1309 réponses à ce sujet

[donbaloo]

I was okay with the endings, they were thought provoking. And up until coming to the forums I would have considered myself a big fan of Mass Effect. Absolutely loved each title, always did all sidequests, I've read every single Codex entry through each game and darn it if I haven't read MOST of the planet descriptions while scanning. That seemed pretty hardcore to me. Boy was I deceived. Because as much as I liked the games, I only have one playthrough of each. I just don't replay games. To find out that some folks have literally six or seven completed Shepards through the end of ME2 amazed me. So I've had to demote myself back to casual fan.

That said, I very much took the ending to heart and thought a great deal about it and how it fits into the story. To say that everyone that liked it, just didn't think about it and are action fans? Come on now.

You're going to see more and more folks coming in here liking the ending because I have a sneaking suspicion that most folks will at least be okay with them. The hardcores finished the game week 1. Those folks have far more emotional investment at stake in it and were dissatisfied. This will be tough times for the Retake movement as more likers come forward. I'm not a Hold the Liner but I can appreciate what you guys are doing. You should remain strong as the more tolerant voices come forward!

By the way, there's a whole other thread somewhere where folks have been invited to explain why they liked the ending. Folks probably get tired of repeating themselves.

[piemanz]

I'm a huge ME fan, probably have around 10 playthroughs in both ME1 and 2. I wouldn't describe myself as a **** either since the ME series are the only bioware games I own.

I enjoyed the endings because they ended how I envisioned the series ending. I think they end the story without trivialising the Reapers, by requiring the Galaxy as a whole to make huge sacrifces to get rid of them once and for all.

It's not that I don't see where a lot of the complaints are coming from either, I can see some plot holes, but i've chosen to explain them to myself rather than demand an explenation, which I think may have been the whole point in making them fairly vague in the first place.

Overall I felt like I got closure, I got to say goodbye to all my crew before embarking on what i fully expcted to be a suicide mission, all the loose ends were resolved throughout the game, and the Reapers were defeated.

I understand that people think their decisions should have had more of an impact, but I never went into the game with that expectation, so it's not really an issue. I always looked at Shep as just one man trying to get things done. Just because he made a decision to do something doesn't mean that decision has to have earthshattering consequences. I think it takes something away from the overall universe when everything revolves around the decisions of one person. For example, I actually quite like the fact I chose Anderson as counciler in ME1 but in ME3 Udina is the counceler, because it shows that Anderson has his own free will and not tied down to a decision Shep made for him.

Modifié par piemanz, 19 mars 2012 - 01:58 .

[Psythorn]

Fail_Inc wrote...

CombustiblePanda wrote...

I swear if I read one more post about how the only reason we don't like the ending is because it isn't "happy" I'm going to explode.

This 
And I swear if I read one more post comparing this game's ending to movies I'm going to explode. Seriously which movie director let's you choose anything while shooting his movie? Can you kill Jar-Jar in SW:Ep1? Can you call Padme a f***** pedophile for banging Anakin? It's like saying you can ride cars on the sea because they have seats just like boats.

This is maybe because the mother of all polls started with this. Because of so many votes the author decided to not change the questions at it would reset the poll. However if you read the first posting it clearly states that this is about much more than just a "brighter" ending...

[golyoscsapagy]

Diablos2525 wrote...

golyoscsapagy wrote...

Diablos2525 wrote...
I would call people stupid, working with customers all day long it pretty much becomes an established fact. What exactly about their position of liking horribly stupid endings makes them smart?

So um, they are stupid because they don't like the same things you do? Great we have another moral compass...

Btw, good luck with your career, I really try hard not to point out how hilarious your comment is from someone who should like customers who, erm, pay his/her salary.

Hi, can you please explain to me how having 10 plotholes in 10 minutes is the definition of a good ending? Only then can I take you seriously.
Here they are:

Sure, right after you point out where I said (or even hinted at) the ending is good. Or where I did imply that anyone who doesn't agree with you and think you are just plainly stupid must like the ending.

[stormhit]

Because if you're here long enough you start to realize that some people aren't complaining about JUST the aspects of the ending that you didn't agree with. People taking extreme positions force some who would otherwise be willing to say "yeah, the ending kinda blew" to defend things with a "seriously, it wasn't as bad as all that."

