1309 réponses à ce sujet

[Vikali]

Diablos2525 wrote...

JerichohHill wrote...

I've put about 200 hours into Mass Effect 1-3.

I fully believed, prior to coming to these forums, that the ending was an Indoctrination Attempt.  Reading that thread on it convinced me completely.  Ergo, I very much liked the ending, because I think it ties nicely to a running theme in the game.

That said, I have read this entire thread, and posters like Diablo represent those who want the ending to be more fleshed out horribly.  I've been thoroughly disgusted with those acting like Diablo, calling us gamers who actually liked the ending as stupid, immature, non-thinking, what have you, consistently and repeatedly with little reprimand from the community (Appreciation to all who voiced a sentiment that it is OKAY to be okay with the ending, and its OKAY to want a better ending, that is mature).

I respect the argument that the ending left much to be desired.  I'd prefer a more fleshed out ending.  I'd like my Shepard to die killing Harbinger, and see an epilogue.  That said, I'm not unsatisfied at all with its current state.

"It's not even in any way like the traditional game endings, where you
can say how many endings there are or whether you got ending A, B, or
C."~ Casey Hudson on Mass effect 3 endings prior to release.

Explain?

And like I predicted. There you go again. You're attacking someone who's is fundamentally on your side. Good for your cause. Hold the line, right?

[Shiran]

Poison_Berrie wrote...

vertigo72 wrote...

Why I like the endings? Because they are good. You just have to think a little bit to see a whole picture but when you did everything makes sense.

People thought that ME is a space soap opera with some sci-fi, turns out it's a hard sci-fi with some space soap opera. That hurts.

As someone who appreciates hard sci-fi I take offense to that.
You don't know what hard science fiction is, if you consider that ending to be it.

The Crucible and Citadel combine to make
1) you control the Reapers, but only through some a pulse rather than the methods they use among themselves (probably Quantum Entanglement)
2)  Destroy the Reapers by shooting a tube which sends out a pulse of radiation that only targets synthetics (hard scifi knows that EMP can be lethal to humans)
3) The worst offender rewrite all organic and synthetic live to be the same... SAY WHUT!?

That ending made the game into a sci-fantasy.

Uh, this entire Universe is pretty far away from Hard Sci Fi. It is not quite as blatantly science phantasy as say Star Wars are, but it still not anywhere close. FTL drive, loud space explosions, asari (everything about them) etc etc. Also consider solar arrays build around uninhibited blue giants because your own stars just don't have enough "umph" vs Reapers taking over cities one street block at time.

[Diablos2525]

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

Diablos2525 wrote...

"It's not even in any way like the traditional game endings, where you can say how many endings there are or whether you got ending A, B, or C."~ Casey Hudson on Mass effect 3 endings prior to release.

Care to explain that quote?

I don't have to - try asking Casey Hudson who is the one who said it. They might have had ideas that they were playing around with earlier on, but ultimately they decided to go with the endings they chose, which amount to three main endings with minor variations based on your actions (the state of the Earth, the breath ending, etc. from what I hear). If I want to get nitpicky and technical, I could point out that those variations mean there are more than three endings.

And if I really wanted to nitpick and be sarcastic, I could point out that what he says is true in that the endings  similar enough that you can't tell "whether you got ending A, B, or C."  Also, your completely tangential point doesn't address the issue of liking the endings/not liking the endings and your assumptions about those of us who are fine with the existing endings. But please feel free to continue insulting people and/or bringing up complelely unrelated issues.

Sorry you can't like the endings. There is only one ending, with three different colors. They are 98% the same. Link here. 

I might of been willing to look past the completely nonsensical endings if there had actually even been more than one, probably not, but I would of just said "meh that sucked and was poorly written" as opposed to "WTF SERIOUSLY?!".

[Vikali]

Diablos2525 wrote...

Sorry you can't like the endings. There is only one ending, with three different colors. They are 98% the same. Link here. 

I might of been willing to look past the completely nonsensical endings if there had actually even been more than one, probably not, but I would of just said "meh that sucked and was poorly written" as opposed to "WTF SERIOUSLY?!".

