7052 réponses à ce sujet

[goatman42]

Oh I have another issue I want to address. The quest log in the Journal is terrible. It doesn't actually track your progress on the quests so I run into situations where I hear about some object in a star system. I then run to that star system, only to find out I've already scanned all the planets which means I must have that object. But the quest log doesn't update so I would never know that! Then I run all the way back to the citadel and have to run around trying to remember where I actually got the quest from! Its a horrible system and I'm confused that this is even an issue because Mass Effect 1 and 2 did it perfectly.

So yeah, please fix this in a patch or something.

[Mangz]

I will talk about the endings wich are imo the only gamebreaking flaw, some minor annoyances like the journal are really nitpicking at this point.
 
1. The deus ex machina.

 Instead of magically making some reaper child coming from the cheapest scenes of the games (I didn't really like the whole guilt dreams, got why they were there and accepted it, til the endings) the central and final point of the plot, I wanted something in the lines of the rest of the series. Wich didn't include space magic, wich included Shepard questionning everything regarding reapers, wich included Shepard's will to fight. The themes are gone and we look at some sort of delirium tremens that spawns from nowhere in the 3 games, acknowledges nothing from them, even contradicting some.
-> I would like the ending to follow the theme and rules of the series.

2.No acknoledgement of choices

So as the ending cuts itself from the setting that took place in the other games of the series, it ends up happening in a bubble where nothing you've done matters. War assets, that I get as a gameplay way, are just a score making something - that has nothing to do to the fact of what you've done to gain them- happening. Tell me, how given the setting of the ending, the fact that I scanned every planet, managed to secure Salarian, Krogan, Asari, Turian, Quarian and Geth fleets has to do with Shepard magically transporting from the citadel to rubble, and taking a breath. Yep, nothing at all. This is because of the deus ex machina and the "magic bubble" where you end up.

->I would like the ending giving a show of my decisions panning out in this all out war.

3. Harbinger abscence

Harbinger managed to be even cooler than Sovereign as an antagonist, throught all the second setting he was everywhere, telling you would fail, that you accomplished nothing. Yet he is nowhere to be seen in ME3, bar the laser beam -that obliterates dreadnought- you survive.

->A confrotation of sort with him was inevitable, the indoctrination theory can offer a way out for that.

4.Mystery of the reapers

For 3 games we were taunted by reapers, telling us that our species couldn't understand them or their purpose. But when it comes to the final 10 minutes, the magical super space kid reaper god gives us the reason. Wich makes the reapers... well.. not unknowable at all, is an instant Xzibit meme, is all in all, well excuse me, pretty cheap.

-> If you're going to reveal the great truth behind a mysterious and far beyond mortal comprehension reach enemy, please let it be well written. Or. Just. Don't. We don't need to know why the reaper do what they do, speculation on this is healthy. Speculation on what the hell were these out of context 10 last minutes , is not.

5.Closure

As I said, leaving some gray areas is not a problem at all, in fact you should, in explaining EVERYTHING, you'll probably cheapen a lot.
But not giving any kind of closure and introducing new concepts in 10 minutes in a 100h long story is not.
We want to see consequences of our choices. Be it a DA:O style epilogue, some CGI, whatever. 
Not suddenly discovering things that make zero sense in the very universe you setup.
This is the last setting with Commander Shepard, (s)he deserves way more "so that happened after Shepard did beat the reapers (or didn't WICH IS FINE)", and way less "You see Grandson this was Shepard, buy some DLC and I'll tell you another story"

-> Give closure, not full explanation of everything that did and will happen, just closure.

6.It's not about bittersweet endings.

No really it isn't, at all. Sacrifice fits Shepard extremly well (giving a way out by a complete gold playthrought is also to consider). Just.. well, not this way.
I want to see failure to bring enough asset force Shepard to sacrifice himself, I want to see this making Earth burn to the ground, I want to see this make Shepard fail to beat the reapers.
I don't want my war assets calculating if Shepard can take a breath after ABC badly written, cliché on their attempt to not be cliché, out of character, choices. Choices that can't be rationnally affected by them (the war assets) in any way.
So yes, it's really not about the ending not being butterflies flying in pink silk background.

-> Given your choices, degree of bitterness of ending varies. The idea of Reign Tsurumaki in that regard is very good, in my opinion. (Effectiveness of Crucible, etc etc, this is something that has real impact from the war assets as you progress and improve its conception during the game. Damage taken by the fleets also taking into consideration how much you brought, civilian casualties, status of ground forces, possibilites are endless and actually linked to what you achieved)



TL;DR:

I would like the ending to be reconnected to the series, use whatever pot device to invalidate God Reaper Child (indoctrination by Harbinger bringing two birds with one stone on this). 
Make Harbinger an antagonist, stay in the theme of the series, the ending needs to be linked to the game, not magical ten minutes out of it in a stasis bubble.
Make war assets impact something they really impact (being fleets, ground forces and scientifics workig on the crucible).
Let the Reapers be mysterious, this is something we "don't need to know" for certain.
Give closure about Shepard, it's impact, his(her) companions, what's happening in the years to come in lights of the ending you got. Just a general idea.
The ending does not need to be a wonderful Shepard saves all, all is well, Shepard proceeds to fly out with the girl (guy, alien, hanar) on a flying unicorn and make tons of babies.
Please, I beg you, no Deus Ex Machina.

Modifié par Mangz, 17 mars 2012 - 05:27 .

[Druss99]

While I really can't offer suggestions for change because the ending as it stands baffles me so much that I don't know where to start changing it. What I would have expected to see in an ME3 ending would have been:

- Decisions: Not one big decision at the end but numerous smaller decisions throughout which change circumstances and can effect the survival of your squad, key characters and assets. Like the suicide mission and Virmire.

- War Assets: War assets needed to play a part in a final battle, obviously showing them all would be asking way too much, but showing a few of them and them having a genuine effect on the outcome and variables would have been excellent.

