7052 réponses à ce sujet

[Sgt Reed 24]

Honestly, they just need to go with the Indoctrination Theory... b/c IMO if that is all a hallucination made by Harbinger it (provided there is some DLC to continue after Shepard lives and actually use the crucible) would be a great ending.

EDIT: I mean, battling in your own mind to keep control of it and not give in to the Reapers/!?! That's an epic idea! Just need to continue it after you win or fail. You fail... don't show those hallucination endings of everyone being happy and the reapers leaving and what not. Show Shepard dying and the Reapers winning. After you win against the indoctrination have it continue and let you wipe out the reapers after reawakening in the rubble. 

Modifié par Sgt Reed 24, 31 mars 2012 - 01:34 .

[Chrislo1990]

The indoctrination theory is the only thing that can make sense out of that ridiculous ending. It brings forth more questions than it does answers. That ands it also has no regard for established concepts. remember ME2: Arrival? Yeah I'll let you think about that for a moment...

Dmh33con wrote...

 Mass Effect 3 is one of the best games ever made but i do have my opinion/criticism about the game(like the ending) so here are my suggestions for upcoming DLC Bioware.

1. more/equal dialogue with squadmembers- the thing i notice in ME3 was that Liara and Garrus had the most opprotunitys to talk to while squadmembers like Ash had less dialogue even though i romaned her. I hadn't talk to her since ME1 so i wanted to get to know her again and see how much she changed since ME1 but i couldn't talk to her half the time. Ash ain't the only one Vega and Tali didn't have a lot of dialogue either. so have more in depth conversation with every squadmember not just two.

2.more dialogue option- I was disapointed to see that the dialogue wheel got dumb down to just the paragon and renegade options and that there is no middle/neutral option anymore. so just ad more dialogue options.

3. more places to go to- i was also disapointed to see i can only go to the citadel for free roam i want to see illium and omega again and maybe and new place not just citadel 3.0.  

4.side quest- all the side quest except the N7 mission required little effort to complete i wanted more that just retrieve this by scanning a system until you find the object it okay to have a few quest like that but 90% of it no so more side quest mission like in ME2. also i would like some squadmember based missions like in ME2.

5. improve the journal- the journal was a complete mess no organzation so clean it up.

6. the ending- the ending needs to be change so here a sublist of things that need to change about the ending.

• get rid of the synthesis(green)ending- this ending was unnecessary because it nothing like Mass Effect so remove this ending and just have conrol or desroy ending.
• indoctronation theory- just use this to correct yourself so you can revert back to when shepard get hit by Harbenger.
• Harbenger main antagonist- i want harbenger to be more involved because he was so well done in ME2 so i want to see him to "assume direct conrtol" in the story and to have a conversation with him.
• More closure- i want to see what my sheperds choices did to the galaxy.
• variety- endings that ranges from the Reapers winning to a "perfect" ending and every thing in between.
• Shepard able to live- you can still let shepard die but if i get above a certain Effective Military Strength(EMS) i want him to live.

all this is my opinion so every one doesn't have agree with my statment but i really hope bioware reads and considers all of our suggestions.
P.S. Boiware please don't rush we want quality so take your time on making DLC

I agreee with everything you say!!! Me3 certainly feels dumbed down. Again I think this may be becasue Bioware was not targeting loyal,passionate fans at all. They were focusing on the casual player. Those who perhaps would be attacted by fancy shooting and action as opposed to the deep storytelling. What a big mistake!

[Big Deal Online]

Kevlar xD wrote...

You know that there's a problem when all the fans are hoping that the developer will say "loljk, that entire thing was just a dream."

They managed to make an ending that is worse than the worst kind of generic cop-out ending. Almost impressive, when you think about it.

But mainly just depressing.

[NurseMack]

Well, I stated in a fan review topic
that I loved everything about ME3 except the ending. But I'm going to explain
bit further into that.



Landing on Earth, fighting Reapers on the ground, eventually using a Cain on
the Reaper Destroyer, all great. The part were you just have to survive until
the evac shuttle picks you up. Again all great. Having your last conversations
with your squadmates before you leave for the final push, particularly with
Liara, even though she was not my LI on my main character, was very
heartwarming.



Hearing that Harbinger has broken through the fleets and is heading for London
filled me with excitement. After hearing him throughout ME2, I was looking
forward to seeing Harby again. And that charge at the transport beam, getting a
near hit and seeing Harby fly away…I thought minor hiccup at the time,  “I’ll see you again soon Harby.” I thought.

 

Kill some enemies, get up to the
Citadel, and I immediately notice the things around me. I’m in school to become
a game designer, actually working on my own independent title. But back to the
things I noticed the reused art assets. Though I can’t confirm it all, I
recognized Collector Corpse piles from ME2, Shadow Broker engine parts from
ME2, and Citadel skybox from ME1…full of traffic. But I pressed on, willing to
forgive at the time. I conversed with the Illusive Man and Anderson, convinced
the Illusive Man to shoot himself. The scene sitting down with Anderson
afterwards was another heartwarming moment. Hearing him say “You did good son”.

