358 réponses à ce sujet

[LilaNoir]

I know the indoctrination theory has been discussed to death and back, but I recently read a rather insightful (and may I add eloquent?) piece on this popular theory... and I wanted to share.


Spoilers! Do not read if you have not finished ME3 or wish to avoid spoilers for the ending.
Alright. I’ve been toying with the idea of the Indoctrination theory for the ending of Mass Effect 3 that has been floating around the internet. And I have discussed many points with my housemate, who has also studied literature extensively. She knows how invested I am in the story, and has given me a seed of hope that has blossomed into a razor-sharp flower of abject disbelief. She has also been researching this purely to ease my troubled mind, because living with me when I am in the throes of anguish or the grips of rage is pure hell.

And I can safely say that this is either the most dick move that Bioware could have pulled, or pure. ****ing. Genius.

So, yes. I have been won over to the indoctrination theory, and I’ll share with you some of the reasons why.

MORE

Apologies if it has been shared already.

Modifié par NanNoir, 21 mars 2012 - 04:56 .

[The Real Bowser]

It's a shame that this thread hasn't gotten any attention yet. I have gotten bits and pieces of this before, but this is downright impressive.

[Sublyminal]

Mind is blown

[The Real Bowser]

If they are trying to make the most intelligent and creative ending a game has ever seen by playing this through, then releasing the true ending... I'll accept it. Gladly. Maybe I was wrong.

Maybe they already have the ending ready, and are holding it off until it's time, not giving any hints to make this truly sink in.  I'm starting to go crazy, thinking Bioware actually planned all this all along?  What a risky move, but... the reward?  I think it will pay off, if this is true.  I'm getting kind of excited, now, getting hope back.

If my own take on this is correct, then Bioware will not make us wait much longer if they already have the ending ready.  It could be a matter of days or weeks... I think it might occur exactly a month from the release.  This is my theory... this DLC will be released for free, and come out exactly one month from this game's release.

Modifié par The Real Bowser, 20 mars 2012 - 02:40 .

[Jagri]

That's what I have been pretty much thinking. Harbinger said he would find another way and if this what he meant it would make him one of the most dasterdly villians to date. Which villian has anyone known to troll millions and come to fool many  who accepted these endings?

It would be utterly brillant if true.

Modifié par Jagri, 20 mars 2012 - 02:42 .

[LilaNoir]

I was a bit worried that this piece was posted already and may have gotten lost among the countless indoctrination threads.

Glad to bring a smidgen of hope!

[GBGriffin]

They launched the endings as they intended with no plans for post-game DLC, which is the idea that appeals to so many followers. The indoctrination theory is a fan theory, created and fueled by the fans; BioWare hasn't confirmed it, and I personally don't expect them too.

[The Real Bowser]

Imagine that he has been indoctrinated since Arrival, in some extent. That the dreams and visions of the kid were part of this, and everything became full circle in the ending.

Bioware is acting very unprofessional, teasing us and misleading us. But if this is why, then... wow.

[qdust]

Very well put. Really you laid it all out brilliantly. The only quibbles I have with it are the real world ones. At this point BioWare has a real image problem with a lot of its most loyal fans, and its rapidly developing into a financial problem as well.

Heh...maybe I'm still indoctrinated, but it seems to me if there were a big secret to be revealed they would have done so by now if only to stop the bleeding.

I can't bring myself to say I think you're right, but I sure HOPE you are. I really do.

[The Real Bowser]

GBGriffin wrote...

They launched the endings as they intended with no plans for post-game DLC, which is the idea that appeals to so many followers. The indoctrination theory is a fan theory, created and fueled by the fans; BioWare hasn't confirmed it, and I personally don't expect them too.

Yet, at the risk of sounding crazy, isn't this exactly what they would want us to think for this to be successful and powerful as it is?  To be a truly artistic and memorable ending like they say they want it to be?

[Qareen]

It's hard not to be pulled in by his conviction. However, it just seems so unlikely that Bioware would be holding off on a concrete statement if Indoctrination Theory was their plan all along.

[The Real Bowser]

qdust wrote...

Very well put. Really you laid it all out brilliantly. The only quibbles I have with it are the real world ones. At this point BioWare has a real image problem with a lot of its most loyal fans, and its rapidly developing into a financial problem as well.

