407 réponses à ce sujet

[Dean_the_Young]

jb1983 wrote...

No, there isn't an argument against it. When you build a game on choices, you need to have multiple endings. I get what you're trying to say, but you're wrong. You can come to multiple endings through deliberate choices and still enjoy them. It doesn't take away the joy.

You're arguing something entirely different from what I'm arguing, then, because I'm not arguing against multiple outcomes.

For instance, to get the happy ending you could still have to make sacrifices. The problem is you're thinking that, "Oh, to get the happy ending you must have to do paragon choices." Not necessarily - the writers could take a consequentialist approach and say that only the most selfish decisions get you a happy ending. I.E. you end up having to kill Mordin yourself if you want to live in the end. Thus, you get a nice ending, but you had to make some gut-wrenching decisions to do so.

Which avoids the utopianism I was talking about, ergo what I was addressing. If your outcome has severe costs, it isn't going to be utopian.

Everything you're saying only works if we take one approach to writing. But the approach you're suggesting is a cliched approach.

It's also the cliche approach that Bioware took into ME2, and it's also the cliche approach that many fans are demanding.

Do you even recognize that? That some people really are insisting on having their cake and eating it?

Regardless, in the end, there's only one ending with three different colors.

Then so was ME2, which had Red and Blue. And ME1, which had a light background or a dark background.

If you're going to over-generalize, don't selectively overgeneralize. No choice in any Mass Effect game has significantly affected the endings, and those endings themselves differed in tone, not great content.

[Warrior Craess]

I disliked the ending because it's a cop out that makes little to no sense and doesn't have any option that my style of play through would have utilized. Not to mention the introduction of more plot holes than I care to catalog.

[Tovanus]

I hated it for many reasons, but at the top of the list is probably that the starchild's reasoning for the Reapers was so poorly thought out. They took a somewhat interesting sub-plot that had largely resolved (organics and synthetics getting along) and elevated it to the all-powerful reason for this giant cycle without a worthy explanation. Utterly disappointed. There have been far better fan theories for the Reapers than what the writers ultimately came up with. It was lazy writing.

Add to that the plotholes, add to that the failure to account for choices, add to that the brevity (I wanted to see cutscenes of all those war assets being used that were the result of those choices), and it was just one disappointment after another.

As a tiny bit of salt in the wound, I also found out that they took out some really good dialogue with Anderson (the audio clip is actually kind of moving if you google it).

[Echo_V]

Happy ending?
hell, i want a happy ending, a bittersweet ending AND a bad ending! i want to be able to choose which one i truly want

of course it should make sense! not like the wtf ending(s) that already exist.

[The Real Bowser]

Big reasons I hate the ending.

1. It makes no sense.
2. There is no closure -- more questions gained than solved.
3. The Galaxy is basically destroyed.
4. The reapers win and Shepard does not oppose them or even question starchild.
5. The ending does not leave me feeling like a hero that saved the Galaxy.  It makes me feel like a pathetic loser that was mind controlled into destroying it.

[Somath Cegem]

Both, I want an ending that makes sense and I want the possibility of a happy ending, even if it's an absolute nightmare to get, I want it to be there and attainable.

[Dean_the_Young]

Divitiacus wrote...

Oh, and how does that happen with no Mass Relays?

Space ships with FTL.

Apparently FTL is space magic now despite having been in the series from the start, so {smilie}.

It's more like "And the species of the galaxy all died a slow agonizing death due to scarce resources. The end!"

Well, besides the fact that that need not apply. Because, you know, the ability to fly from resource-scarce areas to colonies with resources. And that not everywhere is devastated by the Reapers.

[In Exile]

Dean_the_Young wrote...
No, not least because we didn't do that.

You said the survival of the galaxy is enough for victory. The survival of the galaxy was never in doubt. We knew the Reapers were never going to kill everything - just the advanced races.

[amblin_xi]

Because it's artistic non-sense. Especially the space kid and all the bonkers things he tried to fill me with.

