456 réponses à ce sujet

[agentofatlas7]

Bioware should just cut the last 10 mins of the game. Have it end with Shepard bleeding with Anderson as he looks on as either the reapers destroy everything or the crucible destroying the reapers (depending on your ems). Make it simple.

I still can't believe they blatantly copied Deus Ex ending choices. Christ, have a little originality once in while.

[kato42]

I didn't vote in the poll, and I don't think a mandatory rainbows and cake ending is the best idea. But I'm well sick and tired of the ending must be grim and depressing as well (that notion seems so in vogue these days) - if I want grim and depressing, I can watch the news, or go to work, I don't spend money to see it in my entertainment.

Yeah, I want escapism. That should hardly be a shock in this world.

So I'm not surprised there are a lot of people who want the end of all the crap Shepard and crew has been through to be uplifting instead of a downer.

[kato42]

praliban wrote...

Bioware should just cut the last 10 mins of the game. Have it end with Shepard bleeding with Anderson as he looks on as either the reapers destroy everything or the crucible destroying the reapers (depending on your ems). Make it simple.

Agreed, that could well be the easiest thing to do.  And leaves plenty of room to speculate on how things proceed from there.  Its also somewhat in keeping with the first two.

I still can't believe they blatantly copied Deus Ex ending choices. Christ, have a little originality once in while.

Originality costs money, EA doesn't spend a nickle it doesn't have to.

[archanesoldier]

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

archanesoldier wrote...

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

archanesoldier wrote...

The Dark Knight of Steel wrote...

I don't get the fuss about the ending, the only thing that didn't make sense to me was how the team I choose to come with me ended up on the Normandy, other then that no problems.

they always said this was going to be the end of shepards story and it was.

You know you can end story of a character without killing the protagonist.  Odysseus did not die at the end of the Odyssey and Homer nor anyone else made more stories with the character.  Also I don't think there is one person who thinks the Normandy scene makes sense, so everyone should at least be in favor of removing that scene from the game.

And you can end the story of a character with killing the protaganist too. Both options are equally valid storytelling techniques. Why are you insisting on forcing the "Shepard lives HAPPILY. EVER. AFTER." option down people's throats? You're demanding that they take the storytelling option that they chose, and "fix" it to cater to your whims. I just... I don't get it. 

How is demanding someone "fix" a product that ISN'T BROKEN, that just doesn't live up to your overblown expectations, not insanely selfish?

If I go to Disneyland and Splash Mountain isn't as cool as I built it up in my head to be, does that give me the right to demand Disney to "fix" it? 

First of all your putting words in my mouth I never said that you had to
have Happy, Happy endings.  All I am saying is that there should be
multiple varied options for the ending ranging from shepard surviving (bittersweat happy) to
reapers winning, and anywhere in between.  Second I am not demanding that bioware change the ending I would be perfectly fine is they just corrected/explained the plotholes.  Also my expectations were set by Biowares own words like I don't now that there would be 16 varied endings, or there would not just be an A,B,C choice ending.

Maybe you didn't, and I apologize for putting words in your mouth. But according to these polls, that's exactly what the majority of people want. A happy, saccharinely sweet ending with unicorns that fart rainbows and brofists and krograns bearing birthday cakes. 

And that... that breaks my heart. Because if every single person Shepard knows, if every single person Shepard's ever encountered, if every single being that Shepard's acknowledged the existence of lives happily ever after... then that completely neuters the threat of the Reapers. Is nobody's ever in danger... what the hell is the point of playing? And it breaks my heart that people want Hello Kitty Effect. It just breaks my heart.

But I beilieve the methodology and way that question on the poll was worded skewed the result to saying we want a mega happy ending.  If you examine the Q14 the only choice that scraps the original ending with no spacechild and allows for a surviving Shepard is the first.  A new poll is therefore need to actually break down exactly why people are choosing that option.  And my choice for a "happy ending" would be somewhat similar to the end of "Saving Private Ryan" or "Shcindler's List" where Shepard has survived maybe reunited with his LI and remaining crew but deeply regrets all the lives that where lossed and he could have saved if he had just done more.

