41 réponses à ce sujet

[Shazzie]

Yeah, with regards to the 'year' comment, I would have preferred something with the PC given options as to how long it's been. Where the PC has choices to say "It's been (a couple of months/a few months/half a year/nearly a year/over a year) since I left the tower" and Wynne could comment differently depending on your choice "It feels longer" if the PC picked a shorter time or "Has it really been so long?" or "It has indeed been nearly a year, has it not?".

Fortunately for my mage I had done several things prior to doing the Circle quest and then did a few things afterwards before this comment came up, so when she said the 'year' thing I went 'wow, yeah it would have been about that long wouldn't it?' so it was actually immersive for me. Having it come up too soon though would be jarring.

[KalosCast]

Heldenbrand wrote...

Armies are always hard to raise, it's more than just strapping on armor and girding on your weapon. You have to stock up supplies, you have to manage the separate armies and integrate them into a cohesive force (certainly not even easy with humans, just imagine how hard it is now to get a modern coalition force working together). You have to establish supply lines, transport troops, skirmish with scouts and play the overall battlefield to face the enemy on your terms.

In medieval times, it was severely complicated by the fact they didn't have a modern ability to preserve food. This required them to scavenge for food on the field, often at the expense of local peasants. This made it nearly impossible to campaign against your enemy during the winter, establishing campaign season between spring and fall when food was more readily available. Darkspawn may not need this since they tend to feed on flesh, but I bet that they can still die from exposure.

Fighting a war in that level of technology isn't nearly as easy as we see it today, especially when you consider that pressing hard you can march an army about 10-25 miles a day. On open ground, without the need to scavenge or avoid foul weather. For a lot of us, that's less than we commute to work on a daily basis. For me, the haste of a year to raise a multi-coalition army embroiled in civil wars and assemble them in one location stretches the imagination enough to make it faster.

Of course, none of these things happen at all in the game. The war consists of entierly of a single forced march to a city that had been overwhelmed by three different small armies, and then an extended battle inside the city walls. After this point, the majority of the Darkspawn horde retreated, causing everybody to go back home and deal with the war bands one a more personal basis.

[Maria Caliban]

Marillian wrote...
This is the second line Ive heard ingame that broke my immersion greatly. The first was Isolde taking about some Urn like I was already supposed to know about it.

Anyone had similar experiences, where a character says something that makes you go "..what?"

How is this immersion breaking? 

Yesterday, at Thanksgiving dinner, a woman I know started talking about characters on a show called CSI. She assumed I knew all about this show and its characters despite the fact that I've watched all of five episodes and forgotten much of it. At no point during the conversation, did it strike me as unreal that someone would assume I know about something I know little about.

[Onyx Jaguar]

The time is off in this game I see some claiming that the game takes place over a couple of years, but when you consider that the elf in the dungeon of Arl Howe's residence said he had been in there for a few months (which being in the City Elf Origin takes place during your conscription) and that early on Alistair says that going to rendevous with the Grey Wardens would take a couple of weeks, so it would seem that the game only takes place in the span of 8-10 months. Not counting the Dwarf Noble Origin which could have taken place over a significant period of time since you were most likely imprisoned for quite a time as Gorim tells it to you.

Plus being medeival or not you are apart of a caravan and are traveling for the most part on highways. The only other instances would be the walk to Lothering from Ostagar and the walk to Haven since you are not apart of a caravan when going to Lothering and that Haven is in the mountains off the roads.

Also to consider it supposedly takes a day to get to the circle tower from Redcliffe and at the end you catch up to the Darkspawn army when going from Redcliffe to Denerim in a few days.

Plus its not medeval its fantasy in a dark ages setting, they can preserve food with magic and whatnot, lets not limit ourselves.

Granted I pulled that 8-10 month timeline out of my ass, by then if the Landsmeet hadn't been called the Bannorn would have most likely rallied troops against Loghain so in all likelyhood, not counting a couple of the Origin stories the timeline after Ostagar would have taken maybe half of the time I gave.  

Modifié par Onyx Jaguar, 30 novembre 2009 - 04:39 .

[Vicious]

This is pretty unclear in the game, but pretty much every origin except human noble gives you clues that



about 9 months pass from ORIGIN to OSTAGAR.



