where is my happy ending now I know little blue kids house with tali and so on I know a lot of people think that that is just being soft or whatever but there is more to it that that. If all three ending end in the same way IE shepherds death relay destroyed Normandy crash then what do I and other player have to work for?
DAO got it right there was always the choice to allow the PC to live but the cost (At least to me) was very high from a morel point of view. This could be the case for the Destroy choice. In my mind it would play out something like this.
War Assets 1000-1500
destroy earth and Normandy all synthetic life reapers die and shepherd live but at a very high cost.
War assets 2000-2500
same as above but earth is unharmed All synthetic life is destroyed shepherd lives
3000-3500
again same thing but the Normandy is OK
4000+
in all the other endings the mass relays are destroyed but this on is the golden ending as people have said where in the relays. Earth, Normandy and shepherd are fine but it still has the synthetic life being destroyed. To me this is far from a fairy tail ending but still give a happy ending of sorts.
Regardless of what ending the player picks have a dam epilogue even if it is just a sideshow with text boxes letting the player know what happened with the crew and places he/she visited and had an impact on.
Sorry about spelling and grammar dam Dispraxia oh well that’s what I think maybe you can take an outline from this. I hope my thoughts have provided some help and I hope you do something about this. I would hate it if such a grate game and even a grate franchise is over shadowed by this ending.
Anyway thanks for reading.
PS if shepherd lives it should show Him/her with love intrest.
Anyway thanks again and hope to see something come of this
ME3 Suggested Changes Feedback Thread - Spoilers Allowed
Débuté par
RaenImrahl
, mars 17 2012 03:00
Retour en haut
#1752
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 04:53
Vapaa
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OK so there a few things aside the ending
- the Quest journal is bad, seriously, just put back the quest journal from ME1/ME2 witch is really easy to read and really detailed
- Romance differencies, OK I know the "ship romances" are more complete than "exterior romances"....that doesn't mean some characters has to cheat on you ><
Yes it adds some depth to characters....but that also makes some romances as worthy and others as worthless
- Speaking of romances, no Tali or Ashley for Femshep ? whyyyyy ? *sadface* (well I don't mind, gibbed is my friend !)
Now on to the ending, here are the problems:
- Inconstitencies: the convniently placed "control placed that controls everything", Shepard breathing on earth while she was on the Citadel, the Normandy miraculously landing in the god-only-knows-where while it was on earth, TIM popping out of nowhere......hell everything after Shepard gets hit by the beam doesn't makes sense
Suggested changes: whatever you do, it has to makes sense, the WTF festival didn't serve whatever artistic value this ending was supposed too carry
- the Deus (Catalyst) ex machina (Citadel): It popped out from nowhere with no foreshadowing whatsoever and it's inconsistent with the whole ME1 plot, even worse it shares its apparence with the little boy witch: 1) doesn't makes sense, 2) starts getting on my nerves and sounds like unwelcomed pathos
Suggested changes: why not Harbinger ? it's a long-time "old friend" and conversations with Reapers are awesome (just see Sovereign in ME1, and Harbinger in Arrival), besides, everyone excpected to confront him, that was the best opportunity to do this
- the Choices: too few, too similar: synthesis (galaxy saved), control (galaxy doomed), and destroy (galaxy doomed), and they wipe out every single choice from ME1 and ME2
Suggested changes: MOAR choices, and more variations and balanced between each other, to fit in every Shepard's feet
- the Quest journal is bad, seriously, just put back the quest journal from ME1/ME2 witch is really easy to read and really detailed
- Romance differencies, OK I know the "ship romances" are more complete than "exterior romances"....that doesn't mean some characters has to cheat on you ><
Yes it adds some depth to characters....but that also makes some romances as worthy and others as worthless
- Speaking of romances, no Tali or Ashley for Femshep ? whyyyyy ? *sadface* (well I don't mind, gibbed is my friend !)
Now on to the ending, here are the problems:
- Inconstitencies: the convniently placed "control placed that controls everything", Shepard breathing on earth while she was on the Citadel, the Normandy miraculously landing in the god-only-knows-where while it was on earth, TIM popping out of nowhere......hell everything after Shepard gets hit by the beam doesn't makes sense
Suggested changes: whatever you do, it has to makes sense, the WTF festival didn't serve whatever artistic value this ending was supposed too carry
- the Deus (Catalyst) ex machina (Citadel): It popped out from nowhere with no foreshadowing whatsoever and it's inconsistent with the whole ME1 plot, even worse it shares its apparence with the little boy witch: 1) doesn't makes sense, 2) starts getting on my nerves and sounds like unwelcomed pathos
Suggested changes: why not Harbinger ? it's a long-time "old friend" and conversations with Reapers are awesome (just see Sovereign in ME1, and Harbinger in Arrival), besides, everyone excpected to confront him, that was the best opportunity to do this
- the Choices: too few, too similar: synthesis (galaxy saved), control (galaxy doomed), and destroy (galaxy doomed), and they wipe out every single choice from ME1 and ME2
Suggested changes: MOAR choices, and more variations and balanced between each other, to fit in every Shepard's feet
Modifié par Vapaä, 17 mars 2012 - 05:00 .
#1754
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 04:55
movieguyabw
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I see a couple people mentioning the slow motion bit, after being hit with Harbinger's beam. This is fine to keep in, but with a high enough EMS rating, there should be a way to bypass it, and play through the end of the game with all your armor, weapons, and squadmates intact.
Maybe you need 90% Galactic readiness, or something ridiculous, but it should be possible. Again, we shouldn't have to have such a depressing and bitter end if we do everything right. Having Shepard limp to the beam is just downright depressing. But it should be left in if we aren't fully prepared for the final battle.
Maybe you need 90% Galactic readiness, or something ridiculous, but it should be possible. Again, we shouldn't have to have such a depressing and bitter end if we do everything right. Having Shepard limp to the beam is just downright depressing. But it should be left in if we aren't fully prepared for the final battle.
#1755
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 04:56
Evan Belmont
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I think the indoctrination theory offers an easy and simple path to alternate endings and better closure without the need to actually change anything.
The current ending(s) could be expanded upon by adding short scenes that explain the otherwise unexplained things that are occurring.
-Why using the Crucible that was designed to destroy the reapers requires you to destroy one of the main components of the machine in order for it to destroy the reapers.
-Your crew making it onto the Normandy. The reason for the Normandy to escape at all. You see the Crucible wave wash across the planet and soldiers not even being knocked down by it. It seemed completely harmless to people. Why did Joker flip his lid and run like a crazed lunatic? Why did the crew go with him? Did he run because Shapard unwittingly destroyed the whole system with the Crucible causing the Relays to explode? This might be the oddest plot hole of all, and it should be explained.
-The damage caused by the Mass Relay explosions and the resulting situation.
-Having dialogue with the Catalyst that explains the origin of the Reapers would be wonderful. We don't need to know the origin of the Catalyst. Some level of speculation is great. We can be left wondering if this is a god, a VI from a civilization long past, a creation of the Reapers, creator of the Reapers, or something else. Leaving that to speculation would be great, but learning the origin of the Reapers at the end seems necessary at this point. That's actually what I thought one of the achievements was going to be about: Fact Finder, Discover an enemy's monstrous origin. That was a letdown when I realized it was about the banshees.
-Most importantly is that if people make the wrong choices before and during this ending and are unable to resist indoctrination, it needs to feel real and conclusive. Maybe for a moment after you've done your action at the Crucible someone snaps you out of it but by now it's too late and you get to see the terrible mistake you've made and the dire consequences. Fantastic "bad" ending.
If you make all the right choices, if you resist indoctrination, the cinematic plays that moves to Shepard lying in the concrete rubble of London and you guys can do whatever the hell you want from that point on. Bioware's writers have proven they're more than capable writers during the rest of the game and in the previous ones. I don't care if Shepard lives or dies ultimately, BUT if we could do the impossible and make every decision perfectly to create a scenario where he survives to see it through, that would make for a more whole experience. The most important thing is to remove plot holes and create closure. We need to see the results of our choices and actions.
Just some personal preferences:
-For the Rachni to be a major decision looming over us for all three games, the ultimate result was... underwhelming. They either become a simple number for war assets or they don't. For such a major decision they at least deserve some kind of short cut scene or cinematic (10 seconds would thrill me).
-The Illusive Man... Martin Sheen's performance gave me chills. The exit or conclusion of The Illusive Man should be more profound. Maybe in the end he could resist indoctrination long enough to do something important for the mission. Maybe the person who goes in and fixes something with the Crucible will ultimately die, and he goes and does it. Sad as that would be, I think it sends a feel good message about the power of human will. No, he couldn't reverse it or resist it completely, but he resisted it long enough to make his death matter because he believed so strongly in his cause.
The current ending(s) could be expanded upon by adding short scenes that explain the otherwise unexplained things that are occurring.
-Why using the Crucible that was designed to destroy the reapers requires you to destroy one of the main components of the machine in order for it to destroy the reapers.
-Your crew making it onto the Normandy. The reason for the Normandy to escape at all. You see the Crucible wave wash across the planet and soldiers not even being knocked down by it. It seemed completely harmless to people. Why did Joker flip his lid and run like a crazed lunatic? Why did the crew go with him? Did he run because Shapard unwittingly destroyed the whole system with the Crucible causing the Relays to explode? This might be the oddest plot hole of all, and it should be explained.
-The damage caused by the Mass Relay explosions and the resulting situation.
-Having dialogue with the Catalyst that explains the origin of the Reapers would be wonderful. We don't need to know the origin of the Catalyst. Some level of speculation is great. We can be left wondering if this is a god, a VI from a civilization long past, a creation of the Reapers, creator of the Reapers, or something else. Leaving that to speculation would be great, but learning the origin of the Reapers at the end seems necessary at this point. That's actually what I thought one of the achievements was going to be about: Fact Finder, Discover an enemy's monstrous origin. That was a letdown when I realized it was about the banshees.
-Most importantly is that if people make the wrong choices before and during this ending and are unable to resist indoctrination, it needs to feel real and conclusive. Maybe for a moment after you've done your action at the Crucible someone snaps you out of it but by now it's too late and you get to see the terrible mistake you've made and the dire consequences. Fantastic "bad" ending.
If you make all the right choices, if you resist indoctrination, the cinematic plays that moves to Shepard lying in the concrete rubble of London and you guys can do whatever the hell you want from that point on. Bioware's writers have proven they're more than capable writers during the rest of the game and in the previous ones. I don't care if Shepard lives or dies ultimately, BUT if we could do the impossible and make every decision perfectly to create a scenario where he survives to see it through, that would make for a more whole experience. The most important thing is to remove plot holes and create closure. We need to see the results of our choices and actions.
Just some personal preferences:
-For the Rachni to be a major decision looming over us for all three games, the ultimate result was... underwhelming. They either become a simple number for war assets or they don't. For such a major decision they at least deserve some kind of short cut scene or cinematic (10 seconds would thrill me).
-The Illusive Man... Martin Sheen's performance gave me chills. The exit or conclusion of The Illusive Man should be more profound. Maybe in the end he could resist indoctrination long enough to do something important for the mission. Maybe the person who goes in and fixes something with the Crucible will ultimately die, and he goes and does it. Sad as that would be, I think it sends a feel good message about the power of human will. No, he couldn't reverse it or resist it completely, but he resisted it long enough to make his death matter because he believed so strongly in his cause.
Modifié par Evan Belmont, 17 mars 2012 - 05:02 .
