571 réponses à ce sujet

[Evercrow]

Why not? You can't teach big corporations such as EA with something other than straight money loss. But free DLC would be self-inflicted money loss.Why would they want to do that? So what,if Bioware would not sell anymore? They can just focus profit they already got from ME3 on something else.Ending DLC would at least sell better, then any other DLC they might've cooked up in development period.

So, make the ending DLC for decent price. I will buy it.Maybe,I will buy something else from Bioware in the future.
No ending DLC means that I most definitely won't buy anything from EA/Bioware in the future.Simple.

And to the people with the same argument about "incomplete game".The only fix you can get for free is cutted ending similar to the first fan-videos, without Normandy and catalyst kid. Do you really want that?If that argument didn't fly with "From Ashes",already completed DLC(where all you need to do is change price), i can't see how it could possibly fly here.Just give up and stop wasting your time and money on EA.

[granyte]

IrishRents wrote...

granyte wrote...


hate and violence when i'm talking about cutting funds really? i'm starting to grasp why EA can charge per bullet

Again, your terminology is far too disturbing. Just what do you mean 'paying per bullet?'

this si what i ment now if you missed it i guess you misunderstood all my comments

[garf]

Lugaidster wrote...

wulf3n wrote...

Lugaidster wrote...
Yes I would, it would be bittersweet, but I prefer that to no/crappy DLC. With money I have leverage, without it I have to take what they give and be thankful.d

No we don't have to be thankful.

and that's what will make us powerful, not grovelling at ea's feet, begging for scraps.

Don't put words in my mouth please. You can have different opinion on this but don't dare call me a beggar. I'm not grovelling at anyones feet, I'm using what I believe is my weapon. You use what you believe is yours. I'm tired of the condescending tone all this responses to "giving money" have. Don't want to give money? Great for you, make sure to state it as you have been doing, but don't diminish others because they don't share your opinion.

Guys ... CHILL .. please.

I don't know who tossed the apple of discord into this thread but but EA is laughing it's way the bank everytime we get hot under the collar at the enemy of our enemy. please remember that. The rEApers are going to win unless you turians and krogans can stop turning everything into a personal fight. Dig?

Modifié par garf, 19 mars 2012 - 11:44 .

[CRISIS1717]

"I have heard whisperings of unpaid DLC..."

[TheRealMithril]

Tregon wrote...

IrishRents wrote...

Anyone else baffled on exactly when marketing constituted a promise?

If you are not willing to pay for a fix, do not bother asking for one. I am willing to pay, so I will continue to hold the line.

Over here lying in marketing is a crime. You cannot promise something but never deliver it.

As for paying for a fix. Are you even remotely considering that once they have you paying for one ending, they demand you to pay for EVERY OTHER ending too in all their games? Give in once, give in always.

No, that kind of move only works once.

[Lugaidster]

Tregon wrote...

Ampliment wrote...

Now what I got in my copy of Mass Effect 3 was well worth the $75 I paid for it plus the DLC.  Now before I get attacked no I did not like the ending, I hated the ending as much as a lot of others did, but the experience up to that point was well worth my money that I paid for it.  This can not be called an incomplete product just because you are not satisfied with how the developers completed it.  To expect a free ending DLC would be unreasonable.  If I were a worker at Bioware why would I work hard to improve the ending if there is nothing in it for me.  And though some say that they'll never buy from EA/Bioware again the amount who will actually never purchase their products again if they don't make a free ending DLC is miniscule.  I agree without a doubt that something needs to be done about the endings but expecting that to be done for free is just setting yourself up for dissappointment.  If they decide to make an ending DLC at all, just be happy that we have gotten that.

Hold the Line, but be reasonable

I am reasonable. I am fully open for purchase of other DLC, but I cannot accept reworked ending for anything but free.
Until I am given this, I will not give single cent for Bioware products. And I recommend everyone else to do the same pledge, that worker you mentioned who would be working for free... They could consider what it would be like in current economical situation to not work at all.

