepard decide that no one should have the power to both destroy the galaxy as we know it, or to control the Reapers.  Both are not worth the cost.  Shepard destroys the console.  He hopes that the next cycle will be able to do what he couldn't.  He shares some words with Anderson.  Shepard spends his last moments with his squadmates, or his love interest if he brough them.  They watch as Harbinger descends on the Crucible.

The epilogue is largely the same as the downer ending.  The Reapers win.  Everyone is dead.  But at least Shepard wasn't constrained by a difficult choice.

If you choose to destroy the Reapers:  The Crucible powers up, and activates right as Harbinger gets to it.  Harbinger is blown away.  This sequence appears mostly identical to what happened in the game.  The surviving Allied fleet ships stop and watch.  Some Reapers try to run, but they can't escape.  The wave of energy hits Earth and spreads all over the world.  All Reaper forces are disintigrated.  The Conduit collapses.  Your friends on the ground emerge from the rubble.  The Citadel then aims at the Charon Mass Relay.  It fires once more, pumping the relay full of it's energy, and the relay fires toward it's sister relay.  The relays themselves are destroyed, but all their energy is released as Reaper killing energy.  Cut to Palaven, Thessia, and other worlds as it shows the Reapers being destroyed.

Shepard observes these results on the console.  The Citadel is rocked by explosions.  I've thought of some 'sub endings' for this part:

The first one is that you and your squadmates die.  It's a scene somewhat similar to choosing not to do anything at all.  You share some words with Anderson, and then you spend your final moments with your squadmates.  Shepard takes solace in the fact that the Reapers will no longer be a threat.  He's concerned about what will happen to the Galaxy, but hopes that they'll be able to figure the future out themselves.

I'm not sure how it could be implemented, but the other scene has Joker going on one last extraction run.  I don't know what you'd have to do to get this ending over the other one, but  somehow, Joker is able to get to you and your Squadmates and pull you guys out at the last second.  This is the semi good end.

Both epilogues will be narrated by Shepard.  The galaxy has survived, but at an extremely high cost.  Without the relays, everyone is now cut off, and isolated.  The Alliance got busy disposing of the Reaper corpses by launching them into Sol.  Cleanup and rebuilding began around the world.  Due to the destruction of the relays, Earth had to become self sustainable.  Thanks to ingenuity and technology, this was achieved after some time.

The alien forces considered attempting to return to their worlds, but all knew that the distances were too vast to be overcome, even through FTL travel.  Earth was no longer the home of just humans.

The krogan were granted land. While the clans were united during the war, eventually internal conflicts broke out.  Such is the krogan way.  They eventually scattered, living out their long lives alone, all over the planet.  They became more rare as time went on, eventually becoming the stuff of legends.  Due to their long life spans, it was a while before they died out.

The salarians, knowing they wouldn't be around for much longer, did what they could to help the humans with what time they had left.

The turians had few women on their ships, barely enough for a viable gene pool.  They integrated with humans in a few of their cities.  They could either struggle to keep their numbers up, die out, or they eventually make it.

The quarians did okay for themselves.  If you had the geth help them too, the quarians would be able to adjust to Earth and live there in their own enclaves.  If the geth were not present, the quarians would live on their warships.  With a good mix of males and females, the Quarians were able to maintain a steady population.  The greater concern was food.  They worked with the Turians to synthesize dextro amino acid food.

It's the asari who were able to thrive.  Thanks to being mono gendered, it didn't take many of them to grow into a sizable population after a few generations.  They also integrated with the humans.

The geth helped immensely in the rebuilding.  If they were there with the quarians, then they integrated back with quarian society.  If not, then they kept to themselves in space.  Eventually, some geth left in order to explore and seek out the rest of the collective.  Aging wasn't a concern, so decades of FTL travel seemed feasible.

Other places in the galaxy were able to rebuild as well.  Some were not so fortunate.  Many colonies and space stations starved, or ran out of energy.  Element zero became exceptionally rare and valuable, because almost no one had access to raw eezo.

As soon as they were able, Earth's top scientists began studying how to replicate the mass relays.  Without the resources and scientists of the rest of the galaxy, progress was slow.  It would not be for hundreds of years more that anyone would come close to solving this problem.

Insert individual epilogues of Shepard, his love interest, and his squadmates of the things they do on Earth if they are alive.  If Anderson is alive, then he becomes head of the Alliance.  A final scene should focus on the memorial for all who lost their lives in the Reaper war, and for Shepard if applicable.  Any living squad members and important characters should be present.

