7052 réponses à ce sujet

[jspiess]

https://docs.google....s/preview?pli=1

pretty much sums it up

[Pelle6666]

BIOWARE! Listen up, I have already posted my opinion here but it might have been a bit much to take in. I thought I should brake it down a bit. What I and the most people want added in the game whith the dllc is;

1. The option to not blow up the mass relays.
2. Not having the Normandy crash and your squad members deserted an a random planet.
3. Shepard to live and reunite with his or her love interest.
4. An explanation to the reapers that makes sense, the synthetics/organics thing doesn't hold water and should at least be explained more.
5. A way to convince the Catalyst of this by using the fact that geth and quarians now live in peace and Ede and Joker is in love.
6. A way to avoid the red, green and blue choice. Shepard would not give in to this deal.

Thanks for considering this.

[Ruusaar Cin]

It can't be said often enough, our choices must matter. That's what this game is all about.

Additionally, I'm strongly in favour of the chance to earn a happy ending.

[WardyLion]

Jessica

First of all, I would like to say that 99% of Mass Effect 3 was nothing short of epic and even though the last ten-minutes are why we are here (mostly), everything that led up to that point was so awesome I keep running out of superlatives.

I only mention this because, while I have never said I hated the whole game / series because of the ending, I am guilty of forgetting to say / make clear that I loved the game overall.  While I am sure many are in the same boat, I still feel I had to say it.  If you want me to tell you all the things I thought were pure fried-gold then I will be more than happy to, no matter how long it takes.

But this is for feedback regarding changes so here we go:

- this guy pretty much sums up my feelings although I have some points of my own too.

I was going to link to Angry Joe's video but I'm sure that you already saw that one and it's a little too "ranty" for this thread. Funny though...

1) The Quest System - I liked how the Codex and Journal were merged together but the quest journal needs to update.  It is such a simple little thing and it worked perfectly well in the first 2 Mass Effect games but I suppose with all the other stuff going-on, it would be highly possible for it to get overlooked.

What I'd like to see is the quest log that updates properly  as we meet the various criteria.  As it stands, there is no way to be sure how far along with a particular quest we are without resorting to pen and paper.  There are a lot of quests and there is a lot going on (like a war, for example) so it gets very easy to forget if we already found that Reaper Code fragment or not and, if we have, who wanted it.

Occasionally a random new name will pop up on the Citadel floor map but that's as much indication the game currently provides and it can be easily missed.  

One thing from the quest system I wouldn't like to return from ME2 was the way the Galaxy map could easily get cluttered with quest-markers.  Thankfully ME3 seems to have resolved this so that part doesn't really need to change.  Markers for main / prioroty quests I have no problem with.

Ultimately, I think all that is best suited to a patch rather than being indluded in the changes we're asking for. It's the same with the face-import glitch. It was an mild-annoyance for about a minute or so for me...that's about it.

2) War-Assets - I spent a hell of a lot of time gathering them and my EMS score was over 5000 (without multiplayer or any of the iOS games).

I will admit that, when the staggeringly huge armarda of ships I had amassed burst through the Charon Relay I felt like I was God in a monster-truck doing jumps over a shark-tank. The oly thing that could have made that cutscene any more epic would be if it were to the accompaniment of Queen's "Don't Stop Me Now!"

I thought the space battle at the end of Mass Effect 1 was epic but this was on an entirely different scale! While the battle raged on, I was too busy to pay much attention because I was in London, doing my bit on the ground so couldn't really tell who was winning or if we were scoring any points at all.

Come the ending, I had no what state my vast armarda was in and had it managed to do anything worthwhile. There was nothing that let me know if this vast inter-species fleet had done anything to further prosper the alliegances I had helped forge. Maybe one species wound up accusing another of not pulling their weight? Were they all obliterated when the Mass Relays went up?

It left me feeling like it was all a waste of time because I would get the exact same ending had I turned up with nothing but a broken beer-bottle.

Sure, when they all showed up I thought: "My God...I did that!" but, if you go by the current ending then I am also responsible for wiping out the lot of them!

Speaking of ships...

3) The Destiny Asencion - Brilliantly designed ship and I know what a huge gesture it was for the Asari to put it at my disposal.

Sadly, despite dialogue in ME1 stating that it packs a hell of a punch, it never fires it's main-gun!  Even if it was just the once, I'd love to see it blast a Reaper out the sky or at the very least land a massively telling blow.

Even better if the Reaper in question was:

4) Harbinger

One way the War-Assets could have an outcome on the ending is if I had enough, or merely the right ones, then a certain amount of damage could be inflicted upon him before he lands in London.

During the battle, someone (Hackett?) remarks that Harbinger has been spotted and is breaking off from the fight and headng my way but no-one seems to follow him or move to intercept. The ground team is crucial to success so you'd think at least someone would try and slow Harbinger down.

Best-case, he is badly damaged and crashes but still manages to get off a few shots before another attack finishes him off. Worst-case he lands unharmed and then the encounter / run to the beam scene remains unchanged and it's no-ones fault but my own for being lazy or choosing the wrong assets to intercept him with. Add to that a "middle-ground" option or two where he is damaged but to a lesser degree so that he can land and start shooting but is vulnerable to additional attack.

5) The Indoctrination Theory really seems to be the only way to go without a massive re-write and the complete removal of the final scenes aboard the Citadel. It addresses the hundreds of plot-holes and backs it up with a lot of solid evidence and, if I were looking for a way to sort all this out, it would be a no-brainer to me. Run with it, give a slot in the credits along the lines of "Thank you to the many people who took the time to create the Indoctrination Theory", and roll with it.

During my playthrough, I was hoping against hope that, while the Illusive man was banging on and on and generally doing my head in, that Garrus or James (they were with me in London for the final push)would struggle up the ramp and slot him in the head.

Then I read up on the Indoctrination Theory and thought how this could work.

The common opinion is that. After the Harbinger attack, everything is an Indoctrination attempt. Going back to what I said above about Harbinger being damaged (or not), the overall effectiveness of this attempt could be affected badly if he was badly damaged, not affected at all if he is unharmed and, as before there could also be one or two "middle-ground" points.

One thing that need not change is the fact that Harbinger, no matter what state he's in, blasts Shepard and Co. into unconciousness, as happens already. I say this as it sets up the scene for indocrination regardless - Shepard is down and finally open for a proper Indoctrination attempt - again all the evidence to everything after this point being Indoctrination is already right there, in the game.

Anyway - assuming all this is indoctrination and Anderson represents Shepard's willpower fighting back, why not let someone in the real world try and get through to him as well? If Harbinger was damaged then have (in my case) Garrus and/or James (both if Harbinger was well and truly battered, one if only moderately or mildly damaged) find Shepard's broken, battered corpse, shake him, call out his name, blast him with Medi-Gel and so on.

These scenes could intercut with the scenes on the Citadel and help Shepard fight against indoctrination. He would hear their voice(s) from the real world in his head and, if he manages to pass certain checks, beat back the indoctrination attempt to the point where he can reject it.

In my own mind, this rejection would be an interrupt in which Garrus (or whoever) shouts frantically "Shepard, wake up!" and, on hearing this in his head, we can hit the interrupt and have Shepard give the Illusive Man a thousand-yard-stare / smile before saying: "Might need some help, Garrus." This results in Garrus walking up and slotting the Illusive Man before it all goes white and he wakes up back in London.

If this fails due to missing the interrrupt or not having enough war-assets to nail Harbinger then the Child scene will play out but, again, give us a choice to tell him he's making no sense. The requirements would have to be higher though, if it were all easy-street there'd be no point.

Have (most of) the current ending be the bad ending in which Shepard fails to fight off the indoctrination. Add an option to have Shepard shoot himself in the head as it's the only way left to free himself of the indoctrination but it results in his real-world death. With their Talisman killed in action the forces of the galaxy were dealt a huge blow and, although the war continued to rage, the net result was a blasted, burned galaxy with barely enough people left alive to maintain a viable species, let alone rebuild.

If Shepard doesn't choose this option and instead succumbs then this will trigger the really bad ending in which the Reapers complete the cycle and head on back to dark space to hibernate until it's time to start over.

In any-case, the one thing that I feel has to go is the destruction of the Mass Relays. As it has been proved, when a Mass Relay is destroyed it unleashes terrible destructive power. No matter what "choice" we take in the game as it stands, we are effectively commiting the genocide the Reapers are out to commit, only we're doing it in seconds rather than decades.

