281 réponses à ce sujet

[Capeo]

Davies993 wrote...

S Atomeha wrote...

can we get a link?

No need. What he is saying is simply not true.

Chris Priestly wrote...

'TO BE CLEAR:
The app in question was created by Geoff Keighley of Gametrailers. It was made from materials he collected, with support from BioWare, in the weeks before Mass Effect 3 is launched. This app is NOT BioWare's "official response about the endings of the game", or similar. We will be addressing the endings in the future as I have indicated in this thread.'

I'm shocked you can type with all those straws in your grasp. 

[Leafs43]

sadako wrote...

If the indoctrination theory is true. Why is there stargazer and starchild in the ending for ALL the choices?

That essentially invalidates the indoctrination theory.

How?

And if they tack on more ending stuff, does it invalidate stargazer's scene?

[nyogen]

I really do no understand how anyone can back up the indoctrination theory when your final choices are a direct consequence of EMS (low ems you get only one choice, so and so EMS you get 2 choices and enough EMS you get 3 choices), I mean cool story bro... you are hallucinating channeled through your final choices by the actual EMS when you were supposedely not indoctrinated... that makes a load of sense , I am sure the Reapers kept tabs on your EMS and indoctrinated you accordingly and separately on that basis

[Xerkysz]

sadako wrote...

If the indoctrination theory is true. Why is there stargazer and starchild in the ending for ALL the choices?

That essentially invalidates the indoctrination theory.

I don't know what you're on, but I want some.

How does that invalidate the indoctrination theory?

[Rusty0918]

nyogen wrote...

I really do no understand how anyone can back up the indoctrination theory when your final choices are a direct consequence of EMS (low ems you get only one choice, so and so EMS you get 2 choices and enough EMS you get 3 choices), I mean cool story bro... you are hallucinating channeled through your final choices by the actual EMS when you were supposedely not indoctrinated... that makes a load of sense , I am sure the Reapers kept tabs on your EMS and indoctrinated you accordingly and separately on that basis

Because of this: You see, with enough EMS, the Reapers know that if they fail to indoctrinate you, they're not going to bode too well ultimately. THAT's why the give you the other choices. They're trying to fool you. They don't WANT you to choose destroy. Keep in mind that Anderson in this "dream" is portrayed as red, as in Renegade when you know he's a Paragon, and the Illusive Man is portrayed as blue as in Paragon but he's Renegade incarnate. The Reapers are trying to distort you. They're trying harder.

[NeitherNor]

I've tried this a couple of times now, but perhaps this time somebody on the Indoctrination-Train can answer the following:

If Shepard was never on the Citadel, and everything he 'experienced' was the process of being fully indoctrinated, how did he activate the Crucible? And if not Shepard, who did - and why?

[cyric085]

nyogen wrote...

I really do no understand how anyone can back up the indoctrination theory when your final choices are a direct consequence of EMS (low ems you get only one choice, so and so EMS you get 2 choices and enough EMS you get 3 choices), I mean cool story bro... you are hallucinating channeled through your final choices by the actual EMS when you were supposedely not indoctrinated... that makes a load of sense , I am sure the Reapers kept tabs on your EMS and indoctrinated you accordingly and separately on that basis

low ems and destroy you do not wake up

high ems and destroy you wake up

explain to me please

[Outlaw704]

How does the god child know about EDI if hes not at the very least in shepards mind?

[Jaze55]

Rusty0918 wrote...

nyogen wrote...

I really do no understand how anyone can back up the indoctrination theory when your final choices are a direct consequence of EMS (low ems you get only one choice, so and so EMS you get 2 choices and enough EMS you get 3 choices), I mean cool story bro... you are hallucinating channeled through your final choices by the actual EMS when you were supposedely not indoctrinated... that makes a load of sense , I am sure the Reapers kept tabs on your EMS and indoctrinated you accordingly and separately on that basis

Because of this: You see, with enough EMS, the Reapers know that if they fail to indoctrinate you, they're not going to bode too well ultimately. THAT's why the give you the other choices. They're trying to fool you. They don't WANT you to choose destroy. Keep in mind that Anderson in this "dream" is portrayed as red, as in Renegade when you know he's a Paragon, and the Illusive Man is portrayed as blue as in Paragon but he's Renegade incarnate. The Reapers are trying to distort you. They're trying harder.

 

Modifié par MassEffected555, 18 mars 2012 - 05:13 .

[Capeo]

Xerkysz wrote...

sadako wrote...

If the indoctrination theory is true. Why is there stargazer and starchild in the ending for ALL the choices?

That essentially invalidates the indoctrination theory.

I don't know what you're on, but I want some.

How does that invalidate the indoctrination theory?

Its called parsimony. If one ending was real and the other two were fake they would not have the same epilogue. If one ending was real and the others fake they wouldn't have the same title screen telling you you beat the Reapers. 

[Jaze55]

 Here is another one that's like the ending we got, just to remind you what we got IS THE ACTUAL ENDING


http://t1.gstatic.co..._DMSSq9KCkvu1L 

[nyogen]

Rusty0918 wrote...

nyogen wrote...

