7052 réponses à ce sujet

[Eralrik]

My theory on how the ending should work, As Shepard an the the alliance military is rushing for the blue beam to port to the citadel and Harbinger's beam cuts into the ground knocking or killing those unlucky few.
Shepard and his team are knocked out and the battle of the citadel is what is playing out in Shepards unconscious mind being very strong willed and Harbinger trying to break him presents Shepard with questions by using the Illusive Man and Anderson as key points to his arguement and the child as Harbinger's Avatar as it saw into Shepards mind an saw his deepest guilt as the loss of a child and used that against him. As Shepard battles the citadel battle in his mind and either succumbs or defeats Harbinger's test. 
Shepard wakes up in a field hospital as the Alliance Military ground forces were pulled back to assess damage and grab who they could save and thus never having actually made it to the teleportation beam, leaving room for further ground DLC and a whole new option to use our combined military assests and our ground forces just like we did in ME2 breaking each into diffrent teams and choosing squad leaders.
An then with the added new DLC for planet scale battles and objectives we get the option for a quiet insertion or a full frontal assault but better prepared, calling on the fleet to hit Harbinger or other options as we hit it from the planet or try a stealthy appraoch and then we get the option for 6 possible endings.
Each ending has 2 Paragon options either Shepard lives or dies and 2 Renegade options with the same either shepard lives or dies and a couple endings 1 for Paragon & 1 for Renegade showing the loss against the Reapers and a little movie showing the last vestiges of life being harvested.
The closure and the plot holes filled, the after the war option explaing where the crew is and those we affect the ones who lived through the war, if shepard lived what is he/she doing and if a love intrest where they settled down and if their helping rebuild the galaxy.
<Doesn;t need to be in video can have Shepard standing in the background like ME1 and have text on the side explaing what happened with really cool music.

Modifié par Eralrik, 23 mars 2012 - 04:34 .

[Destr1er]

I enjoyed the series as a whole, only a few minor bugs and plot-holes, etc detracted from my experience. Overall it was a great way to spend my gaming time over the past few years.

The only problems I really had was with the ending, like so many other people. There was no sense of closure.
I don't think the ending needs to be re-written, but as others have posted, an epilogue featuring your squadmates, love interest, and the how the ramifications of your decisions affect the galaxy.

Also, I missed the epic N7 Mass Effect theme music from the original and modified version in the sequel. The new music was good, but it wasn't what I expected, or even wanted at the very start of the game.
If the ending is just a huge fake-out leading into a DLC, you should bring back a version of the Mass Effect theme to start the DLC, or end the series.

Edited for cold fingers and mistyping.

Modifié par Destr1er, 23 mars 2012 - 04:37 .

[Xellith]

I wouldnt mind a bit more personal dialogue between Engineers Donelly and Daniels. I gave them a pardon and they are like "cool" and dont even have a conversation with you.

I uno bout the rest of you guys but I feel that the game took a step back from ME2 in regards to dialogue.  Way too much auto-dialogue.

[Strange Aeons]

Rather than make some theoretical argument about storytelling, I'm just going to tell you why the ending felt completely wrong to me and how I think it could be made right. Take it for what it's worth, I guess.

The best comparison I can make for the current ending is that it feels like end of Dragon Warrior 1 where you agree to join the Dragon Lord, except that in ME3 you don't even have the choice to say no.

What's really amazing is the way each variation manages to invalidate the lessons of the previous games in its own unique way. Lessons like opening your mind to accept that synthetics are capable of individuality and selflessness and love and can live side by side with humans in peace. Or like spending ME2 (or literally the previous scene) arguing with the Illusive Man that attempting to control the reapers is evil and insane and doomed to failure, and that Shepard won't sacrifice his soul for victory. Or like, using the examples of Saren and the Illusive Man and the Collectors, that forcing evolution into the Reaper paradigm of man-machine hybridization only destroys individuality and makes you a slave.

The current ending ignores these lessons and forces you into a "choice" that is, frankly, morally abhorrent and violates every principle that Shepard has lived by. You can't even really call it a sacrifice, because you have no choice but to die, unless you just sit there and watch the fireworks until your XBox red-rings.

When I was finished, I didn't feel inspired, or triumphant, or heroic, or satisfied, nor did I have any sense of accomplishment like I did at the end of the previous games. I just felt sick and empty, like nothing I did mattered.

You said you wanted to make ME3's ending memorable, to make players feel something; but it's memorable in the wrong way. It's memorable like a trauma, and I never want to feel that way again.

I think the only internally consistent way to keep the current ending (i.e., all three variations) is to make that the worst ending. That's the path you take when Shepard is broken by his struggle and you've abandoned all hope and are too tired to fight anymore and simply accept the horrific premise of the Reapers at face value. Then you meekly pick one of his three equally damnable choices, destroy galactic civilization, and basically justify everything the Reapers have been doing. Then you die alone and never see your friends again.

Like I said, that's the worst ending.  It's basically conceding defeat.