Control, Synthesis or Destruction make no sense if, just after the consequences take effect, everything gets wiped out. Saying: "It's a different kind of explosion" would be a cop-out answer, by the way. Just saying...

Also, destroying the Mass Relays and wiping out near everyone and everything in the galaxy would be yet another reason not to bother collecting all the war-assets. It has also been strongly hinted that this is not the end of the fanchise but ho can you keep on calling it "Mass Effect" if the single-biggest thing that the title refers to is no longer there?

6) The Crucible, Mass Relays and You - As has been established already, Mass Relays going up would be catastrophic. However it has also been proved that it is possible to use them to transmit pulses and other such transmissions and in that is the key.

Part of the war-assets you collect include resources and personnel that contribute to the Crucible war-asset "score".

I quickly realised that it would be very dangerous to get my hopes up that the Crucible would be a magic "make all the Reapers go away" device long before the ending so I'm not expecting it to be now.

But, depending on the score, why not have it use the Citadel to transmit a pulse that affects the Reapers in some way? If the score is low then the effect will be the equivalent of throwing a flash-bang at someone's feet. Disorientation and confusion that allows the massed forces to get some real shots in, not unlike the way Sovereign is dealt-with at the end of ME1 but with more losses for the galaxy as it's on a much greater scale.

With a higher scores, the Crucible could transmit a pulse that disabled their indoctrination-fields (thus robbing them of their most insidious weapon), brought down their shields or, if the score was FULLY maxed out then it shut them down completely or at least put them down long enough for the fleets of the galaxy to comprehensively finish them off.

7) Closure - There isn't any.

Bittersweet is fine - it could transpire that a big decision I thought to be benificial actually turned out to be ultimately harmful or downright catastrophic. However I have no way of knowing at the moment. If I cocked it up, at least tell me what I did wrong and what the result was.

Fallout: New Vegas is a good-example of how, no matter how hard you try to, you can't please everyone at the end. You can do your utmost to make the negative impacts as gentle as possible but that's about it.

Saying that, a happy ending isn't too much to hope / ask for if, like me, you poured everything into making sure that you had war-assets coming out of your ears. Much loved characters gave everything they had, some even giving their lives, to band together and stand up to the Reapers. Assuming I used all these assets correctly, let me walk away as the hero. Even this ending could be bittersweet because, even though we won, countless lives were still lost in the war. The Earth is still a mess and so is Thessia, Tiptree and countless other worlds. There is a lot of cleaning up to be done, best grab a Hoover, Shepard!

8) The Normandy fleeing the scene - No matter what else, this has to go. yes it is perfectly possible Joker swooped down and rescued at least some of my crew but there is no rational explanation for him running away or the crew letting him.

Sorry.

At the very best, keep the internal scenes of Joker frantically working his console but have it because the Normandy is hit and going down after picking up Shepard and Co. (assuming they got through the indoctrination part). Depending on the ending, they could have crashed on Earth and are watching the endings start to play out - Reapers falling out the sky, being shot down or obliterating the armarda, depending on how well I did. Then it cuts to an epilogue that wraps up the story depending on my choices and actions.

9) Tali's Face - I do not wish to suggest that the woman from the stock photo is in any way unnatractive because she isn't. However, Tali's face reveal was a big moment, no matter what context it would be in.

I had an idea last year that she would only take off her mask if she was mortally wounded and, just before dying in Shepards arms, took off her mask to kiss his cheek (or lips if she was romanced).

Regardless, using the stock photo smacks of laziness. Sure I can appreciate that there were / are muich bigger fish to fry and I am not losing my sense of perspective but it was still a much-anticipated moment that deserved a little more work to resolve.

10) Replay value and those still catching up - One of the loading screens in ME2 urged me to create a whole new Shepard with a different class, gender and so on for a "whole new experience". I was all about that and couldn't wait to get started with that. Now though, I have lost any enthusiasm because ultimately it will make little or no difference what I do, come the end.

Also, at least one of my friends heard me babbling about how much Mass Effect rocked and so decided to try it out for herself. She's currently working through Mass Effect 1 and while I am not spoiling any of it for her, it near broke my heart when she said how much she was loving it and "couldn't wait to see how it all pans out at the end".

I didn't have the heart to tell her...

The fact that so many people wanted to replay right from the very start is a HUGE testament to anyone who has ever worked on a Mass Effect game. Their collective genius gave us a universe that was so rich and characters that were so realistic and compelling made us want to replay Mass Effect 1 even if the graphics were sub-par compared to the sequels and my squadmates did more damage to my shields than the enemy ever could. These matters could be overlooked because the rest of the game was brilliant.

Having the last ten minutes to the trilogy cast a pall over all of that is not just bad for the players and fans but it also detracts from the accomplishments of the many people who worked so hard to bring us Mass Effect.

Thank you for listening...reading...cheers!

Modifié par WardyLion, 22 mars 2012 - 05:43 .

[yejo]

double post sorry

Modifié par yejo, 22 mars 2012 - 06:01 .

[InterlagosBlau]

I’ve been gaming for more than 30 years.  In that time, I‘ve never played a more compelling, rewarding and well-constructed series than Mass Effect.  That a product in this medium, which in my youth was a dozen sprites or 24 lines of monochrome text floating around a TV screen, can deliver the kind of emotional experience that rivals the finest motion pictures or stage performances is truly astounding to me.

While the general game play started solid and improved markedly with each title, what truly puts ME at the top of the heap has always been the story and the characters. 

Like many loyal fans of the saga, I was very disappointed with the ending, which I did not feel lived up to the truly high standards set by the rest series.  To hear that the development team is going to directly address the shortcomings is great news.  Like many fans, I felt that ME3 was pretty much the best game I’ve ever played (and I’ve played a LOT of games) until the last 10 minutes or so.

So in rough chronological order, here are some of my thoughts on how the ending can be improved from a STORY standpoint.  I have some ideas on how the GAMEPLAY can be improved, but I’ll post that at some later point.

#1) Introducing the Catalyst so late in the story is disjointing.  I like the idea that there is a higher power behind the Reapers, but the existence of such an entity should be hinted at much earlier in the story. It would make Reaper-God-Child’s eleventh-hour entrance more palatable and not so abrupt.  Also, not hearing from Harbinger at all is disappointing.  Given that he is the defacto leader of the Reapers until the God-Child appears, I think at least a small appearance is warranted.

#2) Making the Reaper-God-Child resemble the lost boy from Shepard’s dreams is a mistake.  This may not SEEM like a big deal at first, but the more I think about it, the more important I feel it is.  From the moment we first see the boy and his apparent tragic death, he becomes symbolic of all the pain Shepard has to cope with as he goes on his mission.  He is the face of countless billions murdered by the Reapers and haunts Shepard’s dreams throughout the story.  He also becomes the symbol of Shepard’s guilt and shame over not being able to save everyone from the holocaust and the realization that he is only human --and not all powerful.  In another sense the boy also symbolizes the utter loss of innocence amid all the senseless and brutal violence. 

I found this a very powerful piece of imagery and immediately connected with all these emotions. Therefore I feel it demands an equally powerful resolution in order for the player to have an emotional catharsis at the end. 

When we see this Reaper-God-Child taking the form of HIS VICTIM, it creates wild cognitive dissonance. The game has taken THE THING THE PLAYER HAS BEEN FIGHTING AGAINST and bizarrely merged it with THE THING HE IS FIGHTING FOR.  The two things don’t belong together and now that the original imagery of the boy (and the associated emotions) has been effectively lost in the translation to the Reaper-God-Child, there isn’t any
way to get any closure from all the painful emotions that Shepard and by proxy the player has been carrying around for the whole game.

The people who support the indoctrination theory will say this is exactly why their explanation works. There is no real boy and the Reaper-God-Child has been messing with Shepard’s head since day one of the invasion. But if this is the intent all along, and this is a feature rather than a failure of the storytelling, then the player should be presented with an option to challenge or simply call out the Reaper-God-Child on what he is attempting.  This goes right back to having that meaningful confrontation with the villain again.

The solutions are simple. The Catalyst must either be visually distinct from the boy or the player must be able to oppose --within the game, the appearance of the Catalyst.

