Matt_gekko88 wrote...
Valk72 wrote...
goose2989 wrote...
I'd pay any ammount of money at this point to see Shepard and Tali building their house on Rannoch
This.
This².
ME3 Suggested Changes Feedback Thread - Spoilers Allowed
#201
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:31
#202
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:31
SolidisusSnake1 wrote...
This video explains everything wrong with the ending, everyone should just repost it:
This. BioWare just needs to watch this e start making changes.
Make choice matter. Good choices equal good ending, bad choices equal bad ending. And "shades of grey" endings for when you do some right and some wrong throughout the game.
We want Epic Shepard, who destroy the reapers e saves the WHOLE galaxy (including Geth and EDI) lives and is reunited with his crew and L.I.
We want Tragic Shepard who dies in a blaze of glory, destroy the reapers and saves the WHOLE galaxy.
We want Fail Shepard, who can't destroy the reapers, and the galaxy is doomed.
And we want other possible outcomes in between those.
A lot of people already said it much better than I, I'm just here to support this ideas.
Please, gives us the CHOICE...the option to give my Shepard the ending that I think he deserves. choice is the golden word for everyone here, I think.
And make cinematics that SHOW what happens after the final choices, don't leave it implied and open to speculation.
#203
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:31
Also, some closure and clarification. Things like what happened to all your teammates and your love interest(s) that we have all grown so attached to.
#204
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:32
what I want for the ending :
1) use the Indoctrination theory
2) make us see our war asset in action
3) I want to be able to fail if I don't have enough war asset ( reaper destroy everything ), I also want to be able to have a somewhat bright ending (very hard to get but still there)
4) I don't want to know what is the reaper true purpose, I'm ok with the fact that there purpose are beyond what organic can understand (that's what make them great enemy and what make this whole story so epic imo)
5) give us closure ( even if it's just some text à la Dragon age origin, I want to know what happens to my squadmates and all the races
7)make it free
what I liked in the ending :
1) Final run to get to the beam
2) Anderson/shepard talk ( I have seen the uncut version and I like it more then what we have in the game tho)
I want a new ending because I love the game, I love the Mass Effect universe and 99,99% of the trilogy.
Modifié par Giguelingueling, 17 mars 2012 - 03:50 .
#205
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:32
Modifié par Major Swift, 17 mars 2012 - 03:44 .
#206
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:32
RaenImrahl wrote...
I'll take off my metal moderator skullcap for a second and respond as just another gamer for a moment...
I am looking forward to more pre-ending DLC that will expand the story before the finale and allow me (someone who is devoutly single-player) to aquire more war assets. As to the ending, I would suggest:
1) A DLC epilogue, which includes a series of slides after the final cutscene (the one with Joker and the crash, not the one with Buzz Aldrin). The content of the slides could answer many of the lingering questions, including those brought about by introducing an important new character ("The Star Child") in the last few minutes of the game... what did my decision mean? What happens to Earth? The fleet? The rest of galactic civilization? Did the destruction of the Mass Effect relays wipe out entire star systems, as was implied in the Arrival DLC? And, of course, what of the major characters? The actual content of the epilogue should reflect the choices I made throughout the series.
The DA:O epilogue was a great coda to the game... actually one of its best aspects, because it gave us a sense of accomplishment, even if our character sacrificed herself in the end. It should also be (relatively) easy to do, as opposed to having actors come back and animating entire cutscenes.
2) The Epilogue DLC should be free to those who have purchased and registered the game.
Ultimately, the problem with the game stems from a mis-reading on the part of the developers on the nature of the medium. They should look to Canada's own Marhsall McLuhan... "the medium is the message". We use this medium of the video game, especially a game as intricately woven and interactive as the Mass Effect series, at a much higher level of cognitive and emotional involvement that print, film, or television. The ending, as it stands, denies the player of much of that accustomed interactivity once Shepherd is blasted by the reaper during the final charge. An epilogue, as I have described, won't fix that, but it would mitigate it.
One other suggestion...
3) I'd like to see Electronic Arts dip into its coffers and match whatever amount the Retake Mass Effect movement has raised by the middle of April. EA's accountants can surely find a way to justify such corporate good will.
