190 réponses à ce sujet

[Abrams216]

 The situation may come down to Bioware having to change the ending to appease their fans.  I'm all for artistic expression, and making your art the way you want to.  However, making games is still a business, and making a product that upsets your fanbase is no way to stay in business.

[IsleySilverlord]

Bethesda is so great because they DO listen.

Although BW is still my favourite developer, they should learn from them.

They ask for "feedback" sure, but then they just ignore us.

[Renew81]

I sitll have faith in bioware to make this right , now just waiting to see
if that faith also gets crushed or strengthened.

[MandatoryDenial1]

saga56 wrote...

BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT - colin of IGN said they changed the ending to add more DLC not cause they made a mistake...... how could Colin and IGN be wrong!!!!

Because Collin is an idiot who is "working" as a journalist in a games Propeganda and hype machine company?  That would be my guess but I admit I could be wrong. 

[Yalision]

We all have to maintain faith until given reason to do otherwise and stay positive.

[Tyrzun]

Todd Howard is to be respected. The reason that worked is Todd was still with the project.

The man that had the REAL ending planned Drew Karpysyn was taken off the ME project after ME 2. He is also the creator of entire Mass Effect universe and the lead writer or ME 1 and ME 2. He was moved over to SWTOR. That's write they took their best writer away from ME and left in incapable hands.

So, this is a "bigger" issue at Bioware. By moving Drew in the first place they made it clear ME 3 is NOT their priority.

There is a thread here where Drew admits he has NO idea how they chose to end the game and he hasn't seen it. That's right, they didn't want his INPUT even on the ending. Do you not see a major problem with that? It's why we have soo many plot holes etc.

So, for Bioware to admit they were wrong they'd have to bring back DREW and whoever it is in Bioware that chose to take him off the project would have to admit they are wrong. They are most likely and executive that is only concerned with $$$ not integrity much less what the fans think.

So, you don't have a Todd Howard calling the shots. You have some bean counter calling the shots at EA/Bioware. Basically, it's not going to happen.

At least we still have Bethesda! We'll just have to mourn Bioware and move on.

[Sanrei]

Renew81 wrote...

I sitll have faith in bioware to make this right , now just waiting to see
if that faith also gets crushed or strengthened.

I had faith that Bioware would never mess up that bad with the ending.
Then I finished the game.

I still have faith, it's just shaken really bad right now.

[idunhavaname]

This is why I love Todd Howard/Bethesda and why they deserve GOTY. Instead of paid DLCs (although they did screw up with paid DLCs in the past), they give gamers the tools to make their own.

[Tyrzun]

PedEgg wrote...

Renew81 wrote...

I sitll have faith in bioware to make this right , now just waiting to see
if that faith also gets crushed or strengthened.

I had faith that Bioware would never mess up that bad with the ending.
Then I finished the game.

I still have faith, it's just shaken really bad right now.

So, you have faith in a BRAND name?  Really?  You think the name magically cares?  Seriously.  

The people that "Cared" about single player story telling are gone.  Understand?  Gone!  I don't  understand how some people keep giving credit to the company name and not the people that MADE the game happened.  Most "fans" have no CLUE on who made their best games and it's sad. 

Psychology 101 I guess.  Indoctrination into believe the BRAND is all that matters.  Rather sad.

Basically, there is not ONE person in charge at Bioware that has made a game you LIKE.  ME 1 and ME 2 for example.  Drew is gone and that's why they butchered this story.  These people took his job, claimed they could do it better, told the board of directors they could do it better, etc... they aren't going to admit they aren't capable of doing their job.

Which is why Casey came out and said WE are proud of OUR ending.  The sold the powers that be that it would be the way to go.  Would you give up your job because the customers said you were bad?  
No, you'd tell your boss they were wrong.  No one at Bioware will admit it was left in POOR hands.

You're only prayer would be for the CEO or some very high level exec to step in and REMOVE power from the people that have it and restore Drew, but they won't do that. EA invested over $100 million in SWTOR and I'm certain the "deal" was that their "Best" talent work on SWTOR, Drew is on SWTOR.