Then there could be a range of better endings where Shepard does what he should have done all along: defy the Catalyst's false dilemma. You tell the catalyst that he's wrong, and that the united fleet assembled from all races of the galaxy shows that we're committed to shaping our own destiny, and that win or lose we're not going to have our fate dictated to us by some self-appointed guardian and his army of genocidal monsters.

Then we fight the Reapers in a conventional battle. Actually, it's more than just a conventional battle: it's fundamentally a battle of philosophies that has been building the entire series, pitting freedom and self-determination against subjugation and indoctrination. The outcome is shaped both by your overall military strength as well as some key individual choices that you've made (such saving the rachni, making peace between the Quarians/Geth and the Krogans/Turians, saving/destroying the Council and the Collector base, etc.).

On one end of the spectrum, there could be a bad ending where you just rushed through the game, never playing ME1 or 2, and your military strength is so low and you're so short on allies that the Reapers just annihilate you. Note that, while horrible, this is still a better outcome than the ending we were given, because at least you didn't surrender to the Catalyst and went down fighting. Maybe the last scene there could even be some civilization 50,000 years hence finding Liara's time capsule, giving a ray of hope to the next cycle.

On the other end there needs to be a golden ending. If you played like a champ through all three games, making good decisions and taking the time to build up a very high military strength, you beat the Reapers, your squad survives, the Normandy survives, you reunite with your love interest, and everyone can move forward in a more united galaxy that you helped create without the false evolution of the Reapers constraining you.

In between, you beat the Reapers but your military strength and choices determine whether your squad survives, the Normandy survives, who makes it out of the battle alive, etc.

You see, that way you might get to the end and even if you don't get a great ending you actually have some incentive to go back and re-examine your choices and try to do things better. Maybe even buy the previous two games and work on building that ideal save file.

Compare that to the current situation, where everybody from those of us who have been playing hundreds of hours over the last five years to the guy who just picked up ME3 on an impulse buy 2 weeks ago are funneled into the same slough of despond.

Modifié par Strange Aeons, 23 mars 2012 - 05:47 .

[aetheldod]

Well I had written a complex letter explaining why I like and reasons why I love Mass Effect and found the ending not right , but since you have a lot to go through I will sum it as best I can , thanks for listening to us anyway , no matter if you make big changes or not :´) :

First Mass Effect games are awesome as a whole and I loved every minute of it ... until the end , if the game was just 1 then by all means the indoctrination theory would be a great way to end the game , problem is that this is a 3 game epic story the way it ended doesnt do it justice I have no problem if you keep what is there already , but just as 1 of the many possible endings.

Even if what we are asking is beyond impossible the only thing I need is that my LI (LIara) has the spotlight NOT JOKER!!!!! From the first game I ´ve always antagonized with him only to have him have most of the end was very hard to swallow , also the implication that he gets to have my LI ... it is too much. But ok , if that cant be changed fine , but the 1 only thing that would make me happy is that the stargazer is Liara or an asari decendat of Shepard .... with that I will get all what I ultimately needed from the ending (impliying that Shepard did have decendency with Liara). That and having an epilogue akin to Dragon Age Origin explaining the galaxy post Reaper invasion (what happens to the krogan , squadmates etc.)

(Oh yeah bring back missions with vehicles like operation Overloard/Bring Down the Sky)

Thanks for reading

[k8ee]

The psychology behind people's anger at the endings - I suggest this: http://www.ted.com/t..._vs_memory.html

[prizm123]

Vortigernrex wrote...

Some good ideas here that I've seen. The indoctrination thing is the obvious way to go - it really actually seems as though someone at Bioware planned for this all along - there are too many conincidences.

When Shepherd is faced by the three choices, the selection could have the following outcomes:

Synthesis: Basically what the Reapers have been saying all along. Choosing this path leads to Shepherd accepting indoctrination (flash scene to him lying on earth with Harbinger in the background - he stirs, eyes open suddenly, glowing like a husk. Perhaps a voice on the radio saying "It's Shepherd .. wait, something's wrong. Oh my god he is indoctrinated. Pull back, all forces, pull back!" - Harbinger hovers like a mother hen over her latest hatchling ...)

Destroy synthetics: Shepherd wakes up on the battlefield having inadvertantly given Harbinger access to take control of synthetics. Being partly synthetic himself, it could be said that he contained a copy of the control codes (reaper code modified by Legion) broadcast by Legion and the Geth (a cut scene showing the 'ghost of Legion' - a mental image downloaded to Shepherd -  saying nooooo and dissolving into datastreams). Shepherd's moment of compromise has given these codes to Harbinger. Geth, EDI and any other droids then switch sides and make things a lot harder for the allied species.

Control synthetics: As the 'star-child' said concerning TIM: "he cannot control as he is controlled". This control is therefore an illusion. He is subtly indoctrinated, like The Illusive Man but thinks he is in control. He could rise from the ruins with Harbinger and other Reapers in the background holding their fire, while Shepherd (looking more and more like TIM) gives a speech saying that the Reaper threat is over. They will serve humanity and help rebuild, and humanity stood poised to rise as the dominant power in the galaxy. (A real fascist type speech: "those who do not stand with us are against us ...")