RI
We definately don't want picture slides with text as an Epilogue. It's better than what we have but we want ingame engine cutscenes at least.
#207
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:32
As for the method of obtaining this DLC I suggest that it be part of a larger pack that can be paid for by anyone regardless of pass status but that a 'Free Ending DLC' version which is essentially the pack lite be available to people with a registered online pass.
Also while in game cutscene epilogues would be nice, or just a definitive ending showing what happens after you defeat the Reapers would be nice, I think a text epilogue would actually work for the better ala DA or Jade Empire. You see, if you fail to stop the Reapers, it would describe in graphic detail how badly you messed up and failed which would give most players to go back and do it right.
Modifié par deathscythe517, 17 mars 2012 - 03:36 .
#208
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:32
But this epilogue must vary greatly depending on your war assets and ME1-3 decisions. I also think you should hire the Liara VA to read the epilogue as if it was from the time capsule she made
This shouldn't be all that changes though. There are some fundamental problems with the current endings, from simple things like expanding the dialogue with the Starchild so it makes more sense, fixing the squadmate-to-Normandy teleportation, explaining Joker's escape and reversing the loss of the Mass Relays in any genuinely "good" ending.
You can't have an uplifting ending where the entire fleet is stuck in Sol and Shepard's LI is lost on a faraway world. THat ending renders any pre-endgame DLC pointless, along with the ME trilogy and entire ME universe.
Modifié par CasbynessPC, 17 mars 2012 - 03:34 .
#209
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:32
Very , very interesting.
French fleet out.
Modifié par SpaRR, 17 mars 2012 - 03:34 .
#210
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:33
Most people have already covered the problems with the ending fairly well. The only thing I will say is that the charge towards the beam to the Citadel was great but it felt like it should lead to more combat and gameplay rather than the end it has now. The London mission is excellent and well done but doesn't actually feel like a proper final battle or end sequence. There needs to be a fight that really feels like a final fight for the game in order to cap off the series, the missle defence fight doesn't quite do that.
I would enjoy seeing more content with Jack and Miranda, although this is unlikely to happen. An excellent job was done with Jack in Mass Effect 3. Where I was lukewarm on her in Mass Effect 2 after her mission in Mass Effect 3 I was quite disappointed there wasn't more content for her as I really liked her character and the direction the team took with her.
I would like to see the Collectors return as enemies as there design was very interesting and they would bring a different play style to missions. The game sorely needs more enemy types than the three we have now of Cerberus, Reapers, and Geth (and the Geth are used rather sparingly in the single player). It gets rather boring just fighting the same old Reaper or Cerberus troops so many times.
The game is 99% good and I would very much enjoy more content but until the ending is changed (which I would not mind paying for I must admit) I will have trouble buying new mission DLCs. As it stands right now I don't even feel like starting a second play through on this excellent game because I find the ending so atrocious.
#211
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:33
The whole game Commander Shepard was getting more and more stressed, as time went on she became less and less 'human'. In a way.
When you first get onto the Citadel it feels like a dream. You're crawling through a hallway of your own dead. Mysteriously faced with the Illusive man with no hint at how he got there. When he commands you, you put a bullet in Anderson and are using all your might to resist.
The bodies are like the phantoms in her dreams that she'd been having. They didn't seem real. Her mental state is weakened by blood loss, consistent exposure to indoctrination. They might not have even been real.
Let's use other examples of other people who'd felt it.
Saren said Indoctrination was subtle and crafty. The Illusive Man didn't even know he was indoctrinated unless you Paragon'd the HELL out of him. Rana Thanoptist (Get out of here before I blow up Vermire Girl.) who had a weak mind committed suicide after even her relatively small exposure compared to Shepard. Shialla (Green Girl) was only freed from it by the effects of the Thorien and was Mindlinked to the Feros Collenists who made a suprising effective force. I believe Shialla's mind-link allowed other's minds to stabilize and counter re-indoctrination, that and the exposure to the Thorian's mind.
Shepard in the dream chases the kid, a dream that started as Post Traumatic Stress from watching a kid die, a cross of guilt to bare. But as the game went on Shepard kept being exposed to the Reapers more and more and more, destroying them, getting close. Others even with no reapers around were getting taken over and killing each other.