Personally, I just thought the ending was fairly dumb mostly because the whole fleet strength and decision mechanic -the point of the entire game- made no real difference. But I find many of the other complaints regarding closure and what HAS to be fixed to be unnecessary. An awful lot is perfectly resolved throughout the course of the game.

That and people insisting on calling things plot holes when they're really just unexplained is always annoying.

[bytemarks]

There are plenty of posts justifying why people like the ending. I myself have written a detailed response to this very question. Lets just agree that we have different opinions and drop it. This pointless back and forth is not the proper way to have an intelligent discussion.

Modifié par bytemarks, 19 mars 2012 - 01:43 .

[Claym0re]

Lightice_av wrote... Blew up? People are still mistaking the energy burst from the Crucible for an explosion?

You can call the destruction of mass relays a different type of explosion, but the fact remains Joker was fleeing from a HUGE shockwave which crippled the Normandy even at lightyears distance.

The way its shown on the galaxy map is also very similar to how it happened in the Arrival DLC.

So to be fair both of us can be right. So much for ending without questions...

[Reiella]

Gunslinger01101 wrote...

Maybe so but at least it didn't have a....giant f***ing terminator reaper.

Quite, I think the backlash against the Reaper-baby bossfight is why we didn't have a traditional boss fight ending.  That fight seemed particularly tacked on.

[Lightice_av]

stormhit13 wrote...

Personally, I just thought the ending was fairly dumb mostly because the whole fleet strength and decision mechanic -the point of the entire game- made no real difference.

It makes some: if you go in at bare minimum, the Crucible will just plain fail, and kill everything in the galaxy

That and people insisting on calling things plot holes when they're really just unexplained is always annoying.

FINALLY, someone with a reasonable view on things.

[Syrellaris]

the 10 reasons explained.

Pre-1) (also I cant stand angry joe or his voice....just an annoying ****** I rather avoid)

Number 1 : Joker escaping. All right, I will give him this one. This is the part together with the crash landing that bugs me the most. But lets delve deeper. Taking the evidence from the Indoctrination theory, which is indeed very logically and could thus be very well true, perhaps the normandy was and is never near earth and the reapers have destroyed a single mass relay. Speculation and without bioware word or perhaps DLC, we shall never know. or it could simply be a mistake.

Number 2 : Pretty much falls under the crash landing and gilligan world ending. It never made sense, unless shepard was never actually on earth. or is on earth but right from the very beginning, never left.

Number 3 : This was not a pure explosion as it also encapsuled. If the mass relays are destroyed, this capsule could have caused the explosion to be detained. However indoctrination theory shows evidence, this never happened or if it does, it was just 1 solar system, which related back to the normandy crash landing.

Number 4 : I do not know why people keep thinking the fleets are stranded. They have engines, they can still travel. it will just take longer.

Number 5: He is just speculating here. If you payed attention, you would have known the war assets are there to increase the outcome of the crucible and mainly a space related fleet. The few krogans and so on that are on earth are actually fighting reaper forces. They and the turians are pretty much the only race that has sufficient ground troops.

Number 6: I agree the popup should not have been there. I do however believe Bioware did it this way to introduce future DLC that continues the story or even a ME4 game. It is a cliffhanger yes, does not mean it is perse a bad one.

Number 7: Why does every ending to be good? This is not a real problem, just opinion.

Number 8: Another opinion. Also there is an actuall reasoning behind this. He refers to advanced organics that could cause the ultimate destruction of all organics. Even the under evolved at this point. He reaps the advanced civilizations and creates reapers with them. They are not mass effect slurpee as some call it, no they become reaper troops in order to let the other species survive.


Number 9: If the indoctrination theary is true, which it most likely is, or atleast all evidence shows that way, then Shepards acceptence is logically. Noticed how the endings are reversed in color and with the illusive man or Anderson? Your god child saying "Wake up"

number 10: Color choices, altough strange have purpose. Red is the color that indicates Destruction, flame etc. We use that color even in real life to make clear dangerous goods or places that are considered dangerous etc.

Blue and the lightning. a overal used graphical animation that goes along with control or Static behaviour. even in the real world, we use this a lot.

Green : This is an alternate color. In the game it symbolizes joining. Green also stands for life. Which is what you do. You create new life.

Now I agree that the ending for all color choices could have been differently done, but if the game did not end here and shepard is indoctrinated, well the choices make sense.

[CombustiblePanda]

bytemarks wrote...

