7052 réponses à ce sujet

[Kaji-chan]

If BioWare really wants to "hold the line" with this idea that Reapers were created (by the strange and unrealistic God-Child of the Citadel), then why not offer a choice of a "bittersweet" ending to those players who were successful in creating an alliance between the Geth and the Quarians? Seeing as the Geth/Quarian war was the only synthetic/organic war to occur in the current cycle, and many fans have cried out that this alone makes the God-Child's cyclical logic a fallacy... why not offer up an ending to those who were able to secure this peace? Or at least offer it as some sort of dialogue choice with the God-Child... in some sort of argument. At no point is Shepard allowed to flip a middle finger to this AI, or at least protest its logic!

Organics are just as likely--if not MORE so--to kill each other, than synthetics are to kill organics. Its just the justification for the creation of the Reapers (and subsequent annihilation of organic life every 50 millennia) is illogical... and for an AI, isn't it impossible (or at the very least, unnatural) to be... illogical?

And lets wind back to ME1. Why would Sovereign need to MANUALLY uplink to the Citadel master control if all he had to do was page his "creator" (i.e. the God-Child) to open the relay? After all, the God-Child IS the Citadel, right?

I feel like the God-Child just punched Mass Effect 1 in the face.

Honestly, if the transparent boy would have been cut out of the ending entirely, I would have been able to swallow it a little bit better.

[Kaji-chan]

Atomic Waffle wrote...

ThePasserby wrote...

I'll keep it simple.

1. Shepard is an epic hero, not a tragic hero. Epic heroes have epic endings.

There is nothing that sets Shepard up as being fatally flawed or having committed a flawed act. Many of us, especially Paragon Shepards, play him as an epic hero. As such, the expectations that the player brings to the game is one that includes an epic ending, not one in which Shepard perishes in his bid to achieve what is at best a pyrrhic victory.

2. The ME series are games, and as games, players want to win.

Shepard single-handedly destroying the galactic economy and stranding the biggest armada ever assembled in the Sol system is not winning; it is a pyrrhic victory. In other words, he gave his life to secure a doubtful win.

3. Follow conventional story structure. You don't have to break away from it just to be "artistic"

It worked for ME1, didn't it? Keep to the structure:

i. The setting and introduce main characters.

ii. Rising action

iii. Climax

iv. Falling action

v. Resolution (<----- Not the right place to introduce new characters and plot devices)
 
4. Make players' choices matter. Don't negate them with an ending that drastically alters the galaxy and putting them in question

The quarian and geth peace is all for naught when they can't get back home, for example.

Yes. This guy understands. Is it too much to ask that we're allowed to win the game? And by "win" I mean Shepard lives, and overwhelmingly defeats the Reapers. He should get to enjoy the fruits of his labor.

Agreed.  A random gasping breath at the end is not a "win" for me.  Particularly not when Tali will never get to see the homeworld, and a bunch of rabid Krogan have dispatched the last of the husks and are getting hungry...

I don't even care if you have to beat the game on Insanity, achieve every achievement, acquire every war asset and pursue every possible romance in the game.  Throw whatever you want at me, I will CONQUER it for that beer on the beach with Garrus!

[drgnslayer64]

So i just wanted to put my two cents in for what its worth and everyone can take it or leave it. I'll start off with what I liked about the game:
1. The gameplay was really smooth for the most part and always entertaining; I didn't get bored or frustrated, except fighting Kai Lang the last time. Bioware also did a good job of giving more custimization of weapons and powers to fit different play styles.
2. I loved the dialogue and intereactions between the characters, except at the end. I mean Tali's Liquid Induction Port was hilarious.
3.I enjoyed the journey that was provided to the fans in all three games.
Now the bad:
1. The ending. Its not so much that Shepard dies its the fact that regardless of what Shepard did, synthesis, destruction, or control, the galaxy is still doomed because by destroying the reapers you have effectively neutered galaxtic civilization and the ability to live beyond a certain distance. Also, the three differnet colored explosions didn't help much either. I mean sure its possible that the people left around Earth or anywhere else for that matter could potentially create new relays but considering that none of the species bothered researching them they have to start from scratch. So, basically I felt frustrated because not only did Shepard not save the galaxy but I felt there was no closure.
2. I would have liked some more in depth conversations. The ambient conversations are nice but i would have liked the chance to catch up with or get to know some of the people and I felt that their wasn't enough of it.
3.The characters that died in the 2nd game, if they died, don't seem to matter considering they just get replaced by inferior copies that fulfill the same role. Sure the dialogue may be different or a few minor things might change but it seemed to lack impact or at least the kind of impact I was expecting.
4. Liara's gift that she gives you at the end kinda confused the hell outta me and seemed to come outta nowhere. I realize this is a minor point but it bugs the hell outta me. I mean if it was limited to people that had a relationship to Liara than ok maybe it implies that you just got her pregnant but the same thing happens even if you didn't so I was just kinda left confused but maybe thats what Bioware wants so ya....