#3) The general dialogue with the Reaper-God-Child needs to be improved.  Shepard only offers weak rebuttals for the Catalyst’s insistence of the inevitable conflict between organics and synthetics.  Given that the player can work for the entire game proving this wrong, and that free-will and the right of sentient beings to self-determinate is a central theme of the series, the ineffectual retort is a huge missed opportunity.  The overly simplified explanation for the ultimate motivation of the Reapers feels empty and dissatisfying.  They murdered billions and have caused untold suffering.  The Reaper-God-Child may not look like it, but it is the real villain. Why can’t we talk to him like one? Not being able to reject the Reaper-God-Child in no uncertain terms means the player never gets to have a meaningful confrontation with the antagonist.  Without meaningful confrontation, there is no closure.  Give Shepard the strength he needs to tell the Reaper-God-Child just how stinking wrong he/it/whatever is.

#4) Blow those relays.  Yep, I’m down with that.  Unlike many people, I completely support the destruction of the relays and believe this is an appropriate end.  The relays were presumably built by the Reaper-God-Child as part of his diabolic plan.  So while they benefitted the galaxy by bringing intelligent species together, they were also double-edged sword, allowing the Reapers to dominate them. They were something of a Trojan-horse, a sinister gift the galaxy did not earn on their own merits.  Therefore breaking the cycle and ending the threat should necessitate losing the benefitsof the relays as well.  You can’t have your cake and eat it at the same time.

But at the same time, all those people who point out that the entire combined fleet would perish around Earth after the destruction of the relays have the right of it as well. The apocalyptic scenarios are entirely consistent with the established canon. 

So if mass extinction and a galactic dark-age is something the players can avoid (and I think it should be in at least a few of the endings), there needs to be careful and intelligent explanation.  Believe me, I'm pretty sure we all want to buy it, so it’s not going to be a hard sell.

#5) Many people didn’t like the ending choices offered, but I think they work IF adequately explained. Why must Shepard die if he controls the Reapers?  Why must the Geth also be destroyed?  This being has god-like abilities.  Surely he can tell the Reapers to leave the galaxy alone without destroying it in the process.  Without a believable rationale to support the costs of these decisions, the player feels like he is simply being punished because –well because he can be.  And that can only make us feel cheated.

#6) After the player has made the choice, what would have been nice is for Shepard to have some kind of last minute radio conversation with one or more crew members (such as his Love Interest and Garrus) and
explain to them what he is doing and why he is doing it.  Not only does this reaffirm the player’s decision with Shepard’s voice, it allows any remaining doubt to be removed. 

I know you don’t want to say goodbye Liara, but I have to break this cycle once and for all.  I love you.  Or.  I’m putting a stop to the Reapers forever, Garrus.  I’ll see you at that bar.  Drinks are on me.

Shepard has always had the support of his crew.  They should be with him, if not physically, then at least emotionally in his last crucial moments.

#7) I’m not so bothered as some with the appearance of the Normandy flying away at FTL speeds at the end. 
It is not clear how much time passes between Shepard getting hit by Harbinger’s beam and making his final choice. Could be hours.  Establishing  where the Normandy is and what it’s doing  BEFORE Shepard makes his choice would go a long way towards fixing this problem. 

Heck, you can simply have Shepard WARN Joker about what he is going to do and order him to fly away, which would solve the issue with a minimum of fuss.

#8) I like the Normandy landing on a jungle planet and the Adam and Eve imagery with Joker and EDI. But this really only works with the Synthesis ending.  Most people seem to think the Normandy and her crew should end up in different places depending on Shepard’s choice and I agree with that.  It supports the idea that your choices matter.

I personally believe the Destruction ending should involve losing the Normandy and certain members of the crew.  This would be consistent with a Renegade Shepard’s willingness to make great sacrifices to achieve his goals.

The Control ending feels too much like Synthesis.  It also makes no sense.  The God-Child says he CONTROLS the Reapers.  If so, it stands to reason he can make them stand down.  From a logical stand-point why is a person’s death necessary to issue that order?

One possible way to make this work is to explain that Shepard has to merge his own consciousness with the Reapers in order to control them.  That it would be HIS will that makes them stand down.  That means Shepard would live on, but only as a kind of guardian keeping the Reapers in check for all eternity.  Maybe this was the intent all along, but it certainly wasn’t presented as such to us in the final game.

This would be consistent with Paragon Shepard’s willingness to sacrifice his own life for the sake of the mission.  Of course, this would mean that the God-Child doesn’t really have control over the Reapers at all, so this would need to be ret-conned and explained in some fashion.

It also begs the question of why it needs to be Shepard who sacrifices himself.  In Dragon Age: Origins, The Warden can order Alistair or Loghain to make the sacrifice to kill the Archdemon.  It would make sense to allow Shepard to convince a crew member or some other character to do the same.  Although anyone playing a real Paragon Shepard is not likely to send Garrus to die in his place, having the option to do so gives us a much greater sense of control.

A nice bonus is that it would give Renegade players another choice.  Heck, you can even have endings where if you choose the wrong crew member, it backfires because they simply don’t have the sheer will to do it.

#9) A true epilogue after a story of this scale is crucial.  A perfect place to do it would be a memorial for Shepard if he dies or for Anderson if Shepard lives.  Anything that can’t be reasonably wrapped up in a cutscene can be addressed by a series of news vids or even some text narrative played over music like at the end of Dragon Age: Origins.  In fact, the post-campaign epilogue in DA:O is a masterful example of how to wrap up an epic story.

#10) I actually like the short Stargazer bit at the end.  I know lots of people hated it, but I think that’s because they’re simply transferring their anger from the ending onto this.  Judged on its own merits, it is a nice touch.  Keep it.


#11) Any DLC content should be post-ending, and deal with the issues of a galaxy trying to survive without relays and recovering from the deaths of billions.  This would be a great opportunity to show case Garrus, Tali or Wrex as playable POV characters.

But first, you should nail the ending That’s all I can think of for now.  This ended up much longer than I anticipated, but I guess there was a lot to cover.  Thanks for listening.

Modifié par InterlagosBlau, 22 mars 2012 - 06:32 .

[theronac]

I havent reached that part of the game,if it even exist(some thing are very unclear,btw bioware mislead us with codex entries of protheans,i still dont know what the heck is tall creature with glowing eyes and tentecales,i mean on picture of "something" that's displayed in prothean codex),also i want explanation who,how and why are Reapers are made,obviously someone has to be behind ancient war ships which obviously cannot built himself. IF its in-game simply reply random nonsense on this post,i cannot get spoiled,i just want to know is there detailed explanation on Reapers,i have seen achievement related with that issue anyway,fact finder or something.. Thank you.

[shephard987]

http://www.gamefaqs.....html?poll=4666

LET YOUR VOICES BE HEARD

HOLD THE LINE

[yejo]

yejo wrote...

I would love it if bioware just picked up when you sit down by yourself just after shooting the illusive man or him shooting himself and you sitting down next to anderson.
anyhow from there.

Let shep fire the galactic gun and depending on your ems have everything be destroyed (geth edi reapers relays the whole sjebang) make the normandy crash since edi controlls the freaking thing and just let everybody die... hell mass relay explosion has got that one covered. (LOW EMS)

Let shep fire the galactic gun and destroy the citadel with sheperd on it, let it send out and e.m.p. which takes down the barriers of the reapers but doesn't destroy the relays, make it indeed kill of all synthetic life so geth and edi are screwed, make the normandy crash but make joker survive that ordeal and show the new and old crew from the entire trilogy fighting of reaper forces and winning groundside on earth. (MEDIUM EMS)

Let shep fire the galactic gun and make it send out an E.M.P. charge through all the mass relays (without destroying those which takes out the reapers barriers then show how normandy finishes Harbringer and the rest of the galactic fleet blow the reapers to smithereens. show sheps crew and former teammates from the entire trilogy all fighting the reapers on the ground and winning.
And have shep's L.I. and best friend pick him up inside the citadel. (HIGH EMS).

just some quick thoughts on how it should have ended.

p.s.
keep true to the whole you puny organics can't understand our motives cause we are the reapers and don't offer an explanation to why they do what they do every 50k years.

p.p.s.
and PRETTY PLEASE WITH SUGAR ON TOP Bioware cut the god kid in the machine stuff PLEASE.

[Iam2ugly]

 My turn for detailed suggestion First I would like to say that I love ME3 And that the entire trylogy mean to me something much more(!) than STAR WARS, and trust me this is something
And I would like to say, a big THANK You for creating such a wonderfull game. I heart you :> But unfortunatly I was a little dissapointed at the ending of the story.  And to me the ending is far more important than the beginning of the story. And so, I decided to give some feedback about it. I was wondering the ending, and how it could be altered. And this is what I came up with.

