281 réponses à ce sujet

[Xerkysz]

MassEffected555 wrote...


They could have planned all the players falling into the Lifestream to fight Sephiroth also, but is that in the game? NO so who gives a sh#t what they planned, all that matters is what they shipped and what we got.

Because DLC doesn't exist? Right?

[Davies993]

MassEffected555 wrote...

Outlaw704 wrote...

So instead of debunking Davies response, you guys just post LOLgraspingforstraws.jpg. trolls gonna troll, try actually responding if you really think you're right

I'm not wasting my time. Nothing is going to prove to you its false. Even though Casey Hudson made an official statement the game was done from their eyes. Go back a page I even copied it and left a direct link for you and even bolded the important parts.

There is nothing left to explain since Casey Hudson already flat out said that end is what they planned. Facts are facts bro sorry if you just refuse to believe them. 

'There’s been a lot of discussion and debate about the conclusion of Mass Effect 3, so I thought I’d share my perspective with you here.'

This is not the official response, they have already stated that they are going to make an official response regarding the ending when more people have had a chance to finish the game.

Modifié par Davies993, 18 mars 2012 - 05:28 .

[Jaze55]

Rusty0918 wrote...

MassEffected555 wrote...

Outlaw704 wrote...

So instead of debunking Davies response, you guys just post LOLgraspingforstraws.jpg. trolls gonna troll, try actually responding if you really think you're right

I'm not wasting my time. Nothing is going to prove to you its false. Even though Casey Hudson made an official statement the game was done from their eyes. Go back a page I even copied it and left a direct link for you and even bolded the important parts.

There is nothing left to explain since Casey Hudson already flat out said that end is what they planned. Facts are facts bro sorry if you just refuse to believe them. 

What Casey Hudson said was true to a point. If my surmise is correct, they DID plan the indoctrination thing. But they need to have content after it, the closure stuff. Ending it if you choose right (Destroy with high-enough EMS) should not just end with Shepard in the rubble. I keep wondering if BioWare has another trick up their sleeve. However, regardless if this is right or not, Bioware did make a terrible mistake that's going to be tough to rectify.

I think that is something we can ALL agree on. 

[nyogen]

Rusty0918 wrote...

nyogen wrote...

Rusty0918 wrote...

nyogen wrote...

I really do no understand how anyone can back up the indoctrination theory when your final choices are a direct consequence of EMS (low ems you get only one choice, so and so EMS you get 2 choices and enough EMS you get 3 choices), I mean cool story bro... you are hallucinating channeled through your final choices by the actual EMS when you were supposedely not indoctrinated... that makes a load of sense , I am sure the Reapers kept tabs on your EMS and indoctrinated you accordingly and separately on that basis

Because of this: You see, with enough EMS, the Reapers know that if they fail to indoctrinate you, they're not going to bode too well ultimately. THAT's why the give you the other choices. They're trying to fool you. They don't WANT you to choose destroy. Keep in mind that Anderson in this "dream" is portrayed as red, as in Renegade when you know he's a Paragon, and the Illusive Man is portrayed as blue as in Paragon but he's Renegade incarnate. The Reapers are trying to distort you. They're trying harder.

Destroy is the ONLY choice you get with low EMS, cool story though

Yes - because the Reapers know that you don't have a chance in defeating them with low EMS. Higher EMS, they're going to put the effort in to indoctrinating you. That's why they give you the other choices with higher EMS, they distort you from choosing the Destroy option.

Ok, your argument is that you really want to believe that, at the expense of logic and your own contradictions, if that's what spins your wheels you payed the same money as I did on the game so you are entitled to your opinion, that doesn't make it logically sound or proven by facts.

Once you say Reapers want to influence you not to choose destroy, then you say ... I don't know exactly what you tried to say but there were two colors there, no offence, completely disregarding that what you say that they want you NOT to choose is the ONLY option with low EMS (they must be suicidal or something)  and you totally avoided to explain why indoctrination is channeled by EMS, they don't know your EMS, the Crucible was a secret otherwise they would have destroyed it when they were building it.