[Iamyew]

Yeah dude, thanks for informing about the poll, but the poll was created to give your opinions to the community, you made this thread to give your opinions on the opinions found in the poll. my question is why? lets focus on Bioware please. EVERYONE! REMEMBER THAT WE HAVE TO STAY VOCAL ABOUT THIS AND STAY FOCUSED ON BIOWARE, NOT EACH OTHER!!! Don't attack them, but let's make this very clear... Bioware, we have all loved you for a long time but your endings are making us call your validity as a company in to question, and your slow responses to our questions/demands are making us question your concerns for your consumers. It seems like most of the statements you have issued are attempting to belittle those of us who disagree with you. We're not petty children, even if you want the world to believe that we are, We are VERY dissatisfied customers and you have the power to change that, we even told you how, but you haven't done it yet because you'd rather hold your profit line than our hearts. So, since all you want to see is whether or not making a new ending will be more profitable than not, I will close with this...

HOLD THE LINE!

[SidNitzerglobin]

praliban wrote...

Bioware should just cut the last 10 mins of the game. Have it end with Shepard bleeding with Anderson as he looks on as either the reapers destroy everything or the crucible destroying the reapers (depending on your ems). Make it simple.

This a damn good fix to be honest.  Doesn't give you a hell of a lot of additional choices, but it would have been alot more satisfying to me anyway and actually winds up feeling like you had more control over the outcome via your recruiting efforts and how they were influenced by your choices over the course of the previous 2 installments.

Modifié par SidNitzerglobin, 20 mars 2012 - 06:17 .

[FatalX7.0]

kato42 wrote...

praliban wrote...

Bioware should just cut the last 10 mins of the game. Have it end with Shepard bleeding with Anderson as he looks on as either the reapers destroy everything or the crucible destroying the reapers (depending on your ems). Make it simple.

Agreed, that could well be the easiest thing to do.  And leaves plenty of room to speculate on how things proceed from there.  Its also somewhat in keeping with the first two.

I still can't believe they blatantly copied Deus Ex ending choices. Christ, have a little originality once in while.

Originality costs money, EA doesn't spend a nickle it doesn't have to.

They paid 15 bucks for a stock photo and called it Tali.

[Straw_foot]

I want a gambit from mushy ending to horribly depressing failure. Choice makes everyone happy, don't canon us into depressing or fluffy. In between endings like only Shep and the Reapers die, or if you had a bit less war assets Shep and his team that went with him to the end (Whatever that end is) die. The potential to please everyone is there, we don't have to infight.

Modifié par Straw_foot, 20 mars 2012 - 06:27 .

[Spectre Chris]

People want a happy ending, a Reapers win ending, and everything in between, based on the choices we've made from ME1. Like we were promised. If you'd put that as an option most people would have chosen it, but the other choices you gave were not up to par. The same goes for your imdoctrination theory. A lot of people liked the scene with Anderson and found it very bittersweet. We just didn't like the ending after starchild and the elevator. Don't ask leading questions and then get upset when people don't pick the option you want.

[SidNitzerglobin]

Spectre Chris wrote...

 A lot of people liked the scene with Anderson and found it very bittersweet.

This was pretty much the only redeeming bit after beaming up to the Citadel.  I found myself getting a bit verklempt...

[liggy002]

The ending poll doesn't take into account that many people want the indoctrination theory to be true. This means that we keep the current ending and EXTEND it so that different things happen: such as a battle with Harbinger and all of the main character have more of a resolution.

[MsKlaussen]

Miekkas wrote...

SPOILERS

Actually, they still failed to hit the nail on the head, and it has been demonstrated over and over again as to why. Read this article that point for point, shows why the entire Starchild situation and ending in nonsense:
https://docs.google....?pli=1&sle=true

People at this point are so disgusted with the starchild's concept that some want him scrapped entirely.

