7052 réponses à ce sujet

[darkshadow136]

The only thing I see that would work is by removing the Starchild altogether, and have Harbinger Reanimate the illusive man’s body like Sovereign did with Saren in ME1, and have Harbinger do battle with Sheppard 1on1 inside the Citadel. Most players of ME3 expected that Harbinger was going to play a very important part in the story, and fully expected a final showdown of sorts between Sheppard and Harbinger.

The rest of how the ending would happen from there Bioware can work their magic. I do feel though if they went that route they could incorporate peoples choices into at least 6 possible ending outcomes going from very good-worst.
Also they really need to separate multiplayer from having influence on single player. Despite what they say there is no way to get the ending were Sheppard draws his one breath before credits without playing multiplayer.

If that is too much for them, then they at least to lower the assets required to get that, since even if you make all the right decisions, and gather all war assets you can’t get that ending unless playing multiplayer, and they also promised that it would be possible to get all the endings without playing multiplayer.

[austinsj82]

My biggest problem with the indoctrination theory is if Harbinger knows Shepard is alive and is trying to indoctrinate him why would he bother doing that? Why wouldn't he just vaporise him? he knows how big a threat Shepard is at this point.

IF Bioware is going to create an entirely different ending after the run on the beam then best of luck and I will look forward to seeing what they come up with, fingers crossed it is better than the original. 

However if they are going to tweak the 3 endings slightly I have some thoughts about how the choices could be revised keeping them all somewhat "bittersweet" without being too bitter to swallow. 

The final conversation with the catalyst should definately allow you to ask more questions and have them answered about what the choices mean for the future of galactic civilisation, allow Shepard to argue the case more for organics rather than just passively accepting what he is being told. 

When it comes to the ending choices.

Destroy Ending: Shepard lives, only the Reapers die not all synthetics, but the mass relays are destroyed. Fleet losses depend on ems, if ems is low enough Normandy can be lost, otherwise Normandy is still intact at games end for future adventures. (Albeit In a severely hindered me universe without mass relays but one that can live free of the Reaper threat)

Synthesis Ending: Shepard lives, Reapers are allowed to leave for dark space, everyone is reunited who lived through the final battle but now everyone is a hybrid synthetic/organic, mass relays intact. Fleet casualties/Normandy status based on ems.

Control Ending: Mass relays intact and everyone gets to keep their original form but Shepard dies, Normandy crew's fate is decided by ems. high it survives, too low it crash lands with some casualties. surviving crew/fleet members honor shepard and he goes down as a legend in history for giving his life to stop the reapers.

------------------------------
Other Notes:

The final battle on earth should be edited to periodically show scenes of war assets and recruited ex-party members (jack/miranda/zaeed/grunt etc) who are fighting for you in the final battle, whether they live or die can depend on ems/readiness and whether or not ex party members were loyal to you in ME2 and ME1 (like if you did the loyalty missions in me1 like wrex's armour/tali's geth data/garrus' c-sec loose end) Granted I don't know if this is possible with the way save games work, if it isn't then just base it on galactic readiness so we at least have some control over it.

In all endings show the results of our decisions we've made throughout the game via cutscenes or inengine cinematics or even maybe Liara doing a voiceover telling us what happened as a result of our decisions throughout the game as the final entry into her Shepard hologram thing.

My final thought that I am throwing out there is DO NOT just tack on a "BG2:Throne Of Bhaal" style epilogue. I think the last thing anyone wants is the game ending and cinematics to be identical and then a scrolling wall of text saying "Garrus Vakarian continued to have many badass adventures and once a year visited his favourite spot on the citadel to remember his old commander" 

That will not cut it as far as i'm concerned. If it costs £10 extra i'll take that hit to have an ending with pre-rendered cinematics and high production values that is more satisfactory.

 

[yumesama]

 The Strategy Guide gives away how much impact your war assets/galactic readiness has.

We never get to see, in-game, what impact it has.

After fighting off the indoctrination attempt, I never got to see earth getting saved. I have seen two clips, one that shows me that shepard survives, and one that lets me KNOW that the galaxy was ultimately saved. 

That is fine and dandy, actually i like a lot of how it's done, but getting to know what happens to earth in a game where the tagline is "take earth back" is kind of important. 

After the clip with Shepard breathing, i wouldn't beed more than for instance:
-Still pictures during the credits that shows how the flotilla beats the reapers on earth
-pictures showing the actual use of the crucible
-pictures showing a multitude of my war assets in combat with the reapers
-pictures of earth, tuchanka etc, either destroyed or flourishing

Other than a bit of closure on what happens, just a tiny bit, i want to say that Mass Effect 3 is one of the most gripping and fantastic games i have ever played. I bought the limited edition with my fiance, and we have laughed, crused, cried and had an amazing time together as we've alternated continuing my paragon Shepard and her renegade Shepard through the amazing accomplishment that this game is.

I'm miffed about the ending, but i am looking forward to both content and upcoming games from Bioware with excitement. To  the entire team that worked on ME3, thank you for your amazing contribution to a roller coaster ride that has few, if any equals.