I hope you are right actually and that they spin off this indoctrination nonsense, because it is factual nonsense, just to give us some decent endings not color based.

[NeitherNor]

Xerkysz wrote...

NeitherNor wrote...

I've tried this a couple of times now, but perhaps this time somebody on the Indoctrination-Train can answer the following:

If Shepard was never on the Citadel, and everything he 'experienced' was the process of being fully indoctrinated, how did he activate the Crucible? And if not Shepard, who did - and why?

I'll gladly do this.

It's not fully indoctrinated, after you get hit by the beam, you're knocked unconcious. Harbinger uses this to his advantage as it's easier to indoctrinate someone who's unconcious as they are not aware of what's going on.
Your will power makes it hard enough for him to take control of you.

The crucible has not yet been activated, what you see is part of the indoctrination, if you choose Control/Synth during the Star Child part , you're letting the reapers live, they have detered you from doing what you have been aiming to do since Mass Effect 1/2, destroy the reapers to bring peace to the galaxy.
If you select destroy, you're beating the reapers, this shows your strong and your will power is strong, you overcome indoctrination, you live, earth lives, the geth live. You wake up in the rubble of london after being hit by the beam.

Thank you for taking the time to answer. I want to enjoy these endings much more than I do now (probably most people's reason for being here!), so I'm genuinely interested in hearing some perspectives on them, even if I am not convinced of this particular interpretation.

I'm still not sure if I understand how this theory explains how the Crucible is activated since Shepard, at least in my understanding of this theory, never leaves Earth and is at no point even close to the Crucible and/or the Citadel.

Thanks.

Modifié par NeitherNor, 18 mars 2012 - 05:29 .

[Rusty0918]

nyogen wrote...

Rusty0918 wrote...

nyogen wrote...

Rusty0918 wrote...

nyogen wrote...

I really do no understand how anyone can back up the indoctrination theory when your final choices are a direct consequence of EMS (low ems you get only one choice, so and so EMS you get 2 choices and enough EMS you get 3 choices), I mean cool story bro... you are hallucinating channeled through your final choices by the actual EMS when you were supposedely not indoctrinated... that makes a load of sense , I am sure the Reapers kept tabs on your EMS and indoctrinated you accordingly and separately on that basis

Because of this: You see, with enough EMS, the Reapers know that if they fail to indoctrinate you, they're not going to bode too well ultimately. THAT's why the give you the other choices. They're trying to fool you. They don't WANT you to choose destroy. Keep in mind that Anderson in this "dream" is portrayed as red, as in Renegade when you know he's a Paragon, and the Illusive Man is portrayed as blue as in Paragon but he's Renegade incarnate. The Reapers are trying to distort you. They're trying harder.

Destroy is the ONLY choice you get with low EMS, cool story though

Yes - because the Reapers know that you don't have a chance in defeating them with low EMS. Higher EMS, they're going to put the effort in to indoctrinating you. That's why they give you the other choices with higher EMS, they distort you from choosing the Destroy option.

Ok, your argument is that you really want to believe that, at the expense of logic and your own contradictions, if that's what spins your wheels you payed the same money as I did on the game so you are entitled to your opinion, that doesn't make it logically sound or proven by facts.

Once you say Reapers want to influence you not to choose destroy, then you say ... I don't know exactly what you tried to say but there were two colors there, no offence, completely disregarding that what you say that they want you NOT to choose is the ONLY option with low EMS (they must be suicidal or something)  and you totally avoided to explain why indoctrination is channeled by EMS, they don't know your EMS, the Crucible was a secret otherwise they would have destroyed it when they were building it.

I hope you are right actually and that they spin off this indoctrination nonsense, because it is factual nonsense, just to give us some decent endings not color based.