Let's address the fact that the current endings do not follow the prevalent theme of the series: the perseverance of Shepard and his team to overcome impossible odds and live to fight another day. They have built their legendary careers around defying authority and doing what people said no one could do, and they came out alive after doing it as icing on the cake. The ending of the game completely disregards this theme, which is why so many players are upset. They have come to expect a Shepard who is larger than life, a being who we can all look to as a *living* example of a hero. Shepard went from being a living hero throughout the entire series who lives depending on how much effort you put into the game even into the majority the third game until the last ten minutes where Bioware decided to change Shepard into a mindless drone who does as he is told instead of a being of defying authority. He is not even a tragic hero in the ending, which some people could have accepted. He is a pawn who simply gives in because some god starchild *says* he is right.

Why do "bashers" continue to think that by players asking for a "happy ending", they are asking for something out of a Disney movie? Consider the following:

1. Billions are dead by the end of the game regardless of Shepard's actions because the Reapers.
2. Earth, Palaven, and Thessia have all been essentially burned to the ground.
3. You have lost several current or former team members by the end of the game, regardless of your actions.
4. There are numerous hints that Shepard is suffering severe emotional and mental stress to the point of PTSD such the dream sequences, and Joker mentioning that EDI has detected Shepard's stress levels are higher than when he/she fought during the Skylian Blitz. Characters like Garrus, Joker, Ashley, Kaiden, and other characters all mention they don't know what has happened to their families. Liara's entire life spent studying the Protheans is completely uprooted by the appearance of Javik and discovery of Thessia. She feels like her entire life in the study has been wasted.

Regardless if the Reapers are destroyed, the relays are left intact, and Shepard lives to reunite with his surviving team, the end is at BEST bittersweet. Shepard and the entire Galaxy has suffered and sacrificed a lot to defeat the Reapers, and now they have to live each day while rebuilding what little they have left with the knowledge of EVERYTHING they have lost. There is no victory is war. There is only those who are left to pick up the pieces and bury the dead. Bashers cheapen the impact of the points I have made like they do not matter, but they do very much so. Talk to soldiers how they feel about coming home alive with friends who have died overseas and get back to me about the "whiny happy ending" nonsense because it is darn insulting to me. Happy endings are not always rainbows and bunnies. Sometimes they are just about living to see another day to honor those who we have lost and living with what has been lost for the rest of our lives. There is strength and meaning to be found in a man or woman who lives to see another day after losing so much and walks away with the determination to become a better person, to appreciate everything they still have whether that be friends or lovers or simply being alive. We should not cheapen the sacrifices of the lost by saying a soldier must die in having any deep meaning.

SPOILERS

Thank you. I was about to open up a can on this same subject, but probably would not have been able to be that silky about it and stay focused on the game. There is as much if not more deep meaning in soldiers coming home as there is in soldiers dying. I've got family I need home from deployment right now, as do hundreds of thousands of other families, and to hear someone even in regard to a fictional storyline point out the folly of the obligatory BS Hollywood blaze of glory ending is really refreshing.

I have to wonder whether those who consider such endings as having Shepard continue a life after all this as boring fairytale garbage have ever gotten any closer to PTSD than a DVD of The Deer Hunter. Living a life after war, even on a fraction of the scale of ME is no Disney story. It can be as trying and painful for all involved as the war was. Re-discovering who one was after completely losing oneself becoming someone else is a hell of its own, and success is not a guarantee.

Modifié par MsKlaussen, 20 mars 2012 - 06:34 .

[daftPirate]

I liked the effort put into this, and hope it amounts to something on BioWare's end. I don't need ending DLC. I expect DLC, but if it's not for the ending I'll be fine. The change I saw on there that need not be DLC related is the Effective Military Strength. I strongly agree that it should be lowered. I think it is important that the ending where Shepard appears to be alive remains difficult to achieve, but I think a balance needs to be struck. For example, I have a Shepard who lost a lot of people in the ME2 suicide mission, and it may be impossible for him to get that ending as is.

This seems like as good a place as any to make a suggestion: If possible, when a character has died and won't be present in ME3, remove his/her value from the total military strength available, so the total required is less. That would be great.