[BFG Achilies]

my main issue with the current ending is the fact that it makes almost no sense when placed within the mass effect universe. i am not looking for a happy ending, although i would enjoy the option, i am simply asking for an ending that is appropriate to the rest of the series.

im sure it has already been raised but the fact that the ending of mass effect 3 directly contradicts the ending and plot of mass effect one is a huge concern of mine. i am also wondering why there was no explanation as to why Councilor Anderson was suddenly Admiral Anderson with no memory of having been the human representative on the council.

just a quick note regarding the idea that has been bouncing around about possible shepard indoctrination. this idea to me just seems like a lazy explanation for the issues that people have with the ending, a patch or band-aid to try and hide the problem by hiding behind the idea that it was all a dream.

i absolutely loved the mass effect series and i am just asking for the final installment to reflect the adventure, i am willing to wait as long as it takes to have an acceptable ending

[monsoontide]

Top of My list of "suggested changes" isn't technically a change, but with Dr RayMuzyka's announcement today talking about something happening as early as April I would encourage BIOWARE to NOT RUSH INTO making something just to calm people down.

In several threads I have read, the general concensus is to take at least 6 -12 months to develop something really worthwhile IF Bioware decides to go that route... rather than just slapping on a band-aid solution.

And also to reiterate I think almost everyone thought the game was totally worth the 95% scores the critics gave it - it's just that last 5% that has tripped everything up.

[ArchLord James]

Call me old fashioned, but I think me and whole lot of other people just want to make the reapers pay for all the death and destruction they have caused.

As it stand now, no matter what ending you pick, the Mass Effect trilogy can be summed up like this: Mass effect is about Commander Shepard's adventures throughout the galaxy in an effort to unite the civilized races of the galaxy against an evil genocidal force called the reapers. However, after uniting much of the galaxy, and winning many victories against the reapers, Shepard ultimately decides the reapers are right and the only way for life to continue is to help the reapers implement a new solution.

Ultimately I think the real problem with the endings that people have is it justifies the reapers. We don't want to go along with their solution, we want a final showdown with harbinger!

[Neverwinter_Knight77]

I've already posted my own suggestions, so now I'll post his, because they're relevant. It's a 30 minute video, but sit through it and listen. This man has it right! I like his ideas much, much better than the original ending.

[jsblake01]

 I have played many games through the years and by far the mass effect trilogy has been my absolute fave.

The issue of the ending: From an artistic story the endings all make sence. However for many devoted gamers they have become so attached to the characters in a real tangable way that not haveing an opertunity to have the happy ending (shep lives and gets their lover too) feels like a choice has been with held from them. It is simple physicology. players want the oppertunity to be the hero and survive and live happily ever after. That being said, it has been the emotional response they have been acustomed to in the previous 2 games. What it comes down to really, is Bioware made such a great game that brought true emotion and love for the universe and characters they created.  This intense care for biowares creation is a postive outcome. they did their job more than well, they were magnificent. It has been a very nartural response from many fans of the mass effect universe, I believe the criticism in many cases have been more than that, and I apolagise for them. We all love the games dearly.  It feels kinda funny, You created us the fans and now were turning on our creators, lol.

Closure:  It is a natural human response to want to know what happend next. I think even more to the point, everybody just wants to know what happend to their friends. Did they survive, what did they go through, is there somthing next on the horizon for them. The universe is not as important to us as those amazing characters you created for us to fall in love with. not to say the universe isnt important, its just the canvese that you painted on. I beleive for most gamers this is what they would like to know, the mystery of the state of the universe will come out in the next game (hint).

Anyway, I just wanted to tell all of you at bioware to keep your chins up and held high, you made an amazing game trilogy. And your support for us the fans is fantastic (for me the proof was in lair of the shadow braoker dlc) thx bioware for all youve done.

[darkshadow136]

Dear Bioware,

Indoctrination
would be a cop-out on Bioware’s part, especially when you consider that
Sheppard was able to break the indoctrination control of the illusive man and
shoot him, or force him to shoot himself using paragon dialogue option. Adding
pieces of information without actually changing the ending is not going to
satisfy fans.

SPOILERS…………..

The only thing I see that would work is by removing the
Starchild altogether, and have Harbinger Reanimate the illusive man’s body like
Sovereign did with Saren in ME1, and have Harbinger do battle with Sheppard
1on1 inside the Citadel. Most players of ME3 expected that Harbinger was going
to play a very important part in the story, and fully expected a final showdown
of sorts between Sheppard and Harbinger.

The rest of how the ending would happen from there Bioware can
work their magic. I do feel though if they went that route they could
incorporate peoples choices into at least 6 possible ending outcomes going from
very good-worst.

Also they really need to separate multiplayer from having influence on single
player. Despite what they say there is no way to get the ending were Sheppard
draws his one breath before credits without playing multiplayer.

If that is too much for them, then they at least to lower the
assets required to get that, since even if you make all the right decisions,
and gather all war assets you can’t get that ending unless playing multiplayer,
and they also promised that it would be possible to get all the endings without
playing multiplayer.


The game play up to the last part of
ME3 was great, but the end of the game ruined the entire series and the
franchise. The parts that ruined the game for me are listed below.

1.1.
The endings for the game were
horrible 3 choices that led to 16 variations of the same black. No variety like
promised, all the endings shared 95% the same cut scenes. We were promised
throughout the series that all our choices would shape not only our Sheppard
but the galaxy and the final ending to the series; this was taken away in the
final 15 minutes of the game. You can’t just take an interactive game built on
choice and make it into a linear game in the final moments.

1.2.
Multi player content should have no
effect on the single player campaign. There is a reason why no other game has implemented
this, since not everyone like multi player. A player should be able to reach
100% galactic readiness without having to play multi player.