We must take HARD stance here and draw the line in the sand. Any compromises or offers of compromise are just used to make more crap products which do not fulfill the promises made explicitly.
I am willing to do my part, are you? Together we make or break Bioware and teach industry a lesson. Do not be cattle.

I'm more of a "one thing at a time" guy. Spread yourself too thin and you won't acomplish anything, I've already studied several revolts in college to know that what makes one succesful isn't how hard your stance is but how good are your tactics, the best is usually to focus on one thing at a time. What I want is a better ending, fixing the industry can come later.

[granyte]

garf wrote...

Lugaidster wrote...

wulf3n wrote...

Lugaidster wrote...
Yes I would, it would be bittersweet, but I prefer that to no/crappy DLC. With money I have leverage, without it I have to take what they give and be thankful.d

No we don't have to be thankful.

and that's what will make us powerful, not grovelling at ea's feet, begging for scraps.

Don't put words in my mouth please. You can have different opinion on this but don't dare call me a beggar. I'm not grovelling at anyones feet, I'm using what I believe is my weapon. You use what you believe is yours. I'm tired of the condescending tone all this responses to "giving money" have. Don't want to give money? Great for you, make sure to state it as you have been doing, but don't diminish others because they don't share your opinion.

Guys ... CHILL .. please.

I don't know who tossed the apple of discord into this thread but but EA is laughing it's way the bank everytime we get hot under the collar at the enemy of our enemy. please remember that. The rEApers are going to win unless you turians and krogans can stop turning everything into a personal fight. Dig?

the turian and the krogan are meerely having physical vocal way to vent thier concern befor the battle ;p

[Kirmy]

Good luck with that. I'm sure they care more about money.

[jkflipflopDAO]

Kirmy wrote...

Good luck with that. I'm sure they care more about money.

And how much money do you suppose they'll make in the future when 40% of us walk away from Bioware forever? You don't run a business, do you?

[IrishRents]

Tregon wrote...

IrishRents wrote...

Anyone else baffled on exactly when marketing constituted a promise?

If you are not willing to pay for a fix, do not bother asking for one. I am willing to pay, so I will continue to hold the line.

Over here lying in marketing is a crime. You cannot promise something but never deliver it.

As for paying for a fix. Are you even remotely considering that once they have you paying for one ending, they demand you to pay for EVERY OTHER ending too in all their games? Give in once, give in always.

But again, no promise was made. Talking up a product is not illegal, sorry to burst your bubble. Further, your 'game endings' conspiracy you've cooked up is nearly as ridiculous as expecting BioWare to release a free ending change.

[Tregon]

[quote]TheRealMithril wrote...
As for paying for a fix. Are you even remotely considering that once they have you paying for one ending, they demand you to pay for EVERY OTHER ending too in all their games? Give in once, give in always.

[/quote]

No, that kind of move only works once.

[/quote]

Nah. Once you have accepted paying for bad product is ok, your resistance to do so again is lower. More times you say "yes, take my money", easier it gets.

[quote]Lugaidster wrote...

I'm more of a "one thing at a time" guy. Spread yourself too thin and you won't acomplish anything, I've already studied several revolts in college to know that what makes one succesful isn't how hard your stance is but how good are your tactics, the best is usually to focus on one thing at a time. What I want is a better ending, fixing the industry can come later.
[/quote] 

We do not need to spread too thin. We simply need to refuse to give any money to Bioware until issue is fixed.
While you are studying revolts, study also history of unions etc. And human psychology. Like I said, once you give in to paid DLC to make proper ending, you will be less likely to refuse when they repeat the trick.

Modifié par Tregon, 19 mars 2012 - 11:59 .

[wulf3n]

jkflipflopDAO wrote...

Kirmy wrote...

Good luck with that. I'm sure they care more about money.

And how much money do you suppose they'll make in the future when 40% of us walk away from Bioware forever? You don't run a business, do you?

Do you really think 40% will walk away? do you think EA think that?

[Ampliment]

Tregon wrote...