In the dark dream Shepard is warned, as she runs chasing the phantom she sees herself hugging the child, smiling creepily as they both burn, a forewarning of what lies ahead. That the reapers are riding on an image of her guilt as 'The Catalyst' of her indoctrination.
"Good Endings." -
Finally Shepard stands at the end face to face with her nightmarish guilt. Having made it so far only through the will to beat the reapers. She is offered three choices by the Catalyst.
One is to Control the Reapers, to become them. However as I was hinted, she is indoctrinated herself in the final throws. This destroys the Mass Relays and causes the reapers to withdraw.
Second is the Biomerge of Technology using her as the Palate. Everyone in the universe is made into a Cyborg. Including Synthetics who are Augmented with organic. The Reapers Withdraw.
The Last is to carry on strong, We win or we die! You destroy the reapers once and for all. However the cost will be the death of the Geth (Who would willingly make the sacrifice to save organics if you persuaded them.) and EDI (Who was always ready to die to help Shepard.)
The Catch 22.
I theorize the Catalyst ISN'T what it seems. It the Catalyst of Shepard's Indoctrination. That in each ending Shepard does not die a true death.
Ending 1 and 2, Shepard's mind is overthrown, Shepard is indoctrinated and is now controlled, Shepard thinks (S)he is dead. Now a tool of the reapers who is still alive. The Mass Relays are gone, but the reapers are infinitely patient and truly unknowable.
The Illusive Man's path of control means Shepard didn't stop the reapers and now the universe is stuck without the Mass Relays and the reapers are infinitely patient.
The Biomerge Path, means all life has been given the ideal form for indoctrination of all. Shepard's indoctrinated energy is in all life, organic or not. And the reapers are a part of everyone now. Allowing them to begin a mass indoctrination beyond scale.
The Destruction Path, Shepard destroys the reapers. Overcoming the indoctrination. Waking up amidst the rubble on earth. (Shep is a sturdy SOB to take so much damage.) The Indoctrination attempt failed Shepard's conviction held through to the end and even in an unstable condition Shepard was able to hold to "We fight or we die."
Both other endings Shepard stops fighting and sees Her/Himself die. Stop fighting and die.
However is Shepard dead? Or is Shepard walking indoctrinated while the true ending is under design?
"The Bad Ending" -
Shepard quickly before everyone is ready, before the Crucible is perfected rushes to fight the reapers. The Crucible is incapable of the Technomerge and Outright Indoctrinating Shepard isn't an option.
With some Resistance left (Due to shorter exposure time) Shepard destroys the reapers, the unfinished Crucible destroys the planet, the reapers, everyone on earth and Shepard. Shepard never gave into the Indoctrination and was too strong at the time to ever do so. Too much resistance left.
---
The Joker Vision
A final glimpse at what is going on, Joker crashing down somewhere. Is it a vision to placate Shepard? Is Joker lost and stranded with a need to be picked up?
The Reapers died, but so did the earth.
---
The Possible Future.
"Can you tell me another story about the Shepherd?"
At some point Shepard is required, if (s)he is indoctrinated (Blue/Green) Ending. She awakens to learn the reapers are still out there. That doom is still upon them. And that through the sacrifices of others His/Her indoctrination was broken.
If Shepard destroyed the Reapers, Shepard awakens. Having destroyed the Reapers and fought off the Indoctrination. The Reaper Tech is gone. However Shepard is alive. (Shepard is very largely Cyborg, grey muscles, wires, AKA Lazarus Project Cyborg.) Meaning that the Geth also possibly survived.
The new Mission Either way involves coping with the change to the universe. Tracking down the lost. Picking up the peaces and building a new path.
"I need to find my people.", "I need to know that (Love Interest) is okay." At your side you have your people. "I need to get the Quarian's Home." "Wrex's Family needs him." "The Asari need to return to Thessia."
"We are all together now, our enemy is gone, but we are stranded away from home. We need to rebuild, but we, all the people of this Galaxy, stand together to rebuild. We will do on our own what we always have. We will forge our own path."