1.3.
I did not like that after you make it
clear to Cortez that you are not interested in him, that he still seems to push
you towards liking him in future conversations. My personal beliefs I don’t
approve of the Homosexual lifestyle, and I don’t feel I need to have that
pushed on my in a game.

1.4.
We want our endings more varied and distinct
from each other like was promised, having all our choices taken into account in
the final outcome.

1.5.
Fill the plot holes give us a real back
round on the Reapers, and their purpose, bring Harbringer into the picture
more.

1.6.
For those that ME3 is their first
exposure to the ME universe, offer them a DLC that allows them to make the
choices they would have had a chance to if they played ME1-ME2. This will make
more revenue for Bioware in a DLC purchase, and give the player a chance to
have a real full ME3 experience and a bump in galactic readiness to help with
their ending.

1.7.
The Rachni were always represented in
ME1/ME2 as being an important part of ME3, and in ME3 they played a very small
part. We had to save them again, and all they did was help build the crucible.
We should have seen some Rachni ships in our fleet and so on.

1.8.
We were also told in previous
magazine interviews prior to release that Cerberus was going to be an enemy,
and that we should make sure to destroy the collector base in our ME2 saves, This was so the illusive man
would not get a hold of Reaper tech. Well I destroyed the collector base and
the Illusive man still got a hold of Reaper tech. How he got acquired Reaper
tech needs to be explained.

1.9.
One of the pieces of feedback many of
us asked for was the return of the Mako Tank and exploration missions. That
feedback seems to have fallen on deaf ears since we have no Mako missions in
ME3.

1.10.
We had Loyalty missions in ME2 and it
would have been nice to have them with the new squad members of ME3, it added
immersion into the relationships with the characters.

1.11.
A helmet toggle option similar to
what we had in ME1 would be nice, especially with the custom sets of armor we
got from pre-orders, and import saves.

1.12.
If you are going to have 16 variations
on the ending fine. But You could cut that to 6 endings and make them so varied
and different it would make a more complete experience, with a excellent, very
good, good, neutral, bad, very bad ending. The key thing being that it takes
our past choices and actions into account, not just war assets and galactic readiness.

I know that if at least the endings
are not redone I will no longer purchase products from Bioware, and the ending
DLC should be free, since we already paid for a proper ending to the game we
purchased. People make the argument that the game is Art and not subject to
pressure to change.

I make the argument that an
Interactive game like the Mass Effect series, in which certain promises and
descriptions and player game shaping was established by the company makes it a Commercial
product , with art aspects, and a every changing storyline, sue to the players participation
in the creative process. ME3 is not a piece of art to mat and hang on a wall
and it is not a 1st edition book to place in a protective case.

When customers like us give you Bioware
5 years of our life playing your series, making choices, taking different paths
on different Sheppard’s so we can have a complete experience, and that trilogy
is ended in the linear way you chose to do, it was a betrayal not only to your
customers, but to the epic masterpiece that we have helped you shape over the
last 5 years.



Bioware it is time for you to be
Sheppard, and you have a new mission, gain back our loyalty so we can together battle
and claim victory over the Reapers.

[recentio]

Some brief constructive ideas...

> Problem: Player experiences a WTF! reaction to meeting the Starchild.
>> Reason: Unknown godlike character introduced out of nowhere in final scene.
> Possible Solution: Add new mid-game mission on Citadel to plant seeds of suspicion about Catalyst AI existence and motives.
> Intended Result: Player experiences an AHA! reaction to meeting the Starchild.
>> Reason: Clues placed earlier in narrative click into place in player's mind.

> Problem A: Player disagrees philosophically with Starchild's technophobia.
>> Reason: Personal beliefs.
> Problem B: Game's thesis of uniting factions to save everyone is lost in ending.
>> Reason: Thesis of ending -- organic and synthetic life cannot coexist long-term due to physical (pre-Synthesis) differences -- is different from thesis of game.
> Possible Solution: Allow player to reject Starchild's choices and thus its premise. If player gathered maximum EMS, Allied forces win in a straight fight vs. Reapers because no previous cycle had ever successfully united the whole galaxy. If player EMS is too low, Allied forces lose in a straight fight vs. Reapers.
>> Comment: This is a socially relevant message for the world today: Divided we may all be destroyed (eg. nuclear war); but united despite our differences we may all triumph (eg. world peace). That is a powerful message and more valuable to the world than the tech. singularity message, IMO. ME3 is only one scene short of sending that message.
> Intended Result A: Players with philosphical misgivings against Starchild's technophobic motivation are happier.
>> Reason: Player is not forced to play along with a belief they personally reject.
> Intended Result B: Thematic consistency restored to game.
>> Reason: Thesis of ending becomes same as thesis of game.

I hope that some substantial revisions will make the second draft of ME3's ending as mind-blowingly amazing as the rest of the game. Thank you, BioWare.

Modifié par recentio, 22 mars 2012 - 05:02 .

[Kuro_Fenikkusu]

I'm not going to comment on the endings those need to change, but I'm not sure into what. Overall I thought ME3 was amazing. It was an amazing rollercoaster ride...that ran out of track at the end and killed everyone, but endings aside one thing that irked me was the Tali face reveal. The photoshop job was beyond lazy and an insult to people like myself who have been waiting since ME1 to see whats under the mask.