I am reasonable. I am fully open for purchase of other DLC, but I cannot accept reworked ending for anything but free.
Until I am given this, I will not give single cent for Bioware products. And I recommend everyone else to do the same pledge, that worker you mentioned who would be working for free... They could consider what it would be like in current economical situation to not work at all.

We must take HARD stance here and draw the line in the sand. Any compromises or offers of compromise are just used to make more crap products which do not fulfill the promises made explicitly.
I am willing to do my part, are you? Together we make or break Bioware and teach industry a lesson. Do not be cattle.

But the reworked ending would be made for you (the community in general). Bioware could just as easily say nope no reworked ending, and maybe Bioware would be no more (which I doubt by the way but for the sake of argument we can say it might happen). Now that worker goes to work under EA in general.  You may have shut down the Bioware name with your hard stance but most workers who do a lot of the "important" work on video games (not trying to diminish what others do) will remain employed.  If you say you are going to boycott EA, good luck to you.  I hope you hate football then because you won't own another Madden game, and I hope you like COD cuz you'll say bye bye to Battlefield too.  You aren't hurting EA here because EA could lose every bit of Bioware's fanbase and still be fine.  If an ending is made you need to realize that you are going to have to pay for the work that went into that.  If you won't pay, many others (including myself) wll pay for that DLC.  So I can't influence what you do or what you want or expect from Bioware, I just feel that it is something unreasonable to ask for someone to go out of their way to do something for me without any payment from me.  Again that is just my stance.

I will be holding the line

[Hexoskin]

meisjoe wrote...

granyte wrote...

The ending need to be fixed for free just look at the amount of plot holes the actual ending created.
these plot holes need to be fixed for free now if they wanna add some dlc content after the plot holes have been fixed fine for them.

but we need to stop setteling for crap if we bow down and buy a DLC only to fix what they broke we are basicaly saying it's alright put out crap and then have me pay so you fix what you did wrong.

I absolutely do not agree.  Free endings would mean "cheap" endings...  Let me pay for it and give me  something AMAZING! 

AFAIK We all already paid 60+$ on a perfect ending.

All you dumbasses who are willing to pay for them to fix their own mistakes are only screaming for that black guy to come bumfuk you in the shower again.

Company screws you by providing a lousy product, you screw yourself by throwing money at it in hopes of a new ending that SHOULD come free of charge.

Are you all really so narrowminded that you can't even comprehend just a small part of the big picture? If you're willing to pay now for them to fix their own damn ****, how long do you truly think it'll take till this "Unfortunate incident" is repeated?

You're saying it yourselves, it's a Corperation, they want money, if you want to pay now, you can bet your asses you'll be buying more flawed games in the future, just to have lolol games now fixed DLC a few months later.

Get your heads out of your asses and realize where you throwing money at this **** is putting gaming and gamers in general. (We're all left at a disadvantage if i TRULY need to spell it out for you.)

Modifié par Hexoskin, 19 mars 2012 - 11:54 .

[jkflipflopDAO]

wulf3n wrote...

jkflipflopDAO wrote...

Kirmy wrote...

Good luck with that. I'm sure they care more about money.

And how much money do you suppose they'll make in the future when 40% of us walk away from Bioware forever? You don't run a business, do you?

Do you really think 40% will walk away? do you think EA think that?

No one can really know that. So as a business owner, that's what you have to ask yourself. Is it worth giving up a small portion of the profits I just made off this game to make a "fixed" ending for free - or should I just keep my money and hope this doesn't destroy me in the future. 

If this was my show, I'd give up ~5% of the profits I just made off the game and release a free ending DLC that would make my fanbase happy. That way they keep paying for my DLC later.

[granyte]

wulf3n wrote...

jkflipflopDAO wrote...

Kirmy wrote...

Good luck with that. I'm sure they care more about money.

And how much money do you suppose they'll make in the future when 40% of us walk away from Bioware forever? You don't run a business, do you?

Do you really think 40% will walk away? do you think EA think that?

more like 90% walked away from C&C4 remember?

[TheRealMithril]

..