#1756
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 04:56
Dec4denc3
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My two credits;
The first Mass Effect was a unique game with epic overall story, and an amazing universe where Mass Effect 2 built upon. Mass Effect 3 was similiar to Mass Effect 2 in a lot of ways; right from the start, you knew where the game would end and the antagonists of the game were clear. You had a sense of what the end would be like, and you continiously pushed towards it. This is where Mass Effect 3 fell flat on it's face.
While the journey was great, the end certainly was not. I loved how my choices from all the games had consequences in the last installment, and I expected nothing less from the ending, but sadly, I was dissappointed.
If the ride was smooth, then the end in ME3 was like a brickwall. I didn't see the culmination, the climax of all my choices, but instead, I was met with three choices for an ending that had nothing to do with my choices! I was expecting something along the lines of if I did bad decisions in previous installments, I would get a "bad" ending, where the ultimate goal is not met, and I fail. If I did good decisions, I would have gotten a "good" ending, where the end goal is met, and everything ends good. I expected this because that's the trend that the other installments had established; your decisions, your choices have an impact, a consequence. The last thing that I was expecting was the slide-show, featured in other BioWare games, where, after it all was over, a slide-show would tell you how each of the characters you met during the story lived the rest of their days, and how your decisions had a impact for "decades to come" in the story.
I'm not pleased with how this all turned out, it was like a slap to the face. I will not endorse Mass Effect 3 to any of my friends or acquaintances, and I will warn anyone about to make the purchase to save their money until BioWare fixes this mess, if they are even going to, at all.
Now, I'm off to playing other games, which don't disappoint and exploit me and my expectations as a consumer, instead of wasting my time with this bs.
The first Mass Effect was a unique game with epic overall story, and an amazing universe where Mass Effect 2 built upon. Mass Effect 3 was similiar to Mass Effect 2 in a lot of ways; right from the start, you knew where the game would end and the antagonists of the game were clear. You had a sense of what the end would be like, and you continiously pushed towards it. This is where Mass Effect 3 fell flat on it's face.
While the journey was great, the end certainly was not. I loved how my choices from all the games had consequences in the last installment, and I expected nothing less from the ending, but sadly, I was dissappointed.
If the ride was smooth, then the end in ME3 was like a brickwall. I didn't see the culmination, the climax of all my choices, but instead, I was met with three choices for an ending that had nothing to do with my choices! I was expecting something along the lines of if I did bad decisions in previous installments, I would get a "bad" ending, where the ultimate goal is not met, and I fail. If I did good decisions, I would have gotten a "good" ending, where the end goal is met, and everything ends good. I expected this because that's the trend that the other installments had established; your decisions, your choices have an impact, a consequence. The last thing that I was expecting was the slide-show, featured in other BioWare games, where, after it all was over, a slide-show would tell you how each of the characters you met during the story lived the rest of their days, and how your decisions had a impact for "decades to come" in the story.
I'm not pleased with how this all turned out, it was like a slap to the face. I will not endorse Mass Effect 3 to any of my friends or acquaintances, and I will warn anyone about to make the purchase to save their money until BioWare fixes this mess, if they are even going to, at all.
Now, I'm off to playing other games, which don't disappoint and exploit me and my expectations as a consumer, instead of wasting my time with this bs.
#1757
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 04:56
Jamie9
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The Crucible not doing anything would actually speak greater about all the events in the story than any other outcome. By definition, the Crucible is a test of someone's will, in this case not just Shepard's, but the whole galaxy's.
Funerals would leave an emotional impact on me, for not only the next few days, but for whenever I think of these characters. Have Anderson, and all companions who die perhaps have a "mass funeral" where everyone on the ships just stands still in memorial.
Funerals would leave an emotional impact on me, for not only the next few days, but for whenever I think of these characters. Have Anderson, and all companions who die perhaps have a "mass funeral" where everyone on the ships just stands still in memorial.
#1758
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 04:57
DrDetective
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Get rid of the godchild, don't reveal the Reaper's actual motivation, make the end choices something completely different, with nothing to do with that bull**** about synthetics.
The Indoctrination theory is a good way to go about this. Make everything after the Reaper's particle beam knocks Shepard out a hallucination, and then give us a scene where (s)he wakes up and we get literally any other ending.
The Indoctrination theory is a good way to go about this. Make everything after the Reaper's particle beam knocks Shepard out a hallucination, and then give us a scene where (s)he wakes up and we get literally any other ending.
#1759
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 04:57
Little Vixen
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Things to that could be improved in ME3:
1. I believe and still believe that we could have a cure for Thane. I have attached my own solution to that story arc because I have been so distraught over Thane’s treatment in ME3. Thane got no choice what so ever. There is no choice to save him. With the other events in the Mass Effect universe (curing the genophage, bringing Shepard back from the dead with all his/her memories intact, cloning the extinct Krogan mounts so they have something to ride into battle, etc.), is giving Thane a choice for a cure all that far fetched? I don’t see his death as a necessary plot point. Please see my solution below. I have written my solution in a way that wouldn’t require many changes to the already included game altering events. Please, I beg you to reconsider. Give us a choice. I know some liked his death, but I couldn’t have been more heart broken or stunned that his character was handled in such a way. Believe me, I have spent more hours than I care to in real life holding my sweetheart’s hand in hospital rooms hoping he would see tomorrow. Please, give us a choice. We don’t always get one in real life and that is why Bioware games are a means of escape. They can provide hope where there isn’t in the real world.
2. A lot of our choices didn’t actually matter in the end. The whole game is supposed to be about choice. I have 12 distinct Shepard’s from Mass Effect 2. I tried to get all the different choices and the love interests covered. And, as it turned out, most of it doesn’t matter. This doesn’t help with me wanting to replay ME3 that many times. It is what I loved about ME2 and ME1. The choices. The differences because of the choices. I don’t feel like I got that in ME3.
3. Why are the characters from ME2 brushed aside for the most part? I really thought at least a couple of them would make it to ME3. I am not counting Tali and Garrus because they were also squad mates in ME1. I had myself talked into the fact that Thane and either or Miranda or Jack would be on the squad. I realize that they could die as part of the suicide mission, but I just thought that if you killed them in an ME2 import, then they simply wouldn’t show up in ME3. Starting with an ME3 game could have easily had them there. I thought that was probably why the new ME3 squad members were there, in case you killed off your ME2 squad. But, if you got them through ME2, why couldn’t we have a few of them on the squad?
4. I am embarrassed to say, that I started with ME2. Thane was the character that made me fall in love with the whole series. I have been a long time fan of Bioware games. I even still have my limited edition Baulder’s Gate game. I generally play more fantasy RPGs, but I saw the ad for ME2 in the sleeve of Dragon Age :Origins. Being completely in love with Dragon Age: Origins, I decided to give Mass Effect 2 a shot. Thane made the difference and I have been an avid Mass Effect fan ever since. I went back and played through ME1 and found out how wonderful Garrus was as well. So, from my perspective of beginning with ME2, I found the treatment of the ME2 squad in ME3 perplexing.
5. The lack of squad members. One of the fabulous things about ME2 was that I could take different squad members around for every play through. In ME3, we are often forced into taking a specific member (which for some specific missions, I do understand, but there was a lot of that.) Why do we have to wait so long to get the party members together? By the time I got Tali and Kaidan/Ashley back, there were hardly any more missions left to try them out as party members.
6. I liked, and appreciated the extensive dialog put into the game. The squad banter was sorely missing in ME2, and I appreciate the effort that went into correcting this in ME3. Thank you for that.
7. For the love interests that were there, they were well written and I was very appreciative. The Garrus one is fantastic. However, if you had an ME2 character love interest, they were tossed aside like they didn’t matter and we were wrong if we made that choice. (I realize that Garrus and Tali were only romanceable in ME2, however, they did start out with Shepard in ME1.) My Shepards with ME2 love interests didn’t have them because they cheated on anyone. They went through ME1 without a love interest and found love in ME2. They were faithful to their ME2 loves. There was no payoff for that. The ME2 love interests simply ceased to exist. Please, please, please, could we fix this in some way?
8. Female Shepard gets fewer choices than male Shepard to begin with, and then ME3 promptly kills off Thane and Jacob runs off with another woman. That is pretty harsh for female players. Male Shepard doesn’t seem to be made to suffer the way the Female Shepard has to.
9. As a female player, I have always been very appreciative of Bioware for remembering us and making characters for female players to love. (Thane, a case in point, was tailor made to be female player attractive. And, yes, I was at the midnight launch with my Thane t-shirt on.) I don’t begrudge male players their love interests. In fact, my hubby and I always buy two copies of your games and we end of comparing notes about all the different Love interests. I generally end up playing all of the love interests, just because I want to see what happens with characters I care about, and he does as well. But, in ME3, poor female Shepard gets her options severely limited. Female Shepard needs her Drell back.
10. I had to chuckle at the scenes about the Lazarus project and Shepard’s brain being kept intact by his/her helmet, so they only had to rebuild Shepard’s body. Wasn’t that Shepard’s helmet that we go find in the dog tag/memorial quest in ME2? I always did that quest because I liked to decorate Shepard’s room.
11. Thank you for giving us our space hamster back. I have cried buckets over the tragedies in ME3, but the space hamster did make me smile. I still call mine “Boo”, in remembrance of Minsc. (I did sort of think he might turn out to be the giant space hamster that Minsc said he was at some point. Just a thought. “Boo! Go for the eyes!”
12. It is a small thing, but I would appreciate a few more things to make Shepard’s cabin less drab and depressing. It is about the only refuge from the storm that poor Shep gets. A love interest picture maybe? An alliance recruitment poster on the wall? Those flowers from the hospital kiosk show up in his/her room? Something.
13. Not a fan of the bottlenecking of story points where there is a requirement to do a little arcade sort of game to get through that section and back to the RPG. It doesn’t seem appropriate, and causes frustration. A case in point is fighting the reaper with the Halo orbital strike laser. Shepard is trapped on a tiny cliff trying to call the laser in on the reaper. That kind of feel is better handled shooting pyjacks on Tuchanka where it isn’t necessary to complete the game.
14. Thanks for not bringing back the button mashing for decoding in ME1. Sorry to lose the more cerebral hacking and bypass from ME2. I enjoyed the little matching mini game.
15. There could have been more diversity in the endings. It seemed more like one ending with just different people.
16. Overall the game was extremely emotionally draining to play. After Thane’s death, I literally put the game away for a while. I had to give it some space and try again with another love interest. I realize it is the end of days for the Mass Effect universe, but I really could use a bit more of an up lift. I game to escape the tragedies in my own life, and there have been many for me in the last few years. At the end of ME2, I felt up lifted and ready to immediately go on the adventure again. At the end of ME3, I felt like I needed to do something else for a while.
17. I didn’t think I would like multiplayer, but I do. It is a lot of fun. Thank you for the amazing Drell multiplayer characters. I was glad to see they were not left out of the multiplayer universe.
18. Bioware made some sort of comment about “if we are going to save this universe, it might be worth playing in.” Did we save it? It didn’t feel like it.
19. I am not looking for the end where Shepard saves the universe as is, and lives through it, but it just seemed that there was very little difference no matter what you did.