You can't be serious.

[LegatoSkyheart]

It's probably the signs of Grief, some people have decided that "It's not worth it, They'll make a New Ending if they want to." and they move on with life.

I for one still hate the ending for Jericho Shepard, but once I get around to making another character that will actually FIT the ending for Mass Effect 3 I might hate it less.

But there will always be that hole, in me that says that "This isn't right."

[Diablos2525]

KitePolaris wrote...

Diablos2525 wrote...

Sorry you can't like the endings. There is only one ending, with three different colors. They are 98% the same. Link here. 

I might of been willing to look past the completely nonsensical endings if there had actually even been more than one, probably not, but I would of just said "meh that sucked and was poorly written" as opposed to "WTF SERIOUSLY?!".

You can't be serious.

I know that's what I said when I beat the game a second time. First time as Male Paragon Shep, second time as Female Renegade shep. The explosion was a different color though my choices were completely different lol.

[LucidStrike]

Bah. People who like these endings are like the people who STILL believe the world is flat. =/

[AtreiyaN7]

Diablos2525 wrote...

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

Diablos2525 wrote...

"It's not even in any way like the traditional game endings, where you can say how many endings there are or whether you got ending A, B, or C."~ Casey Hudson on Mass effect 3 endings prior to release.

Care to explain that quote?

I don't have to - try asking Casey Hudson who is the one who said it. They might have had ideas that they were playing around with earlier on, but ultimately they decided to go with the endings they chose, which amount to three main endings with minor variations based on your actions (the state of the Earth, the breath ending, etc. from what I hear). If I want to get nitpicky and technical, I could point out that those variations mean there are more than three endings.

And if I really wanted to nitpick and be sarcastic, I could point out that what he says is true in that the endings  similar enough that you can't tell "whether you got ending A, B, or C."  Also, your completely tangential point doesn't address the issue of liking the endings/not liking the endings and your assumptions about those of us who are fine with the existing endings. But please feel free to continue insulting people and/or bringing up complelely unrelated issues.

Sorry you can't like the endings. There is only one ending, with three different colors. They are 98% the same. Link here. 

I might of been willing to look past the completely nonsensical endings if there had actually even been more than one, probably not, but I would of just said "meh that sucked and was poorly written" as opposed to "WTF SERIOUSLY?!".

Oh, and now you're telling me I can't like the endings? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL. You are actually trying to dictate to us what we can and can't like. Who do you think you are? Well, now I know what to do you with your opinion and this entire thread: toss them both into the wastebasket right where they belong.

Newsflash: you're not the boss of me.

Apparently, I have to reduce things to that level thanks to your obtuseness.

[Scyldemort]

Lately seeing a lot of people like the endings...why?

Because PR stooges can post just as easily as the rest of us.

[iamthedave3]

Valo_Soren wrote...

I just want to point out that Bioware said they are still considering all feed back, and that altering/changing the ending has not been ruled out, now this really is mostly beating a dead horse, i think its time to be more patient and less hostile.

You're absolutely correct, however the 'other' side is terrified that Bioware will see the upswell of people saying they liked the ending, wipe the sweat from their brow and brush off their best smiles to go back to the 'vocal minority' line.

The anger against people who like the endings isn't really because you liked the endings, it's fear that essentially you ended up getting what they didn't: satisfaction, and that because you got satisfaction it will lead to them also not getting it.

Vis a vis, you bet your bottom dollar if 100% of the fans hated the ending it would be changed.

And in the end the thing people want is more options. Nobody's calling for the current endings to be removed from the game, just that more permutations be added (essentially what was promised in the first place), so they see the claim that they're asking too much as again them being denied what you got out of the experience.

That is what strikes me overwhelmingly as the reasons for these arguments springing up every time.

Plus there's the simple truth that these endings have thrust many people into genuine depression for various reasons, and quite a few of the people who like the endings are like that smarmy jerk who can't stop telling you how awesome their life is when it's obvious you're in a bad place and don't want to talk about it. There are people being stupid and trollish on both sides, which doesn't help, but I hope that the essential nature of the debate isn't forgotten or invalidated by anyone.