*first -  I would not change anything to the point where you are in the citadel(after the whole "I took a beam to the knee") Where you contact with normandy(which is possible. Obviously you can comm with Anderson, and later Admiral Hackett, so why not Normandy?) saying that you are alive, and you were able to get to the citadel. And that you will continue the mission. Then he replies that he took the 2 squad mates(injured) from the ground after the retreat order by Coats.(teleporting squad plot hole fixed)  And that he will stick around. Then we are starting the convo with anderson. In which he tells you that he got to the beam BEFORE you, and he is happy to hear you made it too. And he will try to go foreward.

Things go just like in the ending. to the point where you meet TIM, which STAYS THE SAME! After the talk with him is over we hear Admiral Hackett the same speach "nothing happens, try on your end. And then the second alteration is taking place.

*second - Shep is standig, facing the panel. He clicks on on it and then a prothean VI (!) is rendered near the panel. And it is this prothean VI that talks to shepard(not some god child) that the reapers threat is immenet, and give shep the same options(!) and this VI says that the options are avaible because the other cycles before wanted to do this but they did not succed. (for exaple, the control - in some pre-prothean cycle some race wanted to control reapers, but the one who tried to do this was indoctrinated, like TIM, and the reapers won. The destroy option is a option that was supposed to be a prothean one, but they did not finished building it) The VI urges shep to choose one if he wants to stop the reapers. And in this moment we can choose:

1. Control - VI talks to shep to put his hands on the panel, and also that the outcome of that option will lead to transferring his conscience into the reapers system in which he can control the reapers. If we choose this option - We see similar animation like when SHEP is absorbing information from prothean artifact on Eden Prime... And then his body fall to the ground. And the Blue "shockwave" is spreading acros the galaxy, thru mass relays. BUT THIS DO NOT RESULT IN RELAYS DESTRUCTION!

Outcome: 
*Low EMS - Reapers break from the control and kill organic life, worst ending possible.
*Middle EMS - Reapers obey Shep and leave the sol system. Earh destroyed in more than 70%, and galactic fleet has over 60% casualties. Shep crew watch from Normandy as reapers leave.
*High EMS - Reapers leave earth partially destroyed(major cities) and leave the sol sytem. Fleet - 40% loss. 
Shep crew watch from Normandy as reapers leave.


2. Merge - VI talks that if you wanted to merge organic life with mechanical to stop the reapers giving them no reason to fear the technical singularity, you need to sacrifice yourself to give the cruicible the "proper formula"(in some cycle before, a race did not give a "proper formula" thus the cycle continued) which VI belief shep is because he already is partially syntetic. If you choose this you are tranfered via the "white lift"(sorry, english is not my native, don't know how to name it corectlly;) ) to the place where you are chosing in the original ending and you must do the same - you jump to the beam And we see the Green "shockwave" spreading across the galaxy. AND AGAIN this do not DESTROY the mass relays. Because they are simply a conductors of this energy.

Outome:
*Low EMS - Merging is not working. The cycle continue.
*Middle EMS - Merging is succesfull, reapers leave the galaxy, Earth destroyed in over 50%, the fleet have more than 60% loss. 
Shep crew watch from Normandy as reapers leave.

*High EMS - Merging succesfull,  Shep crew watch from Normandy as reapers leave, Earth saved. Galactic fleet loss no more than 40 %

3. Destor( my favorite! ;P) - VI talks that you can destroy the reapers by sending them a code/virus that will shut them/destroy them. BUT(!) [can't be all sunshine and rainbows] there is a possibility that you,  due to the reaper tech in shep body.Whole citadel, mass relays, the geth(geth reaper upgrades) will die too... Here we are given a options to interrupt, and say that(IF WE HAVE DONE THE SIDE MISSION - Citadel: Reaper Code Fragments) we have a reaper codes. Then VI loads them into the crucible, saying that thanks to this the wave should only deactivate reapers. And if we chose this options VI starts the operations.

Outome(without reaper codes)(technically the same ending from the original ending, minus the whole stranded crew.
*Low EMS - Red shockwave destroys citadel alongside with shep on it, mass relays, geth, EDI. The earth is destroyed, unable to sustain life. Glactic fleet is devastated. Normandy is on earth, the crew is crying.
*Middle EMS- the same as above but earth is destroyed in over 50% but is able to sustain life. More than 70% of galactic fleet is destroyed. Normandy crew are left with bittersweet victory.
*High EMS - same as above, but earth is saved, crew is happy, but mourns for shepard(i bet they saw the citadel goes bye-bye). Fleet destroyed with 40% is preparing for a long way home.

Outcome(With reaper codes)[For people like me who want THE BLUE BABBIES!!!! please, bioware? <3Or ash/kaidan babies :>]
*low EMS - The operation started by VI is aborted due to some abnormal error(some callibrations would be nice;) ) And Shep have to manually destroy the part responsible for the error, like in the original ending he need to go up and shoot the core, which results in his death. But the red shockwave is succesfull in destroying only reapers, leaving earth destroyed. And the fleet in more than 70% losses. Crew and who is on the surface is left with the bittersweet victory, and not knowing the fate of his friend...
*Middle EMS - The operation is succesfull and the red shockwave kill only reapers leaving earth partially destroyed, crew is on earth celebrating. You LI looking at the stars smiling. Shep watching from the platform as reapers are shut down/destroyed. Fleet over 60% loss.
*High EMS - Operation succesfull. Red wave destroys only reapers. Shep turning around and takes anderson and leave. Galactic fleet is in a good shape (30% loss) Earth is saved. The crew celebrate on earth, Your LI gaze with a smile at stars, while the shuttle lands on earth, with shep comming out of it. Whole crew welcome you. Shep And his LI are smiling to each other, credits roll..

And this is how I imagine the ending should be like Not even epiloge is needed thanks for your time if you read it. And remember to show some love to each other. Once again a big <3 for devs. And to all of you guys that stays civil, and well mannered! 

[NikaAzure]

Since there are already a lot of posts on this forum I'm sure some of what I'm going to say here is going to be repeats of whatever other people have said. However, given that I love bioware games and Mass Effect has been my favorite francise since the first game came out in 2001 I feel like I need to give some love, while offering a little polite constructive criticism.

Overall I love Mass Effect 3. It was clearly well-thought out and carefully made for most of the game. The character relationships are amazing, the way your companions banter with you and one another, the way you can go with them to the Citadel as well as your ship. Getting different character comments makes replaying the game just to take different companions along something that is well worth it.

For most of the game I was totally immersed. It worked very well with my kinect, making it a lot easier for me to give orders to my squadmates than had been in the previous games. The character deaths throughout were incredibly emotional, but had purpose to the plot. Even though Shepard wanted her friends to live, and was saddened by their loss, I never expected everyone to walk away from this final game, given what was at stake.

The galaxy readiness was a little bit annoying, if only that it seemed to have very little impact at the end. Granted I got it high enough so Shepard could take her breath at the end, but without making up some reason in my head for everything that happened after reaching the Citadel, it wasn't all that comforting. While I don't think there's anything wrong with wanting the option for a happy ending (this is a game after all - which people play for fun), my issue was not the fact that Shepard dies in most scenarios. 

My issue with the ending is that it just makes no real sense. If this is the intended end for the game, we need a lot better explanation for wtf just happened to Shepard and all her friends. These characters we've been following for a decade now. The rest of the game shows how important Bioware believes these friendships and relationships are. The final goodbyes are emotional and beautiful. But why in the world does Joker RUN AWAY at the end? Why would he leave his Commander stranded after he's already got guilt over letting her/him die in the second game? He promised Anderson he'd look after Shepard.

How does Anderson get onto the Citadel after Shepard, and beat her to the controls? I love that moment between them before he dies, another sad, lovely moment, but I don't understand what is happening from the point Shepard goes into the beam after. In Arrival, Bioware made a point to show us that destroying a Mass Relay blows up a star system. Is this just not the way it works when Shepard does it? And even if these only kill a few thousand people instead of whole systems, destroying them strands an entire fleet around Earth. And then there's no explanation at all of what happens to all those aliens.

The fact that Shepard can't argue with "Catalyst" at the end also is irritating. Depending on your options, you could have just made peace between the Quarians and Geth. The Geth are there fighting alongside you. Can't you at least throw that in his face? I don't know if the ending was simply a bit rushed to meet deadlines, because there are so many holes that I feel someone must have seen (teleporting party member to Normandy crash site?) Or if Bioware was trying to leave many things open to interpretation. Sometimes having an open ending can be nice, but I personally would like a bit more closure. And for things to be a bit less confusing.

