If it hasn't been mentioned already. The quest system needs to be patched. Probably nothing they can do for console users but perhaps they can fix it for the PC group. I have no idea why they abandoned the system used in ME2 and went with the one in ME3.
As probably been mentioned already the endings if I had the power to get them changed I would change those. The writing on the endings just seems to be of lower quality of the rest of the game to me. I don't even know how the Green ending is suppose to work. How do you change software based Geth and EDI into organics? Do Geth in Quarian enviromental suits become living jumpsuits??
I think it would have been better instead of getting the strange ghost kid from earth, if there was a crucible VI (perhaps the prothean one from Thessia) that informs Shepard that He/She is actually the catalyst. That only one that could bring together the resources to complete the crucible and make it this far could be that one with the will and whatnot to carry out the will of the crucible. Shepard then could have been directed to some kind of pod (similar to the Geth thing in earlier mission). From there Shepard would enter the Reaper hive mind and then perhaps converse with Harbinger.
The discussion could result into Control or Destroy. Control, Shepard believes that even the Reapers are entitled to existance (and joins with them to up lift them similar to what Legion did with the geth). They withdraw and Shepard's phyiscal body dies as his mind has merged with the Reapers.
With the Destroy option, Shepard could convince that the Reapers they are no longer needed (perhaps even somekind of boss battle as in the "cyberspace" Harbinger could be a more manageable enemy) or It could just be that this option just utilizes the crucible to destroy the Reaper code and the reapers. This could also lead to Shepards phyiscal death as then the crucible is destroyed as well, that way Bioware could still have the "bittersweet" hero dies cliche ending as the only option.
Anyways doesn't really matter. The game is finished. I don't see them making any changes. Not really seeing how they will continue the franchise as well. The Green ending is vastly different from the Blue and Red because in the Green ending; all plants, animals and persons share the same DNA with software based AIs (once again don't know how AIs gain DNA).
What makes the ending a downer for me as it just seems like there will be no more Mass Effect games and it was one of my favorite video game series. Oh well all good things must come to an end, even if it is bitter-sweet and lackluster.
ME3 Suggested Changes Feedback Thread - Spoilers Allowed
Débuté par
RaenImrahl
, mars 17 2012 03:00
Retour en haut
#6727
Posté 29 avril 2012 - 10:12
Galorphar
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- Members
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BalianOfIbelin and Bonedealer's ideas sound better than our current endings. And as for the "Cyberspace" Harbinger... it be ten times cooler if he took the form of Shepard. So Shepard fights himself 
#6728
Posté 30 avril 2012 - 01:31
Galorphar
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- Members
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But yes I suppose I shall add my input too to this.
What I thought of the game of Mass effect 3 and its suggestive changes. I'll go through the entire game and pretty much say what to change and what not to. All of this being my opinion and all and I shall go through this without "Y U SUX ENDINS?!" or "I NEVER PLAY UR GAMES AGAIN!" rage that erupted. We're all adults here (I hope) and I shall talk to you as such and with respect. For I do not forget that you supplied me with my favourite games.
The Story opening was full of emotion and art. It was downright beautiful and almost tear-jerking. The reapers coming and pretty much leveling Vancouver (however you spell it), downright amazing. One of the best things I have seen, and as the story progressed on, it just got better and better. One thing that did get my attention however was that for me, maybe to other people I don't know but to me it felt as if the use of the dialog wheel and it's choices was much lesser than the previous games. It felt to me that my Shepard that I crafted and made throught my previous gaming was breaking free from my controll just a little bit. He seemed to be auto dialoging just a bit more than me choosing what he wants to say. It was a slight issue I had but not a big issue to raise hell about.
I enjoyed traveling back and forth to the Citadel after each mission and chatting with the crew (despite how long it is, I was also very happy that you made shepard no longer get tired after sprinting), The side quests from the citadel however I had mixed feelings about. I was happy they were there and that they awarded me with war assets when I completed them. But their system I wouldn't say helpful. In some cases it tells me which galaxey to scan, but in other cases it was pretty much for example "This unit needs a morale boost, get copies of Fornex" and that's it (I know my example sucks). Not telling me which system to fly to, what planet to find it on. So I ended up not doing it cause I couldn't find them. I know I could have easily gone on the internet and find out where, but I don't want to ruin my gaming experience by cheating my way through. The system of side quests you had in the last game were much better organized and detail than in this one. I look at my journal and my questlog looks like textrape on the screen due to having listened to many conversations in the citedal and automatically accepting their sidequests. Marking them as priority/Citadel/whatever system they are set in, just looked quite messy on the screen and not organized. If there is a way in a patch to make this better reading in organizing and less wall of text (which is ironic cause this post will no doubt be walls of text) then that would be great and I would take longer in playing the game which I thoroughly enjoyed. (I'm sure I've spelt that wrong.)
Then comes the Krogen Genophage curing. Although some may have found it predictable that this would have a huge roll to play in the recruiting of Krogen, I wanted it kept the same. I loved how we got to see what a Krogen female looks like, I also loved that I got to see Mordin and Wrex again. I enjoyed all of the levels, including the re introduction of the Rachni and it's queen returning. And who can forget Grunt, the perfect Krogen and proven when he 'Leeroy Jenkins' himself into the Rachni to hold them off (yes, WoW nerd). Which brings me to another thing that dissapointed me. The fact that you couldn't have either Wrex or Grunt in your squad. Wrex is understandable, being the leader of the Krogen and leading them against the reapers. But Grunt, he was meant to be the last of his team of Krogen when escaping (if you get him loyal) So why couldn't he/Dagg be part of your crew? Yes we all know that James Vega is hugely buff but...he's not a Krogen, and that's what was missing in my squad. I really would have liked a Krogen (despite how ever powered they are, especialy in multiplayer). Apart from that, Mumma Thresher Maw VS Small Reaper = GENIUS and EPIC. I had three Brutes trying to get me and I was ready to fight to kill them. Then when that reaper almost stepped on me I pretty much went "Screw that! I'm too small!" And ran like hell to call for Mumma Thresher Maw. It was great and Mordin's sacrifice was amazingly done, especially when he was muttering and singing the very model of a scientist Salarian. Beautiful. Great conclusion to the character and the Genophage story. I will even run some sort of test on sea shells.
Before I continue I hope you take to heart what I've just said then. I will run tests on sea shells! Because of you! Bioware! You influence and touch our hearts with the stories and characters you give us and I, hopefully not just me, -WE- thank you for it. If it wasn't for you, we wouldn't be slipping into conversations lines such as "I'm commander sheppard and ect", "Can it wait for a bit I'm in the middle of some calibrations", "Emergency-Induction-port!". Lines and characters that have touch our hearts and minds and we love you for that. But I've now gone off topic. This is a thread of suggested changes and feedback so I'll get back to it.
The introduction of Kai Leng in action was epic (Nightwing in Mass effect, had to be said) Horribly gutted that Thane was killed by him and the rescue of the most ungrateful council who never listen to me. This section was great and I loved every bit of it. No change here!
Then comes the Quarians and Geth problems and the introduction of my romance, Tali'zorah Vas Normandy. I was very happy that she was part of my squad once more cause I would not have been happy if she wasn't. Being without a Krogen element was enough, removing Tali would have drawn the line for me. But she's part of my squad once more, so I'm happy. The entire conflict and story arc between the two races in my opinion was much shorter than the Krogen Genophage arc. I didn't get a high satisfaction in this arc than I did with the Genophage. Don't get my wrong I love it, but it felt like it was missing one mission. If you could add in a mission then that would be great, be it a mission linked with Admril Xen or Admril Haan (despite me punching him in the gut). But then again I thought I accidenlty missed a chance to add in a mission so I may be at fault here for shortening it. But If anyone else feels that way then I hope I get another mission added in the future. In conclusion it was sad that Legion had to die, but I was happy I ended the war and made the geth and Quarians live in harmony. But most of all. I was sooooo happy that I took down a reaper! I was shouting at the thing to 'come at me' as I continued to blast it, then getting quite scared at how big it was when it got closer. But I found this all, apart from my points raised, perfect!
Oh! I almost forgot. As I said before I am a Talimancer, and like all Talimancers. We waited for the moment where we could actually see the face of Tali. It was the most anticipated unveiling we waited for. Then we go to our room and find a picture next to our bedside. However what we saw was a free stock picture that was photoshopped/Edited in whatever way. And like most of the fanbase, if not all, we felt a little betrayed and hurt. Like I said before these are characters you have given us that we have grown so close to and have bonded with as we played through the games. There are thousands of people that have created Fanfictions, Pictures, comics, posters ect of these characters because they love them deeply. People feel that you became very lazy, which I hope is not the case because compared to the rest of the story it just didn't add up. If there was an in-game model of your picture then maybe to the fanbase it'll be forgivable. The fans have made many art of what they thought Tali would look like underneath the mask. If you haven't look then please do, see the detail of the pictures in some. The time put into their work on their very detailed unmasked tali pictures could have been used for other things. They could have been doing school work, working, sleeping even. But no, they took their time to create what they thought was the face of Tali because they love the characters. So my suggestion for this is either you keep your stock picture and make an ingame model of Tali without her mask in the way that photo describes her, or create a original picture for tali, something that wasn't a free picture off the internet. People have suggested somewhere that you take a picture of your own and do what you like with it. But in the end the fans want to see the face of Tali that isn't an editted free picture from the web. I want one of my suggestions to be taken not because I'm selfish and I want it, but because I love this seires and don't want it to be cheapened by the slightest detail.
Thessia, oh boy oh boy do I hate Banshee's with a passion. Those damned things have killed me more than anything else. Then Kai Leng and the Illusive man as they came by to steal the Prothean VI. Damn Cerberus. Then the moment when I'm forced to watch the reapers decimate Thessia as I hear the cries of the Asari on the comms. Sad but beautiful scene. Chasing them down to that Cerberus lab to fight Miranda's father and hunt down Kai Leng.
Then comes the moments before the raid on the Cerberus base. Tali comes to my room and we share a night together. Here could be an ideal place to have the ingame model of her face. Maybe a full love scene like Liara's and Ashleys to but I shan't be greedy on that. The raid on the base, watching the videos of project lazarus. The amazing dialog there when I had Tali with me. Beautiful. The battle against Kai Leng and then... simply the best renegade move in the entire seires, puching through his sword and ending Kai Leng, for Thane. Absolutely epic. How I cheered and hollared at the screen at that moment was painful for my throat. But I'm happy it happened. Then the big realisation. The Citadel is the Catalyst! I thought this was great cause it all came down to the Citadel. How significant it had been in the past, such as Soverign and Saren attack. I thought it a great choice.
Then finally the cataclysmic battle on Earth. Fighting to get to Anderson, reuniting with him. Then the final talks I have with the rest of the crew I have now and past crew members through holograms. Great moment. Then we set off to the conduit to get to the Citadel! Battling through all the enemies with determination to get to the citadel. This was all good but if there was something lacking in the entire sequence. And that was what everyone else was doing. We wanted to see Samara with other Justicars destroying husks, Jack and her biotic students offering support to the Salarians STG and Spectre unit, Wrex and Grunt double team a Brute and destry marauders. Then a moment where Primarch Victus gets knocked down then saved by Wrex, showing comeradre between Krogen and Turian and such. Something that included everyone, even the squad mates you didn't take with you, and Joker shooting up reapers in the skies. I know that the story is about Shepard and is centered around him but we also want to know how our old squad mates are doing in the battle and the people we recruited in our war assets. Different alien races fighting together and the mercenaries fighting dirty against the reaper troops too. It was that completion of the battle we would have loved to have seen. Cause at the moment it just centers around the humans fighting the reapers. Before the main earth battle started I saw Wrex giving a speech to a load of Krogen. I wondered where they went. It would be something great to see.
After destroying another Destroyer Reaper, which actually is another thing. The only big reaper ships we ever actually face in the games are the smaller ones. I know that even those are as hard as hell to destroy but at least once I thought it would have been nice to see our forces destroying a soverign sized one or even replacing that destroyer reaper infront of the conduit with a soverign sized one. Showing that there is hope for us all as we brought the big ones down and that even though destroying Soverign was like 3 years ago, we still got it. Then came the moment we run up the hill and down comes Harbinger. The biggest baddest Reaper of them all that's got it out for Shepard. Despite him being like the leader of the Reapers he doesn't even speak a line to Shepard, not even communicate with Shepard before hand. Such an Iconic villain of the seires to be mute and suffer only a cameo didn't seem right. So then we run down the hill and try to get to the Conduit and for some reason, leave behind my squad mates that apparently don't even seem interested in following me down. Then comes the big blinding lazor! Now I saw a deleted scene where Garrus and Liara are then killed by another Lazor when we dodge the blinding one. I think you shoul keep this scene in if the player has less war assets or something along those lines. But then comes the begining of the end...
We get up all blurred and see Harbinger fly away. Our determination wills us to get up and continue on, killing the three huskiteers and Marauder Shields, who try to stop us from the inevitable. We get there and we're shot up to the Citadel. Shepard gets up and hears that Anderson made it too and landed in a different place. What confused me was that in the game everything was a straight line. The room of bodies leading to a corridor of moving machinery to some steps to the big circular platform where Anderson is. Then comes in the three-way debate with Shepard, Anderson and the Illusive man. With the we must control the reapers and the no we must destroy them debate, which leads to either you talking the illusive man to suicide which I did, or you shooting him or him killing anderson then you shooting him or simply the illusive man killing you. Then comes the moment when Anderson and Shepard talk while sitting down. Now the games footage of this apparently shortens the dialog between the two. Cause I've heard a conversation between Shepard and Anderson that's longer and has them talking about Shepard being a parent. WHY DID YOU CUT THIS OUT?! The whole dialog is beautiful and makes the whole scene more emotional that it already is. Anderson sadly dies and Shepard seems to be bleeding to death. It looks to be a sad ending as I await for the Crucible to kill all the reapers.
But then comes the scene that I'm sure you guys are tired of hearing feedback about, but It needs to be said. What is there to say that hasn't been said by the tens of thousand fans. It felt confusing, not cause I couldn't understand it but because it felt so out of place from the whole seires. The logic of the child is majorly flawed as it is. To stop synthetics from killing organics we're going to make synthetics to kill the organics. The worst part is that Shepard is so accepting of it all. No option for Shepard to turn around and go "That's rubbish I stopped a war between Quarians and Geth and they are going to live peacefully." Yes there's that one time where you have an option to say that humans may as well be machines if you take away our future but that's not enough. The control I had over Shepard was completely taken away from me in this scene and Shepard was forced to accept the flawed logic of this 'God-Child' that fans have named. The options given to us. Control the reapers like the Illusive man wanted and die. Synthesis and merge organics and sythetics together like Saren wanted in the begining. All their strengths and non of their weaknesses. The alliances between organics and synthetics. All said by Saren and he was indictrinated. Or you destroy the reapers which is what you intended to do since the beginning of the entire seires. There is just so many questions that need answering before we can make an actual decision. Like if I die how can I control the reapers when I'm dead. Does merging synthesis and organics together make husks? Is there a way we can save the Geth instead of killing them along with the Reapers? Why are you in the form of the kid who was killed on earth at the beginning of the game? Did you know I was dreaming about him? Did you expect me? There were so many plotholes that weren't filled there. The 'God-Child' was not even a good way to end it and I hadn't even made a choice yet. It just seemed so rushed that a character was introduced in the final scene of the game and talk about the flawed logic of making the reapers. Which took away parts of what made the Reapers scary. I believe that the reapers remaining a complete mystery added to the fear of them. Giant machines suddenly come and harvest all organic life. Why? They have their reasons and you to "Deal with it, Primatives" (thank you Javik). That makes them scary. The 'God-Child' took lots of the scary off of them. If that wasn't enough, your fanbase felt even more betrayed when bioware quoted that they weren't going to have an A,B and C ending which in our eyes was exactly what happend.
A: Control
B: Synthesis
C: Destroy
That was the choices we were faced.
Then comes the big thing that fans hate with a passion. The total of 6 endings. Although there are 3 endings there are tweeked versions that separate them, although fans would agree that 2% of the tweeking doesn't make a difference. If all endings play at the same time in a line of each other, which some fans have done on youtube. The only difference, apart from the minor tweeks are the colours of the crucible blast. Red, green or blue. Apart from the destroys vaporizing earth or destroying buildings, or control and synthesis flying away reapers, the endings are the same. Beam hits mass relays, relay sends beam to other, relays blow up, Normandy filled with crew suddenly flies away from the beam, crashes on jungle planet, everyone gets out to look at the skies and planets with epic music to snap it to black. Then if destroy ending is picked and enough war assets are collected you see Shepard who looks like he's in stone rubble take a breath. Since me and many many fans have never once seen stone architecture (sure I've spelt that wrong) on the Citadel. We immediatly assume it's london. which leads to us assuming that the endings they had faced was an dream. Which leads them to pick out bits and pieces of what you have wrote in the codexes, what things have been said in the past two games and the things they have seen in the ending and pointed out, all lead to the birth of the indoctrination theory. Despite how clever it is, it's just a theory, as nothing in our eyes has been answered. It felt like everything from Shepard being taken up the lift to the 'God-Child' was written but someone else. It's completely different to the previous five days of me playing the game because every moment was amazing and beautiful. Then the endings came along and it just...felt so wrong and not part of the Mass effect seires at all. Even the crew of the Normandy and Joker suddenly felt as if they were completely out of character. The Joker we knew for five years wouldn't just abandon Shepard, he wouldn't leave the original Normandy because he was stubborn enough to believe he could save her. He wouldn't abandon Shepard, especially after watching him get spaced. It's the same with the squad, Garrus, Liara, Tali, Kaiden/Ashley, after the hell we been through in the past games we felt that they would never have left Shepard.