If Shepherd's reputation (Paragon and/or Renegade scores) is high enough, two more choices could be presented:

Paragon: "Something is not right. This isn't right. I will not submit to your will for this galaxy and its people." Maybe fire a shot at the colour-coded contraption or even at the 'star-child'. He wakes up with a gasp in the ruins on earth as his two companions (looking as battered as he is) drag him away. Harbinger screams with anger in the background and maybe blasts some buildings. Normandy or a couple of shuttles could fly down to try to cover Shepherd's evacuation.

Renegade: "There's a fourth option, eat lead!" He opens up on the contraption / 'starchild' with a similar effect to above.

---------------------------------

Next scene can be a message from Admiral Hacket saying that something is happening on the Citadel. The arms are opening and it appears there is fighting. The citizens, C-sec and various mercenary groups recruited by Shepherd (Blue Suns, etc) are resisting the Reaper minions and their indoctrinated servants, including what remains of Cerberus.

Shepherd must now act the strategist. He must assign roles to his/her assets to hold off the Reapers while they attempt to take back the Citadel. What remains of the allied fleets will run interference, while ground forces try to delay the Reapers on Earth with counterattacks. Shepherd could choose roles for assets, such as: who will storm Harbinger head on as a distraction (Turians, Krogan or Rachni). Who will cover the flanks of the attack, who will hold the swarms of husks back from the Normandy. Etc. The more assets committed optimally will make the entire last strike easier and more likely to succeed. Also could reduce casualties, although heroic deaths by known characters could make this last ditch attack/defence/delaying manouvre more poignant for the whole story.

The operation kicks in, Normandy comes in to land as Reapers unleash everything they have to overwhelm what they see as the centre of resistance to their forces on Earth. Normandy takes off and flies to the Citadel which now is slightly open. Ships of all alliance races run interference, including heroic ramming of Reapers to try to clear Normandy's way. "Hold the Line" becomes the rallying cry ... Maybe have a damaged Quarian ship sacrifice itself, to save a Geth ship, which in turn rams a Reaper trying to intercept the Normandy. All races working together, based on Shepherd's previous actions to unite them. In amongst it all the crucible is launched to connect to the Citadel - this time for real.

Normandy dives between two arms of the Citadel and crash-lands (perhaps on the Citadel Commons). The inhabitants of the Citadel, C-Sec and the mercs led by Aria T'Loak (maybe even a few Volus and Elcor) are fighting a running battle with swarms of husks, Reaper servants and Cerberus. Synthetics like the Geth would also help the Reapers if Shepherd had chosen the 'destroy synthetics' option during the indoctrination scene. The more war assets on the Citadel Shepherd had accumulated, the better this battle would go and the smoother Shepherd's path to the Presidium. This battle would be much like the initial Cerberus attempt to take over the Citadel. Players could fight through familiar districts from any of the previous settings.

It would be a good idea to incorporate elements of the 'suicide mission' from ME2 whereby Shepherd and the crew need to split up. Perhaps sending some to try to rescue and secure the Council members, sending some to help Commander Bailey to hold C-sec headquarters and maybe some to help Aria take back control of the Docking area and keep the Citadel arms open while the crucible docks. Eventually Shepherd and one or two chosen companions (his romantic interest could insist on accompanying him to add to his fears for the finale - 'will she die if she comes with me?') would fight through to the Presidium council chambers.

The final battle could take place in the Presidium itself (where the council usually  held audiences). The comapanions may turn to fight a horde of husks while Shepherd goes on ahead. Shepherd is then confonted by the 'star-child' again, which appears to be a hologram. But now he is far beyond indoctrination control and the 'star-child' reveal's it's true form. It is a sophisticated AI directly linked to Harbinger, and through Harbinger, to the rest of the Reapers. The truth of the Reapers is that they are much like the Geth, sophisticated AI programmes that seek to incorporate organic and synthetic tech into their physical makeup (they see synthesis as the pinnacle of evolution). The Citadel itself is the 'main server' which links this Reaper AI network, maintaining communication and control between all Reapers. The Protheans had interfered in the control mechanisms of the Citadel (discussed in ME2), to prevent the Citadel from opening a relay point for the Reapers, but in so doing, they had isolated the Harbinger AI which no longer had full control over the Citadel and needed minions to restore its control. The AI 'Harbinger' then adjusts its holographic appearance to reveal itself to be ... wait for it ... Avina, the Citadel tour guide. This AI has been hiding in the VI network. Avina has taken many forms over the millenia, but she normally mimics contemporary life forms in order to hide in plain sight. Avina then releases her latest minion champion to take on Shepherd. This champion has taken the place of Saren. It is The Illusive Man, but mutated into a killing machine, part organic, part synthetic. He would be pretty monstrous, but also devious using sneaky technology, holograms and such to fight (since this is his character). Killing him will open up Avina's mainframe (perhaps with a spectacular explosion) which Shepherd can then deal with in a final death or glory rush. The mainframe can be initialised and manually linked to the crucible (which is basically a big antenna, designed to amplify signals through the relay network). Once initialised the crucible sends out a wave that disrupts the Reaper AI network and shuts down all the connections (maybe deleted the Reaper AIs from the entire galaxy-wide wireless network). Avina can start to dissolve with a cry as she turns into whatever her original form was millenia ago (I imagine the aliens that orginally created the Reapers looked vaguely like them). Maybe just as the Reapers break through defences everywhere in a mad rush to save their mainframe server and AI 'mother'.

