2816 réponses à ce sujet

[Thor Rand Al]

Cryocore wrote...

Mark Darrah wrote...



Maybe I should just put a stop to something right
now.

We ARE NOT going to:

* Burn DA2 to the ground

* Pretend it doesn't exists

* etc...

I am proud of what DA2 accomplished in several
areas. It is certainly not without flaws.

We have things to learn from BOTH Dragon Age gamesas well as other titles.

Starting your post by telling me to ignore the hard work of over a hundred people is NOT a good way to start a dialogue with
me.

This attitude it what scares me, it almost invalidates your initial comments. A lot of people hated DAII and loved DA:O so therefore is it not a valid request to ignore a game loathed by that person. Yes hundreds of people worked hard on that game, and I am sure were proud of the end result. THOUSANDS hated it. Our opinion is just as valid as the hundreds who made it.

I respect that you defend the game, and there were a few positive aspects but look at what your fans are saying. Look at the resulting loss of sales due to the direction DAII took. Look at the ongoing animosity and resentment due to that game. Don't let pride or ego or whatever blind you to the simple fact that DAII was the single worst RPG BioWare has ever made in terms of quality and commercial success. Look at DA:O very successful, and enjoyed (still) by the vast majority of your fans.

Whoever made the decision to change direction with DAII made a HUGE mistake and in my opinion needs to look at the great games from BioWare's catalogue and see that the one thing they all have in common is deep, and complex customization for the protag and all party NPCs, tactical and strategic combat, a rich 'epic' story, a meaningful and robust conversation mechanic (with multiple options), an open world(s) you are free to explore.

In short telling us that asking your team to ignore DAII or its numerous failings/shortcomings is telling us
that our opinion doesnt matter because its in opposition to yours.
As I said that attitude scares me... as nothing important will change and more fans hoping for a return to the
glory days of BioWare (like myself) will just stop caring.

I've been a fan since Baldur's
Gate. I own(ed) every game. DAII is the only one I hated... and I mean hated. DA:O I adored.

You wanted an open dialogue,well you've got it. Don't discount an opinion because you don't like it.   In my
honest opinion DAII was appalling and the only thing that can learned from it is that it is NOT how you make a Dragon Age title.

Here's the thing though, NOT everyone hated DA2.  Their are some issues but it's not hateable by everyone.  For everyone that wants DA2 trashed like it never existed there are also those that loved the game.  2 sides of the coin and the fact that Bioware is considering taking things from both games makes people like me happy because I loved both games, just prefered 2 better. 
But the point is there are people that liked DA2 so by saying trash DA2 ur saying our opinions n feelings don't matter because according to you the game was garbage.  NOT SO.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Mark Darrah wrote...

CrustyBot wrote...

Guess my dialog compass idea went unanswered/ignored. Pity, but I guess it won't hurt to keep posting it.

Compass idea is interesting.
We will be looking at additional options and posibilities in this space.
The compass (at least as you present it here) has some issues on the consoles where screen real estate is at a premium.
That is not to say they have to be the same.

Thanks for the response.

In regards to the real estate issue, I believe it's partly caused by where on the screen the dialog options are put: at the bottom, out of the way, etc.

I believe you could raise the position of the dialog options UI higher with a distinct bar, similar to what games such as Alpha Protocol did. Even if the result is that some of the cinematic scene is obscured by the UI, despite the entire point of placing the UI at the bottom of the screen being so that it wouldn't look unintrusive.

This has the intended benefit of forcing the player to focus on the dialog options (closer to the centre of the screen, making it easier to write with smaller fonts) and the unintended benefit of taking away the focus from the cinematic, which often pauses while you're choosing dialog -- you won't have to look at your character dribble and stare blankly while (s)he waits for you to pick a dialog choice.

Any thoughts regarding my other feedback (Multiple Solutions, Gameplay is Important to Storytelling)?

Modifié par CrustyBot, 20 mars 2012 - 10:11 .

[HiroVoid]

Mark Darrah wrote...

CrustyBot wrote...

Guess my dialog compass idea went unanswered/ignored. Pity, but I guess it won't hurt to keep posting it.

Compass idea is interesting.
We will be looking at additional options and posibilities in this space.
The compass (at least as you present it here) has some issues on the consoles where screen real estate is at a premium.
That is not to say they have to be the same.

Hmm....I'm glad you took notice of this since one of my biggest problems with the dialogue wheel is that it feels like it always limits the character to three options most of the times.  I just didn't think it was that possible of an option due to a limit of voice acting with the protagonist.

[Arppis]

artsangel wrote...