- The Squad: Showing them having an affect on the final battles seems like a no brainer to me, small cutscenes or even radio chatter updating on stuff like Grunt leading a squad to fulfil an objective, Jack's biotics holding back an advance, your unpicked squad members fulfilling some sort of role somewhere. Instead they are just standing around and then they are all gone, I don't need to see them all having a happy reunion or living happily ever after, I just need to see if they lived or died, to know they did something in the final battles, everything after that can easily be left to the imagination aslong as we know if they lived or died in the battle for earth.

- The actual final battle: Was Marauder Shields it? What about Harbinger? He spent all of ME2 firing off bizarre sexual taunts and he does next to nothing in ME3, I need to see him get taken out. Wether the final epic battle is Shepard fighting his way to activate the crucible and weaken the Reapers for the fleet to take out Harbinger and by implication the rest of the Reapers or I'd even settle for taking out Harbinger's core aslong as its a suitably epic battle. ME3 *HAS* to end on a bang, not a wimper.

- Shepard: Sending the guy out like that? After all the years and battles, it ends with him doing more damage than the Reapers? That would be fair enough if the explanation made any sort of logical sense. If he has to die then atleast give the option of dying a hero, no matter how hard it is to achieve, give the option. Calling him a legend at the end makes no sense when he does as much damage to the galaxy as the Reapers do.

- The Star Child: Lets just pretend that didn't happen.

[gabbie]

Hi Jessica,

I’ve never posted on any forum before but I feel the need to make my voice heard!
For the sake of your charts/graphs i’ll try to be as concise as possible.

Major problems:

Ending
I really like the Indoctrination Theory, intended or not, it would explain Shep’s limited choices at the end. Shep’s decisions have the potential to completely disprove Starchild’s/Reaper’s notion that synthetics and organics cannot peacefully co-exist and this should be reflected in the final outcome - ie Geth and EDI alive despite reaper destruction. It would be great if this ending could also include a final confrontation with Harbinger.

Closure
I need an explanation of the “teleporting” squad-mates/LI scenario. Clearly a vast chunk of the ending plot needs adding/explaining, my preferred resolution being squad-mates/LI manage to scrape you off the floor and everyone is marooned or gets back to Earth together. If Shep lives I at least want some hugs and smiles to conclude everything and if not, some sort of recognition for her sacrifice!

Minor points:
All character storyarcs were handled and concluded amazingly well, with the exception of Thane. I thought the fight with Leng was awesome but the romance needed more airtime and it was disappointing that none of the other characters commented on his death.

I’m ok with the destruction of the relays - I imagine it would make for an interesting and, more importantly, challenging universe for future characters or for future DLC.


Other than that I’d just like to say a big congrats to everyone involved in this otherwise amazing and unforgettably emotional experience. My favourite moments are too numerous to list here but the ones that stand out the most are the final goodbyes with Anderson and Kaidan (LI) and the renegade option to end Leng - my arm physically mirrored Shepard during that cutscene!

Thanks for listening!

[BTDUBS]

Just discovered a new plot hole. If the Reapers are so concerned about organic and synthetic life, why did Legion (who was familiar with the reapers through the heretics) say that the Geth were not liked because the fell outside of the Reapers plans in ME2?

[Belhawk]

I agree with samflag & junmadine.
also, the journal was next to useless. Why doesn't it update while u r doing a quest?

[Jitawa]

While I found the ending disappointing, that's not my largest issue with the game. If you want to go angsty and artistic with the ending, that's certainly your prerogative.

I would draw a distinction between that and the actual climax. The series has been sold on a concept of choices mattering (Bioware execs always talk about this, there's interviews about how they're different from jrpg-makers because their games have "actual choices" and decisions matter).

This game is the culmination of many many decisions. I found myself saddened that decisions like saving/killing the rachni queen amounted to so little change in the actual game. The rachni went from building ships and armies that would be there to support you (as they suggested in ME2) to total annihilation and a trapped queen in ME3. The rachni nearly conquered the galaxy, and a queen is capable of populating a colony within days. However, we're led to believe that unlike the batarians, elcor, volus, etc. (who all survived with some sort of fleet/force) - they're a total loss. The sum total of difference between your "large" decision is a few lines of a dialog, and a possible betrayal/loss of a war asset.

This is my issue. The climactic final battle should be a showcase for your choices throughout the series, but aside from some behind-the-scenes arithmetic, your choices through the series and final game have little-to-no-impact on the conclusion. The forces you've assembled are ultimately of very little significance aside from some barely noticeable differences prior to the "pick your ending, A, B, or C." sequence that has everyone up in arms.

For me, it's less an issue of the catalyst/god-child existing in the first place, and more an issue that nothing you did mattered. If you go into the final battle killing everyone possible from ME1 to the conclusion vs. being Saint Shepard... you'll see practically no difference in your choices at the conclusion. You could do exsocial.bioware.comexact same possibilities ending-wise with a little multiplayer alone.

I think some people have suggested an analogy of Dragon Age:Origins, that the forces you collect for the final battle are... actually there for the final battle. This makes it seem like it mattered more.

It's more than that though. These are choices over the course of a much longer time.
If you'd secured the aid of the rachni queen (save her, etc.) you'd expect a message from her prior to the final battle. You'd expect a cutscene or part of the final battle where a force of marauders/whatever is taken down by rachni warriors.
You'd expect the Salarian aid you secured by whichever means to be reflected by STG-style forces sniping charging brutes.
You'd expect scenes of that those totally randomly secured alien aid like Drell or Volus to have some scene in the space-battle or ground battle (like in Star Wars you see cut-aways to pilots or Admiral Ackbar in the middle of the climactic battle).
You'd expect all those characters that you kept alive through three games to be heard over the comm or running by your side in the background fighting with you.
Also, if you're a spacer, you should probably be able to talk to your mother.

There's a distinct lack of feeling that those prior choices really mattered. More than any substantial "out of nowhere" or "screws up the universe" element of the god-child, the fact that your choices don't seem to impact the final outcome of either the battle or ending is bothersome. It makes it feel like we've been lied to with respect to the agency of our player avatar.

[Vandriel]

Reign Tsumiraki wrote...

 Ah, perfect! I already wrote up what I think would solve the problem...

