197 réponses à ce sujet

[fwc577]

Subject One wrote...

He4vyMet4l wrote...

- All the species can still have holo-communication to work together and create new Relays at the same time.

Actually, this is wrong.  The following is from a codex entry.  Without Mass Relay's communication is limited to in system communicaton.

Communications
Real-time communication is possible thanks to networks of expensive mass relay comm buoys that can daisy-chain a transmission via lasers.
Comm buoys are maintained in patterns built outward from each mass relay. The buoys are little more than a cluster of primitive, miniature mass relays. Each individual buoy is connected to a partner on another buoy in the network, forming a corridor of low-mass space. Tightbeam communications lasers are piped through these "tubes" of FTL space, allowing virtually instantaneous communication to anywhere on the network. The networks connect across regions by communications lasers through the mass relays.
With this system, the only delay is the light lag between the source or destination and the closest buoy. So long as all parties remain within half a light-second (150,000 km) of buoys, seamless real time communications are possible. Since buoys are maintained in all traveled areas, most enjoy unlimited instant communications. Ships only suffer communications lag when operating off established deep space routes, around uninhabited outer system gas giants, and other unsettled areas.
During wartime, comm buoy networks are the first target of an attack. Once the network is severed, it can take anywhere from weeks to years to get a message out of a contested system. In systems where a buoy network has not yet been built or has been destroyed, rapid communication means ferrying information through high-speed courier ships and unmanned data drones.

Modifié par fwc577, 20 mars 2012 - 12:27 .

[Subject One]

fwc577 wrote...

Subject One wrote...

He4vyMet4l wrote...

- All the species can still have holo-communication to work together and create new Relays at the same time.

Actually, this is wrong.  The following is from a codex entry.  Without Mass Relay's communication is limited to in system communicaton.

Communications
Real-time communication is possible thanks to networks of expensive mass relay comm buoys that can daisy-chain a transmission via lasers.
Comm buoys are maintained in patterns built outward from each mass relay. The buoys are little more than a cluster of primitive, miniature mass relays. Each individual buoy is connected to a partner on another buoy in the network, forming a corridor of low-mass space. Tightbeam communications lasers are piped through these "tubes" of FTL space, allowing virtually instantaneous communication to anywhere on the network. The networks connect across regions by communications lasers through the mass relays.
With this system, the only delay is the light lag between the source or destination and the closest buoy. So long as all parties remain within half a light-second (150,000 km) of buoys, seamless real time communications are possible. Since buoys are maintained in all traveled areas, most enjoy unlimited instant communications. Ships only suffer communications lag when operating off established deep space routes, around uninhabited outer system gas giants, and other unsettled areas.
During wartime, comm buoy networks are the first target of an attack. Once the network is severed, it can take anywhere from weeks to years to get a message out of a contested system. In systems where a buoy network has not yet been built or has been destroyed, rapid communication means ferrying information through high-speed courier ships and unmanned data drones.

OK, it's not possible real time communication through Comm Buoys. But still we can have communication through FTL. It can take weeks, months and even some years, but it is possible. And if Asari can make a new mass relay they can share the info with the other races as they already know where they are. The same can do the Normandy: send a message to Earth and Sheppard will know where they are after some time. Anyway he will be for months at the hospital, so not a big issue :happy:

[fwc577]

Subject One wrote...

fwc577 wrote...

Subject One wrote...

He4vyMet4l wrote...

- All the species can still have holo-communication to work together and create new Relays at the same time.

Actually, this is wrong.  The following is from a codex entry.  Without Mass Relay's communication is limited to in system communicaton.