Heh...maybe I'm still indoctrinated, but it seems to me if there were a big secret to be revealed they would have done so by now if only to stop the bleeding.

I can't bring myself to say I think you're right, but I sure HOPE you are. I really do.

I thought so, too, but maybe this is intentional.  Look at all the attention this game is getting.  Maybe they are wanting everyone to watch as this becomes the most epic conclusion anyone can imagine.  Or maybe they just screwed up bad.

I'm starting to get curious, though.

[Lakeshow1986]

Excellent points! I also thought that something wasn't right when I saw Anderson struggling, but still chose the destroy option because it's always been about destroying the reapers.

Well played BioWare!

[Qareen]

The Real Bowser wrote...

What a risky move, but... the reward?

Making the endings to ME3 an illusion. Heavy risk.... but the priiiiiize.

[GBGriffin]

The Real Bowser wrote...

GBGriffin wrote...

They launched the endings as they intended with no plans for post-game DLC, which is the idea that appeals to so many followers. The indoctrination theory is a fan theory, created and fueled by the fans; BioWare hasn't confirmed it, and I personally don't expect them too.

Yet, at the risk of sounding crazy, isn't this exactly what they would want us to think for this to be successful and powerful as it is?  To be a truly artistic and memorable ending like they say they want it to be?

At the risk of sales, publicity, and bad business? Even on the off-chance it was intentional, why would they stick with it through all of this? Again, what you're doing isn't necessarily "crazy", but it's looking beyond what's actually been presented into the realm of possibilities. There, anything is possible, sure, but the fact of the matter is that they launched the game alongside notes that basically confirm this is the ending they wanted, and their PR, at the very least, is suffering from it, alongside the recent price drops and Amazon refunds.

EA pulled a similar stunt iirc with Dante's Inferno, where they staged a protest over the game. Look up that marketing campaign; it was a disaster. I'm pretty sure they came clean about it later. The thing is, I know people are hoping for the grandest troll ever...but it's pretty clear they rushed the product and didn't plan on adding to the ending (again, based on what they've shown us and what little they've said about it)

[mgoss]

Amazing video about indoctrination.
http://www.youtube.c...v=ythY_GkEBck#!

[The Real Bowser]

GBGriffin wrote...

The Real Bowser wrote...

GBGriffin wrote...

They launched the endings as they intended with no plans for post-game DLC, which is the idea that appeals to so many followers. The indoctrination theory is a fan theory, created and fueled by the fans; BioWare hasn't confirmed it, and I personally don't expect them too.

Yet, at the risk of sounding crazy, isn't this exactly what they would want us to think for this to be successful and powerful as it is?  To be a truly artistic and memorable ending like they say they want it to be?

At the risk of sales, publicity, and bad business? Even on the off-chance it was intentional, why would they stick with it through all of this? Again, what you're doing isn't necessarily "crazy", but it's looking beyond what's actually been presented into the realm of possibilities. There, anything is possible, sure, but the fact of the matter is that they launched the game alongside notes that basically confirm this is the ending they wanted, and their PR, at the very least, is suffering from it, alongside the recent price drops and Amazon refunds.

EA pulled a similar stunt iirc with Dante's Inferno, where they staged a protest over the game. Look up that marketing campaign; it was a disaster. I'm pretty sure they came clean about it later. The thing is, I know people are hoping for the grandest troll ever...but it's pretty clear they rushed the product and didn't plan on adding to the ending (again, based on what they've shown us and what little they've said about it)

They believe that we'll forgive them.  And to be honest, wouldn't you?  

Look at all the attention this game is getting.  All the publicity in the most unlikely of places.  I think they want this publicity.  If this is true, then this game will be one of the most famous ever created, remembered forever.

The biggest reason I believe this is because Bioware is smarter than this.  They know that we would never accept this kind of ending, they are not stupid.  They wouldn't just ignore us and give vague or snide remarks.  The reason I believe this is because it makes more logical sense than anything else.

[The Real Bowser]

Wrong thread, lol!  Ignore this reply, I would delete it if I could.

Modifié par The Real Bowser, 20 mars 2012 - 02:58 .

[GBGriffin]

The Real Bowser wrote...
They believe that we'll forgive them.  And to be honest, wouldn't you?  