Anyone those are my thoughts and take them as you will I kinda needed to vent my frustration anyway

[Kaji-chan]

I would have appreciated some more in-depth conversations as well. I felt that unless you romanced a character, you really don't get to delve into their personality as much as you would otherwise. But perhaps, writing wise, that is unavoidable... I can see that it might leave the player feeling a bit disappointed with the romances if the dialogues were otherwise identical (other than an intimate cutscene near the end).

I actually would have liked to see more references to Shepard's gender... just to encourage players to trying playing as both male and female Shepard. I, myself, have multiple playthroughs, one of which is the default poster John Shep, in which I experienced a slightly different relationship with my female companions. Other than Wrex calling Shepard something akin to a "sister", there wasn't much reference to my Shepard being female (or male, for that matter).

I've carried over nine playthroughs through the first two games, but the ending (or lack thereof) has nearly discouraged me from carrying them all through the trilogy. Back in ME1 it took nearly three playthroughs just with ONE character to max out their level, and I maxed out four of my nine Shepards... so that's easily 400 hours just in the first game.

Needless to say, I'd like there to be some satisfaction at the end of the trilogy. Something more than an Alliance fist pump as a Reaper falls/flies off and Joker checking out a jungle scape, regardless of any choices made throughout the entire series.

((This being said, everything up until the final moments, in my opinion, is well deserved of its 75 perfect scores.))

[justjack452]

here are the issues there all mentioned in this article. 
http://www.gamefront...fans-are-right/ 
If you can use indoctrination theory do it. Thank you for listening  

[jak11164]

from game to game ME gives us less exportation and more shooting game. really i loved MassEffect1 exploration system with MAKO ..it was really nice with really good handling and shooting/hiding capability. compared to that ME2 hammerhead sucked. I liked in ME1/2 ability to return to certain locations Citadel Feros Noveria Alpha station Ilium ......
what i like to be fixed :
1:exploration -now its save and reload game due to Reapers awareness it really sux
2: certain locations should stay unlocked not just citadel..... we should be able to return to Tuchanka Rannoch Eden Prime at least to see what is going on there 4 trade maybe too
3.Id like to see some other locations unlocked . Like retake base Alpha might be DLC

and THE ENDING much was said before but i think it have to be fixed. My favorite ending is merge (i saved Geth and Quarians see EDI and Joker romance) and I really don't like I have to die during that i hate mass relay net was destroyed separating whole galaxy. this ending cutting ability to release any further MassEffect games (it just destroy whole ME universum) and post ending DLC
it just makes me play game to some point and disgust to finish it

[res27772]

Fix the EMS so you can get past the 4000 mark in single player.

I've played through ME3 with the same character (New Game +) 3 times now (making sure I had max Paragon in all three games), and I'm still falling short of the 4000 mark by just a couple of hundred point, even with the DLC points you get, and that REALLY pisses me off... I could've sworn it said somewhere that accumulative play would enable you to pass 4000, but just HOW many times do I have to play through to get there - 10? 100? 1000? (I hate multiplayer, so that's not a legit option imho)

[Kaji-chan]

To get that coveted 5000+ rating, you must play multiplayer, or one of the iOS apps, or it will be nearly impossible for you to see the "perfect ending". By "perfect", everyone just means a half second gasp of breath from an N7 chest plate buried under some rubble, which the Collector's Edition Strategy Guide deems to be Shepard "surviving".

Or you could just run into Harbinger's beam yourself and dream up your own special sparkly ending. That's what I did. Wrex comes over sometimes for tea.

[Raynulf]

Taking a step back from the detail to talk about 'suggested changes' from a higher level:
 
Conclude the story in the same theme and narrative style as it began
 
Mass Effect 1-3 is a sci-fi epic, and Shepard is an epic hero, who defies the truth presented to them in favor of finding their own.
 
Other themes are those of hope, of self-determination, of questioning what it means to be alive, and of success through perseverance, but the strongest theme of Mass Effect, and particularly Mass Effect 3 is not sacrifice, or organics vs synthetics. It is that of racial tolerance and acceptance through understanding of each others differences.
 
The whole series of games has reinforced this message time and again, and it is, in fact, one of the greatest achievements of Mass Effect: There is a moral to the story, and it is good!
 
With the ever increasing ease of travel and mingling of cultures and people, this is a message that is more pertinent than ever, and it is a credit to the Bioware team that they have produced such a masterpiece of storytelling in which to deliver it.
 
And thus it is practically a sin that this message was so thoroughly and unjustly destroyed by the ending.
 
Additionally: While the unreliable narrator can be an incredible narrative tool (Dragon Age 2, The Princess Bride etc), it has never been the narrative style of Mass Effect. Dramatic shifts of narrative style rarely, if ever, are well received - particularly if there is no lead up to warn the audience it is happening.
 