Communications
Real-time communication is possible thanks to networks of expensive mass relay comm buoys that can daisy-chain a transmission via lasers.
Comm buoys are maintained in patterns built outward from each mass relay. The buoys are little more than a cluster of primitive, miniature mass relays. Each individual buoy is connected to a partner on another buoy in the network, forming a corridor of low-mass space. Tightbeam communications lasers are piped through these "tubes" of FTL space, allowing virtually instantaneous communication to anywhere on the network. The networks connect across regions by communications lasers through the mass relays.
With this system, the only delay is the light lag between the source or destination and the closest buoy. So long as all parties remain within half a light-second (150,000 km) of buoys, seamless real time communications are possible. Since buoys are maintained in all traveled areas, most enjoy unlimited instant communications. Ships only suffer communications lag when operating off established deep space routes, around uninhabited outer system gas giants, and other unsettled areas.
During wartime, comm buoy networks are the first target of an attack. Once the network is severed, it can take anywhere from weeks to years to get a message out of a contested system. In systems where a buoy network has not yet been built or has been destroyed, rapid communication means ferrying information through high-speed courier ships and unmanned data drones.

OK, it's not possible real time communication through Comm Buoys. But still we can have communication through FTL. It can take weeks, months and even some years, but it is possible. And if Asari can make a new mass relay they can share the info with the other races as they already know where they are. The same can do the Normandy: send a message to Earth and Sheppard will know where they are after some time. Anyway he will be for months at the hospital, so not a big issue :happy:

No, you aren't getting it.  There is NO COMMUNCATION BETWEEN SYSTEMS PERIOD.

There is still instantaneous communication between comm bouys but they aren't linked beyond the system they are in without a Mass Relay.  Communcation would be no quicker than what we have today beyond the distance of the comm bouys.  The weeks and years which you are clinging to is the hopes that the message is received by a ship or comm bouy that can forward the message back into the extranet.

Mass Relays rely on other Mass Relays meaning if you are going to rebuild the mass relays, you build 2 and you ship the other relay at FTL speeds to other systems from the SoL system.  FTL travel from system to system can take decades.

To top it off, the Asari's ability to create a Mass Relay probably somewhat depended on that prothean technology on Thessia.  By all accounts, the Protheans were far more advanced than current civilizations and they only managed to build 2 mass relays. The ones that connected Ilos and the Citadel meaning they probably still lacked the ability to integrate Mass Relays into a network.

Modifié par fwc577, 20 mars 2012 - 12:44 .

[Kidd]

EDIT: Bah, I'm off topic now. To sum up a previously discussing post, Ieldra2 owns. *edits out post*

Modifié par KiddDaBeauty, 20 mars 2012 - 12:53 .

[Subject One]

fwc577 wrote...

Subject One wrote...

fwc577 wrote...

Subject One wrote...

He4vyMet4l wrote...

- All the species can still have holo-communication to work together and create new Relays at the same time.

Actually, this is wrong.  The following is from a codex entry.  Without Mass Relay's communication is limited to in system communicaton.

Communications
Real-time communication is possible thanks to networks of expensive mass relay comm buoys that can daisy-chain a transmission via lasers.
Comm buoys are maintained in patterns built outward from each mass relay. The buoys are little more than a cluster of primitive, miniature mass relays. Each individual buoy is connected to a partner on another buoy in the network, forming a corridor of low-mass space. Tightbeam communications lasers are piped through these "tubes" of FTL space, allowing virtually instantaneous communication to anywhere on the network. The networks connect across regions by communications lasers through the mass relays.
With this system, the only delay is the light lag between the source or destination and the closest buoy. So long as all parties remain within half a light-second (150,000 km) of buoys, seamless real time communications are possible. Since buoys are maintained in all traveled areas, most enjoy unlimited instant communications. Ships only suffer communications lag when operating off established deep space routes, around uninhabited outer system gas giants, and other unsettled areas.
During wartime, comm buoy networks are the first target of an attack. Once the network is severed, it can take anywhere from weeks to years to get a message out of a contested system. In systems where a buoy network has not yet been built or has been destroyed, rapid communication means ferrying information through high-speed courier ships and unmanned data drones.