This is kinda crazy, but you know what I'd like? The ability to choose your PC's emotions during cutscenes. I don't mean with a dialog wheel or anything like that, but imagine something Little Big Planet style, where you could use the arrows during an otherwise non-interactive scene to change your character's expression with (sad, happy, angry, worried). There would be a preset expression for the scene otherwise, but you could have the option to pick something that better suited the character you were roleplaying. Imaging being able to choose whether to be angry or sad at your mother's death, or to frown disapprovingly when Isabela invites you back to her room.

This would be funny to mess around with too. To have impropriate emotions in some scenes.

[soren4ever]

soren4ever wrote...

Could you all think about implementing new weapon styles and specializations for each class:

Warrior-Archers (equip Crossbows)
Rogue-Duelists (equip Dueling/Fencing Blades/Swords) (Think Muskateers)
Mage-Arcane Warrior (can equip any Bladed Weapon [swords, daggers, etc.] possibly new "Spell Blades")

Just want to make sure this doesn't get buried and forgotten too quickly, before an opinion is given. 

Modifié par soren4ever, 20 mars 2012 - 10:10 .

[Darji]

Arppis wrote...

Darji wrote...

Arppis wrote...

Then you should have tried playing the first game on 360. It was pretty annoying, to put it mildly. You know when you can't move your characters away from AOE effects because there is no "move here" button, it's annoying and interupts with the game.

DA2 FIXED THIS.

We finaly had a command to make characters move to the spots we desired, without having to manualy move them there. The game is doable, no doubt with higher difficulties, but it's not FUN to play when controls and your own team mates are fighting against you the whole way in.

Even when you put them to move away from AoE it didn't always work and they took unneccesary damage. So the 360 version atleast was pretty cripled.

Thatit was bad control design. But DA2 was anything but not tactical at all.  Again they need to decide what direction they want. And they needf to tell us very early.

It was bad design, no doubt about that.

Every time they fix controls to be fluid and good, I'll rise difficulty a notch. This has been the case with ME1 and ME2 also. ME2 had pretty great controls, so I raised the difficulty up quite a bit.

Sometimes game is more easier when the controls are great. Controls should't be the enemy we fight against, it should be something that's there to convey our decissions precisely as possible.

Controls and the gameplay are actualy the things that are top priority for me in games. They are very important to me. But if game has great story and controls that don't do the job, I'll just switch it to easy and play trough it like that.

Yes they should not be the enemy same goes for a overview camera it should be included in every party based tactical RPG.  And again ME was just a shooter mechanicwise.  it never was tactical or strategical it was just a normal cover based shooter.

[Arppis]

CrustyBot wrote...

Mark Darrah wrote...

CrustyBot wrote...

Guess my dialog compass idea went unanswered/ignored. Pity, but I guess it won't hurt to keep posting it.

Compass idea is interesting.
We will be looking at additional options and posibilities in this space.
The compass (at least as you present it here) has some issues on the consoles where screen real estate is at a premium.
That is not to say they have to be the same.

Thanks for the response.

In regards to the real estate issue, I believe it's partly caused by where on the screen the dialog options are put: at the bottom, out of the way, etc.

I believe you could raise the position of the dialog options UI higher with a distinct bar, similar to what games such as Alpha Protocol did. Even if the result is that some of the cinematic scene is obscured by the UI, despite the entire point of placing the UI at the bottom of the screen being so that it wouldn't look unintrusive.

This has the intended benefit of forcing the player to focus on the dialog options (closer to the centre of the screen, making it easier to write with smaller fonts) and the unintended benefit of taking away the focus from the cinematic, which often pauses while you're choosing dialog -- you won't have to look at your character dribble and look blankly while (s)he waits for you to pick a dialog choice.

Or do what Deus Ex HR did.

They basicaly had the wheel too, with few words. But there was small box under the wheel that basicaly gave first few lines of the reply. But here it could give small description. Would take less space I guess.

[darth gringo]

Not sure if it has been addressed in this forum (probably, but I'm gonna say something anyway), but AI controlled AOE attacks can be frustrating, especially under the nightmare difficulty setting. I usually remove these abilities from a companions tactics because of the "friendly fire". As a player, say with a AOE radius, I'll try and place the outer rim against a few enemies (just enough to hit them without hitting my party), and sling. Companion AI agents can detect hostiles, why not companion proximity to an AOE?

[Sylvianus]

Darji wrote...

Sylvianus wrote...

Fast Jimmy wrote...

I honestly don't envy the guys at Bioware the job of making DA3. Its going to be an uphill battle all the way through

I am reading this topic, and I can already see that people don't agree on anything except maybe the wheel and some other stuff. It will be worse when we'll see the first results.