20. ME3 is heavy on the fetch quests. I don’t mind a few fetch quests, but there were hours of them and there didn’t seem to be much of a payoff for doing them. I loved the fact that in ME2, I found “surprise” side missions by keeping up with my mineral mining. While the mining wasn’t always so much fun, the excitement of finding a secret quest was. Suddenly EDI would tell Shepard there was something going on and he/she could land. ME1 had the same sort of reward for exploring the galaxy. I miss the surprise missions that I found by exploring.
21. The other problem with the fetch quests, is that in my games, many times they didn’t work. I couldn’t get the red circle to appear to turn in the quests. I had to replay whole sections of fetching to be able to turn the quests in. I know that is probably a bug issue.
22. One of the big highlights for me was Conrad Verner and the fan service done with his character. So many of the other characters were simply mentioned in tragic emails send to the Normandy or not mentioned at all.
23. I do have to commend you on how you changed the actual game mechanics in regards to biotics. The way biotics work in ME3 is incredible. I have never had so much fun with an adept Shepard. The way powers can combine and explode for even more effect is fantastic. That was done extremely well. I have chuckled many times to my hubby, “Bullets? We don’t need no stinking bullets. We have biotics!” The battles are extremely fun and I have had a wonderful time experimenting with which powers combine best in different situations.
24. Speaking of biotics, and this isn’t a complaint, but if Kaidan is always defined as a biotic, why is his character heavy on tech skills? Just curious.
25. Why does the quest log always start in the middle of the list. I get rather tired of scrolling to the top of the list to see what the currenet quest is. Couldn't it start at the top, where the current items are? The log list get long by the end of the game and there is a lot of scrolling to be done.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
How we could fix the storyline for Thane:
I put this in the Thane fan threads, but please, Bioware consider other options to Thane's death. Please give the Thane fans a choice. He was an amazing squadmate in ME2. Please. This is only my suggestion about how his character could be handled without changing events that occured in ME3.
I have mainly written this for a love interest Shepard, but it could also be adapted for a friend Shepard. I wrote this as therapy for me, because I have been greatly pained at the treatment of Thane. I am sharing it with you in hopes that it will help my fellow Thanemancers and friends of Thane. I cannot hope to write the part as beautifully as Thane was done in Mass Effect 2, but I this is my humble try.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Leave Kai Leng/Thane fight as is.
Leave Death scene as is, although, it if is possible to fix, have Shepard at least act like she is sad about Thane’s passing. LI Shepard should also get the chance to say she loves Thane.
Return to Normandy. Garrus or Liara or someone tries to comfort Shepard.
** *
New solution:
Shepard returns to Normandy. Goes to her cabin for a good cry and to reflect on Thane’s death. She finds a letter waiting for her from Feron. It simply says, “Shepard, meet me on the Citadel. Please hurry. It is important.”
***
Shepard goes to the Citadel and meets Feron.
Feron: “I have a message from Thane.”
Shepard: (distressed) “Just Stop!” (Slight pause – softly…) “Thane’s dead.”
Feron: “I still have a message from him and I …”
Shepard:(Shepard interupts with tears in her eyes) “What?!”
(Shepard looks away) “I don’t know that I can do this right now. Is it important? I suppose it is if Thane contacted you.”
(snippy tone) “What major emergency do I have to solve now when I can’t even think straight. I have lost two of my best friends in as many days.”
(regretfully) “Sorry, Feron, you didn’t deserve that.”
(Shepard looks apologetically at Feron.)
Feron: (looks at Shepard with feeling and states flatly) “No, he is not.”
Shepard: (confused) “No, who….? What are you talking about, Feron?”
Thane steps from the Shadows slowly. His steps are unsure and obviously pained.
LI Shepard is shocked and bewildered but leaps into Thane’s arms and showers him with kisses. (Friend Shepard looks at Thane in amazement and smiles.)
Feron: “I will leave you two alone and go check on Liara. It has been too long since I have seen her anyway.” (Feron turns around and leaves.)
Thane: “Siha, (pause)…I see my presence in not unwelcome.” (Thane smiles at LI Shepard.)
Shepard: Am I dreaming? You’re dead. I was there, I saw you die.
Thane: (Deep Chuckle) “Siha, do you know how much irony is dripping from your lips at this moment? Shepard, you of all people should understand that the first death is not always the final chapter.”
Shepard: (weeping)“You came back to me?”
Thane: (With feeling) “Of course, Siha. You need me now.”
Shepard: (Confused) “But, I don’t understand how? How is this not a dream?”
Thane: (reasurring) “Let me try to explain as best I can for I do not understand it clearly myself. I told you in the hospital I was not as I was. I needed constant medical treatment, which is why I could not come with you. (pause) That was true. (deep breath) I told you long ago that the Hanar had been working on adapting the Drell so that we would not succumb to Kepral’s Syndrome. The Hanar were further along than I had thought in their search for a cure. They had already started clinical trials. After you awoke me from my battle sleep, I told you that you had given me a reason to want to live. Using my contacts, I found out about the Hanar’s clinical trials. I was a perfect candidate because my disease was advanced enough that I didn’t qualify for any other treatment.”
Shepard: (slightly hurt) “Why didn’t you tell me?”
Thane: (pained) “Because, Siha, you have had enough in your life torn from your grasp. I did not want to give you a false hope. At the time you visited me in the hospital, the trial was not going well. I wasn’t responding to the treatment. I could not burden you with this truth. You have already lost so much and you need to be strong for the fight ahead. My first concern was for you. It is always for you.”
Shepard: “What changed? How can you be here now?”
Thane: “When that assassin stabbed me, I received a blood transfusion from my son Kolyat. While my cells were too weak to respond to the Hanar’s adaptive genetic code, Kolyat’s were not. I did die, Siha, for a time, but with the help of Kolyat’s blood and your love, my body started to respond to the treatment. I was sent back to you. I am weak, but I am whole again.”
Shepard: “Sent back to me? Thane, I don’t understand.”
Thane: “I will explain it further another time. For now, isn’t it enough that I have returned to you?”
Shepard: “Yes, of course.” (crying) “But, why didn’t anyone tell me? Why didn’t you notify me you were alive?
Thane: “Siha, the last thing in the world I would want to do is hurt you. But, like you, I wasn’t aware. I was dead for a time. Please, you of all people should understand this. Is this not the same reaction Kaidan/Ashley gave you on Horizon?” (Thane takes Shepard’s hands and draws her close, kissing her softly.)
Shepard:(teasing) “Oh, it really is you.” (hopeful) “Can you come with me now?”
Thane: “Yes, Siha, I will never leave you alone again. Come, Shepard. Our light will continue in spite of the growing darkness.”
Shepard Embrace and Kiss (Thane becomes a party member with a +10% automatic shield bonus when he is in the party. Bonus called “Thane’s Protection.” Possible Thane powers, Throw, Pull and Warp.)
***
Adjustment to Scene on Thessia (Asari home world at the temple) and 2nd run in with Kai Leng.
- If Thane is in the party, he charges after Kai Leng, and Kai Leng runs off at the end of the battle.
- Thane: (angry) “I will not be such an easy mark this time.”
-
- If Thane is not in the party, he sends a message to Shepard, “He was there. I knew I should have accompanied you, Siha. Are you alright?”
-
** *
Date Scene – Shepard and Thane finally get to visit that desert. (Even if it is a virtual desert on the Citadel.)
** *
Side Mission with Thane – Travel to Kahje help the Hanar to save the cure for the rest of the Drell. We now know it works and the Reapers do not want the Drell forces strengthened. A successful mission means that all Drell can now be cured of Kepral’s Syndrome and a war assest is gained.
** *
Love scene with Thane before big battle. Pillow talk afterwards.
Shepard: (loving looks at Thane) “Why did you say you were sent back to me?”
Thane: “Because I was across the sea. It is beautiful there, Shepard….(pause)
Shepard: (laughs and kisses Thane) “I don’t remember any thing from when I was dead.”
Thane: (with a knowing smile) “You will. When it is time. And, I will be there to guide you.” (Pause…with difficulty) “I saw Irikah while I was there.”
Shepard: (eyes wide looking at Thane) “Irikah?”
Thane: (comforting) “Siha, don’t be alarmed. I told you once that you were the second warrior angel I have had the privilege to know in my lifetime. My wife, Irikah was the first. “
Shepard: (slightly hurt) “You still miss her.”
Thane: (comforting) “Of course, I do. But, Shepard, while I was across the sea she gave me two gifts.”
Shepard: “I don’t understand.”
Thane: “Her first gift was her forgiveness to me.”
Shepard: (smiles) “And, her second gift?”
Thane: “It was for you, Siha. She gave her strength to you.”
Shepard: “I don’t know what to say. She must be a remarkable woman.”
Thane: “Siha, I have a weakness for remarkable women. It was her gift and her blessing. Now use it to help yourself stay strong in the face of total destruction.”
Shepard: “Are you okay?”
Thane: “Yes. She sent me back to you. You need my help and my love. I am your shield and my love for you is your protection. Use me. I will protect you with all that I am. I am here for you, Siha. Let me help you in anyway that I can.”
(Thane and Shepard embrace and kiss.)
** *
Adjustment to the last battle with Kai Leng.
If Thane is in the party – Thane delivers Kai Leng’s death blow.
If Thane is not in the party – Thane drops out of the ceiling and delivers the death blow.
Thane then starts praying over Kai Leng’s dead body.
Shepard: (snarky) “Seriously? You think this guy deserves a prayer? Killing him was a service to this galaxy. I don’t think anyone would expect you to ask for forgiveness for taking his life.”
Thane: “I am praying in thanks to him, Siha. If it hadn’t been for him fatally wounding me, and my subsequent need for a blood transfusion, I wouldn’t have been able to return to you. So, yes, he deserves a prayer. (Tenderly takes Shepard’s face and kisses her.)
** *
End Scene with the goodbyes:
Shepard: “Thane, I don’t think I can bear to lose you again. I love you too much.”
Thane: “Siha, whatever happens, know that I also love you. My love is your shield. And, should the worst come to pass, I will be waiting for you across the sea. Nothing will keep me from you. Not even death. (pause and a small laugh) Your death or mine.
(Passionate kiss)
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Thank you for reading through all this. It is my hope that it help sooth your hearts. It has helped me with mine. Thane is a worthy character to love and he deserved more in Mass Effect 3.
1. I believe and still believe that we could have a cure for Thane. I have attached my own solution to that story arc because I have been so distraught over Thane’s treatment in ME3. Thane got no choice what so ever. There is no choice to save him. With the other events in the Mass Effect universe (curing the genophage, bringing Shepard back from the dead with all his/her memories intact, cloning the extinct Krogan mounts so they have something to ride into battle, etc.), is giving Thane a choice for a cure all that far fetched? I don’t see his death as a necessary plot point. Please see my solution below. I have written my solution in a way that wouldn’t require many changes to the already included game altering events. Please, I beg you to reconsider. Give us a choice. I know some liked his death, but I couldn’t have been more heart broken or stunned that his character was handled in such a way. Believe me, I have spent more hours than I care to in real life holding my sweetheart’s hand in hospital rooms hoping he would see tomorrow. Please, give us a choice. We don’t always get one in real life and that is why Bioware games are a means of escape. They can provide hope where there isn’t in the real world.
2. A lot of our choices didn’t actually matter in the end. The whole game is supposed to be about choice. I have 12 distinct Shepard’s from Mass Effect 2. I tried to get all the different choices and the love interests covered. And, as it turned out, most of it doesn’t matter. This doesn’t help with me wanting to replay ME3 that many times. It is what I loved about ME2 and ME1. The choices. The differences because of the choices. I don’t feel like I got that in ME3.