[Grunt420]

it should had ended with Anderson and Shepard sitting right after activating the Crucible and then they ****ed it up with the extra bull crap

[liggy002]

I would like to request that the person who issued that poll add more questions that include going with the Indoctrination Theory and ask us what we would like to happen after that. This would imply that we keep the Star Child scene which is what they should do. Just go from where Shepard wakes up in London.

[WizenSlinky0]

This is a very very flawed assessment. It only takes into account what players would "prefer" as their ending. It does not take into account how far from that preference players are willing to travel before an ending is no longer satisfying.

Would I like a well-written happy ending with Shepard alive and with his friends? Of course I would. Why wouldn't anybody? Does anybody truly *want* people to die and suffer because it's more dramatic and interesting? We recognize people die in war...but when war happens...do we hope for as many casualties as possible because it's more *real*? No, we'd prefer if every single one of those soldiers came home and got to enjoy life.

That's why this analysis is horribly flawed.

Personally, I think the whole hero has to sacrifice himself to be complete nonsense. There is no "has to" in stories. That's why it's fiction. But I recognize that hero's will die as well. I will accept Shepard dead so long as the ending is satisfying. I will accept a lot of things that I don't prefer.

But if you outright ask me what I want without setting any limitations then what do you expect to get as an answer?

If you ask me what I wish for I'll set my imagination to work envisioning a happy world. If you ask me what I find reasonable, I'll be much more open to other options..

[Raging Nug]

"There is no "has to" in stories. That's why it's fiction. But I recognize that hero's will die as well. I will accept Shepard dead so long as the ending is satisfying. I will accept a lot of things that I don't prefer."

Sure, but there are formulae we would like to see followed. Joseph Campbell articulates this very nicely in "The Hero With A Thousand Faces".

[ThaDPG]

xsdob wrote...

52% favor, and I quote, "Mega Happy Ending (Shepard survives, Normandy stays, Relays Stay, ONLY Reapers Dead, romantic epilogue with LI and crew, no starchild, no stargazer)"

I think that counts as a "ending of only bunnys and sunshine", for comparison, the "Bolt-On Conventional (Shep rejects "Star Child", reapers are eventually destroyed with HEAVY losses using the allied fleet, Shep survives to reunite with crew)" has 29% in second place, with a 23% gap between them.

I believe that the second place one is more realistic, and what I thought from observation that everyone on here wanted as opposed to an "everything worked out fine and dandy" ending. I was wrong, and have been proven wrong through empirical evidence from this very community.

Actually, I think most of us just want that to be an option, depending on how you played your game out.  All the other options are fine too, they can even keep the star child thing as a possible ending, as long as it is better fleshed out and all the plot holes and inconsistencies in the current version are ironed out or explained.

[papapwnzone]

To address at least one point in the OP, people vote for Shepard to survive and reunite with his LI and crew because that's their ideal scenario. I voted indifference on his survival personally because I understand that keeping at least 1 option for him to sacrifice himself makes good sense, but so does having 1 "super happy" high note ending. Even more options for endings would be great as well, seeing as we were more or less promised ("told" if you wanna get all semantic about it) such things in the past. As it is, playing the first 2 games has no effect on how the the 3rd ultimately pans out (last 15m). And Shepard dying+Relays exploding+Normandy being stranded on random planet all happen in every ending which is a total cop-out BS way to end the trilogy. Also, sorry but 1s shot of N7 chesplate and a quickly taken breath does not equal Shepard lives, at best it's debateable and inconclusive.

[Numdenu]

I think there might be some misinterpretation of the poll questions here.

I voted for "It is important that the DLC allows shepard to live and reunite with his squad and love interest" because I interpreted ALLOWS as meaning it can be done period. Not necessarily easily, not necessarily with the majority of the fleet intact. Just to have the option there. Victory drinks don't have to be on the Citadel, they can be in the smoking remains of a trench, in the middle of a wasteland on Earth, sure. Letting everyone off the hook is one thing--busting your butt for 100% completion to give your squad that chance to reunite is a whole other.

Less "sunshine and rainbows" and more "I can take this crapsack galaxy as long as I have my friends at my back".

Does that help clarify things?