Look at all the attention this game is getting.  All the publicity in the most unlikely of places.  I think they want this publicity.  If this is true, then this game will be one of the most famous ever created, remembered forever.

The biggest reason I believe this is because Bioware is smarter than this.  They know that we would never accept this kind of ending, they are not stupid.  They wouldn't just ignore us and give vague or snide remarks.  The reason I believe this is because it makes more logical sense than anything else.

Forgive them? Hardly. It would mean I paid $80 for an incomplete product, and that they basically dragged everyone through this for nothing at all. Also, indoctrination theory does not excuse poor writing / storytelling. 

It makes sense...to you. It makes sense because it fits your belief that BioWare wouldn't "do this". Look at the developer notes, though, and the fact they openly admitted to scrapping the indoctrination gameplay mechanic. Also, the fact of the matter is that they're doing exactly that: they are ignoring us, and they are giving snide remarks, alongside allowing us to make suggestions for a better ending.

Now, consider that. Why allow people to make suggestions for a better ending if they have one planned already?

[Stevebo]

This has been my theory of choice for the most part, and to add to it. The boy was in Shepards mind from the very beginning. Look at the part where Shepard watches him get on the ship. Not on of those soldiers around him even notices that he's there nor tries to help him get aboard.

Not to mention the destroy option is masked as "red" so you would think that would be the renegade choice and playing as a paragon throughout the game, you may believe that wouldn't be the correct choice to make.

In this case you as the player would be "indoctrinated", sure it's an original idea but honestly I'm not sure if it's something that they should have done (i.e ship an incomplete product.....)  Still, I applaud them if this is indeed, what they intended to do (it better be free or there will be riots lol)

Of course this could all be wrong, but I find it easier to believe in this and stay optimistic that there may be something on the way that will finish where this left off.

Modifié par Stevebo, 20 mars 2012 - 03:02 .

[The Real Bowser]

GBGriffin wrote...

The Real Bowser wrote...
They believe that we'll forgive them.  And to be honest, wouldn't you?  

Look at all the attention this game is getting.  All the publicity in the most unlikely of places.  I think they want this publicity.  If this is true, then this game will be one of the most famous ever created, remembered forever.

The biggest reason I believe this is because Bioware is smarter than this.  They know that we would never accept this kind of ending, they are not stupid.  They wouldn't just ignore us and give vague or snide remarks.  The reason I believe this is because it makes more logical sense than anything else.

Forgive them? Hardly. It would mean I paid $80 for an incomplete product, and that they basically dragged everyone through this for nothing at all. Also, indoctrination theory does not excuse poor writing / storytelling. 

It makes sense...to you. It makes sense because it fits your belief that BioWare wouldn't "do this". Look at the developer notes, though, and the fact they openly admitted to scrapping the indoctrination gameplay mechanic. Also, the fact of the matter is that they're doing exactly that: they are ignoring us, and they are giving snide remarks, alongside allowing us to make suggestions for a better ending.

Now, consider that. Why allow people to make suggestions for a better ending if they have one planned already?

In a word, for the publicity.  Have you ever seen a game garner this kind of publicity before?

I can't fathom why they would have broken so many promises and just flat out did so poorly.  There's no fathomable way they would have missed so much and just written such a bad story.  Bioware simply isn't this stupid.  It's not unlikely, it's practically impossible.

Modifié par The Real Bowser, 20 mars 2012 - 03:02 .

[wtbusername]

Genius.

Indoception.

[The Real Bowser]

I also recall Mike Gamble saying "If the fans knew what was in store, their reaction would be different." What could possibly make things different? Certainly not new DLC for taking back Omega.

[pistolols]

Yeah this is a good read that brings up some interesting points. God, there is so much depth to this game. So much to think about. It is so utterly appalling to me that people just brushed it off, gave it no thought what so ever, then proceeded to start a freaking movement to have it change. I cannot even believe the audacity of it all.

[0Sion0]

Good read, very well put and if true - if Bioware intended it this way.... then wow. Greatest mind****, greatest twist, best franchise ever.

Flipside: one would have thought they'd admit it by now and announce something - their image and financial concerns are growing with each passing day. At one point or another that should start to trouble them enough that they would have to speak up and explain a few things. Hasn't happened so far..

Modifié par 0Sion0, 20 mars 2012 - 03:06 .