3. Why are the characters from ME2 brushed aside for the most part? I really thought at least a couple of them would make it to ME3. I am not counting Tali and Garrus because they were also squad mates in ME1. I had myself talked into the fact that Thane and either or Miranda or Jack would be on the squad. I realize that they could die as part of the suicide mission, but I just thought that if you killed them in an ME2 import, then they simply wouldn’t show up in ME3. Starting with an ME3 game could have easily had them there. I thought that was probably why the new ME3 squad members were there, in case you killed off your ME2 squad. But, if you got them through ME2, why couldn’t we have a few of them on the squad?
4. I am embarrassed to say, that I started with ME2. Thane was the character that made me fall in love with the whole series. I have been a long time fan of Bioware games. I even still have my limited edition Baulder’s Gate game. I generally play more fantasy RPGs, but I saw the ad for ME2 in the sleeve of Dragon Age :Origins. Being completely in love with Dragon Age: Origins, I decided to give Mass Effect 2 a shot. Thane made the difference and I have been an avid Mass Effect fan ever since. I went back and played through ME1 and found out how wonderful Garrus was as well. So, from my perspective of beginning with ME2, I found the treatment of the ME2 squad in ME3 perplexing.
5. The lack of squad members. One of the fabulous things about ME2 was that I could take different squad members around for every play through. In ME3, we are often forced into taking a specific member (which for some specific missions, I do understand, but there was a lot of that.) Why do we have to wait so long to get the party members together? By the time I got Tali and Kaidan/Ashley back, there were hardly any more missions left to try them out as party members.
6. I liked, and appreciated the extensive dialog put into the game. The squad banter was sorely missing in ME2, and I appreciate the effort that went into correcting this in ME3. Thank you for that.
7. For the love interests that were there, they were well written and I was very appreciative. The Garrus one is fantastic. However, if you had an ME2 character love interest, they were tossed aside like they didn’t matter and we were wrong if we made that choice. (I realize that Garrus and Tali were only romanceable in ME2, however, they did start out with Shepard in ME1.) My Shepards with ME2 love interests didn’t have them because they cheated on anyone. They went through ME1 without a love interest and found love in ME2. They were faithful to their ME2 loves. There was no payoff for that. The ME2 love interests simply ceased to exist. Please, please, please, could we fix this in some way?
8. Female Shepard gets fewer choices than male Shepard to begin with, and then ME3 promptly kills off Thane and Jacob runs off with another woman. That is pretty harsh for female players. Male Shepard doesn’t seem to be made to suffer the way the Female Shepard has to.
9. As a female player, I have always been very appreciative of Bioware for remembering us and making characters for female players to love. (Thane, a case in point, was tailor made to be female player attractive. And, yes, I was at the midnight launch with my Thane t-shirt on.) I don’t begrudge male players their love interests. In fact, my hubby and I always buy two copies of your games and we end of comparing notes about all the different Love interests. I generally end up playing all of the love interests, just because I want to see what happens with characters I care about, and he does as well. But, in ME3, poor female Shepard gets her options severely limited. Female Shepard needs her Drell back.
10. I had to chuckle at the scenes about the Lazarus project and Shepard’s brain being kept intact by his/her helmet, so they only had to rebuild Shepard’s body. Wasn’t that Shepard’s helmet that we go find in the dog tag/memorial quest in ME2? I always did that quest because I liked to decorate Shepard’s room.
11. Thank you for giving us our space hamster back. I have cried buckets over the tragedies in ME3, but the space hamster did make me smile. I still call mine “Boo”, in remembrance of Minsc. (I did sort of think he might turn out to be the giant space hamster that Minsc said he was at some point. Just a thought. “Boo! Go for the eyes!”
12. It is a small thing, but I would appreciate a few more things to make Shepard’s cabin less drab and depressing. It is about the only refuge from the storm that poor Shep gets. A love interest picture maybe? An alliance recruitment poster on the wall? Those flowers from the hospital kiosk show up in his/her room? Something.
13. Not a fan of the bottlenecking of story points where there is a requirement to do a little arcade sort of game to get through that section and back to the RPG. It doesn’t seem appropriate, and causes frustration. A case in point is fighting the reaper with the Halo orbital strike laser. Shepard is trapped on a tiny cliff trying to call the laser in on the reaper. That kind of feel is better handled shooting pyjacks on Tuchanka where it isn’t necessary to complete the game.
14. Thanks for not bringing back the button mashing for decoding in ME1. Sorry to lose the more cerebral hacking and bypass from ME2. I enjoyed the little matching mini game.
15. There could have been more diversity in the endings. It seemed more like one ending with just different people.
16. Overall the game was extremely emotionally draining to play. After Thane’s death, I literally put the game away for a while. I had to give it some space and try again with another love interest. I realize it is the end of days for the Mass Effect universe, but I really could use a bit more of an up lift. I game to escape the tragedies in my own life, and there have been many for me in the last few years. At the end of ME2, I felt up lifted and ready to immediately go on the adventure again. At the end of ME3, I felt like I needed to do something else for a while.
17. I didn’t think I would like multiplayer, but I do. It is a lot of fun. Thank you for the amazing Drell multiplayer characters. I was glad to see they were not left out of the multiplayer universe.
18. Bioware made some sort of comment about “if we are going to save this universe, it might be worth playing in.” Did we save it? It didn’t feel like it.
19. I am not looking for the end where Shepard saves the universe as is, and lives through it, but it just seemed that there was very little difference no matter what you did.
20. ME3 is heavy on the fetch quests. I don’t mind a few fetch quests, but there were hours of them and there didn’t seem to be much of a payoff for doing them. I loved the fact that in ME2, I found “surprise” side missions by keeping up with my mineral mining. While the mining wasn’t always so much fun, the excitement of finding a secret quest was. Suddenly EDI would tell Shepard there was something going on and he/she could land. ME1 had the same sort of reward for exploring the galaxy. I miss the surprise missions that I found by exploring.
21. The other problem with the fetch quests, is that in my games, many times they didn’t work. I couldn’t get the red circle to appear to turn in the quests. I had to replay whole sections of fetching to be able to turn the quests in. I know that is probably a bug issue.
22. One of the big highlights for me was Conrad Verner and the fan service done with his character. So many of the other characters were simply mentioned in tragic emails send to the Normandy or not mentioned at all.
23. I do have to commend you on how you changed the actual game mechanics in regards to biotics. The way biotics work in ME3 is incredible. I have never had so much fun with an adept Shepard. The way powers can combine and explode for even more effect is fantastic. That was done extremely well. I have chuckled many times to my hubby, “Bullets? We don’t need no stinking bullets. We have biotics!” The battles are extremely fun and I have had a wonderful time experimenting with which powers combine best in different situations.
24. Speaking of biotics, and this isn’t a complaint, but if Kaidan is always defined as a biotic, why is his character heavy on tech skills? Just curious.
25. Why does the quest log always start in the middle of the list. I get rather tired of scrolling to the top of the list to see what the currenet quest is. Couldn't it start at the top, where the current items are? The log list get long by the end of the game and there is a lot of scrolling to be done.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
How we could fix the storyline for Thane:
I put this in the Thane fan threads, but please, Bioware consider other options to Thane's death. Please give the Thane fans a choice. He was an amazing squadmate in ME2. Please. This is only my suggestion about how his character could be handled without changing events that occured in ME3.
I have mainly written this for a love interest Shepard, but it could also be adapted for a friend Shepard. I wrote this as therapy for me, because I have been greatly pained at the treatment of Thane. I am sharing it with you in hopes that it will help my fellow Thanemancers and friends of Thane. I cannot hope to write the part as beautifully as Thane was done in Mass Effect 2, but I this is my humble try.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Leave Kai Leng/Thane fight as is.
Leave Death scene as is, although, it if is possible to fix, have Shepard at least act like she is sad about Thane’s passing. LI Shepard should also get the chance to say she loves Thane.
Return to Normandy. Garrus or Liara or someone tries to comfort Shepard.
** *
New solution:
Shepard returns to Normandy. Goes to her cabin for a good cry and to reflect on Thane’s death. She finds a letter waiting for her from Feron. It simply says, “Shepard, meet me on the Citadel. Please hurry. It is important.”
***
Shepard goes to the Citadel and meets Feron.
Feron: “I have a message from Thane.”
Shepard: (distressed) “Just Stop!” (Slight pause – softly…) “Thane’s dead.”
Feron: “I still have a message from him and I …”
Shepard:(Shepard interupts with tears in her eyes) “What?!”
(Shepard looks away) “I don’t know that I can do this right now. Is it important? I suppose it is if Thane contacted you.”
(snippy tone) “What major emergency do I have to solve now when I can’t even think straight. I have lost two of my best friends in as many days.”
(regretfully) “Sorry, Feron, you didn’t deserve that.”
(Shepard looks apologetically at Feron.)
Feron: (looks at Shepard with feeling and states flatly) “No, he is not.”
Shepard: (confused) “No, who….? What are you talking about, Feron?”
Thane steps from the Shadows slowly. His steps are unsure and obviously pained.
LI Shepard is shocked and bewildered but leaps into Thane’s arms and showers him with kisses. (Friend Shepard looks at Thane in amazement and smiles.)
Feron: “I will leave you two alone and go check on Liara. It has been too long since I have seen her anyway.” (Feron turns around and leaves.)
Thane: “Siha, (pause)…I see my presence in not unwelcome.” (Thane smiles at LI Shepard.)
Shepard: Am I dreaming? You’re dead. I was there, I saw you die.
Thane: (Deep Chuckle) “Siha, do you know how much irony is dripping from your lips at this moment? Shepard, you of all people should understand that the first death is not always the final chapter.”
Shepard: (weeping)“You came back to me?”
Thane: (With feeling) “Of course, Siha. You need me now.”
Shepard: (Confused) “But, I don’t understand how? How is this not a dream?”
Thane: (reasurring) “Let me try to explain as best I can for I do not understand it clearly myself. I told you in the hospital I was not as I was. I needed constant medical treatment, which is why I could not come with you. (pause) That was true. (deep breath) I told you long ago that the Hanar had been working on adapting the Drell so that we would not succumb to Kepral’s Syndrome. The Hanar were further along than I had thought in their search for a cure. They had already started clinical trials. After you awoke me from my battle sleep, I told you that you had given me a reason to want to live. Using my contacts, I found out about the Hanar’s clinical trials. I was a perfect candidate because my disease was advanced enough that I didn’t qualify for any other treatment.”
Shepard: (slightly hurt) “Why didn’t you tell me?”
Thane: (pained) “Because, Siha, you have had enough in your life torn from your grasp. I did not want to give you a false hope. At the time you visited me in the hospital, the trial was not going well. I wasn’t responding to the treatment. I could not burden you with this truth. You have already lost so much and you need to be strong for the fight ahead. My first concern was for you. It is always for you.”
Shepard: “What changed? How can you be here now?”
Thane: “When that assassin stabbed me, I received a blood transfusion from my son Kolyat. While my cells were too weak to respond to the Hanar’s adaptive genetic code, Kolyat’s were not. I did die, Siha, for a time, but with the help of Kolyat’s blood and your love, my body started to respond to the treatment. I was sent back to you. I am weak, but I am whole again.”
Shepard: “Sent back to me? Thane, I don’t understand.”
Thane: “I will explain it further another time. For now, isn’t it enough that I have returned to you?”