Modifié par TheRealMithril, 19 mars 2012 - 12:00 .

[HaesoME3]

garf wrote...

Lugaidster wrote...

wulf3n wrote...

Lugaidster wrote...
Yes I would, it would be bittersweet, but I prefer that to no/crappy DLC. With money I have leverage, without it I have to take what they give and be thankful.d

No we don't have to be thankful.

and that's what will make us powerful, not grovelling at ea's feet, begging for scraps.

Don't put words in my mouth please. You can have different opinion on this but don't dare call me a beggar. I'm not grovelling at anyones feet, I'm using what I believe is my weapon. You use what you believe is yours. I'm tired of the condescending tone all this responses to "giving money" have. Don't want to give money? Great for you, make sure to state it as you have been doing, but don't diminish others because they don't share your opinion.

Guys ... CHILL .. please.

I don't know who tossed the apple of discord into this thread but but EA is laughing it's way the bank everytime we get hot under the collar at the enemy of our enemy. please remember that. The rEApers are going to win unless you turians and krogans can stop turning everything into a personal fight. Dig?

Whether people argue or not - something will always remain:

• If they do nothing, or worse pretend everything is fine and carry on with other DLC, they will garner a level of customer dissatisfaction that will hurt them in the long run.
• If they extend the olive branch and provide the fixed ending for free, they will gain an immense boost in customer satisifaction - the people villifying the game/studio now will be the ones singing Bioware's praises.
• If they charge for the fixed endings, many will pay for it, others will not. Many will feel cheated, some will even feel it was done intentionally to squeeze more money out of it's fans whether or not there's even any evidence to support it. Of those that purchase it, many will do so in disgust and at best regard future titles with suspicion if not outright hostility. Those that do not purchase will all almost likely few future titles with hostility if they acknowledge them at all.

Nobody here has numbers on how many people fall into each category depending on their choices. It's up to bioware to decide if they feel they can accept the hit in the court of public opinion to do nothing, or to charge for the fixed DLC. Which will earn them more money in the long run - will be the good will and positive word of mouth of a free fix? Will it be to sweep it under the rug and hope we turn out to be a vocal minority? Will it be to charge us for their own mistake and bank on the majority being placated and the movement losing all impact?


I earn a living making games, I'd make it right by the fans if I made a mistake and bank on them supporting me in the future in exchange for making it right. Good will and word of mouth are worth quite a lot of money in today's market, but is it's value enough according to Bioware's executives? We'll see.

[Lugaidster]

wulf3n wrote...

Look you seem to be taking this as a personal attack when it really isn't, but can't you see you're helping to ruin games by giving EA positive reinforcement for negative business practices!

don't expect me to fence sit when something I care about is at risk.

Agreeing on paying money for an ending DLC is not groveling or begging. That's what made it a personal attack, even if it wasn't directed. You essentially called everyone willing to spend money for the DLC beggars.

I don't expect you to just sit when something you care about is at risk. I just don't agree that it is. Wanna fight for that, I suggest you start a different movement. Every time a demand is added to the movement, it is that less likely to gain ground. I'm not here to make a stance on the industry, I'm here to get a better ending on a product I otherwise loved. I believe we can agree on that and discuss further demands as we make progress, but by stating it as you are right now, however noble, you're just alienating a lot of people, people that could help the movement further it's cause.

I honestly believe that Bioware has no intention to please every single fan out there. They are probably looking for a solution that minimizes losses, that means fans and money. If they're willing to make a compromise, I'm willing to make one as well. You don't have to fly by that one, but don't force me by saying that I'm caving or grovelling or begging if I do.

[KotorEffect3]

Didn't read the whole thread but I will just say they don't owe the fans anything for free.

[Tregon]

Ampliment wrote...