Continuing the Narrative
 
Putting Mass Effect 3 back on track is a challenge, but by no means impossible. The Indoctrination premise (which, although I would love to believe was intentional on Bioware's part, I strongly suspect it wasn't) is a reasonably elegant way of explaining the existing 'ending', while quickly returning to the actual theme.
 
From a high level perspective, the conclusion should:
 
1) Reaffirm the morals of the story (racial tolerance, self-determination, hope)
2) Allow players choice in which to end the story (DA:O handled this well).
3) Explain what happens to the characters they care about
4) Explain how their decisions changed things
 
As part of this: As many have pointed out: Shepard is not a tragic hero, and does not require a tragic end. Death as a possibility (or even probability) is appropriate, but as an inevitability defies the core themes of the story.
 
On the Reapers
 
Through Mass Effect 1 and 2, the reapers are built up as an utterly alien race that we, the players, cannot empathise with. That makes them horrifying and brilliant as a primary antagonist at the same time.
 
They do not need explanation for why they do what they do, they only need explanation for the intense interest in humanity (as built up in ME2).
 
Additionally, any further building upon them should avoid contradicting previously established story - because the audience will notice, and it will break immersion.
 
 
On Terminator and Mass Shift
 
I sincerely hope the leaked information is either completely falsified or the entire outline is discarded in light of the reception to ME3's ending.
 
Why?
 
As they appear (again, I sincerely hope they are 'fake'), they serve only to reinforce the debunking of the entire series core themes (hope, self-determination, strength-in-unity, racial tolerance) and Shepard's failure.
 
We do not need to build upon the 'new' moral of the story that was jammed into the last 15minutes of ME3. It's nihilistic, distasteful and ultimately goes against not just everything that the game previously established, but core modern western morality.
 
If one peals off the layer of detachment the science fiction genre allows through the use of unfamiliar environments, and put the ending into a contemporary setting, it becomes clearly evident just what is wrong with the message in it.
 
And if it is art, it has a message.
 
 
On the Stargazer
 
To be honest, the scene does not work. It's a massive and abrupt shift in narrative style, the religious symbology (present all through the end sequence) and sheer lack of connection with the character detracts from the overall work.
 
And to be frank, this saddens me.
 
It saddens me because the inclusion of Buzz Aldrin as the narrator was a touching and beautiful nod to a man who has risked his life to advance mankind, who has done the things we only dream of. We are playing Shepard, the space hero, Aldrin is one.
 
So no. His voice acting isn't the best. Because he's not an actor, he's an astronaut who has done what few since have and none have recently - walked on the moon, and come home again safely.
 
I only wish that the scene did justice to the greatness of the man.

[Aridas]

N7 Vey wrote...

 I completely forgot the lack of CONRAD VERNER this game had.

Actually, Conrad Verner can appear.  And you can get a War asset worth 1 point from him... with a possible addition of 4 points on top of that, if you completed a collectable quest in ME1.  Easily missed, though.

Bored-WIzard wrote...

Please make it easier to spot and talk to Matriarch Aethyta in the Citadel. I didn't see her the first time around.

I missed her through 2 playthroughs... and I was fairly complete with both.

Both of these things are distractions to why I went to the trouble of figuring out how to post here, though, given that I haven't cared enough to post on a game forum, in a long, long time.  I thought I'd try to give some suggestions on the simplest and easiest way to fix the endings so that they could actually work.  The game is completely amazing, but the ending just doesn't work.  This annoys me, greatly. I'm just going to thank you, Chrislo1990, and quote and answer you on some of the points, since you so kindly typed them up for me, then provide my ideas for an easy fix.  Also, I'm not a fan of the Indoctrination theory, given that the best pieces of evidence for it that I've seen are inconclusive, at best, and there's a bunch of claims that have been made to support it that are flat out wrong.  In short, it's a bad conspiracy theory, in my opinion, so I'm not going to base anything on it.

Chrislo1990 wrote...

1.) As had been established in
the Mass Effect 2 Arrival DLC, destroying a mass effect relay would
unleash an incredible amount of energy, akin to that of a supoernova,
that would decimate an eniter solar system. If this were true, then I
fail to see how my crew, indeed all life in the galaxy, did not
instantly vaporize upon the destruction of the mass relays in the
ending. Did Bioware completely ignore canon or what? I just don't
understand! This makes absolutely no sense. It gives me the impression
that Bioware writers did not care enough to adhere to established
concepts.

This is a real issue.  One that's repeatedly brought up in game, no less.  There is no good reason, at all, why Shepard wouldn't have at least asked for clarification of the consequences.  A simple couple lines of dialog with the god-child could have cleared up this quickly and easily. When asked, the god-child could either say that the relay that was destroyed just looked like it destroyed the system from the outside.  In reality, only the communications or infrastructure in the system were cut off, because of the nature of the energy released.  It's not an ideal explanation, by any means, though.  A somewhat better response would clarify that the method of destruction would cause different consequences.  Being blown up as opposed to falling apart because of the raw amount of energy released, basically.  In the former, it's just an explosion.  In the latter, it's the relay falling apart after overloading itself.  Neither choice is great, regardless, but it stays within the observed phenomena of the ending and at least gives a superficial explanation to the soldier that is Shepard.