[Neverwinter_Knight77]

Paulomedi wrote...

Neverwinter_Knight77 wrote...

I've already posted my own suggestions, so now I'll post his, because they're relevant. It's a 30 minute video, but sit through it and listen. This man has it right! I like his ideas much, much better than the original ending.

I posted this video and the sequel of it right above you.

This is EXACTLY what we wanted.
How could they be so blind?

Sorry about not noticing, heh... but I like to believe that once they got past a certain point on Earth, the writers passed the script to... some other group entirely... to finish the ending.

[Strider Ryoken]

My suggestions:

1) Allow us to earn a way to save the artificial life we have helped develop from the "destroy" ending; when you accomplish peace between geth and quarian, we can later see that they have even started to develop a simbiotic relationship, and EDI and Joker's relationship also shows that synthetic and biological life can exist apart but at peace; the cycle of either kind of life destroying/controlling the other should be changed.

2) Exploring the real origin of the Keepers; when you reach the citadel, I was expecting a revelation when seeing that Keeper at work while surrounding by dead bodies; if the catalyst is the citadel, perhaps the keepers should have some link or direct relationship with it?

3)Keep the destruction of the relays, no matter what; it goes with the main theme of breaking the cycle of the past, plus, what if a relay survived, or even only activated relays were destroyed? A future game in the Mass Effect universe based on exploring whats beyond new relay would be awesome; hell, a expedition crew of various races going through inactive relays and meeting new species and societies while looking for a way to reunite the fractured galactic society would be fantastic.

3) Closure for our teamates and the galaxy we saved; yes, the trilogy is Shepard/our story, but its through the relationships we built and the choices we made that we shaped our own tales; being able to have some epilogue for these wonderful companions and lovers is needed.

4) Do NOT, I REPEAT, DO NOT give us a happy ending; we can have shepard survive and continue his adventures/life, but this was the worst conflict in galactic history; casualties and destruction should not be ignored; hell, if earth must pay the price, or further sacrifices must be made, then so be it:

5) While not a basic/huge omissions, the lack of a direct final confrontation with the reapers or even Harbinger takes a lot out of the endgame; there is no need for a huge boss fight or epic sequence, but perhaps Harbinger could confront Shepard through the Illusive Man, for example, and even bargain with him.

6) If the Reapers are indeed part of the cycle and under control of the catalyst, then does that make them truly monsters? they are machines enslaved to their programming, so what if we could even save the reapers or help them gain true independence; having your main enemies be revealed to be victims as well would be a hell of a gut punch.

7) Abandon the whole artificial vs biological life theme; having it be so heavily featured in the ending feels nothing short of tackled on and enforced on the players; while it is a theme of the mass effect universe, it shouldnt be THE theme of the mass effect universe; the whole quarian/geth sequence in the game already handles this theme and thus takes out A LOT of its impact in the ending.

8) Finally, do not give us this for free (either in gameplay or pricing terms); if you're going to make a "Mass Effect 3: enhanced edition", then make us earn the new stories, changes and surprises you could give us; take a page from CdProjeckt and their treatment of their "The Witcher" series; yes, they listen to fan feedback and give updates and improve their game, but they do so in a way that gives players new reasons to play again; these guys clearly have been inspired by Bioware's long tradition of excellence, so perhaps they are right on the money here; if you add through DLC new scenarios, options or gameplay requirements for a new and improved Mass Effect 3, then you are giving us more reasons to replay this fantastic game again and again.

9) No suggestions, but rather a thank you for a fantastic trilogy and for being open to new suggestions and listening to your fans; while this is Bioware's work of love and art, and the final choice of reworking it falls in your hands, I have nothing but respect and love for your work; thank you once again, and here's hoping that whatever results from this ends up making your work even better,

[EAadembroski]

 Start with the end of Mass Effect 2... note the myriad of ways the Suicide Mission can play out. 

Readiness becomes your new Loyalty, and War Assets replace the selection of characters for specific jobs. We should see everything we accomplished through the game play out.

Also, several segments... I shouldn't be stuck with one team through the whole thing. It'd be especially cool to see the actions of your ME2 squadmates (Jack in particular comes to mind, considering the whole set up for that.).

I'll run with the Jack example. You have two choices with them... mobile artilary platforms or support soldiers. 

Artilliary with high readiness: Jacks team is able to bring down a ruined tower on top of a Destroyer class Reaper, preventing it from reaching Cortez's downed shuttle. 

Artilliary with low readiness: Jack's team is KIA before they can reach Cortez, Cortez is killed by the Reaper.

Support with High Readiness: Jack's team is able to set a barrier up long enough for Shep & crew to move in and recover Cortez.

Support with low readiness: Jack's team is KIA before they can reach Cortez, Shep & crew is forced to extract Cortez without barrier support, making the mission much more difficult. Cortez can still be killed during the attempt.

The basic idea here is risk/reward. Taking the high-risk option here can result in either Cortez being saved without putting Shepard and team in harms way or distracting them from the main mission, or it can result in Cortez's loss without Shepard having a chance to reverse it. Jack and Cortez are lost.

The conservative option gives Shepard a chance to rescue Cortez, but allows no "auto-save". It diverts Shep from the mission at hand... allowing Reaper forces to regroup elsewhere and making the next mission tougher- UNLESS you acquired the Salarian STG, who are able to create a disruption that allows Shepard to continue as if he hadn't diverted (off hand, I'm not sure it's possible NOT to get STG, just using it as an example).