I'll keep playing, because I really do love the rest of the game, I love my Shepard and I love all her friends. Bioware has overall, done an incredible job. But I do feel that there needs to be something more here. Thanks for listening.

[Needsnewending]

im bad in writing.. Just see--->

plz! it makes sense, you can do alot out of this theory:)

[chujwamdotego]

Pelle6666 wrote...

BIOWARE! Listen up, I have already posted my opinion here but it might have been a bit much to take in. I thought I should brake it down a bit. What I and the most people want added in the game whith the dllc is;

1. The option to not blow up the mass relays.
2. Not having the Normandy crash and your squad members deserted an a random planet.
3. Shepard to live and reunite with his or her love interest.
4. An explanation to the reapers that makes sense, the synthetics/organics thing doesn't hold water and should at least be explained more.
5. A way to convince the Catalyst of this by using the fact that geth and quarians now live in peace and Ede and Joker is in love.
6. A way to avoid the red, green and blue choice. Shepard would not give in to this deal.

Thanks for considering this.

YES, YES, YES - Shepard alive and reunited with LI is important.

Make this at least of 1 of promised 16 endings, please.

It is so very important to have pleasure nad joy in playing computer games. Offer those of us who really want happy ending, to have just one, please.

Anyway, thanks to all members of Bioware for excellent ME1, ME2 and 99% of ME3.

[MisterP146]

Bioware please read this:

http://gotgame.com/2...fect-3s-ending/

Were counting on you, and we want to believe in you.

Modifié par MisterP146, 22 mars 2012 - 06:16 .

[O Fenris O]

I might repeat myself here but I'd really like to see the current "ending" as that Indoctrination-dream-sequence, mostly because of the fact that it does make sense only this way. For reasons why watch the famous "evidence"-video



followed by this document

https://docs.google....s/preview?pli=1

Even though we'd already know that it's just a dream in my opinion it would still be mindblowing.

Within this thread are already such brilliant ideas you, dear Bioware-members, could use. Be sure to check EVERY single one.

And btw, what happened with all that signs of rising dark matter which was hinted in ME 2?

Modifié par O Fenris O, 22 mars 2012 - 07:14 .

[Almasan]

Personally I found the character interaction with the crew to be too limited. It is a strength that Bioware has displayed time and again, to engage with a character and to develop a genuine rapport and attachment which should not be simulated. For example take Dragon Age origins; you could talk about events, delve into a characters backstory, have a small but amusing back and forth, see those characters interact with each other. It is perhaps the most emersive an enjoyable bit of an RPG. Its lack in both ME2 and ME3 is rather a little jarring. The interactions are short, far apart and in some cases without substance. This is only a small gripe, but for me I found this both more upsetting and more infuriating than the ending. I want to care about these characters, but in the end I only really care about characters which have been in previous games and most of my emotional attachment is based on inferrances I have made myself due to previously quite stifled interactions. I should also mention that this was also Dragon Age 2's greatest flaw. Hope this was constructive.

[SugarChic]

The first thing I have to say is that I am undecided about the indoctrination theory. I don't know if that's really what the ending was all about or not, but I don't know if I like it. I need to look into it some more. Anyway, here are my ideas for the ending as a whole:

 The ending shouldn't be limited. There needs to be several versions, all showing your decisions. There might be shots of characters cheering/dying; and if you had any killed, they would be absent. There shouldn't be anything left aside because it's not a major decision. Even small things like Conrad Verner, I don't know, clapping for Shepard or something, would add a lot to whichever ending you choose.

Speaking of which, I think there should be at LEAST the "perfect" ending (where everyone lives, Reapers are destroyed, the soldiers are cheering and rejoicing, happy ending,etc.) and the worst ending (where everyone dies, Reapers win, maybe some sad scenes of characters taking their last breaths, very dramatic, etc.) Then there could be a few "middle" endings, all varying based on what you chose along the way. Like, if you chose te geth over the quarians, then that could completely change part of an outcome, or if you chose both geth and quarians, they work together and there could be an awesome cutscene of several reapers exploding.
And if the krogan aren't with you, then it could deplete your chances of getting one major thing done. And if you don't have enough people on your side, or done enough to hinder your chances of defeating the reapers, then it could increase the chances of your Shepard ultimately dying, whether the Reapers are defeated or not, whichever ending you may choose.
So it can really be emotional and heartwrenching while at the same time keeping you on your toes about what decisions need to be made. (There must always be the chance that your Shepard might survive, so it's not set in stone that a Renegade Shepard that made bad decisions in ME1 and 2 will die, but a good challenge never hurt!)

I can't name any full details exactly, but the point I'm trying to get at is that there needs to be that variety that we were promised. We need to have that, "I wonder what happens if I do/don't this" thought every time we restart a playthrough. The ending as it stands now gives absolutely no motivation to replay the game (to the very end, at least) because it just feels utterly pointless. Nothing you do will change anything. And that's the saddest part. Mass Effect was always about changing, rechanging, and exploring the outcomes. Here, we can't. Because no matter what is done, we still get that one anticlimactic ending, just with different colors representing which of the three choices you chose.

Also, there needs to be the "closure" everyone's talking about. Soon the word is gonna be irritating to many of us, but really, that's also a big part that's missing. We didn't sit there spinning the yellow arrow in the dialogue wheel for half an hour deciding what to do just because we were indecisive (hehe). We all knew that our decisions were going to change something in the long run, whether it hindered or boosted our chances of defeating the Reapers. Or choosing who to romance, to see the more personal romantic side of the story. (I personally romanced Kaiden in the first game, then Garrus in the second, and was hoping there would be some drama in the third, and I'm a little disappointed there wasn't some kind of confrontation between the characters, like when in ME1, you have to choose between Liara and Kaiden/Ashley...)

Anyway, we want to see "where are they now?" Does Shepard live happily ever after with their love interest, having cute little (adpoted) kids running around in a house of their own, or does their love interest end up sad and lonely because Shep died? Do the geth and quarians really live in harmony, and do the quarians finally end up living without suits? Or do the geth start their own civilization on Rannoch without the quarians? Do the turians and krogan finally forgive and forget because of the genophage cure, or do they start another war because it wasn't cured? How do all the civilizations rebuild their planets? Can they even be rebuilt? Those are the kinds of things we're looking for.

I admit, personally, I'm the kind of person who would prefer a happier outcome, but I know it isn't necessary as long as questions are answered, and we're given that satisfaction of seeing how our choices impacted the rest of the galaxy after the Reapers. It's not about having an overly cliche "Yeah! We did it!" ending, but about seeing the aftermath. (However, a happy ending would be the "perfect" ending I mentioned earlier, so it's not like that would be the only outcome.) We want the epilogue. We don't want to see the same clip of Joker exiting the Normandy in the jungle in the middle of who knows where. We want to see everything, the big picture.

Oh, and speaking of Joker... don't make him a coward. He should have been in the fight the whole time. He should have been in the heart of the action. He shot the laser through Sovereign in ME1. Now with the Normandy being upgraded, he can do so much more. 

The final thing I'd like to mention (for now, until I think of something more), is that the ending is a bit too short. The whole Earth mission before the Harbinger bit. Something is lacking. It's the final fight, the final push on Earth. The big climax! It seemed, if not lacking, then cut short.

There were two things I could think of that would help flesh out the final mission:
1) Adding one, if not more, big decision that will make us go, "Noooo!!" For example, if you bring Garrus and Tali, you'll have to eventually choose which to leave behind due to a complication (which may or may not be due in part to Shepard's decisions). Sort of like choosing between Ashley and Kaidan on Virmire. Anderson says, 'Choose your sqaud wisely," just before you begin the mission, so I thought your squad was going to be involved in some major decision eventually, but I was disappointed when there was nothing of the like. So a few big decisions like that would add more thrill, as well, as the chance to boost or hinder your chances of defeating the reapers and surviving.
2) Harbinger should have been more involved. The whole game, I was waiting for when he was going to show up on a hologram ( or in person!) and tell Shepard ,"See? Your species will fall, bwahaha!" or something like that. But he only appears for a second at the end, and that, too, was anticlimactic.

I'm sure there is more that can be done, but these are the two main things that should be added.