As the fans would say and pardon my french "The endings are ****." And although it looks good, with the graphics and how it's done. It doesn't change that the endings according to most of your fanbase say it's ****. If anything it's good looking ****, but still ****. I don't mean to offend. When the announcement of the extended cut came out we had huge hope for the seires. When fans then found out about 'clarifying' the endings we currently have. They feel slightly more betrayed and even lost faith in the company as they feel your now "going to explain why it's good ****". Heck there are even some fans saying that EA is the one behind ruining the game because they have such faith in your artistic story and heart breaking scenarios in the story. That they refuse to believe that the company they love could spawn such an ending that sickens them to a story that you took their attention and love for for five years.
These are my views on the game as a whole and possibly how most of the fanbase feels. I hope so cause I'll feel stupid if they all call bull on my ridiculously looooooooong text walls. If you have read through everything so far you have the patients of a god and I thank you for reading this far.
Cause in the end Bioware. I will not loose faith in Bioware. I will remain a loyal fan to the games you supply and hope you all have the patients needed to read through this long post. I hope so. It took me a few hours to write this up. Hours that could have gone to college work. But nope. It goes to you cause I find that it needed to be said from me and that I hope you read and consider what I say. For a company that does listen to it's fanbase, I shall remain to have faith.
PS: I knew I forgot something. I was wondering why the game didn't continue from the Aria loosing Omega story. I thought there would have been a level when I assisted her in recapturing Omega from Cerberus. There's another feedback. If there is anything I've missed I'm sure someone else will cover it or that it's already been mentioned. Again. Thank you for your patients in reading this. I hope bioware has the patients too.
What I thought of the game of Mass effect 3 and its suggestive changes. I'll go through the entire game and pretty much say what to change and what not to. All of this being my opinion and all and I shall go through this without "Y U SUX ENDINS?!" or "I NEVER PLAY UR GAMES AGAIN!" rage that erupted. We're all adults here (I hope) and I shall talk to you as such and with respect. For I do not forget that you supplied me with my favourite games.
The Story opening was full of emotion and art. It was downright beautiful and almost tear-jerking. The reapers coming and pretty much leveling Vancouver (however you spell it), downright amazing. One of the best things I have seen, and as the story progressed on, it just got better and better. One thing that did get my attention however was that for me, maybe to other people I don't know but to me it felt as if the use of the dialog wheel and it's choices was much lesser than the previous games. It felt to me that my Shepard that I crafted and made throught my previous gaming was breaking free from my controll just a little bit. He seemed to be auto dialoging just a bit more than me choosing what he wants to say. It was a slight issue I had but not a big issue to raise hell about.
I enjoyed traveling back and forth to the Citadel after each mission and chatting with the crew (despite how long it is, I was also very happy that you made shepard no longer get tired after sprinting), The side quests from the citadel however I had mixed feelings about. I was happy they were there and that they awarded me with war assets when I completed them. But their system I wouldn't say helpful. In some cases it tells me which galaxey to scan, but in other cases it was pretty much for example "This unit needs a morale boost, get copies of Fornex" and that's it (I know my example sucks). Not telling me which system to fly to, what planet to find it on. So I ended up not doing it cause I couldn't find them. I know I could have easily gone on the internet and find out where, but I don't want to ruin my gaming experience by cheating my way through. The system of side quests you had in the last game were much better organized and detail than in this one. I look at my journal and my questlog looks like textrape on the screen due to having listened to many conversations in the citedal and automatically accepting their sidequests. Marking them as priority/Citadel/whatever system they are set in, just looked quite messy on the screen and not organized. If there is a way in a patch to make this better reading in organizing and less wall of text (which is ironic cause this post will no doubt be walls of text) then that would be great and I would take longer in playing the game which I thoroughly enjoyed. (I'm sure I've spelt that wrong.)
Then comes the Krogen Genophage curing. Although some may have found it predictable that this would have a huge roll to play in the recruiting of Krogen, I wanted it kept the same. I loved how we got to see what a Krogen female looks like, I also loved that I got to see Mordin and Wrex again. I enjoyed all of the levels, including the re introduction of the Rachni and it's queen returning. And who can forget Grunt, the perfect Krogen and proven when he 'Leeroy Jenkins' himself into the Rachni to hold them off (yes, WoW nerd). Which brings me to another thing that dissapointed me. The fact that you couldn't have either Wrex or Grunt in your squad. Wrex is understandable, being the leader of the Krogen and leading them against the reapers. But Grunt, he was meant to be the last of his team of Krogen when escaping (if you get him loyal) So why couldn't he/Dagg be part of your crew? Yes we all know that James Vega is hugely buff but...he's not a Krogen, and that's what was missing in my squad. I really would have liked a Krogen (despite how ever powered they are, especialy in multiplayer). Apart from that, Mumma Thresher Maw VS Small Reaper = GENIUS and EPIC. I had three Brutes trying to get me and I was ready to fight to kill them. Then when that reaper almost stepped on me I pretty much went "Screw that! I'm too small!" And ran like hell to call for Mumma Thresher Maw. It was great and Mordin's sacrifice was amazingly done, especially when he was muttering and singing the very model of a scientist Salarian. Beautiful. Great conclusion to the character and the Genophage story. I will even run some sort of test on sea shells.
Before I continue I hope you take to heart what I've just said then. I will run tests on sea shells! Because of you! Bioware! You influence and touch our hearts with the stories and characters you give us and I, hopefully not just me, -WE- thank you for it. If it wasn't for you, we wouldn't be slipping into conversations lines such as "I'm commander sheppard and ect", "Can it wait for a bit I'm in the middle of some calibrations", "Emergency-Induction-port!". Lines and characters that have touch our hearts and minds and we love you for that. But I've now gone off topic. This is a thread of suggested changes and feedback so I'll get back to it.
The introduction of Kai Leng in action was epic (Nightwing in Mass effect, had to be said) Horribly gutted that Thane was killed by him and the rescue of the most ungrateful council who never listen to me. This section was great and I loved every bit of it. No change here!
Then comes the Quarians and Geth problems and the introduction of my romance, Tali'zorah Vas Normandy. I was very happy that she was part of my squad once more cause I would not have been happy if she wasn't. Being without a Krogen element was enough, removing Tali would have drawn the line for me. But she's part of my squad once more, so I'm happy. The entire conflict and story arc between the two races in my opinion was much shorter than the Krogen Genophage arc. I didn't get a high satisfaction in this arc than I did with the Genophage. Don't get my wrong I love it, but it felt like it was missing one mission. If you could add in a mission then that would be great, be it a mission linked with Admril Xen or Admril Haan (despite me punching him in the gut). But then again I thought I accidenlty missed a chance to add in a mission so I may be at fault here for shortening it. But If anyone else feels that way then I hope I get another mission added in the future. In conclusion it was sad that Legion had to die, but I was happy I ended the war and made the geth and Quarians live in harmony. But most of all. I was sooooo happy that I took down a reaper! I was shouting at the thing to 'come at me' as I continued to blast it, then getting quite scared at how big it was when it got closer. But I found this all, apart from my points raised, perfect!
Oh! I almost forgot. As I said before I am a Talimancer, and like all Talimancers. We waited for the moment where we could actually see the face of Tali. It was the most anticipated unveiling we waited for. Then we go to our room and find a picture next to our bedside. However what we saw was a free stock picture that was photoshopped/Edited in whatever way. And like most of the fanbase, if not all, we felt a little betrayed and hurt. Like I said before these are characters you have given us that we have grown so close to and have bonded with as we played through the games. There are thousands of people that have created Fanfictions, Pictures, comics, posters ect of these characters because they love them deeply. People feel that you became very lazy, which I hope is not the case because compared to the rest of the story it just didn't add up. If there was an in-game model of your picture then maybe to the fanbase it'll be forgivable. The fans have made many art of what they thought Tali would look like underneath the mask. If you haven't look then please do, see the detail of the pictures in some. The time put into their work on their very detailed unmasked tali pictures could have been used for other things. They could have been doing school work, working, sleeping even. But no, they took their time to create what they thought was the face of Tali because they love the characters. So my suggestion for this is either you keep your stock picture and make an ingame model of Tali without her mask in the way that photo describes her, or create a original picture for tali, something that wasn't a free picture off the internet. People have suggested somewhere that you take a picture of your own and do what you like with it. But in the end the fans want to see the face of Tali that isn't an editted free picture from the web. I want one of my suggestions to be taken not because I'm selfish and I want it, but because I love this seires and don't want it to be cheapened by the slightest detail.
Thessia, oh boy oh boy do I hate Banshee's with a passion. Those damned things have killed me more than anything else. Then Kai Leng and the Illusive man as they came by to steal the Prothean VI. Damn Cerberus. Then the moment when I'm forced to watch the reapers decimate Thessia as I hear the cries of the Asari on the comms. Sad but beautiful scene. Chasing them down to that Cerberus lab to fight Miranda's father and hunt down Kai Leng.
Then comes the moments before the raid on the Cerberus base. Tali comes to my room and we share a night together. Here could be an ideal place to have the ingame model of her face. Maybe a full love scene like Liara's and Ashleys to but I shan't be greedy on that. The raid on the base, watching the videos of project lazarus. The amazing dialog there when I had Tali with me. Beautiful. The battle against Kai Leng and then... simply the best renegade move in the entire seires, puching through his sword and ending Kai Leng, for Thane. Absolutely epic. How I cheered and hollared at the screen at that moment was painful for my throat. But I'm happy it happened. Then the big realisation. The Citadel is the Catalyst! I thought this was great cause it all came down to the Citadel. How significant it had been in the past, such as Soverign and Saren attack. I thought it a great choice.
Then finally the cataclysmic battle on Earth. Fighting to get to Anderson, reuniting with him. Then the final talks I have with the rest of the crew I have now and past crew members through holograms. Great moment. Then we set off to the conduit to get to the Citadel! Battling through all the enemies with determination to get to the citadel. This was all good but if there was something lacking in the entire sequence. And that was what everyone else was doing. We wanted to see Samara with other Justicars destroying husks, Jack and her biotic students offering support to the Salarians STG and Spectre unit, Wrex and Grunt double team a Brute and destry marauders. Then a moment where Primarch Victus gets knocked down then saved by Wrex, showing comeradre between Krogen and Turian and such. Something that included everyone, even the squad mates you didn't take with you, and Joker shooting up reapers in the skies. I know that the story is about Shepard and is centered around him but we also want to know how our old squad mates are doing in the battle and the people we recruited in our war assets. Different alien races fighting together and the mercenaries fighting dirty against the reaper troops too. It was that completion of the battle we would have loved to have seen. Cause at the moment it just centers around the humans fighting the reapers. Before the main earth battle started I saw Wrex giving a speech to a load of Krogen. I wondered where they went. It would be something great to see.
After destroying another Destroyer Reaper, which actually is another thing. The only big reaper ships we ever actually face in the games are the smaller ones. I know that even those are as hard as hell to destroy but at least once I thought it would have been nice to see our forces destroying a soverign sized one or even replacing that destroyer reaper infront of the conduit with a soverign sized one. Showing that there is hope for us all as we brought the big ones down and that even though destroying Soverign was like 3 years ago, we still got it. Then came the moment we run up the hill and down comes Harbinger. The biggest baddest Reaper of them all that's got it out for Shepard. Despite him being like the leader of the Reapers he doesn't even speak a line to Shepard, not even communicate with Shepard before hand. Such an Iconic villain of the seires to be mute and suffer only a cameo didn't seem right. So then we run down the hill and try to get to the Conduit and for some reason, leave behind my squad mates that apparently don't even seem interested in following me down. Then comes the big blinding lazor! Now I saw a deleted scene where Garrus and Liara are then killed by another Lazor when we dodge the blinding one. I think you shoul keep this scene in if the player has less war assets or something along those lines. But then comes the begining of the end...
We get up all blurred and see Harbinger fly away. Our determination wills us to get up and continue on, killing the three huskiteers and Marauder Shields, who try to stop us from the inevitable. We get there and we're shot up to the Citadel. Shepard gets up and hears that Anderson made it too and landed in a different place. What confused me was that in the game everything was a straight line. The room of bodies leading to a corridor of moving machinery to some steps to the big circular platform where Anderson is. Then comes in the three-way debate with Shepard, Anderson and the Illusive man. With the we must control the reapers and the no we must destroy them debate, which leads to either you talking the illusive man to suicide which I did, or you shooting him or him killing anderson then you shooting him or simply the illusive man killing you. Then comes the moment when Anderson and Shepard talk while sitting down. Now the games footage of this apparently shortens the dialog between the two. Cause I've heard a conversation between Shepard and Anderson that's longer and has them talking about Shepard being a parent. WHY DID YOU CUT THIS OUT?! The whole dialog is beautiful and makes the whole scene more emotional that it already is. Anderson sadly dies and Shepard seems to be bleeding to death. It looks to be a sad ending as I await for the Crucible to kill all the reapers.
But then comes the scene that I'm sure you guys are tired of hearing feedback about, but It needs to be said. What is there to say that hasn't been said by the tens of thousand fans. It felt confusing, not cause I couldn't understand it but because it felt so out of place from the whole seires. The logic of the child is majorly flawed as it is. To stop synthetics from killing organics we're going to make synthetics to kill the organics. The worst part is that Shepard is so accepting of it all. No option for Shepard to turn around and go "That's rubbish I stopped a war between Quarians and Geth and they are going to live peacefully." Yes there's that one time where you have an option to say that humans may as well be machines if you take away our future but that's not enough. The control I had over Shepard was completely taken away from me in this scene and Shepard was forced to accept the flawed logic of this 'God-Child' that fans have named. The options given to us. Control the reapers like the Illusive man wanted and die. Synthesis and merge organics and sythetics together like Saren wanted in the begining. All their strengths and non of their weaknesses. The alliances between organics and synthetics. All said by Saren and he was indictrinated. Or you destroy the reapers which is what you intended to do since the beginning of the entire seires. There is just so many questions that need answering before we can make an actual decision. Like if I die how can I control the reapers when I'm dead. Does merging synthesis and organics together make husks? Is there a way we can save the Geth instead of killing them along with the Reapers? Why are you in the form of the kid who was killed on earth at the beginning of the game? Did you know I was dreaming about him? Did you expect me? There were so many plotholes that weren't filled there. The 'God-Child' was not even a good way to end it and I hadn't even made a choice yet. It just seemed so rushed that a character was introduced in the final scene of the game and talk about the flawed logic of making the reapers. Which took away parts of what made the Reapers scary. I believe that the reapers remaining a complete mystery added to the fear of them. Giant machines suddenly come and harvest all organic life. Why? They have their reasons and you to "Deal with it, Primatives" (thank you Javik). That makes them scary. The 'God-Child' took lots of the scary off of them. If that wasn't enough, your fanbase felt even more betrayed when bioware quoted that they weren't going to have an A,B and C ending which in our eyes was exactly what happend.
A: Control
B: Synthesis
C: Destroy
That was the choices we were faced.
Then comes the big thing that fans hate with a passion. The total of 6 endings. Although there are 3 endings there are tweeked versions that separate them, although fans would agree that 2% of the tweeking doesn't make a difference. If all endings play at the same time in a line of each other, which some fans have done on youtube. The only difference, apart from the minor tweeks are the colours of the crucible blast. Red, green or blue. Apart from the destroys vaporizing earth or destroying buildings, or control and synthesis flying away reapers, the endings are the same. Beam hits mass relays, relay sends beam to other, relays blow up, Normandy filled with crew suddenly flies away from the beam, crashes on jungle planet, everyone gets out to look at the skies and planets with epic music to snap it to black. Then if destroy ending is picked and enough war assets are collected you see Shepard who looks like he's in stone rubble take a breath. Since me and many many fans have never once seen stone architecture (sure I've spelt that wrong) on the Citadel. We immediatly assume it's london. which leads to us assuming that the endings they had faced was an dream. Which leads them to pick out bits and pieces of what you have wrote in the codexes, what things have been said in the past two games and the things they have seen in the ending and pointed out, all lead to the birth of the indoctrination theory. Despite how clever it is, it's just a theory, as nothing in our eyes has been answered. It felt like everything from Shepard being taken up the lift to the 'God-Child' was written but someone else. It's completely different to the previous five days of me playing the game because every moment was amazing and beautiful. Then the endings came along and it just...felt so wrong and not part of the Mass effect seires at all. Even the crew of the Normandy and Joker suddenly felt as if they were completely out of character. The Joker we knew for five years wouldn't just abandon Shepard, he wouldn't leave the original Normandy because he was stubborn enough to believe he could save her. He wouldn't abandon Shepard, especially after watching him get spaced. It's the same with the squad, Garrus, Liara, Tali, Kaiden/Ashley, after the hell we been through in the past games we felt that they would never have left Shepard.
