2816 réponses à ce sujet

[LPPrince]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

Mark Darrah wrote...

An advantage of a single player race is that it allows us to offer a lot more customization options. Customization is definately a place we want to focus.

Then please let us dress the companions.  Don't enforce iconic looks.

Honestly, look (and I'm sure you have already) at the implementation of iconic looks in the Diversified Followers Armour mod for DA2.  That allowed iconic looks for the companions without enforcing iconic looks for the companions.

I can assign the entire party's skills and tactics.  I can tell them what weapons to use, where to go, and who to kill.  But not what to wear.  That's a pointless restriction.

Though, allowing us to dress the companions would eliminate the design savings of a single PC race, unless all of the companions were that same race, as well.

But, frankly, being able to outfit the entire party is much more important to me than a wide variety of wearable clothing.  Particularly if you enforce class-based appearances again.  In DA2, in Hawke is a mage then all of the non-mage armour in the game because wasted design zots.  You generally don't like to include content players don't see, but by denying us access to the companions' clothing slots that's exacftly what you're doing.

Excellent points I should've brought up earlier.

[Sylvius the Mad]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Yes, you did miss something. You missed the blatantly inaccurate stereotyping that these two are engaging in. Obviously, nothing about DAII looked even vaguely like what is stereotypically thought of as a Japanese game.

Except for the giant swords.  You forgot the giant swords.

[the_one_54321]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...
Yes, you did miss something. You missed the blatantly inaccurate stereotyping that these two are engaging in. Obviously, nothing about DAII looked even vaguely like what is stereotypically thought of as a Japanese game.

Except for the giant swords.  You forgot the giant swords.

That's hardly a "Japanese" thing, at this point. Didn't you just play Kingdoms of Amalur-or-whaterver? 

[Korusus]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

Mark Darrah wrote...

An advantage of a single player race is that it allows us to offer a lot more customization options. Customization is definately a place we want to focus.

Then please let us dress the companions.  Don't enforce iconic looks.

Honestly, look (and I'm sure you have already) at the implementation of iconic looks in the Diversified Followers Armour mod for DA2.  That allowed iconic looks for the companions without enforcing iconic looks for the companions.

I can assign the entire party's skills and tactics.  I can tell them what weapons to use, where to go, and who to kill.  But not what to wear.  That's a pointless restriction.

Though, allowing us to dress the companions would eliminate the design savings of a single PC race, unless all of the companions were that same race, as well.

But, frankly, being able to outfit the entire party is much more important to me than a wide variety of wearable clothing.  Particularly if you enforce class-based appearances again.  In DA2, in Hawke is a mage then all of the non-mage armour in the game because wasted design zots.  You generally don't like to include content players don't see, but by denying us access to the companions' clothing slots that's exacftly what you're doing.

This is another one of those inexplicable things that BioWare insists on that I have no idea why...who asked for "iconic companions"?  I don't remember there being thread after thread begging for iconic, unique looking companions.  I've only ever seen people beg to be free to customize our companions in every way, right down to what armor they wear.  And yet BioWare insists that the companions only have unique, iconic outfits.  It makes no sense..

I don't even know where that impulse comes from.  I guess it's another Mass Effect thing.

[Cedius]

It is a sad thing to see a decision has been made to cancel the expansion. I know a lot of eager fans were waiting for it to come out. I do not know the circumstances to its demise, but I'm sure Hawke's story could've been developed further. (imo) Anyways, I'm glad that Hawke will be at least mentioned in the next game. (from your response)

On another note, What i'd like to see is bring back the RPG feeling like the gearing of your companions, more weapon/armor appearances ( I swear I looted the same kind of garb 4 or 5 different times.)

Also, the monetary system in both DA:O and DA2 were way under shot. I was always scraping the bottom of the barrel on my toons coin purse.

Modifié par Cedius, 20 mars 2012 - 05:44 .

[Imryll]

Indoctrination wrote...

Despite just giving a large rant mostly consisting of accusations of BioWare being out of touch with us, I can sympathize with them on races.

For each race, you'd need new models, new assets to fit those models, new animation to deal with character interactions and heigh differences, and you'd need new voices. Humans don't sound like dwarves, and they don't sound like Dalish elves either. Not anymore. Instead of having two tracks for our voiced protagonist, you'd need six. The protagonist has more lines than anyone else in the game too, so it's a big resource commitment, I think.