 

Then Shepard gets raised to meet
Starchild. And this is where I start to get worried.. It just didn’t seem
right. A new character presents me with choices that are not the things I would
want my Shepard to do. Then I sat there and set my controller down. Part me,
being into hardcore sci-fi, wanted to do with the Synthesis option. I’ve seen
the merging of organic and machine in many other stories and I thought this is
something to aspire to. I ruled out Control immediately even though it was the
Paragon blue. Throughout the game, each time I talked with the Illusive man I
told him controlling the Reapers was not the way. So I looked towards Destroy.
I thought of my goal throughout the series. It has always been to stop the
Reapers. I thought of Hackett and saying the only way to do this was dead
Reapers. I dismissed Control because I was afraid that Shepard wouldn’t be able
to/or eventually lose control over the Reapers. I decided not to go with
Synthesis because I would be forcing everything in the galaxy to ascend to “hybrids”
as I’ll call them. So I eventually chose to Destroy them because that has been
the ultimate goal, to stop the Reapers, and if

 

After seeing the cutscene, The Normandy
on the run, Shepard breathing, and the Stargazer. I just sat there rethinking
what I did. No matter what ending you pick the Mass Relays are destroyed.
Coupled with the knowledge that a Mass Relay exploding is akin to a supernova.
It felt wrong.  It felt like after 3
incredible games, easily the best Sci-Fi universe of this generation, that all
of it was pointless and a hammer of god was coming down on the universe and
crushing it again and again and again.

 

The ending just killed all my love for
the universe. I tried to play through ME3 with my Femshep, but….I just couldn’t.
I got to Sur’Kresh and I just couldn’t go any further.

[Chrislo1990]

Your post captures the essence of what this fan rage over the endings is all about: The fact that the ending makes absolutely no sense no matter how you try to see it. It ignores established canon. In ME2: Arrival Dr. Amanda Kenson mentions how destroying a mass relay would wipe out an entire system, yet when the mass relays detonate in me3, life still manages to go on?

I haven't found the motivation to even start a second playthrough. I was disappoointed with the endings. They force you to die without any regard to your past decisions, moral inclinations, EMS score, etc.What's the point of having played ME1 and ME2 countless times only to find out you have absolutely no control over your Shepard's fate?

Modifié par Chrislo1990, 31 mars 2012 - 01:38 .

[Sgt Reed 24]

Chrislo1990 wrote...

Your post captures the essence of what this fan rage over the endings is all about: The fact that the ending makes absolutely no sense no matter how you try to see it. It ignores established canon. In ME2: Arrival Dr. Amanda Kenson mentions how destroying a mass relay would wipe out an entire system, yet when the mass relays detonate in me3, life still manages to go on?

I haven't found the motivation to even start a second playthrough. I was disappoointed with the endings. They force you to die without any regard to your past decisions, moral inclinations, EMS score, etc.What's the point of having played ME1 and ME2 countless times only to find out you have absolutely no control over your Shepard's fate?

That's what happens when you make every game stand alone and "the perfect entry point" to the series. None of our choices have ever really mattered. 

You destroy the genophage data or save the data ... you still have the fertile female to make a cure and then whether you actually cure them or sabotage them... it doesn't matter b/c of the ending.

But if they go with the indoctrination theory... and you choose destroy (meaning the other two are shepard's hallucination of what happens and he actually dies) you can continue after you wake up and destroy the reapers... making your choices matter. (somewhat lol)

[IndridColdx]

 Hello Bioware,

When I was playing through the game I felt a certain dissatisfication with the idea of the "Crucible."  I didn't like the idea that Shepard was gathering entire fleets, enourmous armies, and countless special ops units from literally all over the galaxy and organics STILL depended on this crucible weapon to defeat the reapers.  

If the crucible was able to defeat the reapers why not just build it and destroy them, what's the point of gathering armies at all?

And even if you needed the armies to defend the Crucible, wasn't the whole point of Shepard gathering the armies to defeat the reapers DIRECTLY in the first place?  I feel like the introduction of the Crucible really took emphasis off what Shepard was doing.  I don't remember the exact quote, but I remember Javik telling Shepard that in his cycle organics never came together like they did in Shepard's.  When I was at the end of the game I envisioned organics actually being able to defeat the Reapers.  I think it would have been cool if they realized they never actually needed the Crucible, in the end if they all come together, they can ACTUALLY do it.  Defeat the reapers. Organics vs Synthetics, with no special weapon.

Also no need to change the current endings.  Just adding a few more would be nice.  Maybe one or two with Shepard living and being with his LI would be nice.        

Just my 2 cents, thanks for reading ,
-jeb

 

[Amikai the Greyfriar]

I am a long time fan of Bioware.  Played every game you guys made since MDK2, and I've really enjoyed them all.  Without reiterating what many others have said, I'd like to start off by saying that ME3 was an amazing game. I cried at several points in the game, particularly when Mordin and Legion died.  The characters were so palpable and real that I personally felt their loss.  You guys truly are amazing storytellers.