The final cutscene should show the surviving characters trying to 'hold the line' wherever they were scattered, while huge hulking Reapers, husks and others crumple and go still wherever they may be. Whether Shepherd survives or not is another story. He could still die in the exploding AI server on the Presidium (like Mordin Solus), maybe holding on long enough for his companions (love interest) to escape. Or he could have an option to escape (if his military prep was high enough). Perhaps only his love interest would be the one to risk life and limb to drag him to safety - hopefully he took her with him, otherwise he would die alone. Maybe he could be the one lying in Huerta Memorial hospital while Ash and others look on. If Bioware feels particularly generous, they could show snaps of
rebuilding taking place on different planets, maybe led by surviving
characters from Shepherd's crew.

This whole thing will make a great DLC and I'd pay $10 for it (or something like it) since it is more than just an ending, it is a whole extra game mission tying everything together. Lot's of choices from previous games will play a role or influence how this scene plays out and who survives. Even the rebuilding at the end could be further along if certain choices were made, than if others had been made.

Hope you take this into account and thanks for listening to us the fans. I know you guys are under constant dealine pressure by your mother company to get boxes on the shelves by D-Day, even if this means cutting content. I imagine you had an elaborate ending planned and then had to cut it short. Thanks for being open to suggestions, though, and congrats on one of the best games in pc gaming history (the passion by fans surrounding the ending is testament to this).

dude, i would pay 20 bucks for something like this..... add in that you get ALL of your squadmates from both previous games (assuming they survived) as well as Bailey, Aria, Dr Michel, Kal Reeger, Urdnot Wreav, Kirrahe (if he is alive), Anderson, Matriarch Aetheyta, and David Archer (if he was sent to Grissom Academy after Overlord)

[SikTaz]

Mass Effect 3 was a great game all in all. Really loved the game except a few things here and there.

- Like a lot of the peoPle mentioned it here earlier, the game needs a better ending. Every choice should reflect how it affected the end. All the choices I made seemed like had no bearing on the en whatsoever except for the minor differences. A proper rewrite with a better ending would be great. In the form of DLC or whatever.

- Garrus, Tali, Mordin and Grunt were my favourite characters in ME2. Great job with how Mordins story was done. Perhaps you can make Grunt as a selectable squad member again. I'd be a happy game if that happened. Also in that good bye dialogue at the end he didn't even call me battle master. Lol

- mass Effect 2 had an epic end fight. Every choice you made resulted in a different ending. Either squad mates died or survived. That was amazing. ME3 in comparison felt very weak and watered down.

- I had been waiting since ME2 to see what Quarians looked like. Maybe when you redo the ending or in a dlc you can show the Quarians finally without their helmets on their planet or something. Especially Tali, that pic beaide the bed was not enough >_<

- Mass Effect movie please make it about Shepard

Modifié par SikTaz, 23 mars 2012 - 05:02 .

[Ilzairspar]

 OK As ME twitter has brought up that you are changing things to give us Clarity and Closure I'd like to point out you have completely forgotten the third "C" that we ar clamoring for.   It is also the most important.

Choice

Don't forget that we want more of our choices to matter. choice for a different option that what Starbrat hs given us.

This game was built upon choice, please don't forget it.

Modifié par Ilzairspar, 23 mars 2012 - 05:19 .

[shnellegaming]

Marytr Ending Flashback Change

If Shep sacrifices themselves can we please get a flashback of our LI.  I romanced Garrus and was staring at Liara, Anderson and Joker  the whole time.  Kinda distracted me from the fact my Shep was giving their life, or they thought they were, to save the Galaxy.

The LIs that will play right now are just Liara, Ash or Kaiden.  Please create a clip for Garrus, Tali, Thane, Miranda and Jack.  Depending if the romance keeps it true.

[DoktorAffentanz]

Eralrik wrote...

