160 réponses à ce sujet

[Lianaar]

Soverign 666 wrote...
The truth of the matter is we fans are driven by emotion instead of logic we will fight even when we know we can't win.

This is exactly why I hope BioWare will not change the ending, no matter what I think of the ending itself.
Players role is to play and have a player perspective of the game.
Game Makers's role is to know their gamers and make a game that is good for many people, many very different people.

Making games and playing games requires a whole lot of different perspectives and mind sets. Putting the player in making role and putting the maker of playing role just won't bring anything good. This would be a very hazardous precedent, I fear it would take the power and bravery from game makers to make unconventional habit breaking and new, fresh games.

[Esoretal]

We're not trying to "force" anything. In fact, the fans who are being rude or trying to make demands are actually in the minority here on BSN. Most of this has been peaceful demonstration and discussion.

"The truth of the matter is we fans are driven by emotion instead of logic we will fight even when we know we can't win." LOL because Sovereign.

Modifié par Esoretal, 18 mars 2012 - 04:52 .

[Soverign 666]

RLesueur wrote...

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

OSUfan12121 wrote...

Thats why major news affiliates are reporting and even supporting us then?

LOL!   "Major news affiliates."

Well, it was reported by CNN.

They're pretty major.

Just saying...

(Should I tell a quick joke now so I don't look like I'm taking myself too seriously?)

Yes CNN covered you but what they said was some fans are very mad at the ending. I just dont see people watching that report and saying to themselves. "The last five minutes of that game suck, well I guess I'm not buying it now."

[III Mav III]

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

OSUfan12121 wrote...

Thats why major news affiliates are reporting and even supporting us then?

LOL!   "Major news affiliates."

CNN arn't major? 

[PandaThing]

Relatively new here, but isn't it good for a forum to be nitpicky. It means that devs get to see all the issues from a different perspective, and they have people who provide honest, detailed feedback. Being thorough is not a bad thing.

[DaringMoosejaw]

tobito113 wrote...

DaringMoosejaw wrote...

Well, I guess you're right! Pack it up everybody, I guess we ought to be totally satisfied with the ending and just forget any of this ever happened.

Read what he actually said, he supports the movement to retakeME3 but some acts seem pointless to him, thats all he is not telling you to stop asking for the ending dlc

I did, and you're putting words in his mouth. He offers no suggestions but many complaints and pretty much says everything being done is pointless.

[cardboardarmor]

Regardless of OP's intentions, we can't ask for openness and objectivity from developers and corporate shot-callers and display none of it ourselves.

Kudos to those who came forth and addressed the points raised by OP rather than dismissing them and the poster who brought them out of hand.  If the Retake movement truly has the bulk and momentum it purports to have, it can spare the time and effort to address all comers with the gravity it asks that it be taken with.

Modifié par cardboardarmor, 18 mars 2012 - 04:55 .

[Spectre Impersonator]

Lianaar wrote...

Soverign 666 wrote...
The truth of the matter is we fans are driven by emotion instead of logic we will fight even when we know we can't win.

This is exactly why I hope BioWare will not change the ending, no matter what I think of the ending itself.
Players role is to play and have a player perspective of the game.
Game Makers's role is to know their gamers and make a game that is good for many people, many very different people.

Making games and playing games requires a whole lot of different perspectives and mind sets. Putting the player in making role and putting the maker of playing role just won't bring anything good. This would be a very hazardous precedent, I fear it would take the power and bravery from game makers to make unconventional habit breaking and new, fresh games.

"Know your role, know your place!"

Isn't this is what the white folks were saying to my people 50 years ago?

[RenownedRyan]

Soverign 666 wrote...

In the end you guys might cause a slight drop in sales but you arent going to do enough damage to "force" bioware/EA to do anything. I've seen some military analogys about how your "Overwhelming bioware" but I'd like to make my own analogy. Bioware has already won your just the gurillea fighters harrassing them. You might cause enough of an annoyance to make them appease you but you won't drive them out. The truth of the matter is we fans are driven by emotion instead of logic we will fight even when we know we can't win.