Dwarf origin has a kid born if you sleep with any of the noble chasers.



Wynne says 'almost a year'



City elf says as much, i forget.



But yes. About 9 months from ORIGIN to OSTAGAR.

[Onyx Jaguar]

I don't recall that in the City Elf, but I do believe that that is the timeline in the Dwarf Noble Origin.

Circle of Magi does seemed a bit confused by Wynne's comment.

Human Noble I doubt it would have been that long, but then again I do not know where Highever is.

But from actually being recruited it would not have taken that long to get to Ostagar since if it was 9 months you would have taken the joining.  Another indicition that going to Ostagar didn't take that long was that Alistair had been a Warden for six months which means that Duncan would have given Alistair the joining while going to Ostagar if it was in the 9 month timeline.  This does not seem the case.

What is more likely though is that the time in the Circle of Magi and Dwarf Noble quest takes place over awhile, from Harrowing to Jowan's escape, and from imprisonment to "execution"

Otherwise the City Elf story takes place in either a day or a couple of days, and in the Human Noble the betrayal and escape is the same day as you begin.

Modifié par Onyx Jaguar, 30 novembre 2009 - 05:01 .

[Seagloom]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

Human Noble I doubt it would have been that long, but then again I do not know where Highever is

Highever is far to the north. It's more or less on the opposite end of Ferelden from Ostagar.

http://images2.wikia...elden_Map_1.jpg

[Durallan]

It would be really nice had there been some sort of way to actually figure out how time progressed in the game, I don't think I even really thought about how long it was taking, I realise the blood dots on the map were meant to signify time spent travelling, but some more recognisable way of how long things were taking would have been nice.

[Ninjatroll]

Vicious wrote...

This is pretty unclear in the game, but pretty much every origin except human noble gives you clues that

about 9 months pass from ORIGIN to OSTAGAR.

Dwarf origin has a kid born if you sleep with any of the noble chasers.

Wynne says 'almost a year'

City elf says as much, i forget.

But yes. About 9 months from ORIGIN to OSTAGAR.

The Human Origin makes no sense if it's 9 months since your family is just about to send soldiers to the battle at Ostagar and you leave with Duncan the same night, I doub't the traveling would take 9 months. I think the logical explaination is that all the origin storys does not take place att the same time. Since the Dwarf Noble, The Magi and the Human Noble protagonist does not exist at the same time they do not need to be consistant in timeline.
You get recruited -> X time pass -> Battle. X is almost a year for Dwarf and Magi perhaps, but probably a lot less for Human noble.

Modifié par Ninjatroll, 30 novembre 2009 - 12:48 .

[Antikristine]

I also was surprised to learn the timespan had been "almost a year", as Wynne puts it, but I found it acceptable. What I didn't find acceptable in terms of time, however, was that during the battle of Denerim I could ask Morrigan "about last night" regarding her offer. That didn't make any sense at all since she made her offer at Redcliffe - and it takes more than a couple of hours' travel between those two locations.

[SardaukarElite]

Dakota Strider wrote...

Considering the map, and how often you travel over it (and under it, in the Deep Roads), quite a bit of time is consumed by just travelling. I have not seen any reference to distance in the game, except a couple where it mentions the amount of time to travel.

Dagna says that it would probably take 2 1/2 weeks to make it from Ozammar to the Circle Tower and back, I believe.
 

Yet a certain conversation in Redcliffe will tell you that the Circle is only a day's travel away. Considering you have to march up and a round the lake (as the blood seeps) I'd say you could probably get to anywhere on that map from anywhere else inside a week. If that travel estimate is accurate. Which means Ostagar to the final battle could all take place within a few months.

Really I think the game only makes sense within a short time span, given that it doesn't make much sense for the Darkspawn to hang around in Lothering when Denerim is only two day's forced march away, and that the world doesn't change at all.

The fact that the Circle is still full of corpses if you go back there is also somewhat jarring I think.

[kevinwastaken]

Wynne is old and senile, don't listen to her. Let as much time pass as you feel like since the game doesn't explicitly say, other than the ramblings of some nutty old hag.

[Riona45]

Xeyska wrote...