As the fans would say and pardon my french "The endings are ****." And although it looks good, with the graphics and how it's done. It doesn't change that the endings according to most of your fanbase say it's ****. If anything it's good looking ****, but still ****. I don't mean to offend. When the announcement of the extended cut came out we had huge hope for the seires. When fans then found out about 'clarifying' the endings we currently have. They feel slightly more betrayed and even lost faith in the company as they feel your now "going to explain why it's good ****". Heck there are even some fans saying that EA is the one behind ruining the game because they have such faith in your artistic story and heart breaking scenarios in the story. That they refuse to believe that the company they love could spawn such an ending that sickens them to a story that you took their attention and love for for five years.
These are my views on the game as a whole and possibly how most of the fanbase feels. I hope so cause I'll feel stupid if they all call bull on my ridiculously looooooooong text walls. If you have read through everything so far you have the patients of a god and I thank you for reading this far.
Cause in the end Bioware. I will not loose faith in Bioware. I will remain a loyal fan to the games you supply and hope you all have the patients needed to read through this long post. I hope so. It took me a few hours to write this up. Hours that could have gone to college work. But nope. It goes to you cause I find that it needed to be said from me and that I hope you read and consider what I say. For a company that does listen to it's fanbase, I shall remain to have faith.
PS: I knew I forgot something. I was wondering why the game didn't continue from the Aria loosing Omega story. I thought there would have been a level when I assisted her in recapturing Omega from Cerberus. There's another feedback. If there is anything I've missed I'm sure someone else will cover it or that it's already been mentioned. Again. Thank you for your patients in reading this. I hope bioware has the patients too.
Modifié par Galorphar, 30 avril 2012 - 01:33 .
#6729
Posté 30 avril 2012 - 09:08
daveyeisley
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BalianOfIbelin wrote...
Suggestion, new ending:
<snip>
Cheers and applause permeate the Presidium and across the galaxy, the broadcast is the first since galactic-wide communications have been reestablished.
Shepard is back on the Normandy. He takes the elevator down from his cabin to the CIC. His squad-mates flank him on either side as he exits the elevator and salute or nod as he passes.
Specialist Traynor: “Commander, we have received reports of an unauthorized activation of the dormant Mass Relays in several nebulae, most notably the Valhallan Threshold.”
She hands him a datapad.
Specialist Traynor: “No one has investigated yet, and given the Normandy’s stealth capabilities we are best suited for the mission.”
As Traynor speaks, the camera pans out of the Normandy, which is docked at the Citadel. Massive overhaul and repair efforts are underway on the Citadel, and the fleets are still massed to protect the galaxy’s super-weapon, the Crucible.
As the screen fades to black, the Normandy detaches and heads to the Mass Relay making one final jump before the screen goes totally black.
THE END!
My intentions for this ending were to be definitive, but still permit future adventures. The Reapers have been destroyed, but there are still some hiding, waiting. It only took one Reaper to be the impetus for the greatest videogame franchise.
What lies ahead? Who knows, but the possibilities are immeasurable. Perhaps a Reaper will use an inactive Relay and find a new alien race to indoctrinate. Maybe there will be a mass of indoctrinated servants that hear whispers from Reaper corpses. Maybe a race will decide that harvesting themselves and merging with AI is the pinnacle of evolution, and will form a new Reaper race. Perhaps there was another indoctrinated race like the Collectors that the Reapers have yet to use. Forget the Reapers, are the Krogan going to expand again? Can the Geth and Quarian races truly coexist? Will the Batarians return to seclusion and terrorism? What roles will the formerly smaller races like Elcor, Hanar, Drell, Volus, etc. be like in a new galaxy?
My point is that the possibilities and storylines are infinite, which means that future games have the potential to be as full and rich as the former.
*applause*
#6730
Posté 30 avril 2012 - 12:23
MattFini
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I know BioWare has said they wouldn't have any post-game DLC, meaning that the Crucible docking is the end of ME3.
But I would honestly like for BW to reconsider this.
The biggest problem I have with ME3's ending is that it's anticlimactic. You reach the Citadel, have a good confrontation with TIM and then that's about it. There's no sense of victory here, BioWare. It doesn't feel earned at all.
When ME 1 and 2 ended, victory was achieved. In ME3, the StarChild basically brings the game to a screeching halt and GIVES us a 'victory'. This feels completely unsatisfying and cheap.
I would propose some kind of 'final' mission that takes place after the game. Yes, I'm sure it would take some creative writing for BioWare to make it work, but perhaps a final assault on Harbinger. Maybe he's too old and poweful to have been compelted deactivated by the Crucible (just a base idea ... I know BW could make something work).
The point is, ME3 needs to give the player a sense of victory and accomplishment. I'm not saying every ending needs to be happy, but we need to feel like we took Earth back ourselves.
A post-game DLC that gives us a final mission would do this. Plus, it would allow for closure along the way.
But I would honestly like for BW to reconsider this.
The biggest problem I have with ME3's ending is that it's anticlimactic. You reach the Citadel, have a good confrontation with TIM and then that's about it. There's no sense of victory here, BioWare. It doesn't feel earned at all.
When ME 1 and 2 ended, victory was achieved. In ME3, the StarChild basically brings the game to a screeching halt and GIVES us a 'victory'. This feels completely unsatisfying and cheap.
I would propose some kind of 'final' mission that takes place after the game. Yes, I'm sure it would take some creative writing for BioWare to make it work, but perhaps a final assault on Harbinger. Maybe he's too old and poweful to have been compelted deactivated by the Crucible (just a base idea ... I know BW could make something work).
The point is, ME3 needs to give the player a sense of victory and accomplishment. I'm not saying every ending needs to be happy, but we need to feel like we took Earth back ourselves.
A post-game DLC that gives us a final mission would do this. Plus, it would allow for closure along the way.
Modifié par MattFini, 30 avril 2012 - 12:25 .
#6731
Posté 30 avril 2012 - 12:31
Trex001
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Here's my feedback. I shall opt for the blunt and neutral feedback style.
My recommendations are :
- If Shepard needs to die in ME3, at least let us see the aftermath or nig long term consequences of his/her final actions. Maybe see his funeral with Hackett giving a speech/eulogy and listing who lived or died and what the future has in store for humanity and the galaxy.
- Remove or alter any instances where Shepard stands watching something when they could be doing something. Two instances of this are when Thane and Kai are fighting, and when Ashley/Kaiden are attacked at the end of the Mars mission. It's really frustating to see Shepard just standing there watching when he/she already has a gun drawn and pointed. Maybe just add in a moment where he/she gets knocked back. It would give an excuse toward why they can't act.
- My largest frustration with the end Catalyst conversation was when my renegade Shepard couldn't get angry. To a minor degree, I can see Paragon Shep treating the Catalyst with some respect, but Renegade Shep would have a least tried to tell the Catalyst where to stick it, even if they knew it was futile.
- Following from the above, I find the dream sequences are wrong for Renegade Shepard. I can see him angry at the reapers, but not fixating on the death of a child he didn't even know. Maybe an alternative dream sequence depending on how many renegade points you have?
- During my first ending playthrough, the normandy crashed and there were no survivors. However, the last thing I saw was the door opening with no one stepping out. I originally took this to mean that someone survived (if not, who opened the door?). I had to read online that this meant there were no survivors.
My point is that it wasn't very clear. I think it would have been better if you actually saw bodies, just so you know for sure.
- I felt Harbinger was a great villain in ME2, and had lots of potential in ME3, so was a little dissappointed to see he only had a non-speaking cameo. I feel like some form of verbal confrontation somehere in the game would be very satisfying, and link well to ME2.
My recommendations are :
- If Shepard needs to die in ME3, at least let us see the aftermath or nig long term consequences of his/her final actions. Maybe see his funeral with Hackett giving a speech/eulogy and listing who lived or died and what the future has in store for humanity and the galaxy.
- Remove or alter any instances where Shepard stands watching something when they could be doing something. Two instances of this are when Thane and Kai are fighting, and when Ashley/Kaiden are attacked at the end of the Mars mission. It's really frustating to see Shepard just standing there watching when he/she already has a gun drawn and pointed. Maybe just add in a moment where he/she gets knocked back. It would give an excuse toward why they can't act.
- My largest frustration with the end Catalyst conversation was when my renegade Shepard couldn't get angry. To a minor degree, I can see Paragon Shep treating the Catalyst with some respect, but Renegade Shep would have a least tried to tell the Catalyst where to stick it, even if they knew it was futile.
- Following from the above, I find the dream sequences are wrong for Renegade Shepard. I can see him angry at the reapers, but not fixating on the death of a child he didn't even know. Maybe an alternative dream sequence depending on how many renegade points you have?
- During my first ending playthrough, the normandy crashed and there were no survivors. However, the last thing I saw was the door opening with no one stepping out. I originally took this to mean that someone survived (if not, who opened the door?). I had to read online that this meant there were no survivors.
My point is that it wasn't very clear. I think it would have been better if you actually saw bodies, just so you know for sure.
- I felt Harbinger was a great villain in ME2, and had lots of potential in ME3, so was a little dissappointed to see he only had a non-speaking cameo. I feel like some form of verbal confrontation somehere in the game would be very satisfying, and link well to ME2.
#6732
Posté 30 avril 2012 - 02:20
Vakarious
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BoneDealer wrote...
I think it would have been better instead of getting the strange ghost kid from earth, if there was a crucible VI (perhaps the prothean one from Thessia) that informs Shepard that He/She is actually the catalyst.
This was actually something I was expecting from the very beginning of ME3, from the moment the catalyst was mentioned - which is also why I may not like this option in practice. It might be way too obvious :-(
But I will run with it for now, as it holds opportunities to tie together a lot of plotlines. Shepard was brought back from the dead by TIM, and Shepard is a bit of an organic/synthetic hybrid now. How was that done? Quite a feat and a mystery since the start of ME2. Reaper technology perhaps...?
Let's say that TIM was indoctrinated, earlier than we thought, just as Saren was. It would make sense that this was part of the Reapers' grand plan all along. Why else would they not simply destroy the Citadel after learning of the Crucible, but move it to earth? Because both Crucible and Citadel were part of their plan.
I must admit I'm having a bit of trouble factoring in Shepard here. The Reapers needed this hybrid person, this Catalyst, and more or less brought about the catalysts creation themselves, but why? What can Shepard do that they cannot do themselves? I'd hate for it to be a devilish/religious "it has to be of your own free will" scenario. I hope someone can help me out there.
So the story then calls for a citadel/crucible/catalyst-needing Reaper plan. Hm. Perhaps "synthesis" was the Reapers' final goal, the final end to chaos, the final "assimilation", if you will, although I do still have a lot of problems thinking of a scenario in which, using the ME technologies and truths, synthesis is possible at all. Perhaps the many cycles were leading up to this. In the end, Shepard manages to refuse to fulfill this bleak destiny, maybe because of the missing control chip? Bit lame maybe, but perhaps TIM's humanity did shine through there, in the end.
Or, better: the story of the Protheans is true, and this is indeed a grand weapon in the making, in an ages old repetition of cycles, organics getting closer to finishing it in every cycle. But the Reapers choose control rather than destruction (not a leap of faith there) and wish to see it finished on their own terms and use it to their own advantage. Each cycle ends with their harvesting of the species that came closest to finding out about them, and with the best chances to kill them off. Actually, any old Catalyst would have worked (any organic), but they changed the citadel that contains the control mechanism to accept a different kind of catalyst, being Shepard. Again, shaky grounds. Why Shepard?
Let's say the missing control chip saves us all. That can make sense. The Reapers threaten earth so that the Catalyst is easily manipulated, even without a chip. But I still need some crazy but believable reason why it has to be Shepard, why they cannot simply repeat the exercise with someone else, and I can't think of anything right now.
In any case, in the end, nothing happens (how's that for anti climactic? ;-) because Shepard destroys the citadel/crucible and the reapers _are_ defeated "conventionally". With heavy losses, but still.
Am I making any sense here? More questions than answers still.
Modifié par Vakarious, 30 avril 2012 - 02:33 .
#6733
Posté 30 avril 2012 - 02:26
megabug7
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I have no problem with the catalyst. I have a problem with feeling zero accomplishment, non-closure, and feeling deflated.
I don't even watch the endings anymore - they are nonsensical - and mean nothing in the grand scheme of things.
The Earth Mission was terrible, it was basically a rinse and repeat of what we did for the majority of the game except it is poorly paced and dragged out.
You have already said you won't change the endings, provide additional gameplay, or provide post-game DLC which means you'll provide the bare minimum to an already poor finale for the best sci-fi series I have ever played. I have a sneaky feeling you will disappoint with the EC. My evidence points to the lack of quality and scope of ME3.
Cutscenes and some filler dialog won't do it, and I'm also certain you'll annoy many if you take the comic approach (like the 'Genesis). I seriously hope you don't even consider it!
You cut back on many instances (including cutscenes) during the main game so why would you even consider showing us what you are capable of?
You won't.
So all the feedback (including mine) in this thread (which still baffles me considering you won't budge either way) is a pointless exercise.
I'll be posting my full review in the review thread after I've finished my 5th playthrough.
(I've skipped most of the tedious planet fetch-quest scanning missions as it makes no difference).
I don't even watch the endings anymore - they are nonsensical - and mean nothing in the grand scheme of things.
The Earth Mission was terrible, it was basically a rinse and repeat of what we did for the majority of the game except it is poorly paced and dragged out.
You have already said you won't change the endings, provide additional gameplay, or provide post-game DLC which means you'll provide the bare minimum to an already poor finale for the best sci-fi series I have ever played. I have a sneaky feeling you will disappoint with the EC. My evidence points to the lack of quality and scope of ME3.
Cutscenes and some filler dialog won't do it, and I'm also certain you'll annoy many if you take the comic approach (like the 'Genesis). I seriously hope you don't even consider it!
You cut back on many instances (including cutscenes) during the main game so why would you even consider showing us what you are capable of?
You won't.
So all the feedback (including mine) in this thread (which still baffles me considering you won't budge either way) is a pointless exercise.
I'll be posting my full review in the review thread after I've finished my 5th playthrough.
(I've skipped most of the tedious planet fetch-quest scanning missions as it makes no difference).
Modifié par megabug7, 30 avril 2012 - 03:50 .
#6734
Posté 30 avril 2012 - 02:31
Vakarious
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@megabug7
I understand how you feel. And I must also admit, if the obvious plotholes weren't there, and the ending would leave Shepard and his/her squadmates and his/her LI behaving in line with how they behaved the rest of the game, with something more personal at the end, then I would perhaps manage to overlook the catalyst.
I understand how you feel. And I must also admit, if the obvious plotholes weren't there, and the ending would leave Shepard and his/her squadmates and his/her LI behaving in line with how they behaved the rest of the game, with something more personal at the end, then I would perhaps manage to overlook the catalyst.
Modifié par Vakarious, 30 avril 2012 - 02:38 .
#6735
Posté 30 avril 2012 - 03:47
SaleemRa
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I remember reading an article that qouted a supposed thread post by one of your writers (Mr. Weekes?), anyway true or false I would like one thing above all if possible - in the priority earth mission please include the option to allocate our resources as was alluded to in said post. I could definitely see this working as a cutscene/dialogue option on the normandy before/after the initial jump to earth and be similar in execution to the suicide mission in ME2. Perhaps this could change up the scene where the asari and krogan get fried by the destroyer just before the final run to the beam by depicting alternate victims (turian/geth/quarian etc). It would be a nice touch and give more impact to the decisions we made in our quest to gather allies.
Additionally if possible could you also add some of them in hammers column to the beam just so it doesnt seem like just humans on the ground - it doesnt matter if they get blown to bits by the reapers just like everything else but it sure would give the feel that everyone is putting boots on the ground.
Finally I know that we DONT need to know alot of things about the reapers - realistically we wouldnt have access to it anyway but it would be nice to have. This is a game after all and walking away with a few more answers is a whole lot more satisfying then the cryptic non responses we get in the final conversation - it doesnt have to be everything in detail just something like why the cycle started in the first place or just how big a threat evil synthetics can be. A ominous "we saw it happen time and again so we decided to harvest advanced civ's to stop the chaos" would be give a new perspective on the reapers.