2.) How in the world was your crew,  of whose members
can vary, flying in the Normandy when they were busy fighting a ground
war in London only a while ago? One would think would have the courage
to stay and fight the Reapers along with the rest of the galactic
species, and not run from them. No explanation is offered as to why this
is.

This answer also addresses point 5 and 7.

For this to work at all, with the other events, there has to have been quite the sequence of events that the player is not informed of in any way.  At the end of a game like this?  That's a terrible idea.  That said, one of my lesser talents in the past has been interweaving disparate facts and parts of a timeline into a coherent whole. 

I... don't feel like taking the time to list all the relevant specifics as they occur in game, beforehand, so, if anyone sees a plot hole in my theoretical progression of events given events/scenes in game, please, point them out.  My apology if this is a bit long, as I try to pay attention to as much as possible.

I'll start at Harbringer, or whichever reaper that was, landing, blasting away, and eventually knocking Shepard out (incidentally, when I played it last night, the beam that hit Shepard literally passed through a huge solid object without doing any damage to the object.  Bug, much?).  The squad was following closely behind Shepard (yes, I checked very shortly before).  I'm going to postulate that they were knocked out, too, otherwise, by all story measures, they should have either 1) helped at all or 2) kept heading to the beam.  Yes, they're nowhere to be found for the next scene, though, which I'm willing to attribute to bad design.  They could have been knocked out of action shortly after at a different time and off to the side where Shepherd couldn't see, though.  After Shepard's knocked out, an indeterminate amount of time passes, during which the rest of the force is downed to Harbringer's satisfaction and it leaves.  Of course, something like the Normandy distracting it would be a fine reason for why it would leave before taking more precautions to protect the path to the beam or finish off the wounded.  Either way, Shepard gets up, manages to get to the beam, and then is teleported up to the Citadel.  The exact nature of the teleportation is unknown, and so is how long it would take.  That there's time lag here is actually fairly important to there being any real chance of the things playing out in a coherent manner.  Preferably, time lag based on amount of mass.  Anderson is wearing much lighter armor, so... he could conceivably arrive at the beam later and still get up at about the same time as or before Shepard, that way.  Anderson also could have reported that Shepard made it to the beam while he was in the process of being teleported when Shepard couldn't actually hear it, removing any proposed issues with Hackett having any idea that Shepard was in the CItadel later.  It's actually somewhat expected that a piece of technology like the teleporter would be keeping track of what it's teleporting, which could have sent an alert to the Reapers, who then dropped off the Illusive Man to deal with Shepherd and Anderson.  After the Illusive Man was being teleported up, likely with increased mass because of how far indoctrinated he was, the beam was shut down or shielded in a way that made getting to it somewhat impossible, at least temporarily, removing any chance of anyone else joining them.  The Normandy acted as a distraction to pull any Reapers there away, with Joker showing off his piloting skills, opening up the opportunity for Cortez (or another pilot) to evac the now awake again squad members and manage to get them into the Normandy.  The Reapers refused to give up chase of the Normandy and somehow, Joker manages to keep the ship from taking too much damage and draw them towards the Mass relay and away from the main battle, possibly with Hackett's blessing as he drew off some of the Reapers from being involved in any assault on the Crucible.  There's blatant damage signs in the cockpit in the ending movie, so damage was definitely done, somehow, and likely not by the wave that hadn't reached the Normandy yet.  Incidentally, Engineer Adam's quest to get the parts for the engine was speaking of a scenario just like this, and it would be perfectly in keeping with Mass Effect's suicide mission Normandy upgrade usage for it to come into play.

If this, or something similar, is the case, it would actually be a fine thing and one of the huge WTFs would be answered.  As it is?  It's just a big, empty nothing.  Suggestion?  A couple cutscenes or a bit of radio chatter would be enough to give some warning of what's going on, at least.

3.) What is the origin of the the Catalyst? What created
it? Why did it it allow Shepard, a simple organinc, decide the fate of
an entoire galaxy? One would think that the catalyst could have
simply left Shepard to bleed out at the control panel in the Citadel and
continue with the harvsting of organinc life by the Reapers unimpeded.

That would be nice to know, but not quite as necessary to understanding what's going on.  As it is, it's likely that it's rather unprepared for this situation, given that it's supposedly never happened before.  The cycle has been altered or broken in a way that it completely didn't expect, and it's very much uncertain.  It's an old, old AI or highly advanced VI, likely.  There's a lot of potential, though, with the backstory.  Backstory that could potentially help Bioware to make a set of games even more epic in scope.

4.) it
is depicted that Joker and the crew survive the crashlanding of the
Normandy on a jungle planet. How in the world will they get back home
without the Mass relays? Also why is my love interest who had just
prclaimned her love for me  before I left for the final battle not seem
worried or distraught about me?  No emotion is depicted as she exits the
Normandy. Hell some crying would have done the trick. It's as if what
we had was just a  fling and nothing more. This really disturbed me.

