341 réponses à ce sujet

[majormajormmajor]

And here we begin to see how those in the other camp operate: exposed for their inability to respond to the valid criticisms of the endings except through slander and name calling, they attempt to discredit their opposition by pushing the following fiction:

leonia42 wrote...

There has been plenty of insulting going on on both sides 

leonia42 wrote...

Anyway my original point is that neither side of the argument is innocent, both have been pretty nasty to the other so don't try to take the moral high ground and tote that one side is better than the other for not stooping to low tactics.

Modifié par majormajormmajor, 17 mars 2012 - 02:50 .

[firebreather19]

Korhiann wrote...

firebreather19 wrote...

I'm sure they can't eat the same type of food, but it doesn't mean a new food can't be crafted until a more suitable solution is found. 

Either way, they were prepared for this. They made peace a long time ago, and knew they were heading into certain death. 

You might be thinking of Star Trek, as far as I know the ME universe doesn't have food replicators and I see no logical reason as to why earth would want to grow food for other species, other than trade.

True they were prepared to die for the salvation of all organics, which might not have happend given the possibility that the relays took out entire systems.
Also I don't remember ever hearing or reading anything about everyone being prepared for the endings that we got, from what I gathered it would actually been far away from what they expected would happen.

I'm not saying food replicator, but you've got scientists with the Crucible. Scientists of all races who know the chemical make-up of different foods necessary for life. Not too far-fetched, I don't think.

Reapers are ending the universe. Three barely were destroyed in one game. It's not wrong to think that if you're going to war with the Reapers, there's a high chance you're going to die.

[Torrible]

 Defenders v.s attackers? Hmm

http://www.theemotio...-white-thinking

Modifié par Torrible, 17 mars 2012 - 02:52 .

[ZeroSum7]

Because we are civil people, with a purpose. We aren't here to cause trouble, or stoop to their level, we are here to see this game gets the ending it deserves.

[LucasBadur]

 I'm just happy I bought the Cerberus version of the Normandy replica...

[Lambchopz]

majormajormmajor wrote...

And here we begin to see how those in the other camp operate: exposed for their inability to respond to the valid criticisms of the endings except through slander and name calling, they attempt to discredit their opposition by pushing the following fiction:

leonia42 wrote...

There has been plenty of insulting going on on both sides 

leonia42 wrote...

Anyway my original point is that neither side of the argument is innocent, both have been pretty nasty to the other so don't try to take the moral high ground and tote that one side is better than the other for not stooping to low tactics.

And by encouraging people to do exactly what they are saying we do (be entitled, angry, etc) all we do is prove them correct. Nothing good can come from that, except maybe a few people will feel relieved in the short term.

I understand if people fly off the handle every now and then, people are upset, it's gonna happen. but let's not ENCOURAGE it.

[Zolt51]

Souris wrote...

kjir wrote...

A thread about and threatening ad hominem attacks? Why no End of Line already? I smell a troll or I smell a mole. Convenient rhyme.

Edit: No, seriously. I'd rather I see this thread shut down. This can't be going good places.

Seconding this.

Thirded

[Gravbh]

Some of you militant anti-ending people remind me of Rush Limbaugh. In his mind, the people who disagree with him are completely irrational, immoral trash that wants to destroy the very fabric of his country. There is no way that they can just honestly have a different viewpoint. They have to be either stupid or evil.

Replace "country" with "mass effect" and you people are the same towards anyone who isn't frothing at the mouth over the endings. This OP is the perfect example.

[Zolt51]

Torrible wrote...

 Defenders v.s attackers? Hmm

http://www.theemotio...-white-thinking

Love that link Torrible. This should be compulsory reading before people are allowed to use the Internets.

[Rodia Driftwood]

No.

I don't roll that way.

For a short time, I defended the ending as well, but when it finally hit me and I realized, how stupid and senseless it is..meh..

Now, I don't get what is this kind of people that defends the abomination that is the ending.

[majormajormmajor]

Gravbh wrote...

Some of you militant anti-ending people remind me of Rush Limbaugh. In his mind, the people who disagree with him are completely irrational, immoral trash that wants to destroy the very fabric of his country. There is no way that they can just honestly have a different viewpoint. They have to be either stupid or evil..

Kuchera and his friends have been lumping everyone who disagreed with the ending as those who'd like RAINBOWS AND UNICORNS - ignoring those who had no thematic criticisms but merely wanted better execution.