In a game that Bioware themselves claim is about choice, how can more choice actually be a bad thing?

Modifié par iamthedave3, 19 mars 2012 - 11:57 .

[Vikali]

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

Diablos2525 wrote...

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

Diablos2525 wrote...

"It's not even in any way like the traditional game endings, where you can say how many endings there are or whether you got ending A, B, or C."~ Casey Hudson on Mass effect 3 endings prior to release.

Care to explain that quote?

I don't have to - try asking Casey Hudson who is the one who said it. They might have had ideas that they were playing around with earlier on, but ultimately they decided to go with the endings they chose, which amount to three main endings with minor variations based on your actions (the state of the Earth, the breath ending, etc. from what I hear). If I want to get nitpicky and technical, I could point out that those variations mean there are more than three endings.

And if I really wanted to nitpick and be sarcastic, I could point out that what he says is true in that the endings  similar enough that you can't tell "whether you got ending A, B, or C."  Also, your completely tangential point doesn't address the issue of liking the endings/not liking the endings and your assumptions about those of us who are fine with the existing endings. But please feel free to continue insulting people and/or bringing up complelely unrelated issues.

Sorry you can't like the endings. There is only one ending, with three different colors. They are 98% the same. Link here. 

I might of been willing to look past the completely nonsensical endings if there had actually even been more than one, probably not, but I would of just said "meh that sucked and was poorly written" as opposed to "WTF SERIOUSLY?!".

Oh, and now you're telling me I can't like the endings? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL. You are actually trying to dictate to us what we can and can't like. Who do you think you are? Well, now I know what to do you with your opinion and this entire thread: toss them both into the wastebasket right where they belong.

Newsflash: you're not the boss of me.

Apparently, I have to reduce things to that level thanks to your obtuseness.

But, bro! We're the aggressive, rude, insulting, and stupid ones. Not them. We fling all the names and rude words. Not them. Hold the line. Berate people who are different.

[rtv053]

Poison_Berrie wrote...

rtv053 wrote...

Thematically, it has a lot in common with many works of hard sci-fi. And remember, hard sci-fi isn't just about being rigorously scientific - can have a focus on scientific and technical DETAIL, without being actually plausible. i.e. explaining in great detail how a ship's drive works, regardless of whether it is even possible.
Some of the best works of 'hard' SF have a large number of parts that are essentially unbelievable/not possible. And don't give me that crap that 'well, hard sci-fi is THEORETICALLY possible'. More often than not, it really isn't.

Good 'hard' sci-fi can be found from the likes of Alastair Reynolds (for Revelation Space, which I think was most likely a huge influence on Mass Effect), Kim Stanley Robinson (the Mars trilogy), and Greg Bear (Blood Music, Eon). All of those books contain unbelievable or unexplainable things.

No it's not.
Hard Science-fiction is notable for it's treatement of science and doing research. 
It does take some leeway by including some impossible things, but it knows the consequences and the limits of those. It doesn't introduce eleventh hour devices that rewrite the entire galaxy. Hard Scifi is more than anythign internally consistent. 
I've read some Revelation Space novels. It's has some impossible things, but it neatly works it into the lore and actual physics.

Yes, hard-sci does include 11-th hour rewrites. Blood Music? Eleventh hour 'singularity' of the noocytes, whose intense observation of the known universe means they have to shift our local reality into an entirely new dimension before the laws of physics are totally ruined. The final novel in the Revelation Space trilogy? The greenfly nanomachines appear and destroy the Inhibitors, but only just before transforming all the galaxy's matter into vegetation, ending life as we know it.
Most of Greg Egan's (who is the hardest sci-fi writer I can think off) work ends with huge, unforetold and unforeseen paradigm shifts at the end of the novels.

[Shiran]

Diablos2525 wrote...

This is a sci-fi series, centered around technological advances of the future and player choice. Not space magic, gilligans island, deus ex machina BS.

"It's not even in any way like the traditional game endings, where you can say how many endings there are or whether you got ending A, B, or C."~ Casey Hudson on Mass effect 3 endings prior to release.