*copypasta*

1.  Only change the ending starting from the last scene with Anderson/Shepard/TIM. Everything about the ending before that stays the same, with a few changes. 

2. Completely ignore the God-child-spirit. It conflicts and contradicts the "Protheans fooled the citadel" basis in ME1. This was important. Cut it out entirely.

3. Make several choices based off of war readiness, and how many assets went into the Crucible. Such as:

Very low: Launch a giant EMP burst that destroys all Reapers, AI, Citadel, Relays, most technology, ect, as well as sacrificing earth. Shepard dies. Normandy crashes, and everyone aboard dies.

Low: Same, but without damage to earth. Shepard dies. Normandy Crashes. Crew dies.

Medium-low: Burst that only destroys all AI. Shepard dies. Normandy Crashes, Crew dies.

Medium: Burst that destroys all AI in the Sol system, and the Reapers. This allows the Geth to live, but EDI dies. Saves the Relays, but not the citadel. Shepard dies. Normandy crashes, crew survives.

High-Medium: Releases a burst that disables the Reaper Shields across the galaxy, allowing the fleet to easily kill the rest(Reapers are weak without their shields, as ME1 shows. A single torpedo from the Normandy killed Sovereign without it's shields) Shepard lives. Normandy damaged, but does not crash, and the player is treated to a small cutscene of the Normandy and the fleet blowing up a few reapers. 

High: Sends out a burst attuned to the Reaper core (The Geth provide the information. They studied reapers, remember. If they are not available, the Quarians provide it, having researched the Reaper corpse on their planet) causing the Reapers' reactors to overload and die. However, the Reaper core just happens to be identical to the Core of the Citadel as well. The Citadel overloads and blows up. Shepard lives. Relays stay intact. Player is treated to a cutscene of the Reapers blowing up, troops on the ground rejoicing, as well as the Normandy picking him and Anderson's body up before Citadel explodes.


Very-high: Sends out a pulse that kills only Reapers. All tech stays intact. Shepard lives. Relays intact. Citadel intact. Player is treated to the cutscene above, minus the citadel explosion. 

In addition, the endings shown in the "original" game would be available. These would be available on the left side of the dialogue wheel, while the ones I have proposed would be on the right. Synthesis would be unlocked at the Very-High level, and Control would be unlocked at the High-Medium level. Destroy would be available no matter what.

To complete the Synthesis, Destroy, or Control ending, the player takes the elevator up to where the Original ending takes place. This way, they do not have to design an entirely new environment. The animations and flashbacks for these endings would stay the same. The only difference in the cutscene after this would be no Normandy crash.

The options of the three highest unlocked options would show up on the right of the wheel on the right side. For instance, someone who had Medium assets would get the option of killing all AI everywhere, all AI in the Sol system, or all technology everywhere without damage to earth.

The dialogue wheel would look like this, if someone had 100% of all assets.
                                Synthesis              Take down Sheilds
                                                __________/ 
                                               (                       )
                 Destroy    --------(                          ) ---Kill reapers, Destroy Citadel
                                               (                       )
                                                -----------------
                                               /                      
                                      Control                Kill all Reapers
4. Include a small, text and scene ending. Small clips of certain occations from the various decisions made will show. This will vary by ending.

EXAMPLE: Geth and Quarians rebuilding, all species rebuilding the invaded home planets, ect.

5. A small scene with Anderson and Shepard before Anderson dies, about what Shepard will do if the Crucible works. Shepard can then respond in a variety of ways depending on what options he is presented with because of the war assets claimed. Anderson then says the whole "I'm proud of you" spiel, wishes you luck, then dies.

EXAMPLE: 

Retiring and living in peace, finally, with LI(or alone, if that is the case).

Saying “This device will probably destroy the citadel and kill us, so it does not matter.”

Continue to pursue peace and justice as a Spectre.

Become a diplomat/politician and guide humanity

Ect.

6. Any teammates that were with you at the time you got shot by the reaper will run towards the teleport-beam and make it to the Citadel ahead of you, thinking that you died, and that they need to finish what you started. Upon arriving there, you meet up with them and get to the console. They also get manipulated by TIM, but only you are able to "break free" by shooting or talking down TIM. 



Anyway, that's my whole view on it. 


THIS WAY:  
Players can get the endings they want, the player can still sacrifice themselves to get the endings they want, the Devs can have the endings they want, and originally intended. The only thing this really cuts is the stupid spectral Ghost-child-God thing, which was ridiculous in the first place. 

How does this sound? I tried to address every concern and viewpoint, and combine them into one good ending that I think would please everyone. 

This is a great scenario.

[cinderburster]

Fred_MacManus wrote...

4. Clean up the graphics a bit, OK? Some of the textures look like they were recycled from ME, without being updated to reflect improved graphic capabilities.

Going to add to that: what happened to being able to tweak my graphics myself?  Not being able to is fine for Xbox, where every machine has the same capabilities, but not for PC.  I don't trust the game to choose its settings for me.

[Amtorian]

First of all I want to say that the game was absolutely superb, until the last 10 minutes.  I expected characters to die and/or sacrifice them throughout the game.  Mordin death was handled well.  Thane's death was marvelously done - I actually got chocked up.  Legion's sacrifice to save his people was extremely well done.  Generally, for myself and I think, many other gamers, having a character that have grown to love, or even hate, die in a tasteful, meaningful way is not a problem.

That being said, here were my expectations for the ending(s).

1) An option for Shepard to sacrifice him/herself to save the galaxy.
2) An option for Shepard to have another way to end the reaper threat without sacrificing themself. Ideally this choice would have varying degrees of success depending on what your EMS was.
3) A Dragon Age: Origins like Epilogue after the ending.

Taking the endings solely on face value (no indoc. theory, etc.)…

Control:

For those not willing to possible sacrifice the Geth and other synthetic life (who just saved from destruction hours before), this seems like a good option.  Even with the Mass Relays being destroyed, Shepard would control the reapers.  Since the reapers built the relays in the first place, they could re-build them under Shepard's direction.  Unfortunately that ending as written doesn't give any indications of something like this occurring.