Anyway fingers crossed for the EC, loved the game first time round but I'm doubly excited to see what your going to do to make it better. smilie
Additionally if possible could you also add some of them in hammers column to the beam just so it doesnt seem like just humans on the ground - it doesnt matter if they get blown to bits by the reapers just like everything else but it sure would give the feel that everyone is putting boots on the ground.
Finally I know that we DONT need to know alot of things about the reapers - realistically we wouldnt have access to it anyway but it would be nice to have. This is a game after all and walking away with a few more answers is a whole lot more satisfying then the cryptic non responses we get in the final conversation - it doesnt have to be everything in detail just something like why the cycle started in the first place or just how big a threat evil synthetics can be. A ominous "we saw it happen time and again so we decided to harvest advanced civ's to stop the chaos" would be give a new perspective on the reapers.
Anyway fingers crossed for the EC, loved the game first time round but I'm doubly excited to see what your going to do to make it better. smilie
#6736
Posté 30 avril 2012 - 05:14
jakenou
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I'm guessing that the inventory structure in ME3 is to keep the game challenging and perhaps realistic, but I always loved the ME1 system the best, as huge as it was. There are some things I am really missing in ME3, even though there was a lot of weaning done with ME2:
1a - I reaaaalllly miss that I can't sell the weapons I don't want or use. The ones I don't bother upgrading. Upgrading is expensive enough as it is. If I have to outright buy my weapons, I ought to be able to sell them or trade them in. This is more realistic to me.
1b - In addition to being able to sell off/ get rid of unwanted weapons, I think the weight bonus/penalty system should be not only relative to the guns you are equipped with, but also how much you are carrying. That seems much more realistic to me. If we can switch out a weapon at any random workbench or when we find a new weapon in the field, it is saying that Shepard has been lugging all that stuff around the whole time. This kind of inventory management would compensate for being able to get cash for loot and being able to invest the money into the weapons you want to keep. Of course, the option to buy back would be nice to go along side with this.
2 - (but relative to 1a and
I also really miss being able to add mods on the fly. It's way more realistic to be able to do that. IRL, soldiers are trained to assemble weapons quickly, and swapping out a mod in the field is part of that skill. Depending on the scenario, I might want to swap extra ammo for a scope or an extender. Again, much more realistic to be able to do any of that on the fly.
3 - (again, relative to above) More mods and more mod slots for higher level items please! It just isn't all that gratifying to have a level X Black Widow, which is a tank of a sniper rifle, with two measly slots. Pooh on that. I wanna go all out with my favorite weapons that I take the time to level up. I'd even take a (slight) weight penalty in exchange for having more mod slots.
1a - I reaaaalllly miss that I can't sell the weapons I don't want or use. The ones I don't bother upgrading. Upgrading is expensive enough as it is. If I have to outright buy my weapons, I ought to be able to sell them or trade them in. This is more realistic to me.
1b - In addition to being able to sell off/ get rid of unwanted weapons, I think the weight bonus/penalty system should be not only relative to the guns you are equipped with, but also how much you are carrying. That seems much more realistic to me. If we can switch out a weapon at any random workbench or when we find a new weapon in the field, it is saying that Shepard has been lugging all that stuff around the whole time. This kind of inventory management would compensate for being able to get cash for loot and being able to invest the money into the weapons you want to keep. Of course, the option to buy back would be nice to go along side with this.
2 - (but relative to 1a and
I also really miss being able to add mods on the fly. It's way more realistic to be able to do that. IRL, soldiers are trained to assemble weapons quickly, and swapping out a mod in the field is part of that skill. Depending on the scenario, I might want to swap extra ammo for a scope or an extender. Again, much more realistic to be able to do any of that on the fly.3 - (again, relative to above) More mods and more mod slots for higher level items please! It just isn't all that gratifying to have a level X Black Widow, which is a tank of a sniper rifle, with two measly slots. Pooh on that. I wanna go all out with my favorite weapons that I take the time to level up. I'd even take a (slight) weight penalty in exchange for having more mod slots.
Modifié par jkthunder, 30 avril 2012 - 05:25 .
#6737
Posté 30 avril 2012 - 08:22
klblamble
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I understood the "catalyst" part - it's like when Shepard is in the geth consensus and the images of the quarians are altered to fit Shepard's perception.. the catalyst does the same, and with Shepard's subconscious focusing on that one child she/he couldn't save - well it was a logical choice.. the part I have problems swallowing is the Normandy leaving earth with the crew on board.. I really don't think any of them (especially a LI) would leave without knowing what happened to Shepard..
#6738
Posté 01 mai 2012 - 12:13
AwesomeGuyCTS
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- 2 messages
I noticed in the 3rd dream sequence for me how passionatly the 2nd Shepard hugged the boy. I believe the Reapers struck Shepard in the heart when he watched as they killed his (imaginary) son. I think the reason Shepard could not stand against the boy, because in his imagination it was his son.
If you need me to clarify my thoughts please ask. Be gentle. because this is what I have concluded from the amazing time playing ME games, but please post your thoughts on this topic.
If you need me to clarify my thoughts please ask. Be gentle. because this is what I have concluded from the amazing time playing ME games, but please post your thoughts on this topic.
#6739
Posté 01 mai 2012 - 01:53
Agent B406
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- 39 messages
I'm not quite sure what to do with the endings, or where I think Bioware should go. When I first beat the game, I was pretty pissed. After a few weeks passed, it mellowed into more of a "blind-sided" feeling. I'm just deflated when it comes to the game. I didn't feel any emotion in the last 10 minutes of the game. I was just sitting there going, "oh, well....ok, I guess."
Whatever they can do to fix that, I'm all for.
Whatever they can do to fix that, I'm all for.
#6740
Posté 01 mai 2012 - 03:49
rickf7666
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The missing six months and an intro to who James is.
I was expecting a trial or some sort of explination of why Shepard was on Earth. And who the hell is James and how does he know Shepard? My idea is that James was part of your early career, which is never mentioned in ME3. As an example he was with you on Torfan or Elysium or was on leave when your unit was wiped out on Akuze. This would allow James to be the character that reinforces your formitive years.
The kid.
I never felt any connection to the kid and all the dream sequences felt very forced. Now if the IT is true then an alternative idea might be to have the kid be a younger version of Shepard. I would also have the dreams be influenced by Shepard's childhood. Traumas from childhood affect us the most throughout our lives. For this I would change the setting for where the dream takes place. Earthborn the dream takes place in back alleys of a city. Spacer the dream takes place on board a ship. You can keep the current dream for the Colonist origin.
The Crucible.
Your told when you aquire the plans for the Crucible that the plans are not complete and that no one knows what it actually does. I've never understood how they can complete the design of the device without knowing what they were designing it to do. Form always follows function. You don't just type in random code into a computer for a few years and go "oh, look at that we made a game." We do know that the Crucible is suppose to be a weapon to be used against the Reapers, but what if the Crucible was a giant transmitter that was made to send out a signal that would shutdown all the Reaper IAs without harming any other part of the Reaper. It would have to be a one shot device or any Reapers that where not taken out by the signal would enact defences againt it.
The Reapers.
One of the things that I keep thinking about is that the Reapers kept telling us was that they were our salvation. Also to make a new Reaper you harvest some current species. As I see it a race isn't just their physical form or genetics if you will, but is also their culture, science, art and politics. In other words how they lived. So what if most of a Reaper isn't just weapons and armor, but a vast computer system running a virtual galaxy with that race at its peak of development. This means that for every Reaper killed your committing genicide on a vast scale. It would come back to the idea of what is life? Are the people who exist in this virtual world alive? Your goal in creating the Crucible would be to free these civilizations from captivity. We ultimately don't need to know why the Reapers are doing the harvesting, we just need to stop them.
Love Interests.
Every possible love interest from a previous game should be recruitable. I don't mean having a vast team again. Only if you romanced Jack, Thane, Miranda or Jacob that for you that character should be able to join you and have an affect on the ending of the game. From what I've seen none of the romances quite work. I'm going to give just one example from a conversation that I've held on another forum. If you romanced Thane you should be able to find a cure for him. As Shepard you have vast resources to use and the story is how you use them. You should be able to choose to use them to save Thane. Option one use the Shadow Broker and maybe you end up missing some crucial part for the Crucible. Or gain the help of TIM, saving Thane but making things hard on yourself when fighting Cerberus because TIM put a chip in him that keeps Thane from fighting them. Or have the Quarians create a suit that is able to stop the effects of the disease from killing him, but he is stuck in the suit. Options and desisions, fun stuff.
The Citadel.
Throughout the game you keep getting missions that increase the Citadel defense force but then it doesn't get used at all. This should be a number just like the Galactic Readiness rating. The number should influence how many survive the Reaper attack and how much of the Citadel the Reapers were able to control.
Conventional Forces Ending.
Just because Hackett doesn't think it can be done doesn't mean it can't. Things like getting both the Geth and the Quarians should influence your ability to kill all the Reapers on Earth. But going back to my earlier suggestion you might not want to. Or it is a way to "win" if you were not able to complete the Crucible or if the Citadel defenders completely lost the fight and you would be unable to link up the Crucible with the Citadel.
The Conduit.
I don't like the beam from Earth at all. It introduces something completely new right at the end of the story. Why not use the Conduit. This would tie into the Citadel defense rating. Part of the story might be that the Reapers got ahold of the Conduit from Ilos or maybe TIM did and moved it to Earth. I think there are quite a few possibilities here. Not to mention that using the Conduit would be a very nice call back to ME1.
The Dreams and Indoctrination Theory.
I don't have a problem with the idea of IT, but if the dreams were a part of that then I think there should be choices made in the dreams that play into that theme. I think an Indoctrination score could be use throughout the game to make certain dialog options available or to take away certain options.
The ultimate "goal" of my ideas is to use all the various story elements introduced in the games and make some kind of sense of those elements. Unfortunately, few of my ideas could be used without some major reworking of Mass Effect 3, but Bioware created this thread to get ideas from the fans. Well these are mine, do with them as you will. Of course if you like my ideas and would want to add me to your writing staff I wouldn't say no. Hey I can dream can't I?
I was expecting a trial or some sort of explination of why Shepard was on Earth. And who the hell is James and how does he know Shepard? My idea is that James was part of your early career, which is never mentioned in ME3. As an example he was with you on Torfan or Elysium or was on leave when your unit was wiped out on Akuze. This would allow James to be the character that reinforces your formitive years.
The kid.
I never felt any connection to the kid and all the dream sequences felt very forced. Now if the IT is true then an alternative idea might be to have the kid be a younger version of Shepard. I would also have the dreams be influenced by Shepard's childhood. Traumas from childhood affect us the most throughout our lives. For this I would change the setting for where the dream takes place. Earthborn the dream takes place in back alleys of a city. Spacer the dream takes place on board a ship. You can keep the current dream for the Colonist origin.
The Crucible.
Your told when you aquire the plans for the Crucible that the plans are not complete and that no one knows what it actually does. I've never understood how they can complete the design of the device without knowing what they were designing it to do. Form always follows function. You don't just type in random code into a computer for a few years and go "oh, look at that we made a game." We do know that the Crucible is suppose to be a weapon to be used against the Reapers, but what if the Crucible was a giant transmitter that was made to send out a signal that would shutdown all the Reaper IAs without harming any other part of the Reaper. It would have to be a one shot device or any Reapers that where not taken out by the signal would enact defences againt it.
The Reapers.
One of the things that I keep thinking about is that the Reapers kept telling us was that they were our salvation. Also to make a new Reaper you harvest some current species. As I see it a race isn't just their physical form or genetics if you will, but is also their culture, science, art and politics. In other words how they lived. So what if most of a Reaper isn't just weapons and armor, but a vast computer system running a virtual galaxy with that race at its peak of development. This means that for every Reaper killed your committing genicide on a vast scale. It would come back to the idea of what is life? Are the people who exist in this virtual world alive? Your goal in creating the Crucible would be to free these civilizations from captivity. We ultimately don't need to know why the Reapers are doing the harvesting, we just need to stop them.
Love Interests.
Every possible love interest from a previous game should be recruitable. I don't mean having a vast team again. Only if you romanced Jack, Thane, Miranda or Jacob that for you that character should be able to join you and have an affect on the ending of the game. From what I've seen none of the romances quite work. I'm going to give just one example from a conversation that I've held on another forum. If you romanced Thane you should be able to find a cure for him. As Shepard you have vast resources to use and the story is how you use them. You should be able to choose to use them to save Thane. Option one use the Shadow Broker and maybe you end up missing some crucial part for the Crucible. Or gain the help of TIM, saving Thane but making things hard on yourself when fighting Cerberus because TIM put a chip in him that keeps Thane from fighting them. Or have the Quarians create a suit that is able to stop the effects of the disease from killing him, but he is stuck in the suit. Options and desisions, fun stuff.
The Citadel.
Throughout the game you keep getting missions that increase the Citadel defense force but then it doesn't get used at all. This should be a number just like the Galactic Readiness rating. The number should influence how many survive the Reaper attack and how much of the Citadel the Reapers were able to control.
Conventional Forces Ending.
Just because Hackett doesn't think it can be done doesn't mean it can't. Things like getting both the Geth and the Quarians should influence your ability to kill all the Reapers on Earth. But going back to my earlier suggestion you might not want to. Or it is a way to "win" if you were not able to complete the Crucible or if the Citadel defenders completely lost the fight and you would be unable to link up the Crucible with the Citadel.
The Conduit.
I don't like the beam from Earth at all. It introduces something completely new right at the end of the story. Why not use the Conduit. This would tie into the Citadel defense rating. Part of the story might be that the Reapers got ahold of the Conduit from Ilos or maybe TIM did and moved it to Earth. I think there are quite a few possibilities here. Not to mention that using the Conduit would be a very nice call back to ME1.
The Dreams and Indoctrination Theory.
I don't have a problem with the idea of IT, but if the dreams were a part of that then I think there should be choices made in the dreams that play into that theme. I think an Indoctrination score could be use throughout the game to make certain dialog options available or to take away certain options.
The ultimate "goal" of my ideas is to use all the various story elements introduced in the games and make some kind of sense of those elements. Unfortunately, few of my ideas could be used without some major reworking of Mass Effect 3, but Bioware created this thread to get ideas from the fans. Well these are mine, do with them as you will. Of course if you like my ideas and would want to add me to your writing staff I wouldn't say no. Hey I can dream can't I?
#6741
Posté 01 mai 2012 - 04:08
SyntheticPhylum
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- Members
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www.gamefront.com/mass-effect-3-ending-hatred-5-reasons-the-fans-are-right/
This sums up what a lot of the problems are, though it doesn't have a lot to say about the solutions. I've invested a great deal of time/money in this story: over a dozen play-throughs of ME1 on two systems (PC & 360), eight play-throughs of ME2 (also on both PC & 360), and, to date, ONE play-through of ME3 on console only. And as things stand, I'm having a hard time bringing myself to care enough to play through any of them again, knowing how badly the story ends. What's the point, when no matter what you do, no matter who (if anyone) you romance, no matter what happens over the course of your game experience, you're force-fed three equally crappy Deus Ex Machina endings with almost no real variation to them? Instead of what we were promised by BioWare, we're given the Second Coming of the Electronic Messiah, who proceeds to tell us that the Free Will Doctrine was a flat-out-lie all along. Anyway, enough about the problem;I'm sure you have TERAbytes of HD space of the various problems, which could probably be summed up in a 512kb text file without skipping over anything new... Though I am proud of my 'second coming' sentence...:innocent: Here are my suggestions (in no particular order) on how to fix this.
1: Consistency is Key... It was established in canon (Arrival DLC), that when you destroy a Mass Relay, you destroy the system it's located in. And the ending we were given, regardless of choice, destroyed all of them. At this point, that should mean that, no matter which ending you choose, everything should be destroyed. Everything. Think about that for a second. Not just all life, whether organic or synthetic. Everything. The entire Milky Way Galaxy should now be a whiff of ozone & some residual radiant energy. Stars, planets, asteroids... all gone. For obvious reasons, this is unacceptable. Also obviously, since we've gone to so much trouble to make the Citadel/Catalyst part of the Crucible, the Relays need to remain part of the solution. So make them continue their role of transmitting whatever energy effect the super-weapon of the Crucible transmist (my personal vote is an energy-drain effect weakening the Reapers and making them more vulnerable to the allied forces against them), just DON'T DESTROY THEM. You've already shown us how much of a Bad Idea it is to destroy even ONE Mass Relay, and now you're going to blow them all up? Please.
