2816 réponses à ce sujet

[SnappyMyappns]

GimmeMoney wrote...

jerms510 wrote...

Another thing, the zones/missions for DA:O were, imo, entirely too long. DA2 took a huge leap in the right direction, but possibly overshot. DA:O was difficult to replay mostly because of how terribly long and abhorrently boring the Orzammar/Deep Roads sequence was.

^This. Prefered DA2 short locations (and same dungeons, yep) more, because in DAO it was always such a long way. Without interaction with outer world.

I disagree. I loved how Orzimmar in the first game started as a small mission that escalated and escalated. The pacing was just right to make the entire mission epic. It's still my favorite quest in an RPG.

[lenzio]

Cant wait!

[Mark Darrah]

SnappyMyappns wrote...

- Some actual sense of reality on your choice on specializations. So you decide to be a Blood Mage, everyone is afraid of them but they just "pretend" you´re not one?

I really like this suggestion too.

Me too! Oh wait...

[sporky1]

I liked DA2, its just that DA:O had a better formula. DA2 was only better in the combat.

1) Don't recycle environments; also, if you are going to have the armor format you had in DA2, make the upgrades change the armor/allow for recoloring
2) More than just one moral dilemma; every section, you should have to make a choice--and more than just two options
3) More chances to talk to companions/expand the story/work on relationships
4) I don't really care if an elf has the same voice as a human. So bringing back the races would be fun.

Modifié par sporky1, 19 mars 2012 - 06:15 .

[Phoenix-Warden]

Well, if Morrigan is in DA3, then please no LI or team member. She should stay at my Warden's side where she belongs

[Kavatica]

SnappyMyappns wrote...

GimmeMoney wrote...

jerms510 wrote...

Another thing, the zones/missions for DA:O were, imo, entirely too long. DA2 took a huge leap in the right direction, but possibly overshot. DA:O was difficult to replay mostly because of how terribly long and abhorrently boring the Orzammar/Deep Roads sequence was.

^This. Prefered DA2 short locations (and same dungeons, yep) more, because in DAO it was always such a long way. Without interaction with outer world.

I disagree. I loved how Orzimmar in the first game started as a small mission that escalated and escalated. The pacing was just right to make the entire mission epic. It's still my favorite quest in an RPG.

Yes. I haven't found DAO difficult to replay at all. Also, if you put the game on easy mode, you can get through Orzammar and the Deep Roads (or any other quests you might find long) pretty quickly.

[Noob451]

LPPrince wrote...

Ahh, Dragon Age.

I could spend ages breaking down Dragon Age 2 and the problems I had with it, but I did it FOREVER ago. Multiple times. Hah.

I remember one post I made long ago where I took the time to critique the game. I thought it would never be read by a DA developer, yet Mr. Epler sent me a wonderful private message assuring me he read it, even if he didn't show that he did in the thread.

I think I've blasted DA2 enough. BUT WHAT THE HELL, LETS BREAK IT DOWN AGAIN FOR OLD TIMES SAKE! WOO!

Art Style- This is my biggest gripe with Dragon Age 2. I absolutely despised the new art style. It felt like an alpha build.

It seemed like so much focus was put on the main characters that side characters' appearances suffered greatly.

Elves were made to look disgusting, in my opinion. I felt they were much more beautiful in DAO, when they appeared physically more "human".

As far as the aesthetic of elves go, and characters in general for that matter, you don't have to make them look anorexic or give them weird facial features to make them feel different.

Change the style of their clothing. Their gaunt. The way they walk, the way they carry themselves, the things they do. Make subtle differences that add up.

Qunari and Flemeth- Great changes. Loved those. No complaints there.

CHARACTERS HANDS- This bugged the hell out of me. Characters' hands were UGLY. Good God. The worst part is that attention was drawn to their hands multiple times, for example Merrill having nail polish, or one scene in particular where Isabella raises her hands up to her face and you can see how bony and skeletal her hands are. Eugh.