If you choose to control the Reapers:  Shepard makes his decision, and his squadmates are distraught.  Especially his love interest.  He shares words with Anderson and his squad, and then steps up to the console.  Shepard is elevated to a thing basically like what we have in the game to control the Reapers.  He uses it and dies.  Harbinger is about to reach the Crucible, but the Crucible powers up, and releases a pulse.  Harbinger goes dark.  And then it's eyes and other light colors change to blue.  It stops, and turns to face the other Reapers.  One by one, they also change their colors.  The Allied fleet ceases fire.   The ones on Earth do the same.  The ground forces attacking your friends suddenly fall over dead.  The Reapers on the planet take off and leave.  This sequence is more or less the same as the one in the game, but without the destruction of the mass relays.  Instead of an explosion, the relays recieve the signal, and then emit a pulse.  Eventually this turns every Reaper in the galaxy.  Cut to scenes of Thessia and Palaven.  Every Reaper ship then makes its way to Earth, and they gather around the Citadel.  Your squad and the Allied fleet are wary, but the Citadel begins to glow with dark energy.  And the Reapers use the Citadel as a mass relay, and use it to leave.

No one knows where they went.  As the various fleets move through the relay network to survey the damage from the war, they find no trace of the Reapers.  It becomes apparent that they have left the galaxy.  People speculate as to the reason.  Perhaps Shepard had the Reapers banish themselves, or remove themselves from the galaxy to stop hurting it.  Maybe there is an unknown threat outside the galaxy and Shepard had the Reapers leave to fight it.  They could have gone to a different galaxy.  Will they return?  No one knows except Shepard, and he is dead.

Rebuilding the galaxy was difficult, but not impossible.  Thanks to the Reapers, the galaxy was united as never before.  The Citadel was eventually moved back to it's old position in the Widow system.  It returned to being the center of galactic politics.

With the heavy losses incurred by the Allied fleet, there was a definite power vacuum for a while.  If Shepard didn't do enough to unite the galaxy, smaller wars for power would break out.

Due to it's part in the war, and thanks to Commander Shepard, humanity finally earned the respect and trust of the whole galaxy.

Relations with the krogan would depend on whether or not the genophage was actually cured.  If so, then the Krogan expanded rapidly.  Eventually, overpopulation occurred, but they had learned the lessons of the Krogan rebellions.  The Krogans expanded into unknown space, exploring, and developing many colonies.  They also limited their breeding.

If the genophage was not cured, then it eventually became apparent that the krogan had been used.  They went on a bloody rampage that set fire to many worlds, and even the Citadel.  The Krogan would be wiped out.

If the geth were able to work with the quarians, then they both settled on Rannoch.  The quarians adapted quickly to the environment and thrived.  And by working with the geth, their society grew rapidly.  For their part in the battle for Earth, the quarians rejoined the Citadel, and were given an embassy.

If the quarians won their war with the geth, it's largely the same outcome, just that they wouldn't have expanded or adapted nearly as fast.

If the geth won, then they would eventually complete their dyson sphere and achieve unity.

Other than that, things should go back to normal with the mass relays still working.  Again, the final scene should bring together the characters who are still living and have them at Shepard's memorial, either on the Citadel or Earth.

These two are bittersweet endings.  And these ones actually make sense.

If you have a high EMS:

The space battle will go very well for the Sword fleet.  You'd be bringing in an overwhelming amount of ships.  Morale is high.  I want to see every dreadnought that the Allies have.  I want to see javelin missle swarms taking down Reaper shields.  I want to see thanix cannons.  The Reapers simply aren't prepared to do battle with this many ships.  The initial assault is a success.  The Reapers get hit hard, and while they still have alot of firepower, the Allied fleet is able to deal them heavy losses.  Hackett's dreadnought and the Normandy both get kills.

As a consequence, almost all of Hammer group makes it to the ground.  Hammer group is also larger this time.  They gain several footholds in London and begin taking the city back.  The FOB you go to is flowing with troops.  More are arriving by the second, and are advancing from the perimeter.  There is heavy fighting during the push to the Conduit, but Hammer group is cutting deep into the enemy.  They have enough forces to secure their flanks as well.  The Reaper ground forces are actually driven back to the destroyer.  There is no fight with the destroyer as it gets overwhelmed by Hammer group.

Back in space, the Reapers have regrouped, and reengage the Allied fleet.  Maintaining some control of the area, Hackett orders in Shield fleet and the Crucible, instructing them to set up near the Citadel.  They are waiting for Hammer to open the Citadel.  The Reapers realize what's happening, and try to intercept the Crucible, but Sword and Shield fleets repulse their attack.  They are also become aware of the situation in London.  Harbinger and a few other Reapers break off from their main group to go after the Conduit.  Hackett sees this, and orders the Alliance fleets to intercept them.  The Reapers take withering fire from the Alliance ships, many being destroyed.  Harbinger attempts to engage Hackett's dreadnought, but he has support and Harbinger is driven off.  Some reapers make it to the Conduit, but they are destroyed by Hammer and by the Alliance ships in orbit.  Harbinger and the reamaining Reaper forces withdraw, going to FTL and escaping through the Relay.  The Allied fleets celebrate.  Hackett reminds them to stay on their guard, the Crucible will be what ends the war.