OK, it's not possible real time communication through Comm Buoys. But still we can have communication through FTL. It can take weeks, months and even some years, but it is possible. And if Asari can make a new mass relay they can share the info with the other races as they already know where they are. The same can do the Normandy: send a message to Earth and Sheppard will know where they are after some time. Anyway he will be for months at the hospital, so not a big issue :happy:

No, you aren't getting it.  There is NO COMMUNCATION BETWEEN SYSTEMS PERIOD.

There is still instantaneous communication between comm bouys but they aren't linked beyond the system they are in without a Mass Relay.  Communcation would be no quicker than what we have today beyond the distance of the comm bouys.  The weeks and years which you are clinging to is the hopes that the message is received by a ship or comm bouy that can forward the message back into the extranet.

Mass Relays rely on other Mass Relays meaning if you are going to rebuild the mass relays, you build 2 and you ship the other relay at FTL speeds to other systems from the SoL system.  FTL travel from system to system can take decades.

To top it off, the Asari's ability to create a Mass Relay probably somewhat depended on that prothean technology on Thessia.  By all accounts, the Protheans were far more advanced than current civilizations and they only managed to build 2 mass relays. The ones that connected Ilos and the Citadel meaning they probably still lacked the ability to integrate Mass Relays into a network.

OK, this fits with the epilogue of the game: it was a generation or two without mass effect relays system... but the 'father figure' says that space travel will be able 'soon'. So I think that somehow the organics ar rebuilding the technology and FTL communication exists. Once you know where to send the information it can be done similar to Contact film.

About the aliens on earth: as I said 'stasis' isnt a reaper technology and was used by Protheans, so it can be done to return the aliens to their homes with a very long space travel, or they can wait here orbiting in stasis mode until the mass relay can be rebuilt.

And about 'living' sheppard as I said it can use the same stasis pods to wait/ travel to liara who can wait hundred years with no problem :happy:

[Ghost Warrior]

fwc577 wrote...

Now if you want to argue about entitlements. quote my whole post and make a real argument instead of sounded like your cognitive functions are below a normal level.

Don't insult me. Which part should I have quoted?

The one saying you paid for it? Yeah,you got a 30 hour game,if you didn't like it's your problem. A lot of people did.

Or maybe I should have quoted the part where you insult everyone who doesn't agree with you?

Which one is it?

[thelovebat]

I don't think the guy who wrote that has seen this yet.



Yet another thing Bioware ripped from and slapped into the ending where it didn't belong.

Modifié par thelovebat, 20 mars 2012 - 01:11 .

[kbct]

fwc577 wrote...

Subject One wrote...

- All the species can still have holo-communication to work together and create new Relays at the same time.

Actually, this is wrong.  The following is from a codex entry.  Without Mass Relay's communication is limited to in system communicaton.

Communications
Real-time communication is possible thanks to networks of expensive mass relay comm buoys that can daisy-chain a transmission via lasers.
Comm buoys are maintained in patterns built outward from each mass relay. The buoys are little more than a cluster of primitive, miniature mass relays. Each individual buoy is connected to a partner on another buoy in the network, forming a corridor of low-mass space. Tightbeam communications lasers are piped through these "tubes" of FTL space, allowing virtually instantaneous communication to anywhere on the network. The networks connect across regions by communications lasers through the mass relays.
With this system, the only delay is the light lag between the source or destination and the closest buoy. So long as all parties remain within half a light-second (150,000 km) of buoys, seamless real time communications are possible. Since buoys are maintained in all traveled areas, most enjoy unlimited instant communications. Ships only suffer communications lag when operating off established deep space routes, around uninhabited outer system gas giants, and other unsettled areas.
During wartime, comm buoy networks are the first target of an attack. Once the network is severed, it can take anywhere from weeks to years to get a message out of a contested system. In systems where a buoy network has not yet been built or has been destroyed, rapid communication means ferrying information through high-speed courier ships and unmanned data drones.

I'm glad someone else has read the codex.

