254 réponses à ce sujet

[Dragoonlordz]

Initially I kept saying I have no problem if you have ending DLC optional to resolve your disappointment and so you can enjoy the game like I have as long as you ask for it in a reasonable and respectful way... But as time is going on and more and more aggressive and disrespectful threads pop up I am beginning to change my mind. Those who cannot be respectful or reasonable are ruining the image and reputation of the ones who are being such. 

At this stage I am beginning to think due to the actions and arrogance of a lot of the fanbase over Origin, Liara statues, anime series, femshep voting, endings, ammo clips, kinect, textures, LI's, DLC, multiplayer and much more that maybe Bioware should find some new fans. One's less prone to hyperbole, vitriol, review bombing, contempt, personal attacks on wiki and twitter, emotional blackmail and holding them to ransom with boycotts plus threats of legal action for false advertisment also constant flux of aggression towards half the things they do. 

Maybe they should just switch and make FPS from this point on with mere 7 hour single player campaigns because right now I don't think many of the people here even deserve Bioware to make RPG's and RPG hybrids anymore, not if this is the way many are currently acting over past few months. If the peoples assumptions here were true and Bioware only cared about money they would of ditched you so called fans long ago because more money can be made making FPS shooters with poor story and reliance on multiplayer alone. 

Just cool your heads, calm down and be patient, reasonable and respectful all of which of late is far from the case for many.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 18 mars 2012 - 05:13 .

[commonperson]

I have to say I agree. I find this "hold the line" thing kind of distrubing. An writer sits down to create a piece of work and pours their soul in to it. They create something they feel is powerful and moving and resolves the story they have been telling. Then just because a vocal group of individuals don't like it they are expected to change their story. That's akin to going back and changing Lord of the Rings to a slap happy road trip. This kind of loops back to an "ownership" argument regarding art. Art for the viewer versus Art for art's sake. Frankly I'm of the opinion the artist creates the work for themselves, they put it out there for people to take from it what they will. Mass Effect 3 was a poigniont story with a powerful conclusion. It's like in Serenity, no one wanted Wash to die. But we needed him to die, we needed to be reminded that the universe isn't shiny and things don't always turn out the way we hope.

[effortname]

Cool-headed rational argumentation has never achieved anything in the history of getting things done. People getting all up in flames over random things usually does.

[cjmarsh725]

The word "fan" comes from fanatic for a reason. People around the BSN are so vehement about their wishes for a different ending because they are so invested in the IP and have been for some time. Your argument that BioWare should go get some new fans is not one that really works in the real world. Their hardcore fan-base is one of their primary word-of-mouth marketing sources and shouldn't be, and assuredly isn't being, ignored or cast aside. BioWare has a history and a pedigree of making excellent RPGs which is why they will continue to do so, and why the fans will continue to support them doing it.

Sure, some people could take things down a notch, but I don't think they will respond to your criticism if it is also not very constructive.

[Caz Neerg]

effortname wrote...

Cool-headed rational argumentation has never achieved anything in the history of getting things done. People getting all up in flames over random things usually does.

Which is why, ironically enough, some of the most inflammatory people you will ever meet will also be some of the most rational.  Because a rational person uses the tactics that work.

[effortname]

Caz Neerg wrote...

effortname wrote...

Cool-headed rational argumentation has never achieved anything in the history of getting things done. People getting all up in flames over random things usually does.

Which is why, ironically enough, some of the most inflammatory people you will ever meet will also be some of the most rational.  Because a rational person uses the tactics that work.

Quoting this. Circlejerk all up in this thread.

[totalrecall87]

the only way that we will get change is if we fight for it in a calm and respectful manner.

[Deemz]

Yes. I probably need to be more respectful and reasonable. I will admit it.

[thebobafettest]

Honestly, the vast, vast majority of people dissatisfied with the endings are courteous, and are reasonable. There are obviously going to be a few that take it too far, but every group will have it's extremists.

Every time I see one person going over the line, I see a dozen others there to show how far from the average fan that one person really is.

And the 'hold the line' stuff is more of a focus, just to unite people with a simple phrase.

[Gibb_Shepard]

I'm honestly not seeing much of this disrespect. For the most part, people have organised themselves into constructive forms of protesting.

The fact that you see a couple people vitriolic and label the 50,000 other people in the same light is kind of dickish.

[Simpfan]

I just wish the forums would stop being spammed by the same ending-hate threads and go nowhere posts about how "nothing matters so why should their be any discussion"

[RaptorZefier]

You, do realize this is the internet right? Asking people to be calm, level headed and not disrespectful is like asking a rabid tiger not to break anything in a house of glass.

[Paparob]

thebobafettest wrote...

Honestly, the vast, vast majority of people dissatisfied with the endings are courteous, and are reasonable. There are obviously going to be a few that take it too far, but every group will have it's extremists.

Every time I see one person going over the line, I see a dozen others there to show how far from the average fan that one person really is.

And the 'hold the line' stuff is more of a focus, just to unite people with a simple phrase.

[Cpl_Facehugger]

commonperson wrote...

I have to say I agree. I find this "hold the line" thing kind of distrubing. An writer sits down to create a piece of work and pours their soul in to it. They create something they feel is powerful and moving and resolves the story they have been telling. Then just because a vocal group of individuals don't like it they are expected to change their story. That's akin to going back and changing Lord of the Rings to a slap happy road trip. This kind of loops back to an "ownership" argument regarding art. Art for the viewer versus Art for art's sake. Frankly I'm of the opinion the artist creates the work for themselves, they put it out there for people to take from it what they will. Mass Effect 3 was a poigniont story with a powerful conclusion. It's like in Serenity, no one wanted Wash to die. But we needed him to die, we needed to be reminded that the universe isn't shiny and things don't always turn out the way we hope.