News spreads of the battle to those on the ground.  Hammer is advancing past the Conduit, pushing the Reaper forces out of the area.  Shepard and Anderson decide to lead a strike team through the Conduit and onto the Citadel.  Several of Hammer's squads go through the Conduit and then Shepard steps through.  He is greeted by a firefight.  Every Cerberus soldier who didn't die on their base was called to the Citadel by the Illusive man.  The strike teams are heavily engaged.  Anderson and Shepard are separated, with Shepard and his squad fighting through to the command console.  They reach it, expecting to find the Illusive man there.  But there is no one.  So Shepard opens the Citadel's arms.  He radios Hackett and tells him that they are ready for the Crucible.

Just then, several Phantoms decloak with their blades aready in front on Shepard and your squad's throats.  You and your squad drop your weapons.  TIM emerges, applauding.  You did what he needed, and now he will get the Crucible.  Shepard tries to communicate with Hackett or anyone else, but TIM is jamming their comms.  You talk back and forth.  You can weaken his resolve, but eventually the Phantom guarding you gets shot in the head, Anderson steps out.  He throws a flashbang grenade into your group.  Shepard rolls out of the way and TIM escapes the blast, but it stuns your squadmates and the Phantoms guarding them.  Boss fight.  The Phantoms go after you while TIM fights Anderson.

All the while in space, the remaining Reapers, pulled off of Palaven, Thessia, and countless other worlds arrive with Harbinger.  They pour through the relay.  Hackett orders the Allied fleet to engage.  He tries telling Shepard to activate the Crucible, but Shepard can only hear Hackett, not respond.

After killing the Phantoms, Shepard tries to help Anderson.  TIM reveals that he's had upgrades done, and overpowers Anderson, shooting him in the gut.  He's about to finish him, but Shepard tackles him.  TIM throws him off.  Boss fight.  Shepard disables TIM.  He's in pain, but thanks to his implants, he can't die.  Your squad comes to, and one of them helps out Anderson.

Meanwhile, the space battle rages outside.  The Allied fleet is holding its own, but they are taking losses in the center.  The Reapers are attempting to break through to the Citadel, but are taking heavy losses.  Harbinger and a few other large Reapers emerge and advance.

Shepard gets to the console and brings up the Prothan VI.  He is informed of his options.  Like the medium EMS version, both are apalling.  As Shepard weighs his options TIM begins to glow and surge with energy.  Harbinger is trying to assume direct control.  TIM cries out for help.  Shepard can talk to him.  Blah blah blah fight the indoctrination.  If you've got a high enough paragon or renegade score, you can talk down TIM who asks you to put him down.  If you don't, Harbinger assumes control of TIM and you have to go through the boss fight from the meduim EMS ending.  But this time it will be harder.

After defeating Harbinger/TIM, you again step up to the console.  Harbinger sees how close you are to winning and charges the Allied fleet.  It and other heavy Reapers break through.  Hackett does his best to engage Harbinger.  Again, you only have so much time before Harbinger destroys the Crucible.  But you have another option.  Again, you can choose to not do anything, but instead of resigning yourself to death, you inspire the fleets.

The choices from before are laregely unchanged:  If you control or destroy the Reapers, the same basic things happen.  In the epilogue, the size of the surviving fleet is much larger.

But when you refuse to take either choice:  Shepard opens the console radio.  Thanks to the Citadel, it is broadcast to all Allied ships and ground forces around the world.  Shepard goes into the inspirational speech to end all inspirational speeches.  He inspires and rallies the fleet.  In turn, they destroy Harbinger.  With their leader dead, the Reaper forces are left in disarray.  In their push to the Citadel, they left themselves open to encirclement, and are now surrounded.  The fleet destroys every Reaper present.  On the ground, the resistence movement ignites all over the world.  Hammer group is inspired to push the Reaper forces out of London.  Victory.

Again the epilogue is narrated by Shepard.  After the battle, the fleets went about liberating planets from Reaper forces.  Shepard hunted down every last Reaper.  Whenever a new one showed up it was met with overwhelming force.  After a few years, the war was declared over.

The rest of the epilogue occurs like the epilogue for controlling the Reapers.  Things go back to normal.  The galaxy enters a new era of peace and prosperity.  For the first time ever the entire galaxy is united.

The final scene should actually be playable.  Shepard talks to all the important characters at a war memorial ceremony.  Good times.

So yeah, this is the golden ending. 