There's also the lore issue. If you were paying attention, you'd notice that Thedas is a very racist place. Elves and dwarves have a hard time being taken seriously in human society. Origins got around this problem because your elf or your dwarf was a Grey Warden, a status which was larger than the societal race barriers. It would be difficult to fish up a similar excuse in future games. How can your character negotiate with the local lord for aid in the coming grand battle when his guards see that you're an elf, grab you, and then throw you into the alienage? I feel that in order to do a game with an elf or dwarf protagonist now, you'd have to do a game where the protagonist can only be an elf or only be a dwarf and tell the story completely from that perspective. Unfortunately, I don't think BioWare has the guts to do a game where you're only a dwarf or only an elf.

Of course one of the reasons some of us dislike having a voiced protagonist is that the cost of voice acting is then advanced as an argument in favor of a more pre-defined character ...  "We insist on giving you something you don't want and therefore can't afford to give you the racial choice you do want" isn't exactly a compelling argument.

[Yrkoon]

CarlSpackler wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

The statistics also show that 80% of all gamers never finish any given game that they play, therefore,  Devs shouldn't waste their resources creating decent endings to their games??

That's the logic you're operating under. It's Wrong.

First of all keep in mind I'm not arguing against multiple races I think they're a fantastic idea I'm simply saying I understand why they may not focus dev time here.

Also you're equating the game having an ending and the game containing multiple races to be of equal importance there which is not the case.  EVERY gamer regardless of whether they actually finish the game* or not expects the game to have an ending.  An ending in of itself is a necessary ingredient of a Bioware rpg, multple races are not.
 

You're stating an opinion as fact.  Statistics are statistics.    80% don't finish the games they play, so if developers were to operate under such statistics then good business practice would dictate that they not expend more than  the bare minimum resources neccessary  towards a game's ending.    And you know what?     I find the Journey far more important  than the ending anyway.  


But frankly, I'm getting tired of people Defending developer laziness.  Since we don't get a cut of their profits, there's absolutely NO reason to verbally "understand"  (read: give them a pass) for  cutting corners.  I want multiple races.  And so do you.   So The debate should end there.  period.   And the ball should go to Bioware's  side of the court now.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 20 mars 2012 - 05:47 .

[merrygoround]

Ideally, the largest improvement would be centered around creating a vast, highly intricate world where I could customize my character and my party. 

I would love to see a world that is huge and scary.  A world that humbles my character, not immeidately makes him an epic hero where everyone knows his name.  I want to feel like I earned the right to be a hero.  DA2 did get this idea down pretty decently, and it was part of the story.  I loved the idea of coming into a foreign land and having to work my way up the ranks of nobility, but I felt like it was only implemented when convenient to the story instead of being a naturally blossoming level of fame.  My only suggestion is to maybe implement a Fame/Karma system (somewhat like Ultima Online) that affects interactions with other npcs through out the game.  Speech skills are cool, but often seem unrealistic. 

I want a game that caters to different play styles with a lot of room for customizing.  I can't imagine the difficulty there is in finding a middle ground between having skills and items that matter (that a player will actually use) and having a crap ton of extra skills that are basically pointless, but I would like to see a more evolved game than Dragon Age 2. 

The trend in games right now seems to be widdling down complicated game play to try to appeal to the masses, however, after 2.5 games in a series, you would think a player would be able to grasp slightly more in depth ideas with each sitting rather than making it more idiot friendly.

I keep hearing "Dragon Age 3 needs to be like Skyrim".  I'm here to say that, No! It does not!  I'm sorry, but Skyrim's gameplay is very softcore.  Yes, I would like to see an open world, but I don't think Skyrim necessarily needs to be the source of inspiration.  Ultima Online would probably be better.  I loved UO so much before Trammel was introduced.  The game enthralled me completely.  First sitting down and playing it, I felt like the game was so big and scary, that it just created one of the best gaming experiences of my life.  However, there was a level of naivety that was there from age and the fact that there weren't other games really like it at the time.  But, if I could play a game that made me feel overwhelmed with the possibilties the game had to offer, I would be thrilled.  Too many games nowadays feel obvious, like they don't have any secrets to tell.  but, I'm not entirely sure what that entails.  It's probably a combination of everything.

I would, however, like to see a Creation Kit (or Toolset... whatever you want to call it) for Dragon Age 3. It could help keep the world evolving like it does for Skyrim.