There are plenty of posts justifying why people like the ending. I myself have written a detailed response to this very question. Lets just agree that we have different opinions and drop it. This pointless back and forth is not the proper way to have an intelligent discussion.

I admire what you're trying to advocate but....
This is BSN.

People don't back down.

Modifié par CombustiblePanda, 19 mars 2012 - 01:45 .

[incinerator950]

I like the endings. My reasoning is my own.

I also don't remember what I was going to say or what I've been doing, so I'll go back to watching MlP FIM.

[PluralAces]

Well, I chose the red ending first, and I was disappointed with the fact that it was very short, and it occurred to me that none of the choices that I made throughout the entire game mattered... the only thing I could see possibly not happening, is not having enough war assets to get to the end mission, but I wont play the story again to find out...

I like the red ending for what it was, even though I dont really understand the point of destroying all the mass relays, as it leaves every one stuck where they are, and there is no chance to really develop the game any further. Harbinger ended up not even being in the game until the end, even though he was basically the main villain in ME2. I knew the Illusive Man was indoctrinated since when I first saw him in ME2, even though having him shoot himself was silly as they already did that with Saren in ME1, couldnt think of another way to have the Illusive Man die Bioware?

I'm disappointed with the endings because all three are basically the same ending with a different color light, which made me very annoyed. I'm disappointed because of all the 200+ hours I spent playing this game, none of the choices I made mattered. I guess Bioware's thinking was that it was all about the journey and how you got to the end. I don't buy into that at all, there should have been more thought and creativity put into the endings based on the choices that were made.

I dont really blame Bioware, I blame EA. Bioware has been basically indoctrinated by EA since ME2 and I understand because Bioware probably felt they couldnt survive without a big name company taking them over but it definitely was a disappointing ending to a terrific franchise. It made me feel ripped off for spending so much time and effort into this game and noe of it actually mattered because it came down.to basically one choice to decide all things.

But with the red ending, I like the fact that Shepard is still alive at the end... other than that I am overall very disappointed

Modifié par PluralAces, 19 mars 2012 - 01:48 .

[bytemarks]

Here is the copy and paste from a post I made when I beat the game.

-----

What’s wrong with leaving the ending open to interpretation? Don’t get me wrong, I understand the criticisms; Having all my choices amount to three relatively similar endings with almost no consideration for how I played the game is disappointing, but not game breaking. The choices I made up until this point shaped the Shepard who I associate with. These choices made my playthrough of the game enjoyable and I wasn’t making them solely so I could see them all unfold during the game’s finale.

This is how I saw it...

Shepard enters the Citadel void of hope. He’s tired of fighting - tired of having the weight of the world rest on his shoulders. He’s burdened, not just with physical trauma, but mental trauma as well. “I didn’t know it was so bad”, says a confused and deeply saddened Shepard upon watching the video log of his resurrection. Here he is, a mere fragment of the man he once was, barely alive, trenching through the Citadel in an effort to end this impossible war. He made it, the final room. Faced with two very separate ideals, Shepard’s struggle is not yet over as he’s confronted by Anderson and TIM; Physical representations of his own conscience and the choice he will soon incur. This is where Shepard pushes the button and opens the citadel. It is here he takes a moment of rest. It here where he is at peace... but wait, something isn’t right. The Crucible didn’t fire. In one last ditch effort, Shepard pulls himself towards the console, and it is here where he falls down.

Is he dead? Has he been indoctrinated? The physical manifestation of what he perceives as the catalyst is appealing to his vulnerability. He’s faced with a final choice. Is this choice real?

Perhaps Shepard died and is now making a decision that will allow him to rest peacefully. In his final dream, Shepard changes the world, even if only for himself.

Perhaps not. Maybe he’s been indoctrinated and this reaper is manipulating his fragile mind, yet Shepards willpower and staunch loyalty to the mission and his people allow him to see past it. Maybe he can’t see past it.
Maybe Shepard can’t see the right choice and will allow the reapers to win.

Maybe what he’s seeing is real. Is the catalyst telling the truth? Shepard is about to die and is in no condition to argue or ask questions. Desperate times call for desperate measures.


What about the squad?...

