22 réponses à ce sujet

[Tonya777]

All the AW/BM builds I hear of say pump constitution and ignore willpower so you can cast spells

But really? Wtf?

If you just go /SH and pump willpower instead of constitution then you are still an invincible freak but now even more so because of lifeward, cleansing aura , group heal , & revive

Even with all the "Improves blood magic" gear in the game and lots of constitution "Blood magic" mode still reduces healing effects and still hurts your character

I've come to find that as an arcane warrior you are untouchable , so yes you could get away w/ being a blood mage and sucking up all your own health to cast spells but then your suicidal buff combined with what little damage you actually do receive could lead your character to being killed , whereas AW/SH is simply not going to get killed at all period.

I find I can do all the casting I even want to anyway , and thats with like 10 sustained buffs on
I might make an AW/BM sometime to see what its like to play as one first hand , but from my AW/SH experience and my SH/BM experience (I do know of blood magics abilities because of that character) I see no real way that AW/BM could possibly actually be the better of the 2 choices?

[Nooneyouknow13]

Blood Mage is overpowered because of Blood wound, not using HP to cast. That's really all there is to it.

[Alphakiller]

/agree nooneyouknow



just pop into bm mode, cast blood control and blood wound, pop out of bm mode, have your healer heal you. tank frozen enemies. rinse and repeat.

[TheNecroFiend]

Yup. I would take Bloodwound over the entire Spirit Healer line.

[Tonya777]

Then why does everyone say to pump the living **** out of constitution then? I thought you all thought it was better for mana reasons

Edit : Why does it even matter if you're tanking frozen enemies? Arcane warriors are invincible/untouchable anyway?

Modifié par Tonya777, 30 novembre 2009 - 12:25 .

[Alphakiller]

actually... enemy casters can be a huge threat to an AW, along with enemy templars. just take off all the buffs on the AW and they're so much cottage cheese. casting blood wound before hand and then focusing on those dangerous enemies fixes said problem.



personally I pumped 2 points of magic and one point of dex for attack and defense each level. with blood dragon armor and lifegiver you don't need any constitution.

[Tonya777]

Hmmm I've never had much issues with any regular mage enemies



I mean Gaxkang as a caster? Yes there was issues



But other casters? I just have spell shield on and walk right up into their face and put them in the crushing prison and then kill them with my sword

[Alphakiller]

do you play nightmare mode?

[Tonya777]

I go back and forth between normal and nightmare



I already proved to myself that I can beat the game on nightmare mode and I already proved my arcane warrior can solo crazy stuff on nightmare mode so I generally leave it on just normal cause I don't feel I have to prove anything so no I don't not really anyway



But also , couldn't you just do mass paralysis to the enemies and get practically the same effect? Or you know just crushing prison the mage in mention from far away? Or mana clash the mage enemy? Being a blood mage really isn't the only way to take out enemy mages so I don't understand the whole strategy your saying as some kind of only viable option to deal w/ mages

[Alphakiller]

the blood wound is basically a combination of mass paralysis and crushing prison. while mass paralysis might deal with the enemies, it doesn't come with a chance of beating them. I often end up soloing the boss while the enemies are constantly kept in blood wound.



actually... combining mass paralysis with blood wound completely eliminates enemies if you alternate, and eventually kills them. as an AW/BM you'll basically go through all the fights as you vs the boss.

[Tonya777]

Are you one of those ones who decided to solo the entire game w/ your AW?



I figure since I get nothing special for soloing the game I usually take my party w/ me to do everything



They usually go handle the other mobs while I solo the boss , kind of the same thing. I just soloed the carta leader in orzammar while the party ran around taking care of the others so its kind of similar , and they are competant w/ the tactics I have for them all so nobody gets killed or anything not even on nightmare mode

[Foofad]

Mass para kind of sucks, it doesn't last very long. Also, Blood Wound does damage much like Crushing Prison (in fact, it does more if I'm not mistaken?) meaning you can seriously injure trash monsters in the process.



Anyway, I don't see what the argument is about; why not have both? Paladin Wynne (SH/AW) + Blackguard Warden (AW/BM) = destruction.