A better example would be Charles Dickens changing Great Expectations' ending.

...

Which is exactly what he did, and now literary critics generally take the revised version as "canon" because it's so much better.

In short, when an ending simply does not fit the work and undermines the themes of that work (as ME3's does), it can and should be changed.

Modifié par Cpl_Facehugger, 18 mars 2012 - 05:24 .

[Militarized]

Yes, tell the cold corporation your feelings in a nice manner and watch what happens.

[Greed1914]

thebobafettest wrote...

Honestly, the vast, vast majority of people dissatisfied with the endings are courteous, and are reasonable. There are obviously going to be a few that take it too far, but every group will have it's extremists.

Every time I see one person going over the line, I see a dozen others there to show how far from the average fan that one person really is.

And the 'hold the line' stuff is more of a focus, just to unite people with a simple phrase.

Yep.  I'd say we've done a decent job of squashing threads that get out of line.  And most everybody will chime in and say that we really loved 99% of the game. 

[ChopyChopZ]

I don't even think its gone too far. People are not making threats to burn this forum down...yet.

[majormajormmajor]

I'm not going to accept a demand from someone who liked the ending. You have abrogated your right to make demands of your fellow human beings.

[Dragoonlordz]

Gibb_Shepard wrote...

I'm honestly not seeing much of this disrespect. For the most part, people have organised themselves into constructive forms of protesting.

The fact that you see a couple people vitriolic and label the 50,000 other people in the same light is kind of dickish.

A couple is not even close, even in last few minutes someone has posted a link where someone filed a federal complaint. Sorry but these couple are new threads and people that appear every 5-10 minutes... Not a "couple" of people at all. The more they pop up the more I feel the way stated above and it has been non stop since the title was release constant waves of new people and new threads crossing the line.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 18 mars 2012 - 05:25 .

[sirstikay69]

I don't like throwing muck around at people to begin with but most of the disrespect that has been posted comes from people who think they ending is great and just act plain arrogant about it.

everyone is entitled to their own opinion, its when people start thinking that their opinion is the only one that matters is when disrespect comes into play.

[Meltemph]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Initially I kept saying I have no problem if you have ending DLC optional to resolve your disappointment and so you can enjoy the game like I have as long as you ask for it in a reasonable and respectful way... But as time is going on and more and more aggressive and disrespectful threads pop up I am beginning to change my mind. Those who cannot be respectful or reasonable are ruining the image and reputation of the ones who are being such. 

At this stage I am beginning to think due to the actions and arrogance of a lot of the fanbase over Origin, Liara statues, anime series, femshep voting, endings, ammo clips, kinect, textures, LI's, DLC, multiplayer and much more that maybe Bioware should find some new fans. One's less prone to hyperbole, vitriol, review bombing, contempt, personal attacks on wiki and twitter, emotional blackmail and holding them to ransom with boycotts plus threats of legal action for false advertisment also constant flux of aggression towards half the things they do. 

Maybe they should just switch and make FPS from this point on with mere 7 hour single player campaigns because right now I don't think many of the people here even deserve Bioware to make RPG's and RPG hybrids anymore, not if this is the way many are currently acting over past few months. If the peoples assumptions here were true and Bioware only cared about money they would of ditched you so called fans long ago because more money can be made making FPS shooters with poor story and reliance on multiplayer alone. 

Just cool your heads, calm down and be patient, reasonable and respectful all of which of late is far from the case for many.

You were the guy talking about how worried you were about interaction and how they were not making the games for you anymore...right?  Or am I mising something.

[majormajormmajor]

The defenders of the ending have treated us with nothing but contempt. They are receiving nothing but the same in turn. This is very fully justified.

[Caz Neerg]

Cpl_Facehugger wrote...
A better example would be Charles Dickens changing Great Expectations' ending.

...

Which is exactly what he did, and now literary critics generally take the revised version as "canon" because it's so much better.

A more recent example would be Magnum P.I.  They killed him in the series finale, fans got in an uproar, they changed their minds and brought the show back for an entire new season, and retconned his death to flesh wounds.

[ohbarf]

commonperson wrote...
I find this "hold the line" thing kind of distrubing. An writer sits down to create a piece of work and pours their soul in to it. They create something they feel is powerful and moving and resolves the story they have been telling. Then just because a vocal group of individuals don't like it they are expected to change their story.

I don't think that really covers what's happening here, though, as Bioware employees have even said -- these games are a collaborative effort.  We (the customers) have no clue what's going on behind closed doors.  How do you know that the entire team was 100% supportive of the direction the end of the game took?  Many people poured their souls into these games.. it's not that black and white.

[cyrrant]

commonperson wrote...

I have to say I agree. I find this "hold the line" thing kind of distrubing. An writer sits down to create a piece of work and pours their soul in to it. They create something they feel is powerful and moving and resolves the story they have been telling. Then just because a vocal group of individuals don't like it they are expected to change their story. That's akin to going back and changing Lord of the Rings to a slap happy road trip. This kind of loops back to an "ownership" argument regarding art. Art for the viewer versus Art for art's sake. Frankly I'm of the opinion the artist creates the work for themselves, they put it out there for people to take from it what they will. Mass Effect 3 was a poigniont story with a powerful conclusion. It's like in Serenity, no one wanted Wash to die. But we needed him to die, we needed to be reminded that the universe isn't shiny and things don't always turn out the way we hope.

The second you take "art" and release it into the public to be bought, paid for, consumed, it becomes a "product".  Consumers have a right to take issue with a product when it is not how they think it should be.  In the end, these games are created to be sold, and they are therefore beholden to all the relevant market forces, including customer criticism.

Hold the Line