My theory on how the ending should work, As Shepard an the the alliance military is rushing for the blue beam to port to the citadel and Harbinger's beam cuts into the ground knocking or killing those unlucky few.
Shepard and his team are knocked out and the battle of the citadel is what is playing out in Shepards unconscious mind being very strong willed and Harbinger trying to break him presents Shepard with questions by using the Illusive Man and Anderson as key points to his arguement and the child as Harbinger's Avatar as it saw into Shepards mind an saw his deepest guilt as the loss of a child and used that against him. As Shepard battles the citadel battle in his mind and either succumbs or defeats Harbinger's test. 
Shepard wakes up in a field hospital as the Alliance Military ground forces were pulled back to assess damage and grab who they could save and thus never having actually made it to the teleportation beam, leaving room for further ground DLC and a whole new option to use our combined military assests and our ground forces just like we did in ME2 breaking each into diffrent teams and choosing squad leaders.
An then with the added new DLC for planet scale battles and objectives we get the option for a quiet insertion or a full frontal assault but better prepared, calling on the fleet to hit Harbinger or other options as we hit it from the planet or try a stealthy appraoch and then we get the option for 6 possible endings.
Each ending has 2 Paragon options either Shepard lives or dies and 2 Renegade options with the same either shepard lives or dies and a couple endings 1 for Paragon & 1 for Renegade showing the loss against the Reapers and a little movie showing the last vestiges of life being harvested.
The closure and the plot holes filled, the after the war option explaing where the crew is and those we affect the ones who lived through the war, if shepard lived what is he/she doing and if a love intrest where they settled down and if their helping rebuild the galaxy.
<Doesn;t need to be in video can have Shepard standing in the background like ME1 and have text on the side explaing what happened with really cool music.

Thumbs up to this!.

[NoirLegend]

OAFSPGS wrote...

I'm not really a fanboy.  This may get me mocked here, and so be it, but I don't really care that much about plot holes or other inconsistencies.  What I care about is my Shepard, my love interest, and my crew.  I invest my time in role-playing games for payout in the form of emotional satisfaction.  I don't want deep thought, I don't want intellectual musings, I don't want art.

I want a happy ending.  I want the bad guys punished for messing with me.  I want all of my teammates to survive (or as many as possible; I can live with a limited number of Kaidan Alenko moments) and I want to see them have closure with their issues.   I want every ally who doubted me (I'm looking at you, Council) to grovel at my feet.  And most of all, I want closure with Liara, where I marry her, grow old with her, and have lots of blue babies (like I promised).

Bioware, you convinced me, via both advertising and the first two game endings, that happiness and success were within my reach if I did everything right.  Heck, the trip to the collector base was clearly suicide (and labelled as such!), yet you let me bring everyone back home.  I expect the same from the third game as well, with the bonus of a warm and fuzzy epilogue because my Shepard's adventures are finally over.

Anything less is just mean.

This guy speaks for me, BioWare(Also add more Ashley moments).

[Walgreen2345]

I don't know if this has been posted in this thread, or not, so I'll post it again anyway. I thought it would be a neat way to put in an actual, alternate ending. Credit goes to phrizek.

phrizek wrote...

 So right after the assault on the
Cerberus base we learn that the Citadel has been retaken and is now
closed up in orbit around Earth. The only way in is a beam of light
somewhere in London. But wait! That simply isn't true, is it? There is a
back door onto the station, and we've known about it since ME1: The
Conduit at Ilos. 

So here is my proposal. After destroying Cronos
base you have an option. You could travel to the Sol system on the
galaxy map and launch the final mission just like we have now. The
mission, the ending, and the consequences will remain unchanged. Or we
could download a new Ilos DLC that will enable us to travel to Ilos on
the galaxy map and if we choose this branch, will launch a completely
different ending sequence.

This ending will mirror the the end of
the first game, providing a good bookend to the series. You have to
fight your way to the conduit on Ilos just as you did Saren's geth at
the end of ME1, except you are now fighting Reaper troops that are
trying to stop you. Harbinger shows up and tries to stop you from
reaching the conduit but the Normandy and some allied ships come in the
nick of time and blow it away with their Thanix cannons, like what we
see in this trailer: http://youtu.be/eBktyyaV9LY?t=2m35s

Now here
is where things get interesting. As you are getting to the conduit, and
even after, the perspective changes from Shepard's squad to that of
Admiral Hackett commanding the fleets trying to retake Earth, just like
how the end of ME1 had the perspective change from the boots on the
ground team to the space battle for the Citadel going on outside. Only
one major difference here: you get to play as Admiral Hackett as he
guides the allied forces of the galaxy against the Reapers and can even
give a rousing speech. This is done so you won't lose sight of the
battle that is going on at Earth.

When you reach the presidium
from the conduit, some cool stuff happens, and you have to fight your
way up to the council chambers and open up the citadel arms. You could
meet the Illusive Man over there just like in the ending we already
have. Shepard opens up the arms, the Crucible docks and activates, the
Reapers die, and we get the happy ending (or sad, depending on your
readiness) we want that hopefully involves ingesting alcoholic beverages
via emergency induction ports with Garrus. The end.

The best
thing about this is if you like the original ending, that is totally
your option. Just choose to launch the end game from Earth instead of
Ilos. For the rest of us, we get the ending we want in a totally
optional way that doesn't detract from Bioware's original ending.

Thoughts?

The only problem here is that the Conduit ran out of power and shut down, so there would need to be a mission as part of the whole DLC to restart the reactors that power it. In my opinion, the above would be awesome.

[attack vector]

Miekkas wrote...

