259 réponses à ce sujet

[sAxMoNkI]

RX_Sean_XI wrote...

I may not have liked Mordin, Than and Legion dying but I think it fit the plot very well and it was a good send off for those characters.

+1

[Yorkston9152]

Sparatus wrote...

The major issue a lot of people that romanced Thane have isn't really the cure. It's how poorly his romance arc is treated. You get one cringeworthy interrupt when you meet him... and that's about it. No more variation. Thane dies and Shepard simply never mentions him again. His is better than Jacob's arc in Mass Effect 3, but barely.

That and Bioware kind of supported the Cure Thane movement on their facebook page and got his fanbase's hope up.

this mostly. I think the issue most people have with thane an his death is just the sheer lack of interaction you get with him, inculding if hes your LI. Heres some badass dude who you get to know *and in some cases love* and you get like 10 lines of converstaion with him before he dies.

That said, for how they removed him from the game *his death* was very very very well written. I remembered when he gets stabbed screaming nooooo at the screen and tears/my jaw just dropped when my femshep asked his son "why did the end say she?"

[cogsandcurls]

Sparatus wrote...

The major issue a lot of people that romanced Thane have isn't really the cure. It's how poorly his romance arc is treated. You get one cringeworthy interrupt when you meet him... and that's about it. No more variation. Thane dies and Shepard simply never mentions him again. His is better than Jacob's arc in Mass Effect 3, but barely.

That and Bioware kind of supported the Cure Thane movement on their facebook page and got his fanbase's hope up.

This. I'm one of the people who was okay with Thane dying in theory, especially as I fully expected the Shep who romanced him to follow him into death not long after (that said, this emotional arc does NOT suit a lot of other people's Shepards who romanced him, so an option to choose between life and death would be nice). But we get the conversation everyone else gets, one interrupt, no option to show any kind of geniune concern for his life once he gets stabbed, one different line in his death scene and then he's never mentioned ever again except by KL/My Shep when I stabbed him to death. It was handled horribly.

[Welsh Inferno]

I loved his cameo(I considered him a good friend with my canon Shep) he died in a great way. Went out like a hero, but I do feel bad for anyone who romanced him. One bit of dialogue to acknowledge the romance then nothing? wut? ... what were you thinking BW?

[stysiaq]

cogsandcurls wrote...

 I'm one of the people who was okay with Thane dying in theory, especially as I fully expected the Shep who romanced him to follow him into death not long after (that said, this emotional arc does NOT suit a lot of other people's Shepards who romanced him, so an option to choose between life and death would be nice). But we get the conversation everyone else gets, one interrupt, no option to show any kind of geniune concern for his life once he gets stabbed, one different line in his death scene and then he's never mentioned ever again except by KL/My Shep when I stabbed him to death. It was handled horribly.

that one too.

[SuperTeal]

I don't understand the reaction at all.  I loved the way his death was portrayed.  The scriptures being read by Shep and the son was a heartbreaking scene.

I had serious manly tears during the whole hospital room scene.

The die hard fans just can't let go - and having him die because Kei Lang is a **** is kind of annoying.

[ReallyRue]

I'm not even a Thane fan, but I still think Shepard (especially if she romanced him) should be able to have more conversations with him before he dies, and then get to talk about it to someone after he dies. I mean, when Mordin dies you can talk to Joker/Garrus about it, and when Legion dies you can talk to Joker/EDI about it. It would have been good for Joker to have a little conversation with Shepard about Thane too.

[Reorte]

I was never that keen on Thane, finding him a rather uninteresting character but his death was very well handled and brought a tear to my eye. I can understand those upset at the lack of more conversation with him. I'm less sure about anyone wanting him to live; that was wishful thinking IMO (I could understand the complaint if it was Garrus or Tali who was killed). We knew he didn't have that long from the moment we first met him, and he got a damned good exit. If his disease had been sprung on us once we'd got to know him it would've been different.

edit: if there's precious little difference if you've romanced Thane then that sounds like a valid reason to be upset too.

Modifié par Reorte, 31 mars 2012 - 08:38 .

[Julia_xo]

Eterna5 wrote...

FbangIncentinveX wrote...

MJF JD wrote...

Hi, my name is Thane. I am going to die soon. It is incurable.

