Dunno how they can say a hive mind of machines programmed to repeat a process every 50000 yrs is considered evil. It's like Thane, he's been programmed to be a cold killer, don't consider him evil, or Samara programmed to kill whom she deems wicked, even police trying to enforce the law on her. Reapers aren't evil, they're just sentient machines, not really any different from either Samara, Thane, or Legion. So, if it is possible to reprogram them, then Im certian it's theoretically possible. Another reason why think the indoc theory is bullcrap. Genocide of all synthetic life shows organics and synthetics can't coexist, proving the starchild's point. Just like reprogramming the heretics is a Paragon choice, reprogramming the Reapers is the same sort of choice, opposed to complete destruction of a people.
Remember first of all, when Illusive man tried to "Control" the Reapers, the cruicible wasn't yet installed, which is why he failed. And thusly why Shepard succeeds
Let me begin by saying, every and all "evidence" brought to the table about the Indoctrination Theory are assumptions and speculations
Though my interpretation isn't full of pics, and screengrabs, or a page long, it's not convuluted either. It's straight forward thinking and Indoctrinated Theories is just people trying to make Chaos out of Order
All paragon choices are to save life, why is it wrong to consider destroying Reapers- pretty much a race themselves (ex. Geth) a Renegade option?
Preserving life, the Rachni queen, saving the Geth, saving the Krogan are paragon options, why can't saving the Reapers, Geth, and EDI be considered a Paragon option too, if it means saving all forms of life?
Reapers are gone, and life can carry on, and Shepard will take the Reapers far away, it isn't continuing the cycle, it's breaking the cycle peacefully, allowing all parties to live. Sounds very Paragon to me
I thought it through more carefully, the whole indoctrination theory is false simply because I dont think they'd make things THAT convoluted, especially since the entire series is straight forward in its definition of Paragon and Renegade, especially since they color code everything up to that point. You do renegade, red burst of death, paragon, blue burst of peace. Either you kill ALL synthetic life, including EDI and the Geth, or allow EVERYONE to Live, believing starchild is lying or the Reapers will return is speculation
SOME OF THE ASSUMPTIONS BROUGHT TO THE TABLE
Anderson being a red decision, Illusive Man being blue; killing an entire race, synthetics or otherwise instead of the Reapers leaving and everyone being left alive peacefully is a Paragon decision, some just can't get over the fact, "it's Anderson as red". He's someone who's been fighting on ground level, on Earth with the Reapers since the beginning of Mass Effect 3, ofcourse he wants to kill them (well that's speculation) but what isn't speculation is that choosing Red will kill all synthetics which include Geth, EDI, and the Reapers.
Btw, EDI willing to make the ultimate sacrifice, is "her" choice, killing her and every other synthetic you deemed as a species, is "yours" don't fool yourself in thinking Anderson's decision is the right one simply because he was your Pal throughout the game.
Choosing Blue, Everyone lives, Shepard controls the Reapers and commands them to leave in peace. You can speculate and assume all you want that the Reapers will return, that the starchild was lying, but that's not what happened at the end was it? No, the Reapers seized fired, picked up and left; anything else is speculation and vague assumption
Shepard being shot in the gut like Anderson... some ppl seem to take this as evidence that it was a dream, no, if you recall, Shepard was shot by the Marauder right before entering the beam
The dark tendrils during the chat with the Illusive Man, some seem to think this indicates he was indoctrinated the whole time, no, he was being controlled by the Illusive man at close range which he in part shot Anderson, my proof of this is how it disappeared when the Illusive Man died.
Everybody assumes the Reapers are evil. They are synthetics programmed to reset the Galaxy every 50,000 years or so, they're not evil, and the means of destroying a hive conciousness is not good, nor is killing allies who trusted you and helped you fight these attackers, namely the Geth, and EDI. And throughout the game you proven, they are a civilization, for all intent and purposes, they are alive; yet you kill them like it was meh, atleast Organics will live
Everybody assumes the StarChild is simply, lying.... what makes you assume that? The "Bad" machine theory? Up to that point they told you the "truth" they are there to harvest the technologically superior of the galaxy to make way for new life to flourish. And the end result of Blue Paragon was not turning Shepard into a Reaper Avatar, instead it was to do exactly as the kid promised, Shepard told all the Reapers to pick up and leave.
Everybody is saying..... well marooning a bunch of races on one planet, yadda yadda.... remember whats left of the population on Palaven and Thessia are still there, whatever the fleet maybe, will only be the ones populating Earth, and this is the result in ALL instances, so why this is even an argument.... eh Idk, desperation from Indoctrination Theorists
Why Shepard's gun doesn't need to reload...... it's a sequence, something to further the story, could ask why his life bar disappeared too, or why he didn't just regenerate shields when the Marauder shot him in the gut, or in every other instance, why Shepard and everyone don't lose breath when they run anymore.... because of the feel and drama of the scene, it's an interactive sequence meant to further the story, there isn't anymore "real" combat, it's an interactive movie. If you believe its something Bioware could NEVER overlook, 30minutes into the game, my head was doing an exorcist thing following glitch around, they overlooked that obvious oversight, and I rather take that over speculation and assumption from a mass of angry fans
The beam of light during the slow mo sequence and the beam of light with the starchild, coincidence; great visual, and frames importance, like the hammers or whatever on Tuchanka, they were framed in the middle with a giant Reaper shooting lasers at you, it frames importance, don't look too much into it, you'll rot your brain with speculations and vague assumptions, and finding similarities is just reaching
The Illusive Man was a bad guy........ with good intentions till he was indoctrinated, but unlike the IM, Shepard did fuse with the Reaper mind. Illusive Man did alot of good, till he started turning bad, saving the butterfly by killing the spider is not always the best way, why not save them both?