Everything he said, and this is the direction I expected the game to end. It has vastly different outcomes, tied to EMS: sad, bittersweet, happy.
I especially like the tension of pointing the gun at a squadmate (LI), makes more sense than Anderson. Did not care much about Andersion, so I would be on the edge of my seat on this one - every time. Just like the suicide mission, just because you played it once, it doesn't make it less intense. I think Neverwinter Nights 2 pulled something like this off in the finale, only with team members turning on the player if their loyalty was too low. Same result. Pointing the weapon at someone you actually care about.

His suggestion even has bossfights - not just Marauder Shields. I like the confrontations with Harbinger and TIM.

Having the squadmates with shepard gives a sense of unity, the theme Mass Effect has been going with all along. Going down anyway with them nearby, in low and mid EMS endings, is much more bearable and bittersweet than dying alone. Seriously. That's what bugs be about the ending we have now, Shep dies alone, confused, and even if he or she survives, friends and loved one are far away. I can see shepard voluntarily commiting suicide after hearing about this. How was this supposed to be uplifting?

Also, space battles. Who doesn't love space battles? And like this person said, missed opportunity: Neverwinter Nights 2 also allowed to build up forces and place them wherever the "Knight-Captain" wanted them to be. I was expecting this to happen with the ground support team. It didn't.

The ending described here has truly an epic vibe, worthy of three playthroughs or more. What we have currently is acceptable for a mediocre movie, but not an epic game trilogy. Game -/- Movie.

Also: Shepard's squadmates represent the different races. Tali makes me care about the quarians, Liara about the Asari, Wrex about the Krogans and Garrus about the turians. They represent what Shepard should care about, not just some faceless statistics. This is a reason why the current end sequence is insulting: Only human soldiers are seen cheering. Were the other races used as cannon fodder for Earth, so earth can now rule supreme? This is not just about earth. This is about the Galaxy as a whole, their inhabitants. Not just humans alone.

Modifié par NekOoNinja, 19 mars 2012 - 03:08 .


#3377
leapingmonkeys

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Oh yeah, someone mentioned the whole "multiplayer" thing. Kill it. Kill it hard. It is annoying as heck that MP impacts the ability of one to win in single-player mode. It is a ham-handed attempt to force everyone into playing MP, which is frankly repulsive.

Modifié par leapingmonkeys, 19 mars 2012 - 03:11 .


#3378
Lasergrid

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My point is going to start with a congratulations to Bioware for making quite possibly the greatest Sci-Fi game trilogy ever made. It's a real shame the ending almost broke my heart with Mass Effect. Almost.

For a suitable ending, there had to be the element of variety in the ending. Like so many people before me have said, the Mass Effect 2 ending was a perfect example of how this should have played out.

The outcomes and consequences should have been decided on choices made throughout the entire series, as well as the Effective Military Strength and Galactic Readiness in ME3. For me, the best way to this would be several endings ranging from good, to bad, to catastrophic. I was thinking maybe that in the darker endings, Shepard dies and the attempt to save the galaxy is a complete failure. Maybe the 'hollow victory' ending would involve Shepard dying, but his love interest also. I was thinking Admiral Hackett, too. He could go down with his ship to save the Crucible. The good ending could involve Shepard surviving reuniting with his love interest (for those little blue babies my Shep was always promised!). So many factors should be considered too, like whether or not you kept the Collector base. What would that mean for Cerberus? The Illusive Man? The Reapers.

It all comes down to, like I said, every single choice in the game having an impact on how the game would end.

If anything good is to be taken from the ending at all, it's the music and Anderson's death. They worked extremely well, and paired to together made for an extremely emotional exit by Shepard's older half-sidekick (like Halo's Johnson).

Thanks for letting me put my views forward.

#3379
Cribbian

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I would like to see some more content for the ME2-squadmates who weren't in the ME3-squad. Maybe in the form of a LotSB-style DLC in wich they get to temporarily join shepard.

#3380
maxpowers2525

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Rachni decision had no pay off at all and it was one of the biggest choices from ME1

#3381
Varus Torvyn

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Lasergrid wrote...

My point is going to start with a congratulations to Bioware for making quite possibly the greatest Sci-Fi game trilogy ever made. It's a real shame the ending almost broke my heart with Mass Effect. Almost.

For a suitable ending, there had to be the element of variety in the ending. Like so many people before me have said, the Mass Effect 2 ending was a perfect example of how this should have played out.

The outcomes and consequences should have been decided on choices made throughout the entire series, as well as the Effective Military Strength and Galactic Readiness in ME3. For me, the best way to this would be several endings ranging from good, to bad, to catastrophic. I was thinking maybe that in the darker endings, Shepard dies and the attempt to save the galaxy is a complete failure. Maybe the 'hollow victory' ending would involve Shepard dying, but his love interest also. I was thinking Admiral Hackett, too. He could go down with his ship to save the Crucible. The good ending could involve Shepard surviving reuniting with his love interest (for those little blue babies my Shep was always promised!). So many factors should be considered too, like whether or not you kept the Collector base. What would that mean for Cerberus? The Illusive Man? The Reapers.