I once saw a pile of buckets in Modern Tate London. And i thought it's rubbish and makes no sense what so ever. So the artist explained,trying to make me understand the meaning,his motive. He pushed so hard that his obsession almost made me cry some tears for him.

but still, it makes no sense, why the pile of buckets? Why not some tyres? milk bottles? Why the space kid? not the holy cow?

It shouldn't have excisted in the first place. No matter what shiny meanings or explainations you try slap on it, it's still non-sense. It's OUT OF PLACE. artistic or not.

Modifié par amblin_xi, 18 mars 2012 - 06:01 .

[kalerab]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Then so was ME2, which had Red and Blue. And ME1, which had a light background or a dark background. 

If you're going to over-generalize, don't selectively overgeneralize. No choice in any Mass Effect game has significantly affected the endings, and those endings themselves differed in tone, not great content.

Complete irrelevant as both ME1 and ME2 were supposed to have sequels where impact of destruction of Council/Collector base was shown. ME3 however is the end of series, there won´t be any ME4 which will show what of an impact had your decision (or rather forced decision as plan was always the blew the hell out of Reapers, not become bud-bud with their godlike creator) of either destroying every toaster in galaxy, some systhesy or control. So you are let with ending that doesnt answer nearly no question and raises much more. Here, I remember beeing promised complete opposite. On this ground I bought the game. So yes, I feel cheated.

[Montana]

Yeah, poll is flawed.
I don't want a happy ending (would be nice if it were an option though).
I'd like a bittersweet ending like BioWare intended.

Not some plothole-ridden, major bummer ending that effectively kills any chance of future ME games we'll recognize.

[williamz614]

I pretty much hate it because of both. I paid for this game so I could be entertained. Not preached to, not educated in the meaning of 'art', but entertained.  I paid to walk away with the same good feeling I got at the end of Mass Effect 2 when I defeated the collectors and all of my squad survived.  This isn't like a book or a movie where you can have only one ending.  It's a decision-based RPG where you can have multiple endings.  A happy ending should be a choice, depending on player preference.

Here is a parallel you can think of. You pay $70 to get into an amusement park. You spend all day riding roller coasters and you have a blast, everything is going swimmingly. You decide to ride one last roller coaster, and due to shoddy design and/or laziness on the park owner's part, the roller coaster derails and many people get hurt or killed.

When you think back on your day at the amusement park, do you think about how 95% of your day was awesome and you should be thankful for it?

Do you ever want to visit that amusement park ever again?

Do you want to ever give a damn cent to the company that designed the ride that left you so disappointed?

The point is, the climax of the mass effect series is the most important part. They messed up the climax, and left us feeling crappy about it all because of either laziness or poor design. Are they offering to give us our money back? Or at least to do something about it? Nope.

Modifié par williamz614, 18 mars 2012 - 06:09 .

[C Trayne]

I've mentioned it before and I'll say it again. Bioware is using these "happy ending" arguments as the only reason people want a new ending (at least thats how it started... things may have changed since) They are saying that people only want to change the endings because they are sad. For me that is entierly not the case.

I could live with a sad shepard dies ending if i didn't walk away from the credits scratching my head asking more questions than when the final mission started. A good ending shouldn't be "left for interpretation" it should let us know what happens in the galaxy, show us our decisions mattered, and effectively end the story without thrusting hundreds of plot holes and questions on us.

[dbt-kenny]

let me put it this way. how many plot holes are in the ending.

[JELLAQTP]

In my case, I don´t like the ending because it´s weak, seems rushed, and the final options seems like they come from another game.

But I can be on the happy camp a little, because I fell too that the actual options are just not being Shepard but a sheep. We just did what the reapers wanted.

[Kayawyn4]

I hate the ending, not because Shepard dies, but because it's completely absurd, poorly written, and feels as if it was rushed off at the very last second and patched into the game on day 1.

[Deventh]

Because it's not happy and because there wasn't answers.

[JohnnyG]

I would like a good ending to be a possible one (even if you have to perform certain actions all the way through all three games to get it), but I could live without one.  However, I need an ending that actually makes some semblance of sense.

[Spectre_Shepard]

it doesn't make ANY SENSE!