Care to explain that quote?

Uh, so when you talking about Deus Ex Machima, you are referring to Kalros I take it? I can't really think of any other ones at the moment... Other than of course the fact that Shepard has magical ability to survice when no no creature really shouldn't.

Casey's statement is 100% absolutely accurate. Each game is unique and takes into account your actions in previous games, restricting or opening choices that are available to you and outcomes. E.g. try keeping Mordin alive if you didn't ahve Wrex executed back at Virmire in Mass Effect 1.

[Diablos2525]

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

Diablos2525 wrote...

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

Diablos2525 wrote...

"It's not even in any way like the traditional game endings, where you can say how many endings there are or whether you got ending A, B, or C."~ Casey Hudson on Mass effect 3 endings prior to release.

Care to explain that quote?

I don't have to - try asking Casey Hudson who is the one who said it. They might have had ideas that they were playing around with earlier on, but ultimately they decided to go with the endings they chose, which amount to three main endings with minor variations based on your actions (the state of the Earth, the breath ending, etc. from what I hear). If I want to get nitpicky and technical, I could point out that those variations mean there are more than three endings.

And if I really wanted to nitpick and be sarcastic, I could point out that what he says is true in that the endings  similar enough that you can't tell "whether you got ending A, B, or C."  Also, your completely tangential point doesn't address the issue of liking the endings/not liking the endings and your assumptions about those of us who are fine with the existing endings. But please feel free to continue insulting people and/or bringing up complelely unrelated issues.

Sorry you can't like the endings. There is only one ending, with three different colors. They are 98% the same. Link here. 

I might of been willing to look past the completely nonsensical endings if there had actually even been more than one, probably not, but I would of just said "meh that sucked and was poorly written" as opposed to "WTF SERIOUSLY?!".

Oh, and now you're telling me I can't like the endings? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL. You are actually trying to dictate to us what we can and can't like. Who do you think you are? Well, now I know what to do you with your opinion and this entire thread: toss them both into the wastebasket right where they belong.

Newsflash: you're not the boss of me.

Apparently, I have to reduce things to that level thanks to your obtuseness.

I completely understand why you like the endings, I look forward to beating it a third time so I can see the pretty blue explosion this time. I already saw the green and red ones. They were so pretty, and then I saw Deus Ex's ending all over again. God it's been like over a decade since I was presented with those three choices. Mostly I liked the red explosion though, it was the prettiest and left me feeling all warm and fuzzy inside. Plus the Normandy reminded me of Gilligan's Island, so funny

[AtreiyaN7]

LucidStrike wrote...

Bah. People who like these endings are like the people who STILL believe the world is flat. =/

Funny thing, I believe that the world is round and that the Earth revolves around the Sun - I believe in all kinds of amazing  things like that.

Furthermore, I could argue that based on your collective behavior, you're acting somewhat like the Catholic Church during its "let's burn Galileo at the stake for having an opinion that runs contrary to our orthodoxy" phase back in the day. Giordano Bruno, of course, didn't get off as lucky as Galileo who was only put under house arrest for believing that the Earth revolved around the Sun.

Modifié par AtreiyaN7, 20 mars 2012 - 12:03 .

[sAxMoNkI]

iamthedave3 wrote...

Valo_Soren wrote...

I just want to point out that Bioware said they are still considering all feed back, and that altering/changing the ending has not been ruled out, now this really is mostly beating a dead horse, i think its time to be more patient and less hostile.

You're absolutely correct, however the 'other' side is terrified that Bioware will see the upswell of people saying they liked the ending, wipe the sweat from their brow and brush off their best smiles to go back to the 'vocal minority' line.

The anger against people who like the endings isn't really because you liked the endings, it's fear that essentially you ended up getting what they didn't: satisfaction, and that because you got satisfaction it will lead to them also not getting it.

Vis a vis, you bet your bottom dollar if 100% of the fans hated the ending it would be changed.

And in the end the thing people want is more options. Nobody's calling for the current endings to be removed from the game, just that more permutations be added (essentially what was promised in the first place), so they see the claim that they're asking too much as again them being denied what you got out of the experience.