For example : Do we keep DA2's artsyle ? Do we keep the gameplay combat like DAO or DA2 ? In these areas, no way we can agree.

This is just the beginning XD

Exactly thats why they need to decide on a direction. If MArk and co do not want to admit that DA2 was terrible becasue they are emotional connected to this game becasue they put alot of work in it. Thats fine.

But than please dont tell anyone here that you want to have suggestions and than only choose the suggestions that do not "hurt" the quality of DA2.

Just try to talk like normal people.....

Yeah, they need some decisions, whether we like it or not... It would be nice to know what they have already decided... Suggestions are made for months, it is sure they have already some ideas. I know that if they keep the same artstyle, I'm done with dragon age. This the only critical point for me.  That's why, I would like they tell us now what they have already decided.

[Darji]

Thor Rand Al wrote...

Cryocore wrote...

Mark Darrah wrote...



Maybe I should just put a stop to something right
now.

We ARE NOT going to:

* Burn DA2 to the ground

* Pretend it doesn't exists

* etc...

I am proud of what DA2 accomplished in several
areas. It is certainly not without flaws.

We have things to learn from BOTH Dragon Age gamesas well as other titles.

Starting your post by telling me to ignore the hard work of over a hundred people is NOT a good way to start a dialogue with
me.

This attitude it what scares me, it almost invalidates your initial comments. A lot of people hated DAII and loved DA:O so therefore is it not a valid request to ignore a game loathed by that person. Yes hundreds of people worked hard on that game, and I am sure were proud of the end result. THOUSANDS hated it. Our opinion is just as valid as the hundreds who made it.

I respect that you defend the game, and there were a few positive aspects but look at what your fans are saying. Look at the resulting loss of sales due to the direction DAII took. Look at the ongoing animosity and resentment due to that game. Don't let pride or ego or whatever blind you to the simple fact that DAII was the single worst RPG BioWare has ever made in terms of quality and commercial success. Look at DA:O very successful, and enjoyed (still) by the vast majority of your fans.

Whoever made the decision to change direction with DAII made a HUGE mistake and in my opinion needs to look at the great games from BioWare's catalogue and see that the one thing they all have in common is deep, and complex customization for the protag and all party NPCs, tactical and strategic combat, a rich 'epic' story, a meaningful and robust conversation mechanic (with multiple options), an open world(s) you are free to explore.

In short telling us that asking your team to ignore DAII or its numerous failings/shortcomings is telling us
that our opinion doesnt matter because its in opposition to yours.
As I said that attitude scares me... as nothing important will change and more fans hoping for a return to the
glory days of BioWare (like myself) will just stop caring.

I've been a fan since Baldur's
Gate. I own(ed) every game. DAII is the only one I hated... and I mean hated. DA:O I adored.

You wanted an open dialogue,well you've got it. Don't discount an opinion because you don't like it.   In my
honest opinion DAII was appalling and the only thing that can learned from it is that it is NOT how you make a Dragon Age title.

Here's the thing though, NOT everyone hated DA2.  Their are some issues but it's not hateable by everyone.  For everyone that wants DA2 trashed like it never existed there are also those that loved the game.  2 sides of the coin and the fact that Bioware is considering taking things from both games makes people like me happy because I loved both games, just prefered 2 better. 
But the point is there are people that liked DA2 so by saying trash DA2 ur saying our opinions n feelings don't matter because according to you the game was garbage.  NOT SO.

Again...

They just need to decide which direction they want to go. The tactical and complex RPG origins or the more streamlined action oriented DA2.  Decide on one audience and than go straight for it instead of making compromises. These core RPG players that loved origins wont make compromises.  So if you try to please everyone you just can lose.

[Arppis]

Darji wrote...

Yes they should not be the enemy same goes for a overview camera it should be included in every party based tactical RPG.  And again ME was just a shooter mechanicwise.  it never was tactical or strategical it was just a normal cover based shooter.

Mass Effect gameplay has strategy too.

But sure, it's easy in the Normal and even Hardcore difficulty. But those games are great examples of what I ment. They envolved to better direction gameplay wise part by part. I don't see why DA wouldn't be able to do the same. Even if it would mean having more RTS-styled combat, just as long the controls work.

[Insaner Robot]

For the most part I enjoyed DA II, but I do hope the are of the nex game will be increased to the entirety of a nation again.
Also perhaps a liitle more time focusing on the origin of the character you play.

e.g.
Seeing breifly a little of Hawkes life in Lothering before they flee the blight, or for the warrior class, Hawke and Carver arrive in Lothering and attempt to raise the alarm before collecting their mother and sister.