 

Funny, guerilla fighters did drive out the enemy in the United States during the American Revolution, Russia during World War 2, China during the Chinese Revolution, Vietnam during the Vietnam War, and Iraq during the War on Terror.  They're an unbeatable opponent.  You can't kill all of them, you can only hope that they let up the pressure.  You can take all the cities (which happened in every one of these scenarios), but you can't win the war.

Modifié par RenownedRyan, 18 mars 2012 - 04:57 .

[Cartims]

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

Cartims wrote...

We shall overcome.....

No, you won't.  :-)

At least I won't give up .....I have been fighting my whole life, it's not new to me.

[RLesueur]

Soverign 666 wrote...

RLesueur wrote...

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

OSUfan12121 wrote...

Thats why major news affiliates are reporting and even supporting us then?

LOL!   "Major news affiliates."

Well, it was reported by CNN.

They're pretty major.

Just saying...

(Should I tell a quick joke now so I don't look like I'm taking myself too seriously?)

Yes CNN covered you but what they said was some fans are very mad at the ending. I just dont see people watching that report and saying to themselves. "The last five minutes of that game suck, well I guess I'm not buying it now."

Okay, I didn't count on your powers of premonition to prove me wrong.

[Huyna]

Soverign 666 wrote...

 So let's say Im looking into buying ME3 unlike most people (who will buy off how the game looks) I do some research I here some fans are complaining about the ending. I read some articles about how you guys are "entitled whiners" (I don't support this view). Also BSN has been infamous for being nitpicky and unpleasable. 

 

It's not only BSN. I, for example, can say, that similiar reaction can be observed on a few major web-resources in my country, that full of dissapointe people. They feel betrayed. They are angry. And a little bit scared - for Bioware. To have such conclusion for ME3 trilogy is not a good signal at all.

Modifié par Huyna, 18 mars 2012 - 05:00 .

[Peete]

Unit-Alpha wrote...

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

OSUfan12121 wrote...

Thats why major news affiliates are reporting and even supporting us then?

LOL!   "Major news affiliates."

Forbes, CNN, and Fox News aren't major?

Do you live in the US or any Western country?

Forbes, CNN and FOX NEWS arenot major news outlets in anywestern country except the US (dunno 'bout Canada).

I think OP has a point. A bit defeatist but a point.

[Lianaar]

JohnShepard12 wrote...
"Know your role, know your place!"
Isn't this is what the white folks were saying to my people 50 years ago?

Are you actually comparing a GAME to real life of people? You can not seriously say that segregation and racism has the same magnitude as buying games from a given game maker.

To explain what I mean, if you make a baker sew dresses, the end result might be a dress, but I still prefer seamstresses and tailors doing that sort of job because they know how to.

Modifié par Lianaar, 18 mars 2012 - 05:00 .

[cotheer]

Oh snap.

[Turtlicious]

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

OSUfan12121 wrote...

Thats why major news affiliates are reporting and even supporting us then?

LOL!   "Major news affiliates."

Fox Forbes and CNN?

How are these not Major?

[TFulls]

trololololololololol fail thread this is

[KaeserZen]

Lianaar wrote...

This is exactly why I hope BioWare will not change the ending, no matter what I think of the ending itself.
Players role is to play and have a player perspective of the game.
Game Makers's role is to know their gamers and make a game that is good for many people, many very different people.

Two flaws in your theory :
- In the polls, around 90% of 50.000 people find the ending not good. I don't consider 10% to be many people. And don't say it's not representative, marketing polls and political surveys base their decision on "small" samples of often fewer people than here, and still make enlightened recommandations that drive to success.
- So, game makers are supposed to educate us on what is a good game ? Even if we're not going to enjoy an *entertainment* product, we still must consume it, because our roles as players is just play and shut up ?