Always remember it is a vast universe, there is still Dark Energy out there. There is still many enemies waiting in the universe. What new threats await when the Mass Relays aren't around to guide you?
#212
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:33
2. Not enough variance in the endings: These endings are fine as sort of middle-of-the-road choices where you didn't work hard enough in the game and so got an ending where almost everything is depressing, but the Reapers didn't win. There should have been at least 4-5 endings besides them that varied with things like: do the relays get destroyed? Does Shepard die? Do your squadmates die? Does Earth get destroyed? In the end, you are presented with 3 choices that do not vary in terms of what Shepard has managed to accomplish. There should be a Reapers win option. There should be a "Shepard dies but manages to preserve the galaxy" ending, and a similar one where he survives(Disney ending). There should be at least one ending where I feel like a hero. These endings did not make me feel like a hero.
3. I know it's boring to hear by now, but by God the rest of the game is nearly perfect. The writing was excellent, I was pleased with the range of choice offered to you within the non-ending story arcs, the gameplay was flawless. I cried manly tears at least 3 times, I pumped my fist, whispered threats to Kai Leng to myself....it was all fantastic besides the end.
Thanks.
#213
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:33
#214
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:33
Modifié par CaptainJaques, 17 mars 2012 - 03:34 .
#215
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:33
Jessica Merizan wrote...
I think I need to clarify myself. For the past few weeks, I've been collecting feedback. I have excel sheets, word documents, quotes, graphs, you name it.
In order for a collaboration between the devs and the fans to work, I need you guys to CONTINUE being constructive, and organizing your thoughts. I know where to look, but I need you to help me by contributing to the dialogue.
Saying "this blows" helps no one. Saying, "I enjoyed X but I found Z _____ because of A,B,C" is what I'm looking for. Channel your frustration into something positive (such as the RetakeME3 movement - constructive, organized thoughts).
Chris and I are both collecting your feedback. We're listening. Make yourself heard.
Alright then. I loved the game until the ending. It was entertaining and the amount of care BioWare has put into the game was obvious from the little references to ME1 and ME2 to the banter between the squadmates.
What I didn't like is quite possibly nearly everything about the ending. What I'd like to see is:
- Closure for Shepard's story. No "Make up your own stuff!" or "Lots of speculations!"
- Endings that make sense and do not feel like a disjointed, plothole-riddden nightmare.
- More varied endings. Everything seems to lead to the same outcome right now. The relays are always destroyed, the Normandy always lands on some sort of backwater planet.
- Endings that fit into the recurring theme of Mass Effect. The ME games always represented hope to me despite having to fight against almost unbeatable odds. It has been about emerging from the ruins in triumph with the hope for a better and brighter future and not this modern notion of an artsy grimdarkgritty ending.
I, personally, don't need a Hollywood Ending, but what I'd like to see is to at least a silver lining after all that has happened. Shepard, with his/her friends at his/her side, ready to face another day, to rebuild what has been lost. Shepard deserves a break.
Modifié par Chignon, 17 mars 2012 - 03:38 .
#216
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:33
Sharkey1337 wrote...
JoeLaTurkeyII wrote...
The effects of indoctrination are irreversible, and Shepard being "forced" into anything defies what Mass Effect has been about for so long.
Ah, but strong willed characters like Saren and TIM were seen fighting the control at the very end. Based on what choice you make at the crucible point the effect would be seen on your willpower. If you chose Destroy, your will power is so strong that Shepard would actually break free of the indoctrination attempt. Seeing as how Shepard has been able to perform the impossible so many times before, why not have him be the first person to break free of indoctrination?
Because his brain would continue rapidly deteriorating after ME3, robbing all Shepards of their sanity and chance at a longer life. And robbing the player of choice in the matter.
#217
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:33
Firstly, thank you for taking the time to listen to our opinions. I'm not particularly good at trying to explain my thoughts coherently, but I'm going to try.