[ThaDPG]

Numdenu wrote...

I think there might be some misinterpretation of the poll questions here.

I voted for "It is important that the DLC allows shepard to live and reunite with his squad and love interest" because I interpreted ALLOWS as meaning it can be done period. Not necessarily easily, not necessarily with the majority of the fleet intact. Just to have the option there. Victory drinks don't have to be on the Citadel, they can be in the smoking remains of a trench, in the middle of a wasteland on Earth, sure. Letting everyone off the hook is one thing--busting your butt for 100% completion to give your squad that chance to reunite is a whole other.

Less "sunshine and rainbows" and more "I can take this crapsack galaxy as long as I have my friends at my back".

Does that help clarify things?

exactly

[N3xium_Crash]

Here are my two points.

1. I like the tally of the poll results even though the polls linked are still ongoing and thus the entire first post is subject to change.

2. If your going to elaborate and post information on the polls then try leaving your opinion piece out of it or at least put that in a separate post so the community can make their own conclusions instead of having to sift through the OPs bias.

[Konges]

Great polls! Great questions!

[BenjaminR00]

FatalX7.0 wrote...


Mass Effect 2 was great. The end could either be really bad, everyone dies but you defeat the collectors, or with a bit more work, everyone is saved and you defeat the collectors.

Didn't see much of anyone complaining about that.

[...]

Either we can choose the Deus Ex/Battlestar Galactica rip-off Gainax ending that most people hate, or we can choose the more upbeat options that isn't the ending we hate. Again, avoiding the contradicting problems that the ending is full of.

You are right about ME2 ending.

Even if everyone dies conventionally it's more interesting an option that Star Child.

Personally I would be happy with a GAINAX/Hideaki Anno/Evangelion original ending as long as it was actually well done - personally I just don't think Casey Hudson has the stones or the brains for it. But he thinks he does. Bear in mind that there were two whole episodes of the events of the Instrumentality Project - that's over 40 minutes long (in a series that was only 22 x 20 minute episodes - that's basically 1/11th of the whole time on the ending) where the whole storyline was about getting over anxiety/betrayal/loss and how does a single individual trust/love/feel whole etc and plus the 'conspiracy' of the human instrumentality formed the basis of the whole plot - in other words the ending was true to the context of the story even if people did hate it for being artsy. The reaction then to Evangelion was very similar to people's feelings about ME3 (Anno got death threats) - but the difference is that Hideaki Anno actually is an artist and he didn't promote or promise anything to anybody unlike BioWare - and artistically it worked for Evangelion even though the fans demanded a movie to 'explain' it I personally didn't need it because at least the whole bloody show was about these ideas...

[Rockworm503]

Father_Jerusalem wrote...

archanesoldier wrote...

The Dark Knight of Steel wrote...

I don't get the fuss about the ending, the only thing that didn't make sense to me was how the team I choose to come with me ended up on the Normandy, other then that no problems.

they always said this was going to be the end of shepards story and it was.

You know you can end story of a character without killing the protagonist.  Odysseus did not die at the end of the Odyssey and Homer nor anyone else made more stories with the character.  Also I don't think there is one person who thinks the Normandy scene makes sense, so everyone should at least be in favor of removing that scene from the game.

And you can end the story of a character with killing the protaganist too. Both options are equally valid storytelling techniques. Why are you insisting on forcing the "Shepard lives HAPPILY. EVER. AFTER." option down people's throats? You're demanding that they take the storytelling option that they chose, and "fix" it to cater to your whims. I just... I don't get it. 

How is demanding someone "fix" a product that ISN'T BROKEN, that just doesn't live up to your overblown expectations, not insanely selfish?

If I go to Disneyland and Splash Mountain isn't as cool as I built it up in my head to be, does that give me the right to demand Disney to "fix" it? 

If Disney promised the Splash Mountain to be as cool as you thought it would be and failed to deliver I say why the hell not?
False advertising man would you have gone to disneyland if you knew Splash Mountain wasn't as cool?

We are not forcing anything down your throats if you confusing convoluted messes make you happy then you already got what you wanted.