350 réponses à ce sujet

[Fulgrim88]

Cyberfrog81 wrote...

I guess a "quick, lame offering" is OK in fantasy then.

Well I don't mean to be insulting towards people who liked the game, but let's just say that in terms of Story and character development, DA2 wasn't top notch to begin with.

It was a fun flick, a lot of over the top action and a reasonably fun ride.
It was also the first and only story about the Champion.

So you didn't grow even remotely as attached to the Characters as you did in Mass Effect.
And you didn't expect the same level of storytelling, seeing the overall quality of DA2.

You could enjoy it for what it was, see the ending, shrug and move on.

It's hard to do the same with Mass Effect. Because we've come to expect a level of excellence (and were actually promised one) that was overally delivered by the game, but simply gutted and spat on by the ending.
The whole problem lies in the gap between the story itself and it's ending.
DA2 had no such issue - at least not on this scale

Modifié par Fulgrim88, 18 mars 2012 - 07:56 .

[BWGungan]

ArmyKnifeX wrote...

Baronesa wrote...

Savber100 wrote...

suntzuxi wrote...

wow, in the meantime they gave Dragon Age 2 a 4/5. LoL

...

And suddenly all credibility was lost. 

Actually, you should read their review... I found it quite good.

I haven't read the review, but I can tell you from some inside knowledge about the climate at the time DA2 was being produced... they did the best job they could with incredibly limited resources compared to what was needed. Focusing the narrative down was a ploy to produce more varied content for one narrative rather than the hugely varied content that would be required for hugely varied narratives. And as far as the ending to that game is concerned... at least by the time we got to it, it wasn't utterly unexpected.

DA2 is more of a reboot than a sequel, anyhow.

Yes, some people didn't like DA2.  I certainly didn't like everything about it, but the ending was consistent with the rest of the game, both in terms of quality, and narrative.

DA2 wasn't a perfect game, but it was certainly a good, enjoyable game. 

[Yalision]

Great! Lets just hope they take it to heart and do something about it.

[BWGungan]

ArmyKnifeX wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Edje Edgar wrote...

The genocide is about the geth. Think before talk=win.

We've genocided Batarians, Heretic Geth in ME2, whatever species Harbinger was, and the Collectors.

Genocide is a tool in Shepard's tool box, whether you admit to it or not.

We have not done such a thing. We defeated an enemy. Not going to explain you the difference since you probably know. You are basically trolling right here Dean.

Well arrival did force Shepard to commit genocide - but that's Marc Walter's writing, the same guy who gave us the ending. The collectors weren't a species considering they were under direct reaper control the entire time with no way of freeing them from indoctrination. Hell, even ME1 demonstrated that there's really no way to permanently reverse severe indoctrination.

As far as the heretic Geth in ME2, whether or not you killed 'em all is a player choice.

That wasn't genocide.  He destroyed one colony, not the entire Batarian race.  It was also not his intent to destroy those colonists.  That was mass murder at worst.

People need to actually read the definition of a word before they start whipping it around.

Genocide as defined by the United Nations:  "Any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such: killing members of the group; causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group; deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life, calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part; imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group.  Intent must be proven, otherwise the crime cannot be identified as genocide.

Maybe the heretic Geth could fall under this definition, but only if you consider them a religious subgroup of the Geth. Even then, it would be hard to say we did it with systematic intent.  They were trying to kill us after all.

Modifié par BWGungan, 18 mars 2012 - 08:26 .

[Desteron]

nice!

[Wattoes]

BWGungan wrote...

Yes, some people didn't like DA2.  I certainly didn't like everything about it, but the ending was consistent with the rest of the game, both in terms of quality, and narrative.

DA2 wasn't a perfect game, but it was certainly a good, enjoyable game. 

Ya DA gets a bunch of hate - probably because its basically a downgrade from origins, but its still a fun title.  It was just disappointing from expectations.

[gmboy902]

Almost as childish as the players giving it bad reviews, except at least they (I imagine) focused just on the story of it, whiel the players also ignored the awesome gameplay in their tearing apart of the game's score.

[NubXL]

I still gave it an 8, but I do question whether or not that is overrating it. An ending so bad that I've been put off to replaying any game in the series.

[Baronesa]

Wattoes wrote...

BWGungan wrote...

Yes, some people didn't like DA2.  I certainly didn't like everything about it, but the ending was consistent with the rest of the game, both in terms of quality, and narrative.

DA2 wasn't a perfect game, but it was certainly a good, enjoyable game. 

Ya DA gets a bunch of hate - probably because its basically a downgrade from origins, but its still a fun title.  It was just disappointing from expectations.

Agreed... Origins was EPIC... DA2 was a competentn even good game at some points, with many flaws...

If not made by BioWare would have been a decent RPG.. it just... felt below BioWare standards. I still like the game for what it is, even if some of the flaws are ughhh

Even then DA2, has more replayabiliy for me than ME3 as it stands right now witht he current endings.

[MissMaster_2]

Lol! yes,

[Machazareel]

Iwillbeback wrote...

Nexis7 wrote...