Because you don't really destroy them in the dream. You THINK you do. I mean, if you have low enough EMS, they don't NEED to put the extra effort in giving you the choices. But if you have higher EMS, which means you and all the allies you brought with you have a chance in defeating the Reapers, they're going to try to indoctrinate you to get you to change your mind. Because they know you're a key to knocking them out.

It also explains the Shepard in the rubble when you choose Destroy with high enough EMS.

[JMA22TB]

Low EMS represents how well you prepared for the battle. If you didn't do that, it's fair to assume that even if you fought off the indoctrination Shepard knows that there's not much left in terms of resistance.

You could say that EMS = confidence, Reputation to convince Shepard = character, and your choice = judgment.

Without all three lined up Shepard fails what I call the Dream Trap and either dies or becomes a slave to the Reapers.

[nyogen]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

nyogen wrote...
Destroy is the ONLY choice you get with low EMS, cool story though

Control is the ONLY choice you get with low EMS when you saved the Collector Base, cool story though

cool story bro right bak at ya
www.ign.com/wikis/mass-effect-3/Endings

[sAxMoNkI]

I think at this point any ending speculation should be treated as "Schrodingers Cat", we are all correct until the box is opened by the devs proving us to be correct or incorrect.

[thehomeworld]

A bigger plot hole for the indoctrination theory is why would you keep the big red self destruct button at all when you want your indoctrinated toy to do as you say and help you win? The real option would only be hybrid mode not control because the reapers where trying to kil TIM because he wanted to control them and having their own achilles heel open for shep to strike just incase makes zero sense either unless you're suicidal badguys it can't make sense. I still can't buy into the indoctrinated thing either the reapers controlled shep and A) wanted to be controlled, wanted to die, or C) want to make life a new

Or TIM is controlling shep even after he dies to A) control the reapers for his own ends, kill the reapers cuz they won't play his game, or C) make everyone as miserable and crazy as he is. We've already proven with Saren kill the thing that is indoctrinating them and they are no longer a threat we killed TIM so he wasn't using shep and the reapers wouldn't control shep just to have him or even allow him to kill them unless again they're suicidal machines and machines shouldn't feel the need to commit seppuku on themselves.

Modifié par thehomeworld, 18 mars 2012 - 05:36 .

[TheMerchantMan]

The idea is that indoctrination theory means you've never left Earth.

I.e. the destroy option is just to realease yourself from their control, it doesn't actually fire the crucible, and thus the Reapers do not actually die. Thus the Starchild only gives you "destroy" when your EMS is too low because the Reapers have already won, they don't need Shepard's mind.


That said, yes. It's a hole, but when you look at this hole and compare it to the several dreadnought-sized holes of the original ending, I much prefer Indoc Theory.

[lakdav]

There was a game not so long ago, Blood Omen, where there was a choice in the end: sacrifice yourself to cure the world of corruption, or rule the corrupted world for eternity. Later, another company made a game (Soul Reaver) out of the ruling the world ending. And before it was complete they decided to make it a series. In the series it is hinted that the first game's possible sacrifice would not have cured the world at all.

My point is: It is not unheard of to have a new game from another's ONE possible ending among the many. If they (not necessarily Bioware) can make it good, i would welcome a new chapter or several according to that 1 ending.

But what we (me at least) like in Mass Effect is the universe and our characters. The 3 ending of ME3 changes the universe of ME and puts the characters away on a nowhere planet. Any of the choices presented if real, would pretty much shatter what is most enjoyable about the ME universe.

As a consumer i could urge the developer to salvage more from something that was intended to end, take the best explanation you (or some desperate fans) can think out, and go milk more money from us.
Or as a consumer i can accept the developer's right to end their product the way they see fit, but as a consumer i can **** all i want about how the ending doesnt make sense or doesnt provide the expected/desired sense of closure.

Bottom line: IF you want to end something, end it RIGHT.
If you dont end it right, dont end it at all until you know you can end it right.

[Rusty0918]

Thank you JMA22TB for backing me up on this.