But the reworked ending would be made for you (the community in general). Bioware could just as easily say nope no reworked ending, and maybe Bioware would be no more (which I doubt by the way but for the sake of argument we can say it might happen). Now that worker goes to work under EA in general.  You may have shut down the Bioware name with your hard stance but most workers who do a lot of the "important" work on video games (not trying to diminish what others do) will remain employed.  If you say you are going to boycott EA, good luck to you.  I hope you hate football then because you won't own another Madden game, and I hope you like COD cuz you'll say bye bye to Battlefield too.  You aren't hurting EA here because EA could lose every bit of Bioware's fanbase and still be fine.  If an ending is made you need to realize that you are going to have to pay for the work that went into that.  If you won't pay, many others (including myself) wll pay for that DLC.  So I can't influence what you do or what you want or expect from Bioware, I just feel that it is something unreasonable to ask for someone to go out of their way to do something for me without any payment from me.  Again that is just my stance.

I will be holding the line

EA does not close studios because of ****s and giggles. Loss of Bioware, even if they take some of the more useful members to other departments, will hurt EA. They have lost a studio brand AND couple gaming brands which used to be successful.

EA does not want to kill off brands like ME or DA, but they cannot easily switch them to other studio brands either. It will be huge loss. Computer games are rather risky business, and well selling brands are worth their weight in gold, because odds of people buying another instance of the brand are far higher than in case of publishing completely new game. Thus, by hurting DA and ME brands we hurt EA as well severely.

[wulf3n]

jkflipflopDAO wrote...
No one can really know that. So as a business owner, that's what you have to ask yourself. Is it worth giving up a small portion of the profits I just made off this game to make a "fixed" ending for free - or should I just keep my money and hope this doesn't destroy me in the future. 

 

No, but if EA are looking at this thread/forum I'd be wagering their estimates at less than 10% walking away. A lot maybe but not a crippling loss.

jkflipflopDAO wrote... 
If this was my show, I'd give up ~5% of the profits I just made off the game and release a free ending DLC that would make my fanbase happy. That way they keep paying for my DLC later.

I totally agree, and they'd get more than just future dlc purchases, the good will it would buy them would be immeasurable.

[TheRealMithril]

Tregon: fix the quote.

[jkflipflopDAO]

Lugaidster wrote...

wulf3n wrote...

Look you seem to be taking this as a personal attack when it really isn't, but can't you see you're helping to ruin games by giving EA positive reinforcement for negative business practices!

don't expect me to fence sit when something I care about is at risk.

Agreeing on paying money for an ending DLC is not groveling or begging. That's what made it a personal attack, even if it wasn't directed. You essentially called everyone willing to spend money for the DLC beggars.

I don't expect you to just sit when something you care about is at risk. I just don't agree that it is. Wanna fight for that, I suggest you start a different movement. Every time a demand is added to the movement, it is that less likely to gain ground. I'm not here to make a stance on the industry, I'm here to get a better ending on a product I otherwise loved. I believe we can agree on that and discuss further demands as we make progress, but by stating it as you are right now, however noble, you're just alienating a lot of people, people that could help the movement further it's cause.

I honestly believe that Bioware has no intention to please every single fan out there. They are probably looking for a solution that minimizes losses, that means fans and money. If they're willing to make a compromise, I'm willing to make one as well. You don't have to fly by that one, but don't force me by saying that I'm caving or grovelling or begging if I do.

Well, paying them for their failure is kind of groveling. I would pay as well, but you can bet your ass I'd never buy another product from EAware ever again.

[Syrellaris]

granyte wrote...

The ending need to be fixed for free just look at the amount of plot holes the actual ending created.
these plot holes need to be fixed for free now if they wanna add some dlc content after the plot holes have been fixed fine for them.

but we need to stop setteling for crap if we bow down and buy a DLC only to fix what they broke we are basicaly saying it's alright put out crap and then have me pay so you fix what you did wrong.


EDIT just something i found browsing this forum it might give you more into why they need to do it for free www.youtube.com/watch

 You have no rights to demand things for free, sorry to bust your bubble. Looking around the internet should tell you the plausible theory thats the indoctrination. Even if you do not agree with it. It might be a well thought out plan and Bioware might have already thought of the controversy it brought forward and have little things planned out.