An ending sucks when everyone has to spend a bunch of time trying to patch over the plot holes.

[Overule]

Just remember guys: maintaining a creative vision born of the desires of a CEO is more imporant than getting what you want. That CEO's message is deep, personal, and entirely his own!

[fwc577]

Ghost Warrior wrote...

fwc577 wrote...

Now if you want to argue about entitlements. quote my whole post and make a real argument instead of sounded like your cognitive functions are below a normal level.

Don't insult me. Which part should I have quoted?

The one saying you paid for it? Yeah,you got a 30 hour game,if you didn't like it's your problem. A lot of people did.

Or maybe I should have quoted the part where you insult everyone who doesn't agree with you?

Which one is it?

Don't pick a part, quote the whole damn thing and make a counter argument about entitlements instead of a small part of the post to bolster an argument for entitlements.

I mean it is obvious you have below average intelligence if I say "quote my whole post" and you follow it up with "Which part should I have quoted"

THE WHOLE THING DUMMY.

The point is this, entitlement argueing is dumb, it is a double edged sword.  Sure they created a game I enjoy but I also paid for that game which provided them with a means to create the game in the first place.  It is a symbiotic relationship and "entitlements" shouldn't factor in at all.  If bioware decides this is how it ends and makes no effort to rectify it then I simply will never purchase another Bioware game again and I'm sure I'm not alone on that one.

Maybe pull your head out of your ass and use it as a mechanism to form ideas before you speak next time.

[piemanz]

kbct wrote...

fwc577 wrote...

Subject One wrote...

- All the species can still have holo-communication to work together and create new Relays at the same time.

Actually, this is wrong.  The following is from a codex entry.  Without Mass Relay's communication is limited to in system communicaton.

Communications
Real-time communication is possible thanks to networks of expensive mass relay comm buoys that can daisy-chain a transmission via lasers.
Comm buoys are maintained in patterns built outward from each mass relay. The buoys are little more than a cluster of primitive, miniature mass relays. Each individual buoy is connected to a partner on another buoy in the network, forming a corridor of low-mass space. Tightbeam communications lasers are piped through these "tubes" of FTL space, allowing virtually instantaneous communication to anywhere on the network. The networks connect across regions by communications lasers through the mass relays.
With this system, the only delay is the light lag between the source or destination and the closest buoy. So long as all parties remain within half a light-second (150,000 km) of buoys, seamless real time communications are possible. Since buoys are maintained in all traveled areas, most enjoy unlimited instant communications. Ships only suffer communications lag when operating off established deep space routes, around uninhabited outer system gas giants, and other unsettled areas.
During wartime, comm buoy networks are the first target of an attack. Once the network is severed, it can take anywhere from weeks to years to get a message out of a contested system. In systems where a buoy network has not yet been built or has been destroyed, rapid communication means ferrying information through high-speed courier ships and unmanned data drones.

I'm glad someone else has read the codex.

An ending sucks when everyone has to spend a bunch of time trying to patch over the plot holes.

Two words, Quantam communication.

How do you think shepard was talking to Hackett and Anderson throughout ME3. It seems fairly standard now throughout the alliance.

Modifié par piemanz, 20 mars 2012 - 01:29 .

[fwc577]

piemanz wrote...

kbct wrote...

fwc577 wrote...

Subject One wrote...

- All the species can still have holo-communication to work together and create new Relays at the same time.

Actually, this is wrong.  The following is from a codex entry.  Without Mass Relay's communication is limited to in system communicaton.