In other words, the final mission should be a very complex weaving of consequence. 

Finally, the end... there should be dozens. Everything from the big happy ending where everyone has drinks on the beach and Shep & L.I. live happily ever after, all the way down to the entire squad is wiped out, Earth falls, the Reapers settle in to a long century of cleaning up the stragglers. RUN THE GAMBIT... the key is; give me a reason to play the game twice, three times, whatever. 

There are people who probably don't like the idea of playing readiness into it. Personally, I love it, but I do agree that alternative ways to raise readiness should be included in the game. Maybe slower, more deliberate ways.

To be honest, I think things like the Eden Prime supply chains should translate to readiness INSTEAD of War Assets. I'd go through the existing war assets and ask myself, "Is this a direct combatant or support of some sort?" Support would gain readiness, combat would be assets. 

A few extras:

* I think the starchild should be done away with, or confirm "indoctrination theory", making him a figment of Shep's warped mind. In the end, Harbinger should be the antagonist.

* I'd personally keep the TRUE motivation of the Reapers a mystery. My teeny human mind is incapable of comprehending, so I'd just as soon keep it that way. The fact that Godchild sums it up in 2 lines renders that amazing conversation with Sovereign in ME1 moot.

* Destroying the Relays has to go... it totally renders everything we've done to this point pointless.

* In the end, the whole thing SHOULD be bittersweet... but that bittersweetness should be survaying the wreckage of the homeworlds, coming to terms with the massive losses suffered. This cannot me a "personal story about Shepard"... it has to be epic. We have to understand that the majority of those who were alive at the start are now dead. The Batarians have replaced the Krogan on the endanger species list. The happiest of endings is still a post-apocolyptic galaxy. The rebuilding efforts in future games can be interesting (though not without Mass Relays).

Anyways, that's just my elevator pitch. Hope it helps.

Modifié par EAadembroski, 22 mars 2012 - 05:25 .

[Spanking Machine]

One thing I wanted to post here is that based on the public statements by Bioware so far I still feel that you don't understanding why people are upset by the ending. Based on your statements so far it seems like you think that we are just upset that we didn't get a happy ending or that we just have unresolved questions about the end, and while those are issues for some people I don't think that they are the primary reasons for why people are unsatisfied. I believe the larger issues arise from the rejection of the logic given for the motivation for the reapers, which ends up being the primary motivator for the choice of endings at the end of the game, and also in dis-satisfaction with the degree to which our decisions in the game affected the ending. Unless these points are addressed in the fix you are planning to announce in April, I believe that people will lose even more faith in your products, and I really don't want to see that happen because I love your games overall. Please, really listen to what the fans are saying and give us a true fix for the ending rather than just a band-aid. If you do, I will totally be your biggest fan forever.

[monsoontide]

Someone mentioned the Tali Zorah mask reveal... this should be like JUDGE DREDD - you should NEVER see her face, ESPECIALLY if its done using a hacked together stock photo!!!!! Look at all the amazing concept art everyone on the BIOWARE art team made... and gosh darn it, SHE IS A HUMANOID ALIEN - not a human, so her face and body should not totally mimic a human only with two fingers and toes.... that's just going all cheap Star Trek episode on everyone.

[jarms48]

The DLC / Patches I want is primarily

- Ending DLC (Before I even consider the rest)
- Omega DLC (Return of old areas, new areas, main plot quest, side quests, war assets)
- Illium DLC (Return of old areas, new areas, main plot quest, side quests, war assets)
- Return of old areas Feros / Noveria additional side quest DLC
- More missions on Palaven and/or its moon
- I want to get Tali earlier so an option to either help the Quarians or the Turians first would be my idea
- More Dialogue / More Dialogue wheel usage
- More in combat dialogue (Go for the optics, Chiktikka! Go for the optics)
- More enemies in Mulitplayer collectors and mercenary groups my first guess
- More frequent Squad power usage

[RaenImrahl]

Thank you, all, for continuing to express thoughtful and civil suggestions.

Carry on.

[Airell]

With Happy ending make me want to play mass effect again, with sad ending I don't want to play again i just stop. so please bring back the happy ending so I can play mass effect 3 again

[hellgate49698]

I'm sure there have been many post here already about the problems with the endings, but I would like to add my two cents to the pile.

What bothered me about the ending for Mass Effect 3 was the lack of choice and  I wanted an ending that makes sense. Most importantly of all though, was the fact that Shepard felt out of character. (Even those brief text ending we use to get back in the NES days had more cohesiveness then all 3 endings.)

I understand that killing Shepard, may have been important to Bioware to end the series, but the way Shepard died was so unlike the way Shepard had been writen in the past. Personally, I would have made Shepard die in battle or by crashing the Normandy into a Reaper's control ship disrupting the others, not placing his hand on a control panel and vaporizing him or herself.

What I can't understand. Why couldn't Bioware spend a little extra time to include a screen shot of all the other romantic interest that should have been included? Those choices mattered a lot to many Mass Effect fans. And if you had to limit them, you could have at least include 5 choices for Male Shepard and 5 choices for Female Shepard. (I felt really bad for the female Shepard players, because there was only one male interest for them to pick.)