I really do no understand how anyone can back up the indoctrination theory when your final choices are a direct consequence of EMS (low ems you get only one choice, so and so EMS you get 2 choices and enough EMS you get 3 choices), I mean cool story bro... you are hallucinating channeled through your final choices by the actual EMS when you were supposedely not indoctrinated... that makes a load of sense , I am sure the Reapers kept tabs on your EMS and indoctrinated you accordingly and separately on that basis

Because of this: You see, with enough EMS, the Reapers know that if they fail to indoctrinate you, they're not going to bode too well ultimately. THAT's why the give you the other choices. They're trying to fool you. They don't WANT you to choose destroy. Keep in mind that Anderson in this "dream" is portrayed as red, as in Renegade when you know he's a Paragon, and the Illusive Man is portrayed as blue as in Paragon but he's Renegade incarnate. The Reapers are trying to distort you. They're trying harder.

Destroy is the ONLY choice you get with low EMS, cool story though

[Davies993]

Capeo wrote...

Davies993 wrote...

S Atomeha wrote...

can we get a link?

No need. What he is saying is simply not true.

Chris Priestly wrote...

'TO BE CLEAR:
The app in question was created by Geoff Keighley of Gametrailers. It was made from materials he collected, with support from BioWare, in the weeks before Mass Effect 3 is launched. This app is NOT BioWare's "official response about the endings of the game", or similar. We will be addressing the endings in the future as I have indicated in this thread.'

I'm shocked you can type with all those straws in your grasp. 

So grasping at straws = proving someone is wrong on this topic with a quote from the devs stating the complete opposite of what said person is asserting?

Huh?


Congratulations for being yet another user to conform to the trend of posting that phrase without knowing what it means though. I might even post its definition as my sig seeing as most of you haven't a clue.

Modifié par Davies993, 18 mars 2012 - 05:22 .

[Xerkysz]

NeitherNor wrote...

I've tried this a couple of times now, but perhaps this time somebody on the Indoctrination-Train can answer the following:

If Shepard was never on the Citadel, and everything he 'experienced' was the process of being fully indoctrinated, how did he activate the Crucible? And if not Shepard, who did - and why?

I'll gladly do this.

It's not fully indoctrinated, after you get hit by the beam, you're knocked unconcious. Harbinger uses this to his advantage as it's easier to indoctrinate someone who's unconcious as they are not aware of what's going on.
Your will power makes it hard enough for him to take control of you.

The crucible has not yet been activated, what you see is part of the indoctrination, if you choose Control/Synth during the Star Child part , you're letting the reapers live, they have detered you from doing what you have been aiming to do since Mass Effect 1/2, destroy the reapers to bring peace to the galaxy.
If you select destroy, you're beating the reapers, this shows your strong and your will power is strong, you overcome indoctrination, you live, earth lives, the geth live. You wake up in the rubble of london after being hit by the beam.

[Rusty0918]

nyogen wrote...

Rusty0918 wrote...

nyogen wrote...

I really do no understand how anyone can back up the indoctrination theory when your final choices are a direct consequence of EMS (low ems you get only one choice, so and so EMS you get 2 choices and enough EMS you get 3 choices), I mean cool story bro... you are hallucinating channeled through your final choices by the actual EMS when you were supposedely not indoctrinated... that makes a load of sense , I am sure the Reapers kept tabs on your EMS and indoctrinated you accordingly and separately on that basis

Because of this: You see, with enough EMS, the Reapers know that if they fail to indoctrinate you, they're not going to bode too well ultimately. THAT's why the give you the other choices. They're trying to fool you. They don't WANT you to choose destroy. Keep in mind that Anderson in this "dream" is portrayed as red, as in Renegade when you know he's a Paragon, and the Illusive Man is portrayed as blue as in Paragon but he's Renegade incarnate. The Reapers are trying to distort you. They're trying harder.

Destroy is the ONLY choice you get with low EMS, cool story though

Yes - because the Reapers know that you don't have a chance in defeating them with low EMS. Higher EMS, they're going to put the effort in to indoctrinating you. That's why they give you the other choices with higher EMS, they distort you from choosing the Destroy option.

[Outlaw704]

So instead of debunking Davies response, you guys just post LOLgraspingforstraws.jpg. trolls gonna troll, try actually responding if you really think you're right

[Xerkysz]

cyric085 wrote...

nyogen wrote...

I really do no understand how anyone can back up the indoctrination theory when your final choices are a direct consequence of EMS (low ems you get only one choice, so and so EMS you get 2 choices and enough EMS you get 3 choices), I mean cool story bro... you are hallucinating channeled through your final choices by the actual EMS when you were supposedely not indoctrinated... that makes a load of sense , I am sure the Reapers kept tabs on your EMS and indoctrinated you accordingly and separately on that basis

low ems and destroy you do not wake up

high ems and destroy you wake up

explain to me please

This was explained earlier, I'll see if I can find it.

Rusty0918 has done me a favour and put it right here for me so I don't have to search.