That being said, the excellent precession of the plot only exacerbated the collosal failure of the ending.  It's sad that a 10 / 10 game could drop to an 8 / 10 with such a horrible ending.  As the game stands, I feel that a modified quote of A Tale of Two Cities is appropriate: "It was the best of games, it was the worst of games."  As many others have mentioned, the ending gave no closure to the story.  As an analogy, imagine if in the KOTOR finale, your only ending choice (after a game full of light/darkside choices) was to kill Malak with force lightning or a telekinetic shove.  And the very ending was watching your ship fly away before the Star Forge detonated... and then the credits rolled. No light or darkside ending.  That was the ME3 ending... no choice, no closure, and no explanation (not to mention the plot holes).  It's like the development team embraced the zen philosophy that the journey is the only thing that matters.  Well, it doesn't: no one gets cheered for running 99% of a marathon, just to give up in the last 100 meters before crossing the finish line.

However, even though the ending was terrible and made the whole series feel empty, I'd like to ask that you not change the core of your vision in remaking the ending.  If - upon reflection - you discover that your ending was either rushed or inconsonant with your true vision for the story, then by all means change it.  On the other hand, if this aweful ending was truly the vision that you held for the finale, then please don't compromise it by giving the fans what they're demanding.  Sure, I'd love to see a final confrontation with Harbinger or have the opportunity to convince the Reapers that their entire theory is flawed, assuming you can convince the Geth and Quarians to get along.  I'd also like to see the ramifications of your choices throughout the series come up at the end, even if it's just a bunch of people attending your character's funeral.  But not if that means compromising whatever you were trying (unsuccessfully) to accomplish.  In the end, I'd rather you take the black eye on this than compromise yourselves into creating a perversion of your vision.

Regardless, there is one thing I would strongly hold to. I hate to say it, but Shepard needs to die, period.  A core theme throughout the games was the need for sacrifice, and only by Shepard sacrificing him/herself at the end will it truly bring the story full circle and create closure.  Even if a person makes all the "right" decisions in life, there are some consequences that cannot be avoided.  Allowing Shepard to survive would just feel empty and hollow. So please, let the hero die.

[t3hTwinky]

- Lose the hologram kid
- Get the mood right
- Focus on characters
- Keep it simple

Ripped straight from an excellent YouTube video that explains- much better than I can- what exactly is wrong with the ending.

[Halberd96]

1. Multichoice dialog. Like in Dragon Age 2. It only has to be in certain parts of games.

2. A more defined protagonist (without taking out player agency/choice.) Shepard is just a little generic and boring and he only has the illusion of the player being able to give him a personality.

3. The ending...yeah I know, just number #1456553343434 complaint about the ending, I know its really non-constructive. But still...whatever it was that caused the ending to be disappointing should be figured out and made sure it doesn't happen again.

[Ikalise]

 Just going to add my two cents...

I think the game was great up until the point when Harbinger lands on Earth. This is where I got a little confused with things.

I would like to see:

- A final boss fight (if it is with The Illusive Man or Harbinger). I know it may seem too video game like, but I thats what I kinda would like to see.
- Possibility to see a happy ending with my Love Interest or if there was no LI; maybe go chill out with Garrus on a beach somewhere.
- Have a Epilogue showing what happened to all the races and characters that Shepard encoutered throughout the trilogy.
- I did not like the idea of the mass relays and Citadel being destroyed (the whole galactic fleet is now stuck at Earth with now quick way to return to their homeworlds)
- I was very annoyed that my Shepard had to destroy the Geth along with the Reapers. The Catalyst saying that peace between synethetic and organics is not possible, was a slap to the face of what Shepard accomplished with the peace between the Quarians and Geth. On that point, the theme of creators vs created, not very Mass Effect like. I liked the Dark Energy idea, it really showed how the Reapers were really convinced what they are doing is was to save the galaxy from itself.
- I wanted to see more investigative options about the Reapers. Where are they from, who built them, their history, and why were they created.
- I liked one other community member's idea about including more scenes on the final battle. You get to see quarians being saved by the geth fleet, rachni attacking a reaper after saving the Destiny Ascension, or salarian STG under assault by reaper forces only to be assisted by Krogan forces. Also with characters helping in the final battle, ex: Tali leading Geth Primes into battle, Wrex and Garrus fighting side by side, Liara saving Ashley, or you might see Aria leading the Blue Sun, Vorcha, and Eclipse into battle against the Reapers. I think that is very good, because it would show former adversaries have put their differences aside and are now allied in war, all because of Shepard.
- Change Tali's face, no google image... nuff said

I hope this gives some constructive info for my fellow Albertans developers... 

[Bellerophron]

Multiplayer feedback:

Positives
I like the characters available and the customization options
Weapon choices
Very fun

Changes:
I would like a store front for the multiplayer where I can choose what to buy. This random set up is very frustrating.
More modes of play for multiplayer
More multiplayer maps


Single player feedback:

Positives:
Gameplay is excellent.
Graphics are great
Dialouge 
Tuchanka missions
Rannoch Mission
Cinematics 
Pacing of game and missions