[Tonya777]

Well I have a Spirit healer/Blood mage lvl 24 and for whatever reason I never used blood wound a whole lot , but I also had no +blood magic gear and avoided it usually because it often resulted in my character being dead cause that one wasn't in platemail lol

[Zilod]

it depends by the AW and if you are willing to exploit shimmering shield bug

a SH will cast using mana, something that shimmering shield drain in very short time, for this reason a non BM build will have to use shimmering shield with a lot of care and depending by the situation while a BM can pretty much keep it up all the time.

if you are not willing to exploit the bug then imo it depends by the build... an AW that use low fatigue armor, a staff and who focus mostly on his spell (so armor just for some added defense) will be probably better with BM... an AW on the frontline using sword and whatnot will be probably better because... a) he risks to kill himself casting a few spells, he cant be healed if something bad happen and then his benefits are gone (as probably his low mana pool)... again i'm speaking about not exploiting SS bug

Modifié par Zilod, 30 novembre 2009 - 01:56 .

[Besetment]

Sometimes I wonder if I'm playing the same game you folks are.

1) Shimmering Shield definitely collapses when you reach zero mana and that happens pretty quick when most of your mana is reserved on sustainables.  I have no idea why people claim otherwise unless its different on consoles because I have tested it many times on the PC version (no mods, patched up to date). I did it again just now and same deal. Still had to heal pot whilst walking into the mob but after Shimmering Shield goes down after about 15 to 20 seconds then its a case of spamming the pot button to stay alive.

2) I read elsewhere that some people claim that they can counter the mana degen from Haste + Shimmering Shield *or* Cleansing Aura using items with +mana/stamina regen *and* break even (i.e. using Fade Wall, Spellweaver, Wade's dragonbone armour or Warden Commander's armour). I find this very hard to believe since with the above and Warden's Commander armour I was never able to completely negate the mana degen from just Shimmering Shield on its own.

3) AW/BM with 2:1 Magic/Constitution ratio is entirely inferior to 2:1 Magic/Dexterity. With all your sustained spells, Combat Magic and Massive Armour you are going to push at least 90%+ fatigue so your spells are going cost alot of life. I just respecced my dude to a level 24 AW/BM 2:1 magic/constitution and basically, I can cast Mass Paralysis once and it will take 1/3rd of my life instead of just over 1/2 (I rarely use it, it was just the first talent I clicked on so it stayed constant for the comparison). Big deal if you are health potting which you should be as a BM.

At least with a 2:1 Magic/Dex build you dont get hit anywhere near as often so for most of the game damage mitigation isn't as critical and you accumulate more healing potions for when you really need them. You are supposed to Crushing Prison/Force Field/Blood Wound casters anyway and for everything else theres Spell Shield.

4) I've heard some people claim to do over 100+ damage on the main hand but that sounds like hokum unless you're seriously modifying the game in some way? Solo, I don't see how its possible to get much higher than 70. At level 24 with nearly ideal equipment, my dude has 66.2 with 92 spellpower.

5) Where are all these exaggerations coming from? Did the collector's edition give you a ring of god mode or something? Even with a levelling plan and judiciously cheesing chokepoints + a ridiculous number of save/reloads its nowhere near a walk in the park. For most of the game its a struggle until you get your second specialization and even then all it takes is for one Crushing Prison to misfire at a bad time and yay lets reload.

edit: dunno whats up with the formatting :\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\

Modifié par Besetment, 30 novembre 2009 - 02:22 .

[demireamer]

i played AW/SH with shimmering shield almost 100% of the time my mana regeneration was high so the the drain from it and haste, with out a problem,



i havn't played with BM yet seem like fun



But i can tell you AW/SH is a power house. sure you dont have Blood Wound, but you can replace it with Revival + Group Heal witch I found helpful, Cleansing Aura was nice too but i would have to give up an other buff to put it one do to the mana Drain on it (but for my wynne aw on first play when i was rouge it was awsome)



with mine i soloed the High dragon and the last fight on nightmare



i was thinking of playing a power house party doing 3 AW out of the pc(aw/bm) morrgain(aw/ss) and wynne(aw/sh) + Leliana(bard/?ranger?)

[Besetment]

How is your mana regen high enough to cancel out the degen from Shimmering Shield *and* Haste? This is where I never hear an explanation. I've already tested gear combinations and +mana/stamina items so I know its not practicable to do it that way. I've heard it called a bug but why don't I have this bug?