The whole Normandy fleeing Earth not only made zero sense, but made the crew of the normandy seem like they were either cowards or afraid of what Shepard was doing.  Hold the line! j/k

The conversation with the Catalyst was poor at best. Shepard hardly disagrees with anything the Catalyst says and doesn't have a single idea of his or her own. Instead of having the Catalyst talk to Shepard so much about the options, Shepard should have been the one to voice what he or she was going to do. (This would have been the perfect time to include a few choices for conversation.)

Anyone remember the opening of Mass Effect 2? What did Shepard do? Shepard told Kaidan to get off the ship and Joker to get in the escape pod because he / she were in charge.

And at the End of Mass Effect 2 what is Shepard doing? He / she are telling the Illusive man exactly what they thought of his ideas, good or bad and what they were going to do about the Reapers. In Mass Effect 3 Shepard just goes along with whatever the Catalyst says. There is no character or sense of self, just a Reaper clone.

Remember, Shepard being there was supposed to mean that they were in control of the situation, but where was Shepard's assertiveness? The fire which makes Shepard a leader everyone looks to for guidance? This by far was the worst part of the ending. It just felt wrong on so many levels.

As far as changing the Ending, I hope Bioware has been listen to at least some of these post and will use the knowledge to fix things a bit. Everyone here is not asking for Bioware to move Heaven to Earth, but we all feel like it would be nice if Bioware would extend an olive branch to it's loyal fans.

[Indigo the Cat]

I agree with most of your statements except this wildcard of an opinion.

darkshadow136 wrote...

1.3.
I did not like that after you make it
clear to Cortez that you are not interested in him, that he still seems to push
you towards liking him in future conversations. My personal beliefs I don’t
approve of the Homosexual lifestyle, and I don’t feel I need to have that
pushed on my in a game.

This point is highly irrelevant in the game.  If you aren't interested in Cortez, don't talk to him.  He clearly states he had a husband very early in the game, so if homosexuality offends you, why didn't you keep your distance? If you don't talk to him, he'll never have the chance to hit on you... and he doesn't hit on you until very late in the game, and he only does so if you ask him, "Why aren't you looking at me?"

Again, your complaint here rings hollow; you made the choice to get friendly enough with him for him to develop interest in you.  The poor guy is still mourning his deceased husband... if you leave him alone, he won't come near you.  No one forced you to talk to Esteban Cortez even once outside of the drop-shuttle.  Also, Diana Allers and Kaidan Alenko are bisexual, and Samantha Traynor is lesbian (she even hits on EDI), but I don't see you complaining about them... (and the Asari are all pretty much pansexual)

Here's what I feel is a more appropriate synapsis of the problems with the romance sub-plots in ME3:

The romance sub-plots in general needed a lot more work, dialogue and attention than they were given.  Had you romanced Garrus and Tali in ME3 (and perhaps Liara), you do get more out of the relationship than if you decide to rekindle romance or start anew with any of the human options.  However, the "amount" you get out of it is still a bit limited, your interaction with these characters is still primarily unchanged, only adding a bit of extra dialogue in a few conversations.  That said, getting intimate with ANYONE is 100% optional, and BioWare did that for a reason... so people didn't feel forced into romancing anyone, which you never were. 

One of my primary complaints about the paramour sub-plots is that even after you lock-in a romance with someone, she or he still refers to you by last-name or just commander.  Commander makes sense during missions, but there was another option that BioWare missed that they explored in Mass Effect 2...  Remember Thane?  He would call female Shepard "siha" once they started a romance.  A pet-name.  Why did BioWare decide against this in favor of a last-name romance?



Addendum:  This ending idea would provide a way to "end" the game's primary story, but not completely end Cerberus or the Reapers, which would allow for proper DLC that fits in well with the plot and story.  Please read this!

For the ending, it's probably best for BioWare just to scrap the entire star-child idea all together, and instead, let the Crucible attach to the Citadel, in which it creates an almost transformer type interaction.  Here's a better explanation.

The Reapers were warned by the Illusive Man (can we just call him Jack Harper yet?) that Commander Shepard discovered that the Citadel was the Catalyst to the Crucible, so they quickly fled to the Serpent Nebula to take it over and bring it to the thickest concentration of their attack, which was in the Sol System on Earth.  The ending sequence and "beaming up civilians" concept may have to be reworked, but somehow Commander Shepard through the help of the ground-forces and galactic fleets allow her/him to retake the Citadel and have the Crucible attached.  Once it attaches, the Citadel transforms into a supreme dreadnought Star-Ship, capable of taking out Reapers much more conventionally than waiting for their main gun chamber to open up and shooting that.

With this ending, the war doesn't end, but it allows Earth to be taken back, albeit probably at a severe cost for the fleets and ground-teams. (Galactic Readiness Rating and EMS will also be measured here, as their new goal will be to protect the Citadel.) This will be the first major victory that the Milky Way Galaxy has made against the Reapers, showing that the tides have truly turned in their favor.  Commander Shepard and can potentially survive to continue the fight, and this will allow for more DLC to be released as all of the combined forces of every species work to begin the purge of Reapers from the Galaxy.  In the mindset of Javik, his purpose will not be complete until every Reaper has fallen.

Personally, the DLC I most want to see is Return to Omega.  It is STRONGLY implied in-game that DLC wil be released to help Aria take back Omega from Cerberus (hence why it's important to not kill the Ilusive Man just yet).

The Reapers can still be created from both Synthetics and Organics as stated in ME2, that makes sense.  Just get rid of that damn star-child stuff in the Citadel.  If you decide to keep it, then the Indoctrination story is your best option, but I think I'd prefer to scrap the concept all together.