Changes:
Make the normandy one building, the constant loading between decks seems silly and breaks up gameplay
No more blue wall between the bridge and the war room area
More N7 missions- Galaxy feels really small in this game without all the planets and side missions compared to the first 2 games (I know this is part of the tension in creating a FPS/RPG hybrid but more exploration would be nice)
Be able to get the best ending without multiplayer.
I want to be able to use my war assets for something, anything...
Needs to be a bigger reward/punishment for major decisions like saving the Rachni and Collector Base. 100 pts is almost insignificant for huge choices. Same applies to other major decisions from the series. 
Renegade Shepard should be able to enslave the Geth to the Quarians
More Squadmates both new and returning (Wrex, Mordin, Miranda, Jack, Kirrahe if they are alive I want to use them. Not have them reduced to points in the war asset system)
Galaxy scanning is better then planet scanning but only by a bit.
Lots of endings, epilouges

DLC wish list

Retaking Omega
Vehicle combat (Makos, Hammerheads, Asari gunships, Krogan Tanks, Elcor Mounts)
More in depth look at the batarians
A play through where Shepard stays with Cereberus ( Akin to the dark spawn playthrough on dragon age)

[Hdmetz]

I think it'd be nice to see a lot more options in the end. Have the time, effort and choices we made actually mean something. The game was great up until you get hit by Harbinger's laser. I think it'd be alright to roll with the Indoctrination theory, because from what I've seen it does make some sense. I'd like to see an available happy ending. Not everything has to dark and grim. But to be balanced there should be an actual variety of endings ranging from the happy to terrible. Make the happy ending hard to get. Make us put time and effort into it so that those who are ok with a darker ending can still have it. Mass Effect 2 did a good job of this. If you put the time in and made the right choices everyone lived and you destroy the Collectors. It's really about the option being there if we want to work for it. It's not going to ruin anything. Yes Shep has had to make tough decisions, but he's been through a lot him/herself. Hell, even died once. I just want to see the time I've put into the series resolve in something good. With the current ending I seriously wonder what I accomplished. The reapers may be gone, but the mass relays are destroyed sooo....yeah. Personally I believe the Indoc theory may have something. Why put in a shot of Shep laying in the rubble of London and taking a sudden breath? Please continue from there and give everyone a chance at getting the ending that suits their character.

[superfuzznpd]

The advertising campaign alone is misleading. "Take Earth Back". Why? So we can blow it to smithereens when the only "choices" we are given all cause the relays to go Nova? The advertising campaign makes you believe you will have the opportunity to be successful in defeating the Reapers and saving Earth, when in fact your only choices all lead to the destruction of Earth.

There are 2 major problems with going for the "artsy ending" that Bioware tried. If you haven't tied that ending into the rest of the story properly to make it logical and meaningful, which Bioware did not, then it is just confusing and disheartening and the effort at breaking the mold is wasted.

Additionally, Bioware has a very large fan base who have invested a tremendous amount of time and money into the series. Bioware needs to give them fulfillment, and make them feel like the entire experience was worthwhile. Destroying everything that their fan base has come to love over the course of the trilogy of games for the sake of an artsy ending, is product suicide. Fitting I guess since that is what they made Shepard choose. Galactic suicide so a handful of people could start from scratch on some random planet.

Modifié par superfuzznpd, 31 mars 2012 - 04:01 .

[Nightdragon8]

Text wall read at your own risk.

Ill go by arc.

the begining, while I sort of understand why they didn't allow us to have control of the court considering I think it would have been a Kangaroo court anyway, then have a transition to 6 months later. I think do think that those of us who had Anderson as councilor for humanity, needed an explantion as to why he stepped down. It would have taken I think 3-5 lines of Dialoge, Shep asking "what happened to being councilor" Anderson: "They wheren't moving anywhere on it and I felt I could do more good back in the miltary" Something along those lines. At least it explained in-game what happened.

So the kid... I understand why you did it, but as stated those of Renagade kinda forced something that may not have been bothering Shep.

Mars, the VSquestioning your every move. I mean Hackett trusted you, Anderson Trusted you, both Admirls Why doesn't a LC trust you? I mean I understand being susious but I think it was alittle over the top. Cause even with the first playthought, I wanted to say. "Fine dont trust me just shoot me now, or shut up." I mean it too Vega to say "How could he, he has been on lockdown for 6 months" When the VS should have already known that.

With Ash with a male/romance shep i accutly do sort of understand it, that she still isn't sure that it really is Shep, but that it at lesat sounds more of an emotional issue rather than a mental issue.

Turian/Korgan arc. I think its well done, most of the letting you either betraying the Krogan or not, Also Mordan's death, I think was wonderfully done. One of the truly great scenes, it makes the "Bittersweet" list... and the "Mother of all Tharsher Maws" taking down the Reaper, "Awesome" Just the idea that something so advanced being taken down by something that I think we can all agree represents the most primal of nature was great. Also find it kind of funny that the Primarch and Wrex had to be the ones to calm Shep down after the Bomb mission.

Citidal arc. Thanes death while tragic was good as well. (sorry Femshep's) But I will agree that the ones who romanced him should have gotten a better scenes. Also would have like to hear the motive behind Uldina doing what he did (shot him the moment was allowed to) but I foud it kinda funny the fact that I was just start liking the fact that he was seeing the council for what it was, he goes ahead and joins Cerberus to try to take over the council... (and really it did seem kind of a strange move for Cerberus anyway.

It could have been one of those moves to get the council to move on the Crucible considering there wasn't going to be a way for the Humans to do it on there own.