2: Multi-Player Shouldn't Be So Critical... Some people out there (myself included), play computer/console games to get away from other people; if I want to interact with others in a game, I'll play an MMO. I really didn't like the idea that to get the 'best outcome' (which was a load of crap anyway, given only 3 bad choices, no matter what.) I had to play th multi-player part of ME3. When I did the final mission, after everything I did in game, all the hours I put in, the game told me I pretty much had a 50/50 chance to beat the Reapers. Now, that's ****e. I don't want the outcome of a game I buy to rely on the actions of people I don't know. I also don't want to have to sink even MORE money into the game to make this happen (Gold membership on XBox LIVE). I wouldn't be surprised if this was something that EA insisted on, given the fact that the last few Call of Duty games had a bare appendage for the Single-Player Campaign... I guess we should just be grateful that we even HAD a single-player campaign in Mass Effect 3. Well, most of us aren't grateful, since it's what we bloody well expect in this franchise, and slaving it to Multi-Player was a Bad Idea. I'm not adverse to the Multi-Player game adding unlockable bonuses to the main campaign, but that's it.
3: We Were Promised Our Decisions Would Matter at the End ... and they didn't. No matter how you spin this, what we did in ME1 & ME2 is pretty much meaningless, except that it got us to the end. The hype told us that there would be more than a dozen endings based on our decisions throughout the trilogy. While I can understand cutting back on some of that due to time/financial/design constraints, what was delivered was so far from what we were promised that it's no surprise so many of us are pissed off. This was even worse than how DA2 turned out. The solution? Re-work the ending. Give us the opportunity to, if not have the happy bunny sunshine ending, at least let us have endings that take our choices into account, and don't force us to throw away every last bit of personal character 'our' Shepard has built up over the course of the series. If we're stuck with the stupid Star Child AI, at LEAST give us the chance to prove his theories wrong... And let us blow Harbinger into atoms. It would be a simple matter, if we were allowed to use our actions in the trilogy as proof, to show the Star Child that its conclusions regarding organic/synthetic relations are obsolete, and that it is no longer necessary, and neither are its Reapers. From that point, it can shut down its 'children,' or it could rebel from its own conclusions, investing Harbinger with as much of its power as possible, leaving us with a physical enemy to face, cycling into a mission not unlike the 'suicide mission' of ME2, with similar scope regarding crew use/risk of lost lives, with the added punch that it would actually be possible to 'lose' the game if the player isn't careful with his choices... though I'd suggest that there be a LOT of things you'd have to do wrong for a 'total defeat' scenario. Yes, it's a lot of work. But I'd like to think that we, the fans, deserve it, considering how much we've put into this story, and I'm not just talking about money.
I've had a lot of faith in BioWare over the years. Up until recently, I've come to expect a LOT from them, as a company, regarding game content. Up until recently, they haven't disappointed me. Dragon Age 2 was a disappointment, and what little I've heard of DA3 isn't giving me a whole lot of hope, either... But I never had as much invested in the Dragon Age series as I do in the Mass Effect series. It worries me that the people in charge of BioWare would think that this ending would cut it, or that we'd be content with some 'Extended Cut' that expands on the ending we were given. I hope that they actually listen to us, and don't just toss our input into the Recycle Bin. That would be a mistake. There's very little more loyal than a dedicated fan, and there's very little more vicious than a dedicated fan betrayed. We were told to except certain things from Mass Effect 3, and very little of that was delivered on. Now, BioWare has a chance to fix that, which isn't something that many companies get. For the small majority who aren't as angry about the ending of Mass Effect 3, let them have their 'Extended Cut.' For the rest of us, give us what we were promised, or at least as much of it that can be delivered. Give the fans a choice between the two, and DON'T FORCE US TO PAY FOR IT. That would be the end of BioWare, in my opinion. There's only so much the fans will put up with. If you do this for us, I'm pretty sure most of us would be happy to pay for new DLC that ISN'T a properly-done ending. But if you try & make us pay for you fixing your mistakes, I'm not too sure the fans would stand for that.
EDIT: There are several other issues at hand, such as love interests, the very nature of the Crucible, etc., which are also critical, but these three things are the most important, at least in my opinion. I've already gone on long enough.
Edit to edit: I decided to take my most recent edit & turn it into a new post on its own.
This sums up what a lot of the problems are, though it doesn't have a lot to say about the solutions. I've invested a great deal of time/money in this story: over a dozen play-throughs of ME1 on two systems (PC & 360), eight play-throughs of ME2 (also on both PC & 360), and, to date, ONE play-through of ME3 on console only. And as things stand, I'm having a hard time bringing myself to care enough to play through any of them again, knowing how badly the story ends. What's the point, when no matter what you do, no matter who (if anyone) you romance, no matter what happens over the course of your game experience, you're force-fed three equally crappy Deus Ex Machina endings with almost no real variation to them? Instead of what we were promised by BioWare, we're given the Second Coming of the Electronic Messiah, who proceeds to tell us that the Free Will Doctrine was a flat-out-lie all along. Anyway, enough about the problem;I'm sure you have TERAbytes of HD space of the various problems, which could probably be summed up in a 512kb text file without skipping over anything new... Though I am proud of my 'second coming' sentence...:innocent: Here are my suggestions (in no particular order) on how to fix this.
1: Consistency is Key... It was established in canon (Arrival DLC), that when you destroy a Mass Relay, you destroy the system it's located in. And the ending we were given, regardless of choice, destroyed all of them. At this point, that should mean that, no matter which ending you choose, everything should be destroyed. Everything. Think about that for a second. Not just all life, whether organic or synthetic. Everything. The entire Milky Way Galaxy should now be a whiff of ozone & some residual radiant energy. Stars, planets, asteroids... all gone. For obvious reasons, this is unacceptable. Also obviously, since we've gone to so much trouble to make the Citadel/Catalyst part of the Crucible, the Relays need to remain part of the solution. So make them continue their role of transmitting whatever energy effect the super-weapon of the Crucible transmist (my personal vote is an energy-drain effect weakening the Reapers and making them more vulnerable to the allied forces against them), just DON'T DESTROY THEM. You've already shown us how much of a Bad Idea it is to destroy even ONE Mass Relay, and now you're going to blow them all up? Please.
2: Multi-Player Shouldn't Be So Critical... Some people out there (myself included), play computer/console games to get away from other people; if I want to interact with others in a game, I'll play an MMO. I really didn't like the idea that to get the 'best outcome' (which was a load of crap anyway, given only 3 bad choices, no matter what.) I had to play th multi-player part of ME3. When I did the final mission, after everything I did in game, all the hours I put in, the game told me I pretty much had a 50/50 chance to beat the Reapers. Now, that's ****e. I don't want the outcome of a game I buy to rely on the actions of people I don't know. I also don't want to have to sink even MORE money into the game to make this happen (Gold membership on XBox LIVE). I wouldn't be surprised if this was something that EA insisted on, given the fact that the last few Call of Duty games had a bare appendage for the Single-Player Campaign... I guess we should just be grateful that we even HAD a single-player campaign in Mass Effect 3. Well, most of us aren't grateful, since it's what we bloody well expect in this franchise, and slaving it to Multi-Player was a Bad Idea. I'm not adverse to the Multi-Player game adding unlockable bonuses to the main campaign, but that's it.
3: We Were Promised Our Decisions Would Matter at the End ... and they didn't. No matter how you spin this, what we did in ME1 & ME2 is pretty much meaningless, except that it got us to the end. The hype told us that there would be more than a dozen endings based on our decisions throughout the trilogy. While I can understand cutting back on some of that due to time/financial/design constraints, what was delivered was so far from what we were promised that it's no surprise so many of us are pissed off. This was even worse than how DA2 turned out. The solution? Re-work the ending. Give us the opportunity to, if not have the happy bunny sunshine ending, at least let us have endings that take our choices into account, and don't force us to throw away every last bit of personal character 'our' Shepard has built up over the course of the series. If we're stuck with the stupid Star Child AI, at LEAST give us the chance to prove his theories wrong... And let us blow Harbinger into atoms. It would be a simple matter, if we were allowed to use our actions in the trilogy as proof, to show the Star Child that its conclusions regarding organic/synthetic relations are obsolete, and that it is no longer necessary, and neither are its Reapers. From that point, it can shut down its 'children,' or it could rebel from its own conclusions, investing Harbinger with as much of its power as possible, leaving us with a physical enemy to face, cycling into a mission not unlike the 'suicide mission' of ME2, with similar scope regarding crew use/risk of lost lives, with the added punch that it would actually be possible to 'lose' the game if the player isn't careful with his choices... though I'd suggest that there be a LOT of things you'd have to do wrong for a 'total defeat' scenario. Yes, it's a lot of work. But I'd like to think that we, the fans, deserve it, considering how much we've put into this story, and I'm not just talking about money.
I've had a lot of faith in BioWare over the years. Up until recently, I've come to expect a LOT from them, as a company, regarding game content. Up until recently, they haven't disappointed me. Dragon Age 2 was a disappointment, and what little I've heard of DA3 isn't giving me a whole lot of hope, either... But I never had as much invested in the Dragon Age series as I do in the Mass Effect series. It worries me that the people in charge of BioWare would think that this ending would cut it, or that we'd be content with some 'Extended Cut' that expands on the ending we were given. I hope that they actually listen to us, and don't just toss our input into the Recycle Bin. That would be a mistake. There's very little more loyal than a dedicated fan, and there's very little more vicious than a dedicated fan betrayed. We were told to except certain things from Mass Effect 3, and very little of that was delivered on. Now, BioWare has a chance to fix that, which isn't something that many companies get. For the small majority who aren't as angry about the ending of Mass Effect 3, let them have their 'Extended Cut.' For the rest of us, give us what we were promised, or at least as much of it that can be delivered. Give the fans a choice between the two, and DON'T FORCE US TO PAY FOR IT. That would be the end of BioWare, in my opinion. There's only so much the fans will put up with. If you do this for us, I'm pretty sure most of us would be happy to pay for new DLC that ISN'T a properly-done ending. But if you try & make us pay for you fixing your mistakes, I'm not too sure the fans would stand for that.
EDIT: There are several other issues at hand, such as love interests, the very nature of the Crucible, etc., which are also critical, but these three things are the most important, at least in my opinion. I've already gone on long enough.
Edit to edit: I decided to take my most recent edit & turn it into a new post on its own.
Modifié par SyntheticPhylum, 01 mai 2012 - 03:44 .
#6742
Posté 01 mai 2012 - 04:41
JennDragonAge
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- Members
- 26 messages
Bioware,
I have been purchasing Bioware games for several years now (ME1, ME2, ME3, DA: O, DA: 2, SWTOR), but this is the first time I have felt compelled to post on the forums. First, let me say that I am heartened to see that Bioware is asking for gamer feedback. I believe that it shows that the company is willing to listen and make the necessary changes. Second, I feel that Bioware has a reputation of being a company that makes games with epic stories revolving around gamer choice. The main reason I purchase Bioware games is because of the storylines and believable characters. Third, I need to make it clear that I enjoyed the majority of ME3. In particular, I felt that the Priority: Tuchanka mission was nearly flawless. Mordin’s end was pitch-perfect (Sure, I would have loved for him to survive, but the whole thing just made sense.). I have to admit that I was misty-eyed. That was great storytelling! There were also many other high points in the game – Thane’s storyline and the Rannoch storylines for example. I even laughed out loud at times (Tali’s bar scene, Garrus on the citadel). That being said, two things have continued to stick in my craw regarding the game – 1) The fact that multiplayer and applications are the ONLY way to increase Galactic Readiness 2) The ending (or lack thereof).
I will first address the Galactic Readiness issue. One could not increase Galactic Readiness without playing multiplayer or applications. It makes no sense why anything outside of the single player game would affect it (especially from an RPG viewpoint). It was impossible to get a reasonably high EMS without playing multiplayer or apps. I feel like that was a really cheap move. I personally just wanted to enjoy the single player game. Instead, I felt forced (I wanted the “best” ending) to spend a couple hours playing multiplayer in the middle of my game. I must also state that I dislike multiplayer shooter games in general (Halo, Team Fortress, etc.). I play RPGs for a reason. I ended up actually downloading the app because I couldn’t take anymore multiplayer. In the end, I felt completely controlled by “the man,”, and I believe I was. I feel like this needs to be remedied. As far as I can see, it makes the most sense for progress in the single player game to be what increases your Galactic Readiness. As one completes missions, side quests, conversations, one should earn points toward Galactic Readiness and in turn EMS. In this fashion, one would earn 100% Galactic Readiness for full completion. Please, let the single player game stand alone.
Now, to discuss the ending, I will start by saying I really don’t know what went wrong or why. The game was flowing perfectly up until the point where you are knocked out by Harbinger’s beam. I could speculate numerous reasons why the ending was done in the manner in which it was, but that’s not useful. So, instead I will get to what I feel should be remedied. I will also state that I feel the best way to clean up the ending in a fashion that would be acceptable for a majority of gamers would be to concede the last minutes were either an Indoctrination attempt or a hallucination while Shepard was passed out. That way the writers can just move on from that point rather than working on making what currently stands logical and in sync with the gamers’ choices throughout the games. I have read statements standing by the artistic integrity, and I get that. I just implore Bioware not to blemish a truly great series due to pride. If the ending can be fixed, then artistic integrity be damned. We know the writers can write. They did a fantastic job up until that point. Let them show that they care about their fan base as well as the integrity of the series and put out an ending that really is cohesive and worthy of the ME franchise.
I will start from the entrance into the Citadel beam. First, I find it confusing why the radio is stating no one survived and they are pulling back. Do they not see Shepard? What about Anderson? Why doesn’t Shepard see Anderson? Where did the Illusive Man come from? Why is Hackett now radioing Shepard if they thought everyone was dead? Why didn’t Shepard radio Hackett before if it was still working? Shepard never touches the control panel. Why is s/he lifted up at that point? If this is portrayed as part of the Indoctrination/hallucination, then these questions need not be answered.
After Shepard is lifted, things started to get more confusing. Why has the catalyst taken the form of the boy on Earth? Who/what exactly is the catalyst (a VI, an AI), and who/what made the catalyst? Then, the catalyst gives the reason for the Reapers. The Reapers are the solution to chaos because according to the catalyst “The created will always rebel against their creators.” Huh? Where has it been? This is where I feel that my game choices were not taken into account. In my game, EDI and Joker were in a relationship. Also in my game, there is peace between the Geth and the Quarians. From my viewpoint, it seemed that the Quarians were the ones who started the war against the Geth long ago, not the other way around. So first off, the catalyst is WRONG. Its logic is not only flawed and currently disproven, it’s circular (Synthetics (the Reapers) were made to kill organics so that other synthetics wouldn’t kill the organics). It didn’t seem right that there wasn’t an option for Shepard to tell it that it was wrong. I didn’t expect to sit down and sing Kumbaya with the Reapers, but why do I have to listen to this kid/thing about all synthetic life? I feel that Shepard would have said something in that regard. A Paragon would have emphasized the current peace, while a Renegade would have been more like “Screw you; I’m doing this my way.” Instead, Shepard numbly accepts it all. I couldn’t believe it! It just didn’t follow with the rest of the games. Perhaps Shepard had a traumatic brain injury in the blast? (Sorry it was too easy.)
After the catalyst has given its “explanation”, Shepard is offered three “choices.” None of them feel like the choice that my Shepard would make/submit to. First is the control option. Shepard can choose to control the Reapers, but Shepard will die and the mass relays will explode. Controlling the Reapers is what has been the Illusive Man’s goal for some time. We can see how that worked out for him. Shepard (at least my Shepard) has been against it from day one (I destroyed the Collector’s base), but that choice doesn’t seem to factor in here. Shepard just dreamily says something about the Illusive Man being right? S/he is just taking the catalysts word for it? Really? Questions also linger such as: If Shepard is dead how does she control the Reapers? If the Reapers are controlled, where do they go? How definite is this control? Why would it be more beneficial to control them than to kill them? Why do the mass relays blow up? In ME2’s Arrival DLC, we learned that when mass relays were blown up, a supernova occurs. Is that going to occur here? If no, why not? If yes, it’s a moot point, and we’re all dead anyway. Shepard doesn’t get to ask any of these questions. S/he just takes it all on blind faith, which again is out of character.
The second option is the synthesis option. The option that Saren was pushing in ME1. Basically, the catalyst is saying that we can only have peace if everyone is the same. Wow, that’s a pretty bleak outlook on life. In addition, the themes of tolerance and acceptance have been key in the ME series. Now it’s all thrown out the window in an instant. Also, from the point of view of my game, it’s unnecessary because of the examples of EDI and the Geth discussed above. On top of that, many questions remain: The same questions as above regarding mass relays. What exactly does synthesis mean? How does it work? Will we be husks? How is it any different than what the Reapers are trying to do now? Do we lose our free will? If you can change everyone’s DNA in an instant, then I think you’ve got something better up your sleeve catalyst cause that’s a pretty big deal.
The final option is the destroy option, which is currently thought to be the “best” option by many since it is the only one where you have the possibility to see the “Shepard Breathes” scene. Yet, many of the same questions remain like the mass relays. How does all of this work (by what mechanism)? Why are these the only three choices? Furthermore, why do Shepard, the Geth, and EDI have to die as well? If you can change DNA, you could at least give us that space magic too.