[Sett101]

Beth is owned by ZeniMax Media. ZeniMax owns a few game devs. Not sure ZeniMax is as bad as EA but they are the same type of corp. and you can see real changes from Morrowind-Skyrim. Not to get off topic with Skyrim bugs but after a month 1/3 of their target PLATFORMS still was unable to play the game + + + a ton of other massive bugs. I think it was rushed for target date but were willing to admit they had issues and fix them at least.

[VigilancePress]

I never thought I'd see the day when I considered Bethesda to have made a superior product to BioWare. Their products are consistently buggy and often don't interest me... but I have to say, I've logged well over 100 hours into Skyrim, and when they finish cleaning up all the bugs I'll be going back.

I don't think I'll be going back to anything BioWare has made any time soon... unless they fix the ending to ME3.

[TexasToast712]

 I have yet to see a Bethseda game that truly deserved GOTY. They make fun games but they have more bugs on release than any game ever. Buggy games that never get fixed don't deserve GOTY.

Modifié par TexasToast712, 20 mars 2012 - 09:29 .

[Borothir]

Yes, I definitely thought about this as well. It's basically all up to Bioware at this point, no matter what they do. We've played our cards, and will continue to keep the pressure on, but it's up to them now. They can either, in some ungodly way, say "Let's stand our ground" or honestly tell us "We screwed up. Big time. SOOO bad. Let's fix it."

[Reiella]

Sett101 wrote...

Beth is owned by ZeniMax Media. ZeniMax owns a few game devs. Not sure ZeniMax is as bad as EA but they are the same type of corp. and you can see real changes from Morrowind-Skyrim. Not to get off topic with Skyrim bugs but after a month 1/3 of their target PLATFORMS still was unable to play the game + + + a ton of other massive bugs. I think it was rushed for target date but were willing to admit they had issues and fix them at least.

They are not the same type of corporation.  They are entirely privately held.  Which is a significant distinction in terms of corporate climates.

[idunhavaname]

TexasToast712 wrote...

 I have yet to see a Bethseda game that truly deserved GOTY. They make fun games but they have more bugs on release than any game ever. Buggy games that never get fixed don't deserve GOTY.

You must be playing on PS3 then because I only encountered ONE BUG on PC version and it was minor (couldn't drop quest item after completing).

[dbl219]

I think this video is really on the nose and brings up an important point that this sort of thing is not entirely unprecedented.

I also think people are being too quick to crap all over BioWare, or pointing the finger at EA or Casey Hudson and saying, "Bethesda is one thing, but because [whoever] is in charge, this won't get fixed!" We have to have a little more faith than that.

I'm most definitely among the group that disliked the ending. I donated money in the name of the Retake movement. But if want BioWare to fix this, we have to show them we're still willing to give them a shot. That we love 99% of their series and want to love the last 1% as well. Do you think BioWare wants their epic trilogy to be saddled with this sort of legacy that has left a bad taste in everyone's mouth? I certainly don't. I hope that if we show them we'll still support their content so long as they continue to satisfy us, the customer, we'll be heard.

Badmouthing them and spreading negativity about the company (or any one person) is most certainly not the way to get a positive response.

[alx119]

Amazing, and very inspiring.
I didn't even dislike at all the original ending of Fallout 3 I mean it was sacrifice, but you saw all the ramifications of your choices and deeds at the very least, but the DLC was -very- welcome, to be able to continue your roaming through the DC Wasteland was a nice touch.
I will hope for something like that for Mass Effect 3.

Holding the line.

Modifié par alx119, 20 mars 2012 - 09:41 .

[brian_breed]

mkelso27 wrote...

The only difference is I loved the ending to Fallout 3. I also loved being able to continue and play afterwards, but I would have been fine if it stayed like it was. I will not be fine if ME3's ending stays like it is.

I was happy that Fallout 3 "resurrected" The Lone Wanderer, but only because that meant I got to explore more content in the game. I also thought that TLW's death was poignant in itself, and it certainly fit the theme of sacrifice which Fallout 3 explored. 

I would love to see a revised ending for Mass Effect 3, but I'm not against Shepard's death per se. I want Shepard to live, because I like Shepard - but that also lends weight to an act of sacrifice.

What I feel the urgent need to see, though, is a universe in which Shepard's story - the people drawn together, the conflicts resolved, the Reaper crisis averted - could realisitically survive the cataclysm.