Then even after all that talk in the Hospital To have VS go back to mistrusting you again. Now Thanes death, Honestly I liked the fact that he did the prayer for Shep and not himself. One of those last acts as a friend. It made the "Bittersweet" list as well.

Then the Geth arc. Good going, alot of choices with alot of unknowns. Constaly had me thinking... Am I doing the right thing.... making the correct choice... very touching with Tali and her homeworld, Plus learning what that phrase meant. Combat inside the Dread was fun too, not only did you have to think about the bad guys but also the environment. Also learning alittle bit about Geth/Quarians relationship, it wasn't all just We hate the geth lets kill them all. Alot of them thought it was fine and could seek peace with them.

After the sacrifice of Legion, another one on the "Bittersweet list"

We come to the last arc. With Sanctuary and the base. Honestly with Sanctuary it honestly reminded me about all the stuff the ****'s did. If that's what you where going for then you nailed it. Learning EDI past was great to, and those of us who played ME1 was a nice throwback to that. And Miranda's search for her sister was a nice run around too. Killing Kai Leng one of the greatest interrupts in the game.

Now the big thing the ending, everything was good up to the point you inter the Citidal (granted the plot hole of the citidel being at earth and under reaper control is sort of a big... why didn't they then just shut down the relays and began the task of destorying everything as they did with the Prothans. Becaus unless they Retconed what Vigil said, they shut down all the relays thus Isolating the worlds and just took there over as they saw fit.

The whole Star Child and the reason for killing advanced organic life... I mean really... this was the whole "You wouldn't understand the reason" stuff.... Its a good thing they used a kid, because it sounds like something child would think up. "I will stop people/syntics from killing eachother by making a powerful syntitic/orgainc hybrid to kill organic life to stop them from killing eachother.... " I'm sorry I heard some "Troll Logic" before but that's in the top 5 for sure. The others on the list are "I'm going to kill you because I love you" really that is pretty much what we got here. "I love organic life so much that I will kill it to save it...." yea...but the way AI went from sentiant life able to adapt to logic and reason, and thus be able to change its mind, to more like computer program stuck in what it can or can not do. It really makes it as if EDI and the Geth where the First true AI that they learned how to compromise and learn to live with Organics. Which made the Quarians and Geth peaceful resolve such a huge victory. And if anything should have flew in the face of the star childs programing and logic. Which should have been able to pull up another option to have teh Reapers leave into darkspace and pretty much never bother the Galaxy again. OR let them be the Sentinels of peace. And this could have been done without Shep taking over star kids place. Because if it was a AI then it should have been able to do that itself. Insted it acted more like a VI with no will of its own. Controlling what was played out to be a Organic AI.

Also the destroy ending really didn't seem like a solution to anything... unless it changed the fabric of the physics in the universe. Because the natural facts of Quantum computing will always be the same, and so if AI require a quantum computer then that will always be a possibility, and it will always be a high possibility. Of occurring.

Then the small cutscenes of the wave going out. Plus the whole question of "are all the relays destroyed now?

Then we have Joker running sequence... I was ok with it, seemed kind of silly I mean how did he know? And if the wave travels faster than light... how was he able to escape in the first place? Maybe he found that Crystal Ball? Then we have squadmates walking off the Normandy.... I think thats what really killed it... I mean I had Javik on the ground during the final push.... and he walks out on the Normandy?? ummm.... what? Or even if Liara, Ash/Kadian whoever. on the ship as well?? I mean what? seriously?? Liara would never had ran like that, Javik would have killed Joker for even thinking about it, Ash would never had done that. It just made them so out of character Which is why I think everyone is going with the Indocertation theory. Also the fact that if Garus and tali where on board, there was at least a 50% chance that they would starve to death, or that the Normandy crew would starve to death.

Now the Green ending... honestly when I first heard it, I was thinking it was going to send out a pulse kill everyone and pretty much be a primordial soup sort of start over. But where Syntic life and Organic life would be one in the same (that was my reason for not picking it) but when I saw it it was like... ummm so this dark energy changed all of life, and syntics to have DNA so they can now reproduce.... ummm what? Space Magic is the term for that one.

Now the control ending, what gets me is after the pulse and the Reapers start lifting off, everyone is cheering like they are retreating and what not... honestly I would think there first reaction would be fear/worry because my first thoughts would be.... what are they doing now??

Modifié par Nightdragon8, 31 mars 2012 - 04:04 .

[CaptainCalico]

 For the sake of talking about something besides the ending.......

I get the coolness factor of having the online multiplayer affect the main game - but I'm not an online player, at least not for combat games. Didn't like it with Halo, don't like it with ME3. That is OK, many gamers do like it, I don't begrudge them that.  

On the other hand, I like strategy games, and so do a lot of gamers. So how about adding the option to play a strategy type mini-game so that you can raise Galactic Readiness level by effectively deploying your War Assetts?  Bioware appears to be trying to build a reputation of catering to many different types of gamers (I speak as somone who will be forever gratefull for the Narrative difficulty setting ), so why not bring in many different styles of play?

Just a thought.

[Generalputra]

Bioware.. I hope u explain more on what happen to the ppl living inside the citadel when its starts to move to earth.. what did bailey n csec do to i.e defend or evac? Maybe could have a dlc to play as bailey? Like in me2 we get to play as joker..