[Drachiite]

What I don't get about indoc theory is when Shep supposedly became indoctrinated. The amount of actual close contact with reapers isn't all that much when you consider that it took the researchers *inside* the wrecked reaper (ME2) multiple days to weeks to become derpdrones.

But really, my grudge with the ending is the unecessary destruction of the relays. Just seemed a bit gratuitous.

[Xerkysz]

sAxMoNkI wrote...

I think at this point any ending speculation should be treated as "Schrodingers Cat", we are all correct until the box is opened by the devs proving us to be correct or incorrect.

It can be treated as Schrodingers Cat, and that being said reminded me of this.

[Xerkysz]

Drachiite wrote...

What I don't get about indoc theory is when Shep supposedly became indoctrinated. The amount of actual close contact with reapers isn't all that much when you consider that it took the researchers *inside* the wrecked reaper (ME2) multiple days to weeks to become derpdrones.

But really, my grudge with the ending is the unecessary destruction of the relays. Just seemed a bit gratuitous.

Relay's don't get destroyed, and true indoctrination happens when Harbinger drops down beside the beam and hits you with his beam of rape, rendering you unconcious which gives him an edge over you, as you were hard enough to indoctrinate while you were concious.

*He couldn't pull it off in ME2*

Modifié par Xerkysz, 18 mars 2012 - 05:41 .

[FirstBlood XL]

Okay... let's pretend the indoc theory has some holes.  Let's look at the holes in the 'what you see is what you get' ending:

* Squad running with your Shep to the beam completely disappears... Only to magically reappear aboard the Normandy.  This is poor/lazy writing.  Or a failed retcon of earlier drafts, which is still poor/lazy writing.

* Shep gets hit by Harb's beam... gets up.  Barely able to walk from his injuries, half dead... His armor (shields as well, I would imagine) are decimated.  Maruader Shields jumps out of nowhere and puts a space-bullet in you.  You still manage to take out Maurader Shields and continue your mission, even though you were basically walking-dead BEFORE being shot.  Poor/Lazy writing.

* Anderson says he went into the beam right behind you... when he was nowhere to be seen behind you.  Then he happens to have teleported closer to the control panel, very convienent.  Poor/lazy writing.

* Illusive Man magically appears behind Shephard in the 'control room'.  More poor/lazy writing.

* Starkid AI.  LOL.  You don't introduce a 'magical higher power' in the last few moments of a story.  That's the worst form of Dues Ex Machina (not the lame video games).... which again, is poor/lazy writing TO THE EXTREME.

* The fact the Starkid AI is the Reaper King, Shephard's sworn enemy over the course of the trilogy... and that Shephard just accepts every word it speaks as truth, is poor/lazy writing.  Lets use an example, shall we?  You're a WWII soldier and you're about to wipe out the entire **** army, when Hitler himself magically appears.  He tells you, "You know, all this genocide and horrible mudering of innocents... it's all just a way to save humanity.  What you really need to do is....." would you listen to him, or put a bullet in his head?

* Joker is fleeing before Shephard makes his 'choice' and sets off whatever color beam of energy.   Even though he'd follow you into hell, and even though you basically had to rip him out of his seat in the opening of ME2...  And oh yeah, he managed to save your squad in the meantime, but nobody mentions that Shephard is nowhere to be found.  Poor/lazy writing.

* Assuming you get the 'best ending' (the only one with special footage only shown with extra high EMS)... Shephard still draws breath after FALLING OFF AN EXPLODING CITADEL, THRU EARTH'S ATMOSPHERE, AND TO THE GROUND.  All with his armor already melted/destroyed and with a Marauder Shields bullet in him as a bonus.  Yep, you guessed it.  Poor/lazy writing.

Now which 'theory' has more plot holes?

[Davies993]

thehomeworld wrote...