Modifié par Indigo the Cat, 22 mars 2012 - 06:11 .

[krogstor]

I enjoyed the Mass Effect Trilogy but I found Z ending bad because of A,B,C.

All I had to do was copy/paste the original post and it sums it up perfectly just by adding 5 words.

[Eadric]

I apologize for the length of the post.
(The following is meant wholly as constructive criticism.
That’s the good kind. *nods* Some of this may come across as sarcastic, but it
is meant in a heartfelt, friendly way. I’m looking for answers, and I have a
few ideas, but first I need to lay out my beef)

All right, I’ve played through the ending a few times now.
Both times I picked “destroy” because I can’t get the thought out of my head
that the Starchild is lying, and that “control” and “synthesis” are the options
that TIM and Saren would each pick. I’ve got a problem with that.  I’m sure what I have to say is merely echoing
others who have come before, but the least I can do is offer constructive
criticism if it in any way helps a game series that I have come to love.

The ending doesn’t make sense to me at face value. I’ve
tried, I really have, but I just don’t get parts of it. Shepard, my Shepard,
me, myself, I have been conditioned over the course of three games – right up
until the very end – to believe that trying to either control the Reapers (The
Illusive Man) or join with them (as Saren did) was a Bad Idea. 

So, I find myself surprised when the Starchild (what’s the
official term for him/it, anyway?) gives me two seemingly opposite options:
Control (where I die, but apparently my essence somehow gets deposited with the
Reapers so that I can control their very actions?) and Destroy, where the
Reapers are destroyed, but so is anything else that uses Reaper tech.

The idea behind Control is repugnant to me (my Shepard). Why
would I want to control an armada of synthetic-organic hybrids that are only
good for killing and turning organics into mindless slaves? That’s like telling
Luke Skywalker, instead of firing your proton torpedoes into the thermal
exhaust port, destroying the Death Star, get close enough for R2-D2 to
interface with the space station and you can then control the Death Star. Isn’t
that great?

At first glance, Destroy looks like the ending for me. Stop
the Reapers, save the galaxy? Heck, yeah! Oh, but wait…with the Reapers, so too
go all things that stem from the Reapers. Those Geth I helped upload Reaper
code so that they gain true independence and can better fight the Reapers? They
have to die. EDI? Also dies. What about me? The Starchild said even I have
synthetics in me (presumably referring to the cybernetic things that Cerberus
shoved in me to replace missing or damage parts after my death).  The Starchild does not say here that I die
though, so that’s good, right?

Oh, but wait…there’s a Third Option! Synthesis, where I don’t
quite die, but I don’t go on living either. My “essence” (whatever that
is…soul, maybe?) gets shot out into the galaxy and Synthetics and Organics are
somehow fused so that we’re all pretty much the same on that level. I can’t
even begin to understand how the very DNA of
every species in the galaxy can be instantaneously changed so that Joker now
has glowing greenish eyes. This option kind of, sort of, seems okay, but it has
a great big “Huh?? Factor” attached to it. My Shepard must reject this option because…oh
yes, the Reapers are still around.

Ah, but they are not needed anymore if Starchild is to be
believed. So, I’m not controlling Reapers, and they’re not dead, so…what do the
Reapers do now? Go back to dark space and hide, just in case Synthesis doesn’t
go as planned? Go vacation? Finally get their hulls waxed? The Reapers aren’t
just mindless drones, or are they? Starchild controls them (they’re his/its
solution, after all), but with the Citadel destroyed in any of the three (yeah,
there’re three basic endings with a few minor variations – more on this later)
endings, Starchild is…gone? Destroyed? Dead? Either way, now that Starchild’s
home is gone (and presumably with it the means to control the Reapers), the
Reapers now have no direction. So what are they going to do now that their
purpose is no more, and the being in charge of telling them what to do is
potentially AWOL.

The above boils down to this problem: I am not given enough
evidence by the Starchild to be persuaded just why[/i] I should pick Control or Synthesis. After all, it didn’t work
out for TIM or Saren. I get that I’m special somehow, but Shepard isn’t the
type to just accept that. The Destroy choice just makes so much more logical
sense, in my mind, than the other two options, even if it means Geth and EDI cease functioning[/i]. Hey, at least the
galaxy survives. More or less. My solution is to present the player with
better arguments for both the Control and Synthesis options. We already know
why Destroy is a valid choice: it stops the Reapers for good. We don’t know
that about the other two options. Better yet, give us a fourth option so we can
tell Starchild to take a flying leap. Shepard isn’t the type to just pick a
card, any card, and see if it works. He’s kind of like Captain Kirk running the
Kobayashi Maru scenario. He hates to lose. (I know, mixing Science Fiction
franchises, I’m sorry!) So does Shepard.

The Normandy
being shown hurtling through space at mass effect-accelerated velocity (I’ll
abbreviate this to MEAV for now) does not make sense to me. Where is Joker
going, and why? My crew is 100% loyal to me, and would never abandon me unless
I gave them a direct order. Maybe not even then.  What causes the Normandy
to drop out of MEAV? Maybe I misunderstood just how the relays work, but I
thought that as soon as you hit the relay and it gave you the acceleration that
you were good to go. Apparently the relays are needed to maintain your
velocity? If this is so, then how are the relays able to accelerate entire
fleets at a time? Or does the Normandy
have systems that use Reaper technology, so that when the anti-Reaper shockwave
hits them, the engines stop working? And after all that, how does the Normandy
crash on a planet? Wouldn’t the ship just drop out of MEAV if the relays are
necessary to maintain that velocity? If they are not necessary to maintain that
velocity, then the Normandy
shouldn’t have been knocked out of that velocity. There is a problem here.