Shepard: “Yes, of course.” (crying) “But, why didn’t anyone tell me? Why didn’t you notify me you were alive?
Thane: “Siha, the last thing in the world I would want to do is hurt you. But, like you, I wasn’t aware. I was dead for a time. Please, you of all people should understand this. Is this not the same reaction Kaidan/Ashley gave you on Horizon?” (Thane takes Shepard’s hands and draws her close, kissing her softly.)
Shepard:(teasing) “Oh, it really is you.” (hopeful) “Can you come with me now?”
Thane: “Yes, Siha, I will never leave you alone again. Come, Shepard. Our light will continue in spite of the growing darkness.”
Shepard Embrace and Kiss (Thane becomes a party member with a +10% automatic shield bonus when he is in the party. Bonus called “Thane’s Protection.” Possible Thane powers, Throw, Pull and Warp.)
***
Adjustment to Scene on Thessia (Asari home world at the temple) and 2nd run in with Kai Leng.
- If Thane is in the party, he charges after Kai Leng, and Kai Leng runs off at the end of the battle.
- Thane: (angry) “I will not be such an easy mark this time.”
-
- If Thane is not in the party, he sends a message to Shepard, “He was there. I knew I should have accompanied you, Siha. Are you alright?”
-
** *
Date Scene – Shepard and Thane finally get to visit that desert. (Even if it is a virtual desert on the Citadel.)
** *
Side Mission with Thane – Travel to Kahje help the Hanar to save the cure for the rest of the Drell. We now know it works and the Reapers do not want the Drell forces strengthened. A successful mission means that all Drell can now be cured of Kepral’s Syndrome and a war assest is gained.
** *
Love scene with Thane before big battle. Pillow talk afterwards.
Shepard: (loving looks at Thane) “Why did you say you were sent back to me?”
Thane: “Because I was across the sea. It is beautiful there, Shepard….(pause)
Shepard: (laughs and kisses Thane) “I don’t remember any thing from when I was dead.”
Thane: (with a knowing smile) “You will. When it is time. And, I will be there to guide you.” (Pause…with difficulty) “I saw Irikah while I was there.”
Shepard: (eyes wide looking at Thane) “Irikah?”
Thane: (comforting) “Siha, don’t be alarmed. I told you once that you were the second warrior angel I have had the privilege to know in my lifetime. My wife, Irikah was the first. “
Shepard: (slightly hurt) “You still miss her.”
Thane: (comforting) “Of course, I do. But, Shepard, while I was across the sea she gave me two gifts.”
Shepard: “I don’t understand.”
Thane: “Her first gift was her forgiveness to me.”
Shepard: (smiles) “And, her second gift?”
Thane: “It was for you, Siha. She gave her strength to you.”
Shepard: “I don’t know what to say. She must be a remarkable woman.”
Thane: “Siha, I have a weakness for remarkable women. It was her gift and her blessing. Now use it to help yourself stay strong in the face of total destruction.”
Shepard: “Are you okay?”
Thane: “Yes. She sent me back to you. You need my help and my love. I am your shield and my love for you is your protection. Use me. I will protect you with all that I am. I am here for you, Siha. Let me help you in anyway that I can.”
(Thane and Shepard embrace and kiss.)
** *
Adjustment to the last battle with Kai Leng.
If Thane is in the party – Thane delivers Kai Leng’s death blow.
If Thane is not in the party – Thane drops out of the ceiling and delivers the death blow.
Thane then starts praying over Kai Leng’s dead body.
Shepard: (snarky) “Seriously? You think this guy deserves a prayer? Killing him was a service to this galaxy. I don’t think anyone would expect you to ask for forgiveness for taking his life.”
Thane: “I am praying in thanks to him, Siha. If it hadn’t been for him fatally wounding me, and my subsequent need for a blood transfusion, I wouldn’t have been able to return to you. So, yes, he deserves a prayer. (Tenderly takes Shepard’s face and kisses her.)
** *
End Scene with the goodbyes:
Shepard: “Thane, I don’t think I can bear to lose you again. I love you too much.”
Thane: “Siha, whatever happens, know that I also love you. My love is your shield. And, should the worst come to pass, I will be waiting for you across the sea. Nothing will keep me from you. Not even death. (pause and a small laugh) Your death or mine.
(Passionate kiss)
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Thank you for reading through all this. It is my hope that it help sooth your hearts. It has helped me with mine. Thane is a worthy character to love and he deserved more in Mass Effect 3.
Modifié par Little Vixen, 17 mars 2012 - 05:14 .
#1760
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 04:57
voteDC
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- Members
- 2 538 messages
Just speaking for myself I want an ending that feels like the choices I made throughout the Mass Effect trilogy actually mattered.
Once I arrived on the Citadel at the end it felt as if everything I did was unimportant, nothing was referenced and I had no opportunity to show the StarChild that he was wrong about synthetics and organics (one of the choices made unimportant was my resolving of the quarian/geth conflict.
I didn't expect a happy ending, indeed I kind of expected that my Shepard was going to die at the end. I did however expect an end where my choices mattered and ultimately they didn't.
Once I arrived on the Citadel at the end it felt as if everything I did was unimportant, nothing was referenced and I had no opportunity to show the StarChild that he was wrong about synthetics and organics (one of the choices made unimportant was my resolving of the quarian/geth conflict.
I didn't expect a happy ending, indeed I kind of expected that my Shepard was going to die at the end. I did however expect an end where my choices mattered and ultimately they didn't.
#1761
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 04:58
jupitertronic
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- Members
- 98 messages
The Ending
The Indoctrination Theory seems to be the easiest and most air-tight solution. Nothing has to change, you'd only have to add things on to the end, and if anyone ever thought you did it on purpose, you'd be hailed as geniuses for making the gamer get "played."
The ending as is is too bleak. It's not bittersweet, just bitter. I love high-concept, sad movies (The Fountain is my all time favorite, so obviously I don't need an ending to make sense for me to love something). But I feel like the ME3 ending was a really good ending for some OTHER game that has nothing to do with Mass Effect. It's not that the ending is bad so much as it's bad for the Mass Effect franchise.
Whether you meant for it to be the case or not, it kills the entire universe of Mass Effect. No matter what ending I get, the Mass Relays are always destroyed and to me, that negates there being a point for this franchise to continue existing. You're telling me my sci-fi epic now has less technology than I have in my phone? Now it's no longer a science fiction story in any way, and the universe loses 100% of its appeal. I don't care how much I like Garrus, if he's stranded on a planet forever and there's nothing to do there, it becomes Gilligan's Island in space, with some aliens who will die if the planet they're on has the wrong kind of food.
And releasing pre-ending DLC is just as pointless, because I still know that world as I know it will end, and therefore it is futile to do anything before that point because it will all be wiped out anyway. There's not even the excuse of "but maybe the ending will be different if I download this new character," because it can't be different. The ending will always be the same, no matter what comes before.
I won't go into detail, but I'm sure you guys are aware of how confusing it is for our supposedly dead squad-mates to pop out of the crashed Normandy unharmed and just moments after Shepard makes his/her final choice. I also don't know how Anderson got ahead of Shepard when he came up the beam afterward, or why it "makes sense" that the Citadel would look anything like the Collector ship. And why did the Keepers have dead humans strewn around everywhere? Why was there concrete rubble around Shepard if he/she was on the Citadel, which appears to be made of metal?
If these things were purposely non-sensical because they're hinting at something, the hints are too subtle or we wouldn't be questioning anything.
I'm unsure about the Catalyst AI/the kid.
Is this just a rip-off of the aliens from Contact looking like Ellie's dad to make her feel comfortable? Or was the kid always only the Catalyst and always in Shepard's mind even from scene one, since no one, not even Anderson, seems to have seen the kid themselves? Are you being intentionally clever with this or is it just messy? I can't tell.
The one thing I desperately wish you'd change, other than the ending:
Make Thane's death avoidable, especially for those who romanced him. Pretty much everything about Thane's ME3 appearance was a real slap in the face to someone who romanced him. During the love scene in ME2, Thane was ashamed of himself for no longer embracing death, now that Shepard's love had given him something to live for. Why would he suddenly embrace death again in ME3? It's as if he never fell in love with Shepard and they never had that conversation.
Obviously I didn't want him to die, but I worried you'd kill him and hoped it'd at least be a beautiful end with a lot of good stuff before he went. Instead he gets two lackluster scenes and I don't even get a Paragon achievement out of it.
But the worst part was that Mordin's death was handled so perfectly - both the actual death and the crew referencing it to me afterward and asking how I was taking it - that you gave me false hope that my crew would be even more attentive to me when it came time to talk about Thane's death. I was very, very touched by my crew talking about Mordin and thought that surely, there would be even more touching dialogue when my lover died.
But nope! Even worse, as Thane died I couldn't tell him I loved him or hold his hand. I literally - I am not exaggerating - reached my hand out toward the screen as if I could somehow move Shepard to comfort him, because it felt so emotionally *wrong* to see this character's lover dying and her just STANDING THERE. She doesn't have to be a blubbering mess when he dies, but god, not even tears? No "I love you"? No hand-holding? Ouch.
Solutions for resurrecting Thane from his character assassination:
Little Vixen had an excellent idea that Thane really does die in the hospital room, but only for a short time. The idea being that Kolyat's blood transfusion helped him beat Kepral's because he'd already been getting treatments behind Shep's back, so as not to give her false hope. Shepard wouldn't find out he was still alive until a few scenes later. I love this idea. In a perfect world, he could then become a squad member, but if not could at least sit in Life Support again and I could come see him in between missions.
I would also be 10000% satisfied if Thane reappeared in front of not-dead FemShep by stepping out of the shadows in Mass Effect 4 when you least expect him, and explaining what happened in dialogue or flashback. It would be the greatest day of my life.
Technical issues about the game:
- The quest log doesn't give enough useful information. I actually liked how the quest logs were in ME2. I don't see why they had to change. I spent a lot of time walking around every part of the Citadel until I found something to turn in and it wasted a lot of time.
- It'd also be nice to be able to check the quest log while in the Galaxy Map so I can remember what item I need and from what system. It'd be nice if I could pop it up on my screen with the right bumper on the Xbox, just like the combat system.
- Cover seems pretty tricky to get it to do what you want. Every time I thought I'd finally be able to roll out from one cover to another in the way I intended to, I ended up just standing in between both bits of cover getting showered with gunfire, smashing the cover button to get behind anything I could.
And this is why it's important you change things:
Seriously you guys, this game is INCREDIBLE. Except what I've listed above, there's hardly a thing I'd change. You should be extremely proud of yourselves for what you've accomplished, but nobody is perfect and the Thane romance fail and confusing/non-sensical endings are the things that didn't turn out right.
It's important to me that these things get changed, especially the ending. Because the thing is, I want you guys to know that I've never bought DLC for any game except Mass Effect 2, and then I bought all the DLC you offered. I bought it gladly and I was so, so satisfied with it all. There was no question, in my mind, that I'd buy all the Mass Effect 3 DLC, too - until I finished the game.
Now I don't want to play it at all, let alone buy DLC. I get tired and annoyed when I think of the ending. I was going to buy superfluous copies of Mass Effect and ME2 just to have the experience of playing on my PC rather than an Xbox. Now I don't want to.
I'm an adult who works at home and rarely. I have 100% of my time (and money) to devote to this game right now, and yet I'm sitting here writing fix-it fan fiction and ****ing about everything wrong about the ending with my boyfriend until 2AM. I could be playing multi-player. I could be ordering merch from the BioWare store. I'd love to, in fact. But I'm not.