Synthesis:

This could have really been the Shepard's sacrifice ending that people were looking for.  This would remove the Reaper threat for all time, but not destroy other synthetic life.  This makes it attractive.  However, the utter lack of an Epilogue really shows here though, as people don't really get to see the results of their sacrifice.

Destroy:

This seems like a renegade option on some levels, as we are told that it will also destroy other synthetic life, and a good chunk of our current technology - i.e. Shepard is willing to do whatever it takes to stop the reapers. However, it also seems like a paragon option as it truly remove the reaper threat.  Control seems to have just enough doubt to its success to make destroy attractive.  What would have been better for this, imo, would have been for the crucible to not outright destroy the reapers, but to disable them long enough for our war assets to really be able to take them out.  Then our EMS would have more weight.  The lower our EMS the less effective we are at taking them out.  An epilogue could then show us a range of forms victory over the reapers.  Including another XX years of hard fought battles to  finally be free of their threat, or our war assets barely make a dent in the reaper forces and they go on to reap the  humans and/or other races and the cycle continues. 

The Normandy running away doesn't make a whole lot of sense.  I do hope that more people caught that Stargazer is on the same two-mooned planet that the Normandy crashes on.  While this does give the impression that some of the Normandy's crew survived and that their descendants continued to live on that planet, it’s not the kind of closure people were hoping for.  Also, I thought it was kind of a crappy illusion to current day Earth -- where we really don't know what's out there in other solar systems or on other planets beyond our reach.

Modifié par Amtorian, 17 mars 2012 - 05:28 .

[Jamie9]

BTDUBS wrote...

Just discovered a new plot hole. If the Reapers are so concerned about organic and synthetic life, why did Legion (who was familiar with the reapers through the heretics) say that the Geth were not liked because the fell outside of the Reapers plans in ME2?

Uhhh.... Legion is a synthetic. The Catalyst, and by extension the Reapers entire goal is to stop the creation of people like Legion.

It's the opposite of a plot hole... a plot mountain?

[Bronze65]

I don't mind a bad ending or an ending where Shepard dies. I would just like an ending where it's all happy and such.

Questions I would like answered:
What happened with all the bonds I forged?
What happened to my love interest?
What happens to others interests?
What happened with the Geth/Quarian relationship?
What happened with the Krogan children?
Are the Krogan/Turian/Salarians still getting along?
What happened with Anderson?
What was the overall conclusion?

Frankly, I think the dream/hallucination/indoctrination theory fits, but I don't know what happens after Shepard wakes up from the rubble.

Where was the big boss battle at the end?
Where did Harbinger go?

Conclusions. With such an epic series, I could see the ending lasting for a long time to explain everything.

[Saku39]

Yes, a protracted battle on Earth vs. Harbinger with War Assets (Civilian Fleet Bombardment/Volus Bombers/Krogan Charge of the LB) being central to victory would be very satisfying. Say, five or six variables (biotics/ defense/ artillery/ bombardment/ science/ morale) and several different segments, like the duel with Darth Malak, but much longer. The end fight should take like 20 min at least.

Also, switching between two mechanics would also be very satisfying to me as a player. Make the final battle partially a very truncated RTS for one or two minute segments, making the numbers side of War Assets concrete and visible. This would also serve to make the endings almost infinitely varied. This would also be be very fast to develop, yes? Once reaching the Citadel, Shepard could co-ordinate strikes on the vidscreen with Hackett in between waves of Reaper enemies. Very exciting, very satisfying. This is the kind of thing I assumed the ending would provide.

[Rune-Chan]

Voice acted playable characters are great, they increase the flow of conversation and are an excellent way to keep immersion.

But can you please stop making them say things that we did not choose to?

It is extremely jarring to hear my Shepard proclaim to Specialist Traynor that she finds chess to be boring. Does she? She is supposed to be my character, surely the personal interests are down to me, not the writers? It's not like leaving that reply out detracts from the game in any way, but adding it in, you are deciding features of my Shepards personality for me. It's not necessary, and adds nothing positive to the experience.

How about the fact that Shepard is constantly forced to act unprofessionally without any player input? My Shepard would have told James that no way in hell is she going to spar with him at a time like this, she's not going to risk injury in her free time in the middle of a war, but again, you decided that she would anyway.

Another Traynor section, when she goes to your room invited. You can either mock her belief that Chess is an enjoyable game, or offer to have a shower... No "Sure, chess sounds good."? No "Maybe some other time."? No "I don't like chess, sorry."?

The dreams. Why does my Shepard have nightmares over the death of a single child? Surely there would be more traumatic things they have experienced? Like letting a team member die on Virmire, having parents murdered (colonist), seeing humans liquified (ME2)? Yet you force our Shepard to care about a single death amongst billions for no obvious reason.

Is it that difficult to give us basic options? The answer is no, you have done it in most of your other games. Including Mass Effect 1 and 2.

There are more, but they are basically the same point: Unless it's plot relevant, stop forcing our characters to think/feel/do/say things. Some of these might even sound petty, but when you think about it, they are things that do not add to the narrative or story in any way. They seem like they are adding depth to Shepard, but if they completely go against our idea of Shepards character, they are detracting from them, not adding.

The argument could then be "Well we decided Shepard was a soldier etc.". Yes, but that is relevant to the main plot, it does not say anything specific about who Shepard is or why they did it. You obviously need to choose certain actions for Shepard, but these should be ones necessary to drive the plot foward and nothing more.

The endings were horrific, this has been covered, let's just say I support the '5 reasons why Mass effect reasons are right to dislike the endings' article by Forbes.

Everything else is more or less perfect. Combat, squad banter/interaction, weapon modifications and power upgrades were great.

Oh, and not enough was done for ME2 characters, they were pushed out too much in favour for the ME1 crowd.

Modifié par Machines Are Us, 17 mars 2012 - 05:45 .

[Zebra3]

I doubt I could add more to this discussion that hasn't already been said. But I'll go ahead anyway:

1) 99% of the game is fantastic. Everything up until Harbinger blasts you is amazing. After that is when things fall apart.