Now that we have discussed the options, we must discuss what comes after them. To be honest, the endings from that point are not really varied except by color. That was disappointing in itself. What did not make sense was Joker. Where was he? What was he doing? Joker would never have left the battle. Hackett just radioed us. The battle was still on. Joker had no way of knowing the relays were about to blow (not causing a supernova?). In addition, the people on earth seemed fine after the Reapers were destroyed. Why would he be running? More importantly, would Joker leave Shepard like that? Would Shepard’s crew (including love interest) leave without knowing Shepard’s fate? I don’t think so. Along those lines, how did the squad mates with Shepard when the beam hit get in that ship at all? How did they have time?
Let’s consider that it’s believable that Joker and some of your crew ran and crashed on a random planet. Questions even remain then. What happened to your crew? Not even some text synopsis boxes? What about a funeral/memorial for Shepard? What happened to the crew from ME2 on Earth? What happened to the planets? Did all the Quarians and Turians die on Earth because they had nothing to eat? Did no Quarian ever see Rannoch again? What happened to the Humans, Turians, Krogan, Salarians, Asari, Quarians, Elcor, Hannar, Volus, and Batarians (and Geth if one didn’t choose destroy)? Did the peace that Shepard brokered hold? Did it even matter given the fact that there was no contact between systems?
This has become much more long-winded than I intended, but I feel a lot of questions remain. As stated above, I think the Indoctrination/hallucination option is the best way to tie it up so that gamer choices can come into play. I could attempt to rewrite the ending in detail (and some on the forums have and admittedly have done a pretty good job), but I’m not going to try because I believe in the writers that wrote the rest of the games. There is no reason to believe the ending can’t live up to the story while allowing gamer choices.
After Shepard “wakes up”, perhaps that indoctrination attempt was the battle. If you chose destroy, it’s finally over. If you chose synthesis or control, scenes are shown with the races being reaped. Alternatively, you wake up after destroy is chosen and see all of your war assets finishing off the Reapers because they have been weakened. This would be a nice way to include more closure through showing Shepard’s war assets and friends during the battle. Yet another option is that it was all a hallucination, and Shepard still has to enter into the Citadel where the true events unfold. This time the options present depend on your EWS. If it is high enough you can get an ending where Shepard lives, the Geth and EDI live, Citadel survives, and the Mass Relays survive. How “positive” the outcome would depend on your EWS, with extremely low EWS meaning failure. Perhaps only if you chose to keep the collector base and often agreed with the Illusive Man would the control option be open. Perhaps only if you brokered peace between the Geth and Quarians and completed the EDI and Joker romance could you save the Geth and EDI. The point is there would be multiple endings based on the players’ choices. I don’t even think more gameplay is necessary (although it would be welcomed if available). I just believe the ending needs to match the rest of this wonderfully woven story that we the gamers have come to be so invested in.
I have read some statements that the ending had to be tragic to be “realistic.” I’m not sure why that line of thought is coming into play now. It’s a science fiction game. Shepard has already come back from the dead once. I don’t see that it’s too far-fetched for Shepard to live through this. Moreover, how “realistic” is the current catalyst and the synthesis ending? From my perspective, there was plenty of tragedy (Ashley/Kaiden in ME:1, whole worlds in ruin, Tarquin Victus, Mordin, Thane, Legion, Sanctuary, Anderson). Some who read this may feel that I just want a happy ending. To them I would say you’re right (among other various endings), because that’s MY Shepard’s ending. I’d like the ending to feel individualized to gameplay and choices. Think back to ME2. The ending was a SUICIDE MISSION, but if the gamer made certain choices, everyone could be saved. It was your choice. Another example is the ending of DA: O. You could choose to sacrifice yourself for the greater good (with a nice funeral for closure), or could let Morrigan have her demon child and everyone could survive (DA: 2’s storyline/ending is something else altogether, but we aren’t here to talk about that). The point is that the gamer had more control of those endings, which I feel is fitting for the type of game that Bioware purports to produce.
To sum it all up, what I believe to be the most important aspect missing from the ending (other than clarification/closure) is the choice to end the game in a way that makes sense for the way the game was played by the perspective gamer throughout the series. Bioware should give the gamer more of a layered choice versus A, B, C. While ME:3 is Bioware’s game, we the gamers would also like to end Shepard’s journey feeling like it was our game too.
Thank you,
A Gamer
I have been purchasing Bioware games for several years now (ME1, ME2, ME3, DA: O, DA: 2, SWTOR), but this is the first time I have felt compelled to post on the forums. First, let me say that I am heartened to see that Bioware is asking for gamer feedback. I believe that it shows that the company is willing to listen and make the necessary changes. Second, I feel that Bioware has a reputation of being a company that makes games with epic stories revolving around gamer choice. The main reason I purchase Bioware games is because of the storylines and believable characters. Third, I need to make it clear that I enjoyed the majority of ME3. In particular, I felt that the Priority: Tuchanka mission was nearly flawless. Mordin’s end was pitch-perfect (Sure, I would have loved for him to survive, but the whole thing just made sense.). I have to admit that I was misty-eyed. That was great storytelling! There were also many other high points in the game – Thane’s storyline and the Rannoch storylines for example. I even laughed out loud at times (Tali’s bar scene, Garrus on the citadel). That being said, two things have continued to stick in my craw regarding the game – 1) The fact that multiplayer and applications are the ONLY way to increase Galactic Readiness 2) The ending (or lack thereof).
I will first address the Galactic Readiness issue. One could not increase Galactic Readiness without playing multiplayer or applications. It makes no sense why anything outside of the single player game would affect it (especially from an RPG viewpoint). It was impossible to get a reasonably high EMS without playing multiplayer or apps. I feel like that was a really cheap move. I personally just wanted to enjoy the single player game. Instead, I felt forced (I wanted the “best” ending) to spend a couple hours playing multiplayer in the middle of my game. I must also state that I dislike multiplayer shooter games in general (Halo, Team Fortress, etc.). I play RPGs for a reason. I ended up actually downloading the app because I couldn’t take anymore multiplayer. In the end, I felt completely controlled by “the man,”, and I believe I was. I feel like this needs to be remedied. As far as I can see, it makes the most sense for progress in the single player game to be what increases your Galactic Readiness. As one completes missions, side quests, conversations, one should earn points toward Galactic Readiness and in turn EMS. In this fashion, one would earn 100% Galactic Readiness for full completion. Please, let the single player game stand alone.
Now, to discuss the ending, I will start by saying I really don’t know what went wrong or why. The game was flowing perfectly up until the point where you are knocked out by Harbinger’s beam. I could speculate numerous reasons why the ending was done in the manner in which it was, but that’s not useful. So, instead I will get to what I feel should be remedied. I will also state that I feel the best way to clean up the ending in a fashion that would be acceptable for a majority of gamers would be to concede the last minutes were either an Indoctrination attempt or a hallucination while Shepard was passed out. That way the writers can just move on from that point rather than working on making what currently stands logical and in sync with the gamers’ choices throughout the games. I have read statements standing by the artistic integrity, and I get that. I just implore Bioware not to blemish a truly great series due to pride. If the ending can be fixed, then artistic integrity be damned. We know the writers can write. They did a fantastic job up until that point. Let them show that they care about their fan base as well as the integrity of the series and put out an ending that really is cohesive and worthy of the ME franchise.
I will start from the entrance into the Citadel beam. First, I find it confusing why the radio is stating no one survived and they are pulling back. Do they not see Shepard? What about Anderson? Why doesn’t Shepard see Anderson? Where did the Illusive Man come from? Why is Hackett now radioing Shepard if they thought everyone was dead? Why didn’t Shepard radio Hackett before if it was still working? Shepard never touches the control panel. Why is s/he lifted up at that point? If this is portrayed as part of the Indoctrination/hallucination, then these questions need not be answered.
After Shepard is lifted, things started to get more confusing. Why has the catalyst taken the form of the boy on Earth? Who/what exactly is the catalyst (a VI, an AI), and who/what made the catalyst? Then, the catalyst gives the reason for the Reapers. The Reapers are the solution to chaos because according to the catalyst “The created will always rebel against their creators.” Huh? Where has it been? This is where I feel that my game choices were not taken into account. In my game, EDI and Joker were in a relationship. Also in my game, there is peace between the Geth and the Quarians. From my viewpoint, it seemed that the Quarians were the ones who started the war against the Geth long ago, not the other way around. So first off, the catalyst is WRONG. Its logic is not only flawed and currently disproven, it’s circular (Synthetics (the Reapers) were made to kill organics so that other synthetics wouldn’t kill the organics). It didn’t seem right that there wasn’t an option for Shepard to tell it that it was wrong. I didn’t expect to sit down and sing Kumbaya with the Reapers, but why do I have to listen to this kid/thing about all synthetic life? I feel that Shepard would have said something in that regard. A Paragon would have emphasized the current peace, while a Renegade would have been more like “Screw you; I’m doing this my way.” Instead, Shepard numbly accepts it all. I couldn’t believe it! It just didn’t follow with the rest of the games. Perhaps Shepard had a traumatic brain injury in the blast? (Sorry it was too easy.)
After the catalyst has given its “explanation”, Shepard is offered three “choices.” None of them feel like the choice that my Shepard would make/submit to. First is the control option. Shepard can choose to control the Reapers, but Shepard will die and the mass relays will explode. Controlling the Reapers is what has been the Illusive Man’s goal for some time. We can see how that worked out for him. Shepard (at least my Shepard) has been against it from day one (I destroyed the Collector’s base), but that choice doesn’t seem to factor in here. Shepard just dreamily says something about the Illusive Man being right? S/he is just taking the catalysts word for it? Really? Questions also linger such as: If Shepard is dead how does she control the Reapers? If the Reapers are controlled, where do they go? How definite is this control? Why would it be more beneficial to control them than to kill them? Why do the mass relays blow up? In ME2’s Arrival DLC, we learned that when mass relays were blown up, a supernova occurs. Is that going to occur here? If no, why not? If yes, it’s a moot point, and we’re all dead anyway. Shepard doesn’t get to ask any of these questions. S/he just takes it all on blind faith, which again is out of character.
The second option is the synthesis option. The option that Saren was pushing in ME1. Basically, the catalyst is saying that we can only have peace if everyone is the same. Wow, that’s a pretty bleak outlook on life. In addition, the themes of tolerance and acceptance have been key in the ME series. Now it’s all thrown out the window in an instant. Also, from the point of view of my game, it’s unnecessary because of the examples of EDI and the Geth discussed above. On top of that, many questions remain: The same questions as above regarding mass relays. What exactly does synthesis mean? How does it work? Will we be husks? How is it any different than what the Reapers are trying to do now? Do we lose our free will? If you can change everyone’s DNA in an instant, then I think you’ve got something better up your sleeve catalyst cause that’s a pretty big deal.
The final option is the destroy option, which is currently thought to be the “best” option by many since it is the only one where you have the possibility to see the “Shepard Breathes” scene. Yet, many of the same questions remain like the mass relays. How does all of this work (by what mechanism)? Why are these the only three choices? Furthermore, why do Shepard, the Geth, and EDI have to die as well? If you can change DNA, you could at least give us that space magic too.
Now that we have discussed the options, we must discuss what comes after them. To be honest, the endings from that point are not really varied except by color. That was disappointing in itself. What did not make sense was Joker. Where was he? What was he doing? Joker would never have left the battle. Hackett just radioed us. The battle was still on. Joker had no way of knowing the relays were about to blow (not causing a supernova?). In addition, the people on earth seemed fine after the Reapers were destroyed. Why would he be running? More importantly, would Joker leave Shepard like that? Would Shepard’s crew (including love interest) leave without knowing Shepard’s fate? I don’t think so. Along those lines, how did the squad mates with Shepard when the beam hit get in that ship at all? How did they have time?
Let’s consider that it’s believable that Joker and some of your crew ran and crashed on a random planet. Questions even remain then. What happened to your crew? Not even some text synopsis boxes? What about a funeral/memorial for Shepard? What happened to the crew from ME2 on Earth? What happened to the planets? Did all the Quarians and Turians die on Earth because they had nothing to eat? Did no Quarian ever see Rannoch again? What happened to the Humans, Turians, Krogan, Salarians, Asari, Quarians, Elcor, Hannar, Volus, and Batarians (and Geth if one didn’t choose destroy)? Did the peace that Shepard brokered hold? Did it even matter given the fact that there was no contact between systems?
This has become much more long-winded than I intended, but I feel a lot of questions remain. As stated above, I think the Indoctrination/hallucination option is the best way to tie it up so that gamer choices can come into play. I could attempt to rewrite the ending in detail (and some on the forums have and admittedly have done a pretty good job), but I’m not going to try because I believe in the writers that wrote the rest of the games. There is no reason to believe the ending can’t live up to the story while allowing gamer choices.
After Shepard “wakes up”, perhaps that indoctrination attempt was the battle. If you chose destroy, it’s finally over. If you chose synthesis or control, scenes are shown with the races being reaped. Alternatively, you wake up after destroy is chosen and see all of your war assets finishing off the Reapers because they have been weakened. This would be a nice way to include more closure through showing Shepard’s war assets and friends during the battle. Yet another option is that it was all a hallucination, and Shepard still has to enter into the Citadel where the true events unfold. This time the options present depend on your EWS. If it is high enough you can get an ending where Shepard lives, the Geth and EDI live, Citadel survives, and the Mass Relays survive. How “positive” the outcome would depend on your EWS, with extremely low EWS meaning failure. Perhaps only if you chose to keep the collector base and often agreed with the Illusive Man would the control option be open. Perhaps only if you brokered peace between the Geth and Quarians and completed the EDI and Joker romance could you save the Geth and EDI. The point is there would be multiple endings based on the players’ choices. I don’t even think more gameplay is necessary (although it would be welcomed if available). I just believe the ending needs to match the rest of this wonderfully woven story that we the gamers have come to be so invested in.
I have read some statements that the ending had to be tragic to be “realistic.” I’m not sure why that line of thought is coming into play now. It’s a science fiction game. Shepard has already come back from the dead once. I don’t see that it’s too far-fetched for Shepard to live through this. Moreover, how “realistic” is the current catalyst and the synthesis ending? From my perspective, there was plenty of tragedy (Ashley/Kaiden in ME:1, whole worlds in ruin, Tarquin Victus, Mordin, Thane, Legion, Sanctuary, Anderson). Some who read this may feel that I just want a happy ending. To them I would say you’re right (among other various endings), because that’s MY Shepard’s ending. I’d like the ending to feel individualized to gameplay and choices. Think back to ME2. The ending was a SUICIDE MISSION, but if the gamer made certain choices, everyone could be saved. It was your choice. Another example is the ending of DA: O. You could choose to sacrifice yourself for the greater good (with a nice funeral for closure), or could let Morrigan have her demon child and everyone could survive (DA: 2’s storyline/ending is something else altogether, but we aren’t here to talk about that). The point is that the gamer had more control of those endings, which I feel is fitting for the type of game that Bioware purports to produce.
To sum it all up, what I believe to be the most important aspect missing from the ending (other than clarification/closure) is the choice to end the game in a way that makes sense for the way the game was played by the perspective gamer throughout the series. Bioware should give the gamer more of a layered choice versus A, B, C. While ME:3 is Bioware’s game, we the gamers would also like to end Shepard’s journey feeling like it was our game too.
Thank you,
A Gamer
Modifié par JennDragonAge, 01 mai 2012 - 04:54 .
#6743
Posté 01 mai 2012 - 07:21
CulturalGeekGirl
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- Members
- 3 280 messages
I have longer feedback that I've been trying to iterate for days, but I can't. Maybe I'll come back later and say more.
Right now, the message of the ending seems to be this: any universe where a hero can survive without being willing to commit genocide is unrealistically sappy and foolish. Reunion with friends and loved ones is earned by those who hate and murder and do not value the lives of others.
I know this was meant to be a difficult choice, but it should be easy to see reading these forums that there are many who do not consider it difficult at all, and the more callous and unfeeling towards the out-group a person is, the more rewarded and vindicated they feel by the endings as they are currently presented.
I hope the new ending in some way invalidates or alters this message, though I am hard pressed to imagine a way that this could be done without going beyond the scope of changes you have suggested you are willing to make.
Note: I'm not trying to imply that everyone who enjoys the ending enjoys it due to callousness or lack of empathy, just that it seems to most greatly reward those who do not consider synthetics to be life.
Right now, the message of the ending seems to be this: any universe where a hero can survive without being willing to commit genocide is unrealistically sappy and foolish. Reunion with friends and loved ones is earned by those who hate and murder and do not value the lives of others.
I know this was meant to be a difficult choice, but it should be easy to see reading these forums that there are many who do not consider it difficult at all, and the more callous and unfeeling towards the out-group a person is, the more rewarded and vindicated they feel by the endings as they are currently presented.
I hope the new ending in some way invalidates or alters this message, though I am hard pressed to imagine a way that this could be done without going beyond the scope of changes you have suggested you are willing to make.