It could have added only an extra 5-10 minutes gameplay but might have added to the feeling of running from the blight.

A for dialogue in the next game, instead of text cluttering the gui, perhaps if the pointer is hovered over the selection for a few seconds the first sentence of the line could actually be heard. This could convey tone and meaning and since the line would exist anyway would already be in the game assets. It could even be a toggle in the options screen, something like dialogue preview and a check box.

[Darji]

Arppis wrote...

Darji wrote...

Yes they should not be the enemy same goes for a overview camera it should be included in every party based tactical RPG.  And again ME was just a shooter mechanicwise.  it never was tactical or strategical it was just a normal cover based shooter.

Mass Effect gameplay has strategy too.

But sure, it's easy in the Normal and even Hardcore difficulty. But those games are great examples of what I ment. They envolved to better direction gameplay wise part by part. I don't see why DA wouldn't be able to do the same. Even if it would mean having more RTS-styled combat, just as long the controls work.

They work becasue these games are simplified and more action oriented.......
Something that Origins not was.

And for RTS combat: Name me one  RTS game with woth good controller controlsr. There is none!!!!!!

Modifié par Darji, 20 mars 2012 - 10:17 .

[Arppis]

darth ****** wrote...

Not sure if it has been addressed in this forum (probably, but I'm gonna say something anyway), but AI controlled AOE attacks can be frustrating, especially under the nightmare difficulty setting. I usually remove these abilities from a companions tactics because of the "friendly fire". As a player, say with a AOE radius, I'll try and place the outer rim against a few enemies (just enough to hit them without hitting my party), and sling. Companion AI agents can detect hostiles, why not companion proximity to an AOE?

Yeah... recepie for destruction right there!

By the way, that's one of the things I really liked about DA-series, the way you can modify the AI-behauvior. It's a cool feature.

[Realmzmaster]

Darji wrote...

Darth Krytie wrote...

Darji wrote...

Mark Darrah wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

Mark Darrah wrote...

jlb524 wrote...

I don't know if this has been discussed.

So...can I play as an elf?

Is this even on the table or will it be human-only again?

If the story demands a human-only (or dwarf, elf, or qunari only for that matter) than we would do that.

An advantage of a single player race is that it allows us to offer a lot more customization options. Customization is definately a place we want to focus.

What?  Can you elaborate here?  How, exactly, does removing the ability to choose from difference races increase customization options?  Doesn't basic logic dictate the complete opposite?

Sorry, let me clarify:
This would allow us to have greater numbers of armor, clothing etc...

This does not make much sense. Is it really that time consuming to make the same armor a human  can wear for an elve?

It's not so much time consuming as resource consuming.

It is the same armor... How is this possible? No one asked for reace specific armor for every possible armor.   a leather armor is still a leather armor. It does not matter much if its worn by a n elve or a human.

You have different body types which means that the armor has to be re deigned to fit each body type. If you have three different races and two sexes that means that that each piece of armor has to be redesigned at least six times to fit the body shape. Imagine finding a suit of magical armor that only fits humans and not elves or dwarfs and the one party member who needs armor is the elf or dwarf. That is what is by resource consuming.

If you would notice in DAO most of the humans have the same body build. So do the elves and dwarfs. Whereas in real life most people have different body builds. Which is why many tall or heavy set people get clothes custom made or altered to fit them.

[Arppis]

Darji wrote...

Arppis wrote...

Darji wrote...

Yes they should not be the enemy same goes for a overview camera it should be included in every party based tactical RPG.  And again ME was just a shooter mechanicwise.  it never was tactical or strategical it was just a normal cover based shooter.

Mass Effect gameplay has strategy too.

But sure, it's easy in the Normal and even Hardcore difficulty. But those games are great examples of what I ment. They envolved to better direction gameplay wise part by part. I don't see why DA wouldn't be able to do the same. Even if it would mean having more RTS-styled combat, just as long the controls work.

They work becasue these games are simplified and more action oriented.......
Something that Origins not was.

And for RTS combat: Name me one good RTS game with a controller. There is none!!!!!!

DA2 worked pretty well.

[Realmzmaster]

Darji wrote...

Arppis wrote...

Darji wrote...

It is the same armor... How is this possible? No one asked for reace specific armor for every possible armor.   a leather armor is still a leather armor. It does not matter much if its worn by a n elve or a human.

Not the same body type. Elves are shorter if I recall.

And what if I want to make a short human? This does not make any sense at all....

For example: How does Bethesda do it with all these armors they have? Do they each armor for every race and every height and weigt combination that is possible? I dont really think so. 