2) Give us some endings that are different from each other.

3) Give us closure. Give us a definitive ending. Don't create more questions.

4) Get rid of everything that has to do with everyone in the galaxy being stranded/destroying all advanced technology. What's the point of uniting the galaxy if everyone is screwed in the end anyway?

5) Don't make Joker punk out.

6) Don't introduce new information in the end of the final act. That's where things need to be resolved. Not start something new.

7) Have some endings that agree with your own fiction. It was established in The Arrival that destroying a Mass Relay pretty much annihilates the system its in. So, why wasn't Earth incinerated anyway?

That's all I can think of at the moment. I may post more later.

[durasteel]

Among the issues many of us had with the ending of Mass Effect 3, I think one of the most important – although not the most frequently discussed – is what emerges as the central theme in the final few minutes. We are removed from the driving impetus of the rest of the game (save the Earth, save the Galaxy) and thrust instead into the position of being the ultimate arbiter between organic and synthetic beings. Setting aside, for the moment, whether that last-minute change in theme is a good idea, I think that the treatment of the theme itself deserves some discussion.

The theme of the relationship between organic and synthetic beings might not the central story of the rest of the game (or the series,) but it is certainly present and drives some of the sub-plots. By the time we reach the Crucible, we have had several chances to consider this relationship and its implications, and Shepard will have made a number of important decisions that shape the narrative up to that point. In each of them, questions are raised and answers demanded. “Does this unit have a soul?” is perhaps the most direct example of this, but the questions are deep and the answers meaningful.

On Rannoch, we see the nobility and life-affirming sacrifice that synthetics are capable of. Shepard is able to bring organic and synthetic beings into peaceful cooperation, going far beyond simple coexistence. By accepting and embracing the simple right to exist of the Geth, Shepard proves in an unequivocal way that synthetics and organics do not have to be in conflict.

In the relationship between Joker and EDI, Shepard is able to prove again that the most artificial thing within that dynamic is the perceived boundary between synthetic and organic persons. Once the prejudice is overcome, and AI and an OI (organic intelligence) can interact and become familiar with each other, with all the charming awkwardness of any two people of different backgrounds.

A related theme throughout the game is self-determination. The Krogan clearly deserve the right to set their own destiny, neither uplifted by the Salarians nor pacified by the Turians. Curing the Genophage is a clear metaphor for empowering the Krogan to decide for themselves how they will pursue a role in the galaxy, with the understanding that even if they choose poorly, it is a choice they should have the opportunity to make. This same theme applies to the Rachni, and Shepard can champion their prerogative to determine for themselves how to exist, without mad scientists or Robo-Cthulhu forcing them towards a pre-determined role. This theme is no less prevalent with the Geth, as Shepard decides whether their fate will be their own, or they have no existence beyond being slaves to the Quarians and pawns of the Reapers. In fact, the almost identical situations Shepard faces with both the Geth and the Rachni become an important piece of the synthetic/organic dynamic, showing that each is capable of being dominated by either organics or synthetics, and each presents Shepard with a moving plea for its right to simply exist on its own terms.

As Shepard races to save Earth and the Galaxy, another dynamic emerges. At the end of the previous game, the antagonist and face of the enemy is established as Harbinger. As we progress through this game, however, we find Shepard more often than not facing forces under the control of the Illusive Man. The cold, calculating menace of Harbinger and the fierce zealotry of the Illusive Man are each dangerous in their own right. Both organic beings and synthetic beings are capable of atrocities and generally abhorrent behavior. Interestingly, when you combine these two through indoctrination, things get a lot worse.

All of this weaves into a textured and nuanced thematic fabric before the end of the game. A paragon Shepard probably reaches this point with the understanding that both organic and synthetic beings are capable of heroism and villainy. Both are deserving of the chance to exist on their own terms, both are capable of self-sacrifice and love, and it is even possible for love to flourish and grow between synthetic and organic. Paragon Shepard will be in a position to understand full well that in Mass Effect, the biggest barrier to peaceful and cooperative coexistence between the created and their creators is the attitude that it isn’t possible.

The end shreds that fabric.

At the end, Shepard is told The Way It Is by the star child god being. This entity, the Catalyst, is for all intents and purposes The Voice of God. It is the origin of the problem, and its solution. It speaks with apparent omniscience, even making predictive statements about the future with no equivocation. Shepard cannot question, cannot argue, cannot refuse.

Setting aside for the moment any issues people have (and I have many) with the character of the Star Child and the encounter with it, the fundamental statement of The Way It All Is made by the Catalyst goes completely against the principles established by a Paragon Shepard. The Catalyst makes a statement of inarguable fact that organic and synthetic beings cannot coexist peacefully, that synthetics are destined to surpass and destroy organics. Therefore, The Voice of God forces Shepard to choose from among three unappealing options.

The Red choice reinforces the principle that organic and synthetic beings cannot coexist. Despite the fact that Shepard has peacefully coexisted with every AI he has encountered other than the Reapers, all AI is grouped together as an enemy of organic life here. It is a stark rejection of Legion’s soul, and it is predicated on an “us versus them” attitude that previous events and narrative in the game have unequivocally proven to be a fallacy.

The Blue choice isn’t much better. Despite the strong recurring theme of free will, Shepard forces his will upon the Reapers, making them his puppets. Not only does this reduce the big boogey-man of the Mass Effect series to little more than over-sized pawns, but it completely strips away the possibility of making a paragon argument that coexistence is possible between AI and OI. The Voice of God tells Shepard, in a way that cannot be questioned or argued with, that this coexistence is not possible. If you take control of the Reapers and cease the reaping, it will not lead to peace, but will lead instead to chaos when synthetics inevitably decide to purge organic life from the galaxy, never mind the fact that the only synthetic life that seems to be doing anything of the sort is, you know… Reapers (under the control and at the direction of the Catalyst, currently appearing as the star child and speaking as The Voice of God.)