For now, this is all I have to say about the ending. Everything else in the game was excellent. I will probably post some more feedback if I think of anything, but these are the main things on my mind about the ending. Thanks for listening Bioware! I have faith in you.

[Jokermania5150]

I believe if you have not played ME3 or spent the hours upon hours of game time playing ME1 and ME2, then I'm not quite sure if you understand the actual problem.

Unlike a book or movie you, as a gamer, can become emotionally invested in the characters of the Mass Effect universe. You make choices that, although other players may make the same choices, feels like it's part of your story...your Shepard.

You've also had promises given from company employees...check them out here: http://www.1up.com/d...try?bId=9097672

The person or people filing the federal complaint will make all of us look bad and should have been swatted down as quickly as it was brought up.

I also believe if a person has never played the first two games and bought ME3, they would be satisfied completely with the game. It's a game series that is packed full of history (ME universe history) and people that have played all three know that something is wrong with the history that the ending seems to forget.

The game itself is brilliant and the employees who worked on it should be proud of everything but the last ten minutes. Sure, a glitch or two popped up but nothing that ruined my enjoyment of the game. My complaint is with the ending. I didn't hate it. But, after a day of thinking about what had happened during that last ten minutes, I was still in a fog of confusion about things I saw. Things that made no sense in the Mass Effect universe and, if true, made the two previous games stories come into question.

If Bioware could just explain the ending I'd be happy. Especially if the ending actually made sense. I do not think they have to come up with DLC or anything...just...I would like to know what the hell just happened. That was my only complaint and if there were any other complaints that were not about the ending then I disagree with those.

[Joe vas Normandy]

 I just want my male
Shepard to keep his promise to Miranda (to go find her) and I don't mean as a
disembodied spirit haunting ships throughout the galaxy. I think after three
brilliantly crafted episodes in a series of games that will no doubt become the
new standard in what people are calling a fully interactive story, full of
memorable characters and experiences, the ending of said saga should reflect
that sense of choice and consequence that the series is known for, that being
said I don't mean that every ending should be a "Star Wars ending" in
which the bad guys lose and all the good guys celebrate by having Volus play
catchy tunes on the shells of the destroyed Reapers. However I think
"my" Shepard deserves some small degree of happiness, I mean let's
face it the guy's had it rough. Raised as an orphan on the streets of the great
megatropolises covering Earth, being the sole survivor while his unit was
slaughtered by a thresher maw attack on Akuze, and more recently being spaced
and at the time killed by the Collectors to later be brought back by the same
organization that caused the thresher maw attack on Akuze, the list goes on and
on, my point being the guy deserves a break. I think, in my humble opinion that
"my" Shepard  has already done
more for the galaxy than any one individual should be expected to, without
having to bite the big one, and "the powers that be " should take that
into account when determining his ultimate fate.

I'm not used to
writing in forums, but was inspired to do so by the urgings of Jessica Merizan ,and
my peers in this forum who like me love and care for  the characters that you,  Bioware have created. I hope this feedback is
of some use in determining how to best address the issues that my fellow fans
and myself have brought to bear concerning the ending of one of the best, if not
THE BEST GAME I have ever played.

Modifié par Joe vas Normandy, 22 mars 2012 - 06:46 .

[Orumon]

This cannot be stressed enough with regard to the ending.

OPTIONS!

Having choices to make truly divergent endings for characters based on tactical decisions are what made the second mass effect game so good.

Having this for entire races and being shown the consequences was expected for this game but sadly left out for unknown reasons (yes, I have my suspicions as to whose fault it was, but here isn't the place to voice them).

[Needsnewending]

I did not write this, but felt it should be shared, not jut in link form

chmarr; the person who wrote this

dear bioware

i am a 37 year old network engineer and i am also an avid gamer, i have bought games on developer promises and good previews.

i have gotten all of the other bioware rpg-type games such as the dragon age series and all of the downloadable content, and also the other mass effect 1 and mass effect 2 games along with all of the other DLC (some how 2 of the other dlc has NOT turned up on my account for mass effect 2).

i pre-ordered the collectors edtion of mass effect 3 because of 3 reasons which are listed here

1)- i have the other 2 games and dlc with them

2)- it is the final of the series (which has now been debunked due to patent and copyright registrations under the bioware / electronic arts name)

3)- the biggest reason by far on why i pre-ordered the game was based on the promises made by bioware staff in interviews guaranteeing things.

"As Mass Effect 3 is the end of the planned trilogy, the developers are not constrained by the necessity of allowing the story to diverge, yet also continue into the next chapter. This will result in a story that diverges into wildly
different conclusions based on the player's actions in the first two chapters."
--Casey Hudson

"We wouldn't do it any other way. How could you go through all three campaigns playing as your Shepard and then be forced into a bespoke ending that everyone gets? But I can't say any more than that..."
--Mike Gamble

"Whether you're happy or angry at the ending, know this: it is an ending. Bioware will not do a 'Lost' and leave fans with more questions than answers after finishing the game."
--Mike Gamble

"Pretty much everything that people want to see wrapped up, or to be given answers, will be."
--Dr. Ray Muzyka

"I’m always leery of saying there are 'optimal' endings, because I think one of the things we do try to do is make different endings that are optimal for different people."
--Mike Gamble

“For people who are invested in these characters and the back-story of the universe and everything, all of these things come to a resolution in Mass Effect 3. And they are resolved in a way that's very different based on what you would do in those situations.”
--Casey Hudson

"[The presence of the rachni] has huge consequences in Mass Effect 3. Even just in the final battle with the Reapers."
--Mac Walters

"You'll get answers to everything. That was one of the key things. Regardless of how we did everything, we had to say, yes, we're going to provide some answers to these people."
--Casey Hudson

"Of course you don’t have to play
multiplayer, you can choose to play all the side-quests in
single-player and do all that stuff you’ll still get all the same endings and
same information, it’s just a totally different way of playing."
--Casey Hudson

"Mass Effect 3 is all about answering all the biggest questions in the lore, learning about the mysteries and the Protheans and the Reapers, being able to decide for yourself how all of these things come to an end.”
--Caseuy Hudson

these were printed in everything from newspapers, gaming magazines even in live interviews these promises were made.

it is these that we purchased mass effect.

i have also been lucky enough to work part time at CVG in the uk who got a preview version of mass effect 3 and due to an NDA i could not discuss what i had played and what i had seen.

i would want an answer to this, why was the prothean removed from the game and made into day-one DLC when the edtion we recived had it already part of the full version preview game on xbox360.

why was there a 3rd disc for the xbox version which was inacessable without a developer xbox360 console, once installed the disc used 7.4gig of space, that is 7.4 = disc 1, 7.0 gig = disc 2 and the 3rd was 7.4 = gig thats a total of 20.8 gig.

why was there weapons that were only avalible on pc and ps3 in the xbox360 version.

why was a lot of dialog's and cut scenes cut from the retail version and the biggest of all, why is there a lot of side missions removed, some of these side missions were really intresting, such as the asarii and human female who were having an affair, a side mission to either expose them to the human females husband and the assari's life partner, convincing the vol whos talking about sanctuary where you can convince them to go there or to avoid it.

and the one side mission that had me laughing was an interactive game of poker with james in dock with the refugee's, the dialog was funny and a breath of freshair, the other side mission was with the 2 c-sec guards outside purgatory.

the extended dialog narratives at the start, the extended council dialogs in the citidel, the extended dialog with anderson at the end was tear jerking and would have been pivotal.

so many cut-scenes and the extended battle scene when the "retake the earth" battle was movie grade kick ass, how often do you see a heavy damaged sword ship ramming a reaper while shooting its cannons then cut to inside where the camera pans round to show primark victus standing proud and injured shouting "if were going down, were taking these bastards with us" then it cuts to the outside where his ship impacts the reaper and explodes taking the reaper with it.

the normandy doing manuvers that is just pure unadultirated awesomness, joker going hell for leather, garrus in the cockpit on the weapons seat shooting the upgraded thanx cannons, the normandy taking a direct hit from the flying orbs and shakes it off due to the heavy upgraded kinetic shielding (which was exposed by talking to engineer adams),
tali literly ripping parts out of the walls to shut off plasma leaks.
liara using her shadow broker database to hack some of the orbs to fight for them.

the geth fleet taking a pounding and a geth prime standing n the bridge of a dreadnought screaming "FOR LEGION".