A bigger plot hole for the indoctrination theory is why would you keep the big red self destruct button at all when you want your indoctrinated toy to do as you say and help you win? The real option would only be hybrid mode not control because the reapers where trying to kil TIM because he wanted to control them and having their own achilles heel open for shep to strike just incase makes zero sense either unless you're suicidal badguys it can't make sense. I still can't buy into the indoctrinated thing either the reapers controlled shep and A) wanted to be controlled, wanted to die, or C) want to make life a new

Or TIM is controlling shep even after he dies to A) control the reapers for his own ends, kill the reapers cuz they won't play his game, or C) make everyone as miserable and crazy as he is. We've already proven with Saren kill the thing that is indoctrinating them and they are no longer a threat we killed TIM so he wasn't using shep and the reapers wouldn't control shep just to have him or even allow him to kill them unless again they're suicidal machines and machines shouldn't feel the need to commit seppuku on themselves.

This has been explained in the indoc theory thread.

According to the theory, the choices represent breaking free of indoctrination or succumbing to it.

[sAxMoNkI]

Xerkysz wrote...

sAxMoNkI wrote...

I think at this point any ending speculation should be treated as "Schrodingers Cat", we are all correct until the box is opened by the devs proving us to be correct or incorrect.

It can be treated as Schrodingers Cat, and that being said reminded me of this.

HAHA love it

[nyogen]

Rusty0918 wrote...

nyogen wrote...

Rusty0918 wrote...

nyogen wrote...

Rusty0918 wrote...

nyogen wrote...

I really do no understand how anyone can back up the indoctrination theory when your final choices are a direct consequence of EMS (low ems you get only one choice, so and so EMS you get 2 choices and enough EMS you get 3 choices), I mean cool story bro... you are hallucinating channeled through your final choices by the actual EMS when you were supposedely not indoctrinated... that makes a load of sense , I am sure the Reapers kept tabs on your EMS and indoctrinated you accordingly and separately on that basis

Because of this: You see, with enough EMS, the Reapers know that if they fail to indoctrinate you, they're not going to bode too well ultimately. THAT's why the give you the other choices. They're trying to fool you. They don't WANT you to choose destroy. Keep in mind that Anderson in this "dream" is portrayed as red, as in Renegade when you know he's a Paragon, and the Illusive Man is portrayed as blue as in Paragon but he's Renegade incarnate. The Reapers are trying to distort you. They're trying harder.

Destroy is the ONLY choice you get with low EMS, cool story though

Yes - because the Reapers know that you don't have a chance in defeating them with low EMS. Higher EMS, they're going to put the effort in to indoctrinating you. That's why they give you the other choices with higher EMS, they distort you from choosing the Destroy option.

Ok, your argument is that you really want to believe that, at the expense of logic and your own contradictions, if that's what spins your wheels you payed the same money as I did on the game so you are entitled to your opinion, that doesn't make it logically sound or proven by facts.

Once you say Reapers want to influence you not to choose destroy, then you say ... I don't know exactly what you tried to say but there were two colors there, no offence, completely disregarding that what you say that they want you NOT to choose is the ONLY option with low EMS (they must be suicidal or something)  and you totally avoided to explain why indoctrination is channeled by EMS, they don't know your EMS, the Crucible was a secret otherwise they would have destroyed it when they were building it.

I hope you are right actually and that they spin off this indoctrination nonsense, because it is factual nonsense, just to give us some decent endings not color based.

Because you don't really destroy them in the dream. You THINK you do. I mean, if you have low enough EMS, they don't NEED to put the extra effort in giving you the choices. But if you have higher EMS, which means you and all the allies you brought with you have a chance in defeating the Reapers, they're going to try to indoctrinate you to get you to change your mind. Because they know you're a key to knocking them out.

It also explains the Shepard in the rubble when you choose Destroy with high enough EMS.

Let's say I own a lot of assets, which is what EMS is btw, that means the Reapers have an accountant and if I own more than 1 million in assets they have to fart themselves into Casper and 3 colors compared to Casper and 1 or 2 colors if I owned less ? ... anyway your right to believe whatever makes you happy, wish I could create some illusional endings myself in my head and strongly believe in them, as it is I am hoping for Bioware to do right by themselves and the series and provide some decent closure for mostly everyone

Modifié par nyogen, 18 mars 2012 - 05:42 .