Also, the child pushing you away from renegade option, well, yea...... if I was the human talking to a synthetic, making the same choice, I'd probably downplay my complete destruction too
What it all boils down to, you commit mass genocide of all synthetics, or you trust in Shepard and the Reapers that they will leave the Galaxy forever.
Alot of emphasis is put into the starchild smiling. If the kid was smiling, may have been because you chose a side where no one dies and everyone lives, no other cycle before you has finished the crucible in time making this a unique event.
My beliefs that the Indoctrination theory, is just fans wanting to put more meaning into something even when the true meaning is right in front of them.
Final thing for Theorists before I sign off, 9 pages... Im bored
Im tired...... If anyone comes up with something that isn't an assumption, speculation, or a gut feeling that the
starchild is lying.... maybe you have something, until then... don't waste my time or your time... geez ppl
Indoctrination Theorists are just crazy people who are also upset with the ending so they have to make up some mass speculation about motives and conspiracies about an indoctrinated Shepard using whatever clues they can piece together to form
a solid MAYBE (no matter how small or how broad).... Maybe this, and Maybe that, Could be this, Could be that; by Nooo... means, could it be plastered right on screen for me, that would be toooo easy, oh no...
Has to be difficult and full of switching up,<_< and they actually had meant this and that... please..........
Hold the Line? Dear god ppl, grow up....
I didn't really know how bad your conditions were until I started arguing with all of you, You'd swear a color is Red when it's actually Blue, that's what really gets me, no pun intended towards the discussion ofcourse
In Closing----
Just because the Red ending is the "popular" ending, doesn't make it the good "Paragon" ending, all it means is you accomplished the mission you were on for the last 3 games.
Thinking they lied is an assumption, believing they'll go back on their word is an assumption, Shepard being indoctrinated during his choice of destroying the Reapers or Galactic Peace is a speculation and assumption, believing the entire thing was a dream is an assumption, believing environments were similar is a speculation, believing the starchild was lying is an assumption, believing Renegade and Paragon ending was switched is an assumption........ none with any evidence, only screengrabs of what the mass theorists provide as clues which are also speculations..... for example...... their eyes tell everything..... or this screengrab looks like this and they actually meant that, and the many others who go, "Omg, you're right, I mean, how could they have meant anything other than that. Well ofcourse they hid the true ending from us. The entire game was very black and white and in the end I'm CERTAIN! They switched it up to screw with our minds. It can't just simply be an ending
...Closure
All my pent up irritation with these theorists I think is abated now.... majority of you are the same ones who feel like they;re entitled to a better ending, or would ruin a company simply because you hated the ending, and are ppl fighting and boycotting this as if you're doing something important for mankind, some kind of cause. Frankly I'm tired of Bioware's lack of Bug Support in their games, but as for story, they can write it however they want, but don't put words in their mouths, keep your theories to yourselves. Making the dim witted believe speculation and assumption is wrong in itself. Them admitting to this theory to appease you all is one hair from extortion to get you all buying again, or them "fixing" it, is them giving into a mob. I'd rather hope they simply take the hit, and tell alot of you, like it or don't like it, you didn't make it, and you can't lie that you enjoyed the ride.
Think Ive grown alittle since watching you all bicker and read everything you all posted as proof of the indoctrination theory, your protests, all silly. Yesterday I bought into it, thinking, well, just maybe.... then observing and realizing, everything is either an assumption or speculation while you ignore the plain facts printed on screen and pattern throughout the Mass Effect series to feed your ongoing obsession with some mass proclaimed, convoluted swap up ending, feeling like it couldn't be simple. Then for the rest, I read you all who track the Amazon reviews like it gives you pleasure, that's pretty sick getting excited about the bad reviews btw. And the "Hold the Line" protest people..... just make me chuckle, where do you have the right to try and convince them to change anything? Who are you? Someone who didn't make the game or contributed any sort of vision, all you are is a money pot to make their vision. Im unhappy about alot of things, alot of things I wish they improve, and I will ask and plead for those things, like a better stripclub bar ingame, or fix the number of bugs present in game, but I won't track amazon's pricing of Mass Effect 3 as it drops with my fingertips pressed together, saying, "Goooood, goood....."
---
Now for the new day's theorists to see why they're theory is wrong in every way possible with absolutely no proof, all you guys care about is getting your way and them making a new ending, your noble "for good of gamers" is farce. It's the natural desire to not lose in a fight. It's like all those dumb people who believed the Da Vinci Code was real, or the Bible Code is real. How are Indoctrination theorist any less insane?
Oh btw, before I forget, "LETS SAY", the indoctrination theory is correct and right and wrong was switched and anderson was paragon, Illusive Man was Renegade, lets say this only for a second (because I don't believe any of that bull crap) then why was it blue flame shooting out from the Citadel or red flame? Was space indoctrinated too? I understand how they may have switched colors on Shepard, but the rest of the Galaxy? And don't you dare say Im just nitpicking, Your ENTIRE theory is based on choices being reversed at the end and colors being switched to "trick" Shepard, so, what's the explaination for that? And don't say he "imagined" that's what happened, everything after the "choice" was epilogue since we see how everyone ended up, especially with blue (paragon) where he is obviously integrated into the Reapers and supposedly dead, what's the point of seeing it from his imagination in that instance? And that is fact based on what is shown and explained in the game..... not vague assumption, or speculation, or some theory based soley on an opinion influenced by a mass of "others" who believe in a single insane prospect, "influencing" eachother to believe "this is what happened". The whole saying.... if your friend's walked off a cliff, would you do it too? In this case the cliff is imaginary and much more appealing to walk over, so you all go ahead and walked off, believing the stuff is believing in scientology as a comparison...
Modifié par MalevoIence, 03 avril 2012 - 09:36 .
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