For me, a fix to the art style would be a return to the DAO art style. I had absolutely NO issues with DAO's art style whatsoever, and I think that with some work, creating distinctive races and characters with that art style would not be difficult to fathom and create.

Combat- Too fast, too ridiculous, too twitchy. In some games, I'd prefer that speed, but for Dragon Age, I prefer to pace myself.

I feel that the pace of combat was too quick in DA2, too random. DAO's was fine, albeit a little slow.

I'd correct this by slowing down the combat from DA2, but keeping it faster than it was in DAO. Delicate balance, but it can be done.

Archery- Well done. Vast improvement over DAO's archery. My only complaint is how it seems a tad "magical" that a rain of arrows can fall on someone when you shot one into the air. Perhaps if they were magical arrows I'd understand.

Maturity- I want the game to be believable, but still keep its level of fantasy. I want it to be a dark fantasy, not to the extremes of A Song of Ice and Fire, although I do feel that should be a heavy influence, especially when it comes to the next point-

Politics- I think this is something DA2 completely failed on. The politics of the DA franchise can be great- we saw that in DAO with Loghain sacrificing Cailan, and the whole sequence in Denerim with the Landsmeet. Twas wonderful, and I'd love to see something similar to that but on a grander stage.

Dragons- Goddamn it guys, the game is called DRAGON AGE. Give us more dragons. Hell, find a way for us to HAVE a dragon. Perhaps as a pet or companion to take into battle, as we took our mabari in DAO. A dragon as a companion would be MARVELOUS.

Overall plot- Grander. Bigger. More personal, but with a broad depth. DAO had the Archdemon, which could bring hell upon EVERYONE- that worked. Give us something like that, hell, something even MORE problematic. Give us a grand evil, something we HAVE to take down, to deal with. Something we are aware of from the START of the game, again like DAO. Cliché as it may seem, it WORKS. Its favorable.

Archenemy- We need one. We had Loghain in DAO, and he was a consistent enemy. Twas wonderful, I thoroughly enjoyed it. Especially since I played a Human Noble and got revenge for my family by killing his right-hand man. We need a foe like that again- someone on our level, or someone always BETTER. Give us someone who plagues us, who makes our travel HELL. Make someone make OUR character's lives PAINFUL.

Companions- I found the companions of DAO much more enthralling than DA2's. DA2's just didn't have that same feeling about them. Alistair, Morrigan, Leliana, Wynne, Rabbit(mabari), and the rest all had amazing characterization and wonderful story arcs. I loved how entrenched into the main story Alistair and Morrigan were. I feel we need that again- We need compelling characters with us from the start who are not only attractive and available for romance, but even without romance have compelling storytelling just emanating from them. Speaking about romance,

Romance- Give us multi-dimensional romance options. Don't make the romance options obvious. Let the stronger willed characters come to us with propositions for a romantic relationship, and let the weaker willed characters wait for us to make the first move. Have romantic partners that are in control, and have romantic partners that are quite chaotic. Give us tender options, give us abrasive options. Options, options, options.

Detail- The world, the characters, the story, it all needs more detail. I recall in DAO, the Tower of Ishal, and the birds that flew around it. The books that littered the Circle Tower. Little things add up to a grand experience. Give us much more detail. Much much more.

Me- Hey guys, you know I'm an actual Prince, right? You do realize I can give y'all an inside scoop on what goes on in the minds of royalty? Especially royalty that's unsure of life, what it takes to get through it, his role in the World, what he brings to the World.

Plus, I've got a sexy voice. COME ON, you're shooting yourself in the foot not bringing my ass to Bioware HQ and talking to me. Or not bringing me in for voice over sessions. Hell, I'll take all the time in the World helping y'all out if you need it- which you do.



There we go. That's all I've got on my mind right now, I'm sure I've forgotten a ton of things. Now I'll just have to hope this has been read, whether I find out here in this thread or via PM.

Good luck, Dragon Age developers. DAO was a huge success, DA2 not nearly as much, and I pray you can make a huge comeback and rebound back into having the franchise feel great. Cause honestly?

If DA3/DAO2 or whatever's next isn't up to snuff, I'm bailing on the franchise. And you have to know I won't be alone.