The Indoctrination Theory seems to be the easiest and most air-tight solution. Nothing has to change, you'd only have to add things on to the end, and if anyone ever thought you did it on purpose, you'd be hailed as geniuses for making the gamer get "played."
The ending as is is too bleak. It's not bittersweet, just bitter. I love high-concept, sad movies (The Fountain is my all time favorite, so obviously I don't need an ending to make sense for me to love something). But I feel like the ME3 ending was a really good ending for some OTHER game that has nothing to do with Mass Effect. It's not that the ending is bad so much as it's bad for the Mass Effect franchise.
Whether you meant for it to be the case or not, it kills the entire universe of Mass Effect. No matter what ending I get, the Mass Relays are always destroyed and to me, that negates there being a point for this franchise to continue existing. You're telling me my sci-fi epic now has less technology than I have in my phone? Now it's no longer a science fiction story in any way, and the universe loses 100% of its appeal. I don't care how much I like Garrus, if he's stranded on a planet forever and there's nothing to do there, it becomes Gilligan's Island in space, with some aliens who will die if the planet they're on has the wrong kind of food.
And releasing pre-ending DLC is just as pointless, because I still know that world as I know it will end, and therefore it is futile to do anything before that point because it will all be wiped out anyway. There's not even the excuse of "but maybe the ending will be different if I download this new character," because it can't be different. The ending will always be the same, no matter what comes before.
I won't go into detail, but I'm sure you guys are aware of how confusing it is for our supposedly dead squad-mates to pop out of the crashed Normandy unharmed and just moments after Shepard makes his/her final choice. I also don't know how Anderson got ahead of Shepard when he came up the beam afterward, or why it "makes sense" that the Citadel would look anything like the Collector ship. And why did the Keepers have dead humans strewn around everywhere? Why was there concrete rubble around Shepard if he/she was on the Citadel, which appears to be made of metal?
If these things were purposely non-sensical because they're hinting at something, the hints are too subtle or we wouldn't be questioning anything.
I'm unsure about the Catalyst AI/the kid.
Is this just a rip-off of the aliens from Contact looking like Ellie's dad to make her feel comfortable? Or was the kid always only the Catalyst and always in Shepard's mind even from scene one, since no one, not even Anderson, seems to have seen the kid themselves? Are you being intentionally clever with this or is it just messy? I can't tell.
The one thing I desperately wish you'd change, other than the ending:
Make Thane's death avoidable, especially for those who romanced him. Pretty much everything about Thane's ME3 appearance was a real slap in the face to someone who romanced him. During the love scene in ME2, Thane was ashamed of himself for no longer embracing death, now that Shepard's love had given him something to live for. Why would he suddenly embrace death again in ME3? It's as if he never fell in love with Shepard and they never had that conversation.
Obviously I didn't want him to die, but I worried you'd kill him and hoped it'd at least be a beautiful end with a lot of good stuff before he went. Instead he gets two lackluster scenes and I don't even get a Paragon achievement out of it.
But the worst part was that Mordin's death was handled so perfectly - both the actual death and the crew referencing it to me afterward and asking how I was taking it - that you gave me false hope that my crew would be even more attentive to me when it came time to talk about Thane's death. I was very, very touched by my crew talking about Mordin and thought that surely, there would be even more touching dialogue when my lover died.
But nope! Even worse, as Thane died I couldn't tell him I loved him or hold his hand. I literally - I am not exaggerating - reached my hand out toward the screen as if I could somehow move Shepard to comfort him, because it felt so emotionally *wrong* to see this character's lover dying and her just STANDING THERE. She doesn't have to be a blubbering mess when he dies, but god, not even tears? No "I love you"? No hand-holding? Ouch.
Solutions for resurrecting Thane from his character assassination:
Little Vixen had an excellent idea that Thane really does die in the hospital room, but only for a short time. The idea being that Kolyat's blood transfusion helped him beat Kepral's because he'd already been getting treatments behind Shep's back, so as not to give her false hope. Shepard wouldn't find out he was still alive until a few scenes later. I love this idea. In a perfect world, he could then become a squad member, but if not could at least sit in Life Support again and I could come see him in between missions.
I would also be 10000% satisfied if Thane reappeared in front of not-dead FemShep by stepping out of the shadows in Mass Effect 4 when you least expect him, and explaining what happened in dialogue or flashback. It would be the greatest day of my life.
Technical issues about the game:
- The quest log doesn't give enough useful information. I actually liked how the quest logs were in ME2. I don't see why they had to change. I spent a lot of time walking around every part of the Citadel until I found something to turn in and it wasted a lot of time.
- It'd also be nice to be able to check the quest log while in the Galaxy Map so I can remember what item I need and from what system. It'd be nice if I could pop it up on my screen with the right bumper on the Xbox, just like the combat system.
- Cover seems pretty tricky to get it to do what you want. Every time I thought I'd finally be able to roll out from one cover to another in the way I intended to, I ended up just standing in between both bits of cover getting showered with gunfire, smashing the cover button to get behind anything I could.
And this is why it's important you change things:
Seriously you guys, this game is INCREDIBLE. Except what I've listed above, there's hardly a thing I'd change. You should be extremely proud of yourselves for what you've accomplished, but nobody is perfect and the Thane romance fail and confusing/non-sensical endings are the things that didn't turn out right.
It's important to me that these things get changed, especially the ending. Because the thing is, I want you guys to know that I've never bought DLC for any game except Mass Effect 2, and then I bought all the DLC you offered. I bought it gladly and I was so, so satisfied with it all. There was no question, in my mind, that I'd buy all the Mass Effect 3 DLC, too - until I finished the game.
Now I don't want to play it at all, let alone buy DLC. I get tired and annoyed when I think of the ending. I was going to buy superfluous copies of Mass Effect and ME2 just to have the experience of playing on my PC rather than an Xbox. Now I don't want to.
I'm an adult who works at home and rarely. I have 100% of my time (and money) to devote to this game right now, and yet I'm sitting here writing fix-it fan fiction and ****ing about everything wrong about the ending with my boyfriend until 2AM. I could be playing multi-player. I could be ordering merch from the BioWare store. I'd love to, in fact. But I'm not.
Modifié par jupitertronic, 17 mars 2012 - 05:24 .
#1762
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 04:58
dalethfc
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- 79 messages
To add to my earlier post. I don't Do MP, so why make SP players suffer a penalty because they do not want to play MP ?
#1763
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 04:59
Mariyanna
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- 78 messages
The ending makes no sense. The starchild... Joker abandoning Shepard on Earth... all the teammates suddenly being with Joker on the Normandy when it's shipwrecked...
Plus we only received one ending. The only difference was the color of the relays when they exploded. All of our decisions up until then meant nothing. There was no closure.
Not to mention it makes us wonder what happened with the relays. The ending made it seem like they all exploded. But doesn't an exploding relay take out at least part of the system it's in as well? (I may be wrong, but that's the idea I took away from Arrival.) Which means all the work on Rannoch, Tuchanka and numerous other planets was for nothing as the relays blowing up could mean those planets are now gone as well.
We need closure. We need epilogues. We need an ending that doesn't have plotholes you could fly the Normandy through.
Plus we only received one ending. The only difference was the color of the relays when they exploded. All of our decisions up until then meant nothing. There was no closure.
Not to mention it makes us wonder what happened with the relays. The ending made it seem like they all exploded. But doesn't an exploding relay take out at least part of the system it's in as well? (I may be wrong, but that's the idea I took away from Arrival.) Which means all the work on Rannoch, Tuchanka and numerous other planets was for nothing as the relays blowing up could mean those planets are now gone as well.
We need closure. We need epilogues. We need an ending that doesn't have plotholes you could fly the Normandy through.
#1764
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 05:00
Pipe 42
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- 38 messages
I'm also going to throw in my opinion here.
As many have said, the story up to the ending is moving and overall seems very appropriate, though I do feel sorry for those who romanced ME2 squad members as nothing really seems to come from them so far as I've read. Mordin, Thane and Legion all had appropriate deaths and felt integral to how the story had to go.
But the end of the game seemed to leave all the effort up to that point irrelevant. As many have pointed out, I do honestly believe many people expected a series of missions like the suicide mission from ME2. If this hasn't already been sneakily implemented into the game I find it unlikely it'll be added now. But the indoctrination theory gives the story writers a convenient out.
All most of us are after is closure, pretty much all the events after making the final choice render the preceding three games unimportant and discard previously established canon from the games themselves. I can understand wanting to leave things open for further games in the series. But based on what has already been established, all that can reasonably be assumed is that the quarians and turians are not long for this earth based on their dextro amino systems and the earth has been pretty much destroyed due to the Reaper machinations.
We've seen no evidence that any other planets in the system are habitable yet, Mars at the start of the game only has the prothean archives and the rest of the planet is still covered in nothing. No signs of other habitation around. Of course, this is all presuming that the destruction of the relays hasn't obliterated the entire solar system as has already been established in the arrival DLC.
It's hard to enjoy the game when everything we've seen so far has lead us to the conclusion that this cycle is over and everyone and everything we've fought for is no more.
Like many others I hope that more than we've been presented so far is on the cards and we'll get more feedback from the developers as it goes.
As many have said, the story up to the ending is moving and overall seems very appropriate, though I do feel sorry for those who romanced ME2 squad members as nothing really seems to come from them so far as I've read. Mordin, Thane and Legion all had appropriate deaths and felt integral to how the story had to go.
But the end of the game seemed to leave all the effort up to that point irrelevant. As many have pointed out, I do honestly believe many people expected a series of missions like the suicide mission from ME2. If this hasn't already been sneakily implemented into the game I find it unlikely it'll be added now. But the indoctrination theory gives the story writers a convenient out.
All most of us are after is closure, pretty much all the events after making the final choice render the preceding three games unimportant and discard previously established canon from the games themselves. I can understand wanting to leave things open for further games in the series. But based on what has already been established, all that can reasonably be assumed is that the quarians and turians are not long for this earth based on their dextro amino systems and the earth has been pretty much destroyed due to the Reaper machinations.
We've seen no evidence that any other planets in the system are habitable yet, Mars at the start of the game only has the prothean archives and the rest of the planet is still covered in nothing. No signs of other habitation around. Of course, this is all presuming that the destruction of the relays hasn't obliterated the entire solar system as has already been established in the arrival DLC.
It's hard to enjoy the game when everything we've seen so far has lead us to the conclusion that this cycle is over and everyone and everything we've fought for is no more.
Like many others I hope that more than we've been presented so far is on the cards and we'll get more feedback from the developers as it goes.
#1765
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 05:00
durasteel
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I thought the basic theme of Organics versus Synthetics was handled poorly in the ending, and contradicted the way in which that theme had been developed throughout the series. I wrote up a specific and detailed explanation, which is too long to post in this thread. I created a topic for it:
The End: Organics & Synthetics
It's long, but I felt that to abbreviate the explanation wouldn't do it justice.
The End: Organics & Synthetics
It's long, but I felt that to abbreviate the explanation wouldn't do it justice.
#1766
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 05:00
Barooms
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I heard Bioware/EA/Hudson talk about the "sweet/bitter ending". I have a question :
Where is the SWEET ? And where is the ENDING ?
Where is the SWEET ? And where is the ENDING ?