Communications
Real-time communication is possible thanks to networks of expensive mass relay comm buoys that can daisy-chain a transmission via lasers.
Comm buoys are maintained in patterns built outward from each mass relay. The buoys are little more than a cluster of primitive, miniature mass relays. Each individual buoy is connected to a partner on another buoy in the network, forming a corridor of low-mass space. Tightbeam communications lasers are piped through these "tubes" of FTL space, allowing virtually instantaneous communication to anywhere on the network. The networks connect across regions by communications lasers through the mass relays.
With this system, the only delay is the light lag between the source or destination and the closest buoy. So long as all parties remain within half a light-second (150,000 km) of buoys, seamless real time communications are possible. Since buoys are maintained in all traveled areas, most enjoy unlimited instant communications. Ships only suffer communications lag when operating off established deep space routes, around uninhabited outer system gas giants, and other unsettled areas.
During wartime, comm buoy networks are the first target of an attack. Once the network is severed, it can take anywhere from weeks to years to get a message out of a contested system. In systems where a buoy network has not yet been built or has been destroyed, rapid communication means ferrying information through high-speed courier ships and unmanned data drones.

I'm glad someone else has read the codex.

An ending sucks when everyone has to spend a bunch of time trying to patch over the plot holes.

Two words, Quantam communication.

How do you think shepard was talking to Hackett and Anderson throughout ME3. It seems fairly standar now throughout the alliance.

Not at all, I am pretty sure somewhere in the begining they even mention the fact they only have a handful of these quantum entanglers.

Normany looks way to beat up for anything inside the actual ship to be working.  Assuming they can get it working then yes, they could have. Also, the whole quantum entaglement communication with Anderson/Hackett is another plothole because EDI spells out exactly how it works and it only works as point to point meaning the Normandy's quantum entaglment comm system is only linked to a single other quantum entaglement comm system.  Assuming the Normandy was fitted with two quantum entanglers, ones that Anderson has access to and one that Hackett has access to, then it is fine and wouldn't generate any plot holes.

If the Normandy is crashed and not working, then it's quantum entangler won't work either.

[Redstar6]

It was an interesting read however it seems like all the people who defend it paint people who dislike it as wanting rainbows and high fives. Just because we don't want an only bleak and depressing ending doesn't mean we want an 80s victory montage.

[fwc577]

Redstar6 wrote...

It was an interesting read however it seems like all the people who defend it paint people who dislike it as wanting rainbows and high fives. Just because we don't want an only bleak and depressing ending doesn't mean we want an 80s victory montage.

Althought I wouldn't mind an 80's victory montage.

Nor would I mind a Fallout style ending.

Something that tells us what happens and provides resolution.

[SmellyMetal]

The relays explode, and only a handful of individuals are left stranded on a planet.

--->
NOPPE

No one is alive. It is explained pretty good that an exploding mass relay will also destroy its solar system. Your planet is gone.

Modifié par SmellyMetal, 20 mars 2012 - 01:49 .

[Subject One]

kbct wrote...

fwc577 wrote...

Subject One wrote...

- All the species can still have holo-communication to work together and create new Relays at the same time.

Actually, this is wrong.  The following is from a codex entry.  Without Mass Relay's communication is limited to in system communicaton.

Communications
Real-time communication is possible thanks to networks of expensive mass relay comm buoys that can daisy-chain a transmission via lasers.
Comm buoys are maintained in patterns built outward from each mass relay. The buoys are little more than a cluster of primitive, miniature mass relays. Each individual buoy is connected to a partner on another buoy in the network, forming a corridor of low-mass space. Tightbeam communications lasers are piped through these "tubes" of FTL space, allowing virtually instantaneous communication to anywhere on the network. The networks connect across regions by communications lasers through the mass relays.
With this system, the only delay is the light lag between the source or destination and the closest buoy. So long as all parties remain within half a light-second (150,000 km) of buoys, seamless real time communications are possible. Since buoys are maintained in all traveled areas, most enjoy unlimited instant communications. Ships only suffer communications lag when operating off established deep space routes, around uninhabited outer system gas giants, and other unsettled areas.
During wartime, comm buoy networks are the first target of an attack. Once the network is severed, it can take anywhere from weeks to years to get a message out of a contested system. In systems where a buoy network has not yet been built or has been destroyed, rapid communication means ferrying information through high-speed courier ships and unmanned data drones.