There's no reason to believe that they will ever get back home.  There's no reason to believe that they know that or what that wave of energy was.  There's no reason for your love interest to know anything about Shepard's ultimate fate.  There's plenty of reason why the characters would be thinking of the "I just survived a crash landing in an absurdly beautiful spot."

6.) Why
did Shepard not question the catalyst in depth? Why did he simply accept
every word it said? Shepard is o much smarter than that. He knew so
much about the Reapers. He's spoken to them directly. The only human to
do so.

This is a real issue.  Seriously, after spending the entire game spouting off entirely logical arguments about how synthetic life is, in fact, life and how cooperation is reasonable, he just automatically accepts the god-child's logically fallacious argument from authority?  No, just no.  Also, your statement that he's the only human to speak to the Reapers is highly, highly unlikely.  The Illusive Man, for example, is highly likely to have spoken with them before the end.  Either way, I can accept the Catalyst's reasoning as part of a flawed set of base assumptions that is being worked from.  Likely programmed in by or aquired from events surrounding its creators and that hasn't really had a chance to be challenged since.

8.)
And of course most important of all why is there so little varitety
with the endings? They are 95 percent identical with the exception of
the color of the energy unleashed from the crucible being either, red
blue, or green and some minor details. It is soooooooo disapponting and
lazy in part by Bioware. You can't afford that luxury when yu intend to
provide a satisfying conclusion to Shepard's story. Also why am I forced
to die in every  option taken. Where is the freedom of choice to
survive the consequences of my action? If I wish to be paragon and
survive, why can't I? It isn't fair and contradicts with Bioware's
promise of varitey in the conclusion of Shepard's story.

I'm actually completely fine with the similarities in the ending movies.  I see no good reason for a couple of the differences, such as "Why does the control option mean that the Citadel survives, but not the other two?"  Also, Shepard can survive, potentially, in the Destroy ending.  I'm even fine with all endings ending up with the Mass Effect relays being destroyed and the Normandy crash landing, presumably as part of the set up for future games.  If no games will be set in the future... then it becomes much, much less reasonable.

There are other, dramatically bigger issues, though.  For example, THERE IS NO PARAGON OPTION.  The control option is not paragon by the measures set up throughout the series.  The Synthesis option is a magical rewrite of reality that, like Javik, tells me out that the writer(s) didn't understand even basic biology, much less DNA, nor did they take into account how synthetics work.  Nor did they take into account future biological life (much as there's a chance that there simply wouldn't be any, depending) or synthetic life.  In short, it's a very, very, poorly thought out ending, even though it was an interesting concept.  I could rant about more issues with that ending, of course, but I did choose it on my first playthrough as the least bad of the options.  The Destroy the Reapers, I accept as a reasonable Renegade option. 

To clarify the first point, though, the Reapers are a unique "race" of living beings.  According to the god-child, it's been controlling them.  Paragon, as displayed, has been about bringing disparate races together and making everyone's situation better.  While controlling the Reapers could, potentially, save their race and all the others remaining and do things like a quick rebuild of the mass effect network that would benefit all the races... it's doing so at the cost of any semblance of Free Will, which is another big paragon point.  There's more, but I'm just going to stop, for the moment with... Control is a reasonable ending to include, it's just not Paragon.  Frankly, I'd be happy if things were just switched around a bit.  Namely, Control as the green option and an actual paragon option as the paragon option.

The only real Paragon ending that I can think of off the top of my head is more along the lines of Integration, which could only be unlockable if your Shepard shows a real appreciation for life and cooperation.  All life, whether synthetic, organic, or a mixture.  That, and does things like reunite the Geth and Quarians.  He then has the chance to select paragon dialogue with the Catalyst.  With that ending, your Shepard could point out some of the seemingly major flaws in the logic of the Catalyst and get it to "give peace a chance, given that this cycle is NOT the same" so to speak, or at least to A) call off the Reapers until the reality that it's trying to avoid is coming to pass, bring some order to the chaos with the knowledge and wisdom that allowed a set Order to last for so long, unifying order and chaos into a grander "synthesis," or C, among others, where the Reapers are allowed to gain actual free will after being sent to safety so that they can do so in optimal conditions, in partial accordance with the personalities of the races that they were created from.  Either way, they can easily be removed from the picture for an indeterminate amount of time, if such is required for future games/story.  In any or a combination of these (of which there's more possibilities, but I'm tired), the signal required to change the programming could be used to destroy the relays to make it match the other endings, with the reason for why the Normandy's moving unchanged.  Shepard could potentially survive and somewhat less potentially reunite with the love interest.