I like the characters in Dragon Age 2, and if I could (somewhat easily) create quests for them, then I would of been thrilled.  I'm an amateur artist and 3d modeller, and it would be cool to be able to create content for a future Dragon Age game.  I love character quests that affect the relationships between the characters, and I am always upset when there isn't enough development in that category.  As a gay gamer and a sappy, romantic type of person, I like the stories and the romance invovled.  It really makes me happy that Bioware is creating games where I can play a gay character.  In roleplaying, you play as characters that are different from you, but most the time you play a character that you'd like to think as the best of you, and allowing gay characters and romantic storylines, I can do that.  It really means a lot to me. 

I liked Dragon Age 2, but I did get a little tired at times of the same settings being reused over and over.  There's a difference between Quests and Errands, and I felt a lot of times like I was going to the store because I was out of milk, rather than going on a perilous journey filled with excitement.  Perhaps one of the only things that made the game feel bigger was the passage of time.  I did really like how the game spanned over years of time.

Well, I feel like I typed a lot without saying very much that's useful, but no matter what I look forward to Dragon Age 3.  And, I only hope it becomes larger and more indepth than it's previous installments.  Please don't water it down.  I'm not a hardcore gamer.  In the past year, I've played Super Mario Galaxy 1&2, half of Xenoblade Chronicles, Most of the Starcraft II campaign, some of Mass Effect 2, some of Skyrim, and completed Dragon Age 2.  So, if I'm perfectly ready to handle a more complicated game, I don't see why other gamers can't handle it either.


Some additional stuff to add after reading some comments:

1. I would like the top view back, and to be able to scroll away fro mthe party.  DA2 camera was not very helpful in planning my attacks.
2. I don't need a clear cut, over-arcing villain, but at the same time, I don't want the last villain to seem like a mini-boss.
3. I really want to see where Morrigan has been all this time. I want to go into the portal, I want to find the child.  I know that is a story that might not be open for everyone depending on the decisions they made, but if there was any way of making that happen, it would be awesome.
4. Maybe Bioware should make Ultima Online 2 (and model it off the ideas UO started with before trammel made the game terrible)

Modifié par merrygoround, 21 mars 2012 - 04:47 .

[Indoctrination]

Imryll wrote...

Of course one of the reasons some of us dislike having a voiced protagonist is that the cost of voice acting is then advanced as an argument in favor of a more pre-defined character ...  "We insist on giving you something you don't want and therefore can't afford to give you the racial choice you do want" isn't exactly a compelling argument.

There's still the lore issue though. Unless you're being recruited into the Wardens again in DA3, to make multiple races work, the writers would probably have to retcon the entire structure of societies in Thedas so that suddenly, without reason, everyone is tolerant of everyone else. For elves especially, there is next to no social mobility in society outside of Qunari lands, as far as I know.

Modifié par Indoctrination, 20 mars 2012 - 05:49 .

[the_one_54321]

Korusus wrote...
who asked for "iconic companions"?  I don't remember there being thread after thread begging for iconic, unique looking companions.

I remember the threads, and I was one of the people that asked for them. But since they didn't take the time to take those individual looks and also remove the floating weapons and such, it didn't come across incredibly well. My main concerns, so far as customization goes, is the numbers. Stats, weapons, armor, items, and how they affect the characteristics of combat and other interactions. I'm not interested in dressing up the characters.

[Lupus Canivus]

People they are not listrening, look at what they done to ME3. The DA3 is coming out this year. I have seen this annonsed on two sites already were you can pre-order. This is all a con like all their other promises.

[Thor Rand Al]

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

Mark Darrah wrote...

Sorry, let me clarify:
This would allow us to have greater numbers of armor, clothing etc...

Did somebody say mage pants?  Because I could have sworn I heard mage pants. 

Mage pants.

Ok this one I so got to agree with on the pants, I love playing a mage Hawke n most of my pt's are with a male, I do have issues with putting my male in a robe.  To me those are more or less for the fems which btw my women mages don't wear cause honestly some of the robes look horrible, (sorry, no offense meant)  or that to me robes symbolize something you'd wear lounging around at home in lol.  Yes mods have helped me get thru this prob I have with the robe issue lol.  But at least a pair of pants or 2 for our mages might be nice LOL

[Cedius]

Relshar wrote...

Darji wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Mark Darrah wrote...
If the story demands a human-only (or dwarf, elf, or qunari only for that matter) than we would do that.

An advantage of a single player race is that it allows us to offer a lot more customization options. Customization is definately a place we want to focus.

So you limit customization for the sake of greater customization? 

I think you guys might have forgotten what that word means.

the whole problem is that Bioware has forgotten what the word RPG means or better meant for them back than.