Yup, there you go.  That's not right.

Why not? To me at least, Thanes disease being curable diminishes his whole character because a large part of his character is redemption before his death. Him suddenly getting better would cheapen his whole story.

I strongly disagree that it would diminish his character. It's more apparent if you do his romance but Thane talks about how before meeting Shepard he had accepted his death. He expected to die at Dantius Towers but meeting Shepard was "an intervention by the Gods".

He says that he accepted his body's death and that his mind had been dead a long time. I think that's why he refused treatment (the lung transplant). However, during his romance arc, he tells Shepard she "awoke him" from his battle sleep. He has purpose (Shepard and his son). It would make sense for him to seek treatment at that point. Going by dialogue in LotSB Shepard tells Liara Thane's Kepral's isn't bad yet.

Why couldn't he have gotten treatment during the months Shepard was locked up? Instead all we got was Thane being resigned to death again and the lung transplant was never even brought up.

It's like Thane's character did a 180 and THAT is bad writing. Having more options would not ruin Thane's character, but railroading the character into a single outcome regardless of choice has. It makes no sense.

[sistersafetypin]

I agree. When you first meet Thane he tells you he wont last long, but he's still a total badass so I don't understand all the Fan Rage. I mean, he even puts Kai Leng in his place

[wildannie]

I don't get how some people are so
A -blinkered, that they cannot see that there were perfectly viable paths available (from information put out there by BioWare) to treat Thane and at the very least prolong his life.
B -selfish for objecting to the very idea that there should have been some way to save Thane (for those who really wanted it)

It is a war, and in war it is not only the sick who die, making the sick character die as cannon while allowing all the healthy to survive one way or another is pretty cheap drama.

[Searchnresq]

Esoretal wrote...

At least he went out like a stone cold badass.

[malra]

Sainta117 wrote...

First off, I have no intention of hating on Thane, or his many fans. Thane is a great character, but part of what makes him great is the pathos of his rapidly approaching death. He reminds me of John Wayne in the Shootist, or Clint Eastwood in Gran Torino, a dying tough guy who wants to go out with his boots on in a good cause.

Thane's death is epic, and far better than wasting away over months and months as he coughs his life out. The man saves a councillor and holds off a cyborg assassin bare-handed while dying of a degenerative respiratory condition. I mean, how much better an end could he have? It seems to me that Thane's end is a fantastic one - why are people upset? Were his fans pulling for a miracle cure?

Yeah, this is something I have not been able to fathom myself.  I thought his death was epic, sitting through the last rites affected me as much as Legion ending himself for his species.  We knew going in what his prognosis was, let him have his blaze of glory since it was denied to Shepard.

[malra]

Sparatus wrote...

Again. It isn't his death. It is how they handled his death if you romanced him.

Explanationa please, as I did not romance him.

[malra]

nevermind, found the explanation I think. apparently the writers forgot what they had already written about his illness. surprise...surprise.

[RShara]

It's not the fact that he dies. It's the reaction to that death that is pissing us off.  Nearly identical dialogue, and no reaction from crewmates.

Do we want an option for him to live? Many of us do. But we accept that probably isn't possible at this point. We've been defeated and have fallen back to our minimum line of retreat: Have Shepard gd react to the death of a lover.


dead <> good writing
Romanced Thane's character completely reverses his stance from ME2. Character reversal for no reason is not good writing.

Thane's death was AWESOME for a non-romanced Shepard (leaving aside the question why sword > gun). It was completely wrong for a romanced one.


See, there definitely shouldn't be a magical cure for Thane. That would be cliche and almost as offensive as what has happened in game.

I think that if you romanced him, and got the conversation where he no longer wants to die, then when you import your game, you should have the option to go on a quest to save him. You can save Miranda depending on your decisions, why can't you save Thane?

If Thane were strong enough he should have been able to drive off Kai Leng without being seriously hurt (accepting the fact that Kai Leng has impenetrable plot armor).


Thane was never "destined" to die. The writers in ME2 said they weren't sure where they were going to take the character.

In the leaked script, there were several options where Thane takes a bullet during the Coup, to stop Udina. In one of the options, he pulls off "A slick move" and stops Udina, and just looks "out of breath."

Mordin can magically cure the genophage in a few weeks, but no one can cure drell in years? From a bacterial infection? And we're not talking just 1 person, but an entire race.