Other than that... there's the very serious problem of closure.  We honestly don't need to know everything, but I was very unhappily surprised that there wasn't a bit of an epilogue like Neverwinter Nights, Dragon Age, or Jade Empire gave, telling what happened, at least in the short term, to all these characters and races that we dealt with.  The first time, I was actually saddened, expecting an ending note where the hanar and drell took losses to the Reapers that they, as a race, never recovered from, when I "accidentally doomed the hanar homeworld."  I was shocked and angered when I didn't even get that.  Frankly, the simplest way to fix that is, after beating the game and getting the further adventures and DLC message and being set down right before the final sequence, a set of codex entries telling what happened to each of the races and individuals, given what ending you picked and how it played out is unlocked.  What happened to Anderson, for example? If Shepard could survive, he may have, too, but have just passed out, at the time, while a limited amount of medigel was at work.  For example, it would be surprisingly satisfying if the death of Eve, Wreav as the leader of the Krogan, and the genophage being truly cured resulted in the near immediate beginning of a hostile Krogan Empire.  One that might also have text about how, when they meet, are only really limited by a renewed and surprisingly helpful rachni presence, supported by the other races, if you wanted to go a bit further.  The rachni can open up new lines of research in long range communications.  And there's so, so much more that could be said. 

As it is, it can be said that no matter what the ending, everyone and every race you care about is as good as dead, except maybe the few on the Normandy  who could well die on the unknown planet and some remote colonies that haven't been decimated, given 1, which is a really, really sucky way to "save" the races from being harvested.

As you
can see there are so many plot holes and conflicting ideas in this game.
I just hope that Bioware will take me and my fellow fans seriously
enough to drastically change the ending in accordance with our desires.
After all, Casey said that we too were integral  in the shaping of Mass
Effect 3's story. I hope he proves this to us this time around.

I, too, hope for a better ending, otherwise I wouldn't be spending any time here.

Modifié par Aridas, 27 mars 2012 - 09:54 .

[Petrikles]

Ever thought about that this whole organics vs synthetics philosophy in the ending could be interpreted as racism of the worst sort? Just a thought.

[SkaldFish]

After reading yesterday's article in the online Wall Street Journal about the ME3 ending debate, I posted some comments and expanded them into a blog entry here:

True Player Agency

It's relevant to the request for feedback, as it touches on how important player agency is in modern gaming, what "winning" means and why it matters, and how ME3's ending failed to support players as audience, actor, author, and competitor.

[Mr.Majestic]

I just found this.

The ORIGINAL ending which was abandonned (as the guy in the vid says).


The critical concepts are from 0 to 11 minutes of playback, the rest is good wishful thinking.

WHY would anyone abandon the original twist!? Dear God. The original one was BRILLIANT - isn't that what ME1 and ME2 were leading to?

Modifié par Mr.Majestic, 27 mars 2012 - 09:53 .

[Frozen83]

Until recently I thought that minor changes or explanations or some after-game content would be enough to "repair" the ending. But the more I think about it the more I feel a complete rewrite from the moment Shepard colapses after opening the Citadel until the end is necessary. I agree that the first part of the end (limping around) is not so spectacular as the rest of the game, but it is acceptable for me. However, after Shepard opens the Citadel and sits down to have a talk with Anderson, everything falls appart... Completely. And needs a thorough rewrite. I will not go into faulty Catalyst's logic or totally different explanation of the Reapers he provides, Normandy being stranded on some random planet after Joker flees the battle with crew with him and so on... A lot of people already have said all these things and I agree with them.

What buggs me most is Shepards total surrender to the events and crap the Catalyst is telling himv (he was never a fatalistic hero, events have shaped him, but he would never allow to change him in a way he didn't want to). Thought the game he would always say "no, we will do it my way, no matter the odds". Sometimes he woul win, sometimes not. But now, suddendly, on the Citadel, he just goes "yeah, whatever, just point me where should I go". Remember, this is a man who has broken ribs, is hurt, bleeding, has sprained his ankle and is still answering Hackett and trying to do something, help people. This is a men with such a strong resolve and will to live and help. And then this. This surrender to something so illogical, so not in line with him or his character. In my opinion this is the part that is the weakest in the ending and needs to be changed dramatically. A dialogue option "no" to the Cathalyst, not to give in, not to be forced to choose between Catalyst's options but to have a resolve to find his own path. This is Shepard. And this must be changed. M.

[LadyCass]

A quick point, though it's something that seems to divide fans even more - from a storytelling point of view, it could be tightened up a bit.

Kai-Leng fight on Thessia... as my bf put it "He's just there to distract you from the invisible invincible helicopter which is going to screw you over whatever."