[Trisskit]

Both. If I wanted to deal with things being dark and depressing I wouldn't have to play video games to do it.

[T-Raks]

In this order:

1. A patch that solves the sense problems in the end sequence, squadmates being on board of the Normandy, the Normandy/Joker flying away from the battle, a count of what I have accomplished (i.e. where does everbody stand at least directly after the battle), multiplayer having an impact on the single player campaign (that's a slap in the face for those who played ME1 and 2) being fixed.

2. Maybe a DLC with some post war dialogs - I missed that already in ME2 when you could play on after the suicide mission but nobody actively talked about it. Also I wanna know what my squadmates did after the reapers are destroyed. Did they try to/find me? So if it's not playable because I'm dead, then it should be at least an epilog after the events. This could already come in the patch, but I'm OK with this being extra material, because a patch should first and foremost correct mistakes/plot holes.

3. Maybe an "alternative ending" DLC, because of how bad the one we got was with the starchild and all. But I know that this is asking a lot because whether we like it or not this was the end they wanted the story to end with. Bad judgement, but there is not much we can do about it, changing a game completely based on fan reaction is a pipe dream I guess. I'm all for it, but I'm not letting my hopes get to high, because a completely changed scenery would surprise me.

So fixing the obvious mistakes and extending/explaining what happened in the end would already be a good response by Bioware and I would love to start my next playthrough knowing my Shepard's story gets the end it deserves.

Modifié par T-Raks, 18 mars 2012 - 06:20 .

[Zhen-Lin]

IntoTheDarkness wrote...

there a poll where 80% of people voted they disliked the ending because it wasn't a happy ending.

Really? I personally love bad endings because they are hard to come by. 95% of holliwood movies and 99% of games are good endings. Do we need more on the list?

On the other side, I agree the ending doesn't really make much sense to me.

What's your thoughts?

I hate the end for a few reason.
1: There are no happy ending no
matter what you do. I don't think we need just the happy endings, we
also need bad endings as well just like Mass Effect 2 where there are
some chance you will not survive.

2: Yes, the ending doesn't make much sense

The reason behind it? just read here:

http://social.biowar...4826/7#10192067
http://social.biowar...26133/1#9854107

And the second post of this link as well
http://social.biowar...dex/9992961/165

[RedTail F22]

I would would just like the choice. I mean, thats what Mass Effect is all about, right?

[Sisterofshane]

Okay, so I have finally finished two ME3 playthroughs, and I got the ending that is supposedly the best, so I figure I will put my two cents in about the endings.

I think what I am suffering from is what I will call the "Lost" syndrome.  Instead of answering the questions I've had throughout the series, I feel like I've been left with even more questions than I had before.  With this being the end of the trilogy, I don't know where to find the answers I'm looking for, nor if I ever will find them.

Where I think Dragon Age Origins and Mass Effects 1&2 got it right was tying up MOST of the loose ends by the end of the individual game.  In ME1, we see Shep standing on the citadel, and we got a quick dialogue about where we were going to go from there, and you discuss the new council, and how we are "preparing" for the Reapers.  ME2, you have a quick dialogue about what just happened with TIM, and then (depending on whether you or others died in the suicide mission), you see Shep/Joker mourning losses and preparing, once again, for the upcoming Reaper Invasion.  I didn't have to second guess whether my squadmates lived or died, and there was no mysterious cliff-hanger ending. 

Another way to think about it, imagine if ME had ended with the piece of Sovereign smashing into the council chambers.  Just BAM and credits.  Or if  ME2 ended with the Normandy fleeing the either blown up/ EMP'd Collector Base.  How many of us would have been like "WTF?  What happened AFTER that?  Who lived and who died?  Did we really win?"

I'm not saying that I need answers to EVERY question I've ever had to the series, heck, I would have been satisfied to never know the Reapers origins if they had just given the universe itelf a less ambiguous ending.  Hell, the ending would have been more satisfying if everyone died and the Reapers won.  At least I would KNOW what happened.

That is why I feel the endings do NOT do the game justice.

[Subject M]

Because it does not make enough sense, is unsatisfying and does not have an option of a happy ending.