1. We want more distinction between the endings based on player choices. There's so many huge choices to make in the ME universe, but the endings made none of those choices matter. For a game that
2. Happier endings. In my opinion, all the endings were downers. Should all the ending be sunshine and rainbows and happy times with your LI and your babies in a perfect universe? No, but I believe players should have that option if they want it, just as they should have the option of a bad ending if that's what they wish. Roleplaying games involve the player on a much deeper level than some other genres of games, and players should be rewarded for their efforts and feel that they can end their long, long journey and their hours of dedication and enjoyment on a positive note.
3. If you don't want to make the endings all happiness, at least give us closure on our squadmates and the ending. The ending as it is meant nothing to me because it was so conflicting. We've fought with and loved these characters, and we want to see what happens to them. The ending where your crew runs the heck away and crash-lands on some random planet just kills me, because why the heck would they do that to Shep?
I've tried to put my strongest thoughts into this post, but for everything else:
^ this video sums up my feelings best.
Thanks for your time. I really want to believe you when you say you're listening to us.
#218
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:33
That said the overall story was great. Combat is usually just filler content for me, but ill admit its much improved from the first 2 games.
Most of all i loved the character interaction, the continued relationships with all of your crew and former crew is easily the most satisfying aspect of the franchise to me. Which is why it kills me how the story ends.
What possible purpose does it serve to strand our crew in the middle of the galaxy, with absolutely no details into how they live on afterwards? Do Tali and Garrus starve to death slowly in a levo based environment? Do they ever even get off the planet? Because it looks like the stargazer scene has the same two celestial bodies on the horizon. Why were they even on board the Normandy to begin with?
The only reason i have been able to think up is its a backup in case earth or the sol system was destroyed, your crew (and humanity) would live on elsewhere. But if you defeated the reapers it only serves to fuel a feeling of defeat which seeps into every single one of the endings regardless of your decisions and victories.
I really can't wrap my head around shepards inability to question or refute the catalysts flawed logic during the ending "dialogue". He spends so many years fighting the reapers, barely surviving and sacrificing all this time, and now hes suddenly confronted with the reapers own intelligence, they're very core, and he has NOTHING to say to it?
i realize that the three ending options can be POTENTIALLY meaningful and distinct choices, but you are given such little information and shown NO ramifications about them, that it seemingly boils down to a colorwheel game.
Its a pretty short summary, the trilogy was amazing, simply unparalleled, and it built you up to one of the most unsatisfying conclusions i've experienced in any media setting.
Modifié par Szaiu, 17 mars 2012 - 03:43 .
#219
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:33
#220
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:34
#221
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:34
1- Part of the problem that people had with the endings was, in my opinion, from an emotional standpoint (See: http://social.biowar...961/96#10026628 and item #1 here: http://www.cracked.c...ddicted_p2.html). In this vein, I consider that, regardless of the specifics of what the content ends up being, it has to have enough emotional appeal to counteract this. I believe therefore that it is in everyone's best interests to drive the emotional impact of whatever you release as high as possible without it becoming over-the-top. Mordin's death, Charr's poem, the conversations with Garrus and Kaidan, and the Rannoch finale in all its incarnations are good examples of what can be emulated here in terms of emotions.
2- The way the Catalyst was implemented, in my opinion, was a mistake, not necessarily in concept, but rather in the way it was implemented (Inadequate foreshadowing, breaking of internal continuity, logical inconsistencies, undermining of player choices, and throwing new and much greater uncertainties into the mix that completely undo any sense of closure that could be gained by prior events during the game). I am not in the habit of making up fan-fiction endings and headcanon, so the only concrete suggestion I will make is that it be either removed or combined with the old implementation of the Crucible as a weapon that actually makes conventional warfare possible, in a given way (My personal favourite is making Reapers go insane, making them attack each other, but again, I don't wish to start spouting headcanon). I just lay down my concerns, but you're the ones who work the magic, and I would be thrilled if you do so again
3- War assets, while a wonderful idea in theory, ended up being relatively underwhelming (Although the flavour text was extremely enjoyable, and since I've recently started reading the Malazan series of books, I'd like to send a thumbs-up to whoever named one of the Alliance assets the "Bridgeburners"). An expansion on this as a game mechanic (Either allowing direct use of it somehow, or simply fleshing it out some more in terms of what is actually seen in-game and during pre-rendered cutscenes) could tie in nicely with a reworking of the ending mechanics.