It all comes down to, like I said, every single choice in the game having an impact on how the game would end.

If anything good is to be taken from the ending at all, it's the music and Anderson's death. They worked extremely well, and paired to together made for an extremely emotional exit by Shepard's older half-sidekick (like Halo's Johnson).

Thanks for letting me put my views forward.

I agree...Mass Effect 2 had varied endings, and it was stated in an interview that Shepard could die permanently in ME2.

ME1 and ME2 worked beautifully with the player's choices, so much so that it was almost the equal of The Witcher, yet ME3's ending tossed out all of your choices from ME1 onwards.

#3382
Guest_Catch This Fade_*

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The VS got shortchanged again, they need more content.

#3383
solidsnake1977

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Let me first say to Bioware "Thank You." for making this great series and also other series which I have spent many hours playing. I have been a big fan for a long time of your work.

First thing I really enjoyed Mass Effect 3.. the gameplay was solid and the storylines going thru the game was excellent.

Now having said that lets talk about what I didnt like...

1. I HATE the quest interface, Not sure how many have touched upon this but not having a real quest tracking system of any sort was a huge pain. I spent as much time running around the Citadel looking to see if new conversations would come up instead of truly progressing thru the story. I know you could just pull up the mission and try to rely on memory what planet to go to and the name of the item, however even then it never updated anything in the quest log once you found said item... I feel this could have been done better.

2. Now onto everyones favorite topic.. the ending.
My dissapointment with it was its left to open and you have more unanswered questions then answers, It felt like a ending you would find in a part 1 or 2 of a trilogy... not the end of one. There is no true closure on things like what happens to all the races fighting the reapers after Shepard's choice? Why was the Normandy racing thru space and crew members or your romances thoughts on events after? The origins of the Star Child? The end scene with Shepard has him in what looks like his battle armor, when the last I saw him he didnt have that on? On top of the unaswered stuff I felt that I really didnt have a real impact on how things turned out to begin with, the only difference was the different colors on the explosion of the citadel (refered to as Space Magic... I chuckle everytime I say it now.) and who shows up on the Jungle Planet scene. No different dialog.. no ramifications on the choices you made or how they effect the different races you brought to war. All we get from it is "Well, you destroy the relays no matter what you do.. maybe merge organics and synthetics or destroy the reapers, all races are now stranded near earth so no matter what you did prior for them and their planets.. it doesnt matter cause they cant go home.". This just feels very unsatisfying playing thru all the drama and action and fighting to get such a blah ending. 

I will say I didnt expect a "Unicorn and Raindbow" ending, I fully expected for Shepard to die while playing thru. I just think that for such a epic story you have crafted for the ME universe and for Shepard that this kind of ending is really poorly done and could have ended with MUCH more closure and resolution. This fact alone really kills the replayability of the series for me, Why play thru the game again for a ending that doesnt change except for a few details that wasnt effected by any choices made throughout the series?

Well I think that sums up my feelings and thoughts on it nicely, I want to thank Bioware again for making a great and fun series. its been a blast and I hope you can find someway to rectify this ending either though DLC or a patch. I for one would look forward to a for a DLC that further explains things and brings more closure. I am even patient enough to wait for it, I understand things take time to develop. However until something is changed.. I dont think i will be revisiting the ME universe again.

Thanks for the fun and memories.

#3384
Frostfiend

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leapingmonkeys wrote...

Oh yeah, someone mentioned the whole "multiplayer" thing. Kill it. Kill it hard. It is annoying as heck that MP impacts the ability of one to win in single-player mode. It is a ham-handed attempt to force everyone into playing MP, which is frankly repulsive.


The multiplayer should not impact the single player game since not everyone can or want to play the MP parts.

#3385
Mark of the Dragon

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Well for starters I actually really liked the ending up until they started showing the Mass Relays exploding and the Normandy crash, especially the control ending. So to be honest I would like Bioware to create two new endings a happy and sad one.
In both endings the Normandy crash should be cut out. This was my biggest issue cause it makes Shepards sacrifice worthless. Replace it with a look at al our squadmates on earth. Use the time to add closure to our story and reveal the fate of our companions.
Also dont have the Relays blow up it really just makes the entire game pointless.
Other then that its up to you Bioware. I just really hated the Normandy crash and how we never really know the results of our final descision and more importantly what happens to our teammates.

#3386
VelvetStraitjacket

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I also agree that having to play Multiplayer to get the "best" endings should be removed. One day the multiplayer servers will get shut down, it always happens, so requiring us to play Multiplayer to get maximum EMS is a very, very bad idea. Please consider lowering the EMS requirements so we can get the maximum without being forced to play multiplayer.