[Xerkysz]

FirstBlood XL wrote...

Okay... let's pretend the indoc theory has some holes.  Let's look at the holes in the 'what you see is what you get' ending:

* Squad running with your Shep to the beam completely disappears... Only to magically reappear aboard the Normandy.  This is poor/lazy writing.  Or a failed retcon of earlier drafts, which is still poor/lazy writing.

* Shep gets hit by Harb's beam... gets up.  Barely able to walk from his injuries, half dead... His armor (shields as well, I would imagine) are decimated.  Maruader Shields jumps out of nowhere and puts a space-bullet in you.  You still manage to take out Maurader Shields and continue your mission, even though you were basically walking-dead BEFORE being shot.  Poor/Lazy writing.

* Anderson says he went into the beam right behind you... when he was nowhere to be seen behind you.  Then he happens to have teleported closer to the control panel, very convienent.  Poor/lazy writing.

* Illusive Man magically appears behind Shephard in the 'control room'.  More poor/lazy writing.

* Starkid AI.  LOL.  You don't introduce a 'magical higher power' in the last few moments of a story.  That's the worst form of Dues Ex Machina (not the lame video games).... which again, is poor/lazy writing TO THE EXTREME.

* The fact the Starkid AI is the Reaper King, Shephard's sworn enemy over the course of the trilogy... and that Shephard just accepts every word it speaks as truth, is poor/lazy writing.  Lets use an example, shall we?  You're a WWII soldier and you're about to wipe out the entire **** army, when Hitler himself magically appears.  He tells you, "You know, all this genocide and horrible mudering of innocents... it's all just a way to save humanity.  What you really need to do is....." would you listen to him, or put a bullet in his head?

* Joker is fleeing before Shephard makes his 'choice' and sets off whatever color beam of energy.   Even though he'd follow you into hell, and even though you basically had to rip him out of his seat in the opening of ME2...  And oh yeah, he managed to save your squad in the meantime, but nobody mentions that Shephard is nowhere to be found.  Poor/lazy writing.

* Assuming you get the 'best ending' (the only one with special footage only shown with extra high EMS)... Shephard still draws breath after FALLING OFF AN EXPLODING CITADEL, THRU EARTH'S ATMOSPHERE, AND TO THE GROUND.  All with his armor already melted/destroyed and with a Marauder Shields bullet in him as a bonus.  Yep, you guessed it.  Poor/lazy writing.

Now which 'theory' has more plot holes?

You sir, are an idiot. Especially regarding this bit: "* Assuming you get the 'best ending' (the only one with special footage
only shown with extra high EMS)... Shephard still draws breath after
FALLING OFF AN EXPLODING CITADEL, THRU EARTH'S ATMOSPHERE, AND TO THE
GROUND. "

Please refrain from posting here.
Thank you.

Modifié par Xerkysz, 18 mars 2012 - 05:44 .

[MegumiAzusa]

Xerkysz wrote...

Drachiite wrote...

What I don't get about indoc theory is when Shep supposedly became indoctrinated. The amount of actual close contact with reapers isn't all that much when you consider that it took the researchers *inside* the wrecked reaper (ME2) multiple days to weeks to become derpdrones.

But really, my grudge with the ending is the unecessary destruction of the relays. Just seemed a bit gratuitous.

Relay's don't get destroyed, and true indoctrination happens when Harbinger drops down beside the beam and hits you with his beam of rape, rendering you unconcious which gives him an edge over you, as you were hard enough to indoctrinate while you were concious.

*He couldn't pull it off in ME2*

Additionally in Arrival you were in close proximity to a Reaper artifact for over 2 days.

[Cooptimo]

Drachiite wrote...

What I don't get about indoc theory is when Shep supposedly became indoctrinated. The amount of actual close contact with reapers isn't all that much when you consider that it took the researchers *inside* the wrecked reaper (ME2) multiple days to weeks to become derpdrones.