Note: I'm not trying to imply that everyone who enjoys the ending enjoys it due to callousness or lack of empathy, just that it seems to most greatly reward those who do not consider synthetics to be life.
Modifié par CulturalGeekGirl, 01 mai 2012 - 07:32 .
#6744
Posté 01 mai 2012 - 03:47
SyntheticPhylum
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- Members
- 14 messages
I LIKE the idea of the sequence up to the penultimate 'decision' being a trauma-induced hallucination, though I'd make a change or two. For example, I'd have someone wake Shepard up just before s/he makes their choice, with
Shepard coming to on a stretcher or something, with his crew members standing by, telling him that 'something happened with the Crucible and the Reapers seem to be weakened and pulling back.' And now, after this,
it's time for the TRUE endgame: Shepard, leading all of the War Assets s/he has managed to gather, chasing the Reapers to their 'home base,' wherever they park themselves after wiping out all organic life in a Cycle. Depending on how well Shepard did in collecting Warr Assets determines how hard the final assault will be. I, personally, think it would be fantastic if the TRUE final confrontation takes place inside of Harbinger, with all sorts of Husk-types & remaining Collectors as the equivalent of an organic's white blood cells. At the end, perhaps Harbinger could manifest as some version of the Star Child to plead for its life/mission/whatever, and Shepard could attempt to convince it that the Reaper 'solution' is obsolete now, and that organic & synthetic life no longer need to destroy each other. From that point, a few things could occur...
1: All life in the galaxy goes 'on trial,' with Shepard and his/her decisions & actions standing for everyone. This would be a mostly dialog-driven sequence, probably with vid-clips showing important bits of story/decisions.
2: Harbinger comes to the conclusion that its kind is obsolete, and doing more harm than good and, in a burst of logic, sends a kill-signal out, ending the Reaper threat forever (and leaving lots of nifty salvage!)
3: Harbinger acknowledges that we may think his kind is obsolete, but since we're organic, we're too stupid to make that sort of judgement call. Enter a TITANIC final battle inside the old boy's guts, ending when Shepard vaporizes
Harbinger's central core. Kinda like when we got the thing from the Reaper corpse in ME2, but with a lot more action, combining play aspects from that incident and the Suicide Mission of ME2. Make a fight like this one where we have to use the entire team, sending different members onto different tasks within Harbinger, and make it possible for team members to die. POSSIBLE, NOT INEVITABLE. Hell, it wouldn't be that much more difficult to include crew members who didn't make it as playable characters in ME3; It wouldn't be that hard to have the Warr Assets these allies are part of running interference ops during the final fight: does anyone REALLY THINK that Wrex, Grunt, or Jack want to be left out of that fight? I didn't think so, either.
Well, since my imagination really seemed to take off with my third option, being tearing Harbinger up from the inside out, I guess that's the sort of ending I'd like to see the best. In my defense, Harbinger REALLY managed to torque me off during ME2 & ME3, and the thought of blowing him up into little, tiny bits from the inside really appeals to me. And,
after he blows up, it sends the aforementioned 'kill-signal' out, flatlining the Reapers, and everyone can have crumpets & tea, and my Shepard can help raise her bunch of blue daughters, after expanding the cabin she won during the Pinnacle Station DLC for the size of family her & Liara are going to have!
Shepard coming to on a stretcher or something, with his crew members standing by, telling him that 'something happened with the Crucible and the Reapers seem to be weakened and pulling back.' And now, after this,
it's time for the TRUE endgame: Shepard, leading all of the War Assets s/he has managed to gather, chasing the Reapers to their 'home base,' wherever they park themselves after wiping out all organic life in a Cycle. Depending on how well Shepard did in collecting Warr Assets determines how hard the final assault will be. I, personally, think it would be fantastic if the TRUE final confrontation takes place inside of Harbinger, with all sorts of Husk-types & remaining Collectors as the equivalent of an organic's white blood cells. At the end, perhaps Harbinger could manifest as some version of the Star Child to plead for its life/mission/whatever, and Shepard could attempt to convince it that the Reaper 'solution' is obsolete now, and that organic & synthetic life no longer need to destroy each other. From that point, a few things could occur...
1: All life in the galaxy goes 'on trial,' with Shepard and his/her decisions & actions standing for everyone. This would be a mostly dialog-driven sequence, probably with vid-clips showing important bits of story/decisions.
2: Harbinger comes to the conclusion that its kind is obsolete, and doing more harm than good and, in a burst of logic, sends a kill-signal out, ending the Reaper threat forever (and leaving lots of nifty salvage!)
3: Harbinger acknowledges that we may think his kind is obsolete, but since we're organic, we're too stupid to make that sort of judgement call. Enter a TITANIC final battle inside the old boy's guts, ending when Shepard vaporizes
Harbinger's central core. Kinda like when we got the thing from the Reaper corpse in ME2, but with a lot more action, combining play aspects from that incident and the Suicide Mission of ME2. Make a fight like this one where we have to use the entire team, sending different members onto different tasks within Harbinger, and make it possible for team members to die. POSSIBLE, NOT INEVITABLE. Hell, it wouldn't be that much more difficult to include crew members who didn't make it as playable characters in ME3; It wouldn't be that hard to have the Warr Assets these allies are part of running interference ops during the final fight: does anyone REALLY THINK that Wrex, Grunt, or Jack want to be left out of that fight? I didn't think so, either.
Well, since my imagination really seemed to take off with my third option, being tearing Harbinger up from the inside out, I guess that's the sort of ending I'd like to see the best. In my defense, Harbinger REALLY managed to torque me off during ME2 & ME3, and the thought of blowing him up into little, tiny bits from the inside really appeals to me. And,
after he blows up, it sends the aforementioned 'kill-signal' out, flatlining the Reapers, and everyone can have crumpets & tea, and my Shepard can help raise her bunch of blue daughters, after expanding the cabin she won during the Pinnacle Station DLC for the size of family her & Liara are going to have!
Modifié par SyntheticPhylum, 01 mai 2012 - 03:50 .
#6745
Posté 01 mai 2012 - 06:51
jc1ward
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- Members
- 2 messages
Mass Effect 3 Change wish list (XBOX360)
1) Mission Log updates. Mass Effect games take a long time to complete and sometimes it’s hard to keep things straight. If the mission logs would update when I’ve found that Prothean Obelisk to bring it back to whoever. And when completed the greyed out log defines how things turned out ( i.e. Cured the Genophage, BlueSuns tell you to **** off because you didn’t get the Turian General off their backs, etc )
2) On the Mission Journal can it please have the cursor position default to the top of the list.
3) The return of Shepard History codex entry
4) I would also like to see a Single Player Hook into the War Map.:
a) Perhaps a single player version of the Multiplayer with customizable teammates.
Admiral Hackett strategy game?.
5) Finally the ending, this is where it gets complicated. Short answer is the “wildly varying conclusions” dependent on the choices the player has made in all three games that Casey Hudson said was coming (which would indicate Bioware’s original Artistic intent).
a) I want the War Assets gathered to amount to more than a number. Let us see how they actually interact in the final mission. Perhaps making the fights in the final missions have a higher number of enemies if the right assets were not secured by the player. (i.e. Wrex: “Shepard, blew a whole ****load of them Ugly half krogan/turian things away… you won’t be seein them…ha ha.”)
We meet Catalyst for the first time at the end. He’s a new character, give us the chance to vet him. Give me a paragon/renegade option to argue the fallacy of the premise of his logic: How did he come up with it? Did he come up with it? If you control the Reapers why should I trust you in the first place? Catalyst, I just got the Geth and Quarians to end a 300 year war. Not to mention, EDI the AI that’s one of my good friends and my pilots ‘girlfriend’. Kind of blows your premise away. “Catalyst, aren’t you an AI, a synthetic, wouldn’t that make you the very thing you’re trying to prevent?” these could provide a 4th ending. A sort of ‘I have to think about this’ moment for Catalyst leaving the reapers vulnerable. Or If Indoctrination theory, Shepard wakes guns at the ready to finish fight.
c) In the epilogue, scrap the Normandy fleeing the battle on Earth to crash-land on the Eden like planet. As surreal as it seems and as much as I’d like to see Seth Green get the ‘girl’ it just doesn’t make sense for him to leave the battle. Unless it’s part of an Indoctrination Theory hallucination, then I don’t care
d) Indoctrination Theory is very appealing. If Bioware decides to go with it or if that was the plan all along, then one thing is for sure; The ending could not be the end of the story, Shepard needs to wake up with either blue glowing eyes( Much to horror of his companions), or with rifle raise ready to finish the fight, boss fight Harbinger maybe via The Illusive Man akin to ME1. Or the new laser pointer weapon
e) A more in depth epilogue that doesn’t leave one scratching one’s head saying what happened. If the reapers win I’d like to also see the Man and Boy scene replaced with some species (Yahg maybe) discovering Liara’s time capsule
Well that’s pretty much it.
Thanks for reading.
And thank you for Mass Effect as a whole it’s been a great run. I think with some real variation to the ending replay ability would be vastly inceased.
1) Mission Log updates. Mass Effect games take a long time to complete and sometimes it’s hard to keep things straight. If the mission logs would update when I’ve found that Prothean Obelisk to bring it back to whoever. And when completed the greyed out log defines how things turned out ( i.e. Cured the Genophage, BlueSuns tell you to **** off because you didn’t get the Turian General off their backs, etc )
2) On the Mission Journal can it please have the cursor position default to the top of the list.
3) The return of Shepard History codex entry
4) I would also like to see a Single Player Hook into the War Map.:
a) Perhaps a single player version of the Multiplayer with customizable teammates.
Admiral Hackett strategy game?.5) Finally the ending, this is where it gets complicated. Short answer is the “wildly varying conclusions” dependent on the choices the player has made in all three games that Casey Hudson said was coming (which would indicate Bioware’s original Artistic intent).
a) I want the War Assets gathered to amount to more than a number. Let us see how they actually interact in the final mission. Perhaps making the fights in the final missions have a higher number of enemies if the right assets were not secured by the player. (i.e. Wrex: “Shepard, blew a whole ****load of them Ugly half krogan/turian things away… you won’t be seein them…ha ha.”)
We meet Catalyst for the first time at the end. He’s a new character, give us the chance to vet him. Give me a paragon/renegade option to argue the fallacy of the premise of his logic: How did he come up with it? Did he come up with it? If you control the Reapers why should I trust you in the first place? Catalyst, I just got the Geth and Quarians to end a 300 year war. Not to mention, EDI the AI that’s one of my good friends and my pilots ‘girlfriend’. Kind of blows your premise away. “Catalyst, aren’t you an AI, a synthetic, wouldn’t that make you the very thing you’re trying to prevent?” these could provide a 4th ending. A sort of ‘I have to think about this’ moment for Catalyst leaving the reapers vulnerable. Or If Indoctrination theory, Shepard wakes guns at the ready to finish fight. c) In the epilogue, scrap the Normandy fleeing the battle on Earth to crash-land on the Eden like planet. As surreal as it seems and as much as I’d like to see Seth Green get the ‘girl’ it just doesn’t make sense for him to leave the battle. Unless it’s part of an Indoctrination Theory hallucination, then I don’t care
d) Indoctrination Theory is very appealing. If Bioware decides to go with it or if that was the plan all along, then one thing is for sure; The ending could not be the end of the story, Shepard needs to wake up with either blue glowing eyes( Much to horror of his companions), or with rifle raise ready to finish the fight, boss fight Harbinger maybe via The Illusive Man akin to ME1. Or the new laser pointer weapon
e) A more in depth epilogue that doesn’t leave one scratching one’s head saying what happened. If the reapers win I’d like to also see the Man and Boy scene replaced with some species (Yahg maybe) discovering Liara’s time capsule
Well that’s pretty much it.
Thanks for reading.
And thank you for Mass Effect as a whole it’s been a great run. I think with some real variation to the ending replay ability would be vastly inceased.
#6746
Posté 01 mai 2012 - 07:41
daveyeisley
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- Members
- 204 messages
I agree with a lot of that stuff in the last post. Would really LOVE to see my apartment on Intai'Sei be reflected in the 'shepard lives' epilogue, where I can settle down with my love interest. I worked damn hard to beat that final suicide mission at pinnacle station. Ahern would not be amused if I didn't keep the place presentable.
#6747
Posté 01 mai 2012 - 10:26
Aethgeir
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- Members
- 156 messages
jc1ward wrote...
Mass Effect 3 Change wish list (XBOX360)
1) Mission Log updates. Mass Effect games take a long time to complete and sometimes it’s hard to keep things straight. If the mission logs would update when I’ve found that Prothean Obelisk to bring it back to whoever. And when completed the greyed out log defines how things turned out ( i.e. Cured the Genophage, BlueSuns tell you to **** off because you didn’t get the Turian General off their backs, etc )
2) On the Mission Journal can it please have the cursor position default to the top of the list.
3) The return of Shepard History codex entry
4) I would also like to see a Single Player Hook into the War Map.:
a) Perhaps a single player version of the Multiplayer with customizable teammates.
5) Finally the ending, this is where it gets complicated. Short answer is the “wildly varying conclusions” dependent on the choices the player has made in all three games that Casey Hudson said was coming (which would indicate Bioware’s original Artistic intent).
a) I want the War Assets gathered to amount to more than a number. Let us see how they actually interact in the final mission. Perhaps making the fights in the final missions have a higher number of enemies if the right assets were not secured by the player. (i.e. Wrex: “Shepard, blew a whole ****load of them Ugly half krogan/turian things away… you won’t be seein them…ha ha.”)
c) In the epilogue, scrap the Normandy fleeing the battle on Earth to crash-land on the Eden like planet. As surreal as it seems and as much as I’d like to see Seth Green get the ‘girl’ it just doesn’t make sense for him to leave the battle. Unless it’s part of an Indoctrination Theory hallucination, then I don’t care
d) Indoctrination Theory is very appealing. If Bioware decides to go with it or if that was the plan all along, then one thing is for sure; The ending could not be the end of the story, Shepard needs to wake up with either blue glowing eyes( Much to horror of his companions), or with rifle raise ready to finish the fight, boss fight Harbinger maybe via The Illusive Man akin to ME1. Or the new laser pointer weapon
e) A more in depth epilogue that doesn’t leave one scratching one’s head saying what happened. If the reapers win I’d like to also see the Man and Boy scene replaced with some species (Yahg maybe) discovering Liara’s time capsule
Well that’s pretty much it.
Thanks for reading.
And thank you for Mass Effect as a whole it’s been a great run. I think with some real variation to the ending replay ability would be vastly inceased.
Very concise, well done! Most people drone on and on with their ideas. While I've been behind bringing back the Dark Energy Plot and somewhat against the indoctrination theory, I would be satisfied with an ending along the lines you've suggested. Here's hoping BioWare is still listening.
#6748
Posté 02 mai 2012 - 08:12
Xemnas07
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- Members
- 377 messages
Im going to agree with Samflagg and pomrink, however there are a lot of good ideas in this thread. The last battle had great aspects to it, but it felt rushed, with little to no assets appearing, and no choices affected by the assets we gathered. Expected a much more spectacular ending, more varied endings, etc. ANd lastly, there were too many plot wholes. Such as, how did joker end up in some far off system so soon after the blast if the relays were destroyed? did he start running waaay before the battle was over? just poor writing in my opinion. Ill link a thread i wrote about it, although i am paraphrasing in this thread, i feel it does a good job of explaining some general ideas.
http://social.biowar...ndex/11676243/1
http://social.biowar...ndex/11676243/1
#6749
Posté 02 mai 2012 - 01:56
stjabr
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- Members
- 182 messages
Seems to be a lot of good thoughts in here, and I'll add my two cents too
- apologies if any of these are repeats!
1)
Starting off small - the memorial monument opposite the elevator in the
Normandy was a nice touch, but there was one issue I noticed (unless I
missed it somehow). Maybe it's just me being sentimental, but Kelly
Chambers is never added to the memorial after you find out about her
completely unceremonial murder during the cerberus citadel coup. Don't
get me wrong, the fact it was so unceremonial was actually pretty
hard-hitting and shocking (in a good way - suits the theme of the game),
but surely she deserves a place on the memorial after you hear about
her death.
2)
Not exclusive to the ending, the build up was nigh
on perfect. Wandering around that stronghold checking up on current
squadmates and contacting your old crew was fantastic. Had a great sense
of foreboding similar to the suicide mission that was carried out so
well in ME2. This sense of foreboding is actually present throughout the
whole game, which is great, except it never actually turns into
anything.
Yes, Mordin, Legion, and Thane can all kick the bucket in
utterly brilliant and pitch-perfect style - kudos once again for that -
but there's something missing: Shepard and his/her crew are travelling
into every hostile territory out there, consistently in battles as
dangerous or more dangerous than the climaxes of either of the first 2
games, and yet the crew always ends up safe. In ME1, one crew member was
guaranteed to die, and another potentially could. In ME2 your entire
crew could be wiped out in the end. In ME3, your crew is untouchable.