I've written about this before on this thread and just now on another, but I wanted to share it on here and further expand on what I consider to be a serious problem with the Reapers and introducing a motive for their actions whether it be the existence of the Catalyst as AI (creating synthetics to kill organics so synthetics don't kill organics) or the original dark matter story.

Let's consider everything the Reapers have stated in regards to their state of existence and relationship with organics in the Galaxy. Take note at how the introduction of the Catalyst as an AI, and what it says COMPLETELY contradicts everything the Reapers have said in Mass Effect 1 and 2:

Sovereign:
"We impose order on the chaos of organic evolution. You exist because we allow it, and you will end because we demand it."

Sovereign:
"Rudimentary creatures of blood and flesh. You touch my mind, fumbling in ignorance, incapable of understanding."

Sovereign:
"There is a realm of existence so far beyond your own you cannot even
imagine it. I am beyond your comprehension. I am Sovereign."

Sovereign:
"Organic life is nothing but a genetic mutation, an accident. Your lives
are measured in years and decades. You wither and die. We are eternal,
the pinnacle of evolution and existence. Before us, you are nothing.
Your extinction is inevitable. We are the end of everything."


Sovereign:
""Your civilization is based on the technology of the mass relays. Our
technology. By using it, your civilization develops along the paths we
desire. We impose order on the chaos of organic life. You exist because
we allow it, and you will end because we demand it."

Sovereign:
"My kind transcends your very understanding. We are each a nation -
independent, free of all weakness. You cannot grasp the nature of our
existence."

In my opinion, there is no
enemy more intimidating than one whose logic or better yet existence you
cannot comprehend. The Reapers were introduced in Mass Effect as
literal grim reapers (no pun intended) who represent being of seemingly
infinite powerful that we have nearly no hope of being able to defeat.
They want our destruction and arrogantly hold us so far beneath their
contempt that we are unworthy of even being given some form of
explanation. 

Their relationship with us is best thought of
being similar to the one we as humans typically have with insects within
our home. When an insect is inside a person's home, the human is most
likely going to kill the insect without a moment of hesitation. Why
though? It is because we as humans hold the insect as being so
infinitely inferior to us, that killing it because it is inside our home
is not worth an explanation. Thus is it so with the Reapers and us in
the game. The Galaxy is the Reapers' "home", and we are the insects. We
are regarded as being so inferior to them that they feel there is no
need for an explanation as to why they are killing us.

With the
introduction of a motive, Bioware committed the largest mistake a
writer(s) can make when designing a villain: they tried to humanize a
villain who up until now has been designed to be the exact opposite of
being worthy of empathy. When designing a villain, the very first thing
that is done is you deprive them of anything that the average player,
reader, viewer, etc can relate to in a positive way. You make them ugly,
arrogant, lustful for power, etc. It makes it easier for the villain to
be hated and gives the player greater incentive to want to defeat them
in the end. Humanizing the Reaper completely wipes out this concept that
the entire series has been reinforcing, and seemingly it was done for nothing more than "surprise twist!" shock factor. It completely contradicts EVERYTHING that has been stated by Sovereign and Harbinger.

The
introduction of the Catalyst as an AI who controls the Reapers creates a
mass of problems in the form of contradictions and plot holes. It
effectively reduces the Reapers from being powerful sentient machines to
seemingly the slaves of this single AI who is stuck in one place as the
Citadel. Take note at hoe Sovereign states they we evolve and develop
according to the path that they desire....errr....so why not have us develop down a

path that doesn't involve creating synthetics who kill so that you
don't have to commit genocide against us? Were the Reapers outright
lying to you throughout the entire trilogy or completely out of the loop on what their purpose was or just plain arrogant?
Was Sovereign just an idiot and that's why he was left as the
vanguard so the other Reapers did not have to deal with his senile statements?  So much for them being these larger than life villains that
we are incapable of understanding. 

The
Catalyst as an AI or/and the introduction of an understandable motive,
illogical or not, completely destroys the dynamic of the Reapers
established in the first two games. Bioware needs to stop trying to give
complexity to the Reaper when frankly, they don't need it to be great
villains. Bioware, leave the Reapers as the villains they were portrayed in Mass Effect 1 and 2, and it would save you a lot of grief in trying to explain the massive plot holes in the ending.

THIS! +1
Brilliantly voiced.
I was floored by the Reapers in ME1... and in ME3 they had lost their menace
I
was even disappointed by the 'human-proto-reaper' in ME2... felt like
Bioware was starting to fumble and starting to bring a simple and
derrivative motivation to the Reapers. Simply that they wanted to
consume and cleanse, when in ME1, their reasons for purging the galaxy
were much mroe obtuse and alien.  And not being able to understand my enemy, made everything that more horrific.

There is nothing more terrifying than the unknown.