"Yes - because the Reapers know that you don't have a chance in defeating
them with low EMS. Higher EMS, they're going to put the effort in to
indoctrinating you. That's why they give you the other choices with
higher EMS, they distort you from choosing the Destroy option."

This is why TIM's was coloured Paragon, and Andersons Renegade.

Modifié par Xerkysz, 18 mars 2012 - 05:20 .

[MegumiAzusa]

nyogen wrote...
Destroy is the ONLY choice you get with low EMS, cool story though

Control is the ONLY choice you get with low EMS when you saved the Collector Base, cool story though

Modifié par MegumiAzusa, 18 mars 2012 - 05:22 .

[Jaze55]

Outlaw704 wrote...

So instead of debunking Davies response, you guys just post LOLgraspingforstraws.jpg. trolls gonna troll, try actually responding if you really think you're right

I'm not wasting my time. Nothing is going to prove to you its false. Even though Casey Hudson made an official statement the game was done from their eyes. Go back a page I even copied it and left a direct link for you and even bolded the important parts.

There is nothing left to explain since Casey Hudson already flat out said that end is what they planned. Facts are facts bro sorry if you just refuse to believe them. 

[Xerkysz]

Capeo wrote...

Its called parsimony. If one ending was real and the other two were fake they would not have the same epilogue. If one ending was real and the others fake they wouldn't have the same title screen telling you you beat the Reapers. 

BioWare had to make it fair to people that chose control/synth.
How else would they indoctrinate the player base.

[eddieoctane]

nyogen wrote...

Rusty0918 wrote...

nyogen wrote...

I really do no understand how anyone can back up the indoctrination theory when your final choices are a direct consequence of EMS (low ems you get only one choice, so and so EMS you get 2 choices and enough EMS you get 3 choices), I mean cool story bro... you are hallucinating channeled through your final choices by the actual EMS when you were supposedely not indoctrinated... that makes a load of sense , I am sure the Reapers kept tabs on your EMS and indoctrinated you accordingly and separately on that basis

Because of this: You see, with enough EMS, the Reapers know that if they fail to indoctrinate you, they're not going to bode too well ultimately. THAT's why the give you the other choices. They're trying to fool you. They don't WANT you to choose destroy. Keep in mind that Anderson in this "dream" is portrayed as red, as in Renegade when you know he's a Paragon, and the Illusive Man is portrayed as blue as in Paragon but he's Renegade incarnate. The Reapers are trying to distort you. They're trying harder.

Destroy is the ONLY choice you get with low EMS, cool story though

We are trying to present solutions to the plothole proposed in this thread. Solutions presented in the post you quoted as well as mine give valid theories. You haven't said anything that actually disproves or even challanges the theories presented in any remotely meaningful way. Contribute to the conversation or stop posting.

[MegumiAzusa]

MassEffected555 wrote...

I'm not wasting my time. Nothing is going to prove to you its false. Even though Casey Hudson made an official statement the game was done from their eyes. Go back a page I even copied it and left a direct link for you and even bolded the important parts.

There is nothing left to explain since Casey Hudson already flat out said that end is what they planned. Facts are facts bro sorry if you just refuse to believe them.

Yes the endings are what they planned, but it doesn't say if there was no end planned where Shep gets indoctrinated.

[Vhalkyrie]

savionen wrote...

The VI didn't detect indoctrination. - Javik states that indoctrination can't be seen by VI's until very late.

I didn't get the Day 1 DLC.  Did he really say that?  Wow.

[Jaze55]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

MassEffected555 wrote...

I'm not wasting my time. Nothing is going to prove to you its false. Even though Casey Hudson made an official statement the game was done from their eyes. Go back a page I even copied it and left a direct link for you and even bolded the important parts.

There is nothing left to explain since Casey Hudson already flat out said that end is what they planned. Facts are facts bro sorry if you just refuse to believe them.

Yes the endings are what they planned, but it doesn't say if there was no end planned where Shep gets indoctrinated.

They could have planned all the players falling into the Lifestream to fight Sephiroth also, but is that in the game? NO so who gives a sh#t what they planned, all that matters is what they shipped and what we got. 

[Rusty0918]

MassEffected555 wrote...

Outlaw704 wrote...

So instead of debunking Davies response, you guys just post LOLgraspingforstraws.jpg. trolls gonna troll, try actually responding if you really think you're right

I'm not wasting my time. Nothing is going to prove to you its false. Even though Casey Hudson made an official statement the game was done from their eyes. Go back a page I even copied it and left a direct link for you and even bolded the important parts.

There is nothing left to explain since Casey Hudson already flat out said that end is what they planned. Facts are facts bro sorry if you just refuse to believe them. 

What Casey Hudson said was true to a point. If my surmise is correct, they DID plan the indoctrination thing. But they need to have content after it, the closure stuff. Ending it if you choose right (Destroy with high-enough EMS) should not just end with Shepard in the rubble. I keep wondering if BioWare has another trick up their sleeve. However, regardless if this is right or not, Bioware did make a terrible mistake that's going to be tough to rectify.