#1767
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 05:01
T-Raks
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I want the end to make sense. To be well thought through. To give me the feeling I want to play the game again. I mean I probably will do it no matter what, because you guys from Bioware did an incredible job with how the side stories with other characters developed. So I wanna see what's in store when I concentrate on other sqadmates, how it develops if I don't discover Javik - who BTW was fantastic - and so on.
But: You just can't end the game with mistakes like the humans being alone though many races should be on earth after fighting together in the final battle withh no way out after the relays got destroyed, like squadmates being on the Normandy who just ran with you through reaper fire, the Normandy flying away from the battle, the weird "I kill organic life" speach by the catalyst "because otherwise the synthetics would kill organic life" - huh? what kind of reasoning is that? - giving you no choices in the end, no count after the battle who made it, who not, what's the status, etc.
The end can be bitter - of course Shepard sacrificing himself is an OK end for the trilogy - but can he do that while it makes sense? Please, this is not what we fought 120 hours in one playthrough from game 1 to 3 for.
Let me ask a question, folks at Bioware: did you even thought about the ending when you started this trilogy? I mean, c'mon, this is it? How can there be so many mistakes, plotholes, etc.?
Let me end this by saying that until the end ME3 was the best game experience I've ever had, so it would be sad if it ends like this - with disappointment.
But: You just can't end the game with mistakes like the humans being alone though many races should be on earth after fighting together in the final battle withh no way out after the relays got destroyed, like squadmates being on the Normandy who just ran with you through reaper fire, the Normandy flying away from the battle, the weird "I kill organic life" speach by the catalyst "because otherwise the synthetics would kill organic life" - huh? what kind of reasoning is that? - giving you no choices in the end, no count after the battle who made it, who not, what's the status, etc.
The end can be bitter - of course Shepard sacrificing himself is an OK end for the trilogy - but can he do that while it makes sense? Please, this is not what we fought 120 hours in one playthrough from game 1 to 3 for.
Let me ask a question, folks at Bioware: did you even thought about the ending when you started this trilogy? I mean, c'mon, this is it? How can there be so many mistakes, plotholes, etc.?
Let me end this by saying that until the end ME3 was the best game experience I've ever had, so it would be sad if it ends like this - with disappointment.
#1768
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 05:02
silentstephi
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- 1 881 messages
Honestly, if you guys had kept the ending as it was with out the Normandy/Shepard breath scenes.... I could have lived with it.
The relays blowing up makes sense. The choices... only make sense if the Indoctrination Theory is right.
But the combination of whatever choice and the Normandy scene just didn't make any sense whatsoever and left any sort of chance for closure gone.
If we're stuck with the three colors, make the Indoctrination Theory be the reality. There have been way too many hints within the game to ignore it. It would be a fantastic way to show us, the player what it's like to experience indoctrination.
I won't lie and say I wasn't tempted by Synthesis the first time I got to the end. I sat at my computer thinking about it for a while, but in the end chose Destroy because it's what that Shepard had sent out to do.
But you made me think about it. And when I found out about the Indoctrination Theory... it made so much more sense.
As a story telling element it was brilliant.
But if it's not true, then any sort of closure is impossible. Because we don't KNOW what's happened.
The rumors of 'there will be DLC but it will be about before the end' don't give us much hope to continue with it, because we know how it'll end. In confusion.
Real life already seems like a dark place. We don't need our entertainment to remind us of it.
No, I don't think you should have a sunshine and bunny farts ending. But one with closure. One that makes sense. One that I can look at and go, "So Shepard will be waiting at the bar. But at least she'll see him there eventually."
The relays blowing up makes sense. The choices... only make sense if the Indoctrination Theory is right.
But the combination of whatever choice and the Normandy scene just didn't make any sense whatsoever and left any sort of chance for closure gone.
If we're stuck with the three colors, make the Indoctrination Theory be the reality. There have been way too many hints within the game to ignore it. It would be a fantastic way to show us, the player what it's like to experience indoctrination.
I won't lie and say I wasn't tempted by Synthesis the first time I got to the end. I sat at my computer thinking about it for a while, but in the end chose Destroy because it's what that Shepard had sent out to do.
But you made me think about it. And when I found out about the Indoctrination Theory... it made so much more sense.
As a story telling element it was brilliant.
But if it's not true, then any sort of closure is impossible. Because we don't KNOW what's happened.
The rumors of 'there will be DLC but it will be about before the end' don't give us much hope to continue with it, because we know how it'll end. In confusion.
Real life already seems like a dark place. We don't need our entertainment to remind us of it.
No, I don't think you should have a sunshine and bunny farts ending. But one with closure. One that makes sense. One that I can look at and go, "So Shepard will be waiting at the bar. But at least she'll see him there eventually."
#1769
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 05:02
allentrill
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[quote]pomrink wrote...
Indoctrination theory being correct, then showing us what happens afterwards, with the extra bonus that we will never find out the reapers motivations(they need to stay unknowable, otherwise it cheapens them).
Edit: Also, with an epilogue of sorts, no mass relay explosion (unless you fail), potential failure like promised (i.e. reapers win), and maybe possibly a golden ending with shep living, but very hard to get?
Edit: Golden ending with shep living would hopefully be with LI....
I'd be willing to shell out.
This i agree with
Indoctrination theory being correct, then showing us what happens afterwards, with the extra bonus that we will never find out the reapers motivations(they need to stay unknowable, otherwise it cheapens them).
Edit: Also, with an epilogue of sorts, no mass relay explosion (unless you fail), potential failure like promised (i.e. reapers win), and maybe possibly a golden ending with shep living, but very hard to get?
Edit: Golden ending with shep living would hopefully be with LI....
I'd be willing to shell out.
This i agree with
#1770
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 05:03
Hadeedak
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Most of the game blew me out of the water, which made the discordant notes all the more jarring. I know everyone kvetches about the ending, but what really bothered me is the way the rest of the crew fails to react to Thane's death. And, for that matter, the way Shepard fails to react to Thane's death. Garrus and Thane were my go-to team for most of ME2, and even for a friendship path, it seems a bit odd that there's very little commentary, or even a codex entry, on this amazing character.
His death, don't get me wrong, was great. And so was most of his scene. I think there should be more for a romancing Shepard, because the guy was a spectacular love interest for the ladies. It's touching, but it'd be wonderful if he could get more - an extra dialogue scene, a choice to say Shepard is at the hospital to see him, some sense of continuity of the relationship.
As for the end, there's plenty of good points. I don't mind much about how it as as stands, but I'd really like to see more of the consequences. Can Shepard actually pull off control, or will he/she lose his way? What the blazes IS synthesis, beyond sounding creepy? Destroy -- well, will Shepard live beyond taking a breath?
Also, please, please please explain what Joker and the Normandy are doing skittering off in the middle of nowhere during the battle. What kept Joker out of it? How'd he pick up the fire team, if he actually did? What's going on with that?
And the flashbacks. I like Liara. But I really wish it'd been Garrus, especially because Garrus's status was currently unknown to my Shepard, after losing sight of him and Tali after Harbinger's laser. I know that'd be hard to deal with.
As to what I'd like in the ending -- the same, honestly, with a bit more clarity and extension. Some more things to distinguish them, more things explained, and more chances for my Shepard to ask some questions. I know I had plenty. From a gameplay standpoint, a few more places to save and pause would be supernice, too.
His death, don't get me wrong, was great. And so was most of his scene. I think there should be more for a romancing Shepard, because the guy was a spectacular love interest for the ladies. It's touching, but it'd be wonderful if he could get more - an extra dialogue scene, a choice to say Shepard is at the hospital to see him, some sense of continuity of the relationship.
As for the end, there's plenty of good points. I don't mind much about how it as as stands, but I'd really like to see more of the consequences. Can Shepard actually pull off control, or will he/she lose his way? What the blazes IS synthesis, beyond sounding creepy? Destroy -- well, will Shepard live beyond taking a breath?
Also, please, please please explain what Joker and the Normandy are doing skittering off in the middle of nowhere during the battle. What kept Joker out of it? How'd he pick up the fire team, if he actually did? What's going on with that?
And the flashbacks. I like Liara. But I really wish it'd been Garrus, especially because Garrus's status was currently unknown to my Shepard, after losing sight of him and Tali after Harbinger's laser. I know that'd be hard to deal with.
As to what I'd like in the ending -- the same, honestly, with a bit more clarity and extension. Some more things to distinguish them, more things explained, and more chances for my Shepard to ask some questions. I know I had plenty. From a gameplay standpoint, a few more places to save and pause would be supernice, too.
#1771
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 05:03
crimzontearz
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people should stop posting that shepardmust die
the option needs to be given since
A: you can save him even in the current endings
B: they baited us about it for 2 games now
c: the OPTION of him survivng/living happily (sort of) does not damage the alternatives
this game is about choice
this game is about our goddamn story
the option needs to be given since
A: you can save him even in the current endings
B: they baited us about it for 2 games now
c: the OPTION of him survivng/living happily (sort of) does not damage the alternatives
this game is about choice
this game is about our goddamn story
#1772
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 05:03
Debi-Tage
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It is painfully obvious what needs to happen - the "ending" needs to be changed. Period.
The only way I can see Bioware digging itself out of this mess at this point is the Indoctrination Theory. If done right it could not only negate most of the issues being pointed out here it will also save (perhaps even elevate) the company and the ME universe.
I mean really, more and more players are being introduced to the series through books, comics, now even a movie and you seriously think that those people who will get/are into the lore in much of the same way fans are for Star Wars and Star Trek are going to accept ME3 the way it is?? Your fans are speaking out, giving more than enough information for you to fix this (assuming it wasn't planned all along). Now, get down to fixing it - indoctrination theory.
The only way I can see Bioware digging itself out of this mess at this point is the Indoctrination Theory. If done right it could not only negate most of the issues being pointed out here it will also save (perhaps even elevate) the company and the ME universe.
I mean really, more and more players are being introduced to the series through books, comics, now even a movie and you seriously think that those people who will get/are into the lore in much of the same way fans are for Star Wars and Star Trek are going to accept ME3 the way it is?? Your fans are speaking out, giving more than enough information for you to fix this (assuming it wasn't planned all along). Now, get down to fixing it - indoctrination theory.
Modifié par Debi-Tage, 17 mars 2012 - 05:08 .
#1773
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 05:04
luzburg
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endings that are more explayned and with more options including a chanse for "total victory/happy ending" the fact that mass effect 3s war was a wwII style war that war ended in total victory
#1774
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 05:04
noxiuniversitas1
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Dear Bioware (and I honestly do hope someone from Bioware is reading the forums),
First off, thank you for the Mass Effect experience. The world is one I have sunk hours into - I have 5 ME1 saves, Over 15 ME2 ones, and I have just cleared ME3. I have every achievement for ME1 and ME2, something I have never bothered to do with any other game I have played. I think it is fair to say that Mass Effect is my favourite series. Ever.
ME3 was an emotional rollercoaster. It was fantastic and pulled me in. Every beating my Shepard got, every encouraging word from characters I have grown to hold dear. Those that died did so fittingly and heroically, and their dialogue was superb. Particularly memorable was the exchange between Shepard and Joker following the fall of Thessia and that between Shepard and Garrus in London. To whoever wrote that, kudos. You managed to bring out emotions that I have never experienced via films or books, much less video games.