>20+ hour game
>last 5-10mins are bad
>2.5/5

stay classy

Imagine it was like sex

20 minutes of action and then her parents come in and take her away leaving you only with a tissue.

Doesn't matter, had sex.

[Ravennus]

suntzuxi wrote...

wow, in the meantime they gave Dragon Age 2 a 4/5. LoL

He actually has another good article where he addresses his review of Dragon Age 2.
http://calitreview.com/15438 

It's an interesting read. TL:DR, in hindsight he would have at least gave it a 3.5/5/

[guyfromprague]

Wow, just wow.
I thought that I was harsh, but when a literary critic tears you a new one, that's gotta hurt.
Basically, the entire "it's art" defense line just got annihilated.

Modifié par guyfromprague, 18 mars 2012 - 08:12 .

[Fulgrim88]

Machazareel wrote...

Iwillbeback wrote...

Nexis7 wrote...

>20+ hour game
>last 5-10mins are bad
>2.5/5

stay classy

Imagine it was like sex

20 minutes of action and then her parents come in and take her away leaving you only with a tissue.

Doesn't matter, had sex. fixed that for ya

Modifié par Fulgrim88, 18 mars 2012 - 08:12 .

[Militarized]

Oh look, another reviewer who isn't having their pockets lined with EA cash from ME3 ad revenue telling it how it is!

It wasn't harsh, it's the truth.

[BWGungan]

Almost always I find emplaced-gun sequences (1) boring, and (2) stomach-turning. Killing stuff out of grim necessity? Gimme a gun and point me in the right direction, Major, because I'm onboard. Engaging in mindlessly wanton slaughter because some level designer thinks I'm ready to feel like a man again? It's like being slipped a Viagra. An unbidden boner is, without exception, an unwelcome boner.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha.

http://www.grantland...-mass-effect-3s

[BWGungan]

Fulgrim88 wrote...

Machazareel wrote...

Iwillbeback wrote...

Nexis7 wrote...

>20+ hour game
>last 5-10mins are bad
>2.5/5

stay classy

Imagine it was like sex

20 minutes of action and then her parents come in and take her away leaving you only with a tissue.

Doesn't matter, had sex. fixed that for ya

Hahahaha, I've never seen that one before.

[Fulgrim88]

BWGungan wrote...

Almost always I find emplaced-gun sequences (1) boring, and (2) stomach-turning. Killing stuff out of grim necessity? Gimme a gun and point me in the right direction, Major, because I'm onboard. Engaging in mindlessly wanton slaughter because some level designer thinks I'm ready to feel like a man again? It's like being slipped a Viagra. An unbidden boner is, without exception, an unwelcome boner.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha.

http://www.grantland...-mass-effect-3s

That's hilarious

[Militarized]

gmboy902 wrote...

Almost as childish as the players giving it bad reviews, except at least they (I imagine) focused just on the story of it, whiel the players also ignored the awesome gameplay in their tearing apart of the game's score.

We play FOR the story... if I wanted to play a third person shooter, I'd play Gears of War or numerous other better ones. Mass Effect 3 is an RPG, yes the gameplay is nice but it's really just an means to an end(so to speak). They seemed to have forgotten that, no one loved Mass Effect because it was ZOMG THE BEST 3rd PERSON SHOOTER EVAH. 

[zennyrpg]

The hard thing about these reviews is that everyone plays the games for different reasons. I've heard people say that ME3 was a dating sim, while others say the romances weren't fleshed out enough.

From a literary/ story opinion this review is right on. And since I play games like this mostly for the story/ universe I agree with it completely.

[Bravery1282]

A lot of people say stop calling Mass Effect art (I don't call it art, don't see how it could be), but, yet praise a literary review of a video game.  I understand not liking the ending, but I can't rap my head around  this, is the reason for the praise because the reviewer agrees with those who don't like the ending?

In the review, there is a complaint that the other reviewers ignored the ending,  Even called them a name.  I wonder if this reviewer feels the same about themselves, being they obviously don't believe in basing their score on anything but narrative.  I guess the can hide behind the fact that they are a "literary reviewer" but, can't the others also say they base their reviews on why they play a video game?  

[Janus382]

During its final moments it commits storytelling suicide, and the taste of decay it leaves in the mouth cripples the otherwise impeccable quality of what came before, poisoning even nostalgia against it. 

Nailed it.  Nailed it so hard.  It couldn't have been nailed any harder.

Nailed.


Thanks for posting this! 

Modifié par Janus382, 18 mars 2012 - 08:21 .

[Killer3000ad]

Given how Bioware wanted to shoot for a DEEP and ARTSY ENDING, it's fitting that an actual authority on literature and art just told them their ending was absolute rubbish.

[Lozark]

Every review we've seen that isn't part of gaming journalism has been fair, critical, and mentioned that the ending is so bad that it taints the entire series.

Telling.

[Senario]

Great find, people often forget that RPGs as extensive as ME can often be comparable to a BOOK. Thus need to be kept to the same literary standard. Authors NEED to give their readers a satisfying ending in order not to make anything that has happened thus far void.