Some sort of explanation as to why[/i] the Normandy cuts
and runs in the middle of the most epic battle the galaxy has ever seen. This
isn’t the “flee to live and fight another day” kind of scenario. This. Is. It.
It’s now or never, do or die.

Speaking of the Normandy,
how did Ashley get on board? The last thing I saw, she was right behind me
running down the slope to the transporter beam thingy that would take us up to
the Citadel. It was odd seeing her get off the Normandy
with Joker after the crash landing. Did Joker somehow swoop down and pick up my
squad-mates who presumably were also blasted by the Reaper beam, which (if you
listen to what Major Coates says) left no survivors.

Please tell me this is just a bug, and that it shouldn’t
show either of the two squad-mates I picked for the last part of the game. I
can’t figure this one out, unless Joker pulled the ship around and my
squad-mates somehow found a flyable shuttle (assuming one of them could pilot
it and not get shot down) and used it to reach the Normandy.

Speaking of ships, with the mass relays destroyed, we now have
shiploads of people from a myriad group of races in the Sol system. Many of
whom either cannot eat Earth food (Turians and Quarians) or cannot breath Earth
atmosphere (Volus). Are the Quarian liveships able to sustain the large numbers
of Turians and Quarians now stranded in the system? Can Volus perpetually stay
in their environmental suits/on their ships indefinitely? Maybe. Minor issues,
but they are there.

Simply addressing this mystery would be great. Explain that
the liveships can indeed provide enough food for those stranded in Sol.

Lastly, as I picked the Destroy ending and had over 5000
Effective Military Strength, I got the little clip that showed someone with N7 dog
tags take a breath. Presumably this is Shepard. How, after making the Destroy
decision on the Citadel, did Shepard get back down on Earth, half buried under
rubble? This also does not make sense.

Solution here: make it make sense please. Did flipping the
destruction switch blast Shepard back into the transportation beam? Or maybe he
ran back to it while I wasn’t watching. Please do something here.

That reminds me, how did Anderson
get ahead of me to the console on the Citadel when he followed [/i]me into the transporter beam? I understand that he said he
appeared at a different location, but there did not appear to be any other
paths to the control area. This does not make sense.

I can let this one go. Maybe with the shifting walls and
stuff, Anderson really did find a
faster, more direct route to the control panel. I’m not sure how, as the path
Shepard took was pretty direct, but okay.

One last concern, though minor, is the lack of anything
respecting a boss fight. The last enemy we face in combat is Maurader Shields
(yes, you must know the name by now). I would recommend letting us take control
of the Normandy to battle
Harbinger to buy Shepard some time to get the job done. Say Harbinger realizes
what is going on, and he heads toward the Crucible to blow it up (with Shepard
on board). To take on Harbinger one-on-one as Joker piloting and shooting at
Harbinger, whilst coordinating with Sword to finally finish him off would have
been epic. Heck, make it a two-fer. Just as Harbinger is going to explode at
the end of the boss fight, Joker realizes the only way to save the Normandy
from getting caught in the blast and destroyed is to use the relay. That solves
the problem of why the Normandy
is heading away[/i] from the battle.
(Honestly, I think this is my best idea right here)

I’m not going to discuss the particulars of the
Indoctrination Theory, save to say that if you guys hadn’t planned it, it’s
been handed to you on a silver platter, and it might be a good idea to pick it
up. I understand that Bioware is in a bind here, I really do.

On one hand, there’re a lot of folks out here who just plain
don’t understand the endings, myself included. If you leave the endings as they
are, you’ve got unhappy folks who are going to think twice the next time a
Bioware game is offered for sale. Maybe, as some have said, the entire point of
the odd endings was to let us (the fans/players/customers) decide for ourselves
how it ended by filling in all the holes. 
If that’s true, fine. I don’t like it. I don’t play computer games such
as Mass Effect to have open endings where I am expected to imagine all the
plot-hole filler. I write my own stories when I want to do that.  And I do. Not fan fiction, but my own
creation.

On the other hand, if you had planned all this from the
beginning (and I’m not saying you did), it comes across as rather cold in that
you may have intentionally left out part of the ending which you will then
charge for later. I hope that is not the case. The best option is to add some
stuff in that presents the endings better and closes the plot holes.  I’m not asking specifically for a sunshine,
rainbows, and flowers ending. I just want one that makes sense. While I would
like an achievable ending wherein my Shepard survives the Destroy ending (I
understand why he cannot survive the Control or Synthesis endings), is found by
his crew (love interest included), and actually does manage to ride off into
the sunset. Again, that’s my preference, but it’s not a must.

Well, that’s my take on what’s wrong with the ending, and
what could be done to solve the problems. I’m sure there are other issues that
I’ll think of later, but hopefully others will touch on them, or perhaps
already have. Thanks for a great game, Bioware. If you do actually fix the plot
holes and such, it will be an epic game. Perhaps one of the best I’ve ever
played.

Modifié par Eadric, 22 mars 2012 - 05:59 .