#3387
starscreamerx31

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Other than the endings and bugs that plauge this game i was slightly unhappy with the lack of wheel dialouge mass effect 3 offered. That was something i always loved and appreciated. I also agree that i was slightly disappointed with the lack of character interaction with the previous members of the mass effect 2 crew but who knows perhaps dlc will fix that issue. The last and final thing that i disapprove of was how the side missions were handled on the journal side of things. Mass effect 2's journal informed you if you got a certain item or talked to the neccesary people. Whete as mass effect 3 didnt inform you of anything.

#3388
Varus Torvyn

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PsychoHitsPeach wrote...

I also agree that having to play Multiplayer to get the "best" endings should be removed. One day the multiplayer servers will get shut down, it always happens, so requiring us to play Multiplayer to get maximum EMS is a very, very bad idea. Please consider lowering the EMS requirements so we can get the maximum without being forced to play multiplayer.

I agree, single-player should have had a way to improve readiness. Your point about MP servers being closed is a valid one.

#3389
Rm80

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Minor thing I wish for was some sort of quest tracker for the Citadel quests so you know your progress
Major thing I wanted was the feeling that Shepard was a hero in the end (Dead or alive does not mather) I did not get that feeling at all... for the reasons other people already posted (one of them being Shepard never had a chance to defeat the reapers since the cruiceble could never fire)

#3390
TheKingofRedLions

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A few key things for me.

________WAR ASSETS_____________________________________________________________

The gaining of war assets was a focus this whole game, yet there was minimal visual representation in the final battle/before the final battle. It would be a great addition to see how this force you built to take on the reapers is actually doing.

For example - if you choose the biotics to support instead of attack - show this in a little snippet - or vice versa if they attacked. I made a decision, but I dont really see what happened - so it really doesnt matter on future playthroughs.

________TECH ARMOR____________________________________________________________

As a personal preference, the option to see my tech armor as a sentinel during cutscenes should be present. It doesn't make sense that my Shep would turn off his shields randomly in the middle of a battle.

_________DLC ARMOR_____________________________________________________________

I would also love to see the classic N7 armor return (the one from ME1, beginning of ME2.) This is purely nostalgia/preference.

_________OVERALL/ENDING_______________________________________________________

Overall the game was incredible, I am on a second playthrough currently. The multiplayer is an absolute chaotic blast and great new mode for the series. My only complaints were with the last 5 minutes and the brief conclusion I was given. An extension on the ending would be much appreciated, I spent hundreds of hours on multiple Sheps - I want epic battles.


Thanks for your time.

#3391
chop_shop

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 Just wanted to say thanks for listening to the fans and taking our suggestions into consideration. I've created a BSN account just so I could post a reply for you!

I have been with the ME series since the first game. I love that Shepard's story has always been YOUR story. There is no canon or right or wrong choices. There has never been only one way to solve a problem. When ME3 was in the works, fans were expecting (because we were directly promised) a variety of endings that would matter based on your past decisions. What we were given was one ending (albeit a second or two in which earth was fine, partially burnt, or completely burnt toast) in a multitude of colors that doesn't even make sense if you follow the lore that bioware has so beautifully & elegantly inserted into the ME universe at previous points in the series.

It's been said before, but how can stranding the multi-specied fleet in Sol be "uplifting", when the planet doesn't have the resources to support them? How long will the turians and quarians survive if they can't eat human food? How will the different races get along as tensions build and resources become scarce? Doesn't that mean that all galaxy-wide communication is lost as well if the relays are lost? And how is every system containing a relay not instantly destroyed as the codex says it should be (though I admit there is some creative license to make an exception for relays destroyed by the crucible)?

Why did the Normandy abandon Shepard and the battle by going through a relay? And how did my crewmates who were on earth (even right behind me before the citadel) make it on board? How did Anderson and TIM make it on the citadel? And why weren't we allowed to ask questions of the Starchild, when Shepard has always talked to adversaries in the past?

The plot twist (synthetics destroy organics so that they won't be destroyed by synthetics) goes against the very themes that ME supported in all 3 games - second chances, cooperation, and perseverance. Why couldn't Shepard mention that the quarians and geth are allies, and that EDI and Jeff are in a relationship? It goes against Shepard's previous actions to just accept these pitiful choices without a fight.

If the Starchild is the catalyst of the citadel, why did it need Sovereign to "unlock" the citadel?

It's not that the ending isn't "happy enough." It's a terrible ending because it doesn't make sense, it's not really affected by your choices, and there's no closure to the races/characters that we've come to care about over the course of 3 games.

As for what bioware can do to make it better? There should be a DLC to change the ending. I thought the deleted scene between Shepard and Anderson was absolutely beautiful, and would be a perfect way to let the gamer (remember, Shepard's story is OUR story) decide the post-game fate of Shepard by picking a dialogue option. Do you want Shepard to settle down with his/her LI, or continue to be a Spectre/soldier? 