But really, my grudge with the ending is the unecessary destruction of the relays. Just seemed a bit gratuitous.

Well,  there was the two days of being knocked out cold near object Rho in "Arrival"      Not saying indoc theroy is right,  but that's one of the arguements for it.     I'm hopeful about Indoc Theory,  but I'm far from certain that's what was going on.


EDIT:   Darn, Ninja!

Modifié par Cooptimo, 18 mars 2012 - 05:44 .

[Xerkysz]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

Additionally in Arrival you were in close proximity to a Reaper artifact for over 2 days.

^ This.

[sAxMoNkI]

Xerkysz wrote...

FirstBlood XL wrote...

Okay... let's pretend the indoc theory has some holes.  Let's look at the holes in the 'what you see is what you get' ending:

* Squad running with your Shep to the beam completely disappears... Only to magically reappear aboard the Normandy.  This is poor/lazy writing.  Or a failed retcon of earlier drafts, which is still poor/lazy writing.

* Shep gets hit by Harb's beam... gets up.  Barely able to walk from his injuries, half dead... His armor (shields as well, I would imagine) are decimated.  Maruader Shields jumps out of nowhere and puts a space-bullet in you.  You still manage to take out Maurader Shields and continue your mission, even though you were basically walking-dead BEFORE being shot.  Poor/Lazy writing.

* Anderson says he went into the beam right behind you... when he was nowhere to be seen behind you.  Then he happens to have teleported closer to the control panel, very convienent.  Poor/lazy writing.

* Illusive Man magically appears behind Shephard in the 'control room'.  More poor/lazy writing.

* Starkid AI.  LOL.  You don't introduce a 'magical higher power' in the last few moments of a story.  That's the worst form of Dues Ex Machina (not the lame video games).... which again, is poor/lazy writing TO THE EXTREME.

* The fact the Starkid AI is the Reaper King, Shephard's sworn enemy over the course of the trilogy... and that Shephard just accepts every word it speaks as truth, is poor/lazy writing.  Lets use an example, shall we?  You're a WWII soldier and you're about to wipe out the entire **** army, when Hitler himself magically appears.  He tells you, "You know, all this genocide and horrible mudering of innocents... it's all just a way to save humanity.  What you really need to do is....." would you listen to him, or put a bullet in his head?

* Joker is fleeing before Shephard makes his 'choice' and sets off whatever color beam of energy.   Even though he'd follow you into hell, and even though you basically had to rip him out of his seat in the opening of ME2...  And oh yeah, he managed to save your squad in the meantime, but nobody mentions that Shephard is nowhere to be found.  Poor/lazy writing.

* Assuming you get the 'best ending' (the only one with special footage only shown with extra high EMS)... Shephard still draws breath after FALLING OFF AN EXPLODING CITADEL, THRU EARTH'S ATMOSPHERE, AND TO THE GROUND.  All with his armor already melted/destroyed and with a Marauder Shields bullet in him as a bonus.  Yep, you guessed it.  Poor/lazy writing.

Now which 'theory' has more plot holes?

You sir, are an idiot. Especially regarding this bit: "* Assuming you get the 'best ending' (the only one with special footage
only shown with extra high EMS)... Shephard still draws breath after
FALLING OFF AN EXPLODING CITADEL, THRU EARTH'S ATMOSPHERE, AND TO THE
GROUND. "

Please refrain from posting here.
Thank you.

Wait a minute, he's pointed out some inconsistencies and is asking for an explanation from a counter-theory and the best you've got is that he is an idiot?
On what grounds?
Why isn't he allowed to post here?

In terms of suspending disbelief having Shepard unconciosuly in London and imagining these events is every bit as plausible as him surviving re-entry to earth, through a vacuum, in an unsealed partially destroyed set of armour, after a cataclysmic explosion and still be breathing let alone not a charred hunk of carbon?