4- "The ending" vs. "Multiple endings": I do not believe I need to go into details regarding the current iteration, as enough has been said about that, essentially everywhere. Simply put, we desire multiple outcomes. The idea of a Dragon Age: Origins style epilogue has been thrown around, and is one that I find agreeable, so it has my vote, so to speak. One thing I would like to see would be not just different endings, but different points at which the story can end. As it is, it finishes in a single way, during a single sequence (Albeit with a choice of three options, and slight variation based on earlier variables); My suggestion would be t have diverging points that each lead to one or more different endings. It needn't be a great amount (Hell, it could easily be just two branching paths with a choice-based ending on each, or even only on one; this could also enable a retcon of the current implementation by enabling players to bypass that sequence altogether), and it leaves plenty of variables open for you to mold as you please. Again, I just leave my thoughts, the rest is obviously up to you.
#222
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:34
1. I want to see my war assets doing something. I don't want to look at them as just a number. I want to see a krogan get dogpiled by husks while another destroys rachni warrior.
2. Space battle. Holy crap. Just watching that would be incredible to see.
Use the attempted indoctrination theory to get past the current endings. You can use the EMS to enable the additional options like what you have done. If you break the indoctrination attempt you actually move on to the beam of light and do whatever.
I want to see my choices affect the game. i want to see that saving the original destiny Ascension obliterate a destroyer. I want to see meaningful impacts of my choice in curing the genophage, gettign rannoch back.
I want a happy ending with the LI. Shepard has gone through hell and back. he deserves the ability to retire with his LI and be happy.
There are a ton of good alternate endings that people have come up with. use them.
#223
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:34
#224
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:34
That being said, the I thought the choices were actually pretty cool, but I found myself looking for that unseen, hidden option that Commander Shepard always found, and I didn't see it. I mean, the last ten or so minutes didn't feel like Mass Effect. I did think the choices were interesting, of course, but I had thought there would be plenty more ways to finish the game. It didn't even feel like the choices I made were worth making in the other two games. I didn't expect everything to go over perfect at the end of the game, but i did expect...something more.
SPOILER
I kind of always knew my Shep would have to die to save the galaxy, and that sacrifice would make him the ultimate hero. But, it just seemed like his death would be a betrayal to all those killed by the Reapers, and in the Destroy ending, my Shep basically destroyed some of my allies that I fought so hard to save. I guess I could get over that. But now I get to the major thing I disliked. There is no follow up! No cut-scene that tells us what happened to all of our crew, allies, or even what came of the choices we made at the end of the game. As an avid and extremely loyal fan of the series and you, I was expecting a multitude of endings, with the perfect ending being the choice between sacrifice or defeat, and I didn't see that here. I had at least hoped for a bunch of different cut-scenes, depending on how the entire trilogy was played, that would differ for many players per their in-game experience.
I guess what I'm trying to say is the ending needs work. Maybe make a special ending for people with a very high paragon level, and another ending for people with high renegade, then tweak the endings to fit how those people played their Shep through the series. There could also be endings for the people who haven't really committed to one side or the other. I know people who played like that. There are a few plot holes in the talk with the catalyst as well, but what I, and countless others, really want is to choose an ending that fits us, without compromising our Shepard's moral views. Example: My Shep is 100% paragon, and would do anything to save even a single person. But he would still want the Reapers dead. Really, any ending makes my character betray his morals in some way, and that took me out of the journey that I have been on for the past 5 years.
I guess ths is a lot of text, but if you could read it, that would be great. I had to speak my mind. I tried to be as contructive as possible. I know you'll make us fans proud BioWare, no matter your decision.
#225
Posté 17 mars 2012 - 03:35
A happy ending. Blue babies, Urdnot Mordin, house warming party at Tali's place, getting all the drinks that I've been promised and so on.
Some endings inbetween these.
And a Scooby Doo ending.
"Harbinger was really refund guy all along?"
"Yes. And I would have gotten away with it too, if it weren't for you meddling Spectres."
Modifié par aTrueFool, 17 mars 2012 - 03:36 .





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