the extended battle scene should have been kept in as it would have made the endings have some meaning, also where did the 3rd option come in, the version CVG recived in january 2012 dident even have that option, even with maxed out war readyness, and when did multiplayer play be required to increase the war readyness, i know its a preview version but a single line of coding changed that in retail which i found was bizar and un-needed.

bioware if you removed the content which i have seen from the full game ONLY to sell it at a later date then this is by far the WORST EVER PR STUNT for DLC ever thought of.

not a single game company would remove and entire section of a NECESSARY INTEGRAL part of the game to sell later on.

thats like cutting the last 60 minutes of terminator 2 then telling people "oh yeah you need to pay more to see the ending which you wont see for 2 months"

this has been a PR nightmare for bioware and EA as this has actually effected the fiscal year profits due to the refunds from most of the well known outlets even from EA themself are giving refunds,

this has damaged the reputation of bioware and EA in a really bad way as the "retake mass effect" gains support due to the removal of integral missions and broken promises,

its gotten as far as raising $80,000 for the childs play charity which has gotten a LOT of positive support from stars and other game developers.

we have been called brats, attention ****s, greedy ****s and then be classed as needy spoiled brats by BIOWARE PR STAFF.

just because we are VERY vocal about what we feel about what we know is wrong only to be told "this is art".

as i said i have kept most information of what i have played / seen at CVG offices in the uk about mass effect 3 and the mystery 3rd disc has gotten me annoyied

[Ghost Pirate LeChuck]

I posted what I would change earlier in the thread.  But here is some feeback on what I believe is very wrong with the end, and which also renders the first game completely pointless:

It's established at the end of Mass Effect 1 that the citadel is actually a giant Mass Relay that is only to be activated every 50,000 years or so to allow the Reapers to jump straight in from Dark Space.

The activation of the relay was supposed to be done by the keepers, who were genetically encoded to do so every 50,000 years

The few Protheans that were left on the citadel (after using the Conduit on Ilos) managed to sabotage either the citadel itself or the Keepers (I can't quite recall which) to stop the activation from happening.

The lone Reaper still in the galaxy, Sovereign, realised the activation had not happened, and so indoctrinated one of the most powerful organic individuals in the galaxy, Saren, along with many of the Geth, to attempt to take back control of the citadel and activate it manually.

This is where Shepard comes in, you discovered the plot, and managed to track Saren by following in his footsteps, eventually tracking him to Ilos and foiling his and Sovereign's plan at the 11lth hour.

But in ME3, it turns out the catalyst is actually on the citadel all along, or is the citadel itself. But here's the important part: the catalyst explicitly states that he/it controls the Reapers. So if the catalyst is on, or is the citadel already, and has full control, why does it need the keepers to activate the citadel? Why not just activate it itself? And if it could activate the citadel itself, why brainwash many of the Geth, who were previously minding their own business and not attacking any organic life, and then state the reason for the reapers' existence is to stop Synthetic life wiping out organic life, when that blatantly was not happening.

Basically, the ending makes a complete mockery of everything that happens in the first game.  How Casey and Mac thought that was a good idea is beyond me. 

Modifié par Ghost Pirate LeChuck, 22 mars 2012 - 07:15 .

[Chinirojo]

Do you know which ending would be really the best ever? If there would be one to unlocked just after play again ME3 with the same Shepard (to show us the indoc theory after "red" ending)

It's to late?

Haha... Ok I'll keep on dreaming

[BoneNinja]

CptData wrote...

Chris Priestly wrote...

Today we have a message from BioWare Co-Founder Ray Muzyka to Mass Effect players.

Please use this thread for your comments on Ray's blog.



{smilie}

A well written response.

All I have to say so far: keep listening. The saner fans don't want you to retcon the current endings, but to expand and complete them so they make far more sense.

Re-use your "indoctrination plot" you originally had in mind for Shepherd's last moments. Make the endings becoming a struggle of his/her mind fighting indoctrination. Since the entire game after Harbingers beam feels like an illusion already, keep it that way - and declare it to a hallucination.

Instead of sending the Normandy away, keep her in orbit of Earth. And don't let the game end with Shepherd's breath scene, but add another mission that leads to the -real- end: a fight through the Citadel till a console. Shepherd has to push a button to release the Crucible's power. No decision, nothing else, Reapers flee / get destroyed. Done.
Depending on EMS and decisions in ME1, ME2 and ME3, the player might see a happy ending or one where s/he had to sacrifice everything for another day. From "happy" to "sad" with several grey shades, so to speak.

What do I suggest?

Complete the game. Make it happen. ME3 is a fine piece of art, but it's not complete. The series itself is perfect - with exception of some smaller flaws and story issues - but feels incomplete 'cause of the endings.


Thank you for listening.

I'm with this. The Indoctrination Theory out there is actually sound in its points AND is a really good narrative idea. Indoctrination is something Bioware wanted to do with Shepherd in this game, now they still have the chance. They set themselves up perfectly for it, go with it!

I don't want the endings changed. I think they were fine, I just think they stopped too soon. Which ultimately maybe was a good thing, the team that worked so hard on these games and did such a phenomenal job get to tell their story and yet the fans still get to have their input and contribution to this amazing story too. I'm cautiously optimistic that this can work out for the best for everyone! From what I've seen the endings CAN still incorporate the full range of "happy reunite with crew/LI" ending through the very sad and devastating. As they should in my opinion, there should be a way (even if it's only one very specific path you had to take to get there) to get the "happy /reunite" ending and then staggered with choices on down to the devastating. And the options to do/show this are already set up to be there. So I really hope Bioware just expands out beyond the ending they have created.

My comments I have about the ending:
1. I'm glad you took out the TIM fight. It doesn't fit, the story or his character. I don't need an epic last boss fight to feel complete and accomplished with the game. I just need resolution to the story. I wouldn't, however, mind seeing put back into the game the cut scenes with Joker zooming into Earth with some snide comments and taking shots at Harbinger.

2. After the entire series does such a phenomenal job at paying attention and tracking such minute details about choices and situation, the overall vagueness about everything does come as a very jarring discrepancy. At the same time, while I suppose I wouldn’t mind the rest of the cut scenes that occur with the Star Child where you can have a little question and answer session, I don’t think it’s necessary. I don’t want too much revealed about the Reapers and Cycles past, it takes away from the mystery there. So perhaps something in the middle, a short question and answer set if Shepherd wants to waste the time and ask, or just some little but tantalizing information from the past.
3. I would like to scene the addition scenes with Anderson put back in during the final conversation you can have with him. It was touching, and really shows the bond between them nicely.
Now my confusion about the ending:
1. How did the people over the communication radios miss not just Anderson apparently getting up and making his way into the beam but Shepherd getting up and making his/her way into the beam? How was it just the two of them that made it, and Anderson with no apparent injuries. The communication is just a little strange (and lends a lot to the Indoctrination Theory). Why wasn’t it mentioned that there were specifically people from the assault that are falling back (i.e. my squad that survived)? Or even just something about their being movement but the guy can’t get a good look at what it is (reaper or part of the team)?

2. Why is Shepherd’s armor mysteriously gone once he/she is teleported up to the Citadel, through the entirety of the Citadel scene, but then mysteriously back on if you choose the Destroy option and get to see them taking a breath?

3. The Star Child, from the very moment he showed up, was very suspicious and out of place. Why did he take the form of the child Shepherd had been seeing from the first moments of the game? Where did he even get that form from? Why that form at all to talk to Shepherd? Who the heck is he? Why is he here? Where did he come from? How did anyone miss this area of the Citadel? Why can Shepherd suddenly breath and function in space (once Shepherd is up and going through the “options” for the new solution) without armor or any kind of suit on? This whole area also makes me want to lean towards the Indoc Theory, because, this scene is just so out there to me that it couldn’t have come from anywhere but in Shep’s head…or Harbinger’s mind putting it there.

4. The Synthesis option utterly confused me. On the bigger deeper meaning to life type of confusion. I understood the literal interpretation presented, but on a biological level it just became more and more confusing. How does anything thrive or even function as a hybrid synthetic /organic? Why wouldn’t this just cure Joker’s (and all for that matter) disease? How do species reproduce now? Do they still have children? Build children? Do humans (or any other species) now think in a more synthetic fashion, limited by programming? It just wasn’t explained very well at all, and that fundamentally leads me (as a player playing Shepherd) to ask “Why would Shepherd choose to do something she doesn’t understand the full consequences of?”