I honestly think that you need to either make the whole section a cutscene, ala the Kai-Leng Citadel section, or have the gunship only turn up at the end. Maybe have some backup soldiers to fight while Kai-Leng recharges somewhere we can't get to him (actually, isn't he practically invincible while he does that? Maybe he can just be behind them in that case.) Then just have the gunship zoom in and blow stuff up at the end in a cutscene. That will then make the player feel that Kai-Leng was throwing men away and delaying you intentionally in order to get the gunship there, rather than.. I don't know... getting shot at for his own amusement since he had the gunship with missiles there the whole time? He comes across as a bit of an idiot there. Maybe he wanted to kill Shepard himself, but having the invincible gunship there, considering that taking down those gunships has been done several times before in the series, does definitely infuriate some people. I personally was mostly okay with it, and enjoyed my Shepard being sad after Thessia, but I did agree with the sentiment that having invincible enemies you can't shoot at in a fight who then auto-win at the end was a bit... difficult to swallow. Better to leave that sort of thing to the cutscenes.

It's also a nice reverse echo of the first section where the Normandy comes to save you on Earth.

[Doctor_Jackstraw]

DLC Request incoming.  Integrate backstory choices into dream sequences as missions.

From another thread of mine:  (Just incase this is a better thread to get that request voiced)

Dream 1: N7 Training, a combination of both of your backstory choices effect how this mission plays out.  How did shepard get started, meet anderson, ect.

Dream 2: Sole Survivor/War Hero/Ruthless.  3 different missions based on your carreer service.  Dealing with no-win scenario.

Dream 3: Spacer/Colonist/Earthborn.  3 different missions based on what your backstory is.  Dealing with who your character was before all this and what they've potentially lost as a result of this war.


Or maybe some other order.  The point is that these are the 3 defining moments of your shepard's carreer before serving on the normandy.  The 3 dreams themselves, I think, would have felt more necessary and fallen under less scrutiny if after you reach the kid and white out it cuts away to a unique mission for your shepard.

What this would have accomplished, other than making the dreams themselves more interesting, is a lower level decrease of hatred towards the kid from most gamers.  After the initial weird dream followed by an interesting backstory mission, the player would look forward to reaching the kid in future dreams because it would mean another cool backstory mission (leaving earth to join the alliance, getting abducted by batarians, the skillian blitz, the thresher maw attack, so many cool situations.)  By the third dream the player would better understand who thier shepard is and it would have a greater impact on thier playstyle for the rest of the game.

This is something I would petition Bioware to add to the game.  clarity of character, understanding thier past through these sequences that are already there.  Depending on which order these are dolled out it can have various emotional impacts on different moments in the story.  Not all of them have to be shooter missions, some could just be atmosphere. But yeah, I think this would be amazing and I want Bioware to consider it for game DLC.

keep in mind this suggestion isnt meant to replace the child, but rather to tie gameplay into the dream chases in a way that motivates the player to find the kid in a more self-driven way.  Possible: alter the scene depending on what backstory choice you'd be leading into, or give a prompt.  (Ruthless Shepard might react differently than Sole Survivor or War Hero, for obvious reasons.  Earthborn and Spacer would give two different flavors to what shepard's lost in this war, Colonist would be an entirely different spin because of the situation shepard was placed in during that backstory.)

but yeah, inserting these after the boy burns up but before shepard wakes up would be pretty awesome and maybe put a neat spin on the emotional impact of the dreams.  Following the kid would create motivation because the player would WANT to see what cool backstory mission is next  (associativity patterns).  The order I put up there isnt important, what is important is using all 3 dreams to build the character of shepard based on your character creation choices.  Its who you picked and would give opportunity for greater understanding of who your shepard is.

Modifié par Doctor_Jackstraw, 27 mars 2012 - 10:55 .

[ShinyMetalFIsh]

http://social.biowar...index/9833130/1

[PuppyEurope]

 First of all I'd like to commend Bioware for creating an excellent series.
I thoroughly enjoyed the Mass Effect games.. well up to the ending that is, but
that can be fixed. So here are my issues and possible fix suggestions.

 

ISSUE: Short epilogue

People who played the trilogy easily spent 100 hours on the adventure. The
epilogue is too short and doesn't really show us the fate of the crew we bonded
with. We didn't get to see the results of our work. It's like the Lord of the
Rings fading to black when Frodo throws the ring in the fires of Mt Doom and we
get a note on how he wrote a book.. and then that's it. That just isn't
emotionally satisfying. In other words, the epilogue is simply to short for
emotional awareness. It's over so fast with so many things left open you feel
cheated.

 

FIX: Short epilogue

Show us what became of the crew members. Showing they merely landed is not
enough. Especially a note on the fate of the Love Interest is much appreciated.
If their fates is something you cannot reveal than at least consider them
voicing their plans and intentions even if it turns out different later.. for
this trilogy it will give closure at least.

 

ISSUE: Squadmates alive and on
the Normandy?

This simply doesn't make ANY sense. How and when did they get there? The
last I heard was that they were dead and with the Reapers guarding the entrance
I don't really see how this situation could've come about. I mean if they could
get there then that kind of makes the end sprint foolish.

 

FIX: Squadmates alive and on
the Normandy?

A cut-scene showing the situation changed and that the squadmates are saved
and bandaged. The squadmates should sport these wounds in the epilogue as well,
because they DID get blasted by Harbinger. I would also love to see them
recover from those wounds.