The only way I can think of to do that is to stagger Spellbloom/Dark Sustanence on yourself constantly and health pot to make up the loss of life. In which case, the game really ceases to be a game and becomes a micromanagement exercise in trying to 'get the blue bar around the same level as the red bar.'

Modifié par Besetment, 30 novembre 2009 - 02:30 .

[Tonya777]

Well thats wierd you say stuff about shimmering shield because mine basically stays on forever



I also just accidently killed myself w/ virulent walking bomb on nightmare mode lol

[Nooneyouknow13]

Shimmering Shield is bugged in the PC version, and does not kick off at 0 mana. It's not bugged on the consoles. I can't see sustaining Haste and Shimmering Shield, since that would be -20 mana regen, I can see supporting one or the other forever. Mana and Stamina regen are interchangeable, at least in the PC version, which actually makes that 102 gold belt in the mage tower amazing.

Modifié par Nooneyouknow13, 30 novembre 2009 - 02:34 .

[Besetment]

Nooneyouknow13 wrote...

Shimmering Shield is bugged in the PC version, and does not kick off at 0 mana. It's not bugged on the consoles. I can't see sustaining Haste and Shimmering Shield, since that would be -20 mana regen, I can see supporting one or the other forever. Mana and Stamina regen are interchangeable, at least in the PC version, which actually makes that 102 gold belt in the mage tower amazing.

I've got the PC version. It shuts off at zero mana.

Just to be sure but you are testing this in combat right? Because when you are walking around outside of combat you have massive health/mana regen and that might make some people think they can run cleansing aura + shimmering shield + haste but as soon as your draw your sword, all your mana justs whittles quickly down to zero. Then I see the shimmering shield icon disappear and the cooldown timer kicks off. Same deal with cleansing aura and haste and any other skill with a mana/stamina degenerative effect.

[Zilod]

i have pc version too and shimmering shield is bugged for me, just gave a look in case they patched but its still up when you go oom



maybe it can be possible to keep it up using spell bloom (or how is called ) and rejuv + mana regen items but not a very good choice for a war AW that have to move on he field



actually it seem there is a way to keep sustained spells i did a try to cast haste while oom and it went up and sticked, regardless of my 0 mana (ofc i had shimmering shield active too)

[demireamer]

Besetment wrote...

How is your mana regen high enough to cancel out the degen from Shimmering Shield *and* Haste? This is where I never hear an explanation. I've already tested gear combinations and +mana/stamina items so I know its not practicable to do it that way. I've heard it called a bug but why don't I have this bug?

The only way I can think of to do that is to stagger Spellbloom/Dark Sustanence on yourself constantly and health pot to make up the loss of life. In which case, the game really ceases to be a game and becomes a micromanagement exercise in trying to 'get the blue bar around the same level as the red bar.'

well i have, The Libertarian's Cowl +.25 Andruil's Blessing +1 Spellweaver +2 Improved Combat Training +??? leliana casting Song of Valor (she has high cunning)

note: i also made it so wynne would cast rejuvenate on me but that was so i had some mana regen
it should be noted that if you cast a spell it make you mana hit 0 it will still turn off SS and haste.

[Besetment]

Sorry, I assumed you were going it solo. Yeah I guess its doable with Rejuv and Song of Valor.



As for spellbloom:



I tested it just now...



Level 24:

Only degenerative mana spell being used = Shimmering Shield

Warden Commander's set

Spellweaver

Fade Wall

Destructionist's Belt



I still lose mana over time (albeit very slowly). It would probably be possible to break even using Wade's Superior Dragonbone set but yeah. It restricts where you can move and the effect doesn't last as long as the cooldown so you will probably need to dark sustenance occassionally (which is a hilariously broken but hey).



I dunno. Just in terms of getting the necessary gear you would need to kill a High Dragon, accumulate over 100 gold to buy the belt, do Warden's Keep early and then cheese abuse the storage chest/inventory bug thing to upgrade it as you play just to avoid Shimmering Shield going down in seconds assuming it works as intended. Thats not fun at all and I still don't believe this build is easy mode when it comes to soloing nightmare. Thats a great exageration. I can think of much easier ways to do it. I've been rolling with a BM/SH and honestly, if you planned it out properly you could almost storm of the century your way through the entire game with the usual repetoire of insane single target lockdowns like cone of cold/blood wound/forcefield/crushing prison etc.