I'm glad someone else has read the codex.

An ending sucks when everyone has to spend a bunch of time trying to patch over the plot holes.

No: we are figuring out why space travel wans't available for 1 or 2 (human) generations, but it can be used again after that (the information that gives the epilogue of ME3) and we are confronting this to the tech information available from ME universe. Fill the gap between 2 informations (end of mass relays and the start of new galaxy travelling after some years) isn't a plot hole patch, it is actually use our brains.

[Subject One]

SmellyMetal wrote...

The relays explode, and only a handful of individuals are left stranded on a planet.

--->
NOPPE

No one is alive. It is explained pretty good that an exploding mass relay will also destroy its solar system. Your planet is gone.

Nope. We can seee clearly that there are people on earth at the 'good' endings at least. So the energy disables the relays but it doesn't make a full relay explosion as we see at Arrival DLC

[IST]

fwc577 wrote...

Redstar6 wrote...

It was an interesting read however it seems like all the people who defend it paint people who dislike it as wanting rainbows and high fives. Just because we don't want an only bleak and depressing ending doesn't mean we want an 80s victory montage.

Althought I wouldn't mind an 80's victory montage.

Nor would I mind a Fallout style ending.

Something that tells us what happens and provides resolution.

Somebody please make a montage to "Glory of Love".


pretty,

pretty,

pretty,

(good) please.

[RVallant]

fwc577 wrote...

piemanz wrote...

kbct wrote...

fwc577 wrote...

Subject One wrote...

- All the species can still have holo-communication to work together and create new Relays at the same time.

Actually, this is wrong.  The following is from a codex entry.  Without Mass Relay's communication is limited to in system communicaton.

Communications
Real-time communication is possible thanks to networks of expensive mass relay comm buoys that can daisy-chain a transmission via lasers.
Comm buoys are maintained in patterns built outward from each mass relay. The buoys are little more than a cluster of primitive, miniature mass relays. Each individual buoy is connected to a partner on another buoy in the network, forming a corridor of low-mass space. Tightbeam communications lasers are piped through these "tubes" of FTL space, allowing virtually instantaneous communication to anywhere on the network. The networks connect across regions by communications lasers through the mass relays.
With this system, the only delay is the light lag between the source or destination and the closest buoy. So long as all parties remain within half a light-second (150,000 km) of buoys, seamless real time communications are possible. Since buoys are maintained in all traveled areas, most enjoy unlimited instant communications. Ships only suffer communications lag when operating off established deep space routes, around uninhabited outer system gas giants, and other unsettled areas.
During wartime, comm buoy networks are the first target of an attack. Once the network is severed, it can take anywhere from weeks to years to get a message out of a contested system. In systems where a buoy network has not yet been built or has been destroyed, rapid communication means ferrying information through high-speed courier ships and unmanned data drones.

I'm glad someone else has read the codex.

An ending sucks when everyone has to spend a bunch of time trying to patch over the plot holes.

Two words, Quantam communication.

How do you think shepard was talking to Hackett and Anderson throughout ME3. It seems fairly standar now throughout the alliance.

Not at all, I am pretty sure somewhere in the begining they even mention the fact they only have a handful of these quantum entanglers.

Normany looks way to beat up for anything inside the actual ship to be working.  Assuming they can get it working then yes, they could have. Also, the whole quantum entaglement communication with Anderson/Hackett is another plothole because EDI spells out exactly how it works and it only works as point to point meaning the Normandy's quantum entaglment comm system is only linked to a single other quantum entaglement comm system.  Assuming the Normandy was fitted with two quantum entanglers, ones that Anderson has access to and one that Hackett has access to, then it is fine and wouldn't generate any plot holes.

If the Normandy is crashed and not working, then it's quantum entangler won't work either.