The Green choice… Well, let’s set aside the discussion of digitizing Shepard into a universal virus (retrovirus + computer virus) to rewrite all genetic code and computer code in the galaxy to make everything into a synthetic/organic hybrid via the space magic of big green explosions. Even if that hand-waving is acceptable, you are still left with the underlying premise that this is (unarguably and without question) the next stage of evolution, and the only viable permanent solution to the (unarguable and unquestionable) inevitable conflict between organic life and its synthetic creations. Again, coexistence cannot be; assimilation is the only sustainable way forward. This basically goes against every principle established by a Paragon Shepard. Free will and self-determination go out the window, Shepard and the Catalyst will re-write you for your own good (which isn’t like making husks at all, right?) Respecting the diversity of beings, including refusing to exterminate entire species and acknowledging the right of Geth to exist as self-aware machine sentients, is dust in the wind as Shepard and the Catalyst homogenize every thinking thing in the galaxy.

The Mass Effect series is truly remarkable. There is a line in the song “Thick as a Brick” by Jethro Tull that goes “I may make you feel, but I can’t make you think.”  Mass Effect accomplishes both, drawing the player into the action, into the emotion, and into the philosophy of it all. Legion and EDI make you question what intelligence, self-awareness, and even life really mean. Does this unit have a soul? Legion has as much of one as any character in the trilogy. Can a machine love, and receive love in return? EDI and Joker make it a reality. Consideration of the very nature of love is almost demanded even earlier, as you consider your feelings for members of your squad who are not human, yet with whom Shepard can relate on a deeper level.  Hours upon hours spent in this fictional reality make consideration of these issues inevitable, and you start to wonder about things like an Asari’s ability to touch a synthetic mind, and perhaps bear a child as a result of that contact. Mass Effect’s ability to inspire thought and feeling are a defining characteristic of these games, and yet when we reach the end we are told to stop thinking. The Way It All Is is laid out in starkly simplistic terms and we have no choice but to accept it, because it forms the basis for the three limited choices through which we end the game, end Shepard’s story, and end galactic civilization as we know it. At the core of The Way It All Is, though, is an assumption about organic and synthetic beings that paragons have spent a hundred hours per Shepard proving to be entirely and unequivocally false.

When people complain that the end of the games makes it feel like “it was all for nothing,” perhaps that is one of the reasons why.

Note: I played as a paragon almost exclusively, with a few exceptions. When I say “a paragon Shepard” it is because I don’t know whether or how being generally renegade might change the story.

[Masseeffekt]

ok, so i will also write down again my thoughts about the game. sorry for my english
first of all: me3 is, all in all, a great game.
but there are some issues i dont like:

1. less dialogue options.
cause of that the feeling of talking free is not as good as in me2, but i have to admit that its not really a big problem for me.

2. less dialogues with team/ partner
indeed this is negative, compared to me1 and me2. more dialogues with the teammates, or small missions with teammates would have been great - like in me2. this is something you could add with dlc.
this is the first thing i really didnt liked in the game.

3. story
well, actually the story was clear before the game was out there. thats all i can say about that.

4. and, by far the biggest problem: the ending
ok just the short version of why i really dont like the ending. it all starts when shepard is injured.

- totally brake of the mass effect style. its like star wars ends like matrix. that doesn´t fit!
i read a lot of sci fi stuff and i like "bad endings". but it has to fit with the style! blade runner istn´t matrix isn´t star wars isn´t war of the worlds and so on. is has to fit with the style of the story!!

- where is my team? what you did so great in me2 is this: the TEAMWORK! the final mission in me2 was so great cause you had your team and THE TEAM beats the enemy. not shepard allone, the team did it!
and this is so sad in me3: shepard alone (who needs anderson up there??) and not with his team.

- no choices! you have not the possibility to say what you want in the ending! again i have to say: this is not mass effect style!

- big logical problems. other threads give details about that.

- shepard has to beat the reapers. BEAT THEM. not fly away. this is what the fans wanna see! beating them with your team.

i think you wanted to make an ending everybody remembers. but a lot of players wont play the series again with that ending.
the ending of part2 was soo kitschy - but also soo great! this is mass effect! dont make something out of this game it never was! only a better ending can keep these games alive.

best advice i can give is: watch ending of me2, and then watch me3 ending. then you should see why this thread exists.

[beccathelion]

95% was phenomenal, and I get Shep has to die, but at least let him go out like a champ, not limping towards his defeat. He was just angry and tired. He wasn't at peace. That was the worst part: Shep didn't have any closure for himself.

[MrFrank]

Alrighty then! Constructive feedback time. I've stated my opinion many times on many different forums, imageboards, and news sites but I don't think I've ever really talked about it here so here it goes.

I did not mind the idea of the ending, albiet a bit Deus Ex, but I do believe it was executed poorly. If Bioware were to go on the route of fixing the current ending I would suggest adding more investigative dialogue. Let's not forget that there are a lot of fans out there who spend copious amounts of time reading through the codex and learning about the universe. Do the fans need to know who long the Reapers have been Reaping? No. But they'd sure as hell like to.

The three endings (yes I know they have minor variations, but let's be honest, there's only really three) are far too identical. No matter what the player did during the game, the mass relays are destroyed and the normandy is stranded somewhere (let's not forget the magic teleporting teammembers, though I'm convinced this is a glitch and was not intentional). Take into account the player's paragon/renegade rating - If the player went renegade, the relays are destroyed, if the player went paragon, they're saved. Explain this with "Shepard's outlook on life will affect whatever choice he made" much like his outlook affected his scars. It would also be nice if the game took into account who your most talked to team members were, and who your love interest was, so that Shepard would flashback to them instead of the same three people. This brings me to another point.

Closure. This is probably the biggest part of the problem. While Shepard's story is about stopping the Reapers, the game is, ultimately, about getting to know the characters and universe. I mean, why else would players run around talking to everyone they can? The game is pretty close to a 50:50 ratio when comparing combat time to character interaction. Because of this, ending a game that people have invested insane amounts of time into talking to people, building relationships, and exploring with no sort of epilogue as to what will happen to the universe and the characters they loved is of course going to cause outcry. This can be fixed however by giving players a short cinematic for each important character and race explaining what happened after the events in the games.