5. The Normandy scene I think bothered me the most about the ending. There is no reason that anyone can give to explain why Joker would have come down to Earth, picked up my crew, then left Earth, left the war, proceeds to fly off to the first Mass Relay (which is out past Pluto isn’t it?), jump to some undisclosed location only to get caught up in the blast and crash on some unknown world. There is no way Joker would ever leave Shepherd. There is no way Joker would ever go AWOL against military orders and leave the fight for Earth. There is no way any of the crew on board WITH Joker, including my LI and crew would ever let him even if he did have a lapse into insanity and want to. I appreciate the imagery of at least showing me my crew and LI ended up ok and alive somewhere (which I was indeed concerned about at the end) but this was a really inaccurate way to show it, and felt very rushed and glossed over.

6. Finally, just the showing of the consequences. And not the consequences of all the things you’ve done in through ME1 through ME3, because those WERE shown, and all those consequences and scenes were PHENOMENAL! I’m talking specifically here about the consequences of this new universe changing decision (if it really happened at all…). If Joker was out there flying around and crashed, does that mean every other ship in the Sol System (or any system) crashed into Earth too? What happened to all the fleets? If the Mass Relays are destroyed how does everyone get home? Or at least how LONG does it take them to get home? I mean, just because the Relays are destroyed doesn’t mean we’re all suddenly in the pre-spaceflight era again. They could and should be able to make their way systematically back home, building fuel relays at certain spots, reconnecting the universe again as a whole, but how long does it take? Or does everyone go extinct first because they don’t have enough food to survive on? Or crashed into Earth dealing X amount more damage to an already ravaged world? Do the Krogans manage to pick up war and revenge again? Or do they enter a new renaissance period and rediscover their culture? Do the Quarians ever get back home? Are the Geth really destroyed (The kid lied about Shepherd dying in the Destroy option, maybe the Geth and EDI dying were a lie too?)? Or in the other ending options do the Geth and Quanari continue to get along and work together to return to their home world? How do the Asari, Turians, Rachni all turn out? What happened to all the people on the Citadel? Did they ALL die, including the counselors? Or did some manage to escape before the Reapers invaded and took control of it? And what happened to the Salarians (since in my play through I sided with the Krogran and they didn’t join me? Did Shepherd go down in history as the person that barely defeated the evil Reapers but at the price of much higher consequences that plagued all the cultures for decades/centuries to come or did he/she go down in history as the savior to all cultures/species despite problems or consequences that were around for years to come after the war? And the questions really just go on and on here, but these are some of the immediate ones that come to mind.

There were a couple of small things I would have liked to see during the game as well:
1. For at least Spacer Shepherd, maybe at least a letter from his/her mom?!? I mean, I was grateful when Hackett finally at least mentioned her, but geez, can't she take a second to drop me a note in game? Even passed through Hackett like some of the other missions. Just something to give her thoughts and feelings to her only child out there trying to save the universe?!

2. I would have liked to see more fleets mentioned during the assault on Earth. When everyone shows up in the Sol System and reports in. Only the biggest fleets "check-in" I would have liked for Joker to at least mention the other fleets/war assets that Shepherd had the options of picking up through the game. Examples specifically include mentioning: The Hanar and Drell, Elcor, Volus, Rachni, perhaps even other Specters and STG forces.

Otherwise, I loved this game, this entire series in fact. This series is something the Mass Effect team as a whole should be tremendously proud of.

Modifié par BoneNinja, 22 mars 2012 - 07:17 .

[thegame30]

I like to say that what i am about to write here are my views and ideas. In no way shape or form and trying to drag others to my way of thinking.

My feedback about the game as it stand right now:
Mass effect 3
Without the ending is 9.5/10.
With the ending 3/10.

Amazing game-play great story telling until the end... I am sorry but the final moments of the game after your hit by Harbinger are completely out of touch with Bioware previous work.
Not because the ending needs to be "change"( I am one of the people who think indoctrination theory is the best exit strategy) but because the lack closure deliver to a group of players. When i was done with the game my first comment was. How could the same writers who gave us the Genophase cure story, the closing chapter between Quarians vs The Geth and the great plot on why the Asari where really soadvance compare to the other civilizations. Deliver this type of ending
with so many plot holes and discrepancies.
Not to to mention the introduction of the greatest villain in the history of RPG video games the Starchild. An entity that can't be question and his will is absolute giving us 3 magical choices. Not even taking the time to explain why he looks like a kid. Just leaving the player in the dark.( The only thing i can think of is the geth collective mission, was just a plot to help us understand why the Catalysts looks like a kid).

Now working with this ending material, this is how I will have done it.

1- As soon as our combine forces came out of the Sol relay for the final battle i will have:

- Kill Admiral Hacket with a infiltrated Indoctrinated agent inside his flag ship leaving our forces with out a High chain of command. Forcing Commander Shepard to take control of the situation, Via Paragon/Renegade checks against the others species leaders. Giving us the chance of choosing Strategic decisions plots just using the dialog, our EMS scores and Paragon/Renegade checks. Ending with cut-scenes of how things play out at the same moment with are making the decisions. They could have even added a hidden timer to increase the pressure on the player while he was making this crucial choices about the space battle.

-That is one of the ways Bioware could have avoided one of the major complains about not delivering on the promise "How you wage the war is completely up to you".

2- Regardless of your EMS score and the outcome of those choices there has to be a ground war fought like we had in this ending. Only Commander Shepard should co-lead it with Admiral Anderson on the ground. Leaving you with the crucial decision on who are you leaving in charge of the fleets on space. You will take a look at your companions and just 3 of them will be qualify to do it. Renegade/Paragon Garrus, Liara or Ashley/Kaidan. Depending on who you choose your EMS should take a hit at the end. How bad it will be it will come down on who did you choose and can even lead to the dead of that companion if your EMS scores are low.

- This idea came to my attention because of the LoTSB DLC. In one of the terminal there info about Garrus and how he will never achieve true leadership status while he is under Shepard command.

3- Ground War I will run with it as it happened but with 2 main changes:
- More closure on the department of companions farewells.

- Shepard & Anderson decisions making on how to proceed even if it is just cosmetic on cut-scenes.

4- Now the final push to the Citadel and the space magic!
- Yes Harbinger drops down and see Shepard and Hammer. He begins to shoot at them.

A- LOW EMS score outcome. He does hit Shepard and everyone else is over you die and we get cut-scene of the reapers destroying the fleet and winning.

B- Mid EMS score we get shoot by Harbinger everyone dies even your companions no matter if LI is on the squad. You will see your LI dead if she is on your squad but you will proceed to the Citadel because is what you must do. We are injure but Anderson took the worst part. He is with you heading to the Citadel Space magic entrance and both got in. The communication soldier who says the company was wipe out, should inform the fleet that only Commander Shepard and Anderson got in. Then we proceed with what we got exactly as bioware deliver it NO CHANGE.

C- HIGH EMS score easy when Harbinger is shooting at hammer one strike kills 1 of the Squad members and wipes part of hammer. If LI he/she is with us survives. Then the final moment Harbinger has us in his sights, He fires and is about to hit and finish Shepard, Anderson, & LI.
Now since we had a high EMS score the fleet shoot Harbinger from orbit severely crippling him, buying us time to get inside the Citadel. Inside things will play out exactly as Bioware deliver with TIM with just 1 change. After he makes you shoot Anderson (that been the main cause of Anderson dead eventually). He wants you to do the same with your LI. Paragon/Renegade score checks should play out resulting in either you killing TIM or he doing the suicide thing.

- Now this lead to the Starchild which you and your LI will encounter. While Shepard will seen to accept the Startchild options. Your LI should demand answers on everything. Depending on Shepard Paragon/Renegade Status is how your LI should interact with the Starchild (giving us answers to the questions we have in RL)and even go as far as to demonize the starchild, with logic on each outcome. Best case example the synthesis route(which is the part i really have problems with) Your LI should ask the very important questions:

1- So Saren was right? He wanted synthesis...
2- Why the synthesis outcome is choice? etc
3- Why in the hell do you look like a child?
4 Why do you look like a child to Shepard? While I see you as a completely different thing?

Then we proceed to say goodbye to our LI and choose whatever we decided. Not matter what we choose part of the Citadel should crash on Earth with the following outcomes under this scenario:

*** Synthesis or Control outcomes Shepards dies, LI survives.
*** Destruction LI Surives and he/she finds Shepard with secret cut-scene breathing

The end.

If the add an epilogue like DAO will be great.

Modifié par thegame30, 22 mars 2012 - 07:32 .