Lianaar wrote...
Making games and playing games requires a whole lot of different perspectives and mind sets. Putting the player in making role and putting the maker of playing role just won't bring anything good. This would be a very hazardous precedent, I fear it would take the power and bravery from game makers to make unconventional habit breaking and new, fresh games.

Once again, several flaws :
- BioWare has listened to fan feedback about several features that they have implemented in ME2 : No Mako, Tali/Garrus as romance options, the list goes on.
- How the hell do you think a product is designed ? Companies do not create a product only because they think it is inherently good from their framework of thoughts ! Companies create a product because they think it is good and because they can satisfy an underlying demand (whether the consumer is conscious of it or not before he heards about the product). Look at Ford : During the T-model era, the only available color was black, because he thought it was a classy color and because it allowed economies of scale on paint purchase. Clearly, the reason why you car is not black and is hopefully the color of your choice is because companies have listened to you to satisfy you more, and help you lighten the burden of your wallet and bank account.
- If the makers are not playing during development from a player perspective : how the hell are they going to measure the entertainment provided by an *entertainment* product ? how the hell are they going to spot the glitches linked to areas some player will go ? how the hell are they going to check the quality of their work ?

[RinpocheSchnozberry]

Cartims wrote...

At least I won't give up .....I have been fighting my whole life, it's not new to me.

I'll high five you for that.  :-)

[Tzupi88]

http://social.biowar.../index/10084349

We don't just take ourselves seriously. We are serious business, in every sense.

[Arthorius]

Lianaar wrote...

Soverign 666 wrote...
The truth of the matter is we fans are driven by emotion instead of logic we will fight even when we know we can't win.

This is exactly why I hope BioWare will not change the ending, no matter what I think of the ending itself.
Players role is to play and have a player perspective of the game.
Game Makers's role is to know their gamers and make a game that is good for many people, many very different people.

Making games and playing games requires a whole lot of different perspectives and mind sets. Putting the player in making role and putting the maker of playing role just won't bring anything good. This would be a very hazardous precedent, I fear it would take the power and bravery from game makers to make unconventional habit breaking and new, fresh games.

Agreed. Alas, Bioware just failed assuming their role. The scales are uneven, and it is up to us to do something, anuthing, about it. 

[KaeserZen]

Lianaar wrote...

Are you actually comparing a GAME to real life of people? You can not seriously say that segregation and racism has the same magnitude as buying games from a given game maker.

He is not, he is just wording differently the idea you convey,
with an extreme example to point our the limits of your statements if we
extend the logic to its fullest.

Lianaar wrote...

To explain what I mean, if you make a baker sew dresses, the end result might be a dress, but I still prefer seamstresses and tailors doing that sort of job because they know how to.

Wrong analogy, the baker does not give money to the tailor.

A proper analogy would be : You buy a pastry and the experience is flawless until the last bite, which takes like horsecrap. Next time you go buy your croissant or birthday cake for your son, you're going to have that in mind.
If you're nice, you'll say that you were surprised and disappointed by the last bite, and you suggest he reviews his recipe. A bad baker will tell you to get he hell out of his place, because you don't know what you are doing, as HE is the baker, and not you, little piece of insignificant consumer that allows the baker to pay his bills and his trip to the Seychelles with his wife.

If you're not nice, you'll simply stop buying pastries from him. End of the line.

[Thornne]

I don't really understand the people who say "I don't mind the ending, so you shoudn't either."

If I said "I think the ending failed to deliver the product I was promised, and therefore you should think so too" would that be a reasonable argument? I don't think so.

Why does it matter to you if people who are upset try to get what they think is fair treatment from the company they bought a product from?

[Iam2ugly]

Hey, so what If I don't like something? I'm supposed to stay in the shadow? And pretend that nothing happened? I am a customer and I have a right to say what is off with the product, and for many of us, the ending is a part of a product that is off, and contradicts with everything we were told. Ok, you liked ending, that's ok. I'm glad for you. And I respect your opinion, so maybe You could respect ours? and let us speak up?

[AlexXIV]

I have an amazingly outstanding innovative idea guys. Let's not feed the trolls anymore.