That is what strikes me overwhelmingly as the reasons for these arguments springing up every time.

Plus there's the simple truth that these endings have thrust many people into genuine depression for various reasons, and quite a few of the people who like the endings are like that smarmy jerk who can't stop telling you how awesome their life is when it's obvious you're in a bad place and don't want to talk about it. There are people being stupid and trollish on both sides, which doesn't help, but I hope that the essential nature of the debate isn't forgotten or invalidated by anyone.

In a game that Bioware themselves claim is about choice, how can more choice actually be a bad thing?

You sir have just summed it up perfectly, +1. I personally do want to see more options at the end from the "perfect, happy everyone is all okay" to the "total reaper victory absolute, brutal annihilation" and a good selection in between. If you feel your shepard can only save the galaxy through self-sacrafice then finish your personal story that way, if you want everything to be hunky-dory then finish your story that way, hell if you want everything to be royally screwed and fatalistic then by God you should have the option!

[Diablos2525]

Shiran wrote...

Diablos2525 wrote...

This is a sci-fi series, centered around technological advances of the future and player choice. Not space magic, gilligans island, deus ex machina BS.

"It's not even in any way like the traditional game endings, where you can say how many endings there are or whether you got ending A, B, or C."~ Casey Hudson on Mass effect 3 endings prior to release.

Care to explain that quote?

Uh, so when you talking about Deus Ex Machima, you are referring to Kalros I take it? I can't really think of any other ones at the moment... Other than of course the fact that Shepard has magical ability to survice when no no creature really shouldn't.

Casey's statement is 100% absolutely accurate. Each game is unique and takes into account your actions in previous games, restricting or opening choices that are available to you and outcomes. E.g. try keeping Mordin alive if you didn't ahve Wrex executed back at Virmire in Mass Effect 1.

Which color explosion did you like the best? My favorite color is red 

[AtreiyaN7]

KitePolaris wrote...

But, bro! We're the aggressive, rude, insulting, and stupid ones. Not them. We fling all the names and rude words. Not them. Hold the line. Berate people who are different.

*chuckle* 

[AtreiyaN7]

Diablos2525 wrote...

I completely understand why you like the endings, I look forward to beating it a third time so I can see the pretty blue explosion this time. I already saw the green and red ones. They were so pretty, and then I saw Deus Ex's ending all over again. God it's been like over a decade since I was presented with those three choices. Mostly I liked the red explosion though, it was the prettiest and left me feeling all warm and fuzzy inside. Plus the Normandy reminded me of Gilligan's Island, so funny

*takes your post and throws it into the wastebasket like the last one*

Modifié par AtreiyaN7, 20 mars 2012 - 12:03 .

[Diablos2525]

Diablos2525 wrote...

Shiran wrote...

Diablos2525 wrote...

This is a sci-fi series, centered around technological advances of the future and player choice. Not space magic, gilligans island, deus ex machina BS.

"It's not even in any way like the traditional game endings, where you can say how many endings there are or whether you got ending A, B, or C."~ Casey Hudson on Mass effect 3 endings prior to release.

Care to explain that quote?

Uh, so when you talking about Deus Ex Machima, you are referring to Kalros I take it? I can't really think of any other ones at the moment... Other than of course the fact that Shepard has magical ability to survice when no no creature really shouldn't.

Casey's statement is 100% absolutely accurate. Each game is unique and takes into account your actions in previous games, restricting or opening choices that are available to you and outcomes. E.g. try keeping Mordin alive if you didn't ahve Wrex executed back at Virmire in Mass Effect 1.

Which color explosion did you like the best? My favorite color is red 

Exactly we want CHOICES. I am okay with you guys liking the endings, really I am. But you guys create threads saying "Don't change the ending" or call us "whiners". So that is why I'm angry and retaliating, because if you let Bioware know you are happy with these endings some of us hate, they won't change them. That's the bottom line of it really.

Modifié par Diablos2525, 20 mars 2012 - 12:05 .

[Diablos2525]

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

Diablos2525 wrote...