So we are going to get to play one race in DA3?
You have just lost my order.

Really? Just because you are forced to play one race, you have made a decision not to buy it?  See you in game. 

*oh wait, the MMO forums are this way ------>*

[monima]

Imryll wrote...

Indoctrination wrote...

Despite just giving a large rant mostly consisting of accusations of BioWare being out of touch with us, I can sympathize with them on races.

For each race, you'd need new models, new assets to fit those models, new animation to deal with character interactions and heigh differences, and you'd need new voices. Humans don't sound like dwarves, and they don't sound like Dalish elves either. Not anymore. Instead of having two tracks for our voiced protagonist, you'd need six. The protagonist has more lines than anyone else in the game too, so it's a big resource commitment, I think.

There's also the lore issue. If you were paying attention, you'd notice that Thedas is a very racist place. Elves and dwarves have a hard time being taken seriously in human society. Origins got around this problem because your elf or your dwarf was a Grey Warden, a status which was larger than the societal race barriers. It would be difficult to fish up a similar excuse in future games. How can your character negotiate with the local lord for aid in the coming grand battle when his guards see that you're an elf, grab you, and then throw you into the alienage? I feel that in order to do a game with an elf or dwarf protagonist now, you'd have to do a game where the protagonist can only be an elf or only be a dwarf and tell the story completely from that perspective. Unfortunately, I don't think BioWare has the guts to do a game where you're only a dwarf or only an elf.

Of course one of the reasons some of us dislike having a voiced protagonist is that the cost of voice acting is then advanced as an argument in favor of a more pre-defined character ...  "We insist on giving you something you don't want and therefore can't afford to give you the racial choice you do want" isn't exactly a compelling argument.

I prefer no voice, more races and dialogue options. I see some people want both, I just dont think its realistic

[BubbleDncr]

Imryll wrote...

Indoctrination wrote...

Despite just giving a large rant mostly consisting of accusations of BioWare being out of touch with us, I can sympathize with them on races.

For each race, you'd need new models, new assets to fit those models, new animation to deal with character interactions and heigh differences, and you'd need new voices. Humans don't sound like dwarves, and they don't sound like Dalish elves either. Not anymore. Instead of having two tracks for our voiced protagonist, you'd need six. The protagonist has more lines than anyone else in the game too, so it's a big resource commitment, I think.

There's also the lore issue. If you were paying attention, you'd notice that Thedas is a very racist place. Elves and dwarves have a hard time being taken seriously in human society. Origins got around this problem because your elf or your dwarf was a Grey Warden, a status which was larger than the societal race barriers. It would be difficult to fish up a similar excuse in future games. How can your character negotiate with the local lord for aid in the coming grand battle when his guards see that you're an elf, grab you, and then throw you into the alienage? I feel that in order to do a game with an elf or dwarf protagonist now, you'd have to do a game where the protagonist can only be an elf or only be a dwarf and tell the story completely from that perspective. Unfortunately, I don't think BioWare has the guts to do a game where you're only a dwarf or only an elf.

Of course one of the reasons some of us dislike having a voiced protagonist is that the cost of voice acting is then advanced as an argument in favor of a more pre-defined character ...  "We insist on giving you something you don't want and therefore can't afford to give you the racial choice you do want" isn't exactly a compelling argument.

I think some people really want a voiced protagonist, some people really don't, and then some people just want a good game - which you can get from either pathway.

I've usually been in the camp where I can go either way, but go on youtube and compare Alistair's romance scenes from Origins with Kaiden's from ME3. Even though Alistair is way cooler thean Kaiden, there's a special feeling to femshep's scenes Kaiden's that isn't there with Alistair - and its all due to femshep having a voice .

Modifié par BubbleDncr, 20 mars 2012 - 05:51 .

[Korusus]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Korusus wrote...
who asked for "iconic companions"?  I don't remember there being thread after thread begging for iconic, unique looking companions.

I remember the threads, and I was one of the people that asked for them. But since they didn't take the time to take those individual looks and also remove the floating weapons and such, it didn't come across incredibly well. My main concerns, so far as customization goes, is the numbers. Stats, weapons, armor, items, and how they affect the characteristics of combat and other interactions. I'm not interested in dressing up the characters.

I only care about the numbers as well, which is why if I want to take the armor I had on and give it to my offtank companion because I've found an upgrade...then I should be able to do that.  And if that companion has that armor on then they should have that armor on...not a tweed jacket and bunny slippers.