Shepard has been in the Citadel quite a while. The remaining squad members fall back as per their orders. With Shepard presumably dead at the foot of the beam, Joker arranges a pick-up so they can wait for further instruction or immediate evacuation. The crucible fires - Success!... but wait, the ships are falling out of the sky. What’s going on? Joker, the best pilot in the alliance, is not going to wait and find out. He hits the nearest relay in a last ditch escape effort. Unfortunately he does not make it far. The squad and remaining alien forces are left stranded. All of them gave their life for the cause. (My interpretation)

This is not a happy ending for anybody. Where is the happy ending? The happy ending is after the credits. The war is long over. Here you see a boy and his grandpa sharing stories of a threat they will no longer have to face thanks to the bravery of these men and women who all sacrificed everything.

In Conclusion...

You can’t say I’m right about this ending, but you also can’t say I’m wrong. People are hating on this game because of the 5 minute end cutscene. This is one of the greatest trilogies in gaming and it’s a shame to see so many people ragging on it because they didn’t like the ending. I feel much of this has to do with the internet hive-mind as well. People read 50 sources that talk about how bad the ending is and then all of the sudden they feel cheated.

-----

TL;DR

Defeating the Reapers came with huge sacrifice. Everyone who faught is left either dead or stranded, a necessary sacrifice. The ending that matters comes after the credits.

Modifié par bytemarks, 19 mars 2012 - 02:08 .

[Lightice_av]

Claym0re wrote...

Lightice_av wrote... Blew up? People are still mistaking the energy burst from the Crucible for an explosion?

You can call the destruction of mass relays a different type of explosion, but the fact remains Joker was fleeing from a HUGE shockwave which crippled the Normandy even at lightyears distance.

Normandy is in the middle of a Mass Relay jump just when the destruction begins. The tunnel of negative mass is collapsing, and Joker is trying to escape this effect but fails. It is not an explosion. If you have any sense of scale, you'll understand that largest of supernovas couldn't create a visible effect of that magnitude on galactic scale. If it was and explosion of that magnitude, the Normandy would have been instantly vaporized along with the Citadel and the entire Solar System. Stars would have exploded hundreds of lightyears in every direction. That is not what we see on the galactic map.

[Russalka]

This sense that people of either side are somehow lesser in intelligence or whose opinion does not count at all is why I choose no sides. But apparently those who like the endings are more often the victims of it.

Modifié par Russalka, 19 mars 2012 - 01:55 .

[CasbynessPC]

Xellith wrote...

You can easily unsee a spoiled ending. its called replayability. Ill just pretend that was my worst playthrough and start again aiming to get the ending I worked for and not some bullcrap ending that I was given the first time around.

That works for me

Kinda like the ending of Scott Pilgrim.

Modifié par CasbynessPC, 19 mars 2012 - 01:59 .

[Claym0re]

Lightice_av wrote...
Normandy is in the middle of a Mass Relay jump just when the destruction begins. The tunnel of negative mass is collapsing, and Joker is trying to escape this effect but fails. It is not an explosion. If you have any sense of scale, you'll understand that largest of supernovas couldn't create a visible effect of that magnitude on galactic scale. If it was and explosion of that magnitude, the Normandy would have been instantly vaporized along with the Citadel and the entire Solar System. Stars would have exploded hundreds of lightyears in every direction. That is not what we see on the galactic map.

Well explained. You bought me.

[I.leary]

Diablos2525 wrote...

I've been seeing a lot of people like the endings of Mass effect 3. I have to wonder though, are they really big fans of the series or have they just picked up the latest one and put "action mode" or whatever on. Because the ending makes no sense... at all, and goes against the lore established by previous mass effect games and dlc. Are these people just ****s, or simply ignorant? Every time they say they like the ending they never give a reason why. Is it the fact that it was ripped straight from Deus Ex 1. Or the fact that it creates 10 plotholes, or the fact that it goes against the whole purpose of the series where you collect forces to stop the Reapers only to make the collection of those forces pointless since we all get 98% the same ending.

I am seriously so confused, how can people be so stupid? Have they not finished the game?

EDIT: I'm wondering if all the people who finished the game first were mostly series fans, whereas now we are seeing a bunch of first time fans finishing the game weeks later?