[Aridas]

Chrislo1990 wrote...

The indoctrination theory is the only thing that can make sense out of that ridiculous ending. It brings forth more questions than it does answers. That ands it also has no regard for established concepts. remember ME2: Arrival? Yeah I'll let you think about that for a moment...

Pretty sure that the destruction of the mass relays has been beaten to death, so... it's not like you need to "make us think about that for a moment."  Since it's such an unforgivable hole, though, I'm sure that it will continue to be beaten, though.  As for the Indoctrination Theory... I hate hallucination conspiracy theories.  I could make a better one, for that matter, saying that it's actually Shepard waking up from after the original Normandy was shot down, and it would "explain" so many other things that actually don't really make sense, too.  There are better/reasonable explanations for *everything* the Indoctrination Theory (pick any version of it) tries to use for evidence, much as I can certainly understand the allure of it.

Still, while I'm here... I thought I'd point something out.  People didn't get hooked on the Mass Effect games because of the Reapers.  Not many of them, especially the ones that played through all three games, were fighting to beat the Reapers.

They were playing in large part, because they were awesome games that let you feel like your actions mattered and were filled with characters that they grew to care about.  Most especially, Paragon and Renegade paths, where the majority of the uses of such all seemed to be leading up to... exactly what Bioware *promised.*  Very different endings that fit the path that you took.  Not... what we got.  For 2.9 games, Shepard was, in general, making choices that were setting the stage for... 1) Paragon - a unified and diverse galaxy, where life, in all its forms, is cherished, though dealt with on individual merits.  To note, as a person who played paragon, I couldn't help but compare the Reapers to the Rachni, at the end, given the "they're being controlled" explanation, and all the regrets spoken at killing an entire race.  In short, so much to offer to a unified diversity, but are being forced to make war... somewhat nonsensically, when their actual interests are taken into account.  Alternately, 2) Renegade - Shepard ruthlessly puts humanity in the position of "top dog," setting the stage for a Human Empire or galaxy simply dominated by humanity.

The final large choices in the first two games followed these paths, no less, and they were excellent.  The final choice in the third game... didn't.  Definitely not with the explanation required to explain why the choices were what they were, much as any explanation would have been... tenuous, at best, given the choices.

1 - Control - Represented as Paragon.  This comes out of nowhere, because Paragon has been arguing AGAINST Control, the entire game.  Not to mention failing to address the enslavement of an entire "race."  Sure, it can be explained in a couple ways, reasonably.  The situation's changed and the Reapers are a lot like the Rachni, and it would be a great loss to annihlate them.  The Reapers will help rebuild the Relays, restoring galactic civilation quickly.  The Reapers can be used to prevent synthetics from destroying all organic life in ways that are actually more logical than the one that they're using.  The Reapers can help the galaxy's civilizations grow to be much more advanced, very quickly... or just humanity (which would be one of the renegade desires).  All these are "coulds," though.  There's no elaboration on how Shepard will control them.  There's not even a mention of any of this, which keeps Control, in game, squarely in the Renegade camp, where it's been for the entirety of all three games, until now. 

To note, the Citadel doesn't appear to be destroyed in this ending, which would make it perfectly feasible for a high CDF to still be managing to hold back Reaper ground forces that only JUST took control of the Citadel, potentially, and affect the number of people on the Citadel that could survive.  Much like the Normandy's crew in the second game.  The Citadel magically having everyone slaughtered on it, despite that you can do a lot of things to make it better defended, no matter what one does is... pointless, senseless, and a complete departure from the successes of the previous game.

2. Destroy - Represented as Renegade.  This choice has been represented as Paragon for the entirety of the games until now.  To suddenly say that it's renegade with no real explanation, nor why the geth will die, but EDI won't (judging from the crashed Normandy, not the Catalyst).... is another huge mistake.  Certainly, it can be considered Renegade, largely for roughly the opposite of all the things that I listed for why Control could be argued to be Paragon.

Oh, and the Citadel explodes, unlike the Control ending, for no known vaild reason.  What?

3. Synthesis - Called the best ending, repeatedly, by Bioware, as I recall.  Sure, it might be the best ending in Deus Ex, but it definitely isn't here.  It 1) breaks genre, given implantation, 2) makes very little sense in the context of the Mass Effect Universe, and 3) doesn't actually resolve anything, at all. 

Seriously, a green wave that magically rewrites reality, not remotely following the rules presented so far for what works or doesn't work in the Mass Effect Universe, to, presumably, exploit a loophole in the Reaper's orders is needlessly complex, undermines the Universe itself, solves nothing, and makes the ending scream "rip-off of Deus Ex."

Very frankly, had this third option been "Freeing the Reapers from the Catalyst's Control, allowing them to make their own choices (like the first game implied that they had), with reasonable logic" it could have worked just fine, and all kinds of interesting things could happen, leaving the Mass Effect Universe wide open and definitely still subject to the results of all our choices up to then.  As it is, no.  Just no.