Lets work together to make sure that doesn't happen.

I disagree with your opinion on the art style (and i think a dragon companion is a terrible idea) , but you did bring up an excellent point with the politics, and the maturity.

Modifié par Noob451, 19 mars 2012 - 06:16 .

[Androme]

Phoenix-Warden wrote...

Well, if Morrigan is in DA3, then please no LI or team member. She should stay at my Warden's side where she belongs

This.

Edit:
Also, above post: Agree, politics and maturity, much better in DAO.

Modifié par Androme, 19 mars 2012 - 06:17 .

[Nerdy_Cowboy]

 I'm not big on everyone bashing DAII.  I LOVED IT.  Much more than DA:O.

I love how they simplified armor and inventory so you spend less time outfitting everyone and more time engaged in the story and the action.

I didn't even finish DA:O for that reason.  I played DAII through with each type of character and different scenarios.  

LOVED IT.

[sporky1]

sporky1 wrote...

I liked DA2, its just that DA:O had a better formula. DA2 was only better in the combat.

1) Don't recycle environments; also, if you are going to have the armor format you had in DA2, make the upgrades change the armor/allow for recoloring
2) More than just one moral dilemma; every section, you should have to make a choice--and more than just two options
3) More chances to talk to companions/expand the story/work on relationships
4) I don't really care if an elf has the same voice as a human. So bringing back the races would be fun.

also, more chest hair. This is a must.

[gotthammer]

chilldude22 wrote...
If I was the lead writer I would bring back the warden and A LOT of the previous cast.

This. Plus better atmosphere (that was more or less my main complaint for DA:O. ME2 and ME3 did atmosphere very well, IMHO).
They bring the Warden back and pick up where DA:O and it's DLCs left off and that'll probably mean a buy for me. 

[TolaGarf]

Mark Darrah wrote...

eveynameiwantisfekintaken wrote...

[Combat- i actually like DA2 combat for the most part. Loose the drop in waves of mobs but definatley keep the current pace we saw with DA2. I find mages a lot more enjoyable in DA2 with the new system. DAO mages standing rooted to the spot slowly firing spells of i wouldnt like to see come back

Were you happy with the combat in Legacy? We tried to get the encounters more rational there.

Thought I give some input on the combat systems of DAO versus DA2. Personally I prefer the DAO system, although some of the combat animations seems a bit too slow going, yet the hits made a huge impact. (like two-handed weapons). Comparing to DA2, the combat animations went way too fast for my taste, which made killing something seem a lot slower actually as they hardly took any damage due to the superfast weapon swings. I would even guess a lot of people were button mashing because of this, even though that isn't neccesary. I believe a middle ground should be used for DA3, to satisfy as many as possible.

The removal of the high isometric camera on the PC version was a big letdown though. Please don't do that again =)

[Jonny_Sad]

Hello Mark,

I like so many other forged an incredible attachment to my Warden and unashamedly, Morrigan.. I would love to see more from them. Including playing as my warden again.. I think the inevitable meeting between Hawk and the warden would be excellent.. Maybe at the start of DAIII you could choose between which one you want to play.. Anyway, thanks for the experience so far.. (more so DA:O)

Regards
Jonny Sad

[ladyofpayne]

Mr Mark please do reaction in game on mage player. May be templars will be hunting or something.

[dannerc]

Even though I'm not super-hyped it will be interesting to see what happens with DA3. I absolutely loved DA:O and regard it as one of my favourite fantasy rpgs. DA2 was fun as well, although not near as good as the first one. Still, it was an enjoyable game. Never for a second have I thought DA3 would be about Hawke, as his/her story felt really summed up (DA2 spans for about 8 years if I remember correctly?).
Hoping you will make the third one more similar to the first one, as I think that was one of the flaws of the second game. Make DA3 more grim (like DA:O), more customization (companion outfits, etc), and write an epic story and I will be happy

[eroeru]

Oh, and about the combat -

DA2 felt hectic, and all twichy-like, while DA:O felt awesomely like playing a strategic game (chess) AND awesome in the out-of-the-ordinary animations (finishing moves and cone of cold were my favorites) which were the cherry or the icing.