From LotSB, you see Thane is a candidate for a transplant but declined. It is not specified whether this is BEFORE or after romancing Shepard.

It's only been 6 months or so since the end of ME2 (Arrival). Thane says that he as told he had 3 months to live 9 months ago. So..............he was 3 months PAST his expected life expectancy when he agreed to join up (and kicked ass)???

The doctor you talk to when you go to see Thane says that they had a problem with lack of drell blood for transfusion. Shepard offers to find some, and boom, Kolyat is there. Granted, he can't give ALL of his blood to Thane, but he should be able to donate a good bit. Certainly enough to buy enough time for Shepard to find more (fetch mission to Kahje?). I mean, you go fetching like, flags, and stuff. Wouldn't be any more ridiculous than that.


Thane's also the only ME2 squadmate that doesn't have at least some sort of sidemission, even a Running-Around-The-Citadel type mission.


What would make sense is that, if you romanced him in ME2, you have the OPTION to talk him in to a transplant. If he agrees, (and maybe if your Reputation is high enough) then he is strong enough to recover from the fight with Kai Leng. Strength of will, will to live makes a HUGE difference in survival odds. This isn't even a cure, but it's something that would extend him through ME 3, and leave the rest to......SPECULATION.


I also don't understand the, "Defined by his illness." statements. How exactly is a character defined by one single attribute?

It's like saying, Garrus is defined by his dead team. Or Miranda is defined by her father. They all have FLAWS, but the whole point of Mass Effect for a lot of us is to conquer the flaws and succeed.

Thane is defined by his PAST, just as any other person, place, or thing. His illness is a part of him, but it doesn't DEFINE him.  In fact, his relationship with his son is MUCH more important to him than his future death.


We're all going to die. Are we all defined by death? I think not. I think what's important is not that he's ill and going to die, but that he is an interesting character in and of himself, that deserves more than a perfunct conversation and a single (questionably) interesting fight/cutscene.

tl;dr
Look at this and see why the fight scene is REALLY NOT that great and how disappointing it was for a lot of fans.
Thane vs Kai Leng with commentary

Edit to fix formating

Modifié par RShara, 31 mars 2012 - 10:13 .

[wildannie]

@RShara, Thane declines the lung transplant before he's romanced. After Ilium if your recruit Thane and then do LoTSB and check his dossier Chakwa's report is there.

Modifié par wildannie, 31 mars 2012 - 10:22 .

[RShara]

wildannie: That's what I assume too, but technically there's no proof.

[mnomaha]

There's also the fact that we really want options. Some of us want options for more time and for acknowledgement after his death from the other squad mates in our game. Some of us would love to have the option to cure him in our game. That's what it comes down to. "Our" game. It doesn't have to change in "your" game. It is optional. So how does it negatively affect anyone else if you don't have these scenarios in your game?

[The Makr]

I was pretty hyped when my shep took down down Kai lang wihile saying "this is for Thane you SOB". awesomeness.

[RShara]

This is one of the suggestions in the Protesting Thane thread came up with:

Thane unloyal = dies after confrontation
Thane loyal ^ (MaleShep v Femshep not romancing him) = talk-jutsu test which can result in convincing him that he has plenty of reasons to live, his son being the primary one = death on operating table if not succeeded, successful lung transplant otherwise
Thane loyal && FShep romancing him = tis only a flesh wound, thou shall recieve youre Paramour achievement, beloved one!

And, as I mentioned, a rematch with Kai Leng would be appropriate, and veeeery satisfying to watch. Who wouldn't simply die for seeing Thane neck-snapping that joke of an assassin?

For sure some of the players would gladly sacrifice boss fight with Kai Leng just to see a fair fight between the two. And those who wouldnt would be free not to buy that DLC.

[GabrielK]

Add me to the list of people who were fine with Thane's role in ME3.

BUT...

I do understand why some people wanted more.


AND...


I do think it would have been cool if you walk into the life support room at one point and somebody (maybe Garrus) is in there just looking out the window or something. And he just says something along the lines of, "feels empty in here, doesn't it?"


But yeah, given that Thane's premise was "Drell assassin with incurable disease," I wasn't expecting him to make it out of ME 3 alive.