Where are your words of admonishment for them, huh?

[Dark_Caduceus]

Penny Arcade is written by a couple chumps, no need to take offense to what they have to say.

If someone has to resort to ad hominem attacks then you can rest assured that you've already bested them in the argument(though not proven that your perspective is the right one, necessarily).

[Korhiann]

firebreather19 wrote...

Korhiann wrote...

firebreather19 wrote...

I'm sure they can't eat the same type of food, but it doesn't mean a new food can't be crafted until a more suitable solution is found. 

Either way, they were prepared for this. They made peace a long time ago, and knew they were heading into certain death. 

You might be thinking of Star Trek, as far as I know the ME universe doesn't have food replicators and I see no logical reason as to why earth would want to grow food for other species, other than trade.

True they were prepared to die for the salvation of all organics, which might not have happend given the possibility that the relays took out entire systems.
Also I don't remember ever hearing or reading anything about everyone being prepared for the endings that we got, from what I gathered it would actually been far away from what they expected would happen.

I'm not saying food replicator, but you've got scientists with the Crucible. Scientists of all races who know the chemical make-up of different foods necessary for life. Not too far-fetched, I don't think.

Reapers are ending the universe. Three barely were destroyed in one game. It's not wrong to think that if you're going to war with the Reapers, there's a high chance you're going to die.

They would probably need to have live ships to actually cultivate the crops, which were in the battle if you had the quarians with you. Of course we have no idea if they survived. We also don't know if it would be possible to actually grow "alien" food on earth given the state of things.

Yeah that's not what I'm writing about. Obviously they are willing to sacrifice the invasion fleet for the sake of the rest of the galaxy, but what I'm writing about is the almost entire eradication of civilization as we know it, if the relays do indeed take out entire systems as they should according to arrival.
Death of the fleet =/= Destruction of entire systems and almost entire species. What would have prevented such assumptions was closure.

[Norker]

majormajormmajor wrote...

This is what this PA comic is doing too, and it's dishonest and lazy. Gabe's newspost earlier this week tried to address people's actual  criticisms with the ending, but it was still full of attacking the people, not the argument.

You honestly expected better from PA? Just remember the D*ckwolves Disaster and how they handled that.

No matter how much they attack me on a personal level, I do not think I/we should respond in kind. We don't have to. We have enough points to constructively criticize and should continue doing so. There is a lot of a better chance of changing something by using arguments instead of insults.

I couldn't care less about what PA and Colin think of me or wether they attack me personally. Just proves the point that there isn't anything defensible about that ending.

And there are other sides too:
www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2012/03/13/mass-effect-3-and-the-pernicious-myth-of-gamer-entitlement/

[zarnk567]

You have read the forum rules right?......

[firebreather19]

majormajormmajor wrote...

And here we begin to see how those in the other camp operate: exposed for their inability to respond to the valid criticisms of the endings except through slander and name calling, they attempt to discredit their opposition by pushing the following fiction:

leonia42 wrote...

There has been plenty of insulting going on on both sides 

leonia42 wrote...

Anyway my original point is that neither side of the argument is innocent, both have been pretty nasty to the other so don't try to take the moral high ground and tote that one side is better than the other for not stooping to low tactics.

Okay, valid criticisms:

plot holes? not really. released excerpts from the game revealed Joker did pick up the squadmates. why they were in a mass effect relay isn't necessarily a plot hole, just an opportunity for in-depth DLC detailing it.

lack of choice? that's not true. i can go through the game and ending and write a ten page essay on the veriety of choices. may not have been the choices you wanted, but i wanted to ride a purple unicorn during my assault on the beam. just saying.

developers lazy? sure. they spent thousands of man hours, delayed the game by months, just to pick a couple words out of a hat and use that as an ending. people always use the RGB excuse. destroying the collector base was always a blue paragon choice, and giving it up a red renegade choice. nothing's new about this situation, nothing's changed. 


Your only real criticism of the ending is you don't like it. And other people do. That's it. 

[Detroitsoldier]

Wow. It's amazing to think how self-entitled some of you believe you are. You think that, just because you paid to play the game or games in the past that you should dictate how the game turns out.

You also think that your "rational discussions" (read: personal attacks at the writers of the game, calling them unskilled and idiotic people) help your cause and prove to people that you are correct.

As far as I'm concerned, these articles were right. Most of the people complaining are no better than constant complainers who feel that everything should go their way.

[Lambchopz]

Gravbh wrote...