As for the Relays... destroying them, besides the massive plot hole that went unaddressed by destroying them, throws a massive wrench in the ending that the players played for, whether it was a peaceful galactic society, or a galaxy dominated by humans.  If the developers didn't expect the outcry, anger, and disappointment of the fans that had the endings that they were *promised* and led to believe that they would get thoughout *all three games* snatched away from them at the very end, with absolutely no warning... frankly, they really weren't thinking through this, very well.


We, the players, were told that our choices would matter, and we eagerly awaited the chance to see the results of our actions.  Instead, we were somewhat bewildered by an ending that was, apparently, made to stoke speculation, not to actually provide an ending that actually worked for the stories that were played.

Bioware, the fans are speaking.  Thank you for at least pretending to listen, when the ways that a game that was produced by your company failed are enumerated.  It's always unfortunate, though, when the ways that a product abyssmally failed threaten to overshadow the amazing most of the rest of it.

[sasusori]

ok, i will get to the endings on a different much longer post, but i think there is a minor change that i would like to see, ive only done this with ashley, but i assume its the same with kaiden, after they return to the normandy i think there should be an option where shepard tells ash/kai that though they are one of best assets in the galaxy but he (shepard) cant use anyone that doesnt trust him, ash/kai will respond that they do trust shepard but were just following there instincts, this will cause a Charm/Intmidate where shepard essentially says, he needs them to trust his instincts more than there own, they will either say they can or no they cant do that based on renagade/paragon level, if it fails they will join Hacket rather then shepard, i imagine the conversation going like this, but obviously you guys might come up with something better

Charm: everyone on this ship has good intincts Ash/Kai everyone on this ship is the best at what they do thats why there here, but when instincts come in to play, mine have to supercede yours, there cant be two commanders of one ship, if you look me in the eye and tell me you can do that then welcome aboard, because i can sure use you

Intimidate: Do you think this is a Democracy, everyone on this ship is the best at what they do, but i need my team to trust that i know whats best, Im the only commander on this ship, i need you to trust that im doing whats best for everyone, even if you have crosshairs pointed at the council i need to be able to trust that you wont hesitate if i give the order, because otherwise i cant use you

Modifié par sasusori, 31 mars 2012 - 06:33 .

[Tianar01]

 Most of the game was well done and made sense with the story line.  It made sense that we'd be building up fleets and assets to help retake Earth and the galaxy.  However, the ending did not really make proper use of all the work we put in during the game.
More of the assets we acquired during the course of the game should have been present during the final battle visually.
Ship to ship fighting would have been a great addition to the game if done right, allowing piloting of a  fighter craft or shuttle, fighting our way down to an objective.
The final choice was not clearly reasoned and didn't solidly connect with the rest of the game.  Why did Shepard have to sacrifice himself/herself to fire the catalyst?  The boy came out of nowhere to tell us we had to kill ourselves to get rid of the reapers when there wasn't really any good reason to.  
The catalyst could easily have been setup to work without needing Shepard's sacrifice, Shepard has sacrificed enough!

The view from inside the Citadel was great!  
       But blowing up all the Mass Relays when the catalyst was triggered stank.  Effectifively crippling galactic civilization pretty much ends the Mass Effect universe unless you introduce another form of FTL travel that allows civilization to cross the galaxy reasonably fast.

[JShepppp]

 Please address these plot holes. Then I will be satisfied. (edited for right link)

Modifié par JShepppp, 31 mars 2012 - 06:19 .

[maddog48]

 I don't care about changes, alternatives, or simple deletion (though that would be nice) of Shep's final three choices (Control, Destroy, or Synthesize).  All I want is an epilogue of what happens to Shep's Allies, Teammates, and the ME Galaxy in general.  It could even be done like in Dragon Age: Origins where it is simple text of what happens to people and places. It doesn't have to be DLC, a movie/cutscene, just a simple picture and text like:

For Example - DA: Origins Epilogue for Morrigan:
http://images4.wikia...39/Morrigan.png


What happens to Shep LI if Shep dies or lives?  Which Homeworld's rebuild or fall completely?  Do any of the Teammates try to rebuild or simply die?  How does Earth deal w/ rebuild and the galaxy's entire Fleet's need for resources and housing?  Does the council give earth its seat back?  How long did it take the Reaper's to shake off Shep's control before they came back?  Do EDI and Joker have a kid thanks to Synthesizing?

All this can be solved by simply giving the game and Epilogue-DA: O Style moments before role credits, and the Stargazer-kid scene.  I want it clear that I'm not asking for change, just simply more info on what happens after Shep makes the final choice.  If Shep dies in all three conclusions, fine, but I still want to see HOW in the WAY Shep dies and the CHOICES MADE ALONG THE WAY affects the ME Galaxy.

P.S. I know this has been said by others w/ as many variations as ME 3 should have had in it's epilogue, but I wanted to show MY version of how ME 3 should end since the ME franchise was all about gamer choice - affect, and since I can't see the affects of my Shepard's ME 3 final choices, I'll just have to keep the spirit alive here on the forums.

Modifié par maddog48, 31 mars 2012 - 07:03 .

[Coconut_Monkey]

Bioware:
 
Ok after having played through a few times I think I understand what my problem is with the ending:
 
Note: no matter how hard I try - hitting every paragon and reputation item possible - I cannot get the final Paragon/Renegade TIM sequence.
 