Bethesda uses the same body build depending on race. Another reason why it took five years to develop Skyrim. All those different armor types had to be designed for each race and build.

[Wulfram]

I think length of dungeons is one thing where a happy medium between DA:O and DA2 could be found. DA:O had more long dungeons than were necessary. DA2 could have done with some more extended ones mixed in there.

[DAYtheELF]

Parahexavoctal wrote...

Deviija wrote...

-Keep all LIs as bisexual options,
offering more player choice to everyone rather than being exclusive
content only some people will play with certain PCs. More freedom =
more roleplaying.

I agree with pretty much everything
you said except this (and the voiced protagonist - it doesn't bother me
overmuch). Sexuality is part of a person's character - they should have a
preference whether they show it or not. Making everyone bisexual for
the sake of "equal roleplaying options" cheapens the characters and is
demeaning, in my opinion.

On the subject of romances, I'd like to see a character that is strictly gay.

I actually prefer to have it be flexible. Have al LIs available regardless of protagonist gender, but adapt the story and background to choices made.

For example, MaleCompanionLI in a game with a male protagonist is an LI option; if protagonist expresses interest in guys early on, MaleCompanionLI might play out like a gay (not bi) character whom protagonist may or may not hook up with. If protagonist doesn't express interest in guys, MaleCompanionLI might play out as a completely hetero character.

The point is that as long as we don't know their stories beforehand and their stories remain consistent for every playthrough in isolation without metagaming, they can come off as believable whole characters and maybe even avoid this whole sensation of everyone being interested in the protagonist.

But when it comes down to it, if the choice is between always bisexual (or protagonist-sexual like in DA2) or fixed sexualities like DA:O and ME, I hands down vote for the freedom of having as much choice of LI as possible (that being bi/protagonist-sexual).

I prefer fixed as it is more true to life.  My warden tried so so so hard to get down Morrigan's pants (including doing something bad to Wynne) until about halfway through the game when she/ I finally realized that Morrigan was straight.  It made the game more realistic, cuz come on hasn't that happened to most of us in some way, shape or form at some time?  Although in an ideal world everyone would be bi, that just isnt how it works and it did seem a little odd.

However, I do like the idea of characters that are say 90% straight or gay, but if you make the right choices they could eventually be romanced.  I know people who identify as gay, but have been in a long-term heterosexual relationships because they found "that one person".   A mix of total gay, total straight, total bi, and flexibles would be so cool!

Sexuality is a spectrum, and I would prefer for the game to reflect that.  And if that means I cannot romance my favorite person, or makes me decide not to romance anyone because I don't like my choices?  Well, that's the nature of the beast.  It makes our characters and NPCs have more depth, history, and emotion IMHO. <3

[suemaw]

I've been a long time fan since playing Jade Emp. I loved both DA and DA2. I enjoyed exploring outdoor areas and ruins, found there wasn't enough in DA 2. And Lore, you guys have created such an incredible world of secrets and mysteries, let us find some truths (not all though lol)

And I demand the return of the Mabari! I must have a faithful war hound.

And MUST HAVE ONE: happy fuzzy feel good into the sunset with my LI ENDING!!!!

[Darji]

Arppis wrote...

Darji wrote...

Arppis wrote...

Darji wrote...

Yes they should not be the enemy same goes for a overview camera it should be included in every party based tactical RPG.  And again ME was just a shooter mechanicwise.  it never was tactical or strategical it was just a normal cover based shooter.

Mass Effect gameplay has strategy too.

But sure, it's easy in the Normal and even Hardcore difficulty. But those games are great examples of what I ment. They envolved to better direction gameplay wise part by part. I don't see why DA wouldn't be able to do the same. Even if it would mean having more RTS-styled combat, just as long the controls work.

They work becasue these games are simplified and more action oriented.......
Something that Origins not was.

And for RTS combat: Name me one good RTS game with a controller. There is none!!!!!!

DA2 worked pretty well.

You dont get anything I am trying to say do you?.......

It was easy ass combat with no tactical meaning at all. Hell even the fights were triggered. IT was not even possible to surprise attack guys like you even could do in origins.

[Noob451]

I agree with the compass idea.

[Melca36]

Can we possibly have a feature to temporarily take the map off our screen when we do screenshots?

Some of us are screenshot junkies and it was tad more difficult to get great shots.

[BomimoDK]

Melca36 wrote...

Can we possibly have a feature to temporarily take the map off our screen when we do screenshots?

Some of us are screenshot junkies and it was tad more difficult to get great shots.

There already is a button for that.