I think whether or not Shepard, squadmates (both new and old), races, and fleets survive should really depend on the war assets. Fans were expecting to SEE their decisions play out in some sort of glorious combat scene. ME2 carried this out amazingly, with you seeing exactly how your choices played out. Unlike ME3, after all the trouble I went through saving the rachni queen twice, having my choice manifest as a couple of points on a bar was truly disappointing. 

Mass Effect does not have to end on a happy note, but I think players who went above and beyond with war assets should be rewarded with a better outcome (more people alive; you could do this ending similarly to Dragon Age). Simultaneously, don't you think it is weird that a player can purposefully make the worst possible decisions in all 3 games and STILL destroy the reapers? This goes to show that there is NOT a variety of endings (just the difference in what happens to earth). I was expecting a complete LOSE-LOSE ending (reapers win/galaxy destroyed, cut scene ends with the newest alien race discovering Liara's time capsule), and that option should be on the table as well.

We don't need to know what/where the reapers come from. They've always said they were above our knowing, so stick with it. Go with indoctrination theory, and have everything that Starchild said be Harbinger's way of trying to control Shepard. Then have Shepard wake up, kick ass, and give us a few different endings depending on our war assets and Anderson's conversation.

With the current "ending," the replayability of the entire ME series plummets. Why should I bother replaying the game and making different choices when the ending is the same?

I have been a loyal bioware fan for quite some time, but I will not buy any Mass Effect  DLC until the ending is fixed (I actually would buy a corrected ending DLC, though making it free would be the best way to bolster the fans and gain our support back). If there is no correction, I also will no longer buy any bioware game. I'm sorry to have to set an ultimatum, but the vast majority of ME fans agree. 

Thanks for listening.

#3392
ahmedsamo1

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Velocithon
you said that
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok. I literally signed in the first time in a few years to post to this.

WHAT WE WANT (in my opinion):

First, I want to see the War Assets I worked so hard to get in the Final Battle. I do not recall seeing any of the Citadel assets, the Rachni, the Mercenary groups, Miranda, Samara, Jack, or any of my other squadmates (aside from the two I chose) fighting in the Final Battle AT ALL. I didn't even see the Geth fleet. Come on. I worked so hard to get this, why can't I see them fight to save the galaxy?

Next, I those War Assets that I gathered to actually have an impact on the ending. If I had ALL the War Assets, I should expect a very special and rewarding ending. If I had lots of Assets, but not all, I just expect a great ending. If I had around half the Assets, I should expect a more grim ending. If I had the bare essential Assets that I picked up during the Priority questline, I should expect a bad ending.

HOWEVER. All the squadmates that I SAVED in ME2 should have more weight on the ending then they did. If I could assign them roles in the fight, that would be INCREDIBLE. "Jack, give those soldiers some cover!." "Garrus, lead Alpha team to the right flank, and Grunt on the left flank". Even if I could direct the Geth, Quarian, and Rachni fleets (since those you have a direct link to saving/destroying). All very similar to ME2 in the end when I gave people roles. This would be AMAZING.

Finally, when all is said and done, I want to see who survived. I want to see the result of my work. I want to see the world in ruins, or the world being rebuilt. I want to see the Krogan rejoicing with Krogan babies next to them. I want to see Tail's beachfront home on Rannoch with the Geth helping her build it, or the Geth alone on Rannoch if that's whay I decided. I want to see who I ordered to their deaths in the Reaper fight because I made the wrong decision (perhaps because I didn't do talk to Jack in Purgatory and she dies in the Final Battle). I want to see Hackett address the fleets after victory, or sucumb to the Reapers in defeat. I want to see Liara and Shepard embracing each other, or Liara staring at a picture of me. CONSEQUENCES AND REPERCUSSIONS.

This is a phenomenal game, just NEEDS a better ending that makes sense.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

my idea too

#3393
rock_box

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Expansion thoughts:
1) Chakwas and Brandy - if you and Chakwas "have the drink after defeating the Reapers" The doc and all the crew mates should definitely throw one back in memory of Shep.

2) Love Interest - if you stick with the same LI through the series (you can profess your love to either Ash or Liara, that I know of) LI should definitely be preggo.

3) Grunt - Show Grunt f***ing some Brutes up (like in the Rachni cave... then going back to Tuchanka to be greeted by a bunch of horny (no longer sterile or thought to be, depending on how that turned out) female Krogan :D

4) After Credits - While easily my favorite part of the ending, they could alter this up just a tad for us who have stuck through the entire series. Kid saying "Uncle or Grandpa Conrad," would have been epic.

#3394
Mnementh2230

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The game was great, up until the last 10 minutes.

Then it turned to crap, for reasons everyone else has already touched on - no closure, no explanation, plot holes, unexplained crap like the Normandy inexplicably being in the middle of a jump, etc.