 

ISSUE: Escape of the Normandy

Where was the Normandy? Did it leave the battle after picking up the crew
mates on Earth and went through the Mass Relay to another system? Why did my
team desert the fight? I spent the entire game to get people to show up and my
own trusty crew desert at the last moment?

 

FIX: Escape of the Normady

The Normandy stays in the Sol System.. stranded with the rest who were
fighting. I would prefer if the Mass Relays remained operative, but if it is a
required development they go then the Normandy HAS to remain in the Sol System
in order for the crew to maintain their dignity... or provide a LOGICAL
explanation.

 

ISSUE: Shepard alive?

Killing Shepard is conclusive. No more questions. It works. Though for a
game about choices and different endings I would like the option of one where
Shepard lives.. not just a gasp though, because that again doesn't provide
closure.

 

FIX: Shepard alive?

If he lives then show him reunited with his Love Interest or something.
That is emotionally satisfying. It also increases the replayability of the
game... at least for me and I know I'm not alone in that.

 

ISSUE: Limited endings

For a series that are the epitome of choice and consequence this game has
shockingly few endings. Sure one time if you destroy the reapers people die too
and another time they don't, but overall it just doesn't reach an emotional
difference. A cut-scene of a more devastated Earth, letting the damage sink in
more, or alternatively a celebrating Earth would be more satisfying. This kind
of goes hand-in-hand with the epilogue-duration complaint. It needs to sink in
better rather than a short video and BAM done.

Anyway, the power of the game-medium is that you can have wildly different
endings and this game embraces that more than others. Heck, synthesis is a
completely different situation than control or destroy. So why aren't there
more options for Shepards fate? Why can't there be one that is 'happily ever
after?" We have the doom and gloom options, but one bright one should and
can exist. Again, while this is not a crucial issue unlike the others where the
ending just outright doesn't make ANY sense and doesn't give time to fully
understand what's going on, but I can't help but ask for this. It'd be in line
with the game's promise, it'd complete the game even more, AND it increases
replayability, which is a major win for a game. Though again, this last one is
more of a personal preference. It would be very much appreciated though. Even
if it is DLC.



FIX: Limited endings

This goes hand-in-hand with the short-epilogue issue. Add more cut-scenes
that show clear differences and give a better sense of what the player managed
to do and what impact we had so it can sink in. That'd make the ending of a
long adventure feel less abrupt too.

 

That's what I can think of right now. I think these were the most pressing
issues. Hopefully these comments were useful and thank you for listening to
your fans. Good luck!

[orangesonic]

i just wanted the War assets to matter more than just number...
and in the end maybe you destroy the reapers and go after the ones who build them... i dunno...

have to think a little more

[NoirLegend]

http://social.biowar...5/index/9792751

Here's a good thread about the endings. Read it: It's really worth it.

[ThatDancingTurian]

I was going to try to type up something long and hopefully smart-sounding regarding why the endings don't work for me but there are far better posts here than I could possibly write, so why bother? Let me just summarize: I don't like the ending. I think it is fundamentally flawed and opposed to what these games are about. And I resent the lack of real choices, especially given the promises that were made to us.

I would add though, that there is no such thing as a 'sunshine and rainbows' ending after the events that took place before the ending. The first 90% of the game supplied the 'bitter'. Let the ending provide the 'sweet'.

I would also like to suggest that Joker's miraculous crash landing never happened. There's nothing hopeful about it. You've basically doomed Tali and Garrus to a horrible death because they have nothing to eat, and yet they can look out on the 'beauty' of this random planet as if it's some magical thing (as if no one in Mass Effect has ever seen an uncolonized world before).

Putting that aside, Joker is a pilot who joined Cerberus just so he could fly. His true love is his ship, for heaven's sakes! Why would he look at being stranded on some alien wilderness as though his life was suddenly perfect? This is the man who was jumping for joy over his leather seats. He's all about modern comforts.

Not only does the scene completely fail to present any realistic upside, it just makes no sense!

[MikeVentris]

214 pages of constructive feedbacks and suggestions. Bioware, I hope you can fix the ending.

PS: I could write my feedback, but I'm afraid I'll have to repeat the already written.

[SpartanCommander]

Oh you know a really emotional ending for bitter sweet that would be more fitting with a war is to show the casualties by showing rows after row's of coffins in a funeral progression. Shepard doesn't have to die.

Also I was curious why are their no missions that involve discovering soft spots in the Reapers like a few vulnerable spots. I know their main cannon is a big weakness but aren't their others? Or at least someone mentioning that the discovery that Reapers are vulnerable to weapons fire when they charge their weapons is a major victory because they know where to hit them.

Also I want to ask one thing. Why isn't their any com's from Shepards mother during the war I would think she would say a few things. Or at least make a comment about your love interest.

[Xellith]

I was upset that the mission on Rannoch involved shooting a reaper with a vehicle mounted turret for about 10 seconds. >.>