I liked the ending of ME3.
I preordered the CE and finished it in the first week, and now I am working on my 2nd playthrough with my alternative Shepard. I have played the 2 previous game and I chose the RPG mode for ME3. I didn't skip any dialogue and I read most of the Codex entries. I recently downloaded Mass Effect 3: Datapad so I could read whatever I missed while in the subway on my way to college everyday.
I hate shooters and action is definately not the reason I play Mass Effect. In fact, if it were so I'd never have finished the first game, which was extremely clumsy in this regard. 
Now, there may be a chance I'm stupid. A lot of people call me that, specially when I criticize their political opinions. I get top marks at one of the best universities in my country, however, so i guess that has to count for something.
As to why I don't justify my opinion, well... I don't feel the urge to.
I have posted a fan review with my opinions on the ending on this same forum and I have tweeted the developers communicating my appreciation. Whatever problems the endings have--and I acknowlege they have some--they don't bother me the least. I see no reason to keep dwelling on it. 
It was a pleasant experience, but it has reached a conclusion, and life goes on. There are new games to try, new books to read, new movies to see...

In the end, it's not a matter of intellect or loyalty to the series, but of personal preference. I've had  similar discussions with my friends  regarding The Antichrist and The White Ribbon. Some of us liked them, some of us hated them. Don't let it get over your head. You'd be surprised how enjoyable these exchanges can be if done respectfully. Even now I've learned a lot about game marketing and classical sci-fi by listening to different opinions in this debate.

Thanks for reading. And if I offended anyone, please forgive me. It's tricky to convey intention in the internet

[piemanz]

Claym0re wrote...

Lightice_av wrote...
Normandy is in the middle of a Mass Relay jump just when the destruction begins. The tunnel of negative mass is collapsing, and Joker is trying to escape this effect but fails. It is not an explosion. If you have any sense of scale, you'll understand that largest of supernovas couldn't create a visible effect of that magnitude on galactic scale. If it was and explosion of that magnitude, the Normandy would have been instantly vaporized along with the Citadel and the entire Solar System. Stars would have exploded hundreds of lightyears in every direction. That is not what we see on the galactic map.

Well explained. You bought me.

It's not an explosion, it's the crucibles energy being distributed through the relay network, wich is why it's either red, green, or blue.

Modifié par piemanz, 19 mars 2012 - 02:04 .

[Claym0re]

piemanz wrote...

Claym0re wrote...

Lightice_av wrote...
Normandy is in the middle of a Mass Relay jump just when the destruction begins. The tunnel of negative mass is collapsing, and Joker is trying to escape this effect but fails. It is not an explosion. If you have any sense of scale, you'll understand that largest of supernovas couldn't create a visible effect of that magnitude on galactic scale. If it was and explosion of that magnitude, the Normandy would have been instantly vaporized along with the Citadel and the entire Solar System. Stars would have exploded hundreds of lightyears in every direction. That is not what we see on the galactic map.

Well explained. You bought me.

It's not an explosion, it's the crucibles energy being distributed through the relay network, wich is why it's either red, gree, or blue.

Hey I already said I bought it. Well explained really.

Now all we have to handle are the thousands of ships stranded in the Sol system and solve the mystery behind Joker chickening out.

[DenizYe]

I liked the endings because of the presentation. I've never thought that I would be hit by that beam. I thought that Shepard's dead now. I was kind of disappointed and I thought :"Well if that is the end, Harbinger is killing me without any problem, I understand everybody raging."... then standing up as the dead-alive Shepard was truly epic. Slow Mo, color correction, everything is looking surreal. That feeling. Then the citadel scene was really epic. Talking to the confused Illusive Man reminded me of Sarren in ME1. And the scene with the last three choices was genius. The kid tried to manipulate you by showing contrary things: Renegade Red for Destruction and Paragon Blue for Control. I fall for it :/ I thought that the blue ending is the right one: The destruction of the reaper I failed and the Catalyst won.
I understand all the fans being unhappy about the ending. The Joker scene at the end was unnecessary in that shape. It should have been more elaborated. And finally: The scene at the end with the grandpa talking to his grandson. Kind of cliché but I still liked it.

[Dimensio]

piemanz wrote...


I understand that people think their decisions should have had more of an impact, but I never went into the game with that expectation, so it's not really an issue

Evidently you did not read developer comments issued prior to release.  Expectations that previous decisions would impact the ending were based upon unambiguous claims from BioWare staff that previous decisions would impact the ending, just as expectations that multiplayer would not be required to attain the "perfect" ending were based upon unambigious claims from BioWare staff that multiplayer would not be required to attain the "perfect" ending.

[nevar00]

I don't get it either.

- your decisions mean nothing
- it was underwhelming
- that kid is the definition of a dues ex machina
- plot holes, plot holes everywhere
- no closure

So yeah, I don't see it. If people like it then fine, but I don't see how or why.