Even the end was bittersweet, and perhaps, fitting. When I first finished ME3, I couldn't believe that that was it. I thought I had done something wrong, missed a key mission hand-in, offended the wrong person. After reading a lot of the threads on this forum, as well as the top few Google search results for "Mass Effect 3 ending", I came to realise that that really was it.
I won't lie, I was completely disheartened at first. Then, I played it again - I suppose the series has kind of always been working towards a Shepard martydom. Watching Shepard give up her life shooting the conduit to destroy the reapers, while remembering those she held dear was one of the most moving moments in video game history. In hindsight, it was probably one of the more fitting ends to the series you could have thought of. Even the "control" option might have been somewhat plausible for a renegade Shepard. However, try as I might, I cannot fathom the synthesis ending.
The way the series ends is your choice. We as fans may not like it, but it is ultimately up to you. What I think many people take issue with is the lack of closure. Even though I hate the thought of it, I'm ok with Shepard dying. Its been hinted at, even if it is very sad. However, I felt a bit let down by the lack of explanation for the last cutscene with the Normandy flying away and my squadmates who were with me in London walking out on a jungle world. How did they get there? Its hard to convey the mix of "thank heavens they're alive" with "how the hell did that happen?" that I felt. What happened to the galaxy and loved ones I fought to save? The vibrant world you created deserved a better epilogue than what we saw. It ruined the feeling of sadness and emptiness which Mr Hudson hinted you were trying to elicit.
I don't really understand the ending. Everything that happened from the moment Shepard collapsed on the platform and rose to meet the reaper God. I would love to hear what it truly means. Even if I don't like it, I'd still like to understand it. I have an imagination, but hell, if I wanted to imagine how ME3 ended, I would have done so without shelling out £75 for the CE.
As I'm writing this, I feel incredibly sad. It reminds me that I play video games for fun, to immerse myself in a different world, and to experience things dreams are made of. With Mass Effect, you created such a world, for which I am certain many are grateful for. However, unlike with ME1 and ME2, I am not filled with an immediate desire to replay ME3. Its not because its a bad game. On the contrary, it is an awesome game. It's just that something which ends on such a despairing note is not something I wish to experience again. I'm not that masochistic. You yourself said so in your last scene "without future, we have no hope". How can I bring myself to go through another 40 hours of content (no matter how amazing it may be) if I know there is no hope for the world as I know it or for a future with the love interest I have courted over 3 games?
Please, help us understand, or give us some hope to work towards. The world you have created deserves it.
PS - some other minor niggles, but nothing as game-breaking as the ending:
1. ME3 is more buggy on the whole than ME2 or ME1. Various bits of dialogue don't synch, or Shepard is looking at a wall while talking. It ruins the moment(s).
2. The auto-dialogue is a little annoying. I didn't notice it on my first playthrough, because it was pretty much what my paragon Shepard would have said. However, on my renegade playthrough, it started to irritate me a little more.
3. Squad-mate - Shepard interaction felt much less robust and fleshed out compared to ME2. I would really have liked to talk more to my squadmates and get their feedback on missions, how they're holding up etc etc. Also some strange jumps with Liara as a LI - romanced in ME1 and LOTSB, but somehow at the beginning of ME3 its back to just friends?
4. Too few squadmates! Vega was quite poorly-developed as a character and it would have been nice for some ME2 characters to have more than a cameo. Also - no krogan
5. Journal system is awful. ME has always been about immersion. Just by running around the Citadel my journal is somehow packed with quests I never realised I had acquired? Where do I go? Have I actually fetched the required item? Don't know, and the journal doesn't tell me. Nor does it tell me where to go half the time.
6. After Mordin fakes his death on renegade playthrough - would have been nice to see his name on the Normandy "wall"
7. Requiring MP to get a high EMS in SP is unacceptable. I hate MP and
don't want to pay for an XBL subscription. Please don't make me do it.
I did every single side mission and still fell short of 4k EMS by a few
hundred points.
Last but not least, please don't let the lack of positives get you down. I loved ME3 right up until the ending - its a pity that had to sour the series for me. I've never cared about characters this much - not from TV series, books or movies, so you guys deserve a standing ovation for that. Regardless of what you do, you have my thanks for a wonderful journey. Here's to ME4 and beyond!
First off, thank you for the Mass Effect experience. The world is one I have sunk hours into - I have 5 ME1 saves, Over 15 ME2 ones, and I have just cleared ME3. I have every achievement for ME1 and ME2, something I have never bothered to do with any other game I have played. I think it is fair to say that Mass Effect is my favourite series. Ever.
ME3 was an emotional rollercoaster. It was fantastic and pulled me in. Every beating my Shepard got, every encouraging word from characters I have grown to hold dear. Those that died did so fittingly and heroically, and their dialogue was superb. Particularly memorable was the exchange between Shepard and Joker following the fall of Thessia and that between Shepard and Garrus in London. To whoever wrote that, kudos. You managed to bring out emotions that I have never experienced via films or books, much less video games.
Even the end was bittersweet, and perhaps, fitting. When I first finished ME3, I couldn't believe that that was it. I thought I had done something wrong, missed a key mission hand-in, offended the wrong person. After reading a lot of the threads on this forum, as well as the top few Google search results for "Mass Effect 3 ending", I came to realise that that really was it.
I won't lie, I was completely disheartened at first. Then, I played it again - I suppose the series has kind of always been working towards a Shepard martydom. Watching Shepard give up her life shooting the conduit to destroy the reapers, while remembering those she held dear was one of the most moving moments in video game history. In hindsight, it was probably one of the more fitting ends to the series you could have thought of. Even the "control" option might have been somewhat plausible for a renegade Shepard. However, try as I might, I cannot fathom the synthesis ending.
The way the series ends is your choice. We as fans may not like it, but it is ultimately up to you. What I think many people take issue with is the lack of closure. Even though I hate the thought of it, I'm ok with Shepard dying. Its been hinted at, even if it is very sad. However, I felt a bit let down by the lack of explanation for the last cutscene with the Normandy flying away and my squadmates who were with me in London walking out on a jungle world. How did they get there? Its hard to convey the mix of "thank heavens they're alive" with "how the hell did that happen?" that I felt. What happened to the galaxy and loved ones I fought to save? The vibrant world you created deserved a better epilogue than what we saw. It ruined the feeling of sadness and emptiness which Mr Hudson hinted you were trying to elicit.
I don't really understand the ending. Everything that happened from the moment Shepard collapsed on the platform and rose to meet the reaper God. I would love to hear what it truly means. Even if I don't like it, I'd still like to understand it. I have an imagination, but hell, if I wanted to imagine how ME3 ended, I would have done so without shelling out £75 for the CE.
As I'm writing this, I feel incredibly sad. It reminds me that I play video games for fun, to immerse myself in a different world, and to experience things dreams are made of. With Mass Effect, you created such a world, for which I am certain many are grateful for. However, unlike with ME1 and ME2, I am not filled with an immediate desire to replay ME3. Its not because its a bad game. On the contrary, it is an awesome game. It's just that something which ends on such a despairing note is not something I wish to experience again. I'm not that masochistic. You yourself said so in your last scene "without future, we have no hope". How can I bring myself to go through another 40 hours of content (no matter how amazing it may be) if I know there is no hope for the world as I know it or for a future with the love interest I have courted over 3 games?
Please, help us understand, or give us some hope to work towards. The world you have created deserves it.
PS - some other minor niggles, but nothing as game-breaking as the ending:
1. ME3 is more buggy on the whole than ME2 or ME1. Various bits of dialogue don't synch, or Shepard is looking at a wall while talking. It ruins the moment(s).
2. The auto-dialogue is a little annoying. I didn't notice it on my first playthrough, because it was pretty much what my paragon Shepard would have said. However, on my renegade playthrough, it started to irritate me a little more.
3. Squad-mate - Shepard interaction felt much less robust and fleshed out compared to ME2. I would really have liked to talk more to my squadmates and get their feedback on missions, how they're holding up etc etc. Also some strange jumps with Liara as a LI - romanced in ME1 and LOTSB, but somehow at the beginning of ME3 its back to just friends?
4. Too few squadmates! Vega was quite poorly-developed as a character and it would have been nice for some ME2 characters to have more than a cameo. Also - no krogan
5. Journal system is awful. ME has always been about immersion. Just by running around the Citadel my journal is somehow packed with quests I never realised I had acquired? Where do I go? Have I actually fetched the required item? Don't know, and the journal doesn't tell me. Nor does it tell me where to go half the time.
6. After Mordin fakes his death on renegade playthrough - would have been nice to see his name on the Normandy "wall"
7. Requiring MP to get a high EMS in SP is unacceptable. I hate MP and
don't want to pay for an XBL subscription. Please don't make me do it.
I did every single side mission and still fell short of 4k EMS by a few
hundred points.
Last but not least, please don't let the lack of positives get you down. I loved ME3 right up until the ending - its a pity that had to sour the series for me. I've never cared about characters this much - not from TV series, books or movies, so you guys deserve a standing ovation for that. Regardless of what you do, you have my thanks for a wonderful journey. Here's to ME4 and beyond!
Modifié par noxiuniversitas1, 17 mars 2012 - 05:15 .
#1775
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 05:05
noobslayerz
-
- Members
- 12 messages
Here are my thought of what i like and what i didnt.
For the most part the game was brilliant until the ''beam hit''
After that it just destroys all you played for the past games and in my opinion a cheap way outof the serie like you guys where afraid to put in a real ending just to keep it open enough so people can make their own, but that's really the oposite of what we want.
I really want closure to the story of Shepard and his band of brothers
Call me sentimental but i really long for a happy end, i dont care if it's a dlc and/or i need 10k war assets to get it, as long it's there.
Also i wouldt mind at all if you guys could finally let Tali put of her helmet, even if it's for once and only in the cabin of Shepard as an extra ''bonus'' if you romanced here in ME 2 and 3 like me, ( love Tali xD )
Speaking of Tali after the mission on her homeworld i was really looking forward to a end game scene before the credits go over my screen to see her and Shepard happy ever after holding eachother with a half done home on the background just like she says she would like to see him do.
Imagine my sadness to see the ending as it is now, total letdown.
This aplies to all characters btw, what happened to them? did they die? did i whipe out the universe? what's the deal with the planet my comrades crashed on? another dimension? Limbo maybe? why did they abandon me on earth in the 1th place?
Just to many question are unaswered.
For the most part the game was brilliant until the ''beam hit''
After that it just destroys all you played for the past games and in my opinion a cheap way outof the serie like you guys where afraid to put in a real ending just to keep it open enough so people can make their own, but that's really the oposite of what we want.
I really want closure to the story of Shepard and his band of brothers
Call me sentimental but i really long for a happy end, i dont care if it's a dlc and/or i need 10k war assets to get it, as long it's there.
Also i wouldt mind at all if you guys could finally let Tali put of her helmet, even if it's for once and only in the cabin of Shepard as an extra ''bonus'' if you romanced here in ME 2 and 3 like me, ( love Tali xD )
Speaking of Tali after the mission on her homeworld i was really looking forward to a end game scene before the credits go over my screen to see her and Shepard happy ever after holding eachother with a half done home on the background just like she says she would like to see him do.
Imagine my sadness to see the ending as it is now, total letdown.
This aplies to all characters btw, what happened to them? did they die? did i whipe out the universe? what's the deal with the planet my comrades crashed on? another dimension? Limbo maybe? why did they abandon me on earth in the 1th place?
Just to many question are unaswered.
Modifié par noobslayerz, 17 mars 2012 - 05:36 .