Though the skill-system, and arguably the dynamics of the combat (which I personally liked 100% with origins) could indeed be good for advancing Origins, and importing some of DA2.

[WhiteKnyght]

Mark Darrah wrote...

helmsplit wrote...

Mark Darrah wrote...

We will try to bring some closure to Hawke's story but likely not in a playable form. Originally we had planned to do an expansion pack but had to stop to focus on what we are working on now.

You can't just... not finish a story. The Warden had their closure, and we had the possibility to revisit them with all the DLC. But Hawke? The ending was kind of a cliffhanger, left me under the impression that he was still needed for what was to come, and you're saying there's a good chance it might stay that way? Maybe that's why a lot of people didn't like DA2, it just feels like a lot was pretty much rushed/butchered and you are walking the same path again. I loved the game, grew fond of the characters, and it seriously upsets me that it's just going to be left at that. What was the point?

The Expansion Pack was never intended to be part of the original DA2 story. It wasn't cut or "reserved". It was conceived of AFTER DA2 had been out for a while.
The expansion pack might have provided better closure on certain personal aspects of Hawke's story, but Hawke's actions in DA2 have changed the world. This will have an impact.

A few things I'd like to suggest for the future.

1. If you chose to kill Anders, let him stay dead this time. Follow ME3's example and have other characters fill their position if a certain returning character didn't survive. Or at least give a good explanation for how they're still around.

2. Bring back the ability to choose your playable race. Doesn't need to be a half a dozen origin stories, but having a few different characters which you can choose from to play as would be nice.

3. Do something in DA3 to give answers about what happaned to Hawke and The Warden after their respective disappearances.

4. Put in a lot of hours and late nights. Cause we've already been waiting like seven months to hear about a new DLC only to find out you guys have decided to move on. Get DA3 done fast and with finesse. lol

[DAYtheELF]

I would like to say one more thing:

You all seem so focused on what people are telling you to "fix" in regards to DAII. Many of these things people say need "fixed" are things that me and many people I know enjoyed. Please don't take away all of the aspects of DAII that made it rock so hardcore.

To be slightly more specific.

I loved both DA:O and DAII. Even more, I love how they work together to tell parts of a larger story, but it very different ways. I think the contrast is beautiful. To me, it seemed that DA:O told a story in a bit more of the "standard" format of huge epic storyline quest to save the world. It was event driven; the plot was propelled and told by way of epic events. It was telling a story on a macro-scale.

DA2, on the other hand, told the story on a micro-scale. The plot was driven less by action and more by inter-character interactions. What was important was the ways characters (Hawke, companions, important NPCs, and minor NPCs) worked together and grew together (or, didn't work/ grow together depending..). The story of Kirkwall let us see intimately what was happening all throughout Thedas in a way and with an emotional connection that would have been impossible to convey in a grander DA:O type setting. I love that in many ways Hawke wasn't the main protagonist of the game. I love that we couldn't fix and save everything. Sometimes no matter how hard you try, things still fall apart. I think that is an important lesson for virtual and real-life people.

I play D&D, have for many years, and I have met a lot of different "types" of gamers. Some people are hack'n'slashers and just want to kill things. Some are tacticians and are interested in the mechanics. Some people are mostly interested in the story itself. Others are driven by the characters we create and give life to. I obviously fall into the last camp. I am more than happy to never pick up a die during an entire session. I think DAII spoke to gamers like me in ways that DA:O couldn't. I understand that many gamers do not feel this way, but please don't let the hack'n'slashers force unneeded change.

Every game will have aspects that some people do not like. All things can be improved upon. I think some people out there expect the world to magically cater to all of *their* personal desires. Unhappy people are always louder than the happy ones. Just because 4 out of 5 people you hear from say negative things doesn't mean that 4 out of 5 people who played the game hated it.

(P.S. - One thing I do really like the improvement upon DAII in the DLC was Hawke joining the random inter-party banter).