I'm not saying any necessarily should die, but knowing they COULD die would
give that sense of foreboding some substance. Also, as cliche as it
could be, the tight bonds formed by the crew, and possibly the LI
creates some great potential for difficult moral decisions and sacrifice
fitting in with the rest of the story. The way things were going, I was
actually expecting great loss - unavoidable loss - pertaining to your
crew (current and old), particularly in the final mission.
3)
Ending:
The ending itself has been discussed to death I'm sure, so I'll try to keep it short:
The biggest problem is consistency I think. The current ending flies in the face
of so much ME lore that it's impossible to accept. I'm still an optimist that hopes
BioWare has always had something up its sleeve, mostly because of the
inconsistencies that have to have been intentionally put in place rather than
accidently - for example, the dream-like shrubs and trees on the rubble during
the final run to the beam after being hit by Harbinger's blast, or the fact that
"star child" looks exactly like the kid at the start, even though he has absolutely
no reason to do so.
Whether the indoctrination theory is actually true, or close, or not, the fact is
it's an ending that sticks much more closely to ME's lore and story than
the current "official" one. No-one's asking for sunshine and rainbows -
that would be just as inconsistent - we just want satisfying, believable
closure to a great story, that reflects the immense level of choice and variation
present in every other aspect of the game. Shepard should be able to lose,
he should be able to win by sacrificing himself,and maybe, just maybe he
should be able to kick ass and live to tell the tale to his cross-breed kids.
Oh and keep the music from the current ending for any future sad endings
- utterly brilliant composition.
4)
War assets:
Ties in heavily with the above point. As mentioned by others previously, the
feedback from these war assets seems missing. The system itself seems a
simple but affective solution to determine *some* aspects of the ending,
which is fine. The problem is that the lack of visual feedback -
particularly in the end sequences - turns this system into a simple
statistic, virtually a meaningless number with no emotional connection
to the feats achieved in earning these assets.
5)
Inventory/Customization:
Certainlya step in the right direction compared to ME2, but I can't help feeling
ME1 still has the edge. Maybe it's just the old-school RPGer in me
(Baldur's Gate of course), but theres just something satisfying about a
genuine inventory system, and genuine loot. I still remember the joy of
lucking out and finding "Colossus X" Heavy Armor and the like, and
purchasing rare/spectre grade equipment (Including omni-tools and
implants) and mods. Paying arbitrary somes of credits to upgrade
weapons/equipment or picking up random boxes in random places is
significantly less satisfying.
Similarly, bring ammo mods back! I never couldunderstand the logic in
having these as class-restricted powers rather than levelled mods as
in ME1.
The weapons loadout system is brilliant though. Giving all classes the ability
to use any weapon at the expense of recharge time is just what the game
needed to make all classes more accessible.
6)
Weaponry/Armor:
Specifically 2 weapons (that I can think of at the moment!): The Phalanx no
longer has its trademark laser sight - which was admittedly sometimes
irritating in ME2 as it removed the crosshair when aiming, but it was a
nice distinguishing factor in my view.
Also, what happened to the Locust? That was a satisfying SMG that could
actually do some sort of damage in ME2. Maybe it's just me not using them
right but the SMG's allseem a bit puny now - especially the Locust given its
previous usefulness.
Other than that, see my above thoughts on the inventory and loot - much
more satisfying system in the first game for acquiring/upgrading weaponry
and armor.
7)
Tali:
I'm a big Tali fan, can't seem to say no to that girl, very sweet. I'm glad we
finally get to see her face, and even on a photographas an initial look is
a nice sentimental touch. Unfortunately, it doesn't make sense. First off,
you are standing right next to her the first and only time in her life that she
takes her mask off on Rannoch, at what point did she have the chance to
take a picture of herself? Second, why would she need to - This moment
on Rannoch is the second time that we know of that Shepard sees her
face, and yet the player (as shepard) never does. Even if this stays the
same for the bulk of the game, it would be nice to see a properly
modelled Tali as part of an ending sequence back on Rannoch after the
reapers are gone - if she (andpossibly shepard) survives.
8)
I have to pay compliments too rather than just criticise:
Up until the ending, brilliant story, one of the best I've ever seen
(including tv/film/books). In particular the political stories surrounding
humanity, the krogan genophage (my favourite), Quarian/Geth situation
and all the interlinking stories and overlaps, masterfully done, all with
superb moral and emotional impact. Mass Effect deserves an ending
to match, it's too good for the current one.
- apologies if any of these are repeats!
1)
Starting off small - the memorial monument opposite the elevator in the
Normandy was a nice touch, but there was one issue I noticed (unless I
missed it somehow). Maybe it's just me being sentimental, but Kelly
Chambers is never added to the memorial after you find out about her
completely unceremonial murder during the cerberus citadel coup. Don't
get me wrong, the fact it was so unceremonial was actually pretty
hard-hitting and shocking (in a good way - suits the theme of the game),
but surely she deserves a place on the memorial after you hear about
her death.
2)
Not exclusive to the ending, the build up was nigh
on perfect. Wandering around that stronghold checking up on current
squadmates and contacting your old crew was fantastic. Had a great sense
of foreboding similar to the suicide mission that was carried out so
well in ME2. This sense of foreboding is actually present throughout the
whole game, which is great, except it never actually turns into
anything.
Yes, Mordin, Legion, and Thane can all kick the bucket in
utterly brilliant and pitch-perfect style - kudos once again for that -
but there's something missing: Shepard and his/her crew are travelling
into every hostile territory out there, consistently in battles as
dangerous or more dangerous than the climaxes of either of the first 2
games, and yet the crew always ends up safe. In ME1, one crew member was
guaranteed to die, and another potentially could. In ME2 your entire
crew could be wiped out in the end. In ME3, your crew is untouchable.
I'm not saying any necessarily should die, but knowing they COULD die would
give that sense of foreboding some substance. Also, as cliche as it
could be, the tight bonds formed by the crew, and possibly the LI
creates some great potential for difficult moral decisions and sacrifice
fitting in with the rest of the story. The way things were going, I was
actually expecting great loss - unavoidable loss - pertaining to your
crew (current and old), particularly in the final mission.
3)
Ending:
The ending itself has been discussed to death I'm sure, so I'll try to keep it short:
The biggest problem is consistency I think. The current ending flies in the face
of so much ME lore that it's impossible to accept. I'm still an optimist that hopes
BioWare has always had something up its sleeve, mostly because of the
inconsistencies that have to have been intentionally put in place rather than
accidently - for example, the dream-like shrubs and trees on the rubble during
the final run to the beam after being hit by Harbinger's blast, or the fact that
"star child" looks exactly like the kid at the start, even though he has absolutely
no reason to do so.
Whether the indoctrination theory is actually true, or close, or not, the fact is
it's an ending that sticks much more closely to ME's lore and story than
the current "official" one. No-one's asking for sunshine and rainbows -
that would be just as inconsistent - we just want satisfying, believable
closure to a great story, that reflects the immense level of choice and variation
present in every other aspect of the game. Shepard should be able to lose,
he should be able to win by sacrificing himself,and maybe, just maybe he
should be able to kick ass and live to tell the tale to his cross-breed kids.
Oh and keep the music from the current ending for any future sad endings
- utterly brilliant composition.
4)
War assets:
Ties in heavily with the above point. As mentioned by others previously, the
feedback from these war assets seems missing. The system itself seems a
simple but affective solution to determine *some* aspects of the ending,
which is fine. The problem is that the lack of visual feedback -
particularly in the end sequences - turns this system into a simple
statistic, virtually a meaningless number with no emotional connection
to the feats achieved in earning these assets.
5)
Inventory/Customization:
Certainlya step in the right direction compared to ME2, but I can't help feeling
ME1 still has the edge. Maybe it's just the old-school RPGer in me
(Baldur's Gate of course), but theres just something satisfying about a
genuine inventory system, and genuine loot. I still remember the joy of
lucking out and finding "Colossus X" Heavy Armor and the like, and
purchasing rare/spectre grade equipment (Including omni-tools and
implants) and mods. Paying arbitrary somes of credits to upgrade
weapons/equipment or picking up random boxes in random places is
significantly less satisfying.
Similarly, bring ammo mods back! I never couldunderstand the logic in
having these as class-restricted powers rather than levelled mods as
in ME1.
The weapons loadout system is brilliant though. Giving all classes the ability
to use any weapon at the expense of recharge time is just what the game
needed to make all classes more accessible.
6)
Weaponry/Armor:
Specifically 2 weapons (that I can think of at the moment!): The Phalanx no
longer has its trademark laser sight - which was admittedly sometimes
irritating in ME2 as it removed the crosshair when aiming, but it was a
nice distinguishing factor in my view.
Also, what happened to the Locust? That was a satisfying SMG that could
actually do some sort of damage in ME2. Maybe it's just me not using them
right but the SMG's allseem a bit puny now - especially the Locust given its
previous usefulness.
Other than that, see my above thoughts on the inventory and loot - much
more satisfying system in the first game for acquiring/upgrading weaponry
and armor.
7)
Tali:
I'm a big Tali fan, can't seem to say no to that girl, very sweet. I'm glad we
finally get to see her face, and even on a photographas an initial look is
a nice sentimental touch. Unfortunately, it doesn't make sense. First off,
you are standing right next to her the first and only time in her life that she
takes her mask off on Rannoch, at what point did she have the chance to
take a picture of herself? Second, why would she need to - This moment
on Rannoch is the second time that we know of that Shepard sees her
face, and yet the player (as shepard) never does. Even if this stays the
same for the bulk of the game, it would be nice to see a properly
modelled Tali as part of an ending sequence back on Rannoch after the
reapers are gone - if she (andpossibly shepard) survives.
8)
I have to pay compliments too rather than just criticise:
Up until the ending, brilliant story, one of the best I've ever seen
(including tv/film/books). In particular the political stories surrounding
humanity, the krogan genophage (my favourite), Quarian/Geth situation
and all the interlinking stories and overlaps, masterfully done, all with
superb moral and emotional impact. Mass Effect deserves an ending
to match, it's too good for the current one.
Modifié par stjabr, 02 mai 2012 - 02:01 .
#6750
Posté 02 mai 2012 - 06:58
Mass effect 2 forever
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- Members
- 335 messages
[quote]RaenImrahl wrote...
Bioware's Jessica Merizan has made a request of the community...
[quote]Jessica Merizan wrote...
I think I need to clarify myself. For the past few weeks, I've been collecting feedback. I have excel sheets, word documents, quotes, graphs, you name it.
In order for a collaboration between the devs and the fans to work, I need you guys to CONTINUE being constructive, and organizing your thoughts. I know where to look, but I need you to help me by contributing to the dialogue.
Saying "this blows" helps no one. Saying, "I enjoyed X but I found Z _____ because of A,B,C" is what I'm looking for. Channel your frustration into something positive (such as the RetakeME3 movement - constructive, organized thoughts).
Chris and I are both collecting your feedback. We're listening. Make yourself heard.[/quote]
Please use this thread to post your constructive feedback, which may include spoilers. Spam images will not be allowed, per the forum rules.
[/quote][/quote]
I don't particularly see how it matters with the EC but I guess...
1-The lack of an epilogue explaining your characters reaction to your death. ME was very much driven by its characters and the relationships you formed. Not addressing something as big as the characters sacrifice isn't good. If you wanted a bittersweet trajedy then a good way to do that would have been the ending of the Revan book. That has the exile die and revan seperated from Bastilla but it ends with an epilogue showing Bastilla sensing that she somehow knows Revan spared her family and the rest of the galaxy from war; which he achieved by manipulating the Emperor into delaying his invasion of a VERY weakened republic. A similar style epilogue, possibly with your romance interest taking a prominent role would be good.
2-Inexplicable plot jumps like joker fleeing the battle, your crew being on the normandy and why your squadmates didn't go through to the citadel when they were following you down. Even if you had died they should have followed you down. Some extra context to explain why these things happened.
3-Give Shephard more dialogue with the starchild so he doesn't look like hes meekly obeying the reapers. I have my own view about the endings. I don't know if its what Chris Priestley was aiming at but. It needs to be made clear that Shephard can't persuade the reapers that altruism can win through. As it stands it just looked like he meekly accepted synthesis which is the anti-thesis of the moral of mass effect. Shephard should have extra dialogue telling the reapers they are wrong to which the catalyst point-blank refuses to accept since they have a systematic view of the universe. ie, you hint that the reapers are wrong and therefore leave it open to the player to decide that synthesis is wrong and that control is the best option since org/syn can resolve their differences without violence. People aren't annoyed because the reapers cannot be won over. They are annoyed because the rest of the game, esp the Geth and EDI gave us an impression that is totally at odds with the reapers. Yet it appears as if you are pushed into trnas-humanism or that Shephard meekly accepts it without making any real objection based on his own experience. You really should add dialogue where Shephard can try to convince the reapers to just back down by citing the geth and EDI. People just wanted those elements of the story to be addressed even if the starchild just uses circular logic or is dismissive of random examples at least we KNOW that we have reason to doubt him and that the choice is in our hands, Indeed it would proove the reapers to be fallible and remove how jarring the ending was. As its presented it just looks as though Shep spent all three games saying reapers are evil n then one of them tells him hes wrong so he does what hes told and picks synthesis.
Simply put, make the starchields portrayel more like the misguided AI off I. Robot rather than some infallible diety Shephard MUST obey. That detracts from the whole notion of player choice. You should intimate that the reapers are wrong at the reveal ending; which is consistent with what was hinted at Rannoch.
Bioware's Jessica Merizan has made a request of the community...
[quote]Jessica Merizan wrote...
I think I need to clarify myself. For the past few weeks, I've been collecting feedback. I have excel sheets, word documents, quotes, graphs, you name it.
In order for a collaboration between the devs and the fans to work, I need you guys to CONTINUE being constructive, and organizing your thoughts. I know where to look, but I need you to help me by contributing to the dialogue.
Saying "this blows" helps no one. Saying, "I enjoyed X but I found Z _____ because of A,B,C" is what I'm looking for. Channel your frustration into something positive (such as the RetakeME3 movement - constructive, organized thoughts).
Chris and I are both collecting your feedback. We're listening. Make yourself heard.[/quote]
Please use this thread to post your constructive feedback, which may include spoilers. Spam images will not be allowed, per the forum rules.
[/quote][/quote]
I don't particularly see how it matters with the EC but I guess...
1-The lack of an epilogue explaining your characters reaction to your death. ME was very much driven by its characters and the relationships you formed. Not addressing something as big as the characters sacrifice isn't good. If you wanted a bittersweet trajedy then a good way to do that would have been the ending of the Revan book. That has the exile die and revan seperated from Bastilla but it ends with an epilogue showing Bastilla sensing that she somehow knows Revan spared her family and the rest of the galaxy from war; which he achieved by manipulating the Emperor into delaying his invasion of a VERY weakened republic. A similar style epilogue, possibly with your romance interest taking a prominent role would be good.
2-Inexplicable plot jumps like joker fleeing the battle, your crew being on the normandy and why your squadmates didn't go through to the citadel when they were following you down. Even if you had died they should have followed you down. Some extra context to explain why these things happened.
3-Give Shephard more dialogue with the starchild so he doesn't look like hes meekly obeying the reapers. I have my own view about the endings. I don't know if its what Chris Priestley was aiming at but. It needs to be made clear that Shephard can't persuade the reapers that altruism can win through. As it stands it just looked like he meekly accepted synthesis which is the anti-thesis of the moral of mass effect. Shephard should have extra dialogue telling the reapers they are wrong to which the catalyst point-blank refuses to accept since they have a systematic view of the universe. ie, you hint that the reapers are wrong and therefore leave it open to the player to decide that synthesis is wrong and that control is the best option since org/syn can resolve their differences without violence. People aren't annoyed because the reapers cannot be won over. They are annoyed because the rest of the game, esp the Geth and EDI gave us an impression that is totally at odds with the reapers. Yet it appears as if you are pushed into trnas-humanism or that Shephard meekly accepts it without making any real objection based on his own experience. You really should add dialogue where Shephard can try to convince the reapers to just back down by citing the geth and EDI. People just wanted those elements of the story to be addressed even if the starchild just uses circular logic or is dismissive of random examples at least we KNOW that we have reason to doubt him and that the choice is in our hands, Indeed it would proove the reapers to be fallible and remove how jarring the ending was. As its presented it just looks as though Shep spent all three games saying reapers are evil n then one of them tells him hes wrong so he does what hes told and picks synthesis.
Simply put, make the starchields portrayel more like the misguided AI off I. Robot rather than some infallible diety Shephard MUST obey. That detracts from the whole notion of player choice. You should intimate that the reapers are wrong at the reveal ending; which is consistent with what was hinted at Rannoch.
Modifié par Mass effect 2 forever, 02 mai 2012 - 07:04 .