I completely understand why you like the endings, I look forward to beating it a third time so I can see the pretty blue explosion this time. I already saw the green and red ones. They were so pretty, and then I saw Deus Ex's ending all over again. God it's been like over a decade since I was presented with those three choices. Mostly I liked the red explosion though, it was the prettiest and left me feeling all warm and fuzzy inside. Plus the Normandy reminded me of Gilligan's Island, so funny

*takes your post and throws it into the wastebasket like the last one*

By wastebasket you mean shrine of worship?

[sAxMoNkI]

Diablos2525 wrote...

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

Diablos2525 wrote...

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

Diablos2525 wrote...

I completely understand why you like the endings, I look forward to beating it a third time so I can see the pretty blue explosion this time. I already saw the green and red ones. They were so pretty, and then I saw Deus Ex's ending all over again. God it's been like over a decade since I was presented with those three choices. Mostly I liked the red explosion though, it was the prettiest and left me feeling all warm and fuzzy inside. Plus the Normandy reminded me of Gilligan's Island, so funny

Look you didn't like the ending, some people did. It called a difference of opinion people, there is no right or wrong just different points of view.
I personally found them to be severly lacking, but I don't want them changed just expanded upon with further options added to cater to a wider variety of play styles and decisions.

Ultimately being at each other's throats and trying to out-argue each other achieves nothing and further damages any progress towards giving others an ending option that gives them the closure that some are lucky enough to have found in the endings as they stand.

Modifié par sAxMoNkI, 20 mars 2012 - 12:07 .

[Texhnolyze101]

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

Diablos2525 wrote...

I completely understand why you like the endings, I look forward to beating it a third time so I can see the pretty blue explosion this time. I already saw the green and red ones. They were so pretty, and then I saw Deus Ex's ending all over again. God it's been like over a decade since I was presented with those three choices. Mostly I liked the red explosion though, it was the prettiest and left me feeling all warm and fuzzy inside. Plus the Normandy reminded me of Gilligan's Island, so funny

*takes your post and throws it into the wastebasket like the last one*

*Takes there post out of the wastebasket and puts it in your shoe* hahaha *runs away*

[Vikali]

Diablos2525 wrote...

Diablos2525 wrote...

Shiran wrote...

Diablos2525 wrote...

This is a sci-fi series, centered around technological advances of the future and player choice. Not space magic, gilligans island, deus ex machina BS.

"It's not even in any way like the traditional game endings, where you can say how many endings there are or whether you got ending A, B, or C."~ Casey Hudson on Mass effect 3 endings prior to release.

Care to explain that quote?

Uh, so when you talking about Deus Ex Machima, you are referring to Kalros I take it? I can't really think of any other ones at the moment... Other than of course the fact that Shepard has magical ability to survice when no no creature really shouldn't.

Casey's statement is 100% absolutely accurate. Each game is unique and takes into account your actions in previous games, restricting or opening choices that are available to you and outcomes. E.g. try keeping Mordin alive if you didn't ahve Wrex executed back at Virmire in Mass Effect 1.

Which color explosion did you like the best? My favorite color is red 

Exactly we want CHOICES. I am okay with you guys liking the endings, really I am. But you guys create threads saying "Don't change the ending" or call us "whiners". So that is why I'm angry and retaliating, because if you let Blizzard know you are happy with these endings some of us hate, they won't change them. That's the bottom line of it really.

Uh, no. We make threads saying stop spamming topics with the same posts you put in the threads where it actually belongs. Also, nice slip there. Reveals a lot about you. While I think it has hit a point of whining, I can't say I wouldn't desire more added to the ending like an Awakening DLC. You can be happy with something but find it flawed.

I'd be a pretty lonely person if that wasn't possible.

[Shiran]

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

KitePolaris wrote...

But, bro! We're the aggressive, rude, insulting, and stupid ones. Not them. We fling all the names and rude words. Not them. Hold the line. Berate people who are different.

*chuckle* 

You forgot the best part, people who don't mind the endings are paid to like them by EA. I hope EA doesn't forget to sent out W-2 at the end of year, woun;t want INS to get the wind of this exciting work from home opportunity.