DA:O lets you equip companions however you want, SWTOR lets you equip humanoid companions however you want, KotOR lets you equip companions however you want, BG2 lets you equip human companions however you want...the only game that doesn't is Mass Effect and that somehow made its way into DA2 and for some inexplicable reason is here to stay now.

Modifié par Korusus, 20 mars 2012 - 05:54 .

[Persephone]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Brockololly wrote...
Same thing with maybe meeting Morrigan again in DA3

For the love of God, I do not want Morrigan back. I have absolutely no faith in Bioware after ME2, DA2, ToR and ME3, to write her well. At all.

I'd much rather have Morrigan be forgotten completely rather than have her be back, but written in a bad fashion and / or in an atrocious story and plot.  

Well, no offense, Knight, after reading that, I am glad that that is not your decision. Nor will it ever be.

[Alain Baxter]

waouh wrote...
eh merde je ne comprend rien lol

Ha! Je peux parler un peut, mais mon 'franglais' est terrible.
Qu'est ce qu'ont dit c'est que on est finis avec Dragon Age II et on va travailler sur un autre project dans la famille de Dragon Age. On parles avec vous dans les forums et en veut savoir quoi que tous aimes / n'aimes pas avec DA:O et DAII. Si tu as des chose a dire, dites-les!

phew!

[Sorry for gramatically destroying the french language... my mother would _not_ be proud...]

[Sylvius the Mad]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...
Yes, you did miss something. You missed the blatantly inaccurate stereotyping that these two are engaging in. Obviously, nothing about DAII looked even vaguely like what is stereotypically thought of as a Japanese game.

Except for the giant swords.  You forgot the giant swords.

That's hardly a "Japanese" thing, at this point. Didn't you just play Kingdoms of Amalur-or-whaterver?

That everyone uses them doesn't stop them from being associated with JRPGs.  The Buster Sword basically guarantees that association for all time.

I don't play action games, so I'm not familiar with trends within the action game genre.  If I see something that I've only seen before in JRPGs, I'm going to think of JRPGs, regardless of how prevalent they might now be in action games.

DA2's over-the-top combat animations also have a very anime quality to them, which I think people associate (incorrectly) with JRPGs.

I'm not at all surprised people look at DA2 and see Japanese influences.

[WardenWade]

Korusus wrote...

CarlSpackler wrote...

Korusus wrote...

Mark Darrah wrote...

An advantage of a single player race is that it allows us to offer a lot more customization options. Customization is definately a place we want to focus.

Mark, surely you see that the fans want multiple races.  I don't understand what the point of having a dialogue with you guys is if you're bound and determined to repeat the mistakes of the past anyway.  

For all your talk of wanting to listen to feedback, you guys sure seem to have already made your minds up about a lot of things (voiced protag, dialogue wheel, single race).  It's not looking good so far.

While as a rule roleplaying fans want multiple races, the statistics prove that most people play a human.  That was confirmed by the achievment/trophy tracking that happened with DAO.  The # of folks who completed the human noble without completing any of the others was something like 80% if I remember correctly.*  So while I think everyone can agree that multiple races with varying scenes/dialogue to represent those races is a good thing, it is addmitedly difficult to want to spend a lot of time developing and catering to what amounts to the minority.  And that does not take into account the remaning 20% who also played and completed a human noble origin meaning that if you have a human only character you will still please somewhere around 90% of your market -at least to a satisfactory.

* I could of course be way off on those statistics but I seem to remember and interview with Preistly or one of the other devs talking about this.  I can only promise you that I am not utterly making this this up and recall something to this effect.

That's why DA2 had a lot of the problems it had.  It was designed by focus group and statistics.  Not allowing for multiple races and railroading the player into a predefined character is part of what was wrong with DA2.  DA will never be Mass Effect.  They have to stop trying to do that.  The more they start taking away options, the more the game slilps into this railroading mindset.  So yes, while 80% of the players may never use the elf character option, the fact that it's there is indicative of BioWare's mindset and the freedom and options the game allows.

It's worth the effort in my opinion (and you don't even have to have the origins which I suspect) 

I agree.  Speaking as someone who only plays non-humans in Origins, I believe multiple races are worth the effort as well.  Per Mr. Darrah's earlier comment on the story dictating the playable race (and that the story could even dictate a non-human only PC), that certainly is a consideration as well. 