Re-write it. Explain some stuff, don't just hand-wave at and call it "mysterious". The rest of the writing was top-notch, but this decidedly wasn't. Give our choices *MEANING*.

#3395
bobafett007

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I wish you guys could bring back the dark energy storyline at the end as the twist. It's not too late. What was the point of them building the human reaper if not to stop the dark energy apocalypse scenario. The crucible should be a trap and the end should be indoctrination. Once you snap out of it you should then be given the choice to destroy the reapers or help Harbinger complete the human reaper.

#3396
Syrius013

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Not sure if this will get to Bioware, but I will try anyways.

To say I loved this game would be an understatement. I adore Mass Effect and everything it chooses to be, from the incredible gameplay to the amazingly indepth characters to the unique storyline. ME3 had a lot to live up to with the perfection that was ME2 and it delivered. I know a lot of fans are disappointed with the ending, and I myself was a little taken aback. Up until Shepard gets hit by the laser, I was in shock, staring at my screen in adoration, when suddenly the game stopped making sense, as if it was a completely different game. When the credits hit, I was wondering if I had been fooled. Maybe that is why I find the indoctrination theory so appealing, because it seems to fit what happened so well. However I am not angry with Bioware. The company has been making my favorite video games for a long time, not once failing me in the slightest. I have faith.

***
However there are two things that greatly bothered me about the game. First, I am still in shock that no matter what you do or what choices you make, certain characters such as Mordin, Legion, and Thane die. I had thought that ME was focused greatly on choices, that the story of Shepard was ours to control and shape as we saw fit. I know that there are always casualties in war, and I suppose Bioware wished to reflect this, but I was hoping it would happen honestly, casualties caused by my decisions and actions, not forced upon me by the game.

Lastly. Thane. I have two Shepards. My male Shepard who romanced Tali and a female with Thane. Wow, what a difference. The Tali romance was everything I wanted and more, but did Bioware suddenly grow a hatred for Thane? For a character who was highly featured in the 2nd installment, he suddenly got a back seat in the story line, not even earning a paramour achievement, almost as if we who chose him as our LI were being punished. When he died, I searched the internet, wondering what horrible choice I made to deserve what happened. Upon learning that he would die no matter what I did, or said, I almost quit the game. I understand there was always the matter of his illness looming over the story, but hey, Shepard took down a Reaper with a Thresher Maw, I think we could cure one Drell. I just ask for equal focus for each character, especially the romancable ones. I know this is a high demand, but I just feel cheated. Some people favor Liara or Ashley or Garrus, and I am sure that they are quite pleased with the amount of interaction they received. However I am sure that there are players who favor Jacob and Thane, players who have been clearly pushed to the side.

***
Sorry for the wall of text, I didn't intend for it to be so long, I just love this game so much and wished to express my feelings about it. 
In summary:
-Fantastic game. Bravo Bioware.
-More in shock and confusion about the ending, than angry. I have trust that Bioware will explain things.
-Was very displeased that certain character deaths were forced upon us no matter what decision or choice we made (ie Legion, Thane, Mordin)
-Very unhappy that certain characters were highly ignored, such as Thane, not even receiving a paramour achievement. 

Modifié par Syrius013, 19 mars 2012 - 04:22 .


#3397
Mechanic

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Why are these characters like Miranda, Jack ... no normal sex scenes, instead of which we have the "black screen"? It's not as minor characters, such as Cortez, Traynor, who even with homosexuality have unique sex scenes. They play an important role in the universe of Mass Effect, so I think that a novel with them must be completed not "black screen". Just personally, I get the feeling of unfinished novel against the backdrop of the rest ... My naivete wants DLC, "solves" this problem.:happy:
Sorry for my bad english.:(

#3398
TcomJ

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You might wanna change the "Credit" Theme of the old one. I think that music might become the punishment reinforcement signal to whoever hate that endings. We don't need to be reminded about how ****ty it was. LOL

#3399
clutzo the hopless

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Frostfiend wrote...

leapingmonkeys wrote...

Oh yeah, someone mentioned the whole "multiplayer" thing. Kill it. Kill it hard. It is annoying as heck that MP impacts the ability of one to win in single-player mode. It is a ham-handed attempt to force everyone into playing MP, which is frankly repulsive.


The multiplayer should not impact the single player game since not everyone can or want to play the MP parts.


Indeed; I don't have the bandwidth for multiplayer, and was disappointed to see that it had an impact on the campaign (though, with the generic nature of the endings, it could be argued that the impact was negligible).  I was hoping that multiplayer matches could be advantageous in unlocking new choices, but not necessary.

#3400
seitani

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I would pay for a new dlc. 10-20 € new ending is not gonna break my love for the series so please make it happen Bioware either free or not.