I'll sum all of that up before continuing to another suggestion
If Bioware chooses to stick with the current ending, a couple things can be done to improve upon it

• Give players more investigative dialogue
• Give players more variety in their endings
• Provide more closure, add an epilogue stating what happens to species / characters after the events in the game

Now that this has all been said, I would like to address the indoctrination theory. I feel Bioware has an excellent opportunity on their hands with this. First I'll briefly explain the concept - Shepard is hit by Harbinger's laser and is knocked out. He deals with the Illusive Man and it's clear he's being controlled (the beginning of the indoctrination sequence). When Shepard passes out after trying to activate the Crucible, the indoctrination begins. He is now in a dream sequence and everything after this point is him being indoctrinated.

I honestly believe that if Bioware wanted, they could use this theory to their advantage. It is a very cool idea, and if they were to release a sort of "real" ending once a lot of people had finished the game, it could go down as one of the biggest moves in gaming history. Bioware would have essentially tricked their entire audience, waited a month, and said "but wait, there's more!". The amount of press this would get, especially now with all this controversy would be incredible. It would solidify Bioware as one of the top innovators in the game industry, as a company that's not afraid to try something new. If they pulled it off correctly, they could capatlize on this situation.

Anywho, that's my opinion on this ending stuff. Personally I hope Bioware goes with my latter suggestion.

I'm just going to throw in a quick little gripe 
Characters from ME2 need more love. The entire game I felt I was being pushed towards romancing Ashley, Liara, or Tali. I wanted none of these. I wanted to romance Jack and I was pretty disappointed with the lack of conversations you could have with one of Mass Effect's most interesting characters. Especially the last bit of dialogue you get with her just before the end. I felt it was far too little for someone who's suppose to be Shepard's love interest.

[Zhor2395]

JoeLaTurkeyII wrote...

3) I'd like to see Electronic Arts dip into its coffers and match whatever amount the Retake Mass Effect movement has raised by the middle of April.  EA's accountants can surely find a way to justify such corporate good will.

More people need to quote this!

qouting

[SpectreVeldt]

I'm sure someone has already mentioned this, but I would love to see our decisions/choices come to fruition on-screen. If we saved the Rachni queen, I want to SEE her forces in action, perhaps saving another group, like the Krogan (some sweet irony there). I want to SEE the Quarians and Geth helping each other out if we managed to save them both. If we cured the genophage, I want to see the Krogans go all out, since they have something to live for now. And if we didn't, and Wrex found out, I want to see the opposite--just how much it affects their fight and spirit. Give us cut scenes that show us how every little decision we made, made a difference, and didn't just contribute to some number (EMS).

Additionally, I believe it's the general consensus that we want to know the repercussions and aftermath of the war. I want to be able to see what happens after all is said and done, and the effect of Shepard's doing. Show us our respective LI's reaction (if still alive) as well as the galaxy's. And most importantly, if you are adamant about sticking with Endings A, B, and C, at least give Shepard the option to REFUSE, because that is something Shepard would do (since the beginning, really). If Shepard must die for it, so be it--just show us how that affects the galaxy. Maybe even give us an emotional funeral for the Commander. We want to see how much of a difference we made.

As a side note, if we romanced Liara, it would be interesting to see her when she's a matriarch. We could not only see the long-term effects of Shepard's actions, but also see how and where our LI ended up. This can really apply to any of the LIs--a 'down-the-road' segment, if you will, whether Shepard lives or dies.

I think the baseline here is that we want to SEE how much of a difference we made; we want closure.

Mass Effect 3 is still amazing and worth replaying for the journey alone, but it would still be nice (wonderful, actually) if the aforementioned was implemented somehow. Thanks again, Bioware! Really shows that you are still the Number 1 Dev. when it comes to listening to their fans and gamers.

[Usagihunter101]

 It's good that the fan dissatisfaction with the existing endings is finally be acknowledged.

First off, I want to say that the entire Mass Effect 3 experiance was incredible up until it's "resolution", (But I'll get to the ending later...) that being said there are two things I'd change, both are mostly quality of life issues, but a fix for them would be nice.

1) The quest journal needs to update the status of quests. One of the most confusing things in the game was the fact that I'd often have to fly all the way back to the citadel in order to see if I had the requirements for a quest or not. It would also be helpful if there catagories for quests. (Spectre would be quests resolved by using your Spectre Access on the Citadel, Data would be quests resolved by finding information during missions, Retrieval would cover quests completed by searching for emergency beacons around the galaxy.)

2) There needs to be some other way of increasing Galactic Readiness, aside from multiplayer. I say this as a PC Player, since the PC Multiplayer is a ghost town. In the week I've been playing, I've yet to actually find a match with another human player; I've grinded levels and about 2% readiness from soloing bronze missions as a Vanguard, but doing it this way would take a very long time. (And the only long-term reward would be a slightly less terrible ending.)

Really, though, both of those are sort of small, quality of life issues, my big gripe like almost every other person who's played Mass Effect 3, is the ending. Where do I start? First off, the game is based around choices affecting the future; who you help and how you helped them have an impact on the future story. Mass Effect 3 seemed like it was heading in this direction, with Shephard making decisions around the galaxy and those decisions contributing this eventual fate of the galaxy and all within it. I tried my best throughout the game to make decisions that I thought would best help the effort against the Reapers.

This all changed in the last 10min of the game. None of the decisions I had made throughout the game made any difference; Did I cure the Krogan? Did I reconsile the Geth and Quarians? None of those decisions mattered in the end. All that mattered in the end was how, specifically, I was going to sacrifice my life in order to destroy galactic civilization in order to defeat the reapers.

Really, my biggest problem with the ending is that it lacks resolution; All I can tell you is that Shephard is probably dead, the Reapers are no longer a threat, and the crew of the Normandy is stuck on a planet for the rest of their lives. What happens to the Galaxy and all the planets we saved? Will there ever be another galactic civilization? What about the fleet that is now stranded in the Solar System? The Mass Effect story is truely grand story, and to have it end so... suddenly, without little resolution for the galaxy that we came to love is jarring and unsatisfactory- I sat and looked at the screen for a good five minutes after the final cutscene, waiting for a resolution that didn't come.