[Nefylym]

i could do with less ashley actually
she was an obnoxious waste about
getting drunk so bad off duty that she is left on the floor the next day
constantly questioning Shepards loyalty and trust

dont get me wrong, she is hot, and her voice sexy
but thats about it, and sadly, i have a brain
so i tend to look for more than sexyness when selecting squad members for operations

i kinda regret not saving Alenko now lol

oh well, at least i still managed to win Jack back and save her from the dark side

[Izaelles]

First of all I need to say that I loved ME3 (the whole serie to be more exact!).
I couldn't stop playing wondering what will happen next... Only a few things here in there, but really minor.
The events timing was perfect, the writting, conversation/interraction with your team great!!!

As for many it was the ending that I did not understand (and that was enough to put a big shadow on the rest of this great game).
I felt like when your looking at a good movie and the generic sudenlly shows and you're like: Over? Already? But what about this and that? What really happenned? How did it ended?
They were also so many details that didn't make sense to me. Then I started to read about the indoctrination/hallucination theorie and was like ok it make sense, maybe the story is not over yet...and we will soon be able to understand the impact of our choices.
But then, I felt like a fool: I have paid for a game that should be complete and bring you all the answers(as per the publicity I have seen before buying..) but (if what I understood is correct) I will have to pay more to get to know those answers.

This said, here is what I would have like:

- have a real choice in confronting the little boy at the end
- understand the impact of the choices we made on the ending: what happens to your team mates(cause the normandy crash is not an answer for me it just raises more questions and incomprehension... how did Shep team got on the Normandy is just one of them), the rest of the flee (that get stock if the mass relay are destoyed...), and how about our romance if any, Earth, the krogan (and ther many babies!!!), tessia, galarien, geth and quarian...
- reapers real motivations....unless it is already said
- happier ending options
- I want to understand

Hope this may help, thanks for listening to us.

By the way, from à FShep point of view, Kaidan romance was.....almost perfect!!! Very great job on that!!!

(is there a way to save Thane??? Just had to write it down!!! 

Modifié par Izaelles, 23 mars 2012 - 06:25 .

[japilgrim]

I enjoyed ME very much and don't like to see it going out on a sour note.

The series really needs two different types of 'closure' at this point.  The fans want to see their choices reflected in a diverse set of possible endings, but the storyline also needs to reach a decisive conclusion. 

I found the current endings underwhelming, but they wouldn't have set off such a negative reaction if three things had been done to enhance the sense of player engagement: 1) changes to the final battle cutscenes depending on war assets acquired, 2) changes to the action of the final battle depending on war assets acquired, 3) inclusion of an epilogue. 

The changes to the lead-in cutscenes don't need to be extensive - a few seconds for each major race or NPC would suffice.  The second point is more difficult, but it would be an improvement if a few new obstacles were introduced into the final battle, with the need to overcome them circumvented if key assets are available - krogan ground troops, biotic students, etc. - with cutscene playing out in a positive or negative way depending on how Shep acquired the assets.  Finally, Liara's time capsule already provides the perfect means of delivery for an epilogue.  All prominent characters should get some mention here, depending on which of the endings is received.

In order to reach a decisive conclusion to the series it seems inescapable that either Shepherd must die or the mass relays must be destroyed.  That said, I'm sure it's in the interests of  both the fans and Bioware to keep alive the possibility of further games in this universe.  Fortunately, the concept of multiple cycles - and the sort of eternal recurrence hinted at by the Stargazer - furnish just this possibility.

In addition to problems with closure, some of the elements of the existing endings just don't make sense, especially 1) the escape of the Normandy and 2) the supposed inevitability of conflict between organic and synthetic.  Again, the first is easy to deal with by adding a small cutscene to each ending.  The second is more difficult, but indoctrination theory allows a way out of that.

With these points in mind, and with a view to establishing a balance between speculation and explicit exposition, I offer the following potential endings (FWIW):

1) Assault fails and everybody dies due to not having enough war assets.  Sheperd killed outright by Harbinger.  Epilogue shows discovery of Liara's device by militant alien race during next cycle, but otherwise no detail on what happened to characters.  No stargazer.

2) Current blue ending.  Shepherd is indoctrinated.  Cutscene of Hackett ordering withdrawal of all forces including Normandy (after rescue of squadmates)  Shepherd emerges later as human voice / propagandist of Reapers, prompting mass despair and surrender.  Normandy crew on jungle planet prepare as part of small, marginalised resistance force.  LI mourns loss of Shep.  Epilogue focuses on tragedy of Shepherd's failure and heroic deaths of squadmates in following battles. No stargazer.

3) Current red ending.  Shepherd resists indoctrination and wakes in rubble on earth.  Climbs into beam and enters Citadel.  No starchild this time.  Shepherd warns Joker to get clear.  Chooses either a) to destroy or to control Reapers. 
3a) Shep dies from exposure to destructive force.  LI mourns death at memorial.  Epilogue focuses on heroic sacrifice of Shepherd, exploits of crew and war assets in final battle, and glories of galactic civilisation.  Stargazer.  
3b) Shepherd attempts to gain control of Reapers.  Reapers suddenly retreat into dark space.  Military forces disperse.  Mass relays and Citadel rendered non-functional after Reaper departure, effectively ending galactic civilisation.  Shepherd's lifeless body discovered on Citadel.  Normandy crew in Earth ruins, beginning to rebuild.  Shepherd's burial, mourned by LI.  Epilogue focuses on heroic actions of Shepherd, exploits of crew and war assets in final battle, and alien myths implying Shepherd has become avatar of vengeance within Reaper shared consciousness and involved them in a war with their unknown creators in dark space.  Stargazer.