I want to see an ending where Earth might have to be sacrificed to secure the rest of the galaxy. I want to see an ending where the Reapers win.

I want to see endings which reflect the choices players made throughout the franchise.

I want to see endings that live up to the developers' promises; most of all, I want to see endings that can explain themselves.

[kalamity116]

I used to have three favorite developers: Blizzard, Bioware and Bethseda.

Bethseda's hanging on strong.
Blizz struck out when they signed a deal with the devil (Activision) and their product quality started going to hell.
And Bioware? Idk...EA knows all too well that there are better ways of making money than making a good product. It's Bioware's decision whether they want to subscribe to that method of thinking or not. Simultaneously, they'll be deciding whether or not they get any more of my money.

[Gamingtrek12025]

I was one of the few who actually liked the ending of Fallout 3, made that last decision important (which can't be said about what you choose here, if Indoc isn't true), and even with the DLC changes the ending still mattered and was continued.

Hope Bioware does the same, if the Indoc theory is just false hope (But i think its what actually happened, and i'm holding the line in memory of Mr. Sheilds.).

[Militarized]

jojimbo wrote...

Bethesda are the No1 gaming devs of all time, and i say this because of a really important , crucial element...they support modding, hell they even release a full SDK for skyrim to support the community. if there ever was a mentor for game devs, these guys are it.

[BWGungan]

The irony is that I never really had a problem with the Fallout 3 ending, and I don't think nearly as many people did in general because it wasn't poorly written, it wasn't completely idiotic, and its tone was consistent with the rest of the game. They extended it anyways.

BioWare's ending is the worst thing I've ever seen, heard or read. It is genuinely awful on about ten different levels. If they don't fix it, I'm through with them.

Modifié par BWGungan, 20 mars 2012 - 09:46 .

[legion999]

jojimbo wrote...

Bethesda are the No1 gaming devs of all time, and i say this because of a really important , crucial element...they support modding, hell they even release a full SDK for skyrim to support the community. if there ever was a mentor for game devs, these guys are it.

Valve?

[BWGungan]

legion999 wrote...

jojimbo wrote...

Bethesda are the No1 gaming devs of all time, and i say this because of a really important , crucial element...they support modding, hell they even release a full SDK for skyrim to support the community. if there ever was a mentor for game devs, these guys are it.

Valve?

Eh, I could never really got into Valve's stuff.

[Sanrei]

Tyrzun wrote...

So, you have faith in a BRAND name?  Really?  You think the name magically cares?  Seriously.  

The people that "Cared" about single player story telling are gone.  Understand?  Gone!  I don't  understand how some people keep giving credit to the company name and not the people that MADE the game happened.  Most "fans" have no CLUE on who made their best games and it's sad. 

Psychology 101 I guess.  Indoctrination into believe the BRAND is all that matters.  Rather sad.

Basically, there is not ONE person in charge at Bioware that has made a game you LIKE.  ME 1 and ME 2 for example.  Drew is gone and that's why they butchered this story.  These people took his job, claimed they could do it better, told the board of directors they could do it better, etc... they aren't going to admit they aren't capable of doing their job.

Which is why Casey came out and said WE are proud of OUR ending.  The sold the powers that be that it would be the way to go.  Would you give up your job because the customers said you were bad?  
No, you'd tell your boss they were wrong.  No one at Bioware will admit it was left in POOR hands.

You're only prayer would be for the CEO or some very high level exec to step in and REMOVE power from the people that have it and restore Drew, but they won't do that. EA invested over $100 million in SWTOR and I'm certain the "deal" was that their "Best" talent work on SWTOR, Drew is on SWTOR.

Until you learn you don't lecture people without knowing the details, stop talking to me.
You don't know anything about me, how long I've been playing games released by Bioware, how familiar I am with the gaming industry to begin with, or what I actually know about the current situation, which is a lot more than you've given me credit for. So I'm not going to give you any credit whatsoever.

You aren't teaching me any hard lessons, you aren't waking me up or snapping me out of any sort of stupor, you're just being a self-important dick. If you're trying to help, you're failing as hard as ME3's ending did. It's been nice chatting.

Modifié par PedEgg, 20 mars 2012 - 09:50 .