However, I believe the freedom you mention, Korusus, is vitally important to the franchise.  The world Bioware is exploring in DA is one populated by many races, equally valid and with unique perspectives on the current situation.  I truly do hope, as I have said previously, that Bioware's plan for DA3 can in fact accomodate these different peoples as playable in one game, even living together as uneasily as they do.  Please don't take the so-called "easy" route.  Please do make the effort.

Modifié par WardenWade, 20 mars 2012 - 06:26 .

[Imryll]

Indoctrination wrote...

There's still the lore issue though. Unless you're being recruited into the Wardens again in DA3, to make multiple races work, the writers would probably have to retcon the entire structure of societies in Thedas so that suddenly, without reason, everyone is tolerant of everyone else. For elves especially, there is next to no social mobility in society outside of Qunari lands, as far as I know.

I'm playing a hero who can't overcome garden variety prejudice? A bit of pushback because you're an elf or dwarf would be rewarding to RP.

[Teddie Sage]

Alain Baxter wrote...

waouh wrote...
eh merde je ne comprend rien lol

Ha! Je peux parler un peut, mais mon 'franglais' est terrible.
Qu'est ce qu'ont dit c'est que on est finis avec Dragon Age II et on va travailler sur un autre project dans la famille de Dragon Age. On parles avec vous dans les forums et en veut savoir quoi que tous aimes / n'aimes pas avec DA:O et DAII. Si tu as des chose a dire, dites-les!

phew!

[Sorry for gramatically destroying the french language... my mother would _not_ be proud...]

I could always serve as a BETA-translator. Since I'm canadian french first. XD

But yeah, "whaou"...

French/Français: l'équipe est en train de travailler sur Dragon Age III ou quelque chose comme ça. Ils ont laissé tombé la deuxième partie de l'histoire avec Hawke qui était "Exalted March" pour se concentrer sur le nouveau volet de la série. Si t'as besoin d'un peu plus d'informations, demande. XD

Modifié par Teddie Sage, 20 mars 2012 - 05:59 .

[Cedius]

Yrkoon wrote...

CarlSpackler wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

The statistics also show that 80% of all gamers never finish any given game that they play, therefore,  Devs shouldn't waste their resources creating decent endings to their games??

That's the logic you're operating under. It's Wrong.

First of all keep in mind I'm not arguing against multiple races I think they're a fantastic idea I'm simply saying I understand why they may not focus dev time here.

Also you're equating the game having an ending and the game containing multiple races to be of equal importance there which is not the case.  EVERY gamer regardless of whether they actually finish the game* or not expects the game to have an ending.  An ending in of itself is a necessary ingredient of a Bioware rpg, multple races are not.
 

You're stating an opinion as fact.  Statistics are statistics.    80% don't finish the games they play, so if developers were to operate under such statistics then good business practice would dictate that they not expend more than  the bare minimum resources neccessary  towards a game's ending.    And you know what?     I find the Journey far more important  than the ending anyway.  


But frankly, I'm getting tired of people Defending developer laziness.  Since we don't get a cut of their profits, there's absolutely NO reason to verbally "understand"  (read: give them a pass) for  cutting corners.  I want multiple races.  And so do you.   So The debate should end there.  period.   And the ball should go to Bioware's  side of the court now.

No.  Here is why the Devs cut corners and quite frankly I don't blame them.  It's a no win situation.  Lose/Lose either way.  People whine when they take their time with a game and the game gets delayed or the devs announce a date in the future.  The forums rage and people whine about how they want "their" game now.

On the flip side, when a game gets released that needed a few more months/years to develope(in this case) the same people rage and complain.  There's no winning the war, you either wait patiently for a well developed game that takes time to complete, or you suffer the consequences of being shortened certain variables. ()in this case, no playable race variation)

[Survalli]

can we have a happily ever after ending?

[Kavatica]

Thor Rand Al wrote...

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

Mark Darrah wrote...

Sorry, let me clarify:
This would allow us to have greater numbers of armor, clothing etc...

Did somebody say mage pants?  Because I could have sworn I heard mage pants. 

Mage pants.

Ok this one I so got to agree with on the pants, I love playing a mage Hawke n most of my pt's are with a male, I do have issues with putting my male in a robe.  To me those are more or less for the fems which btw my women mages don't wear cause honestly some of the robes look horrible, (sorry, no offense meant)  or that to me robes symbolize something you'd wear lounging around at home in lol.  Yes mods have helped me get thru this prob I have with the robe issue lol.  But at least a pair of pants or 2 for our mages might be nice LOL

You take away the mage robes, you take away all of the amazing jokes about humans in skirts and quick trysts in the corner.