4) Current green ending. Shepherd is indoctrinated.  Cutscene of Hackett ordering withdrawal, including Normandy after rescue of squadmates.  Shepherd emerges later as synthesized voice of Reapers.  Exact form depends on whether Shep is a) Paragon, Renegade, c) Neutral. 
4a) If Paragon, cutscene shows Shep as charismatic leader, persuading masses to willfully join Reaper consensus. Rest of ending as in 2.
4b) If Renegade, cutscene shows Shep as brutal leader, intimidating masses into fearfully joining Reapers. Rest of ending as in 2, except epilogue condemns Shepherd's actions.
4c) If Neutral, Shep becomes just another part of Reaper forces.  Rest of ending as in 2, except epilogue mentions Shep's later destruction by resistance members.

5) Paragon resists indoctrination by pointing out problems with organics vs. synthetics argument.  Climbs into beam and enters Citadel.  No starchild this time.  Chooses to a) destroy or control reapers.
5a) Same as 3a, except epilogue contains section on wonders of synthetic-organic alliance.
5b) Shepherd gains control of Reapers, prompting their withdrawal but not their destruction.  Military forces disperse.  Mass relays and Citadel rendered non-functional after Reaper departure, effectively ending galactic civilisation until it can be re-developed by the galactic races (but races still mixed where they have chosen to stay together).  Normandy crew with Shepherd (and LI) in Earth ruins, beginning to rebuild.  Epilogue focuses on heroic actions of Shepherd, exploits of crew and war assets in final battle, and legends / memories of galactic civilisation in the now isolated pockets of life in the universe.  Stargazer.  

Final point: all of these endings assume that the scene with Anderson and TIM never really happened.  This can be addressed in the epilogues.

Modifié par japilgrim, 23 mars 2012 - 06:26 .

[GeneralBacon339]

Joker put forward a good question that i'm not sure there is an answer to yet, i sided with liara,

"Do Asari Head Tenticales move?"

i think they should twitch based on the mood of the person!

[GeneralBacon339]

Geth, i loved what was done with the Geth in ME3, and would like to see more of the Geth in DLC! maybe another Virtual Reality mission, or... something

[Legend78731]

"We are creating new content to clarify and add closure as per the request of many loyal fans! That's all"

If this really is the extent of what you are going to do, then please provide LI closure. Even if the LI was from ME2. Judging by how the ME2 LI was omitted from the final flashback and replaced with Liara, development seems fine ignoring those relationships. But they had meaning to many of us. Please give them the attention they deserve.

[GeneralBacon339]

would like to see Quarians without their Masks, Especially tali! Either in a Later DLC or perhaps a Mass Effect 4 if there is one. (if you made peace with the geth and the quarians at least)

NO MMO PLEASE!!!!!!! that would be the death of this beloved game!!!!!

[GeneralBacon339]

If you need to take your time to give us the Quality ending we are looking for (i'd say deserve, but not all of us have been.... friendly regarding that terribly.... incomplete ending) then please take your time, work on some supporting DLC along the way, Lots of story DLC would be awesome, this could also be your chance to get all the voice actors together again, (if there is any problems with that) i am hoping that i get DLC that will blow Shadow Broker out of the water and if i have to wait for it, then so be it! i hope to be blown away and awe struck by any ending DLC added... that IS OF COURSE if my shepard survives! /fingers crossed.

[GeneralBacon339]

just say yes or no if you are going to add ending DLC. you know buying yourself some breathing room while you work.

[BFG Achilies]

i am rescinding my arguments regarding the ending. if the indoctrination theory is true i now see why based upon a video i have seen. now i am pissed because i paid 70+ dollars for an incomplete game

[Rooster8227]

Just get rid of that bloody child! Okay, he dies at the start, very sad. After that, maybe the dreams are cool but to have him as some hugely important 'GOD' is pretty ridiculous. I just don't get it.

I'd also like to see the effect of my decision at the end properly on my war assets and squaddies.

Cut scenes in battle of your war assets seriously effing some sh*t up! But deffo cut scenes or all your decisions on war assets feel like ultimately they don't matter.

Splitting up your squad in the last mission 'a la' mass effect 2 and the suicide mission where you're constantly making huge decisions where your squad mates (and maybe even your war assets like grunt and his company) are put in dangerous places and that can have good/bad consequences.

More consequences in the decisions you make.... just in cut scenes in the end!

And finally, I'd like a few more overall possibilities, like a really unexpected ending. I think the one's there (bar god child) are really good, but some decisions made before that or something could tweak these....

Really though, the ridiculous hate is a bit far

EDIT: more harbinger! he's immense. but maybe that's dlc..

Modifié par Rooster8227, 23 mars 2012 - 06:52 .