Some of you militant anti-ending people remind me of Rush Limbaugh. In his mind, the people who disagree with him are completely irrational, immoral trash that wants to destroy the very fabric of his country. There is no way that they can just honestly have a different viewpoint. They have to be either stupid or evil.

Replace "country" with "mass effect" and you people are the same towards anyone who isn't frothing at the mouth over the endings. This OP is the perfect example.

And your comparison of ME fans to Republicans is certainly going to go over well.

[majormajormmajor]

zarnk567 wrote...

You have read the forum rules right?......

Haven't attacked Bioware or any specific posters. Still well within them.

[Korhiann]

firebreather19 wrote...

plot holes? not really. released excerpts from the game revealed Joker did pick up the squadmates.

I haven't seen any mention of that, do you have a link as I would certainly be interested in seeing it.

[XqctaX]

royceclemens wrote...

Attacking us is what they've been reduced to. They can't call us selfish or entitled when we're really nice and give sixty grand to charity, now can they?

We control the narrative. Not them. Don't hand it back to them by being uncivil.

this !r

[majormajormmajor]

Detroitsoldier wrote...

Wow. It's amazing to think how self-entitled some of you believe you are. You think that, just because you paid to play the game or games in the past that you should dictate how the game turns out.

You also think that your "rational discussions" (read: personal attacks at the writers of the game, calling them unskilled and idiotic people) help your cause and prove to people that you are correct.

As far as I'm concerned, these articles were right. Most of the people complaining are no better than constant complainers who feel that everything should go their way.

And there it is, laid bare for everyone to see- your average supporter of the ending. Why are we bothering to treat this type with any dignity?

[Quietness]

Zolt51 wrote...

Souris wrote...

kjir wrote...

A thread about and threatening ad hominem attacks? Why no End of Line already? I smell a troll or I smell a mole. Convenient rhyme.

Edit: No, seriously. I'd rather I see this thread shut down. This can't be going good places.

Seconding this.

Thirded

Seriously just scanning this thread is flame bait.

[BaladasDemnevanni]

Detroitsoldier wrote...

Wow. It's amazing to think how self-entitled some of you believe you are. You think that, just because you paid to play the game or games in the past that you should dictate how the game turns out.

You also think that your "rational discussions" (read: personal attacks at the writers of the game, calling them unskilled and idiotic people) help your cause and prove to people that you are correct.

As far as I'm concerned, these articles were right. Most of the people complaining are no better than constant complainers who feel that everything should go their way.

Welcome to how the world works. Just because we don't always get things our way doesn't stop anyone from trying.

[firebreather19]

Korhiann wrote...

firebreather19 wrote...

Korhiann wrote...

firebreather19 wrote...

I'm sure they can't eat the same type of food, but it doesn't mean a new food can't be crafted until a more suitable solution is found. 

Either way, they were prepared for this. They made peace a long time ago, and knew they were heading into certain death. 

You might be thinking of Star Trek, as far as I know the ME universe doesn't have food replicators and I see no logical reason as to why earth would want to grow food for other species, other than trade.

True they were prepared to die for the salvation of all organics, which might not have happend given the possibility that the relays took out entire systems.
Also I don't remember ever hearing or reading anything about everyone being prepared for the endings that we got, from what I gathered it would actually been far away from what they expected would happen.

I'm not saying food replicator, but you've got scientists with the Crucible. Scientists of all races who know the chemical make-up of different foods necessary for life. Not too far-fetched, I don't think.

Reapers are ending the universe. Three barely were destroyed in one game. It's not wrong to think that if you're going to war with the Reapers, there's a high chance you're going to die.

They would probably need to have live ships to actually cultivate the crops, which were in the battle if you had the quarians with you. Of course we have no idea if they survived. We also don't know if it would be possible to actually grow "alien" food on earth given the state of things.

Yeah that's not what I'm writing about. Obviously they are willing to sacrifice the invasion fleet for the sake of the rest of the galaxy, but what I'm writing about is the almost entire eradication of civilization as we know it, if the relays do indeed take out entire systems as they should according to arrival.
Death of the fleet =/= Destruction of entire systems and almost entire species. What would have prevented such assumptions was closure.

No, the Mass Effect relays shut down before exploding. That was a destruction of the relay structure and not the energy, so it wouldn't result in the same way. Kind of like detonating a nuclear bomb with the material inside it (Alpha relay) and not inside of it. The end result is just a destroyed shell.