Wynne can't teach Spirit Healer, the only way to get it is from the manual in Denerim.

I'm so glad I finally saw this (and other, similar comments).  All this time I was wondering what I had to do to get the conversation about teaching me to pop up--I guess it never will!  I could have sworn the Prima Guide says Wynne can teach you to be a Spirit Healer.

As for the topic question?  Yeah, the comment about it being almost a year since my Harrowing seemed strange to me too, mainly because there's nothing in the game to indicate that it's been that long.  A few months, I can buy, maybe, but nearly a year?  What was I doing in all that time?  Maybe training with Duncan, but again--there's nothing in the game (that I've seen) that suggests such.

The Urn thing wasn't a problem for me because it's brought up rather prominently in Lothering.

[Onyx Jaguar]

SardaukarElite wrote...

Dakota Strider wrote...

Considering the map, and how often you travel over it (and under it, in the Deep Roads), quite a bit of time is consumed by just travelling. I have not seen any reference to distance in the game, except a couple where it mentions the amount of time to travel.

Dagna says that it would probably take 2 1/2 weeks to make it from Ozammar to the Circle Tower and back, I believe.
 

Yet a certain conversation in Redcliffe will tell you that the Circle is only a day's travel away. Considering you have to march up and a round the lake (as the blood seeps) I'd say you could probably get to anywhere on that map from anywhere else inside a week. If that travel estimate is accurate. Which means Ostagar to the final battle could all take place within a few months.

Really I think the game only makes sense within a short time span, given that it doesn't make much sense for the Darkspawn to hang around in Lothering when Denerim is only two day's forced march away, and that the world doesn't change at all.

The fact that the Circle is still full of corpses if you go back there is also somewhat jarring I think.

Oddly enough you see templars remarking about cleaning up the mess when you go there.

Like I said earlier this game is a bit inconsistant in time and I would personally assume what Alistair says is correct over some of the others.

[TrinityDivine]

Ninjatroll wrote...

Vicious wrote...

This is pretty unclear in the game, but pretty much every origin except human noble gives you clues that

about 9 months pass from ORIGIN to OSTAGAR.

Dwarf origin has a kid born if you sleep with any of the noble chasers.

Wynne says 'almost a year'

City elf says as much, i forget.

But yes. About 9 months from ORIGIN to OSTAGAR.

The Human Origin makes no sense if it's 9 months since your family is just about to send soldiers to the battle at Ostagar and you leave with Duncan the same night, I doub't the traveling would take 9 months. I think the logical explaination is that all the origin storys does not take place att the same time. Since the Dwarf Noble, The Magi and the Human Noble protagonist does not exist at the same time they do not need to be consistant in timeline.
You get recruited -> X time pass -> Battle. X is almost a year for Dwarf and Magi perhaps, but probably a lot less for Human noble.

Consider this: At the very end of the story, during the coronation, try talking to your brother Fergus and he tells you that he was still in the wilds when the battle at Ostagar took place and that they were attacked by darkspawn presumably while the battle was taking place (the presumption is mine). He woke up "two weeks later" in a Chasind hut and by the time he made it out of the wilds, "you were already marching to Denerim". Now there's a timeline for you to ponder on. I'd say A LOT less than a year.

But back to the original topic, there are actually quite a few inconsistencies in the dialogue that make me think it was due to sloppy coding and perhaps lack of testing, specially in the ending.  For example, whether or not you choose to make Alistair the king, when you go to his room in Redcliffe on the eve of battle (well, two days really since it takes two days to march but I digress), he talks like you made him king ("Is this what I get for being king?"). Also if you convince him to marry Anora but don't take the Morrigan ritual cop-out and then Alistair insists on sacrificing himself to the archdemon because he loves you, at the coronation when you speak to Anora, she acts like he's still alive ("Does he always talk that way? *giggle*"). 

So yeah, I really wish they took the time to make it perfect because the rest of it was absolutely amazing!

[AdrianC25]

wow ok so like i was playing the game and i was about to beat it and some random npc said it was like a year and i was wait no this game came out in november and i checked my save game and it was like 20 hours played ..... totally jarring and threw me right off. what a piece of crap im glad i took time to notice and complain abut this.