Hold fire. I'd agree it'd be a plot hole if EDI's explaination was post-Alliance Normandy Quantum Entanglers. It wasn't, so what she says about the QE for ME2 is correct. There was afaik nothing to say it was restricted to one point to point communication in ME3. It's likely either technology was expanded on in that time peroid or, the communications in the war room isn't restricted to one Quantum Entangler device, especially if as they say, Anderson was planning to use the Normandy as his own personal war-command vessel, it would make perfect sense to have multiple copies of the same or variant techs implemented as a singluar point to point communicator would be defeating the point.

Anyhoo, that article is spot on. A lot of people arguing for 'choices' really seem to ignore a lot of the actual impact. ME3 is one long running game of 'consequences' from both games thus far. It's blindingly obvious if you run an imported save and then switch quickly to a non-import save (or one with different choices or where you avoided certain dlc's or quests).

[The Razman]

The Razman wrote...

Not looking for a flame-war as a result of posting this, I should point out.

*sigh*

[Stripe523]

The article cited by the OP misses the entire point. Most of his argument boils down to "my choices had an impact earlier in the game, so that carries through and affects the ending". That's only true to the extent that the ending doesn't undo your previous actions - it just also does nothing to independently contribute to your character's impact on those around him/her.

Unconvincing article

[The Razman]

From the comments field of RPS, John posted this:

[quote]John Walker wrote...

I’m on holiday this week, so despite doing my best to read as many comments as possible, I’m not keeping up here. But I wanted to make a few general responses.

1. Perspective. I wrote a personal account of why I enjoyed the the ending of Mass Effect. I did this in reaction to my having enjoyed the ending of Mass Effect, and because we’d previously published negative coverage and I wanted to express that I felt differently. In the post I acknowledge that I empathise with the issues some have, while not being affected by them. This is not a personal attack on you because you feel differently, and while I recognise the frustration that I have the post for my voice, and you have the comments, you are not harmed by this post.

2. I have read no other positive coverage of the ending on other sites, and oddly enough am not involved in a conspiracy of the gaming press. I liked a thing you hated. I also thought the ending of AI was brilliant, and truly understood the grotesque horror of fairytale. Yet the world continues

3. Personal attacks on my professional integrity, accusations or implications of corruption, and suggestions that I am controlled by advertising/publisher relation pressure are ****ing disgraceful. I like to imagine that any reputation I may have might slightly lean toward the suggestion that publisher appeasement isn’t exactly high on my agenda. Of course, I don’t expect most people to give two ****s who I am so that’s not relevant for most – however, making wildly offensive accusations shouldn’t be something anyone is reaching for in a discussion over whether people liked the end of a game or not. Good GRIEF.

4. I have no idea what Joker was doing on the Normandy at that point. It doesn’t take a huge leap of imagination to assume something like, “he was asked to fly to the Citadel after people realised Shepard was on board, then tried to avoid the green wobbly bubble.” Or even that they were helping a particular ship that was in distress. I dunno! It didn’t strike me as the most important thing happening, but clearly that wasn’t the case for all

5. It turns out that if the Relays were destroyed in the process of relaying an ancient signal from the ancient race, that meant their solar system destroying ways were muted. Phew, eh?

[The Razman]

And incidentally ... I agree with him when it comes to "I don't really know about the Normandy. Does it really matter? I was too busy enjoying the game to care."

[InvincibleHero]

The Razman wrote...

And incidentally ... I agree with him when it comes to "I don't really know about the Normandy. Does it really matter? I was too busy enjoying the game to care."

Also BW can explain what happened without altering the game. If they did that closed all plot holes by having Mac say this is why they did this and it makes sense in the context of their universe would that satisfy the new ending people?

[piemanz]

InvincibleHero wrote...

The Razman wrote...

And incidentally ... I agree with him when it comes to "I don't really know about the Normandy. Does it really matter? I was too busy enjoying the game to care."

Also BW can explain what happened without altering the game. If they did that closed all plot holes by having Mac say this is why they did this and it makes sense in the context of their universe would that satisfy the new ending people?

Apparently not.