I've been a bioware customer since I bought Baldur's Gate II more than a decade ago and I've enjoyed every game since, Mass Effect 3 included, and I've grown accustomed to your level of quality being, quite simply, better than almost every other developer. The current endings to Mass Effect 3 and the trilogy it completes are confusing, contrived, and lack the kind of resolution we expected for the Science Fiction epic we've come to love. We aren't asking for the Icecream and Lollipops Penny Arcade ending; we are asking for an ending that takes into account the work we've done and the choices we've made across three games. For over a decade I've come to expect the highest level of design, gameplay and storytelling from Bioware, the ending of Mass Effect 3 is the first time I can honestly say you've failed to deliver a satisfying experiance. You should be better than that. 

[de3ex]

The character of Tali deserves better than just a altered stock image. Reveal to players, in game, what Tali looks like. Players have always been curious as to what Quarians look like under the mask, this is a great chance to show us.

Also, Bioware is better than just resorting to a haphazard photoshop job. You have made a diverse group of amazing looking and believable aliens. I think Bioware owes it to themselves to put in the same effort to Tali as they did with all the other species.

[Lukanp]

Dear Bioware, in all truth we are not asking for anything specific. I felt that you had a sea of opportunity to deliver a satisfying ending. I mean, there were so many variables taken from the previous games that you could potentially build an ending on. I was hoping for a bittersweet ending frankly, but I feared you might chose an easier path, something along the lines of Michael Bay films. I wouldn't be thrilled about such outcomes but I'd accept them. Unfortunately what we got was, well in my opinion, almost insulting. As a word of advise, I'd urge you to get involved in this matter because as it is, I fear the consequences might be severe, and you might even lose some long time customers, me included. A few of my close freinds are Mass Effect fans themselves, and I can tell you that their reactions to the ending you implemented were equally spontaneous. These people are casual players, they never get involved in any form of game discussions via internet, don't provide feedback or write reviews at all. What I'm trying to say is, the reaction of posters on these message boards is a fairly accurate sample of how your target customer base feels about this game in general. Don't make the mistake of underestimating this situation, I've honestly never seen such disappointment from an ending to a franchise, regardless of the medium. Thank you for your time, and good luck.

As far as actual suggestions go, I'm fairly liberal.The writer of this article has it pretty much covered:
http://www.gamefront...fans-are-right/ 

[Martin Baughman]

I wanted to say that I understand even though the endings are the primary concern
that many including myself are talking about on this forum. But I believe there
are some things that I wanted to clarify over in my reply:

The war assets that we accumulated over the course
of the game that appeared in cutscenes during the take back of Earth only just showed the ships which I admit
was an epic space battle but the ground forces like the krogan, the geth, the
asari, our squadmates from both ME1 and ME2 (those that survived), etc. are
examples we never got to see in final battle on earth. It just seems lke that was one part you guys missed out on.

The scene where we decide to make our final push should’ve been more like a mix
between the suicide mission in ME2 and the final mission in ME1 where we’re
able to make choices to coordinate our counterattack to the objective. Also the
scene where we do our mad sprint towards the beam was definitely very personal
and emotionally because like our greatest enemy is right there standing between
us and the objective is one of many scenes that gave me goosebumps.

Another issue is with the Catalyst at the end that takes the form of the child who Shepard witnessed dying in the beginning moments of the game. I felt that there should’ve been more acts of defiance in
that scene since the Catalyst admits to be creator of the Reapers and we have
been against them throughout both ME1 and ME2, defying them and delaying them
from completing their goal of wiping out all organic life. That scene should
have been our last act of defiance against the creator which then would led to
destruction of the reapers.

The consequences of each ending for Shepard were just three cutscenes of
our character dying no matter what we chose and the mass relays destroyed in
all of them which then leads to our ship with Joker and everyone on it crashing
on a unknown planet somewhere in the galaxy. Like I wrote earlier above
about the where this part in the game should’ve been our last act of defiance,
we should have chose that we can still stop the reapers without  making the choices given to us by the
Catalyst leading to a final boss battle and achieving victory rather than going
along with these choices which then lead to the destruction of mass relays that
leaves colonies, homeworlds, and everyone disconnected from the entire galaxy.
Also it also made us feel like Joker along with our squadmates and our love
interest abandoned Shepard in that cutscene.

I also believe the ending could have been handled better by having some options where
Shepard lives, the mass relays are not destroyed, and we saved the galaxy .The
consequences of the three options described to us by the Catalyst and how they
play out are just too similar to where there is no difference between them whatsoever. The kind
of ending where we are defiant, doing the right thing that enables every race
even synthetic races to live, the relays left behind belonging to the galaxy
this time instead being used by the reapers to enact their cycle of genocide,
and where the crucible uses it power and energy to just destroy the reapers and
them alone. And if we had enough EMS around 3500 to 4000, Shepard would live
reunite with everyone including love interest where there would be cutscenes
showing the united races of the whole galaxy cheering for Shapard then later
discussing with whoever deciding the future of the galaxy and where it lead up
to or if we didn’t had enough EMS around that range, we could’ve had a hero’s
funeral with all Shepard’s friends, love interest, and where life moves on
pointing out to where we help others in the game like Wrex and the fate of his
people on Tuchanka, The peace between the geth and the quarians, the fate of Palaven,
Thessia, Earth, and what becomes for Shepard’s companions. Maybe after the
credits roll, we get a cutscene of shepard’s love interest and/or children,
depending on our character’s gender and who our character got with, visiting
Shepard’s grave later on in not too distant future.

This would have been the kind of closure that we would have wanted for Commander Shepard’s story. The best conclusion that would’ve put our minds at ease and made us feel satisfied should have been
something like this and its something that I, including many others who feel the same as I do, ask of from Bioware to fix. But above all else, it great game nonetheless and I enjoyed every minute of it and if Bioware is willing to fix this for us, their loyal fans, we will happily appreciate it and support them all
the way for working hard to make this a greater experience than we ever imagined.