As I said at the beginning, I love the contrast between the two games. I will be super stoked if DA3 is just as different from the first two (as long as it isn't an MMO or an open-quest game like Skyrim - Skyrim is great but it is already there, there is no need to recreate it). I want to see BioWare take just as big of chances with DA3 as they did with DA:O and DAII. I want you all to continue to approach games from angles that I would never have thought of. I want you all to continue to experiment and do all of the genius things that you do. Please don't let the pull towards catering to the standard, main-stream gaming methods overcome you. Continue to be different, fresh, and innovative. Oh, and give Anders his kitty back.

Much love.

Modifié par DAYtheELF, 19 mars 2012 - 06:51 .

[rolson00]

I think the dalish should take advantage of the war and lead all elves both city and dalish in a rebellion to get a new homeland free from human culture.

[GimmeMoney]

Kavatica wrote...
Yes. I haven't found DAO difficult to replay at all. Also, if you put the game on easy mode, you can get through Orzammar and the Deep Roads (or any other quests you might find long) pretty quickly.

Mby, but I felt like that oh-so-long mission was all for nothing. Oghren wasn't my fav companion, so probably that did part of job, but come on, who would like to be stuck up in Deep Roads for weeks? I wouldn't.

[Clover Rider]

eroeru wrote...

Oh, and about the combat -

DA2 felt hectic, and all twichy-like, while DA:O felt awesomely like playing a strategic game (chess) AND awesome in the out-of-the-ordinary animations (finishing moves and cone of cold were my favorites) which were the cherry or the icing.

Though the skill-system, and arguably the dynamics of the combat (which I personally liked 100% with origins) could indeed be good for advancing Origins, and importing some of DA2.

I think a mix of DA:O and DA2's gameplay would work well.

[1-Altair]

Fully agree with most of the comments here. Forget DA2, take the amazing DA Origins and/or Baldur's Gate series as a baseline, and bring us DA3 asap! I think the idea of having the son of the Warden and Morrigan being the new hero could be nice, but everything is possible!

[Cathey]

I can understand why people want to see more of the warden and those characters but I think DA3 should move on. A new main character with new friends. If DA3 is set around the same time as DAO and DA2 then I would expect previous characters to be mentioned or make a cameo appearance.

Two things I loved about DA2.

1) Expanded LI's (doesn't have to be all bi in future, just at least 2 options for same sex). Every time I play DAO it's either Leliana or single, since Morrigan is straight.

2) Party members had lives. I liked how they all had a base where they would live and they would interact and such. Dragon Age has always had the best party banter, combine that with the DA2 home bases and the ME3 party members visiting each other more and it's perfect!

[Melca36]

GimmeMoney wrote...

jerms510 wrote...

Another thing, the zones/missions for DA:O were, imo, entirely too long. DA2 took a huge leap in the right direction, but possibly overshot. DA:O was difficult to replay mostly because of how terribly long and abhorrently boring the Orzammar/Deep Roads sequence was.

^This. Prefered DA2 short locations (and same dungeons, yep) more, because in DAO it was always such a long way. Without interaction with outer world.

Respectfully disagree. For $60 I dont want a 15 minute jaunt and have everything handed to me.

Hopefully they make a compromise where the dungeons are neither too short or too long instead of catering to one fanbase.

[LyallxFidelis]

LPPrince wrote...

There we go. That's all I've got on my mind right now, I'm sure I've forgotten a ton of things. Now I'll just have to hope this has been read, whether I find out here in this thread or via PM.

Good luck, Dragon Age developers. DAO was a huge success, DA2 not nearly as much, and I pray you can make a huge comeback and rebound back into having the franchise feel great. Cause honestly?

If DA3/DAO2 or whatever's next isn't up to snuff, I'm bailing on the franchise. And you have to know I won't be alone.

Lets work together to make sure that doesn't happen.

How did you contain so much awesome in one post? Your entire post is probably the most amazing analysis of DAII that I've ever read, without bashing on DAII that much. I agree whole-hearitidly to what you have said.