Of the endings the one that makes the most sense for the Paragon Shepard is "control the reapers".
1. Destroying the Geth is not palatable - you just saved them "not an option, not an option"
2. Synthesis - Again this screws the Geth - they have only just begun to live now you gut them and create some bizzaro hybrid
 
That being said "control the reapers" should not result in a reaper chum ending for Shepard.
 
Should you choose not to change this then I will simply write my own ending to the series and walk away still completely satisfied I spent my money well; however I will have to assume you will do this again - A) Get me emotionally invested rip the guts out of the emotional investment - sorry but I am not a masochist -. Therefore if that is the case I will not purchase any further episodes of the series (example: ME 4,5,6).
 
You face some of the same issues that Steve Meretzky ran into with StationFal when he killed off the Floyd robotl (yes I have been playing games that long!) see http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Planetfall  :...
 
 "...Floyd's death has been described as directly evoking the player's emotions because the story and gameplay are aligned. The death of Floyd has been described as changing the game to an "evocative theatrical experience" after which "the player feels lonely and bereaved."
 
In video game art the evocation of emotions are a powerful tool, great care should be taken not to overuse them.

The same issue applies to Paragon Shepard. In terms of Shepard I want him to retire to some quiet corner of the Galaxy with the LI since I have an invested emotional connection to the paragon character. Story wise there is no reason why this could not have be done and still have a new protagonist in the future (it is jarring and a bit bizarre).
 
For my Renegade it doesn't really matter since he just takes what he wants when he wants it (though I did really want him to be Emperor Shepard, ruler of all know space but this was no big deal that I did not get it).
 
Note: In some ways I do like the destruction of the Mass Relays: it prevents or limits intergalactic war for the foreseeable future until they can be "re-established". But it does screw over all of the wonderful Alien races who volunteered to stop the reapers now in orbit around Earth especially the Quarins: only 120,000 light years back to Rannoch! [If they travel as fast as a Tachyon perhaps they can get there before they even start on the journey back] I suppose that the Turians and Quarians could devour each other on the way back if the "live ships" run out of food assuming any survived the battle.
 
The last thing I want to mention is Flight LT. Gilligan crashing on his "island" - a fate worse than death. I assume that: Garrus will be the "Skipper", Barla Von will be the millionaire with the Asari Consort as his wife. Allers will be "the movie star" Liara will be the "Professor" and Tali will be "Mary Ann".


 

[Hexley UK]

Coconut_Monkey wrote...

Bioware:
 
Ok after having played through a few times I think I understand what my problem is with the ending:
 
Note: no matter how hard I try - hitting every paragon and reputation item possible - I cannot get the final Paragon/Renegade TIM sequence.
 
Of the endings the one that makes the most sense for the Paragon Shepard is "control the reapers".
1. Destroying the Geth is not palatable - you just saved them "not an option, not an option"
2. Synthesis - Again this screws the Geth - they have only just begun to live now you gut them and create some bizzaro hybrid
 
That being said "control the reapers" should not result in a reaper chum ending for Shepard.
 
Should you choose not to change this then I will simply write my own ending to the series and walk away still completely satisfied I spent my money well; however I will have to assume you will do this again - A) Get me emotionally invested rip the guts out of the emotional investment - sorry but I am not a masochist -. Therefore if that is the case I will not purchase any further episodes of the series (example: ME 4,5,6).
 
You face some of the same issues that Steve Meretzky ran into with StationFal when he killed off the Floyd robotl (yes I have been playing games that long!) see http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Planetfall  :...
 
 "...Floyd's death has been described as directly evoking the player's emotions because the story and gameplay are aligned. The death of Floyd has been described as changing the game to an "evocative theatrical experience" after which "the player feels lonely and bereaved."
 
In video game art the evocation of emotions are a powerful tool, great care should be taken not to overuse them.

The same issue applies to Paragon Shepard. In terms of Shepard I want him to retire to some quiet corner of the Galaxy with the LI since I have an invested emotional connection to the paragon character. Story wise there is no reason why this could not have be done and still have a new protagonist in the future (it is jarring and a bit bizarre).
 
For my Renegade it doesn't really matter since he just takes what he wants when he wants it (though I did really want him to be Emperor Shepard, ruler of all know space but this was no big deal that I did not get it).
 
Note: In some ways I do like the destruction of the Mass Relays: it prevents or limits intergalactic war for the foreseeable future until they can be "re-established". But it does screw over all of the wonderful Alien races who volunteered to stop the reapers now in orbit around Earth especially the Quarins: only 120,000 light years back to Rannoch! [If they travel as fast as a Tachyon perhaps they can get there before they even start on the journey back] I suppose that the Turians and Quarians could devour each other on the way back if the "live ships" run out of food assuming any survived the battle.
 
The last thing I want to mention is Flight LT. Gilligan crashing on his "island" - a fate worse than death. I assume that: Garrus will be the "Skipper", Barla Von will be the millionaire with the Asari Consort as his wife. Allers will be "the movie star" Liara will be the "Professor" and Tali will be "Mary Ann".


 

Did you save or destroy the collector base? Maybe that has something to do with it.

[Generalputra]

I'm also interested to know what happened to Aria dia she made it before the citadel moves to earth or died in there?..